Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

[Trick13]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

Two words:

rocket catching

The fix there would have been to fix the DB reactions and positioning and made offensive pass interference a real thing because a ton of those "rocket catches" the receiver had to "run through" the defender...

...a defender who was so completely stuck in pattern mirror that they never reacted to user alterations of said route.

Again my wishes would eliminate that even further because holding the button to get a high vertical would automatically slow the receiver because he would be forced to "gather" his feet to jump just like you see in...
...wait for it...
...real life.

[mrprice33]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

Haha I'm not saying go back to those controls. That would be a disaster of a mistake! I just agree that timing should factor into when someone jumps for the ball more.

I haven't been this excited for a Madden game in my lifetime though, and I've got to say thanks to you mrprice33. Ball physics being one of your favorite features is already my favorite one, and the way you described certain things happening had me geeking out haha. You're taking a lot of time out to answer questions from everyone, so a big thank you definitely goes your way! Keep it up sir

I'm just here to give back to the community that gave me the opportunity to get this access. Appreciate the appreciation.

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

Then how come I have timing control on running plays - I can skipp the correct gap and bounce outside, I can truck stick thin air - why should the passing game be any different than the running game.

What you are describing is a fantasy role playing game, or pokemon.

Look, I am not saying you should be able to play like Prime Time D. Sanders with a scrub 67 rated player, but if the user doesn't have control over what type of attempts are made (and particularly when) then you might as well not even play. You can have 99 rated W. Payton and hit the stiff arm early or late and be completely ineffective - why would you not have that same control when playing the ball in the air.

This whole CPU determination thing all materialized out of Randy Moss being "unstoppable" back in the day because weak sauce cats playing online refused to double team him and shade a safety at him. News flash, back then NFL offenses had to double team him and shade a safety his way.


By your logic, when running the ball we should just hold a button and the cpu should determine which move the ball carrier should make, what direction he runs, and if or when he should cut back. Do see how dumb that would be.

I am not talking about overriding the players attributes or ratings. I am saying that within his ratings the user should have to time out the actions just like you do in the running game...

Running game and passing game are two different things, and as it is, the stiff arm is not effective nor is trucking, and it goes much deeper than timing; the animation doesn't even trigger many times..And still, for many, getting the timing correct is very difficult; suction between players is a major issue here..

Take that to the passing game where you are trying to target a moving object, being the football, and it's destination, along with moving players, who can block your view as a user and we really start seeing a mess, IMO. and the only time a user wold most likely be able to use the timing system you are suggesting is in deep balls, and/or jump pass plays..Most all other passes are too fast in development and you are watching, as the QB, the defensive line, receiver routes and pass defenders, etc before choosing a pass style and target..


The timing system as you suggest would essentially take ratings out and bring in arcade stick skills into play, and make those with more time to spend on the game, just better players, and alienate the casual players...Users, such as myself do not have all day to learn how to time everything out in any game..

In the running game you are more up close to the situation at hand, thus allowing for more focus on a single goal; even then, timing is innacurate, and most runs gain yards due to blocking and other things carried out by the AI system which is run by ratings.

[Trick13]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

Adding user timing, takes out player ratings, such as awareness, from what I am reading, also man coverage and zone coverage; if you time when a player is to attempt an action, then you are left with jumping and catching, generally speaking; thus less ratings...

Obviously I am making a basic example, only.

Not to mention timing is very difficult in a game, just from a perspective/visual from user to screen, not to mention lag online; which is why many in FPS games use automatic weapons or things with larger splash damage..

AWR is a complete non factor in the running game then by your logic - HBs do what you tell them to do, when you tell them to do it. Again, I have to ask, why should the ball in air be different than the running game???

AWR would absolutely be used in user controlled timing because you could time your swat attempt perfectly and still miss, due to the defender never "locating" the ball. Just like I can perfectly time a spin move with a lumbering FB and get nowhere right now...

I wasn't comparing Madden to FPS in terms of ratings determinations of outcomes of actions, but rather of timing of actions.



I fail to see the "fidelity" of controls issues you all seem to be worried about - when I tap the passing icons I get a lob pass, if I hold it down I get a bullet pass.

Heck, PS2 gave you three levels of nearly every move based entirely on how long/short your button input was. Spin move you had a tap for quick spin, holding the button was a big plant and spin and in the middle was a little power spin off tackle attempt (the last one rarely worked, but it was in there)...

[JKSportsGamer1984]

Let's get it EA! So with the new ball physics, does this mean the ball will no longer ghost through the Stadium walls? It's always been an eyesore to see players & the ball morphing/clipping through the goal post, stadium, etc..

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

AWR is a complete non factor in the running game then by your logic - HBs do what you tell them to do, when you tell them to do it. Again, I have to ask, why should the ball in air be different than the running game???

AWR would absolutely be used in user controlled timing because you could time your swat attempt perfectly and still miss, due to the defender never "locating" the ball. Just like I can perfectly time a spin move with a lumbering FB and get nowhere right now...

I wasn't comparing Madden to FPS in terms of ratings determinations of outcomes of actions, but rather of timing of actions.



I fail to see the "fidelity" of controls issues you all seem to be worried about - when I tap the passing icons I get a lob pass, if I hold it down I get a bullet pass.

Heck, PS2 gave you three levels of nearly every move based entirely on how long/short your button input was. Spin move you had a tap for quick spin, holding the button was a big plant and spin and in the middle was a little power spin off tackle attempt (the last one rarely worked, but it was in there)...

AWR is already negated for user controlled players. PRC is also negated on defense for user controlled defensive players.

As Devs have already stated, tiers are determined by ratings, not user input..User input merely tells the AI what the player is to attempt, whether spin, stiff arm or truck, etc...and it is timing based, but there are issues there already -

I understand you are trying to bring timing to the passing game, on defense, per your example, but then receivers would have to time catches, and in the passing game, with lag and bodies running around, we are looking at a lot of potential for incomplete passes for receivers, or even more big plays for receivers due to user bad timing on defense; already many users resort to the passing game because running can be very difficult, due to timing and suction, which is why I assume we are seeing more prompts in the run game for M17.

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

I believe some of the issues with the running game, and why a spin or stiff arm, etc may not trigger, is because the balll carrier is already stuck in another action due to a defender that may already be suctioned into the ball carrier, who the user is not even trying to focus a stiff arm or truck, etc onto..

I still see runners getting stuck on the back of their own blockers.

When timing issues are worked out in the run game, maybe the passing game can get more user timing skills added..

[Godgers12]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

How do you set the kick type you want, while punting?

[mrprice33]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

How do you set the kick type you want, while punting?

There's a set of button prompts in the wind indicator. You hit one and it gets highlighted. You can choose to switch back or change it as you see fit. The kicking arc (if turned on) updates as you select the kicks to show you your new trajectory.

[mrprice33]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

I believe some of the issues with the running game, and why a spin or stiff arm, etc may not trigger, is because the balll carrier is already stuck in another action due to a defender that may already be suctioned into the ball carrier, who the user is not even trying to focus a stiff arm or truck, etc onto..

I still see runners getting stuck on the back of their own blockers.

When timing issues are worked out in the run game, maybe the passing game can get more user timing skills added..

The last time EA tried full control of a game with a controller the result was NBA Elite lol. I think the tech and control fidelity has to improve by leaps and bounds before we can get certain things in the game.

[Godgers12]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

There's a set of button prompts in the wind indicator. You hit one and it gets highlighted. You can choose to switch back or change it as you see fit.

Ok thanks. Speaking of wind did the add gail force weather with 40 mph winds, that would legit cause you to change your gameplan? Or is that a pipe dream? If I move my team to Alaska I want legit Alaska weather lol.

[mrprice33]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

Ok thanks. Speaking of wind did the add gail force weather with 40 mph winds, that would legit cause you to change your gameplan? Or is that a pipe dream? If I move my team to Alaska I want legit Alaska weather lol.

Nothing that crazy, I don't think

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

The last time EA tried full control of a game with a controller the result was NBA Elite lol. I think the tech and control fidelity has to improve by leaps and bounds before we can get certain things in the game.

AGREED 100%...............

[Trick13]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

Running game and passing game are two different things, and as it is, the stiff arm is not effective nor is trucking, and it goes much deeper than timing; the animation doesn't even trigger many times..And still, for many, getting the timing correct is very difficult; suction between players is a major issue here..

Take that to the passing game where you are trying to target a moving object, being the football, and it's destination, along with moving players, who can block your view as a user and we really start seeing a mess, IMO. and the only time a user wold most likely be able to use the timing system you are suggesting is in deep balls, and/or jump pass plays..Most all other passes are too fast in development and you are watching, as the QB, the defensive line, receiver routes and pass defenders, etc before choosing a pass style and target..


The timing system as you suggest would essentially take ratings out and bring in arcade stick skills into play, and make those with more time to spend on the game, just better players, and alienate the casual players...Users, such as myself do not have all day to learn how to time everything out in any game..

In the running game you are more up close to the situation at hand, thus allowing for more focus on a single goal; even then, timing is innacurate, and most runs gain yards due to blocking and other things carried out by the AI system which is run by ratings.

If you go back to my original post about this I believe I did say an option for all-pro and turned off for All-Madden. I will even concede an option for all levels, but timing out this stuff isn't that difficult. You can time an out pass, right? then you can time out a swat attempt.

Your timing on the out pass can be perfect and the QB can still miss the target based on his ratings, so timing out an aggressive swat with a DB with low AWR/cth/jmp should be no different.

And I don't see how you only get yards based on blocking, because frankly the blocking system currently stinks, blockers react to the RB - even though they can't see what he is doing, rather than carrying out there assignments - this is drastically evident in the return game...

What I hear you saying is you want to watch an NFL game and make move suggestions.

Makes no sense to me. I wonder, just curious, if the same people are proponents of mishandled snaps, high snaps and the like? Just some random ratings check against what - the pressure of the situation, the player's LS rating, are we going to get to suggest an accurate snap there as well?

Perhaps we should reduce the passing game even further - let us have no icons, zero directional control, no QB rollout control, we just get 3 buttons -
lob pass, moderate arc, and bullet pass and the cpu can determine what receiver to throw to- heck let's just make it all -auto pass. Then we can just snap the ball and sit back and watch the action play out.

Based on what some of you are saying, you don't want to play a game of Madden, you want to coach a game of Madden - they had that once. It didn't sell, I think it was called Head Coach....

[SolidSquid]

Re: Madden NFL 17 Has Ball Physics, New Ways to Eliminate Money Plays & Much More

If you go back to my original post about this I believe I did say an option for all-pro and turned off for All-Madden. I will even concede an option for all levels, but timing out this stuff isn't that difficult. You can time an out pass, right? then you can time out a swat attempt.

Your timing on the out pass can be perfect and the QB can still miss the target based on his ratings, so timing out an aggressive swat with a DB with low AWR/cth/jmp should be no different.

And I don't see how you only get yards based on blocking, because frankly the blocking system currently stinks, blockers react to the RB - even though they can't see what he is doing, rather than carrying out there assignments - this is drastically evident in the return game...

What I hear you saying is you want to watch an NFL game and make move suggestions.

Makes no sense to me. I wonder, just curious, if the same people are proponents of mishandled snaps, high snaps and the like? Just some random ratings check against what - the pressure of the situation, the player's LS rating, are we going to get to suggest an accurate snap there as well?

Perhaps we should reduce the passing game even further - let us have no icons, zero directional control, no QB rollout control, we just get 3 buttons -
lob pass, moderate arc, and bullet pass and the cpu can determine what receiver to throw to- heck let's just make it all -auto pass. Then we can just snap the ball and sit back and watch the action play out.

Based on what some of you are saying, you don't want to play a game of Madden, you want to coach a game of Madden - they had that once. It didn't sell, I think it was called Head Coach....

They also had coach mode in madden and it sold just fine