Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

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  • guff
    Rookie
    • Aug 2011
    • 164

    #1

    Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

    Has anyone considered using PFF's "signature stats" to adjust ratings?

    I was considering getting PFF elite which includes signature stats ($200/yr), it gives stats specific to a position, for instance it has a QB accuracy rating which gives credit to the QB for throwing a catchable pass even if the WR drops it.

    I used to have the PFF subscription long ago and integrated their ratings into the madden rosters.

    If anyone is interested in getting something together to try this please let me know.
  • chunt04
    Pro
    • Jan 2008
    • 646

    #2
    Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

    What system are you looking to do this for? If you look back through the roster forum here you will find my old thread proposing this idea last year. I would be interested, as I think it adds that extra level of realism to a roster and I love how PFF tracks all of these statistics. I'll get you the name of the thread.

    Here's the link:
    NBA 2K14 Wingspan Edits (Usable in 2K15)

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing



    VT Grad '08

    Comment

    • guff
      Rookie
      • Aug 2011
      • 164

      #3
      Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

      PS4, yeah I'll check that thread out. Thanks

      Comment

      • SStory1993
        Rookie
        • Oct 2013
        • 21

        #4
        Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

        I am putting a roster together using pff statistics as we speak. My focus is to bring madden ratings to a HOF type system similar to 2k where players rated at 99 are the best at their position. At least with the data I have available. My ratings are based on a 32 game progression favoring the most recent 16 games.
        I am trying to incorporate the ideas the FBGrating used, but translate it where you can actually use the rosters in franchise mode. I am adjusting the speed, acceleration, agility, and vertical based on the best information I can retrieve and than using Signature stats to transform tackle, pass rush, run-stop, catching, etc.

        This is a project I have worked on for many years, and I believe this year is the year to share it. Would love to have help implementing it.

        Here are some overalls based on a HOF scale using PFF ratings.

        Tom Brady NE 98
        Aaron Donald LAR 98
        Julio Jones ATL 96
        Khalil Mack OAK 96
        Luke Kuechly CAR 96
        Rob Gronkowski NE 94
        J.J. Watt HST 94
        Matt Ryan ATL 93
        Aaron Rodgers GB 93
        Marshawn LynchOAK 93
        Le'Veon Bell PIT 93
        Mike Evans TB 93
        Marshal Yanda BLT 93
        Brandon GrahamPHI 93
        Cameron Jordan NO 93
        Von Miller DEN 93
        Calais Campbell JAX 93
        Eric Weddle BLT 93
        Andrew Luck IND 92
        Russell Wilson SEA 92
        Antonio Brown PIT 92
        A.J. Green CIN 92
        Travis Frederick DAL 92
        Kawann Short CAR 92
        Chris Harris Jr. DEN 92
        Greg Olsen CAR 91
        Trent Williams WAS 91
        Andrew WhitworthLAR91
        Joe Thomas CLV 91
        Zack Martin DAL 91
        Ndamukong SuhMIA 91
        Fletcher Cox PHI 91
        Geno Atkins CIN 91
        Jerrell Freeman CHI 91
        Devin McCourty NE 91
        Drew Brees NO 90
        T.Y. Hilton IND 90
        Doug Baldwin SEA 90
        Larry Fitzgerald ARZ 90
        Ryan Schraeder ATL 90
        Tyron Smith DAL 90
        Rodney Hudson OAK 90
        Michael Bennett SEA 90
        Justin Houston KC 90
        Damon Harrison NYG 90
        Leonard WilliamsNYJ 90
        Mike Daniels GB 90
        Bobby Wagner SEA 90
        Sean Lee DAL 90
        Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie NYG 90
        Casey Hayward SD 90
        Kam Chancellor SEA 90
        Reshad Jones MIA 90
        Eric Berry KC 90

        Love to here feedback on what you think.

        Comment

        • SStory1993
          Rookie
          • Oct 2013
          • 21

          #5
          Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

          Originally posted by chunt04
          What system are you looking to do this for? If you look back through the roster forum here you will find my old thread proposing this idea last year. I would be interested, as I think it adds that extra level of realism to a roster and I love how PFF tracks all of these statistics. I'll get you the name of the thread.

          Here's the link:
          http://forums.operationsports.com/fo...ters-xbox.html
          After reading your link, that is everything I have been working on by myself.

          A differences I noticed was though I loved the idea of a 100 point scale to rate players, I found it very difficult and a lot of work to maintain franchises with rerating rookies that it nearly took the fun out of game. My ratings are current based off of madden's 50-100 scale, so any user can continue to use the rosters throughout franchise modes without much issues. Once again I LOVE the idea of incorporating these ratings, and using PFF and Pro football outsiders as a source.
          Last edited by SStory1993; 08-23-2017, 09:29 PM.

          Comment

          • YogiGarebear89
            MVP
            • Dec 2013
            • 1115

            #6
            Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

            Originally posted by SStory1993
            I am putting a roster together using pff statistics as we speak. My focus is to bring madden ratings to a HOF type system similar to 2k where players rated at 99 are the best at their position. At least with the data I have available. My ratings are based on a 32 game progression favoring the most recent 16 games.
            I am trying to incorporate the ideas the FBGrating used, but translate it where you can actually use the rosters in franchise mode. I am adjusting the speed, acceleration, agility, and vertical based on the best information I can retrieve and than using Signature stats to transform tackle, pass rush, run-stop, catching, etc.

            This is a project I have worked on for many years, and I believe this year is the year to share it. Would love to have help implementing it.

            Here are some overalls based on a HOF scale using PFF ratings.

            Tom BradyNE98
            Aaron DonaldLAR98
            Julio Jones ATL96
            Khalil MackOAK96
            Luke KuechlyCAR96
            Rob GronkowskiNE94
            J.J. Watt HST94
            Matt Ryan ATL93
            Aaron RodgersGB93
            Marshawn LynchOAK93
            Le'Veon BellPIT93
            Mike EvansTB93
            Marshal YandaBLT93
            Brandon GrahamPHI93
            Cameron JordanNO93
            Von Miller DEN93
            Calais CampbellJAX93
            Eric WeddleBLT93
            Andrew LuckIND92
            Russell WilsonSEA92
            Antonio BrownPIT92
            A.J. Green CIN92
            Travis FrederickDAL92
            Kawann ShortCAR92
            Chris Harris Jr.DEN92
            Greg OlsenCAR91
            Trent WilliamsWAS91
            Andrew WhitworthLAR91
            Joe ThomasCLV91
            Zack MartinDAL91
            Ndamukong SuhMIA91
            Fletcher CoxPHI91
            Geno AtkinsCIN91
            Jerrell FreemanCHI91
            Devin McCourtyNE91
            Drew BreesNO90
            T.Y. Hilton IND90
            Doug BaldwinSEA90
            Larry FitzgeraldARZ90
            Ryan SchraederATL90
            Tyron SmithDAL90
            Rodney HudsonOAK90
            Michael BennettSEA90
            Justin HoustonKC90
            Damon HarrisonNYG90
            Leonard WilliamsNYJ90
            Mike DanielsGB90
            Bobby WagnerSEA90
            Sean Lee DAL90
            Dominique Rodgers-CromartieNYG90
            Casey HaywardSD90
            Kam ChancellorSEA90
            Reshad JonesMIA90
            Eric Berry KC90

            Love to here feedback on what you think.
            Where's OBJ fall in these ratings

            The Apex Predators
            Romans 8:31, The Apex Predator Mentality

            Comment

            • SStory1993
              Rookie
              • Oct 2013
              • 21

              #7
              Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

              Originally posted by YogiGarebear89
              Where's OBJ fall in these ratings

              The Apex Predators
              He is an 89 to begin this season


              History of his ratings based on my HOF scale is as follows at the end of each season:
              2017:89
              2016:90
              2015:87
              Rookie Rating: 77

              Things I would like to point out:

              - OBJ best season so far is his rookie year, but being that he only played 12 games, I am still taking his rookie rating into context which brings down his rating to 87. If I based my ratings solely on one season his rating would've been significantly higher, however the other side to that story is if everything is based on one season it will have major negative results on players that might have a down season such as JJ Watt's 2016 season. Where his rating based on that one year is a 67, which I feel doesn't nearly reflect the rating JJ Watt has earned/deserves.
              Last edited by SStory1993; 08-24-2017, 12:11 PM.

              Comment

              • chunt04
                Pro
                • Jan 2008
                • 646

                #8
                Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

                Originally posted by SStory1993
                He is an 89 to begin this season


                History of his ratings based on my HOF scale is as follows at the end of each season:
                2017:89
                2016:90
                2015:87
                Rookie Rating: 77

                Things I would like to point out:

                - OBJ best season so far is his rookie year, but being that he only played 12 games, I am still taking his rookie rating into context which brings down his rating to 87. If I based my ratings solely on one season his rating would've been significantly higher, however the other side to that story is if everything is based on one season it will have major negative results on players that might have a down season such as JJ Watt's 2016 season. Where his rating based on that one year is a 67, which I feel doesn't nearly reflect the rating JJ Watt has earned/deserves.


                What is your theory on rookies and younger players in the league? How do you handle the incoming rookies from drafting? I'd love to share ideas, as I may tinker with a roster once the 53 man roster comes out.


                Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                NBA 2K14 Wingspan Edits (Usable in 2K15)

                https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing



                VT Grad '08

                Comment

                • YogiGarebear89
                  MVP
                  • Dec 2013
                  • 1115

                  #9
                  Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

                  Originally posted by SStory1993
                  He is an 89 to begin this season


                  History of his ratings based on my HOF scale is as follows at the end of each season:
                  2017:89
                  2016:90
                  2015:87
                  Rookie Rating: 77

                  Things I would like to point out:

                  - OBJ best season so far is his rookie year, but being that he only played 12 games, I am still taking his rookie rating into context which brings down his rating to 87. If I based my ratings solely on one season his rating would've been significantly higher, however the other side to that story is if everything is based on one season it will have major negative results on players that might have a down season such as JJ Watt's 2016 season. Where his rating based on that one year is a 67, which I feel doesn't nearly reflect the rating JJ Watt has earned/deserves.
                  Interesting

                  Sent from my SM-G950U using Operation Sports mobile app
                  Romans 8:31, The Apex Predator Mentality

                  Comment

                  • Prilosec
                    Banned
                    • Jul 2017
                    • 307

                    #10
                    Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

                    I only edit to get sim stat realistic. great work and efforts you are doing.

                    Comment

                    • SStory1993
                      Rookie
                      • Oct 2013
                      • 21

                      #11
                      Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

                      Originally posted by chunt04
                      What is your theory on rookies and younger players in the league? How do you handle the incoming rookies from drafting? I'd love to share ideas, as I may tinker with a roster once the 53 man roster comes out.


                      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                      I hope this answer your questions correctly.

                      Generally speaking my rookies are on a 80-20 scale, most rookies I get the information from ESPN, NFL, and now PFF due to their rookie scouting reports that came out recently. Players that are 80 are few and far between, but generally speaking each draft is going to have a player higher than 76. For example Myles Garrett in this year's draft is the highest rookie player and the only 78 overall rookie. While most rookie are going to fall under 70.

                      I DO NOT base my ratings on when a player was picked, but what grades he has been given. For example Mitch Trubisky (75), Deshaun Watson (75), Patrick Mahomes (73). Regardless of what round they got picked this would be their rating.

                      Generally speaking a rookie at the end of the season will never be in the 90's, highest from last year is ezekiel elliott (88), Dak Prescott (86), and Joey Boss (85) who would've been higher had he played a full season.

                      The incoming rookies in franchise mode I have struggled with. It is my goal to make this roster as compatible as possible, but when it comes to generated rookie ratings I generally take the overall that they have an adjust it as follows:

                      M N
                      85 80
                      84 79
                      83 78
                      82 77
                      81 76
                      80 75
                      79 75
                      78 74
                      77 74
                      76 73
                      75 73
                      74 72
                      73 72
                      72 71
                      71 71
                      70 70

                      From the 70 ovr point I tend to not adjust. Probably something that I should change, but just haven't since I get more fixated on the roster side of things.

                      I use most pro day and combine information from different websites (mainly the website FBG used) to get physical attributes assigned, and than use the date from PFF draft guide to translate as much of their advanced grading into ratings as possible.
                      Last edited by SStory1993; 08-31-2017, 07:35 PM.

                      Comment

                      • Kingbailey87
                        Rookie
                        • Dec 2011
                        • 159

                        #12
                        Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

                        Are your rosters shared on PSN?

                        Comment

                        • SStory1993
                          Rookie
                          • Oct 2013
                          • 21

                          #13
                          Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

                          I work on xbox, but that doesn't mean we couldn't get it on the PS4 platform.

                          However, most of my ratings have been based on what I would consider to be data analysis converted into a madden format on a HOF scale. HOF scale meaning that players that have 99 in a certain category be it OVR, STHA, SPD, CTH, etc... are the best at that position or top 3 in all of football history. When I apply these metrics to just the QB in madden the outcome doesn't look good. The overalls I showed for my players on the first page is the OVR I believe they should be based on HOF scale ratings using PFF as my main data. The problem I have come across is EA has the QB scale for what makes an OVR in madden 18 way backwards.

                          What makes Tom Brady, Tom Brady?

                          Is he the fastest QB?

                          No

                          Does he have the a rocket for an arm?

                          No in fact last year his furthest completion he made in the air was 57 yards, which is about the league average.

                          Is he the most accurate?

                          No when it comes to yards under 10 there are at least 7 qbs better than Tom Brady in accuracy last year. Yards 10-30 Tom Brady was the most accurate last year, and tends to be in the top 5 year in and year out. However, balls thrown 30+ yards Tom Brady is one of the worst starting QB's in the league, throwing 27% in 2016 and 14% in 2015. (League average is around 35%)

                          Can he throw on the run? Yes, but I wouldn't say he is top 5 in that category when you have Aaron Rodgers, Ben Roethlisberger, Andrew Luck, Russell Wilson, etc.

                          Is he a master of play action? Ill give him that, but Brock Osweiler was consider a QB that was good at play action and look what that did.

                          I say all of this to point out that Tom Brady is not this golden goose when it comes to how a QB is made, let's say in all these categories he breaks top 5 in the NFL in 2017, that means he MIGHT be top 50 of all time in those categories.

                          BUT! What makes Tom Brady, Tom "GOAT" Brady?

                          It's that his intelligence as a QB has been rivaled by only a handful of QB in the history of football, and arguably no one has the game down at that position like Tom Brady has in NFL history.

                          Yet, the ratings that matter to a QB in Madden are as follows. (Adjust rating by X amount of points affects OVR rating by 1 point)

                          Madden

                          THP 2.5
                          STHA 3
                          MTHA 3
                          DTHA 4.5
                          AWR 5
                          SPD 12
                          PAC 14
                          TOR 26
                          AGI 26
                          ACC 54

                          My opinion, but this rating formula is all wrong. Physical attributes should matter less for QB than knowledge and playing the QB position. Ideally it would fall more in the lines of:

                          AWR 2.5
                          STHA 3
                          MTHA 3
                          DTHA 4.5
                          THP 5
                          PAC 12
                          TOR 14
                          SPD 26
                          AGI 26
                          ACC 54

                          And that is if I just kept Madden formula (wouldn't). I mean literally EA had to up Tom Brady's OVR to 99, if you edit him by dropping anything 1 point down Tom Brady's OVR becomes 94-95.

                          Why does this all matter?

                          It really dampens my hopes to bring an accurate roster based off of any metrics much alone PFF. Taking actual numbers and converting it to successful ratings that can be translated to the game and than be used in CFM. If anybody has ideas, I would love to hear them. But this just doesn't look good.

                          Update: Ran the roster in CFM, where i have adjusted my rating scale for MED, & DEEP ACCURACY. In CFM ratings are coming out with positive results. Will continue to update.
                          Last edited by SStory1993; 09-04-2017, 11:17 AM.

                          Comment

                          • JRT2006
                            Rookie
                            • Jul 2006
                            • 389

                            #14
                            Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

                            Originally posted by SStory1993
                            I am putting a roster together using pff statistics as we speak. My focus is to bring madden ratings to a HOF type system similar to 2k where players rated at 99 are the best at their position. At least with the data I have available. My ratings are based on a 32 game progression favoring the most recent 16 games.
                            I am trying to incorporate the ideas the FBGrating used, but translate it where you can actually use the rosters in franchise mode. I am adjusting the speed, acceleration, agility, and vertical based on the best information I can retrieve and than using Signature stats to transform tackle, pass rush, run-stop, catching, etc.

                            This is a project I have worked on for many years, and I believe this year is the year to share it. Would love to have help implementing it.

                            Here are some overalls based on a HOF scale using PFF ratings.

                            Tom Brady NE 98
                            Aaron Donald LAR 98
                            Julio Jones ATL 96
                            Khalil Mack OAK 96
                            Luke Kuechly CAR 96
                            Rob Gronkowski NE 94
                            J.J. Watt HST 94
                            Matt Ryan ATL 93
                            Aaron Rodgers GB 93
                            Marshawn LynchOAK 93
                            Le'Veon Bell PIT 93
                            Mike Evans TB 93
                            Marshal Yanda BLT 93
                            Brandon GrahamPHI 93
                            Cameron Jordan NO 93
                            Von Miller DEN 93
                            Calais Campbell JAX 93
                            Eric Weddle BLT 93
                            Andrew Luck IND 92
                            Russell Wilson SEA 92
                            Antonio Brown PIT 92
                            A.J. Green CIN 92
                            Travis Frederick DAL 92
                            Kawann Short CAR 92
                            Chris Harris Jr. DEN 92
                            Greg Olsen CAR 91
                            Trent Williams WAS 91
                            Andrew WhitworthLAR91
                            Joe Thomas CLV 91
                            Zack Martin DAL 91
                            Ndamukong SuhMIA 91
                            Fletcher Cox PHI 91
                            Geno Atkins CIN 91
                            Jerrell Freeman CHI 91
                            Devin McCourty NE 91
                            Drew Brees NO 90
                            T.Y. Hilton IND 90
                            Doug Baldwin SEA 90
                            Larry Fitzgerald ARZ 90
                            Ryan Schraeder ATL 90
                            Tyron Smith DAL 90
                            Rodney Hudson OAK 90
                            Michael Bennett SEA 90
                            Justin Houston KC 90
                            Damon Harrison NYG 90
                            Leonard WilliamsNYJ 90
                            Mike Daniels GB 90
                            Bobby Wagner SEA 90
                            Sean Lee DAL 90
                            Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie NYG 90
                            Casey Hayward SD 90
                            Kam Chancellor SEA 90
                            Reshad Jones MIA 90
                            Eric Berry KC 90

                            Love to here feedback on what you think.
                            Are these the signature stats you're using? Curious how you determine short and medium accuracy, from what I remember they only detailed deep passes as far as in depth distances.

                            Still really looking forward to this, wish Madden would revamp their whole ratings and get rid of overalls

                            Comment

                            • SStory1993
                              Rookie
                              • Oct 2013
                              • 21

                              #15
                              Re: Pro Football Focus to adjust player ratings

                              Originally posted by JRT2006
                              Are these the signature stats you're using? Curious how you determine short and medium accuracy, from what I remember they only detailed deep passes as far as in depth distances.

                              Still really looking forward to this, wish Madden would revamp their whole ratings and get rid of overalls
                              Unfortunately, I do not have access to the STHA, MTHA adjusted for drop balls. As PFF for some reason doesn't allow you to see all of there sig stats that are available even when you pay for the $1,500 membership. I mean how nice would it be to know effectivness of zone cov vs man cov, or bull rush vs swim move vs spin move. They have all theses stats, yet not available.

                              So in the mean time I do the best I can with what I have. STHA and MTHA is data I gather from tallying up all the attempts and completions from each passer by yards. You can find this stat at several websites if you know what you are doing.

                              My first thing is to use signature stats, from there I go to other sources be it nfl.com, pro football reference, pro football outsiders, and espn to than determine what would be the best stat for each rating, come up with a formula that fits the mold of the game, and allows a HOF scale.

                              Comment

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