2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

[Pokes404]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

You don't know 23 very well do you?

No. Been on this site for a while to look up information about sports video games, but just started looking at these game discussion threads here recently.

I normally don't really care enough to post, but the (paraphrasing) "they make getting to the foul line a part of their offense ... there's no defending that" comment was one of the more nonsensical things I've ever read. Pretty much any athletic/slashing type team is looking to get an easy shot at the rim or get fouled. That's just smart basketball. Especially when you take into account how efficient OKC is at the line.

[23]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

No. Been on this site for a while to look up information about sports video games, but just started looking at these game discussion threads here recently.

I normally don't really care enough to post, but the (paraphrasing) "they make getting to the foul line a part of their offense ... there's no defending that" comment was one of the more nonsensical things I've ever read. Pretty much any athletic/slashing type team is looking to get an easy shot at the rim or get fouled. That's just smart basketball. Especially when you take into account how efficient OKC is at the line.

Its not nonsensical... it was a statement made by their coach. He alluded to them not being able to win games unless they get alot of free throws.

Sure its fine to get fouls on drives but OKC is a jumpshooting team that seems to live off of fouls driving or not, flopping or not, we've been watching them and they chuck alot! Getting a record FT discrepency is not so much about them as we are always on the back of the inconsistent reffing that happens in the NBA.

You should spend more time here through the season to see what goes on.

[Pokes404]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

Its not nonsensical... it was a statement made by their coach. He alluded to them not being able to win games unless they get alot of free throws.

Sure its fine to get fouls on drives but OKC is a jumpshooting team that seems to live off of fouls driving or not, flopping or not, we've been watching them and they chuck alot! Getting a record FT discrepency is not so much about them as we are always on the back of the inconsistent reffing that happens in the NBA.

You should spend more time here through the season to see what goes on.

My fault. I didn't realize the refs were just picking on you guys and that's why you were getting a bunch of fouls. I didn't realize it had nothing to do with having a point guard hardly anyone in the league can stay in front of, and a 6-10 scoring machine with guard skills. It's just the officials deciding they don't like you guys.

Again, I'm not trying to say that there weren't some bad calls during the 20-0 ft run. Personally, the foul they called on Mills 3-point attempt was one of the worst calls I've seen in a while. It was just slightly worse than the offensive foul they called on Perkins that wiped away a Westbrook lay up. Bad officiating goes both ways for the most part. It tends to even out. The other night, however, you had an older, jump shooting team that was playing conservative, going up against a younger, more athletic team that was being super aggressive. Is there really no way to think that maybe that played a more significant role in the free throw difference?

And no, OKC is not a jump shooting team. Obviously, you can't get to the rim every time, so you have to shoot jumpers at some point. And yes, Ibaka is used primarily to spread the floor and hit the catch and shoot midrange off of pick-n-pop or driving action. But our first goal is the get Westbrook or Durant (or even Jackson) attacking the rim and get one of three things: 1) a finish at the rim, 2) a shooting foul, 3) a kickout when the defense collapses.

Brooks said that we can't win if we don't get to the free throw line because when we're not getting to the free throw line, it's usually because we're settling for jump shots. We're simply not a consistent enough jump shooting team to not be attacking the rim and getting easy points at the line. Basically, if we aren't getting to the line, it means we aren't playing our brand of basketball and utilizing our strengths. That's what Brooks meant. It isn't just the fact that we need to generate easy points for ourselves at the line, it's an indication that we're being aggressive and putting pressure on the defense, which in turn opens up the other aspects of our offense.

[23]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

My fault. I didn't realize the refs were just picking on you guys and that's why you were getting a bunch of fouls. I didn't realize it had nothing to do with having a point guard hardly anyone in the league can stay in front of, and a 6-10 scoring machine with guard skills. It's just the officials deciding they don't like you guys.

Again, I'm not trying to say that there weren't some bad calls during the 20-0 ft run. Personally, the foul they called on Mills 3-point attempt was one of the worst calls I've seen in a while. It was just slightly worse than the offensive foul they called on Perkins that wiped away a Westbrook lay up. Bad officiating goes both ways for the most part. It tends to even out. The other night, however, you had an older, jump shooting team that was playing conservative, going up against a younger, more athletic team that was being super aggressive. Is there really no way to think that maybe that played a more significant role in the free throw difference?

And no, OKC is not a jump shooting team. Obviously, you can't get to the rim every time, so you have to shoot jumpers at some point. And yes, Ibaka is used primarily to spread the floor and hit the catch and shoot midrange off of pick-n-pop or driving action. But our first goal is the get Westbrook or Durant (or even Jackson) attacking the rim and get one of three things: 1) a finish at the rim, 2) a shooting foul, 3) a kickout when the defense collapses.

Brooks said that we can't win if we don't get to the free throw line because when we're not getting to the free throw line, it's usually because we're settling for jump shots. We're simply not a consistent enough jump shooting team to not be attacking the rim and getting easy points at the line. Basically, if we aren't getting to the line, it means we aren't playing our brand of basketball and utilizing our strengths. That's what Brooks meant. It isn't just the fact that we need to generate easy points for ourselves at the line, it's an indication that we're being aggressive and putting pressure on the defense, which in turn opens up the other aspects of our offense.

Who is "you guys"?

You don't come here, but you jump right in making a ton of assumptions and then giving a straight explanation of what Brooks said even though that's not what he actually said?

Are you an OKC fan?

[Pokes404]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

Who is "you guys"?

You don't come here, but you jump right in making a ton of assumptions and then giving a straight explanation of what Brooks said even though that's not what he actually said?

Are you an OKC fan?

Yeah, I am. And my bad, but the way you were seemingly ragging on anything OKC related, you were sure coming off as an angry Spurs fan. I did make an assumption there though.

I really don't know what you're talking about with the "... a straight explanation of what Brooks said even though that's not what he actually said." I was telling you what he really means when he says that "we can't win if we don't get to the free throw line," and/or, "getting fouled and getting to the line is part of our offense." I didn't see the exact quote, so I had to take a rough guess, but Brooks says stuff like this a lot and it means the same thing. We have to be aggressive and not settle for jumpers. I watch the Thunder a lot. I was just giving some context as to why it's so important for us to get to the free throw line for those who might not watch them as religiously as I do. It isn't just the points, it's also an indication of how we're playing (attacking the rim).

You said "there's no defending" what Brooks said about free throws being a part of our offense. I was just trying to do exactly that. Offer an explanation, and hopefully a little analysis, to a group that might appreciate it. My fault.

[Jamesmaster]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

Brooks better not let Ibaka on the court if the Thunder would have a 15 point lead like in Game 3. That was absolutely ridiculous.

[King_B_Mack]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

OKC isn't a jump shooting team though? Since when?

[Pokes404]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

Brooks better not let Ibaka on the court if the Thunder would have a 15 point lead like in Game 3. That was absolutely ridiculous.

It looked like on the broadcast that Ibaka told Brooks and the trainer that he wanted to stay out there. He hadn't played in something like 10 days, not even practice, so he may have felt good and wanted to stay in the flow.

But I agree, I was calling for them to take him out. No matter how good he feels, every second he's on that court is another chance for that hamstring to get re-injured, and our season is over if that happens.

[bakan723]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

OKC isn't a jump shooting team though? Since when?

Well their 2nd best player is one of the fastest & best slashers/drivers in the league and he does have the ball a hell of a lot, so..

What they don't have are post players, that's why ppl say that. (like Barkley)

[23]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

Yeah, I am. And my bad, but the way you were seemingly ragging on anything OKC related, you were sure coming off as an angry Spurs fan. I did make an assumption there though.

I really don't know what you're talking about with the "... a straight explanation of what Brooks said even though that's not what he actually said." I was telling you what he really means when he says that "we can't win if we don't get to the free throw line," and/or, "getting fouled and getting to the line is part of our offense." I didn't see the exact quote, so I had to take a rough guess, but Brooks says stuff like this a lot and it means the same thing. We have to be aggressive and not settle for jumpers. I watch the Thunder a lot. I was just giving some context as to why it's so important for us to get to the free throw line for those who might not watch them as religiously as I do. It isn't just the points, it's also an indication of how we're playing (attacking the rim).

You said "there's no defending" what Brooks said about free throws being a part of our offense. I was just trying to do exactly that. Offer an explanation, and hopefully a little analysis, to a group that might appreciate it. My fault.

I understand what you are saying about Brooks, my point is, I was saying what he actually said. Secondly im not an angry Spurs fan, and it doesn't matter the team, when the refs are atrocious which has been often, we call them out.

Thats why I say spend a bit more time here throughout the season and you'll see. Its not always the this game is hard to ref thing thats the problem, its their massive inconsistency we talk about all of the time.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

About time we get an actual OKC fan around here lol

[Pokes404]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

OKC isn't a jump shooting team though? Since when?

Just because you shoot a number of jumpers doesn't necessarily mean you're a jump shooting team. We're an attacking style of team, at least, when we're playing the way we should. When we start settling for a bunch of jumpers, that's precisely when we start getting ourselves in trouble. We take jumpers off of pick-n-pop and drive-n-kick action, but all of it is predicated on attacking the rim. Even if the jump shot is what the defense is giving us, sometimes we have to force the issue anyways and hope Durant and/or Westbrook's talent can get us a bucket or a foul.

This team just doesn't have enough consistent shooters to get away with settling for a bunch of jumpers. Last year, when we had Kevin Martin and Thabo was shooting around 40% from the corners, we could do it. But now, we have Fisher and Butler who are both a little streaky, Thabo has only hit 11 total 3 pointers since the All-Star break, Jackson is more of a slasher than a perimeter shooter (although he's getting better), and Perkins and Adams both speak for themselves offensively. So outside of our big three, there just isn't a lot of shooting around them. And that's counting Westbrook, who I think we've all seen how hot-and-cold his jumper can be.

I know Lamb's defense is below-average, to put it nicely, but he has to see the floor more. When you rotate Fisher, Butler, and Lamb in there, odds are that a least one of them is going to be hot that night. If a couple of them are feeling it, then we're really in business.

[bakan723]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

About time we get an actual OKC fan around here lol

Def was getting a little too one sided with all the Spurs ppl.

Thread was tough to look at last game.

[Pokes404]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

I understand what you are saying about Brooks, my point is, I was saying what he actually said. Secondly im not an angry Spurs fan, and it doesn't matter the team, when the refs are atrocious which has been often, we call them out.

Thats why I say spend a bit more time here throughout the season and you'll see. Its not always the this game is hard to ref thing thats the problem, its their massive inconsistency we talk about all of the time.

Well, I haven't been around here, but I do watch a decent amount of NBA action outside of the Thunder. At least as much as my job will allow me to. I hear what you're saying about officiating, but I think basketball is probably the toughest sport to officiate. You could literally call something every trip down the floor. Inconsistency is a problem sometimes, no doubt. Especially when they start off calling the game loose, and then all of the sudden tighten up and blow their whistle on everything. There's nothing harder to adjust to as a player. For the most part though, I think that bad officiating/missed calls tend to even out for both sides. Rarely do I think the refs are the ultimate cause of a win/loss, but it does happen unfortunately.

I've just always been of the mindset that you play through officiating. You'll get favorable calls, you'll get bad calls, but for the most part, that stuff will even out and the players are the ones who are going to decide it. Officiating can give teams a slight advantage, especially at home. It's nearly impossible for a person to not allow 17,000-20,000 screaming people to not affect their judgement in the least bit. But, that's why it's a home court advantage.

Refs certainly can completely blow a call or even disrupt a game, either by blowing the whistle too much or not at all. And obviously, a completely wrong call at the wrong moment can be devastating. But this is true of any sport. Basketball just has so few black-and-white calls, I really do think the refs do a good job ... most of the time.

[bakan723]

Re: 2014 Western Conference Finals: #1 San Antonio Spurs vs. #2 Oklahoma City Thunder

Yea, the game is too hard to officiate for the refs (obviously) But I don't agree with the 'always evening out' line.

I mean, what's the chances of that happening, everything ending up equal at the end ? Like ZERO.