Passing Accuracy

[eskimos44]

As it is now, passing accuracy for all current football games seems to be a roll of the dice. Sure, its rating based, but is there that much difference between my starting QB and my backup? Both seem to be able to hit my WRs in stride on deep balls, outs, ins, flags, crosses, etc...

There is a disconnect between the user and the QB that makes it feel as if anyone can throw a 55 yard deep ball right on the money just by tapping the button.

Now, just got around to playing the demo of MLB2K12. Every throw from one of your fielders has an accuracy meter tied to it. Press the button to throw, release the button when in the "sweet spot" for an accurate throw to a base. The better the player and the easier the throw, seem to give the user a bigger "sweet spot".

Notice the green area on the meter. That's the "sweet spot". Red is a bad throw and yellow is OK.


Now, could this work for football. One could assume so. QBs with higher accuracy ratings would be given a bigger cushion for accurate passes. Could also make the meter dynamic by increasing or decreasing the "sweet spot" depending on certain variables. Pressure in the pocket, QB rolling out, windy, or even an existing injury could effect the meter negatively, Conversely, a hot streak(completing multiple passes in a row), time in the pocket, and the QB being able to step into a throw could increase the cushion.

Buttons would be used as they are now. Each corresponding with a certain receiver. Let's say you want to throw a 10 yard in to your TE. Press the button to start your arm going back and release the button when the meter is in the sweet spot. Miss the sweet spot, and the pass may sail or go behind your intended target. Hit the sweet spot and the throw is on target and now a completed pass depends on coverage and your TEs ability to catch.

But here's where this idea may run into trouble. Right now, the length we hold down the button determines what type of pass we throw. Lob or bullet. Thus, defeating the use of an accuracy meter. Only thing I could think of was mapping a trigger button(RT) to throw a bullet pass. Not sure I want to go that route though.

Just trying to get more user input with what happens on the field, instead of a roll of the dice.

[grabursock55]

Re: Passing Accuracy

pretty solid idea... i like it

[drift7one]

Re: Passing Accuracy

it would definitely take some sort of remapping a control. only way I see it working would be to hold down the receiver icon button, and then when the meter reaches the green press a designated throwing button (which then depending on the duration held down would determine the pass type). the only downside would be how long that could take, depending on maybe how fast the meter moves (could player awareness effect that?).
but ultimately it would have to be an option to turn on/off.

I cant remember which game it was exactly, but there was an older football game where when passing, you actually controlled a crosshair with the right analog stick and had to move it around the field to pick a spot to throw the ball. so it required a lot more skill than just pressing a button for a specific receiver.

EDIT: it was NFL Fever 2004, "Read and Lead" feature

[ActLikeYouCrow]

Re: Passing Accuracy

i never played fever, but i like its concept the most. because user has to make a decision on where to place the ball then you have the talent aspect on top of that of whether the qb is talented enough to get the ball in that exact spot. the meter idea could work too, but definitely would like to see the rating of the player and skill of the user matter.

[Big FN Deal]

Re: Passing Accuracy

I like the premise of this idea and I think implementing it the way a basketball game handles jump shots is the best method to prevent on screen meters. In that basketball game, like in the baseball game, there are ratings for accuracy while the "sweet spot" of the release determines how close to that player's max accuracy or rating, the User has on any given shot. Now translate that over to football for targeting receivers, including having the signature throwing motions for each QB, varying their "sweet spot" like the basketball games does with signature shot motions.

This also is a good way to implement the same system basketball games use to allow defensive pressure, not just direct contact, to effect the accuracy of shots, into the passing game. That way less AWR/composed QBs can have their accuracy effected by defenders bearing down on them and collapsing the pocket, without them having to actually make contact, so defensive pressure matters, not just sacks.

Like others have alluded to, this would require them to map the lob/bullet pass mechanic away from the pass icon buttons. Considering I would like to see route based passing added and possibly mapped to the RT, I think the lob/bullet mechanic could be mapped to the left analog stick. Just like the hold time of the pass icon button currently determines lob or bullet, map that to the left stick so that that the longer/more forceful the left stick is pushed in a given the direction, the more force put behind the throw. For example, a lob over the left outside shoulder would simply be a tap of the left stick at the 10 o'clock position during a pass attempt and a bullet pass over that same shoulder would be keeping the left stick held at 10 o'clock during a pass attempt.

[Skyboxer]

Re: Passing Accuracy

Yes Fevers Read and Lead "Throw Anywhere and not just push a button" was for me (and still is), the best passing system made. It just needed some tweaks to the speed of the cursor.
You could also hold LT or RT to throw it higher or lower etc..

Yet here in 2013 we still have the same old, outdated, boring, sleep inducing passing system.

[aerovt]

Re: Passing Accuracy

all that would be nice and all, but the problem is ALL qbs are just way way too accurate.

If its a completed pass, its pretty much always on the money. Over/under throws are normally always just WAY off.

I dont care how they implement it, but most college qbs are inaccurate enough that the WRs are going to have to make at least small adjustments on most throws greater than 5-10 yds out. Of course for this to matter, they'll have to make momentum affect BOTH WRs and DBs, and would also need to make WRs more aggressive in going for the ball instead of what they have now.

If you played this game, youd get the feeling most passes in college hit the receivers in stride no matter how bad the qb or how deep the throw.

[canesfins]

Re: Passing Accuracy

Wow I have no clue why i never thought of this before. Great simple idea that I would love to see in the game in the near future.

[WipeOut464]

Re: Passing Accuracy

all that would be nice and all, but the problem is ALL qbs are just way way too accurate.

If its a completed pass, its pretty much always on the money. Over/under throws are normally always just WAY off.

I dont care how they implement it, but most college qbs are inaccurate enough that the WRs are going to have to make at least small adjustments on most throws greater than 5-10 yds out. Of course for this to matter, they'll have to make momentum affect BOTH WRs and DBs, and would also need to make WRs more aggressive in going for the ball instead of what they have now.

If you played this game, youd get the feeling most passes in college hit the receivers in stride no matter how bad the qb or how deep the throw.

Good stuff.

One way to solve this without having to remap the controller (I'm not a big fan of using the shoulder buttons for lob/bullet or high/low) would be to make a "Catch Zone" that's dependent on QB Accuracy.

It'd work like this: as soon as the QB releases the ball, you'd get a circular zone at the point of the ball's potential impact with the ground. This would replace the always-100%-accurate target we have now. The ball would then travel to anywhere in the zone - the better the QB's accuracy the smaller the zone. Also, the further the pass, the bigger the zone; and an off-balance or cross-body throw would cause a bigger zone, too. It's then on the WR to find the ball's spot in the zone.

This way WRs would have to adjust their route to get to the ball. A tight zone and a WR with a good RTE rating would mean the WR might catch the ball right in stride. Conversely, a Frosh QB with a bigger zone might put the ball behind the WR and cause him to attempt a tougher catch or miss it altogether.

Using this kind of system better replicates the actual act of passing football and also makes the QB ACC, WR RTE, and WR AWR ratings actually mean something.

Of course, like aerovt said, EA would have to rework the WRs so that they'd actually aggressively go for the ball. You know, like real football.

[Big FN Deal]

Re: Passing Accuracy

I know we all have varying ideas about how to better represent pass accuracy but does everyone at least agree that there shouldn't be on screen meters, if possible? At the very least an option to disable any on screen meters of a new mechanic.

[Gotmadskillzson]

Re: Passing Accuracy

I don't want on screen meters. Better ways of separating elite from scrub to experienced to rookie.

1. Ratings: Short, medium, deep, throw on the run, play action. It is long over due NCAA brings this over from Madden.

2. Bring back composure rating and bring consistency rating over from Madden.

Those ratings right there would be much better then a meter. If the ratings are rated correctly and spread out from 0 to 100 instead of 60 to 100 with most players rated in the mid 80s and 90s by default, you would have no problem telling who the better and more experienced QB is. The reason it is so hard for NCAA is because they only have throw power and throw accuracy. And by default every QB is rating in the mid 80s and above in both.

[Big FN Deal]

Re: Passing Accuracy

I don't want on screen meters. Better ways of separating elite from scrub to experienced to rookie.

1. Ratings: Short, medium, deep, throw on the run, play action. It is long over due NCAA brings this over from Madden.

2. Bring back composure rating and bring consistency rating over from Madden.

Those ratings right there would be much better then a meter. If the ratings are rated correctly and spread out from 0 to 100 instead of 60 to 100 with most players rated in the mid 80s and 90s by default, you would have no problem telling who the better and more experienced QB is. The reason it is so hard for NCAA is because they only have throw power and throw accuracy. And by default every QB is rating in the mid 80s and above in both.

I agree that stuff should added and of course about no meters GMS but it's not like that stuff differentiates QBs well in Madden right now. I know in M13, I tried all kind of sliders and what not to make passing harder for less skilled QBs to no avail, online. Now, maybe they fixed that via patch after I traded the game in Oct but that stuff wasn't very effective when I had the game.

I currently have no idea how EA football games determine pass accuracy, it just seems random for missed passes, like the OP stated. I remember having Rex Grossman in M12 and being able to throw down field without the least bit of concern.

[Gotmadskillzson]

Re: Passing Accuracy

Best game of Madden 13 is played in CCM after their last patch.....think it came in November or December. Weird but some reason nothing works as good as it does in CCM. CCM game play is almost like a separate Madden 13.

Meters won't look right in football simply due to it is more players closed together then in baseball or soccer. They already adding a stamina meter under the players. So to add this type of meter the OP is talking about, they either going to have to add a second meter under the stamina meter or put it above the player's head.

[booker21]

Re: Passing Accuracy

As it is now, passing accuracy for all current football games seems to be a roll of the dice. Sure, its rating based, but is there that much difference between my starting QB and my backup? Both seem to be able to hit my WRs in stride on deep balls, outs, ins, flags, crosses, etc...

There is a disconnect between the user and the QB that makes it feel as if anyone can throw a 55 yard deep ball right on the money just by tapping the button.

Now, just got around to playing the demo of MLB2K12. Every throw from one of your fielders has an accuracy meter tied to it. Press the button to throw, release the button when in the "sweet spot" for an accurate throw to a base. The better the player and the easier the throw, seem to give the user a bigger "sweet spot".

Notice the green area on the meter. That's the "sweet spot". Red is a bad throw and yellow is OK.


Now, could this work for football. One could assume so. QBs with higher accuracy ratings would be given a bigger cushion for accurate passes. Could also make the meter dynamic by increasing or decreasing the "sweet spot" depending on certain variables. Pressure in the pocket, QB rolling out, windy, or even an existing injury could effect the meter negatively, Conversely, a hot streak(completing multiple passes in a row), time in the pocket, and the QB being able to step into a throw could increase the cushion.

Buttons would be used as they are now. Each corresponding with a certain receiver. Let's say you want to throw a 10 yard in to your TE. Press the button to start your arm going back and release the button when the meter is in the sweet spot. Miss the sweet spot, and the pass may sail or go behind your intended target. Hit the sweet spot and the throw is on target and now a completed pass depends on coverage and your TEs ability to catch.

But here's where this idea may run into trouble. Right now, the length we hold down the button determines what type of pass we throw. Lob or bullet. Thus, defeating the use of an accuracy meter. Only thing I could think of was mapping a trigger button(RT) to throw a bullet pass. Not sure I want to go that route though.

Just trying to get more user input with what happens on the field, instead of a roll of the dice.

I just love this!

[booker21]

Re: Passing Accuracy

I don't want on screen meters. Better ways of separating elite from scrub to experienced to rookie.

1. Ratings: Short, medium, deep, throw on the run, play action. It is long over due NCAA brings this over from Madden.

2. Bring back composure rating and bring consistency rating over from Madden.

Those ratings right there would be much better then a meter. If the ratings are rated correctly and spread out from 0 to 100 instead of 60 to 100 with most players rated in the mid 80s and 90s by default, you would have no problem telling who the better and more experienced QB is. The reason it is so hard for NCAA is because they only have throw power and throw accuracy. And by default every QB is rating in the mid 80s and above in both.

The thing is that real sim players has been playing with QB acc at 5, 10 sometimes 15 etc. No one leave it at 50 or at default.

Ratings means nothing with this game. specially QB acc.