NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

[MGSW]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

It's called an opinion, and to be honest I don't care about some random nobody "taking me serious".

Go look up their stats; identical. So I can compare them all I want. All day, every day, any time, any where. So when I say they have identical stats but Wroten's taller and more athletic, I can then say I'd rather have him....and he's much younger.

There's no way Rose has the rating he has right now, there's plenty of guards (realistically) better than him. Wroten shouldn't be higher but he shouldn't be 9 points lower if they have the same stats, right? Okay.

I completely understand what you're saying but Wroten only played something like 30 games. That's a really small sample size in the grand scheme of things. His averages over 30 games shouldn't be comparable to the per game averages of a guy who played 20+ more games than he did.

Rose when he was healthy is beyond what Wroten could even dream of being.

Now? Sure since his athleticism took a knock it's different. But to compare them after wroten had one decent season on a very bad team? Come on man.

Also you have to look at all the numbers.

Rose held opposing PGs to an average PER of 14 (<NBA average) an eFG% of 44% and forced almost 3 turnovers per game.

Wroten held opposing PGs to an average PER of 19 (>NBA average). An eFG% of 54% and forced 4 turnovers per game.

Philly were actually better defensively when Wroten was on the bench. They gave up 111 points per 100 possessions with Wroten on the floor. They gave up 104 points when Wroten was on the bench.

With Rose, the Bulls gave up 105 points per 100 possessions with Rose on the floor and 106 with him on the bench.

Rose was a plus defender last year, Wroten wasn't.

With Wroten on the floor Philly allowed more assisted field goals, a higher eFG% and turned the ball over more on offense.

Wroten had a DRtg of 106.6 while Rose was 105.1 so Rose was in the top 40 out of all players (playing > 24mpg). And Wroten was in the top 150 (he was about 148th)


And when you compare the offense you have to remember 44% of Wroten's made baskets were assisted on. Compared to 35% of D.Rose. Rose is clearly better at creating for himself.





Again. Small sample sizes so I don't take too much from it. But I think it's still to early to compare them properly.

[MGSW]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

No idea what's wrong with this forum but it keeps erasing sentences from my posts.

Edit: seriously why can't I post Roses numbers? Wtf is wrong with this crappy site.

*Rose held opposing PGs to an average PER of 14 (less than the NBA average) an eFG% of 44% and forced almost 3 turnovers per game.

Wroten held opposing PGs to an average PER of 19 (>NBA average). An eFG% of 54% and forced 4 turnovers per game.

[MoneyOvaHuds]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

I completely understand what you're saying but Wroten only played something like 30 games. That's a really small sample size in the grand scheme of things. His averages over 30 games shouldn't be comparable to the per game averages of a guy who played 20+ more games than he did.

Rose when he was healthy is beyond what Wroten could even dream of being.

Now? Sure since his athleticism took a knock it's different. But to compare them after wroten had one decent season on a very bad team? Come on man.

Also you have to look at all the numbers.

Rose held opposing PGs to an average PER of 14 (<NBA average) an eFG% of 44% and forced almost 3 turnovers per game.

Wroten held opposing PGs to an average PER of 19 (>NBA average). An eFG% of 54% and forced 4 turnovers per game.

Philly were actually better defensively when Wroten was on the bench. They gave up 111 points per 100 possessions with Wroten on the floor. They gave up 104 points when Wroten was on the bench.

With Rose, the Bulls gave up 105 points per 100 possessions with Rose on the floor and 106 with him on the bench.

Rose was a plus defender last year, Wroten wasn't.

With Wroten on the floor Philly allowed more assisted field goals, a higher eFG% and turned the ball over more on offense.

Wroten had a DRtg of 106.6 while Rose was 105.1 so Rose was in the top 40 out of all players (playing > 24mpg). And Wroten was in the top 150 (he was about 148th)


And when you compare the offense you have to remember 44% of Wroten's made baskets were assisted on. Compared to 35% of D.Rose. Rose is clearly better at creating for himself.





Again. Small sample sizes so I don't take too much from it. But I think it's still to early to compare them properly.

Great post man

[MGSW]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

Great post man

Thanks. Numbers can't tell you everything. Like the guy says, Wroten is bigger and at this point probably more athletic (due to injuries to Rose). The physical side has to be taken into account.

I can see his argument for Wroten being close to the same level or as good in terms of Production. But I don't agree with drawing a conclusion like that after just 30 games. I mean it's just too small a sample size.

Plus all the on/off numbers and advanced metrics seem to support the idea that Philly were better defensively when Wroten was on the bench, so his size didn't have as much of an impact as some might think (although he did force a ton of turnovers).

[2_headedmonster]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

D'Angelo Russell a 77...on a HOF scale?

[MGSW]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

D'Angelo Russell a 77...on a HOF scale?

He's getting that Lakers bump.

Watch Delly get signed to L.A and become an 82 overall.

[Real2KInsider]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

I'll try to post before work in the morning (another full-day tomorrow), sleep is calling me at present.

[MGSW]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

I just looked it up and to my surprise Wroten's wingspan is 6'9. D.Rose has a wingspan of 6'8.

So despite being taller the wingspan isn't that much different. So in terms of size defensively (wingspan matters more than height), it's not that big of a gap.

[Sundown]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

I completely understand what you're saying but Wroten only played something like 30 games. That's a really small sample size in the grand scheme of things. His averages over 30 games shouldn't be comparable to the per game averages of a guy who played 20+ more games than he did.

Rose when he was healthy is beyond what Wroten could even dream of being.

Now? Sure since his athleticism took a knock it's different. But to compare them after wroten had one decent season on a very bad team? Come on man.

They're both players with mediocre to poor performances-- and the fact that Rose has a larger sample size than Wroten should actually cause his rating to drop significantly.

Also you have to look at all the numbers.

Rose held opposing PGs to an average PER of 14 (<nba game.

Wroten held opposing PGs to an average PER of 19 (>NBA average). An eFG% of 54% and forced 4 turnovers per game.

Philly were actually better defensively when Wroten was on the bench. They gave up 111 points per 100 possessions with Wroten on the floor. They gave up 104 points when Wroten was on the bench.

With Rose, the Bulls gave up 105 points per 100 possessions with Rose on the floor and 106 with him on the bench.

Rose was a plus defender last year, Wroten wasn't.

With Wroten on the floor Philly allowed more assisted field goals, a higher eFG% and turned the ball over more on offense.

Wroten had a DRtg of 106.6 while Rose was 105.1 so Rose was in the top 40 out of all players (playing > 24mpg). And Wroten was in the top 150 (he was about 148th)


And when you compare the offense you have to remember 44% of Wroten's made baskets were assisted on. Compared to 35% of D.Rose. Rose is clearly better at creating for himself.

Again. Small sample sizes so I don't take too much from it. But I think it's still to early to compare them properly.

</nba>
<nba game.
Now you make a pretty good case that Wroten shouldn't be rated anything beyond kind-of-pretty-bad for a PG. But the same should apply to Rose. He should rank around the high 70's to 80 at best due to his performance after his injury-- but has instead been insulated from drops and excused BY his injury coming onto... the third 2K release now?

</nba>

[Hopsin]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

It's called an opinion, and to be honest I don't care about some random nobody "taking me serious".



Go look up their stats; identical. So I can compare them all I want. All day, every day, any time, any where. So when I say they have identical stats but Wroten's taller and more athletic, I can then say I'd rather have him....and he's much younger.



There's no way Rose has the rating he has right now, there's plenty of guards (realistically) better than him. Wroten shouldn't be higher but he shouldn't be 9 points lower if they have the same stats, right? Okay.

Tony Wroten more athletic than Rose? Lol okay.

[Hopsin]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

What's wrong with this forum? Why is Wroten even mentioned in the same breath as anyone other than maybe MCW..

[MGSW]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

They're both players with mediocre to poor performances-- and the fact that Rose has a larger sample size than Wroten should actually cause his rating to drop significantly.

I disagree. It's easier to average say 16 and 5 over 10 games than it is over 30. Easier to average over 30 than it is over 50.

The more games you play the more fatigue you accrue and the more likely you are to have bad games that bring your averages down. Also since its such a small sample size we should probably take a look at who the opponents were and what level of defense they were playing against. I'm betting against top flight defensive teams like GSW, Memphis and Milwaukee, Rose out performed Wroten.

Sustaining an average of 18 and 5 over 50 games is more difficult than sustaining an average of 17 and 5 over 30 games.


Regardless, the smaller the sample size the less you have to work with.

[MGSW]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

Tony Wroten more athletic than Rose? Lol okay.

Pre injury, that statement would be outlandish. Rose was arguably the most athletic point guard in the league (only other arguments you could make were for Westbrook and Wall).

But post injury? His athleticism took a massive hit. It's not a stretch to say he's on par with Wroten. I don't think his athleticism will ever return to what it was.

[Hopsin]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

Pre injury, that statement would be outlandish. Rose was arguably the most athletic point guard in the league (only other arguments you could make were for Westbrook and Wall).



But post injury? His athleticism took a massive hit. It's not a stretch to say he's on par with Wroten. I don't think his athleticism will ever return to what it was.

I watched every bulls game last year, I can say his athleticism is still there, now did he use it as much as in the past no. Not at all, but that stems from not playing so long and honestly being tentative.
I guess you could take his rust + tentativeness as saying it took a huge blow, but I know it's there and I honestly believe only wall and westbrooke are more athletic. As far as PGs

[Sundown]

Re: NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

I disagree. It's easier to average say 16 and 5 over 10 games than it is over 30. Easier to average over 30 than it is over 50.

The more games you play the more fatigue you accrue and the more likely you are to have bad games that bring your averages down. Also since its such a small sample size we should probably take a look at who the opponents were and what level of defense they were playing against. I'm betting against top flight defensive teams like GSW, Memphis and Milwaukee, Rose out performed Wroten.

Sustaining an average of 18 and 5 over 50 games is more difficult than sustaining an average of 17 and 5 over 30 games.


Regardless, the smaller the sample size the less you have to work with.

What I'm saying is there's a very high sample set of Rose playing poorly that justifies knocking Rose down significantly without any relation to Wroten.


Wroten also happens to be pretty medicore as well.