Dominant play is not rewarded properly

[BearClaw]

These guys are suppose to be representation of college football players. I don't give a damn about who they are as a person, at the age of twenty there is nobody with the intestinal fortitude to stand stonefaced in the pocket and throw a pinpoint perfect pass while a DE is leveling them on 8 outta 10 plays, they can not dust themselves off and get back to the old grind when they get burned by the man across from them. There needs to be some sort of progressive fatigue and confidence system that rewards teams for dominance by effecting every player on the field. If they're getting there bell rung or clocks cleaned on every play there should be adverse effect .

In my Oregon Dynasty I played every defensive possession as Tony Washington. In that time I netted 16 total sacks and 20+ TFL, and not once did I see a HB or FB line up behind the guard to add an extra layer of protection. Now that may seem like a complaint about CPU offensive AI but it's not, because there was no need for them to add that extra blocker. The man across from me was able to put up a fight on every down, and not once was the QB thrown out of rhythm. My defensive effort was neutralized by the game.

[uofmsteve]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

I really like this idea, very well thought out. It would put a lot more empathis on depth and you could even make some sort of attribute out of it. The thoughts of physically pounding the rock at the defense for three quarters and it finally paying off in the fourth makes me a happy man! Much more realistic then what EA has put out this year, BRAVO.

[BearClaw]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

I really like this idea, very well thought out. It would put a lot more empathis on depth and you could even make some sort of attribute out of it. The thoughts of physically pounding the rock at the defense for three quarters and it finally paying off in the fourth makes me a happy man! Much more realistic then what EA has put out this year, BRAVO.

Bingo! At some point someone on either the offensive line, defensive line or the HB should break. If you or the CPU is continually getting those 3-5 yds inside it shouldn't just continue at that pace the entire game. There should be a reason to make a defensive adjustment to prevent the big one that in an actual game football is guaranteed to come because players get mentally and physically worn out. Instead there is no incentive to make a serious adjustment, just a small shift in the line or change in tackling mentality and all is right with the world. We should see a linebacker or tackle get planted and the HB who's been chugging along running roughshod all over the secondary.

Or say your first few running plays get stonewalled and after getting smacked around for a few quarters a backs legs should start to wear on him, his step might not be as quick as he's cautious about a certain defender and ultimately the dominant defense is rewarded by forcing a complete change in the offense scheme and an offensive line that's running on fumes. However the odds of a big play for either team stay exactly the same throughout the entire game.

[ghettogeeksta]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

This will never happen in a EA Sports football game, it's too realistic and EA does not want to make a realistic football game, they want to make a fun football game, and what you are mentioning is not that fun. The good news is that I think other companies will be allowed to make college football games next year so hopefully NCAA Football get some competition next gen.

Watch as 70 rated Georgia State Qb throws a strike in between 3 Alabama receivers with pressure in his face.
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/p8BYvY-Zxc8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[reedracer]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

>oregon dynasty



wow


so difficult

clap

skill

professional

[uofmsteve]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

I completely understand what you're saying, but at the same time you can only throw so many 60 yard bombs until you get tired of it. That being said EA got their $60 and after that they could probably careless how much you play it.

[BBallcoach]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

so adjust the sliders... There is an entire forum about getting realistic play. And as someone who gets a lot of pressure, the CPU defense does bring in extra blockers and I have to switch up my defense. Are QB's too accurate? yup and thats why i adjusted both the cpu and human sliders to make it more realistic...

You might say, that should be that way out of the box! But as one said EA has to make the game accessible to all. messing with the sliders is how you get sim ball

[BearClaw]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

so adjust the sliders... There is an entire forum about getting realistic play. And as someone who gets a lot of pressure, the CPU defense does bring in extra blockers and I have to switch up my defense. Are QB's too accurate? yup and thats why i adjusted both the cpu and human sliders to make it more realistic...

You might say, that should be that way out of the box! But as one said EA has to make the game accessible to all. messing with the sliders is how you get sim ball

You're point while valid to a discussion, makes no sense in this one. My mentioning of the stats in the op was simply a point of reference. At no point did I mention things not being difficult enough or referencing my own personal skill level (i honestly nobody gave a damn about it on OS) at all. This has nothing to do with difficulty level or anything of the sort. It has to do with how the game handles specific aspects of football. The tension of a fourth quarter can only be self inflicted because of the game clock and that's it. The confidence of a quarterback is represented by a bunch of squiggles that in all actuality have no effect on the game. Fatigue is essentially a turbo meter that's refilled after a timeout or short change in possession.

If my QB is getting his *** handed to him but he's still getting the ball out, there should be a side effect of it. If he gets hit that means my line is getting bulldozed, and after a few drives of that the dline should have an easier time of getting to the qb than they did when the game started. However that is not the case. At some point my quarterback should get rattled and start making less accurate throws...until I change something and can build back his confidence.

[The_Rick_14]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

If my QB is getting his *** handed to him but he's still getting the ball out, there should be a side effect of it. If he gets hit that means my line is getting bulldozed, and after a few drives of that the dline should have an easier time of getting to the qb than they did when the game started. However that is not the case. At some point my quarterback should get rattled and start making less accurate throws...until I change something and can build back his confidence.

I've played QB in D3 football games where that situation happened all game. The other team ended up with double digit knockdowns but zero sacks. It pissed the dline off more that I was consistently getting the ball out before they could reach me which actually made my line's job easier. Those hits actually focused me up more and I was more accurate later in that game, not the other way around even though I continued to take a hit here and there.

I think you are missing the fact that competitive people have a boatload of pride that drives them at moments of adversity. Yes some people tuck and run, but let's be honest, those are not the people who end up as starters on D1 football programs. Strength coaches, spring conditioning, and three-a-days make damn sure of that.

Just because a DE bull-rushes a tackle and wins, that doesn't mean the tackle is going to lay down the rest of the game. I really think you are over-simplifying something that is way more complex then you're making it out to be.

[BearClaw]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

I've played QB in D3 football games where that situation happened all game. The other team ended up with double digit knockdowns but zero sacks. It pissed the dline off more that I was consistently getting the ball out before they could reach me which actually made my line's job easier. Those hits actually focused me up more and I was more accurate later in that game, not the other way around even though I continued to take a hit here and there.

I think you are missing the fact that competitive people have a boatload of pride that drives them at moments of adversity. Yes some people tuck and run, but let's be honest, those are not the people who end up as starters on D1 football programs. Strength coaches, spring conditioning, and three-a-days make damn sure of that.

Just because a DE bull-rushes a tackle and wins, that doesn't mean the tackle is going to lay down the rest of the game. I really think you are over-simplifying something that is way more complex then you're making it out to be.

As you know football is a game of give and take, but video game football there is none of that. It's just "these are the odds and this is how it's going to be all game long." That's where your situation (love hearing that kinda stuff) and dynamics come into play, some players show will their killer instinct while others should fold, all of which in conjunction with a fatigue. Fatigue should be way more important than it is currently. We've all played in situations where our mind wanted to go beyond the distance but 12 rounds was all our body could take, the result of which is a drop in performance.

Of course all of this is just an idea and how exactly it'd be implemented is beyond my comprehension and there must be a system of checks and balances to make sure there is no superman 4th quarters (2k13 closer trait I'm looking at you). But it's a part of sport that needs to be represented.

[leathrneck34]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

Let's talk about a quarterback and getting flustered. Yeah I would agree a 3rd string quarterback or a very soft 1st string quarterback would be rattled after being beaten up by the defense and would more than likely be sidelined at some point with a concussion. But I remember atleast one quarterback in particular that took a beating and never missed a beat till he finally in season 2 went down for a couple weeks with a concussion. And his name was Tyler Wilson. I swear he took more hits in his two years starting for Arkansas and continued to play at a high level throughout than any QB in Arkansas history. I believe at least at QB these college kids get more and more bull headed about finishing the game the more hits they take just to say your not going to stop me like any 20 year old or 19 year old jackass kid would. Same thing with wideouts, unless you knock them out of the game I think they get back up more in defiance than anything. So I think that argument isn't valid as far as the young kids taking hits and it affecting them in a negative way. On the other hand having a game where the QB is taking a sack and can propel a pass downfield 40 yards and land on a dime isn't realistic either.

[The JareBear]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

Pressure definitely affects throwing accuracy in a per play sense, but you're right that is not a progressive cumulative effect

[The_Rick_14]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

As you know football is a game of give and take, but video game football there is none of that. It's just "these are the odds and this is how it's going to be all game long." That's where your situation (love hearing that kinda stuff) and dynamics come into play, some players show will their killer instinct while others should fold, all of which in conjunction with a fatigue. Fatigue should be way more important than it is currently. We've all played in situations where our mind wanted to go beyond the distance but 12 rounds was all our body could take, the result of which is a drop in performance.

Of course all of this is just an idea and how exactly it'd be implemented is beyond my comprehension and there must be a system of checks and balances to make sure there is no superman 4th quarters (2k13 closer trait I'm looking at you). But it's a part of sport that needs to be represented.

I'm with you that it can definitely be improved but I just didn't want it to come across as an over simplying something that is extremely complex.

Maybe through player traits they can find a nice balance to be able to show the difference between a guy who only plays well when nothing goes wrong and another one who can handle some adversity and come back even stronger.

Maybe as far as fatigue goes, I definitely know you feel less tired when things are doing your way so maybe include play result in the amount of stamina lost. That might be able to give you the illusion of an offensive line on a rolling drive, but a carry for negative yards would wipe that out or something.

The main problem is that it's something that's very difficult to model without doing exactly what you're afraid of and ending with a game that is basically won in the first quarter every time.

[BearClaw]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

Okay, games ending in the first quarter. Didnt think that one through, but how bout this? A skill in the head coaching Game Management skill tree that effects the (for lack of a better term) regeneration of a player's confidence between quarters, halves, and timeouts. A way to balance it out would be to make three levels like the other skills, but require a certain number of points to be spent before reaching the second and third levels. That way instead of being the Lombardi of college football right out of the gate, a coach needs to build up a résumé before they can really start impacting players.

[Gotmadskillzson]

Re: Dominant play is not rewarded properly

Okay, games ending in the first quarter. Didnt think that one through, but how bout this? A skill in the head coaching Game Management skill tree that effects the (for lack of a better term) regeneration of a player's confidence between quarters, halves, and timeouts. A way to balance it out would be to make three levels like the other skills, but require a certain number of points to be spent before reaching the second and third levels. That way instead of being the Lombardi of college football right out of the gate, a coach needs to build up a résumé before they can really start impacting players.

They already have that skill in the coaching tree this year......