Penalty Explanation Theory

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  • tdogg097
    Pro
    • Jun 2012
    • 855

    #1

    Penalty Explanation Theory

    As the title states this is simply a theory and it's nothing revolutionary as people have had similar threads in past versions of madden. I have done a lot of testing and I have come to the conclusion that penalties don't necessarily effect player attributes like sliders but instead how players approach plays. If you remember past versions of NCAA you could increase aggressiveness at the risk of penalties, i.e. "Hold Block" would result in bigger running lanes with the risk of more holding/clipping calls. Changing penalty sliders seems to have the same effect without the risk of penalties. With that said here are my observations of penalty sliders.


    Offside: Increases/decreases the aggressiveness of the defensive line. At 0, d-lineman are more conservative and generate less pass rush.


    False Start: Increases/decreases the aggressiveness of the offensive line. At 100, o-lineman fire off the line quicker to their blocks.


    Holding: Similar to the "Hold Block" feature in NCAA. At 100, o-lineman will hold their blocks longer. This seems to be more profound in the passing game.


    Facemask: Sadly, this is the only slider that actually works for CPU and Hum. However, this slider also impacts players tackle aggression. At 100, you will definitely see a ton of facemask penalties but also a lot of big hits.


    Defensive PI: Increases/decreases DB aggression. At 100, pass coverage is more high risk/high reward.


    Offensive PI: Increases/decreases WR aggression. At 100, wr's will lay out for the ball more with the added risk of not being as technically precise. I.e. not getting both feet down in bounds.


    KR/PR Int: Increases/decreases special teams aggressiveness. Lower the slider and you will see increases returning.


    Clipping: Similar to holding with one noticeable difference. Holding seems to impact pass blocking and clipping seems to have a greater impact on run blocking.


    Intentional Grounding: Impacts the qb's release. Increase slider and qb will hold on to the ball longer.


    Roughing the Passer: Impacts the pursuit of the qb. At 100, the defense with have greater pursuit to the qb.


    Roughing the Kicker: This slider is really unique as it impacts the defenses pursuit. At 0, you will see almost all solo tackles and at 100 you will see a team pursuit effort. At 100, 90% of the time there will 2-3 guys around the ball carrier.


    Using this info I've been able to achieve solid gameplay with nearly default All-Madden sliders. The only sliders I have touched besides penalties are QBA (5), Kickoff Power (55), Speed Threshold (0), and fatigue (60).


    Here are the penalties I'm currently using.
    Offsides: 5
    False Start: 95
    Holding: 95
    Facemask: 65 (-30)
    DPI: 95
    OPI: 5
    KR Int: 5
    Clipping: 5
    Int Grounding: 0 (-5)
    RTP: 5
    RTK: 5


    With these settings I'm seeing a lot of stuff you see on Sunday. A lot of 2-3yd running plays with an occasional big run. Variety in the passing game with elite pass d's shutting down sub-par passing games and vice versa.
    Last edited by tdogg097; 09-07-2014, 03:26 AM.
  • zizoux
    Rookie
    • Mar 2007
    • 464

    #2
    Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

    thank you. Will definitely try these.
    as you said user and cpu sliders give attribute boosts and that minimizes the differences between players

    Comment

    • iameich
      MVP
      • Jan 2011
      • 1501

      #3
      Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

      I just tried these along with Charter's AM sliders & face mask penalty has been called a totaled of 5 times in 5 mins (15min qt)!!! 3 were called on me while on defense, 2 were called on the CPUs defense smh!!!
      "It's about damn time... It's about damn time.” - LeBron James

      Comment

      • tdogg097
        Pro
        • Jun 2012
        • 855

        #4
        Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

        Originally posted by iameich
        I just tried these along with Charter's AM sliders & face mask penalty has been called a totaled of 5 times in 5 mins (15min qt)!!! 3 were called on me while on defense, 2 were called on the CPUs defense smh!!!


        I'm still working on the sweet spot for that slider. It's the only penalty that is called with consistency and it also impacts tackler aggression. I tried it at 5 just to see the impact and guys were breaking a lot of tackles. Keep in mind this penalty takes the place of all defensive penalties, PI, horse collar, roughing the passer, illegal hits to the head, etc. You either live with facemask as the only penalty or have virtually no penalties called. But I'm still trying to find the right dial so you get realistic stats, at 95 I'm consistently in double digits which is not realistic. I'm going to try 75.

        Comment

        • tdogg097
          Pro
          • Jun 2012
          • 855

          #5
          Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

          Stats from game with facemask at 75. Still too many penalties. Going to bump down to 65. Overall, this was a great game.


          <html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" /><link href="http://dynasties.operationsports.com/css/osdyn.css" rel="stylesheet" type="text/css"></head><body><table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" class="osdyn" width="575"><tr class="masthead"><td align="center" colspan="6">Indianapolis Colts at Denver Broncos</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="48%">Jan 1, </td><td align="right" width="10%">1ST</td><td align="right" width="10%">2ND</td><td align="right" width="10%">3RD</td><td align="right" width="10%">4TH</td><td align="right" width="12%">SCORE</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Indianapolis Colts (CPU)</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">28</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">7</td><td align="right" class="active">35</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Denver Broncos (HUM)</td><td align="right">7</td><td align="right">7</td><td align="right">7</td><td align="right">17</td><td align="right" class="active">38</td></tr></table><table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" class="osdyn spacer" width="575"><tr class="masthead"><td colspan="3">Team Stats Comparison</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="60%"></td><td align="center" width="20%">IND</td><td align="center" width="20%">DEN</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td align="center">Total Offense</td><td align="center">344</td><td align="center">431</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td align="center">Rushing Yards</td><td align="center">115</td><td align="center">106</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td align="center">Passing Yards</td><td align="center">229</td><td align="center">325</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td align="center">First Downs</td><td align="center">25</td><td align="center">26</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td align="center">Punt Return Yards</td><td align="center">14</td><td align="center">1</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td align="center">Kick Return Yards</td><td align="center">0</td><td align="center">125</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td align="center">Total Yards</td><td align="center">358</td><td align="center">557</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td align="center">Turnovers</td><td align="center">2</td><td align="center">3</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td align="center">3rd Down Converstion</td><td align="center">7-14</td><td align="center">5-8</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td align="center">4th Down Conversion</td><td align="center">1-2</td><td align="center">0-0</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td align="center">2-Point Conversion</td><td align="center">0-0</td><td align="center">0-0</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td align="center">Red Zone Touchdowns/Field Goals</td><td align="center">5-4-0</td><td align="center">6-5-1</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td align="center">Penalties</td><td align="center">9-99</td><td align="center">14-156</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td align="center">Posession Time</td><td align="center">32:55</td><td align="center">27:05</td></tr></table><table cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" class="spacer" style="margin:0 auto;" width="575"><tr><td align="center" valign="top" width="50%"><table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" class="osdyn spacer" width="100%"><tr class="masthead_alt"><td bgcolor="#163F83" colspan="5"><span style="color:#FFFFFF;">Indianapolis Colts</span></td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="36%">PASSING</td><td align="right" width="16%">C/A</td><td align="right" width="16%">YDS</td><td align="right" width="16%">TD</td><td align="right" width="16%">INT</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Team</td><td align="right">29/42</td><td align="right">325</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">2</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="36%">RUSHING</td><td align="right" width="16%">ATT</td><td align="right" width="16%">YDS</td><td align="right" width="16%">AVG</td><td align="right" width="16%">TD</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Team</td><td align="right">27</td><td align="right">106</td><td align="right">3.9</td><td align="right">3</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="36%">DEFENSE</td><td align="right" width="16%">TACK</td><td align="right" width="16%">SACK</td><td align="right" width="16%">INT</td><td align="right" width="16%">TD</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Team</td><td align="right">63-6</td><td align="right">6</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">0</td></tr></table></td><td align="center" valign="top" width="50%"><table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" class="osdyn spacer" width="100%"><tr class="masthead_alt"><td bgcolor="#0D254C" colspan="5"><span style="color:#FFFFFF;">Denver Broncos</span></td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="36%">PASSING</td><td align="right" width="16%">C/A</td><td align="right" width="16%">YDS</td><td align="right" width="16%">TD</td><td align="right" width="16%">INT</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Team</td><td align="right">28/37</td><td align="right">267</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">2</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="36%">RUSHING</td><td align="right" width="16%">ATT</td><td align="right" width="16%">YDS</td><td align="right" width="16%">AVG</td><td align="right" width="16%">TD</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Team</td><td align="right">36</td><td align="right">115</td><td align="right">3.2</td><td align="right">3</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="36%">DEFENSE</td><td align="right" width="16%">TACK</td><td align="right" width="16%">SACK</td><td align="right" width="16%">INT</td><td align="right" width="16%">TD</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Team</td><td align="right">55-0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">0</td></tr></table></td></tr></table></body></html>

          Comment

          • chino22
            Rookie
            • Jul 2008
            • 456

            #6
            Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

            Based on the theory, you should be seeing a large reduction in the amount of sacks the CPU has been giving up. Have you noticed that? In your stats above, did that mean that you as Denver did not sack Luck once?
            Originally posted by Da_Czar
            Don't play video games, play basketball.

            Comment

            • tdogg097
              Pro
              • Jun 2012
              • 855

              #7
              Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

              Originally posted by chino22
              Based on the theory, you should be seeing a large reduction in the amount of sacks the CPU has been giving up. Have you noticed that? In your stats above, did that mean that you as Denver did not sack Luck once?


              Those stats are swapped. I had 6 sacks but I have seen a lot of variety with sacks. From 0, to the 6 that I had in this game. My DT had 3 sacks early and then the AI shored up the pass pro.

              Comment

              • Last Gunfighter
                "I reckon so."
                • Sep 2012
                • 891

                #8
                Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

                Originally posted by tdogg097
                As the title states this is simply a theory and it's nothing revolutionary as people have had similar threads in past versions of madden. I have done a lot of testing and I have come to the conclusion that penalties don't necessarily effect player attributes like sliders but instead how players approach plays. If you remember past versions of NCAA you could increase aggressiveness at the risk of penalties, i.e. "Hold Block" would result in bigger running lanes with the risk of more holding/clipping calls. Changing penalty sliders seems to have the same effect without the risk of penalties. With that said here are my observations of penalty sliders.


                Offside: Increases/decreases the aggressiveness of the defensive line. At 0, d-lineman are more conservative and generate less pass rush.


                False Start: Increases/decreases the aggressiveness of the offensive line. At 100, o-lineman fire off the line quicker to their blocks.


                Holding: Similar to the "Hold Block" feature in NCAA. At 100, o-lineman will hold their blocks longer. This seems to be more profound in the passing game.


                Facemask: Sadly, this is the only slider that actually works for CPU and Hum. However, this slider also impacts players tackle aggression. At 100, you will definitely see a ton of facemask penalties but also a lot of big hits.


                Defensive PI: Increases/decreases DB aggression. At 100, pass coverage is more high risk/high reward.


                Offensive PI: Increases/decreases WR aggression. At 100, wr's will lay out for the ball more with the added risk of not being as technically precise. I.e. not getting both feet down in bounds.


                KR/PR Int: Increases/decreases special teams aggressiveness. Lower the slider and you will see increases returning.


                Clipping: Similar to holding with one noticeable difference. Holding seems to impact pass blocking and clipping seems to have a greater impact on run blocking.


                Intentional Grounding: Impacts the qb's release. Increase slider and qb will hold on to the ball longer.


                Roughing the Passer: Impacts the pursuit of the qb. At 100, the defense with have greater pursuit to the qb.


                Roughing the Kicker: This slider is really unique as it impacts the defenses pursuit. At 0, you will see almost all solo tackles and at 100 you will see a team pursuit effort. At 100, 90% of the time there will 2-3 guys around the ball carrier.


                Using this info I've been able to achieve solid gameplay with nearly default All-Madden sliders. The only sliders I have touched besides penalties are QBA (5), Kickoff Power (55), Speed Threshold (0), and fatigue (60).


                Here are the penalties I'm currently using.
                Offsides: 5
                False Start: 95
                Holding: 95
                Facemask: 95 (Still testing because this generates a lot of penalties)
                DPI: 95
                OPI: 5
                KR Int: 5
                Clipping: 5
                Int Grounding: 5
                RTP: 5
                RTK: 5


                With these settings I'm seeing a lot of stuff you see on Sunday. A lot of 2-3yd running plays with an occasional big run. Variety in the passing game with elite pass d's shutting down sub-par passing games and vice versa.
                I tried these just as they are except with face mask at 75. After 3 quarters I turned it off, 18 face mask calls....
                WHO DAT! | GEAUX TIGERS! | LET'S GO RANGERS!

                "If you work for a living, why do you kill yourself working?" -Tuco

                Comment

                • Team Woopie
                  Rookie
                  • Apr 2013
                  • 22

                  #9
                  Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

                  For what it's worth i've tried a lot of sliders on here and i think there's some merit in these. Facemask needs to come way down (to like 53/55 - still gets called) but I've actually had holding calls etc.


                  Gameplay-wise seems varied, although I think running for CPU might need to be tweaked down just a notch

                  Comment

                  • tdogg097
                    Pro
                    • Jun 2012
                    • 855

                    #10
                    Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

                    65 seems to be a solid number for facemask. Thru 4 games I have 20 penalties for 255 yds. The CPU has 31 for 273. My yards per penalty are a little high so I'm going to combat that by going offsides on any extra point attempt. It's a 1 yd penalty with no impact on the outcome. It's kind of lame but you have to work with what you got to get realistic stats. I've given up 14 td's on the season (I'm playing with the Raiders) so if I had done that I would have 34 penalties for 269 yds.


                    I'm 0-4 so far and have lost 17-31, 20-23, 9-25, and 32-42. I've thrown way too many picks, 11 in 4 games.


                    I'm still working on OPI/DPI. With DPI at 95 the passing game is a little too much dink and dunk. At 5, there is way too much separation. And the CPU is taking a lot of sacks, 21 in 4 games although at least 6-7 of those were on screen passes. I'm going to try OPI/DPI at default and see what kind of results I get (I'll post box scores when I get my next game in).

                    Comment

                    • tdogg097
                      Pro
                      • Jun 2012
                      • 855

                      #11
                      Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

                      Originally posted by Team Woopie
                      For what it's worth i've tried a lot of sliders on here and i think there's some merit in these. Facemask needs to come way down (to like 53/55 - still gets called) but I've actually had holding calls etc.


                      Gameplay-wise seems varied, although I think running for CPU might need to be tweaked down just a notch


                      I've had good games on run d and also some really bad ones. Thru 4 games the CPU is averaging 4.4 ypc. I'm good with that number but if you need to tweak feel free.

                      Comment

                      • forme95
                        MVP
                        • Nov 2013
                        • 3118

                        #12
                        Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

                        I wont be able to jump on Madden to test this today, but I thought of it and wanted to share. I think holding penalty (in general) might be a combination of Holding false start and offsides. In M25 I wasnt seeing any or very little, but I ran across a penalty adjustment and I started seeing 3 or 6 a game. In 25 I had Offsides @ 76, False Start @ 72, and Holding @ 64. Look at these numbers, Offsides is highest, so that indicates the dline gets a good jump off the snap. Whereas False start is a lower value so the oline doesnt react as quick which causes the oline to try to adjust the block which (in theory) triggers holding. Just a thought.
                        Really wish sports games played to ratings!
                        Only thing SIM about sports games now, are the team name and players
                        CFB 25 The absolute GOAT!!!
                        MLB 23 FOREVER 20 is better, 23 just for Guardians
                        Madden get rid of the extras (SS/XF, HFA, media, scenarios, game plan) or turn them down considerably.

                        Comment

                        • Team Woopie
                          Rookie
                          • Apr 2013
                          • 22

                          #13
                          Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

                          Not sure why this thread isn't getting more love. These along with a higher-than-most-people have qba (20 on all madden) have made the biggest difference to the gameplay for me


                          Think the theory seems solid for the most part, although i think both dbs and wrs play tougher on lower OPI and DPI


                          As i said on another thread, i had megatron jump high to challenge a db, rip the ball down in single coverage, stay on his feet as db fell down and jog in for a 50 yard td (with OPI and DPI on 20)

                          Comment

                          • SwaggerCoach
                            MVP
                            • Oct 2011
                            • 1342

                            #14
                            Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

                            Any of you guys have success lowering your sacks per game against the CPU using these? I've been tweaking penalties all day lol. Increasing holding has definitely helped.


                            Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

                            Comment

                            • tommycoa
                              MVP
                              • Nov 2008
                              • 4982

                              #15
                              Re: Penalty Explanation Theory

                              Originally posted by SwaggerCoach
                              Any of you guys have success lowering your sacks per game against the CPU using these? I've been tweaking penalties all day lol. Increasing holding has definitely helped.


                              Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
                              I've lowered KR Interference to 1 and still don't notcice any better returns.
                              For an alltime legends team on xbox, search usertag haughtypine7723

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