Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio Brown

[Big FN Deal]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

Yikes. The bold just screams to me something similar to the D-Line button mini-game that was implemented last year. I pray that's not the case but that's what I'm taking from that. The battle isn't and should never be "mine to win" the battle is between my virtual guy and another virtual guy, they should determine who wins.

I read that part and smh because it implies that it hasn't been the User's to win or lose before now, basically doubling down on more User control. Like most concepts with Madden over the years, more User control is logical in a video game, even a sports sim one but of course history has shown that logic with regard to realism tends to go out the window with the implementation, for whatever reason. I use the term "for whatever reason" quite a bit with regard to Madden because there seems to be a myriad of potential causes but one constant, unrealistic results.

It would be nice to think that whatever User control they add would inherently make the AI better by nature of it having more tools at its' disposal but again, history shows otherwise. So it's no wonder why when even those that agree more User control in a sports sim video game should be a good and logical thing, they have a less than favorable reaction to it being touted in Madden.

It's funny the way Madden is touted sometimes as a unique entity unto itself where the standards set by its' contemporaries do not apply, while at other times its' just a typical video game, whichever one makes for the best excuse on a case by case basis it seems.

[GiantBlue76]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

I find it amazing that any grown person cares about this. I guess I'm just old.

[Skyboxer]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

As a User vs CPU player only, my hope is that the CPU-opponents and User teammates- can, 1. use these tools at all, and 2. use these tools at a high level. I also hope that these tools aren't absurdly overpowered for the User.

If they make a, "This is only for User controlled players" statement, that will be a catastrophic failure.

Unless past history isn't a factor this time... expect a failure. EA's been all about the User controlling everything (Due to no clue how to program decent AI) in all past replies about questions regarding CPU AI.

[Skyboxer]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

Yeah because this is so much more exciting

foh. Just my opinion, I stated that I knew I was in the minority at the beginning of my post.

I'm part of that minority too

[DeuceDouglas]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

To that end - should a user be allowed control a running back? A quarterback?

If so - why not a wide receiver, cornerback, or pass rusher? What's the difference?

If not - that's a perfectly reasonable opinion, but (the limited in-game coach mode options notwithstanding) that's not the way Madden or any other mainstream console sports game has ever been built. They all expect the user to do something - to make the passes and shoot the ball, to swing the bat and throw the pitches - in order for his team to succeed. The ratings influence the result, yes, but the action doesn't begin to happen without user input. The "virtual guys do all the battles and not me" idea is not a useful expectation to hold these games to because it violates a core tenet of the game's experience.

To be clear, this is not me hating on coach mode. I thought Head Coach 09 was fantastic, and coach simulators / text-based sports games can be great. I also think having coach mode options in Madden is great. All I'm saying here is Madden isn't, has never been, and will never be purely a coach simulator and shouldn't be treated purely as such.

I just feel like some of these mechanics that they implement give the user too much control over the outcome. When you implement something like the D-Line mechanic last year where you basically give the user a step-by-step walk-through to success, the majority of users are going to expect success at a very high rate when they execute properly. Most (casual) users don't want to see "Perfect" on their screen only to get stonewalled by the tackle or smothered off the line by the guard. 'Perfect' essentially equals success to a lot of users and that inherently leads to these mechanics being a bit overpowered to appease that notion.

It reminds me a lot of the catcher pitch selection or whatever it was called from the 2K baseball games where it would tell you where to throw and what to throw.

Now, I have no clue what's in store for the WR-DB interaction or if it will be remotely similar to the D-Line mechanic, it just seems like that's where it very well could be headed with the running back "fighting combos" and then the pass rush set up last year. I'm all for user control in moderation. I just don't want to throw a pass 5 yards behind or in front of my receiver and be able to click to him and make some physics defying OBJ catch that wouldn't normally happen otherwise.

Ideally, I'd like to see these things implemented primarily at an AI vs. AI level so that they would just flow with the action and happen naturally rather than primarily setup for User v. User and AI secondarily. I by no means want some sort of coach mode game with extremely limited user control, I'm just not really a fan of the current implementation trend.

[Focus10]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

Yeah because this is so much more exciting

foh. Just my opinion, I stated that I knew I was in the minority at the beginning of my post.

This cover much better than those boring 90s ones

[jfsolo]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

Ideally, I'd like to see these things implemented primarily at an AI vs. AI level so that they would just flow with the action and happen naturally rather than primarily setup for User v. User and AI secondarily. I by no means want some sort of coach mode game with extremely limited user control, I'm just not really a fan of the current implementation trend.

Back during the oh so brief Halcyon Days of team Tiburon's developer interaction with OS, there was a discussion with Ian about this sort of thing. He said that the AI vs. AI ratings based WR/DR interactions could be done, but that obviously a fair amount of User control would be sacrificed. Many here advocated strongly for what he was describing, but it was clear that it was just an intellectual exercise. He didn't expressly say it, but everyone who was paying attention knew that this wasn't going to happen in a Madden football game.

How ya gonna introduce realistic WR/DB play after they've seen Rocket Catching.

[RexDEAFootball]

As a User vs CPU player only, my hope is that the CPU-opponents and User teammates- can, 1. use these tools at all, and 2. use these tools at a high level. I also hope that these tools aren't absurdly overpowered for the User.

If they make a, "This is only for User controlled players" statement, that will be a catastrophic failure.

I can't get into detail until after E3 but I can confirm that the AI's will utilize the all the new mechanics we introduced this year.

[SageInfinite]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

I can't get into detail until after E3 but I can confirm that the AI's will utilize the all the new mechanics we introduced this year.

Does the AI finally utilize the block steering that was implemented last year?

[jfsolo]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

I can't get into detail until after E3 but I can confirm that the AI's will utilize the all the new mechanics we introduced this year.

Thanks, this is a big positive concerning these mechanics, now it's all about the tuning.

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

I can't get into detail until after E3 but I can confirm that the AI's will utilize the all the new mechanics we introduced this year.

Thanks for the info...I do hope that all the animations will be used across any and all slider settings...As it is now, certain animations only appear at certain skill levels and sliders settings..I would hope all the 100's of animations would play out on any level..

And please, a fully detailed list of what all the sliders do, affect and how they relate to each other would be very nice and appreciated...

[GiantsFan2013]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

So a rookie makes one great catch and all of a sudden he's going to be on madden? (You all know this is gonna happen) sorry id like to see how the rest of his career pans out before putting him on the cover. It should be someone who has had an established career. Just my opinion.

He had one of the greatest statistical seasons ever as a rookie, only playing 12 games.

[IndyColts2]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

To those saying that ODB only had one catch this season and doesn't deserve to be on the cover; he had 91 receptions for 1305 yards and 12 TD in just 12 games.

Also, I actually like the cover vote. And the cover athlete is important, in a way, as it is essentially supposed to represent the biggest names in the NFL from the prior seasons. I wish we had the full 32-man field instead of just these four though. PP doesn't deserve to be a finalist over a lot of players.

Yeah he did that because victor Cruz was hurt the whole season. What other offensive playmakers do the Giants have ....? Reuben Randall ? Lmaooo yeah

[IndyColts2]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

To that end - should a user be allowed control a running back? A quarterback?

If so - why not a wide receiver, cornerback, or pass rusher? What's the difference?

If not - that's a perfectly reasonable opinion, but (the limited in-game coach mode options notwithstanding) that's not the way Madden or any other mainstream console sports game has ever been built. They all expect the user to do something - to make the passes and shoot the ball, to swing the bat and throw the pitches - in order for his team to succeed. The ratings influence the result, yes, but the action doesn't begin to happen without user input. The "virtual guys do all the battles and not me" idea is not a useful expectation to hold these games to because it violates a core tenet of the game's experience.

To be clear, this is not me hating on coach mode. I thought Head Coach 09 was fantastic, and coach simulators / text-based sports games can be great. I also think having coach mode options in Madden is great. All I'm saying here is Madden isn't, has never been, and will never be purely a coach simulator and shouldn't be treated purely as such.

That's the thing. Obviously we want as much user control as possible on any given situation, yes. But at the same time I want Calvin Johnson to play like Calvin Johnson and I want Riley Cooper to play like Riley Cooper. Just as in real life, the players are in full control of what they are doing but that doesn't mean that a Riley Cooper being in the same situation as Calvin Johnson will create the same end result. In Madden I can user catch anything I want with the right timing. I can juke anybody I want using any player with the right timing. There is no differentiation besides maybe the speed of a juke. Yes we should give the user control of the situation, but ratings and physics should determine the outcome.

I can put my WR on a 10 yard curl and throw the ball at 6 yards and press B, then smash Y and he will instantly turn around mid-stride and catch the ball as if he knew the QB was going to throw the ball halfway through his route. No. That should not be possible. It's football. The WR should continue running and the ball should sail behind him whether i switched my control or not. But since that is the kind of "control" people want then we will never have a "sim" game of Madden unless we as "sim users" ourselves make our house rules and disallow user switching. Makes sense.

[GiantsFan2013]

Re: Madden NFL 16 Cover Vote Features Gronk, P. Peterson, Odell Beckham Jr. Antonio B

Yeah he did that because victor Cruz was hurt the whole season. What other offensive playmakers do the Giants have ....? Reuben Randall ? Lmaooo yeah

I hate when people give me the whole 'But he's the only one to do anything on that team!'. Yes, his numbers will probably go down a bit due to Cruz being back, and a better run game. But there are plenty of other WR's who basically are alone as playmakers on their teams, and don't do anything close to what Beckham did. So don't hate on him for doing what he can with what he had.

edit: Plus, you could say being the only playmaker is tougher than being with other guys, because he's going against team's Top-CB.