Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

[N51_rob]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

Only way I've been able to slow down the screen game, is to anticipate it being called, control the DE/OLB on what I assume is playside and rather than rush, peel off and get under the RB. Even if you control the LB who (in man) is covering the RB he can't get over there in time, and the CPU downfield blocks are "perfect" every time.

[guaps]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

Does anyone, think that the 3-4 defense is at a disadvantage vs the run? I know that I mostly use the Redskins and that is probably part of the problem. Just wondering if any other user who run a 3-4 defense are having difficulties?

I feel that all defences at a disadvantage against the run. It didn't work properly on current gen and it appears to be worse on next gen, IMO.

It appears that then new War in the Trenches is mostly a numbers game. Madden doesn't seem to account for whether you have a 350 lbs nose tackle or a 290 lbs defensive tackle lined up. This makes the 3-4 defence more or less useless in Madden as it is just reduced to 3 defensive linemen against 5 offensive linemen. Also double team blocking seem to be way too overpowered - this was also the case in CG Madden - and with a 3-4 defence you get more double teams.

What usually happens during double team run blocking is that offensive linemen warp to the DTs/DEs at the snap and almost immediately begin pushing them backward. You almost never see the defensive linemen standing their ground as you would in APF 2k8 and they are easily pushed 3-4 yards back. And when linebackers aren't controlling their gaps, you basically have no run defence.

Below is an example of what typically happens in Madden regardless of whether you play a 3-4 or 4-3 defence. Bare in mind that I've only had the game for two days, so my impressions are subject to change

[LBzrule]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

Only way I've been able to slow down the screen game, is to anticipate it being called, control the DE/OLB on what I assume is playside and rather than rush, peel off and get under the RB. Even if you control the LB who (in man) is covering the RB he can't get over there in time, and the CPU downfield blocks are "perfect" every time.

LOL yep and then when you try to run the screen the CPU blows it up every time by allowing the backer in man coverage to slip underneath all your blockers and hit the HB before he can turn up the field.

[LBzrule]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

I feel that all defences at a disadvantage against the run. It didn't work properly on current gen and it appears to be worse on next gen, IMO.

It appears that then new War in the Trenches is mostly a numbers game. Madden doesn't seem to account for whether you have a 350 lbs nose tackle or a 290 lbs defensive tackle lined up. This makes the 3-4 defence more or less useless in Madden as it is just reduced to 3 defensive linemen against 5 offensive linemen. Also double team blocking seem to be way too overpowered - this was also the case in CG Madden - and with a 3-4 defence you get more double teams.

What usually happens during double team run blocking is that offensive linemen warp to the DTs/DEs at the snap and almost immediately begin pushing them backward. You almost never see the defensive linemen standing their ground as you would in APF 2k8 and they are easily pushed 3-4 yards back. And when linebackers aren't controlling their gaps, you basically have no run defence.

Below is an example of what typically happens in Madden regardless of whether you play a 3-4 or 4-3 defence. Bare in mind that I've only had the game for two days, so my impressions are subject to change

To be a little fair, it looks like based on the way that defense is aligned, your force player is on the right side of the screen. That's why Charles can get out there like that. The issue I have with it though is that the defensive call looks to be a blitz. You shouldn't have to blitz to have a force run support player. The game IMO is still off when it comes to those things on defense Force, Spiller, contain, PA boot player. That said, the game does have "gap control."

To remedy this until the game gets up to speed, I call a defense that is supposed to have a force player on one side, then I control a defender opposite that and if the runs is away from my original force player, I become the force player on the other side. In this play above, controlling the OLB away from the blitz or controlling the Safety up top and lining up over the LG 10 to 12 yards deep could have put you in position. I can't promise that open field tackling will be good though LOL

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

Does anyone, think that the 3-4 defense is at a disadvantage vs the run? I know that I mostly use the Redskins and that is probably part of the problem. Just wondering if any other user who run a 3-4 defense are having difficulties?

Whoever coded run pursuit and gap logic needs to be moved to another part of gameplay. Maybe input and controller code.

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

To be a little fair, it looks like based on the way that defense is aligned, your force player is on the right side of the screen. That's why Charles can get out there like that. The issue I have with it though is that the defensive call looks to be a blitz. You shouldn't have to blitz to have a force run support player. The game IMO is still off when it comes to those things on defense Force, Spiller, contain, PA boot player. That said, the game does have "gap control."

To remedy this until the game gets up to speed, I call a defense that is supposed to have a force player on one side, then I control a defender opposite that and if the runs is away from my original force player, I become the force player on the other side. In this play above, controlling the OLB away from the blitz or controlling the Safety up top and lining up over the LG 10 to 12 yards deep could have put you in position. I can't promise that open field tackling will be good though LOL

But, LB that's not fair. Either the run fit is baked in or totally wrong and flipped. The game isn't smart enough to adjust the run fits based on the flow of the play? That's ***! Frankly, I think that if the run was to the right, that linebacker on the right would not take a good angle to contain the run to that side. Just like the it happened on the left.

[LBzrule]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

But, LB that's not fair. Either the run fit is baked in or totally wrong and flipped. The game isn't smart enough to adjust the run fits based on the flow of the play? That's ***! Frankly, I think that if the run was to the right, that linebacker on the right would not take a good angle to contain the run to that side. Just like the it happened on the left.

I know it's not fair but that's how their game is and no matter how many times it has been said here or in person, it seems to fall on deaf ears That's why when they talked about player smarts and making X amount more calculations I just rolled my eyes. I even asked this very thing: Force, Spiller, Cutback, PA boot and NOBODY answered it. I ask about it all the time and it gets looked over. Now either someone doesn't know what I'm talking about which I refuse to believe, or they don't know how to code it, or they refuse to code it because they don't see it as important or it could be something else, I'm not sure.

Back to what you said, you are most likely right. Had the run been to the right, the safety and backer on that side would have probably started looking for a lineman and ran inside as if to say, hey you are supposed to block me. Actually I'd bet money you are right. They would have not blocked the back side and the line would have picked up everyone on the front side. That's fine that they get picked up, but their movement shouldn't have them sealed off. I don't mind them getting picked up if they keep outside leverage and force the run back to the cutback player. But again, this game aint playing by those principles. This game seems more of, let's create run free, nevermind, guys get to run free a lot of the time because of undisciplined defensive players. It does a fantastic job of showcasing BEATEN defensive players LOL but nothing to show undisciplined players.

Again, I thought that's what player intelligence was supposed to do. If a player is making 50x more calculations why can't they get the Force, spiller, cutback, programmed into the game. It's not like that is a huge calculation. All it is is if the offense runs this way and we are in this defense X is force, Y is the Spiller, Z is the contain, A is the PA Boot. It's not like the defensive player is thinking about 50 things.

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

Are these run defense issues consistent over multiple qualities of defense? Seems that maybe player "play recognition," "awareness" and what have you, may play a big role...I know I have seen defenses look like they were lost numerous times, Green Bay's defense over the last 3 weeks look like a high school team..

I also have decided to believe that EA/Tiburon purposely leaves parts of a defense open as they want the user to take control and play a part in the defenses success or failure, not just call a play and have all the defenders do the proper role to perfection....

I spend time practicing defense, as it is hard to play, IMO, at least compared to offense, and I move players pre-snap and make all sorts of adjustments, when I'm not feeling lazy, and I seem to fail or succeed by how much I put into the defense....I will agree that the defense requires too much work overall, and could be fine tuned....I also agree that I am not seeing 60 calculations a second, but then a bad decision by a player can still indicate the calculation is present, just that the player attributes result in the less than ideal decision.

In the end, EA/Tiburon best have one hell of a M15 game in store...

EDIT - I have to try and consider how many times, while watching my fav team on defense, have I asked questions such as, "what were they thinking," "who called that play," "how did he miss that tackle," "Do they not know that the other team is targetting 'X' receiver or tight end"? etc etc...

[LBzrule]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

Are these run defense issues consistent over multiple qualities of defense? Seems that maybe player "play recognition," "awareness" and what have you, may play a big role...I know I have seen defenses look like they were lost numerous times, Green Bay's defense over the last 3 weeks look like a high school team..

I also have decided to believe that EA/Tiburon purposely leaves parts of a defense open as they want the user to take control and play a part in the defenses success or failure, not just call a play and have all the defenders do the proper role to perfection....

I spend time practicing defense, as it is hard to play, IMO, at least compared to offense, and I move players pre-snap and make all sorts of adjustments, when I'm not feeling lazy, and I seem to fail or succeed by how much I put into the defense....I will agree that the defense requires too much work overall, and could be fine tuned....I also agree that I am not seeing 60 calculations a second, but then a bad decision by a player can still indicate the calculation is present, just that the player attributes result in the less than ideal decision.

In the end, EA/Tiburon best have one hell of a M15 game in store...

EDIT - I have to try and consider how many times, while watching my fav team on defense, have I asked questions such as, "what were they thinking," "who called that play," "how did he miss that tackle," "Do they not know that the other team is targetting 'X' receiver or tight end"? etc etc...

For the most part the run defense will be tied to the coverage across the board, no matter the team. That's just how defenses work. That's why teams look for specific players because they think that specific player will be able to fulfill that role on their team. This does not mean that guys do not get confused or that offenses cannot force them to be undisciplined. Sometimes guys get fundamentally unsound when they start seeing stuff that they've never seen; or when they don't trust their other guys to do what they are supposed to do so they try to overcompensate; or they just get beat by the offensive player. Just because that's the system doesn't mean that it is automatic. For instance in the Ravens system, they rely on everybody up front beating their man. And for the most part it has worked. There have been some games this year where things up front did not work for them and they got ran on (Buffalo; 1st Steelers game; Packers game).

All kinds of games can be played pending on who is a part of the run fit. Sometimes, in 3-4 anyways, the ILB will play a game with the OLB. OLB crashes down hard, ILB takes the edge; back side ILB = cutback. It's not traditional but I've seen it. Most teams use their Safeties in the run fit and the Safety plays a game with the OLB. There is actually a great write up out on this. PM me and I'll send it to ya. Then you will see the uber deficiencies of run defense in this game. Ultimately, how you cover largely determines getting your guys in the best spots to stop the run.

[Gotmadskillzson]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

This sums up my feeling of Madden 25 on next gen.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/eMoMBFhMdDw?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Now excuse me while I dance around with my Madden 25 game case.

[bucky60]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

I know I have seen defenses look like they were lost numerous times, Green Bay's defense over the last 3 weeks look like a high school team..

I know this is off topic. And it may be against the TOS. And I'm obviously saying this in jest. But as a Packer fan, I hate you. Oh has it been painful.

Is there a smiliey with tears?

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

I know this is off topic. And it may be against the TOS. And I'm obviously saying this in jest. But as a Packer fan, I hate you. Oh has it been painful.

Is there a smiliey with tears?

Actually - though I have a Raiders avatar I am a huge Packers fan - they are my one and only true favorite team...It is sad times this season...Cannot believe how important Rodgers is to the "whole" team.

[TeeDogg]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

Only way I've been able to slow down the screen game, is to anticipate it being called, control the DE/OLB on what I assume is playside and rather than rush, peel off and get under the RB. Even if you control the LB who (in man) is covering the RB he can't get over there in time, and the CPU downfield blocks are "perfect" every time.

I just realized my question to you should've been addressed to the person you quoted in that post. But the name wasn't there. I was assuming you ha both PS4 and XB1 versions

[Sausage]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

Updated impressions (played about 20+ games offline/online); I have to unlearn bad "passing" habits I picked up from M13/M25 xbox 360 version.

Truly enjoying my time with the game; using the Redskins in year 1 of my CFM, current record 9-5 on All Pro difficulty (I can't believe I have 5 losses and so happy I'm not demolishing the CPU every game).

My 6+ online games have been a smooth ride; it's like my opponent is on my couch like the good old days, lol. I have played the gamut of madden player:

The 20 yard drop back artist (poor guy still didn't figure it out after the 3rd interception into double coverage, blow out victory)

Read Option Specialist (player could of been better, but didn't use enough creativity running options and don't think he knew how to make the read)

Good player that mixes up playcalling (what a fun game; dare I say chess match!! It was like playing a guy from OS who knows football/Madden)

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: Madden NFL 25 Impressions (PS4)

Actually - though I have a Raiders avatar I am a huge Packers fan - they are my one and only true favorite team...It is sad times this season...Cannot believe how important Rodgers is to the "whole" team.

Why is that hard to believe? The dude is AWESOME. This is coming from a Bears fan.