9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes - Operation Sports Forums

9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

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  • DaSmerg
    Rookie
    • Jul 2010
    • 155

    #46
    Interesting comments. Interesting twist in this case. US law is so fascinating sometimes.

    On the issue many have raised in this topic...amateur/amateurism, the NCAA, TV money, paid players, value of education. I think the one thing I fail to see in anyone who has brought up '...NCAA makes a gagillion dollars...' is that for every big name D1 school that you feel is making a gagillion dollars is that there are something like 10 small schools that might break even or that have a successful program (say men's basketball) that pays for the rest of their sport programs (for men & women). Yeah, ESPN's college deal was a giant number at the top line, but divide that number by conferences, then by teams and then by years. How much is it now?

    I also fail to see addressed how paying young men to play football and/or basketball (let's face it, the two big money sports) and how that would be squared with Title IX...paying an equal amount to an equivalent amount of young women to play sports most of us would never bother to watch.

    Nor do I see addressed what was brought up early on in this thread...the cost of a full ride scholarship, not including unmeasurables like connections you can make through booster & alumini clubs to a bigger/brighter life after college ball. On the value of scholarship, a measurable, my mother was advising a client a couple years ago who's daughter, in New York state, desperately wanted to go to Michigan. Out of state tution alone was 30 grand a year. How exactly would you measure the value of the coaching and athletic training that each student-athlete recieves? Do paid players give up a portion of their "salary" to pay for coaches too? Do red shirt roster hangars get volunteer trainer services? How about their medical care? Do only big name players get a true "full ride" now? Where's the bottom in this what's paid, and not paid?

    IMO the stupid BCS system totally distorted many people's perception of the NCAA making it seem like every school is big and making money.

    "What I look forward to is continued immaturity followed by death"
    -Dave Barry

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    • redsox4evur
      Hall Of Fame
      • Jul 2013
      • 18310

      #47
      Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

      DaSmerg you are so right....Title IX definitely would have to come into play. Also you are right about the big time schools and the money issues. I am one of those people that at some point thought, most of the big time athletic departments make a ton of money for their schools. And boy was I wrong. I took some sports management classes in college and I learned that only 12-15 DEPARTMENTS made a profit. That surprised me to say the least. Passing a new rule like this could really hurt the smaller schools like Akron, Miami OH, etc.
      Follow me on Twitter

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      • RedHawk24
        Rookie
        • Jul 2010
        • 145

        #48
        Why not just take the PES approach to not having the licenses for the schools? Call the schools something generic (think "Columbus College" for Ohio State, etc) and then allow players to import school imagery, uniforms, and change the names? Just call the game "College Football 2017" and avoid any mention of the NCAA.
        NCAA- Toledo Rockets
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        • redsox4evur
          Hall Of Fame
          • Jul 2013
          • 18310

          #49
          Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

          Originally posted by RedHawk24
          Why not just take the PES approach to not having the licenses for the schools? Call the schools something generic (think "Columbus College" for Ohio State, etc) and then allow players to import school imagery, uniforms, and change the names? Just call the game "College Football 2017" and avoid any mention of the NCAA.
          Because not a lot of people will buy it ala. All-Pro Football by 2K.
          Follow me on Twitter

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          • RedHawk24
            Rookie
            • Jul 2010
            • 145

            #50
            Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

            Originally posted by redsox4evur
            Because not a lot of people will buy it ala. All-Pro Football by 2K.
            That's not a fair comparison. All-Pro was competing with Madden, so people just stuck with the known brand which had the licenses. Given the amount of work that people already are willing to do for a great college game with roster shares/edits, I'm confident there would be a market for this style of college football game, especially since right now, it would be the only one on the market. 2K needs to get back in the football game anyway, so why not have them come back with "All-American Football 2K17"?

            Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk
            NCAA- Toledo Rockets
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            NBA- Cleveland Cavaliers
            NHL- Columbus Blue Jackets
            MLS- Columbus Crew SC

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            • Beefmaster
              Rookie
              • Jan 2006
              • 282

              #51
              Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

              At the moment, there is parody in college football. If the NCAA allowed players to be paid for their likeness/image/autographs, that would go away. As soon as a player can get paid, a booster from Texas/Alabama/Ohio State would have $250k for some player(s) on the team. Then it would be "Who has the best team money can buy?" I believe this is part of what the NCAA is trying to avoid. The other part being the loss of their cash cow.

              On a side note, do any of you donate to The Goodwill Store? That is a business as well. But, the owner sells products he never has to pay for. Sound familiar?
              Phat Slob Sports

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              • Junior Moe
                MVP
                • Jul 2009
                • 3824

                #52
                Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

                Originally posted by Beefmaster
                At the moment, there is parody in college football. If the NCAA allowed players to be paid for their likeness/image/autographs, that would go away. As soon as a player can get paid, a booster from Texas/Alabama/Ohio State would have $250k for some player(s) on the team. Then it would be "Who has the best team money can buy?" I believe this is part of what the NCAA is trying to avoid. The other part being the loss of their cash cow.

                On a side note, do any of you donate to The Goodwill Store? That is a business as well. But, the owner sells products he never has to pay for. Sound familiar?
                True. But I think boosters paying player should continue to be strictly prohibited for the reasons you just said. Ohio State, Texas and Alabama would never lose...

                The issue, as I see it, is the NCAA getting in the way of the players' free market value.

                The NCAA is profiting off the players, and I think that's fair considering what they are offered in return like a free education, stage to show off talent, and chance to change their lives. Remember, about 1% actually go pro and an even smaller number those few get the "set for life money". So they, and the rest benefit tremendously from the education and connections they make in college.

                The NCAA prohibits players from doing exactly what they are doing, though. And I think that's wrong. Now I get schools/NCAA not paying players; Title IX, most schools not being as profitable as they seem, how much, etc... But to frown on a Johnny Football getting a few hundred dollars for his autograph just strikes me as greedy. Of the thousands of scholarship athletes there's only a few players who could make decent money off themselves. Most of them are going pro anyway. Just let them if they can. That's all.

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                • BizDevConglomerate
                  Banned
                  • Apr 2012
                  • 284

                  #53
                  One question for the everyone against paying players, have you ever played at the high school or college level? In high school, was your school a big time program?

                  If not, that's why you're complaining. If your life is ruined because people want what's actually due to them for what they bring in, you're touch of reality is gone. SAM KELLER may not jlhave made it to.the league, but he went D1. And ASU was pretty good then.

                  Pay the players is what I say.

                  For the developer's, the real bull is with them. The same way 2k won't make a football game because Madden has the license, we'll there's no excuse for College. Can't name the players anyway
                  This time they would have made a gazillion dollars. The amount of custom edits they allow, the game would've have been crazy. As far as any other, just look at the games back in the day. FSU was Tallahassee, FLA, Note Dame was South Dend, IN. That's cool. The game came with roster cards with each teams attributes. It show's that they are greedy and we are spoiled brats. Why we haven't protested these companies? Beats me, they put out unfinished games that need to.be patched and we still buy them. But they can't put out a college game.that everyone is aching for? And just patch it too?

                  Please miss me with that BS

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                  • real1
                    Rookie
                    • Jan 2015
                    • 15

                    #54
                    College Hoops & Football 2K17 otw!!

                    Comment

                    • scooterterp05
                      Rookie
                      • Aug 2015
                      • 7

                      #55
                      Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

                      Originally posted by GLO
                      Fair point. To counter, then let them take the money they get paid from their image and use that to pay for their education. (just like the rest of us that had to work full or part time jobs to get through college). I understand it's a fine line argument either way, the thing that bothers me is how often this discussion is framed in the (false) context of these student-athletes not having any money for food or other things. I am also an educator and have known plenty of student athletes that are doing more than fine with all the "extras" that come along with being a high profile college athlete.

                      As it stands right now the education is "payment" in the form of a scholarship. If they want to make the millions that a coach or college executive make then let them work hard and earn it over time just like those adults did. There is nowhere in the work force where 18, 19 or 20 year old kids can come into an organization and demand to be paid as much as the CEO or top execs, no matter how "famous" they are. (other than Hollywood and I doubt anyone would argue that Hollywood is the structure we should follow for work-force compensation?)

                      I'm fine with the change to pay the players, but if that happens then remove the scholarships and give them to kids who can't make millions from endorsement deals. If an 18 year old kid gets a 2 million dollar contract from Nike, the $25k tuition shouldn't be a problem.

                      By arguing that they need to get paid and also keep the scholarships you are de-value-ing the education that the scholarship is paying for. There's no way around it.

                      Truth is there probably isn't a neat and clean answer for this....
                      You're missing the point, sadly. [emoji53]

                      Sent from my SM-N915T using Tapatalk

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                      • jvalverde88
                        Moderator
                        • Jun 2008
                        • 11788

                        #56
                        Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

                        Originally posted by lbrown531
                        All I have to say is Thank You Sam keller and the other so called players who think they resemble video game characters. I hope everything was worth ruining people's lives.
                        Quite the hyperbole there.
                        Mets/Giants/Knicks/Rangers/Manchester United/Notre Dame Football

                        Never let fear determine who you are. Never let where you came from determine where you are going.

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                        • BizDevConglomerate
                          Banned
                          • Apr 2012
                          • 284

                          #57
                          Why can't this game male a come back.http://game-oldies.com/play-online/college-football-usa-97-sega-genesis

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                          • buckeyezombie
                            Rookie
                            • Jul 2014
                            • 317

                            #58
                            Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

                            College sports video games aren't coming back. College Hoops 2K8 was my favorite game, but it's best to let it go.

                            Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

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                            • ODogg
                              Hall Of Fame
                              • Feb 2003
                              • 38006

                              #59
                              Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

                              Originally posted by buckeyezombie
                              College sports video games aren't coming back. College Hoops 2K8 was my favorite game, but it's best to let it go.

                              Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk
                              I will never let it go. From my cold, dead hands NCAA 14!!
                              Streaming PC & PS5 games, join me most nights after 6:00pm ET on TwitchTV https://www.twitch.tv/shaunh20
                              or Tiktok https://www.tiktok.com/@shaunh741

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                              • ODogg
                                Hall Of Fame
                                • Feb 2003
                                • 38006

                                #60
                                Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

                                In all seriousness though, college games WILL come back because there's way too much money to be made in them in this day and age..especially with the NCAA playoffs now for football making it more popular than ever before.
                                Streaming PC & PS5 games, join me most nights after 6:00pm ET on TwitchTV https://www.twitch.tv/shaunh20
                                or Tiktok https://www.tiktok.com/@shaunh741

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