NHL 14 - Be a GM and GM Connected Improvements

[actionhank]

Re: EA: BE A GM AND GM CONNECTED IMPROVEMENTS

Let's be honest here with ourselves.

Go back to NHL...09. I didn't get SUPER into hockey until around 3-4 years ago, and I remember playing this game and it being a pretty big deal.

Now. This was an epic game at the time. It was regarded as one of the very top sports games. And here we are coming to NHL 14 and the formula hasn't changed, but instead added to, year by year, and improved, year by year.

If it ain't broke, don't break it.

Are these games still good hockey games? Absolutely. Have they moved in directions that may not please the most hardcore simulator fan? Maybe. But the formula is still the same.

How can so many people complain and say they won't buy a game that is not broke? If the game seems stale to you, then congratulations, you're a true hockey fan and/or gamer. You've played the crap outta it and that's what happens when you do, things become stale. Just look at COD for a non-sports reference.

But that's not to excuse the obvious flaws, and glitches/bugs. Those will be there in any game that is trying to implement something new, move forward. If you do only what you feel safe doing, you will never do anything new and never give yourself the chance to move on to bigger and better things.

Lastly you must understand, if you create something that is not easily accessible to anyone and the casual people, then you are better off not creating a game at all. I don't think there are too many products or companies out there that are hugely successful that only appeal to their most hardcore audience.

By that reasoning though, we should all be driving Ford Model-T's.
They were the best at the time, and still function as a car, but compared to the progress of time, they're a bit lacking in features.
I understand people's frustrations. I'm one of them. I used to defend EA's NHL just because i know it's got to be tough working with a year's development cycle, but that excuse is losing ground.
Be a GM has been constantly ignored year after year. The biggest change i can think of them adding has been adding draft picks into trades.
Other than that, everything is still incredibly frustrating. There's so many small details that get constantly ignored, and it's just gotten to the point where Be a GM mode feels pretty much ignored, and they just throw a bone our way every now and again.
I play only Be a GM. Online doesn't do it for me, and I have no desire to do Be a Pro. So i hope that they do at least something to keep Be a GM interesting, and year after year it's the same thing. A minuscule update (This one is just sad. They didn't even add enough features to warrant a video, but made a decent length one on something as brief as the new fighting engine...)
It just gets frustrating trying to enjoy the game, and year after year finding it harder and harder to do.
Last year with NHL13, i couldn't even make it 6 months with the game, because it just got stale. I've wanted to play it again, and anytime i go back, i get 1, maybe 3 games in, before i just feel incredibly bored with the gameplay, the lack of any real feeling of involvement in Be A GM, and the lack of simple fixes to old problems.
I'm holding up hope for the Next-Gen, thinking maybe they're just stuck working with an old engine, and maybe the move to a Next-gen console will give them more abilities to have better physics, and graphics, but for the time being, i'll just sit this year out and see what comes down the pipe.

[CaptainSuperman]

Re: EA: BE A GM AND GM CONNECTED IMPROVEMENTS

1st off, comparing a Model T to todays car is insane. Top speed is much different (which is a main necessity of a car), and so are safety features. You'd be right about luxury features such as power doors, windows, seats, etc. But their formula needed change as the times got faster, and with faster times comes a need for better safety.

But at the same time, that was kinda my point. You think each and every car that came out after the T didn't have it's flaws? We still hear about recalls today for cars of all models. Going forward is a risk, and nothing will ever come out perfect your first attempt. 360's had red rings, PS3's had...something, right?

I've made this point plenty before outside of this thread. But they have built an amazing game that has received plenty of praise, and they almost spoiled us. We've expected the best each and every year, and maybe that's a huge task to tackle on their part. Change for the sake of change does not equal improvement.

Although here, you are pretty much solely talking about GM mode and how it's been ignored. Does that make the game bad? Like I said, you feel bored after a few games, that means you played the crap outta it. You're lack of interest comes from that, rather than a lack of features and bug fixes. Even if they added accurate things and fixed bugs, it's still the same game that will play the same great hockey from 09 once you hit the ice. With the same players year after year, come new draftees and gone are retirees. Same 30 NHL teams. Same game.

[canucksss]

Re: EA: BE A GM AND GM CONNECTED IMPROVEMENTS

Although here, you are pretty much solely talking about GM mode and how it's been ignored. Does that make the game bad? Like I said, you feel bored after a few games, that means you played the crap outta it. You're lack of interest comes from that, rather than a lack of features and bug fixes. Even if they added accurate things and fixed bugs, it's still the same game that will play the same great hockey from 09 once you hit the ice. With the same players year after year, come new draftees and gone are retirees. Same 30 NHL teams. Same game.

I beg to disagree about your conclusion that you feel bored after playing the "crap outta it". I love hockey and this is the only sport video game I play since 2k3. I played multiple seasons in 1 version.

Yes the game is bad if some features are ignored year after year. Look at the case of 12, lack of penalties...did EA do something about it? NO! In 13, at the release date same issue...good thing they addressed it in their tuner update 1.4. Leaves me 2 questions:

1. Why did not release a tuner in 12 to address the issue?
2. If EA was listening to people who love to play BAGM, why the lack of penalties existed the next version? Lack of QA?

Talk about lack of defense in NZ, this was present at the release date of 13, IMO. But somehow was remove either by the Tuner or Patch, silently. WHY? I dont know the answer.

BAP, creating a feature that's only in TEXT? WHY? If you're going to copy NBA, why not make it BETTER? As I mentioned in the other thread, the only good thing about this TEXT is that it teaches the young kids how to spell properly.

Fighting ....sure...now at least its realistic, you have your teammates on the ice and on the bench.... but how many fights do you see in one game? Finally the put attention to this feature.

IMO, the reason why EA failed in NHL is because of the lack of attention the developers are putting into this game.

[bwiggy33]

Re: EA: BE A GM AND GM CONNECTED IMPROVEMENTS

How can so many people complain and say they won't buy a game that is not broke? If the game seems stale to you, then congratulations, you're a true hockey fan and/or gamer. You've played the crap outta it and that's what happens when you do, things become stale. Just look at COD for a non-sports reference.

That's what happened to me. NHL is no doubt stale for me because I've bought 07-13 on release day every year. This has made me see patterns with the AI. I knew exactly what the CPU would do with and without the puck. The AI has gotten less predictable the past two years but it just isn't at the level that it should be. I used to be hardcore into online but it's just been a cheese fest unless you play someone legit.

I partially disagree with you about games getting stale. Yes, many games do at some point, but if it's well developed it will not get stale. I say this because of MLB The Show. The AI in that game is more dynamic than any other sports game there is. It forces the user to think, fear great players, and adapt their game based on the opponent. That's why the game doesn't get stale. I understand baseball is easier to develop than hockey, but to me I don't see why NHL can't have a more dynamic (non cheating) AI. Hopefully with the memory improvements for next gen the AI will be much stronger and more dynamic. If it is this game will be really solid. Sure I have a crap ton of other problems with the game, but for me the lack of smart CPU AI, and poor player differential is what kills the game for me. Those two things alone make a game stale.

[NHLandPESFan]

Re: NHL 14 - Be a GM and GM Connected Improvements

NHL 2k8's GM mode had draft picks in trades, player progression, variable season length, and local multiplayer where each team could be GM'd by a different player. The fact that NHL 14 won't have this six years later is inexcusable by any measure. I skipped NHL 12, caved and bought NHL 13 only because it was $25 on Black Friday but won't even bother with NHL 14 even if I get the same price.
I would encourage everyone to quit buying this game if you are not happy with the lack of improvements. I know some of you are worried that EA might cancel the series altogether if there are low sales but I would say good riddance! If EA left, maybe 2k or somebody else would come back in.

[actionhank]

Re: EA: BE A GM AND GM CONNECTED IMPROVEMENTS

1st off, comparing a Model T to todays car is insane. Top speed is much different (which is a main necessity of a car), and so are safety features. You'd be right about luxury features such as power doors, windows, seats, etc. But their formula needed change as the times got faster, and with faster times comes a need for better safety.

But at the same time, that was kinda my point. You think each and every car that came out after the T didn't have it's flaws? We still hear about recalls today for cars of all models. Going forward is a risk, and nothing will ever come out perfect your first attempt. 360's had red rings, PS3's had...something, right?

I've made this point plenty before outside of this thread. But they have built an amazing game that has received plenty of praise, and they almost spoiled us. We've expected the best each and every year, and maybe that's a huge task to tackle on their part. Change for the sake of change does not equal improvement.

Although here, you are pretty much solely talking about GM mode and how it's been ignored. Does that make the game bad? Like I said, you feel bored after a few games, that means you played the crap outta it. You're lack of interest comes from that, rather than a lack of features and bug fixes. Even if they added accurate things and fixed bugs, it's still the same game that will play the same great hockey from 09 once you hit the ice. With the same players year after year, come new draftees and gone are retirees. Same 30 NHL teams. Same game.

I don't mean to say it's a completely terrible game. It's been the best representation of hockey made. I've never played NHL2k, or anything before NHL 09, but around 11 they made a move to something that started to resemble the fluidity of real hockey. And it was great.
But a lot of the same legacy issues are still around from that same time.
Do i think i could buy NHL14 and have fun? Definitely. Some of the new features look pretty cool. The fighting and improved hitting it nice, the improved skating looks like it could also be really nice (with the right sliders, the default sliders still make the skating/passing look pretty arcadey).
I don't mean to imply that the game is garbage, but when it comes down to it Be a GM is the mode i play, and in my opinion, it's been ignored for the past few seasons for the sake of making a quick buck through things like the Ultimate Hockey League, and online play.
The other improvements don't do as much for me. Is fighting in? Yeah, and it's been improved a great deal. But that's such a small fraction of the game, that while i'm happy to see it fixed up, it's something that pales in comparison to other features that i think need to be looked at first.
They addressed the goalies, and i hope it's better. Because i remember hearing about improved goalies last year, and i was thrilled. But then once i started playing it was the same frustrations. Wrist shots almost never went in cleanly. No matter what slider settings i searched for, wristers and one-timers were just easy saves, more often than not. Slap shots from the point had a hard time getting through, and that's assuming your brain-dead AI teammates didn't skate into them every time.
And the AI itself was even more frustrating. You're setting up on plays, and no one is moving. Your players were all just standing around, not even at the very least, facing you with their body to get a shot on net if you did pass it to them.
Now, both of these things seem to be at least looked at, but as with past things, it's possible that it will be looked at, and still not fixed.
I remember after the goalies got a revamp in 13 i was super pumped, only to be let down when i saw that weak wristers from the point could still get through, and that sometimes your goalie would let the most easy saves through (Frequently too. I'm fine with it happening in general, because sometimes goalies are just off, but when it's about the only type of goal you see, it gets old), while the goalie at the other end is making warp speed saves, with no sense of inertia, or being on ice.
None of these are game breakers, in and of themselves. But when they're coupled with teams that to me, feel the same, 1st line through 4th, the game just gets old in a matter of weeks, not months.
Small stuff like character creation and roster sharing, that would be nice, but definitely not needed. But all of it just piles up to feel like EA is more focused on a few small fixes, but mainly looking at the latest craze in sports games.
While i can live with having to pick from the same 12 or so faces i've had for characters since 09 (i think 09 was the debut of Be a Pro) I find it hard to continually justify what feels more and more like a roster update every year, especially now that games have creeped up to $60 for the standard edition.
I'm not writing off the NHL series completely, but this will be the first year in 5, that i don't get it the night of release.
And, pending reviews, i may not pick it up at all.

[gopher_guy]

Re: NHL 14 - Be a GM and GM Connected Improvements

My love of the sport will probably be enough for me to get this game. But man, the fact that I even have to think about whether or not I want to buy the new version is a bad sign for EA...

[actionhank]

Re: NHL 14 - Be a GM and GM Connected Improvements

My love of the sport will probably be enough for me to get this game. But man, the fact that I even have to think about whether or not I want to buy the new version is a bad sign for EA...

That's pretty much how i'm feeling.
I'm sure, come October, that i will probably end up getting it, even if it's searching for a slightly cheaper used copy.
And i genuinely hope i love it. The new additions seem nice, and if they've worked a lot on the goalie AI and team mates not just standing in place like they're frozen to the ice, it'll be a big step.
I just hope someday the game will motivate you to pay attention to who is on the ice, and roll lines to react. Right now, all lines pretty much play the same, and seem to have equal chances of scoring.

[canucksss]

Re: NHL 14 - Be a GM and GM Connected Improvements

That's pretty much how i'm feeling.
I'm sure, come October, that i will probably end up getting it, even if it's searching for a slightly cheaper used copy.
And i genuinely hope i love it. The new additions seem nice, and if they've worked a lot on the goalie AI and team mates not just standing in place like they're frozen to the ice, it'll be a big step.
I just hope someday the game will motivate you to pay attention to who is on the ice, and roll lines to react. Right now, all lines pretty much play the same, and seem to have equal chances of scoring.

i love it in 12 wherein you can match lines and having the home advantage, seeing the visiting team's line up before sending yours. For the love of Hockey, I dont know why EA removed this feature....

like you, if i will have a craving to play NHL, i might wait for a 2nd hand copy.

[i am the messenger]

Re: NHL 14 - Be a GM and GM Connected Improvements

Best way to help with the staleness and feeling you aren't immersed in the mode is to create a dynasty thread on here. Post your own storylines. Create the fantasy in your head that you want to experience when you play the game.

You'd hope they'd improve the mode, but everyone may just be waiting 'til next gen gets a year or two in to get the quality gameplay they want along with a revamped mode.

I still don't know why all sports games don't unlock everything though like in NBA 2K as far as franchises go. Allowing you to change anything you want that's happening in the dynasty one way or another is the best way to go about it.

[Moose24x]

Re: NHL 14 - Be a GM and GM Connected Improvements

They could at least fix the ISSUES within the mode if they're not going to ADD anything to it.

If there's issues with trade AI, contract AI, glitches during gameplay or massive problems with the sim speed, these things at least deserve to be addressed and fixed from one season to the next even if they don't plan on adding any new features.

As for adding "new" features, I understand if they don't feel the need to do much, but there are some simple things that you would think would occur to them, such as adding contract extensions during the season, or players with no-trade clauses (icon beside their name in trade screen - if you try to trade for them, you may get a message saying "so and so refused to waive for your team" - this would help keep star players like Crosby from getting traded for a couple of no-names and a pick). Either way, they should at least address things that aren't functioning as intended, as that's not an "improvement" or "new feature", that's just having the decency to not serve up a product with broken parts two years in a row. Fix the parts that turned out to be broken before you release the next product.

[Moose24x]

Re: NHL 14 - Be a GM and GM Connected Improvements

I still don't know why all sports games don't unlock everything though like in NBA 2K as far as franchises go. Allowing you to change anything you want that's happening in the dynasty one way or another is the best way to go about it.

Completely agree. Anything that has to do with OFFline should be totally unlocked and customizable. Who cares what you do with your own private rosters and franchises? This would eliminate a lot of bellyaching and also allow people to "fix" certain issues that they perceive on their own, without worrying if EA got to their specific issue each summer.

[actionhank]

Re: NHL 14 - Be a GM and GM Connected Improvements

Best way to help with the staleness and feeling you aren't immersed in the mode is to create a dynasty thread on here. Post your own storylines. Create the fantasy in your head that you want to experience when you play the game.

You'd hope they'd improve the mode, but everyone may just be waiting 'til next gen gets a year or two in to get the quality gameplay they want along with a revamped mode.

I still don't know why all sports games don't unlock everything though like in NBA 2K as far as franchises go. Allowing you to change anything you want that's happening in the dynasty one way or another is the best way to go about it.

I've tried that, personally. But my frustration always came from the fact that the gameplay itself felt stale.
One thing i've noticed in The Show, is that things seem to matter.
When there's a big event in the game, or a big milestone, you notice it visually, or through the commentary. I called a player up from my AAA team, to get hit first start at 2nd Base in the game. On his first at bat, he gets a nice little single to the outfield, and the announcers commented on it.
He struck out the next AB, but on his 3rd, he gets a double, and they commented again with something like "How about that, got his first hit in the majors tonight, and now, how about a second?".
It's just little details like that, crowds actually cheering and booing big events, or bad calls, and the announcers mentioning important things that make the game feel more alive. And all the teams play a bit different, forcing you to alter your strategies. It just makes you focus that much more.
A team with a lot of speed? A slow pitcher who you can take advantage of with your own fast guys? All of that plays in, and keeps the game fresh, for me.
It would be so nice to see things like that in NHL14. Bill mentioning that your player has picked up his first goal in the NHL, a cut scene of them grabbing the puck and taking it to the bench, mentioning players who are the top scoring threats (I know they mention cold streaks and point streaks, i can't remember top goal scorers in the league). There's just a lot of little things, but my main frustration has always been that i feel all the teams play the same.
Offensive teams should feel different to play than defensive teams.
If they're starting a 3rd string goalie, it would be awesome to see it mentioned, and maybe have the fans cheer louder when he makes a huge save to keep his shutout going.
EA could just do with a bunch of things to make the Be a GM mode more exciting, but, we'll see what happens on the next-gen consoles when i'm sure they will move to a new engine.
I'll definitely be grabbing the demo to see how things looks on the 20th.

[actionhank]

Re: NHL 14 - Be a GM and GM Connected Improvements

Completely agree. Anything that has to do with OFFline should be totally unlocked and customizable. Who cares what you do with your own private rosters and franchises? This would eliminate a lot of bellyaching and also allow people to "fix" certain issues that they perceive on their own, without worrying if EA got to their specific issue each summer.

I would love roster sharing.
It's so difficult having to wait on EA to create a rookie, or fix trades that happen in the game.
Being able to do that in Be a GM once started would be nice too.
I wouldn't mind being able to create players, or edit rosters of the teams you've got going in Be a GM.
It's frustrating when the Trade Deadline comes, and someone makes a huge trade that you would love to add in game, but can't.