MLB 14 The Show OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

[LanteriX]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

Rosters look great on first glance.

The fielding ratings being a problem seems quite overstated. There's a few outliers here and there, but I really wouldn't think that any kind of overhaul is really necessary at all. Rather, just clean up some of the mistakes here and there.

[COMMISSIONERHBK9]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

is the beard situation that bad for the ps4 if i use these rosters. i am using the knight roster and i havent really seen an issues on the ps4. i need to know if i should restart and use this. once again willard good job. i had your roster last year

[URBYJT]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

Don't look at the overall ratings, sure, I can buy that. I know these were tuned to play a great game and not to have pretty overall ratings for the stars. I'm 100% down with that.


But how do you justify Ryan Braun's arm strength being like 25 points higher than Puig's? Those most certainly couldn't be based off ZiPs projections so somebody made a judgement call on that one and definitely goofed it up. That's just a physical trait, no skill involved. Puig has a cannon. I'm guessing it was probably a data entry error, somebody reading the wrong cell off a spreadsheet.

Probably has to do with the limited data on Puig. They said they'd fix it.

Has anyone with a copy of OOTP 14/15 considered seeing how the defensive ratings in that game might translate to MLB 14? Just a thought, trying to offer another possible solution.

That's a good idea. Though it seems like OOTP goes more indepth that it might be hard to make it translate, I dunno.

[Madden's Jowels]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

^^^ I like the idea of using the Fangraphs fan scouting or whatever


Although, it's tempting to just stick the ratings into the game as is since they're base-100 and base-99, I'm guessing we'd get better results by coming up with some sort of algorithm haha.

[blahweee]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

^^^ I like the idea of using the Fangraphs fan scouting or whatever


Although, it's tempting to just stick the ratings into the game as is since they're base-100 and base-99, I'm guessing we'd get better results by coming up with some sort of algorithm haha.

Yeah could maybe do something along the lines of making the floor 20 for MLB players and scaling the other rating to and 80 point scale and adding it to the base 20s, would avoid the low 20 values that would no doubt be error prone as eff.

[Madden's Jowels]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

Probably has to do with the limited data on Puig. They said they'd fix it.

What "data" would be used for arm strength? Assists? Willard basically said that the data they used was only for hitting and pitching ratings. "We made some adjustments to physical attributes but the pure stat based attributes are the same base across the board."

Don't get me wrong I'm not just hung up on Puig here (not a huge Puig fan by any stretch lol), it's just got me thinking, if they got Puig's arm soooo wrong, and then apparently Arenado was given a poor fielding rating despite being a premiere defensive 3rd basemen, then what else could be wrong on the defensive side?

The hitting and pitching stuff, it's all based on projections and they're the same across the board, so there's no nitpicking that. But the objective things like physical tools (speed, arm strength, etc), if those got mangled then that would be a little weird.


Willard I'm not hating on your roster or anything, not trying to be a downer haha, just mostly wanting to know what the deal is with these concerns and if we should be worried or if it's part of your master plan?

[URBYJT]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

What "data" would be used for arm strength? Assists? Willard basically said that the data they used was only for hitting and pitching ratings. "We made some adjustments to physical attributes but the pure stat based attributes are the same base across the board."

Don't get me wrong I'm not just hung up on Puig here (not a huge Puig fan by any stretch lol), it's just got me thinking, if they got Puig's arm soooo wrong, and then apparently Arenado was given a poor fielding rating despite being a premiere defensive 3rd basemen, then what else could be wrong on the defensive side?

The hitting and pitching stuff, it's all based on projections and they're the same across the board, so there's no nitpicking that. But the objective things like physical tools (speed, arm strength, etc), if those got mangled then that would be a little weird.


Willard I'm not hating on your roster or anything, not trying to be a downer haha, just mostly wanting to know what the deal is with these concerns and if we should be worried or if it's part of your master plan?

Oh no I agree with you, just trying to provide reasoning for the oversight.

[Willard76]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

I've would just use 2013 fangraphs data

Arm Strength
Arm Accuracy
Reaction=Instinct
Catching=Hands


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This was what we used - but when you actually look at some of the numbers they are very flawed so we had to make a judgement call at times

Quick Question:

Since the ratings seem to be weighed by position, if I were to change the primary position of a player (example: Peter O'Brien has moved to the outfield from catcher in the Yankeees' organization, probably for good), would that mess up the offensive ratings that you gave him because now he's not at catcher and he'd need different ratings for a different position? Thanks!

His overall would be the only thing that changes

Player Position Rea Fld ASt AACC blk
Manny Machado 3B 84 88 90 88
Chasey Headley 3B 66 68 60 64
Miguel Cabrera 3B 33 45 73 61

Andrelton Simm SS 87 90 91 88
Alexi Ramirez SS 63 58 65 50
Jed Lowrie SS 31 46 34 35

Dustin Pedroia 2B 81 86 52 81
Jason Kipnis 2B 58 50 47 58
Daniel Murphy 2B 41 28 47 50

Paul Goldschmidt 1B 70 71 55 66
Chris Davis 1B 44 50 57 44
Prince Fielder 1B 23 15 27 26



Yadier Molina C 70 89 89 95 85
Miguel Montero C 44 58 59 58 33
JP Arencebia C 20 3 36 4 44

Gerardo Parra RF 76 86 86 91
Nick Markakis RF 54 66 57 70
Daniel Nava RF 41 43 37 50

Carlos Gomez CF 83 77 79 72
Colby Rasmus CF 67 53 49 22
Shin-Soo Choo CF 37 45 56 64

Alex Gordon LF 81 86 83 93
Alfonso Soriano LF 42 43 62 47
Matt Holliday LF 22 28 45 32

This seems to give similar numbers as the ones we had to work with

Don't look at the overall ratings, sure, I can buy that. I know these were tuned to play a great game and not to have pretty overall ratings for the stars. I'm 100% down with that.


But how do you justify Ryan Braun's arm strength being like 25 points higher than Puig's? Those most certainly couldn't be based off ZiPs projections so somebody made a judgement call on that one and definitely goofed it up. That's just a physical trait, no skill involved. Puig has a cannon. I'm guessing it was probably a data entry error, somebody reading the wrong cell off a spreadsheet.

I think Puig got missed somehow - I agree his arm is probably the best in baseball. As for Braun, his defensive rating was that of a LF, which for that position his arm was incredible - this is where using metric ratings sometimes work but don't work because they are based of a specific skill set

is the beard situation that bad for the ps4 if i use these rosters. i am using the knight roster and i havent really seen an issues on the ps4. i need to know if i should restart and use this. once again willard good job. i had your roster last year

It just needs adjusting, because of layers and textures that were needed on Ps3 give out of control hair on the Ps4 - we will be correcting that after the V2 release

^^^ I like the idea of using the Fangraphs fan scouting or whatever


Although, it's tempting to just stick the ratings into the game as is since they're base-100 and base-99, I'm guessing we'd get better results by coming up with some sort of algorithm haha.

These were the rating we used


K guys, I apologize for not being around to answer these questions here is the lowdown on fielding ratings.

First off there are 1500 players on this roster - or somewhere around there - there is bound to be the odd thing missed. We will take suggestions to fix and go back and look at the roster - that I promise

We used Fans ratings for fielding off fangraphs, but if there was no rating we either went with the SCEA rating or ballparked it - I watch a ton of games and have played the game for years and feel I have a pretty good feel for this stuff - but not perfect. Here is my explanation below of how some ratings work.

Arm Strength and accuracy are what they are - but arm strength is based on that position - accuracy is based on throwing error percentage.

Reaction - is basically a player first step towards a ball - this is one of the great equalizers in this roster - just because a CF for instance is fast - doesn't mean he should run down every ball like you see in the default rosters and vice versa. You will really see how this plays out in the roster and how much it gives real gameplay.

Fielding Ability is based on overall skill and fielding percentage.

The other side affect is the BABIP issue and the fact that we had to lower fielding a bit to allow anything to get hit this year - you will find players with high contact rates hitting a lot of balls on a line right at fielders otherwise.

When I get the roster back from the pitch edits, I will look at the fielding again and try to make fair adjustments based on what everyone is noticing. Abreu because he did not play last year had no fielding stats so he may have been missed

Willard

[Madden's Jowels]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

This was what we used - but when you actually look at some of the numbers they are very flawed so we had to make a judgement call at times



His overall would be the only thing that changes



This seems to give similar numbers as the ones we had to work with



I think Puig got missed somehow - I agree his arm is probably the best in baseball. As for Braun, his defensive rating was that of a LF, which for that position his arm was incredible - this is where using metric ratings sometimes work but don't work because they are based of a specific skill set



It just needs adjusting, because of layers and textures that were needed on Ps3 give out of control hair on the Ps4 - we will be correcting that after the V2 release



These were the rating we used


K guys, I apologize for not being around to answer these questions here is the lowdown on fielding ratings.

First off there are 1500 players on this roster - or somewhere around there - there is bound to be the odd thing missed. We will take suggestions to fix and go back and look at the roster - that I promise

We used Fans ratings for fielding off fangraphs, but if there was no rating we either went with the SCEA rating or ballparked it - I watch a ton of games and have played the game for years and feel I have a pretty good feel for this stuff - but not perfect. Here is my explanation below of how some ratings work.

Arm Strength and accuracy are what they are - but arm strength is based on that position - accuracy is based on throwing error percentage.

Reaction - is basically a player first step towards a ball - this is one of the great equalizers in this roster - just because a CF for instance is fast - doesn't mean he should run down every ball like you see in the default rosters and vice versa. You will really see how this plays out in the roster and how much it gives real gameplay.

Fielding Ability is based on overall skill and fielding percentage.

The other side affect is the BABIP issue and the fact that we had to lower fielding a bit to allow anything to get hit this year - you will find players with high contact rates hitting a lot of balls on a line right at fielders otherwise.

When I get the roster back from the pitch edits, I will look at the fielding again and try to make fair adjustments based on what everyone is noticing. Abreu because he did not play last year had no fielding stats so he may have been missed

Willard

Thanks for the explanation Willard. That all makes sense. What do you think I should edit Puig's arm to myself? Did you guys have a system for converting Fangraphs scouting into a rating?

[buczneverlose]

Tell me not to look at the ratings, that's what everything is based off of. Look at the batting averages after a simmed season. Pitchers own this roster set. Only three players hit over .300 in the first simmed season. Give me a break. These rosters need some major work.

[WaitTilNextYear]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

To be honest, some people won't play until the defensive ratings have had similar tender love and care as Jeezy gives the pitch edits, but luckily for me I am not that ocd about these rosters. Pitch edits mark the end of my personal rosteritis.

The problem with trying to standardize defensive ratings is that state-of-the-art defensive metrics (that are not proprietary info) are awful. Even if you guys use a system, there are bound to be problems with that--i.e. good OFs with bad FLDG %. Good SSs with bad UZR. Those stats fluctuate so much year over year it's kind of comical.

I will probably run through the hybrid set as I do my pitch edits and if I see anything glaring like a noodle-armed Puig, I'll just bump the ratings in my personal set.

Willard - I have run some sims using your roster vs OSFM v2.0 and can PM you data on how that's turning out if you'd like. The least I can do after you guys cranked out this masterpiece....some of the variations I am already getting out of Hybrid+MLB14 sim engine in limited sims is pretty impressive.

[WaitTilNextYear]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

Tell me not to look at the ratings, that's what everything is based off of. Look at the batting averages after a simmed season. Pitchers own this roster set. Only three players hit over .300 in the first simmed season. Give me a break. These rosters need some major work.

Be aware of your sample size before knocking these rosters....

I am also simming and in one sim I got 6 .300 hitters and in another there were 12 .300 hitters.

I do agree that it looks qualitatively as though the balance has shifted slightly to the pitchers (looking at team-by-team season K, BB, and ERA numbers), BUT real life MLB is trending that way anyway...note how the hitting #s trend down over the last 5 years.

[authentic]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

Update on the pitch edits:

I have handed the roster off to ILFT. I got through the Cubs and will take a break while he gets after it. When he's done, I'll pick it back up. Still steaming at twitch.tv/osauthentic

I think I'll play a game with the pitch edits!

[Pandetta]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

Be aware of your sample size before knocking these rosters....

I am also simming and in one sim I got 6 .300 hitters and in another there were 12 .300 hitters.


I do agree that it looks qualitatively as though the balance has shifted slightly to the pitchers (looking at team-by-team season K, BB, and ERA numbers), BUT real life MLB is trending that way anyway...note how the hitting #s trend down over the last 5 years.

I completely agree, however the last 3 regular seasons had 24, 25, and 26 .300 players. That is pretty far from 12, much less 6 or less.



Willard and his team have done a fantastic job, and even the roster team understood the batting was a tough fix.

Honestly the current issues seem fixable and the roster is an incredible effort, especially for a v.1

[buczneverlose]

Re: OSFM Hybrid Roster - V1 Release

Sorry if I'm coming across as knocking the rosters. I'm just blown away and lost with some of the sim results and ratings even tho you tell me not to look at them. That's impossible. Pretty much destroyed Puig, Arenando and plenty of others I could name. I just want to know the logic behind it all. When I wake up tomorrow I'll make sure to play a game and see how it pans out but as for me I think I'm gonna take on the task of doing the pitch edits to Version 2 of OSFM and use that for my franchise because it fits me better and provides the stats I want to see. Knowing how tough rosters are to do, I'll never knock them. It's time consuming and sometimes things slip and things don't work out as planned to what some people want. We all have our own personal preference and Willard and company did a great job in doing this and they should be commended for it. It worked great in the past I just want something to my liking and be able to start my franchise. It's the end of May. I'm more frustrated they didn't release this game any earlier so we can figure this stuff out in time for opening week/month of the season. Hope you understand. I actually would love to help fix what I feel is wrong but that wouldn't work cause you guys have a different way of doing it and I don't think I would be satisfied with any end result. Once again personal preference.

Disclaimer I am a little moody cause I spent the past 13 days in the hospital with a double kidney infection and I'm wrecked on pain meds so it makes me edgy, sorry if I offended anyone.