A conversation about EA Philosophy

[llcmac]

I had a few thoughts I wanted to share...

1. Would it be safe to say that EA's biggest priority is online gamers and Ultimate Team (Both make money for them)? Person vs. Person tourneys and what not, and money making card collections. If, let's say there was a glitch in MUT where the 2 highest ranking cards were showing up in the lowest packs, or someone forgot a decimal and Legendary Packs costs 350 points instead of 35000. Or in online play if the passing buttons only worked half the time or something. Would it be safe to assume that these issues would be fixed ASAP? (I mean duh on me right? the loss in money making potential would be their incentive)

To be fair, fixing issues like those might be easier than the ones affect us "sim" heads. Quick server side patches could be out in a matter of minutes, where as fixing the old systems in Madden may be like trying to find a needle in a haystack (more on this later).

But even with that being true, don't most "sim" heads feel like we are being ignored? In the end it is a lose-lose situation for EA. The more they try to tweak the old systems the more potential there is for them to break something else.

In the end Madden has the hardest row to hoe. Their software was the least future proof (seems like) and because of that they cannot easily interact with the community without getting attacked or asked a million questions. This leads me into my next thought...

2. Is it possible that the reason there are so many problems with Madden this year is because EA is putting in the framework for a better all around game? Everyone knows that a 1 year development cycle makes it hard to be too innovative, especially with the archaic systems the game uses.

It has been discussed that the Madden team take a year off of the game, just putting out a patch and roster update for $20 bucks, and take 2 years to really turn the game around. This is impossible for many reasons.

So what if the reason the game is in the current state is because EA is really taking 2 years to really change the game (as in they designed a new framework for Madden that they knew could potentially cause a slew of issues in other areas but would make it easier to implement new systems down the road). They could never say something like that, they would deny it, if it ever came out people would be fired, but what if that was their plan. Install the framework for the next gen madden, then next year install new systems to rewrite most of the game. It might be a pipe dream, but with next gen consoles coming out in, maybe, 2014...what if.

Madden 2013 - new framework.
Madden 2014 - rewritten AI, sim stats, IE 2.0, other systems.
Madden 2015 (on Xbox 720 and PS4) - New graphics system, reworked animations system.

I dunno, this is all conjecture on my part. But I have to think EA has a plan...don't they? lol.

Option A- they have a plan for a better Madden
Option B- they are the only game in town so they don't care
Option C- they are "NBA Live-ing" Madden into the ground

Hey, I am trying to be optimistic here. Believe me, I am still cynical about this years Madden (No intense close games because of the terrible late game AI, franchise stats unrealistic, bad rosters, etc), but I want to believe there is a future for this game.

[Aftershock9958]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

1. Would it be safe to say that EA's biggest priority is online gamers and Ultimate Team (Both make money for them)?

Not even close. Yes, online got the most attention this year. But for several years in a row, online didn't even get a look, to the point where we were having to pay for other sites to give us a half-working franchise mode.

Would it be safe to assume that these issues would be fixed ASAP? (I mean duh on me right? the loss in money making potential would be their incentive)

To be fair, fixing issues like those might be easier than the ones affect us "sim" heads. Quick server side patches could be out in a matter of minutes, where as fixing the old systems in Madden may be like trying to find a needle in a haystack (more on this later).

You just asked a condescending question, and then answered your own condescending question with a very reasonable answer.

But even with that being true, don't most "sim" heads feel like we are being ignored?

It strikes me as almost impossible to believe that there are so many offline gamers who constantly insinuate that sim only takes place offline. I am an online gamer. I am also a sim player. So, no, I don't feel ignored.

2. Is it possible that the reason there are so many problems with Madden this year is because EA is putting in the framework for a better all around game?

Yes.... this is exactly what they're doing, we KNOW this is what they're doing, they've more or less said as much.

[heelphreak]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

don't most "sim" heads feel like we are being ignored?

yes

[roll2tide]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

I think dropped the ball in just about the most major way possible starting with the first 360/PS3 version. Maybe they had hardware/code issues or a short time with the hardware prior to the first games......I really don't know. I know that the first NextGen version was pathetic.

From there I think they tried to band aid it rather than dump it and restart. I recall discussion from 2006/2007 where some suggested that EA put a 2nd team on Madden....1 to keep the current version going, one to rewrite the thing from scratch. They probably should have done this but again dropped the ball.

I think M13 is that rewrite process. Maybe not a full restart but close to it. I think the game potential but is probably still 1-3 years away from really being a tight game where the major flaws are few and far between. The problem, though, is that Madden is notorious for shooting itself in the foot. They get something we all really like and they end up removing it or breaking it. Things that don't work or that need a major overhaul seem to linger endlessly or never get addressed.

I would venture to say that single mode of Madden has ever worked properly and fully. Ever. Between the 165 lb punter who can snap and block, to the superman/village idiot pass defenders, to trades, free agents, play calling AI, QB decision making, GM decisions.....you could go on forever. Play Now, Franchise, SuperStar, Online Franchise, and now CCM all have or have had major, major flaws every year.

IMO, at this point EA needs to address its AI issues and physics engine issues. Build a solid, properly working core, and then start dressing it up and focus less on the new "wow factor" mode each year. They would say that "new" features sell.....I would say that an in-depth, properly working game would sell itself.

[coke hogan]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

i think they trying to milk us for everything they can.

i remember them talkin bout sever side fixes for online franchise, a few yrs ago. they said they would fix the salary cap and fix a whole bunch of stuff.

i don't remember them fixing anything in online franchise that yr.

luckily for me i play alot of different type of games. so i can do without football like i have been doing for yrs now.

[slick589]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

The team did work work on ccm for 2 years according to looman yet they still released a glitchy/buggy product.

Every year its said that madden is laying down a foundation for the future. It seems like they always have a new 3 year plan. The problem is they never get around to building it.

[heelphreak]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

i would wager that most consumers think madden is great. many of my friends are not bothered by the little things that drive me crazy while searching for 'realistic' gameplay. all i want is sliders that work and an explanation as to what they do so we can create a gameplay that suits us.

[SA1NT401]

As a ***** of online anything in sports games...

I am disappointed in the main focus overall in online, but that's their audience and there isnt anything gonna change.

Sadly

[cuttingteeth]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

The only part of their proposed philosophy that would write me off as a customer is if they go further online with everything...and I mean that they make it necessary to be online to enjoy the game at all.

It hit me, and I don't mean this to sound selfish, but watching some crew guys play online with COD - they get shot in mere seconds, respawn, killed again very quickly, etc. etc. etc. They put in another game, GTA4, and basically the same set up. Finally they put in M12 to play online, and I promise you it took three tries in less than 5 minutes to find someone who would play a full game without quitting.

Now, the point I want to make is that it became so much clearer that having to go online and having to plug into the world with everyone else to try and enjoy the game...sucked. I can barely rely on people to do their real jobs in real life and be happy, you know. If I have to rely upon the same for competition in a sports game, then I am going to be very upset and likely very often disappointed. I have absolutely grown up with gaming. I had Atari, first kid with Nintendo, first with Sega and so on. Even at the arcades, it would majority of times be just me with the game on my dime (quarter). Games were a personal and private getaway. It was myself and the game and the immersion for me was just that...immerse me into that game world...that's where I get lost...that's where I choose to be and enjoy myself. When games became more customizable to set up the world even further for personal enjoyment, I have to say that's when even more people like myself got sucked in more. Going backwards on that, though, it pushes me away. I don't want to have to enter a game world where my enjoyment relies on other real people.

Sorry...didn't mean this to ramble on. Just saying. And this isn't me ranting or angry. These are calm and clear thoughts.

[EmmdotFrisk]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

I had a few thoughts I wanted to share...

1. Would it be safe to say that EA's biggest priority is online gamers and Ultimate Team (Both make money for them)? Person vs. Person tourneys and what not, and money making card collections. If, let's say there was a glitch in MUT where the 2 highest ranking cards were showing up in the lowest packs, or someone forgot a decimal and Legendary Packs costs 350 points instead of 35000. Or in online play if the passing buttons only worked half the time or something. Would it be safe to assume that these issues would be fixed ASAP? (I mean duh on me right? the loss in money making potential would be their incentive)

To be fair, fixing issues like those might be easier than the ones affect us "sim" heads. Quick server side patches could be out in a matter of minutes, where as fixing the old systems in Madden may be like trying to find a needle in a haystack (more on this later).

But even with that being true, don't most "sim" heads feel like we are being ignored? In the end it is a lose-lose situation for EA. The more they try to tweak the old systems the more potential there is for them to break something else.

In the end Madden has the hardest row to hoe. Their software was the least future proof (seems like) and because of that they cannot easily interact with the community without getting attacked or asked a million questions. This leads me into my next thought...

2. Is it possible that the reason there are so many problems with Madden this year is because EA is putting in the framework for a better all around game? Everyone knows that a 1 year development cycle makes it hard to be too innovative, especially with the archaic systems the game uses.

It has been discussed that the Madden team take a year off of the game, just putting out a patch and roster update for $20 bucks, and take 2 years to really turn the game around. This is impossible for many reasons.

So what if the reason the game is in the current state is because EA is really taking 2 years to really change the game (as in they designed a new framework for Madden that they knew could potentially cause a slew of issues in other areas but would make it easier to implement new systems down the road). They could never say something like that, they would deny it, if it ever came out people would be fired, but what if that was their plan. Install the framework for the next gen madden, then next year install new systems to rewrite most of the game. It might be a pipe dream, but with next gen consoles coming out in, maybe, 2014...what if.

Madden 2013 - new framework.
Madden 2014 - rewritten AI, sim stats, IE 2.0, other systems.
Madden 2015 (on Xbox 720 and PS4) - New graphics system, reworked animations system.

I dunno, this is all conjecture on my part. But I have to think EA has a plan...don't they? lol.

Option A- they have a plan for a better Madden
Option B- they are the only game in town so they don't care
Option C- they are "NBA Live-ing" Madden into the ground

Hey, I am trying to be optimistic here. Believe me, I am still cynical about this years Madden (No intense close games because of the terrible late game AI, franchise stats unrealistic, bad rosters, etc), but I want to believe there is a future for this game.

This is not true. 80% of people who purchase Madden don't play online. It would be organizational suicide to neglect the 80%.

[Illustrator76]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

This is not true. 80% of people who purchase Madden don't play online. It would be organizational suicide to neglect the 80%.

Well due to the horrible CPU AI (and a slew of other issues), 80% of the people can't play OFFLINE this year, so what exactly is Tiburon doing other than pushing as many units as possible? I don't even think they know or care at this point.

[Big FN Deal]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

I want to tread lightly with what I am about to post because I don't want to unintentionally offend people with the truth, as I see it. I don't understand why so many Madden gamers seem to limit their perceptions about football gaming, according to how EA Tubrion currently chooses to make Madden. Just because currently in Madden, the way it's programmed, it's difficult to play a solid game of football online against RANDOMS, doesn't mean that playing online equates to not being "sim".

This is not about online versus offline, it's just a matter of Madden not currently being capable of replicating applicable aspects of football well enough. The only advantage, aside from the server side "patching", to playing online against other LIKE MINED Users is that they can make up for the lacking AI playcalling and team management in CCM. The downside to that, imo, is that they can also make up for the limitations of AI players on the field by overriding their ratings but I digress.

We are all stuck in this NFL exclusive together and at the mercy of what EA Tiburon chooses to do with the game. So let's not make this about how people choose to play the game, offline or online, because most of us are just trying to find the best way to enjoy the only current NFL football "SIMULATION" video game we got, in a realistic manner.

[rayb]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

Sometimes change is not always a good thing. Why didnt they just keep the game like it was in 05? Been playing that on PC a little..tons of options for us "sim " heads. Use that framework and combine it with todays graphics, gameplay.etc you have a huge winner. I understand that they feel they have to change the game so people dont accuse them of re-releasing the "same old"..But if that "same old" was a wicked game..Im sure the die-hards would be ok with that.

[Big FN Deal]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

Well due to the horrible CPU AI (and a slew of other issues), 80% of the people can't play OFFLINE this year, so what exactly is Tiburon doing other than pushing as many units as possible? I don't even think they know or care at this point.

Also, to this point, I just don't understand it because a Madden that plays well offline, with solid football fundamentals and AI, would just be enhanced with online capability. I just don't get why EA Tiburon or anyone else would have the perception that the way the game plays offline and online, should somehow be different. Just build a solid "offline" Madden with online capabilities.

[tfer717]

Re: A conversation about EA Philosophy

This is not true. 80% of people who purchase Madden don't play online. It would be organizational suicide to neglect the 80%.

I don't really know how this makes sense. So 4 out of 5 people don't play online? But when the game released it was said that a huge percentage of people were online with ccm (although the game really give you no other choice).