Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

[jpdavis82]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

If that's the case why not use your time to create reach or lunge animation to trip the players or make contact with the players and let the physic take over when contact is made.

Instead they created a gimmick feature that sucks you into a animation and take once the animation is determine all defender stops.

Players do reach, in every E3 video, watch closely, reach tackles aren't in, yet, but players can reach and affect plays now. This video points out how it works in M15.

http://youtu.be/6inZEN7YOtU

[StefJoeHalt]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

JP I really appreciate ur hope (side note hope ur child is well) but how can we as a whole believe the next wave of guys? We were told to believe the last group and the group before..let's say they have a board in their office and all the issues Madden has..how is QB Acc the first improvement over running tackling? Each group of dev have claimed sim was the goal..each also did something that had us say "wait maybe they have figured it out" but then what happens they either leave or worse stay and don't figure it out..ask ur self this question.."if Ford made a bad fleet of cars, changed CEO's several times did not improve, but continued to say we have a plan" would u believe them? The improvements I see (which graphics I see) is nothing more then a Mustang that LOOKS GREAT but the motor is terrible and has been for 10 years..how can we trust them ?


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[drlw322]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

Players do reach, in every E3 video, watch closely, reach tackles aren't in, yet, but players can reach and affect plays now. This video points out how it works in M15.

http://youtu.be/6inZEN7YOtU

Youre missing the point bro. Ive seen this video it looks mostly cosmetic. Im talking about reach animation that actually make contact and effect physic. Listen i like what they are trying to do in alot of the aspect of this game ie presentation, graphic, passing acurracy, catch ratio. But you need to take the madden goggles off for a sec and see what they are doing with the tackling system is backwards. Will buy this game, yes. And i will enjoy it too once i put the tackling silder down to like 20 to ensure there are more group - gang tackling

[roadman]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

JP I really appreciate ur hope (side note hope ur child is well) but how can we as a whole believe the next wave of guys? We were told to believe the last group and the group before..let's say they have a board in their office and all the issues Madden has..how is QB Acc the first improvement over running tackling? Each group of dev have claimed sim was the goal..each also did something that had us say "wait maybe they have figured it out" but then what happens they either leave or worse stay and don't figure it out..ask ur self this question.."if Ford made a bad fleet of cars, changed CEO's several times did not improve, but continued to say we have a plan" would u believe them? The improvements I see (which graphics I see) is nothing more then a Mustang that LOOKS GREAT but the motor is terrible and has been for 10 years..how can we trust them ?


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Blind faith. (not saying I have it!)

If what they touted at E3 is working in the final copy as advertised, then maybe people will start to feel a bit more comfortable with the current team.

If things don't work as advertised, no faith at all will prevail.

[StefJoeHalt]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

Blind faith. (not saying I have it!)



If what they touted at E3 is working in the final copy as advertised, then maybe people will start to feel a bit more comfortable with the current team.



If things don't work as advertised, no faith at all will prevail.

I agree kind of lol..I think they(EA as a whole) have burnt us two many times..to be clear though if this "3 year plan" does happen to work I will be the first to post a thread explaining I was wrong! Cause that is what a want a Good Game


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[KBLover]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

Madden will never be fundamentally sound it's a video game. They have to keep the fun factor to sell units if they ever made it to hard people wouldn't buy it.

See - I'm sick of this "if it played solid football it would be too hard for casuals/non-football coaches/whatever" line of thought.

If the player AI reacted like NFL players, the "casual" player wouldn't have to know why they are doing it or even know they are using NFL-style responsibilities. The plays would just play out as though they would, things would work because they should, things that are likely to fail would do so for reasons the "casual" sees on Sunday, and so on.

I mean when "Joe Football Fan" sees a DB make a great pick - does he know (or care) about how DBs play coverage, why the DB got such a great jump? No, he appreciates the play (or curses, depending on how it went for his team) and is engrossed in the symphony that is NFL football.

Playing Madden could be the same way. Just like it is for The Show. The average baseball fan doesn't need to know the mechanics of why high fastballs and big 12-6 curves are nasty to hit against or how to throw them with a controller - he can put it on "Classic" pitching or "Timing" hitting (or both) and get the same experience and player ratings create a similar outcome and his eye is challenged all the same.

So if that player or someone new to football calls a 46 defense against a 4 WR set and gets burned, with the game playing like real football, he can see with his eyes what happened. If he lets the game guide his play calling, and he sees the game suggest a Nickle Cover 3 on 3-and-20, then he can start learning what plays to consider in situations.

If the game played fundamental football with player AI that also did so and an engine that expresses player skill prototypes and such, he'll see the game play more like what it does on Sunday and can use the same "general knowledge" (it's 3rd and 2 - better watch the run, etc) and have things play as they should.

It's not about video game difficulty, it's about the sport playing out. If anything, it might be EASIER because the average fan wouldn't have to "learn Madden" instead of using general football knowledge he'd probably learned/heard watching games and listening to NFL network.

If the game played fundamentally, Gore would have had to power through #27 to get the TD, which would be MORE exciting of a play and MORE fun to watch and make happen. You'd feel like you're Frank Gore plowing over some hapless defender to get a 6-yd TD like Gore has done many times in his career.

#41 wouldn't be all over the place taking himself out of a play for no reason. Once you see him shed, you could switch to him and have a better shot at taking Kaepernick down. That would be more fun than watching helplessly as he does something completely football stupid that no NFL player would do, not even the worst (because he would see why it's called the Not For Long league).

Bowman wouldn't "just trip". Instead, you'd see him lay the wood on Lynch, stuffing the play. A MORE fun thing than watching Bowman trip for no reason and not doing what he's seen Bowman do with regularity on Sunday.

At the end of the day if madden made the best video game ever people would still come on here and complain about it. That's with every video game it's sad but that's just the world we live in.

Completely irrelevant. Just because someone would complain about the "perfect" football game, that doesn't mean games shouldn't keep improving and refining.

Instead, what about those who would EAT UP a game like that? Why not focus on them instead of people who might complain that the grass is too long?

[Big FN Deal]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

See - I'm sick of this "if it played solid football it would be too hard for casuals/non-football coaches/whatever" line of thought.

If the player AI reacted like NFL players, the "casual" player wouldn't have to know why they are doing it or even know they are using NFL-style responsibilities. The plays would just play out as though they would, things would work because they should, things that are likely to fail would do so for reasons the "casual" sees on Sunday, and so on.

I mean when "Joe Football Fan" sees a DB make a great pick - does he know (or care) about how DBs play coverage, why the DB got such a great jump? No, he appreciates the play (or curses, depending on how it went for his team) and is engrossed in the symphony that is NFL football.

Playing Madden could be the same way. Just like it is for The Show. The average baseball fan doesn't need to know the mechanics of why high fastballs and big 12-6 curves are nasty to hit against or how to throw them with a controller - he can put it on "Classic" pitching or "Timing" hitting (or both) and get the same experience and player ratings create a similar outcome and his eye is challenged all the same.

So if that player or someone new to football calls a 46 defense against a 4 WR set and gets burned, with the game playing like real football, he can see with his eyes what happened. If he lets the game guide his play calling, and he sees the game suggest a Nickle Cover 3 on 3-and-20, then he can start learning what plays to consider in situations.

If the game played fundamental football with player AI that also did so and an engine that expresses player skill prototypes and such, he'll see the game play more like what it does on Sunday and can use the same "general knowledge" (it's 3rd and 2 - better watch the run, etc) and have things play as they should.

It's not about video game difficulty, it's about the sport playing out. If anything, it might be EASIER because the average fan wouldn't have to "learn Madden" instead of using general football knowledge he'd probably learned/heard watching games and listening to NFL network.




Completely irrelevant. Just because someone would complain about the "perfect" football game, that doesn't mean games shouldn't keep improving and refining.

Instead, what about those who would EAT UP a game like that? Why not focus on them instead of people who might complain that the grass is too long?

I wish I could marry this post, have kids with it and grow old together.

[jpdavis82]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

JP I really appreciate ur hope (side note hope ur child is well) but how can we as a whole believe the next wave of guys? We were told to believe the last group and the group before..let's say they have a board in their office and all the issues Madden has..how is QB Acc the first improvement over running tackling? Each group of dev have claimed sim was the goal..each also did something that had us say "wait maybe they have figured it out" but then what happens they either leave or worse stay and don't figure it out..ask ur self this question.."if Ford made a bad fleet of cars, changed CEO's several times did not improve, but continued to say we have a plan" would u believe them? The improvements I see (which graphics I see) is nothing more then a Mustang that LOOKS GREAT but the motor is terrible and has been for 10 years..how can we trust them ?


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In the end it comes down to the execution of the things we are being promised. The difference between now and then is this, this team understands that Madden is not currently a quality product and doesn't accurately represent what you see on Sunday. They have been more transparent and honest than any developers before them. When you ask Rex a tough question, he doesn't dance around it, he tells the truth. Secondly this team has a plan with a real vision and purpose, that is backed by the leadership above it. They are building off of each title, not just randomly adding things. Every year you're going to see improvements across the board, as well as additions to make the game more simulation than arcade. Thirdly, they are going to real nfl players and asking them how to do things like the real NFL, Clint Oldenburg and Bob Wylie for O/D line play, two Steelers DBs for zone and man coverage this year. There may have been one or two guys from a team, IE Ian, in the past, but now you have Cam and an entire team of developers pushing for simulation. Like I've said before, if this team can't make it happen, no team will. The vision, leadership, nfl experience, it's all in place, now they just have to deliver.

[NicVirtue]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

I think the reality of the situation is that in order for them to make a legit football sim, they have to scrap whatever those animations are sitting on, because we are on consoles with way more power, and players are still gliding about. They would have to redo everything, and that is just not going to happen, ever. Madden will just be a game with band-aid fixes to it's bruises. It's gotten to the point where we're almost lead to accept that something "good" in Madden is actually good, when is this day and age, it could be done 100x's better. I'm willing to bet that weight still does not matter, and that you can give a 150 lb QB, give him 99 trucking, and he will run through everyone.

[Mechcaniq]

Because I'm still not on board with the ps4, because the ps3 is fine with me, I'm just hoping the M15 looks and plays as good or better than NCAA 14. I see a lot of similarities when viewing these vids of M15 and playing NCAA 14. The kick off 4 example, I love NC's camera angle, and the graphics look great. So for me, unless EA drops the ball on the ps3 version of M15, I'm good with whatever changes EA makes.

[StefJoeHalt]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

In the end it comes down to the execution of the things we are being promised. The difference between now and then is this, this team understands that Madden is not currently a quality product and doesn't accurately represent what you see on Sunday. They have been more transparent and honest than any developers before them. When you ask Rex a tough question, he doesn't dance around it, he tells the truth. Secondly this team has a plan with a real vision and purpose, that is backed by the leadership above it. They are building off of each title, not just randomly adding things. Every year you're going to see improvements across the board, as well as additions to make the game more simulation than arcade. Thirdly, they are going to real nfl players and asking them how to do things like the real NFL, Clint Oldenburg and Bob Wylie for O/D line play, two Steelers DBs for zone and man coverage this year. There may have been one or two guys from a team, IE Ian, in the past, but now you have Cam and an entire team of developers pushing for simulation. Like I've said before, if this team can't make it happen, no team will. The vision, leadership, nfl experience, it's all in place, now they just have to deliver.

JP previous dev understood the game wasn't where it was suppose to be, they also were open were supposedly transparent, had a plan, and came here even (which was nice, and took guts)..u first line though is so true..comes down to execution..having NFL players is big IF they listen and do what these players say though..it just has all been said before..so hence the "show me stance" by many at least here..I hope to eat my words!


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[hanzsomehanz]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

I think the reality of the situation is that in order for them to make a legit football sim, they have to scrap whatever those animations are sitting on, [...]

I do not believe the engine needs to be yanked.

While we all see in the grand scheme what a destroy and rebuild project could accomplish: minor changes can produce major differences.

Take for example the herky-jerky animations: this could be mitigated by a *rating system that puts less "stress" on speed, agility and acceleration and allows for other secondary factors to become more pivotal in the performance of outcomes.

*Dan from FBG Ratings can speak more on how ratings affect gameplay in profound ways.

Is Madden replicating the NFL like the Show replicates the MLB?

Madden right now is built on gimmicky programmig that makes it permissable for the end-user and CPU AI to bypass the neccessary queues and processes we would see performed on NFL Sunday's.

Ball-hawk, heat-seeker, tethered passing - they all appease the casual gamer and while they also allow for warped animations: the former is more concerning to EA than the latter.

DB momentum being exaggeratingly devastated vs outs/in's and curls in off man coverage? It is there on purpose: it is there to give safe routes to the user in an effort to simulate how the average NFL QBs completes 60% of his attempted passes.

Pocket not compressing and enveloping the QB? Don't blame it on a lack of development talent - this is done by design: Madden's way of allowing QB's to casually freelance their way outside the tackles and create highlight-reels.

It should not require a preface by now but...

EA models the game after their own liking and would intentionally rather simulate the stats (end-game) and highlights than bother with articulating player performance and AI (the means) to mimic the NFL which cost more in development.

These gimmicky trappings are so pervasive they should be inherently accecpted by now as the standard culture of business as usual operations for Madden developments and they exist in an effort to coddle the casual gamer.

It is essentially part of the EA Sports - Madden business model to present the game as it is - the engine or lack of talent in departments is not to blame: credit the folks above the EA Tiburon - Madden GM's.

If there is a shift in that model and vision for how gamers play Madden then we should surely see these gimmicks shoveled out and replaced with Simulation programming that triggers thr gamer to play Football in an NFL simulated style.


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[The_Balm]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

In the end it comes down to the execution of the things we are being promised. The difference between now and then is this, this team understands that Madden is not currently a quality product and doesn't accurately represent what you see on Sunday. They have been more transparent and honest than any developers before them. When you ask Rex a tough question, he doesn't dance around it, he tells the truth. Secondly this team has a plan with a real vision and purpose, that is backed by the leadership above it. They are building off of each title, not just randomly adding things. Every year you're going to see improvements across the board, as well as additions to make the game more simulation than arcade. Thirdly, they are going to real nfl players and asking them how to do things like the real NFL, Clint Oldenburg and Bob Wylie for O/D line play, two Steelers DBs for zone and man coverage this year. There may have been one or two guys from a team, IE Ian, in the past, but now you have Cam and an entire team of developers pushing for simulation. Like I've said before, if this team can't make it happen, no team will. The vision, leadership, nfl experience, it's all in place, now they just have to deliver.

This sounds great, but EA doesn't get the benefit of doubt from me (and I'm sure they don't from many others). I need to see stuff, play with it and have it built on for a year or two before I take the word of the devs at face value about it. There have been too many direction changes, features ripped out (M12's replay cameras) and features not doing all the dev and PR teams said they would.

This team could be the best team in the world, but I won't jump up and down until I'm really liking what I'm playing and they have a good track record. I don't have anything against this team either, but sadly do to past Maddens and dev teams I don't give the benefit of doubt to EA.

Again this all sounds great, but let's say this team is fantastic, best team possible. What if the top EA brass said no to a full rewrite when this team asked? Maybe the team knows they can only do so much with this code base and they have a glass ceiling. We don't know if this team can really bring it and if they're fully backed by the brass like they say they are yet. This team really doesn't look like they have dropped "back of the box" features like they say they have yet (Tackle Cone and showing what plays worked online), but this is not proven at the moment.

Give me a very improved game that matches what EA says it'll be like and I'll start to believe, until then...

[GiantBlue76]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

In the end it comes down to the execution of the things we are being promised. The difference between now and then is this, this team understands that Madden is not currently a quality product and doesn't accurately represent what you see on Sunday. They have been more transparent and honest than any developers before them. When you ask Rex a tough question, he doesn't dance around it, he tells the truth. Secondly this team has a plan with a real vision and purpose, that is backed by the leadership above it. They are building off of each title, not just randomly adding things. Every year you're going to see improvements across the board, as well as additions to make the game more simulation than arcade. Thirdly, they are going to real nfl players and asking them how to do things like the real NFL, Clint Oldenburg and Bob Wylie for O/D line play, two Steelers DBs for zone and man coverage this year. There may have been one or two guys from a team, IE Ian, in the past, but now you have Cam and an entire team of developers pushing for simulation. Like I've said before, if this team can't make it happen, no team will. The vision, leadership, nfl experience, it's all in place, now they just have to deliver.

Yup, all with the same programmers on the central gameplay team writing the same code that hasn't worked in a decade.

[KBLover]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Gameplay Video - Seattle Seahawks vs. San Francisco 49ers (Smitty)

The difference between now and then is this, this team understands that Madden is not currently a quality product and doesn't accurately represent what you see on Sunday.

And every team has had some 'vision' for getting it to that point...but it's yet to happen.

Secondly this team has a plan with a real vision and purpose, that is backed by the leadership above it. They are building off of each title, not just randomly adding things.

So why does that video still look like the gameplay I see on M13? I didn't even get M25 so I'm not comparing it to last year's game, but 2 years ago.

Thirdly, they are going to real nfl players and asking them how to do things like the real NFL, Clint Oldenburg and Bob Wylie for O/D line play, two Steelers DBs for zone and man coverage this year

So they have real offensive and defensive linemen on the team and we still don't have pockets or any ferocity in the trench battles where much of football is won and lost?

There's a DB on the team and yet the interaction and contest because the WR and DB still looks pretty much the same?

Like I've said before, if this team can't make it happen, no team will. The vision, leadership, nfl experience, it's all in place, now they just have to deliver.

Until they do, I remain skeptical. Judging from the video in this post, that sounds like a position I'll remain in until shown gameplay evidence, not just good intentions and visions, that show otherwise.