Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

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  • Phobia
    Hall Of Fame
    • Jan 2008
    • 11623

    #271
    Originally posted by jpdavis82
    Here's the best jukes of all time, feel free to compare and contrast to the trailer
    I want to comment about something with this video.

    The last couple years, player movement has been talked about as one of the primary areas that need to be fixed in EA football. Now I seriously thought this year would be the year it was addressed after NHL 13 revamped its movement system based on weight, momentum, and speed the player is traveling.

    I'm not sure if EA didn't not understand correctly the complaints and thought "more moves" is what we meant with player movement? I don't know but it is baffling the most critical component of the sport has been neglected for a entire console life span.

    Running is the most important trait of football, every player on the field does it each and every play. It is also what makes the game of football. Change of direction, using someone's momentum against them, poor angles of attack, I could go on and on .

    Now my connection with the above video. Don't watch the ball carrier, we can do similar moves to what those ball carriers are doing, while it might not look exact we do have animations that portray these real moves. The key is watching the defenders around the ball carrier. This is what EA football has never been able to simulate.

    You never see defenders have their momentum carry them out a play, you never see defenders get turned around, or stutter stepping trying to slow their speed so they can make a play on the ball. In EA football every defenders flies at the ball carrier with perfection and the only way we make guys miss is if the "whiff" animation is triggered on the defender or if our blockers pick up everyone correctly.

    So my biggest complaint is the fact the game will still play not like football. Instead it plays like the defenders have auto-lock on and you are attempting to "weave" your floating ball carrier around blockers and hoping his ratings trigger more broken tackles.

    Truly fix the movement system and you fix EA football for the most part. It is clearly the area that holds the most impact!


    Sent from da lil phone.
    Last edited by Phobia; 05-05-2013, 10:13 PM.

    Comment

    • Sausage
      MVP
      • Feb 2003
      • 3905

      #272
      Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

      Originally posted by Phobia
      I want to comment about something with this video.

      The last couple years, player movement has been talked about as one of the primary areas that need to be fixed in EA football. Now I seriously thought this year would be the year it was addressed after NHL 13 revamped its movement system based on weight, momentum, and speed the player is traveling.

      I'm not sure if EA didn't not understand correctly the complaints and thought "more moves" is what we meant with player movement? I don't know but it is baffling the most critical component of the sport has been neglected for a entire console life span.

      Running is the most important trait of football, every player on the field does it each and every play. It is also what makes the game of football. Change of direction, using someone's momentum against them, poor angles of attack, I could go on and on .

      Now my connection with the above video. Don't watch the ball carrier, we can do similar moves to what those ball carriers are doing, while it might not look exact we do have animations that portray these real moves. The key is watching the defenders around the ball carrier. This is what EA football has never been able to simulate.

      You never see defenders have their momentum carry them out a play, you never see defenders get turned around, or stutter stepping trying to slow their speed so they can make a play on the ball. In EA football every defenders flies at the ball carrier with perfection and the only way we make guys miss is if the "whiff" animation is triggered on the defender or if our blockers pick up everyone correctly.

      So my biggest complaint is the fact the game will still play not like football. Instead it plays like the defenders have auto-lock on and you are attempting to "weave" your floating ball carrier around blockers and hoping his ratings trigger more broken tackles.


      Sent from da lil phone.
      Very well said You mentioned how defenders are on auto-lock this year it is a feature called "heat seeker". Another thing you said they either totally miscomprehend our concerns or just smarter than all of us.

      Comment

      • TreFacTor
        MVP
        • Oct 2009
        • 1138

        #273
        Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

        Originally posted by RGiles36
        Like I've said in the past, I've pushed all my chips to the next gen table. I've been on board with Madden in recent years b/c I felt the game improved each year. I didn't feel that way w/ M13 b/c of the amount of bugs that went unaddressed. With no football game to play, my Xbox has been used sparingly, and I've grown to be ok with that.

        I'm not spending another generation trying to see the forest through the trees. I'm not spending another generation wondering why they can't get the presentation quite right. I'm not spending another generation wondering why Tiburon is not obsessed about the details (player models, sig animations, **CPU playcalling, uniform accuracy, etc) like us fans are.

        M13, for better or worse, has shown me that I don't NEED NFL gaming as a hobby as I once thought I did.

        I hope for the best, and hope Kolbe's impact is felt immediately with the new systems. If it's not, I won't be pouting on the forums. I won't have some angry tirade about how NFL gaming is dead. Rather, I'll gracefully put the 'sticks down and walk away.

        **Speaking of CPU play calling, considering how bad it was last year, you'd think there would be a M25 play book on AI enhancements. Add it to the "must haves" list for next gen I guess .

        I figured M25 would be a swan song, I said it a while ago
        I'm giving them until game 2 on the PS4 and 720. The two consoles will never be closer in specs than at that point. There will be no excuse that if Madden is to call itself a true simulation of the NFL, and version two of a console cycle is all any dev team should need to bring their best product in a sequel/series/Lone Ranger

        If they can't get it right by then I can end all critique and concern. Well said.
        Originally posted by Phobia
        I want to comment about something with this video.

        The last couple years, player movement has been talked about as one of the primary areas that need to be fixed in EA football. Now I seriously thought this year would be the year it was addressed after NHL 13 revamped its movement system based on weight, momentum, and speed the player is traveling.

        I'm not sure if EA didn't not understand correctly the complaints and thought "more moves" is what we meant with player movement? I don't know but it is baffling the most critical component of the sport has been neglected for a entire console life span.

        Running is the most important trait of football, every player on the field does it each and every play. It is also what makes the game of football. Change of direction, using someone's momentum against them, poor angles of attack, I could go on and on .

        Now my connection with the above video. Don't watch the ball carrier, we can do similar moves to what those ball carriers are doing, while it might not look exact we do have animations that portray these real moves. The key is watching the defenders around the ball carrier. This is what EA football has never been able to simulate.

        You never see defenders have their momentum carry them out a play, you never see defenders get turned around, or stutter stepping trying to slow their speed so they can make a play on the ball. In EA football every defenders flies at the ball carrier with perfection and the only way we make guys miss is if the "whiff" animation is triggered on the defender or if our blockers pick up everyone correctly.

        So my biggest complaint is the fact the game will still play not like football. Instead it plays like the defenders have auto-lock on and you are attempting to "weave" your floating ball carrier around blockers and hoping his ratings trigger more broken tackles.

        Truly fix the movement system and you fix EA football for the most part. It is clearly the area that holds the most impact!


        Sent from da lil phone.
        This is how the practice blocking dummies were for ages. I'm guessing that's why they removed that from the game so people wouldn't catch on that instead of pylons they're replaced with NFL avatars that pretty much act, react the same way.
        Last edited by TreFacTor; 05-06-2013, 12:27 AM.
        Proud Beta tester for NFL 2K Dreamcast
        "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity."

        Comment

        • cowboy_kmoney
          MVP
          • Jun 2008
          • 1621

          #274
          Well im tired of waiting on the on the ppl that has been able to make this game. But i find myself year after year hoping on the day they bring it. But were not there yet and it is some good in the games, i mean if they ad in some of the key things that will keep our heads in the game and give us reason to keep it in our xbox. They will be fine. Me i dnt knw why the life of me they dnt record each players probowls and superbowls in their award history. As well as the superbowl M.V.P. when it is one by that player. Everbody is not going to the hall of fame y do i have to go over there and look at superbowls won but i dnt get to see the year they one it or what team.

          Comment

          • kingscrown
            Banned
            • May 2013
            • 18

            #275
            Reason why the game isn't were we want it is simply to expensive to get it there that's my opinion

            Comment

            • KBLover
              Hall Of Fame
              • Aug 2009
              • 12172

              #276
              Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

              Originally posted by Trick13
              That is a major concern in my opinion, the left stick movements should force "foot-planting" and body "lean" and angle at which the legs, feet, ankles and ground are "interacting" with each other.
              What's funny is that if I move the L-stick sharp enough (like from 2 o'clock to 9 o'clock to make a sharp move), the player WILL plant and make what looked more like M12's juke.

              So it's like it's "there" but not prominent enough.

              So much of that in this game, which is why I'm about [--this--] close to being done.

              M13 pushed me to the brink - right now M14-but-we-want-to-be-cute-and-call-it-25 is about to do the same.

              And I'm tired of hearing 'next gen' for any "real" improvements. Maybe I don't "get" console gaming (I'll freely admit to being a PC gamer at heart) but why is the PS3 insufficient for doing what we're asking for? What makes the PS4 that much better - and what makes us think EA won't use whatever extra power in that system for stuff other than deeper realism and better player logic, AI, and football behavior?
              Last edited by KBLover; 05-06-2013, 03:21 AM.
              "Some people call it butterflies, but to him, it probably feels like pterodactyls in his stomach." --Plesac in MLB18

              Comment

              • K_GUN
                C*t*z*n *f RSN
                • Jul 2002
                • 3891

                #277
                Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

                Originally posted by RGiles36
                Like I've said in the past, I've pushed all my chips to the next gen table. I've been on board with Madden in recent years b/c I felt the game improved each year. I didn't feel that way w/ M13 b/c of the amount of bugs that went unaddressed. With no football game to play, my Xbox has been used sparingly, and I've grown to be ok with that.

                I'm not spending another generation trying to see the forest through the trees. I'm not spending another generation wondering why they can't get the presentation quite right. I'm not spending another generation wondering why Tiburon is not obsessed about the details (player models, sig animations, **CPU playcalling, uniform accuracy, etc) like us fans are.

                M13, for better or worse, has shown me that I don't NEED NFL gaming as a hobby as I once thought I did.

                I hope for the best, and hope Kolbe's impact is felt immediately with the new systems. If it's not, I won't be pouting on the forums. I won't have some angry tirade about how NFL gaming is dead. Rather, I'll gracefully put the 'sticks down and walk away.

                **Speaking of CPU play calling, considering how bad it was last year, you'd think there would be a M25 play book on AI enhancements. Add it to the "must haves" list for next gen I guess .
                very well said...in fact......my exact thoughts about a year ago...i didnt purchase M13....once in a while when i have 30-45 minutes to burn i'll fire up M12 and *try* to play a franchise game.....madden/tiburon has allowed me to say goodbye to football gaming....and not miss it
                Bummed that you're not on my ignore list yet?.....Don't worry, I'm sure you will be very soon.

                Comment

                • UMhester04
                  MVP
                  • Nov 2006
                  • 1384

                  #278
                  Originally posted by Sausage
                  Very well said You mentioned how defenders are on auto-lock this year it is a feature called "heat seeker". Another thing you said they either totally miscomprehend our concerns or just smarter than all of us.

                  It's not just this year, it's been like this since the 360 came out. Take a punt return for example.

                  Once you field the punt, move in a direction and watch all the people on the coverage team (that are not engaged in a block) turn right with you, the very second you move the stick.

                  THAT is the problem.

                  Comment

                  • ch46647
                    MVP
                    • Aug 2006
                    • 3514

                    #279
                    Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

                    Originally posted by RGiles36
                    Like I've said in the past, I've pushed all my chips to the next gen table. I've been on board with Madden in recent years b/c I felt the game improved each year. I didn't feel that way w/ M13 b/c of the amount of bugs that went unaddressed. With no football game to play, my Xbox has been used sparingly, and I've grown to be ok with that.

                    I'm not spending another generation trying to see the forest through the trees. I'm not spending another generation wondering why they can't get the presentation quite right. I'm not spending another generation wondering why Tiburon is not obsessed about the details (player models, sig animations, **CPU playcalling, uniform accuracy, etc) like us fans are.

                    M13, for better or worse, has shown me that I don't NEED NFL gaming as a hobby as I once thought I did.

                    I hope for the best, and hope Kolbe's impact is felt immediately with the new systems. If it's not, I won't be pouting on the forums. I won't have some angry tirade about how NFL gaming is dead. Rather, I'll gracefully put the 'sticks down and walk away.

                    **Speaking of CPU play calling, considering how bad it was last year, you'd think there would be a M25 play book on AI enhancements. Add it to the "must haves" list for next gen I guess .
                    Very well said Rgiles and I completely agree. Are you still an EA Game Changer? If so ,did you get an opportunity to go down this year?

                    If you go down, I hope the EA Gamechanger group is really harping on the importance of this next-gen product. We have had 8-9 brutal years of football gaming and they really need to turn this thing around.

                    The first true gamplay trailer for Next-Gen (not some CGI video) will tell me everything I need to know for the next 7-8 years on these next-gen consoles. We will all be able to immediately tell if the Tiburon team is keeping true to their word on creating a much better and more realistic experience. Or if it is just more of the same and they are simply pushing out a sub-par product to earn a quick buck, by capitalizing on the fact they are the only NFL football game around.

                    Comment

                    • simfballcritic
                      EA Game Changer
                      • Jul 2009
                      • 187

                      #280
                      Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

                      What's up guys,

                      I did a quick video explaining some of the things that was shown in the trailer. Hope this helps to clear up some of the questions you may have.

                      <iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Jx3W1k1Pum4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
                      Sim

                      Comment

                      • RGiles36
                        MVP
                        • Jan 2008
                        • 3957

                        #281
                        Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

                        Originally posted by ch46647
                        Very well said Rgiles and I completely agree. Are you still an EA Game Changer? If so ,did you get an opportunity to go down this year?
                        As far as I know, I'm still a GC .

                        I was fortunate to be invited a couple times, but I haven't been able to make it down. I switched employers last year, and am not afforded the same flexibility as I had before.

                        There's some good guys who have made it down though, including TSS. I hope to get back on the ball before too long.
                        Twitter

                        Comment

                        • slick589
                          Banned
                          • Nov 2009
                          • 1285

                          #282
                          Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

                          So is anyone still curious about the infinity engine 2.0 video we were supposed to get?

                          Comment

                          • roadman
                            *ll St*r
                            • Aug 2003
                            • 26339

                            #283
                            Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

                            Originally posted by slick589
                            So is anyone still curious about the infinity engine 2.0 video we were supposed to get?
                            I've seen it mentioned here lately, but I don't recall EA saying they would show us a video.

                            It's hell getting older.

                            If they did, they could throw us a little crumb.

                            Honestly, I'm more interested in the frostbite engine and see how that looks.

                            Comment

                            • DeuceDouglas
                              Madden Dev Team
                              • Apr 2010
                              • 4297

                              #284
                              Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

                              Originally posted by roadman
                              I've seen it mentioned here lately, but I don't recall EA saying they would show us a video.

                              It's hell getting older.

                              If they did, they could throw us a little crumb.

                              Honestly, I'm more interested in the frostbite engine and see how that looks.
                              I still feel like that's what they're waiting on. I feel like if we get anything it will be nothing more than a short trailer or a video with a few clips. I think they're going to want to show it all off on next-gen. Long story short, speculation is fun.

                              Comment

                              • BleedGreen710
                                Eagles Fan
                                • Oct 2012
                                • 4025

                                #285
                                Re: Madden NFL 25 Video - Playbook: Run Free with Trey Wingo and Doug Martin

                                those moves look really great but we should only see those kind of moves work once or twice a game

                                I feel like we are going to see those kind of moves every other play

                                that's not realistic

                                Comment

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