What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

[Black_Tom_Brady]

every teams plays like the last all ai teams use the same playbook. the vikings play just like the patriots who play just like the colts. "coach suggestions are the same 8 plays as well

[cmehustle]

The biggest issue for me are the robo qbs. There is one streamlined way that they all play, regardless of their ratings. I'm in year 3 of my franchise, yet I can count the number of times they've scrambled on one hand.

I'd like to see qbs with high awareness ratings pick on scrub dbs like in real life, then me as the user, tries to counter this with double teams. I want dual threat qbs to take off and scramble and really put pressure of the defense(I have yet to call a qb spy in this game), I want gunslinger qbs to be aggressive throwing the ball, and I want average/scrub qbs to play like neither of the above.

The game lets you know if you knock out the ai's starting qb, but the backup plays with the exact same effectiveness with no drop off.

They rarely throw the ball away, and a lot of my sacks are coverage sacks. And it's not like I have a great secondary, but it's the ai qbs holding on to the ball for so long. I wouldn't mind the vision cone back, though I'm guessing I'm the only person that liked it lol.




I also think the ai is poor at running the ball still. I'm not sure how they can fix this, but the issue is that they run the ball 100% to the script, without trying to evade defenders. The only time I give up 50+ yards rushing is when they break a few lucky tackles and have a couple of massive runs.

Vision cone for me was the realest Madden has ever been. I will stand here and say that Madden 06 and 07 were the very best that Madden has ever been. Im talking PS2, not that bs they put out on 360. The vision cone, plus the formation subs they had in franchise. Also, they had a franchise QB and a RB in that game, and if you drafted one in the first round when you already had one your franchise guy would get pissed. They still havent brought back that realism and this was ten years ago! This is what we get when you kill off the competition EA??

[cmehustle]

I will say this. If EA wont bring back those options from 06 and 07 back for us, they should at least make the CPU smarter in how they both build their teams, and how they use personnel. Give coaches personality. Also where are the assistants? Bring back those guys, and let them have a system, not just the coaches scheme. The old college games had that 3 star, impact player thing. Where even if you impact players were two TEs, the game would get both TEs in, even in a 4 WR shotgun play. CPU should be smart enough to know who their best players are, and get them in the game. Use a two back system, if you have two main backs. What Madden has become is a game that no one actually plays to their strengths. Its become generic, and no frills. 2K lets you call plays, specifically run for a paticular player on your team. So, sometimes Lebron gets the call. Other times its Kyrie. Love may get one when theyre out of the game. You might even call one for Dunleavy if you need a three, I mean its really up to you. Both the CPU and myself should be able to call plays run specifically to get a WR open on your team who you want to get the ball to. The progressions should be made apparent, as they are in real football. Just a couple of suggestions in their, in the off chance someone from EA actually reads this.

[Agent89]

I agree with all of these comments so instead of piling on logic, I'll talk about the more physical aspects of the AI. It's been forever (though I only play All-Madden) that there's a gravitational pull to the sidelines that make simple swing routes and other out-breaking routes a gamble. This is particularly frustrating when you've read the defense quickly and perfectly and that route is the best way to go. Then there's the very sloppy break in the law of physics when it comes to the first down marker. Next time you get stopped by inches, look into the replay - you'll find that CPU defenders slide into place and/or become the equivalent of a brick wall to stop your RB who's already running with force and speed (Jonathan Stewart). Then with speed backs, you'll see that your player who's clearly in route of a first down will stop and "brace for impact" for no clear reason except to give the computer the stop. This has always been in this generation of Madden but it's even worse in 17. Instead of these tactics, and others like inexplicable drops by star players, absolute whiffs by linemen on crucial pass plays, and the game making your player choose the wrong catch type (the one least conducive to getting a first down, or actually making your player go backwards), EA needs to fix the game schematics-wise and fundamentally as you all are saying. It's lazy programming to make the game seem more difficult but really breaking down the replay exposes all of it. They should take whole year or two to clean all of that up. I enjoy the game this year, but it has more bugs and quirks than it did last year physics-wise.

[cable guy]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

The biggest and main thing for me is play calling-playbook utilization and QB behavior/logic

I think it is weird that the game plays significantly better with custom PB or generic PBs assigned to each CPU team, that seams like an easy fix on EA's side to figure out what is causing team PBs to cause less dynamic gameplay experiences in game.

It's very weird. It's like some of the things people are asking for, we are getting the Exact Opposite with team specific playbooks. I don't even know how many people are aware of this.

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[Smallville102001]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

I don't see the CPU play calling be a issue like other people do. I don't think it is bad over all just bad when it comes to time and play call. With that said here is what I think needs to be improved AI.


1. CPU needs to know when to go to a no huddle. Right now the only time they go to a no huddle is when there is less then 2 minutes left in the game. If the CPU has the ball down by like 10-14 points or something with only like 5 minutes left they should be in no huddle but they don't.


2. QB CPU play the CPU QB needs to know when they can run for some yards. In madden 15 the CPU QB IQ was like a 1 as they would just takes sacks and never just get rid of the ball. Now in 16 and 17 things are better as the CPU will get rid of the ball and not take sacks but they still never try to run for yards.

[timhere1970]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

I agree with all of these comments so instead of piling on logic, I'll talk about the more physical aspects of the AI. It's been forever (though I only play All-Madden) that there's a gravitational pull to the sidelines that make simple swing routes and other out-breaking routes a gamble. This is particularly frustrating when you've read the defense quickly and perfectly and that route is the best way to go. Then there's the very sloppy break in the law of physics when it comes to the first down marker. Next time you get stopped by inches, look into the replay - you'll find that CPU defenders slide into place and/or become the equivalent of a brick wall to stop your RB who's already running with force and speed (Jonathan Stewart). Then with speed backs, you'll see that your player who's clearly in route of a first down will stop and "brace for impact" for no clear reason except to give the computer the stop. This has always been in this generation of Madden but it's even worse in 17. Instead of these tactics, and others like inexplicable drops by star players, absolute whiffs by linemen on crucial pass plays, and the game making your player choose the wrong catch type (the one least conducive to getting a first down, or actually making your player go backwards), EA needs to fix the game schematics-wise and fundamentally as you all are saying. It's lazy programming to make the game seem more difficult but really breaking down the replay exposes all of it. They should take whole year or two to clean all of that up. I enjoy the game this year, but it has more bugs and quirks than it did last year physics-wise.

I esecIALLY love it when my running back runs past the first down marker and gets hit so hard he goes back 3 yards and is tackled. Got to love that realism.

[cable guy]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

every teams plays like the last all ai teams use the same playbook. the vikings play just like the patriots who play just like the colts. "coach suggestions are the same 8 plays as well

Yes. Teams play like their real life team counterparts. Offense and defense. And within that, Tendencies!!! THEN, let the elite players stand out. The 90 rated qb, throw to his 90 rated #1 wr more often. Which teams play exclusive zone, man or both. Do they have a pro- bowl elite level cb, who blankets the #1 wr. Who is the top rated LB, and does he blitz the most. Or just most successful. Then he will get to you faster. We then have to game plan around those things. Does anybody have to do these things now?

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[reyes the roof]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

I'd like for the playcalling/game management to be less formulaic and more in the moment. If we're in a shootout and it's 4th and 1 at the 50, have the cpu go for it. I feel like there is a set of rules for when the cpu should go for it on 4th down and if it doesn't fall within those set scenarios, it will never happen

[ajra21]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

1. Recognize mismatches and opponents weaknesses.
2.Learn who they're go to players are on offense.
3. Late game situations
4. Learn when to and when not to run out of bounce and field awareness in general
5.Pursuit angles
6.QB play is a major one. Qbs dont evade the defense or try to buy time.
7.Sometimes they kick field goals at the 45-50
8. Recognize the stars on defence (defensive players should shadow a star player when they are in a zone or simple strategy.

understanding who is playing is key for the next level. if the stud WR goes down, the CPU should not throw the ball as much to the backup who fills in.

yesterday, rodgers was knocked out of the game and RGIII came into the game. he threw as much as rodgers was.

[kehlis]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

understanding who is playing is key for the next level. if the stud WR goes down, the CPU should not throw the ball as much to the backup who fills in.

You have the right premise but the wrong reason.

Any QB will throw to an open receiver regardless of the number. The backup WR just shouldn't be able to get open the way elite WR's do.

[Choward8792]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

Game is amazing. Madden player since original. Need CPU defense to stop calling the same plays vs one formation over n over again. If I'm in ace pair flex formation then I know I'm getting FS fire EVERYTIME. Easy to exploit after you've seen it just once because you know it's coming every play on 1st n 2nd down. Hope it can be fixed because I love the game and it's very close to perfection.

[ajra21]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

You have the right premise but the wrong reason.

Any QB will throw to an open receiver regardless of the number. The backup WR just shouldn't be able to get open the way elite WR's do.

i've watched enough NFL to see QB not look towards the open backup instead preferring to fire it into a (double) covered "better" player.

dalton did this for years with green though he improved last year before his injury. kaepernick did it time & time again with boldin. same goes for mtuliple others.

[ajra21]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

Game is amazing. Madden player since original. Need CPU defense to stop calling the same plays vs one formation over n over again. If I'm in ace pair flex formation then I know I'm getting FS fire EVERYTIME. Easy to exploit after you've seen it just once because you know it's coming every play on 1st n 2nd down. Hope it can be fixed because I love the game and it's very close to perfection.

apparently giving the CPU team a generic playbook improves this.

[Choward8792]

Re: What Does Madden's AI Need to Do Better?

apparently giving the CPU team a generic playbook improves this.

I guess I'll try that but won't that mean that every team I play will run the same few plays in every situation tho. It's not game breaking because it's only a few defenses I've seen so far that run the same plays repeatedly in certain Defensive formations. Just so close to the greatest madden I wish this wouldn't happen. Checked star rating in gameplan and that doesn't seem to be the problem. Trying to find solution