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  • WaitTilNextYear
    Go Cubs Go
    • Mar 2013
    • 16840

    #6166
    Re: College Football Off Topic

    Originally posted by KSUowls
    Even if that were true it wouldn't be the same because having Memphis and South Florida as the two hardest conference matchups on your schedule is a lot different than having any combination of Auburn, Alabama, Georgia, LSU, South Carolina, etc..How many high draft pick NFL players has Alabama had in the last 10 years and how many times have they gone undefeated because a team in their conference which also had a bunch of NFL players dealt them a loss? That's the difference.

    Of course it's also not very true. This is what the top 4 teams in the SEC did this year OOC

    Alabama played FSU to open the season at a neutral field
    Georgia has GT on the docket every year (albeit they've been hit or miss lately). They also had a trip to Ann Arbor.
    Auburn went to Clemson's Death Valley
    South Carolina has Clemson every year
    I think you meant South Bend. I would remember a UGA-Michigan game, lol. Point is still well taken. People trying to extrapolate 1 game Bama played against Mercer into a 'nobody plays good teams OOC' position is baffling and very obviously selective.
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    • TripleCrown9
      Keep the Faith
      • May 2010
      • 23620

      #6167
      Re: College Football Off Topic

      Originally posted by KSUowls
      Even if that were true it wouldn't be the same because having Memphis and South Florida as the two hardest conference matchups on your schedule is a lot different than having any combination of Auburn, Alabama, Georgia, LSU, South Carolina, etc..How many high draft pick NFL players has Alabama had in the last 10 years and how many times have they gone undefeated because a team in their conference which also had a bunch of NFL players dealt them a loss? That's the difference.

      Of course it's also not very true. This is what the top 4 teams in the SEC did this year OOC

      Alabama played FSU to open the season at a neutral field
      Georgia has GT on the docket every year (albeit they've been hit or miss lately). They also had a trip to Ann Arbor.
      Auburn went to Clemson's Death Valley
      South Carolina has Clemson every year
      Alabama also played Fresno State and Mercer
      Georgia also played App State and Samford
      Auburn also played Georgia Southern, Mercer, and Louisiana-Monroe
      South Carolina also played Louisiana Tech and Wofford
      Clemson played Kent State and The Citadel
      Miami played Bethune-Cookman and Toledo
      Notre Dame played Temple and Miami (OH)
      Oklahoma played UTEP and Tulane
      Ohio State played UNLV and Army
      Wisconsin played Utah State, FAU, and BYU
      USC played Western Michigan
      Penn State played Akron, Pittsburgh, and Georgia State
      UCF played FIU, Maryland, and Austin Peay
      Washington played Montana and Fresno State
      TCU played Jackson State and SMU
      Stanford played Rice
      LSU played BYU, Chattanooga, and Troy
      Oklahoma State played Tulsa, South Alabama, and Pittsburgh
      Michigan State played Bowling Green and Western Michigan
      Memphis played Louisiana-Monroe, UCLA, and Southern Illinois
      Northwestern played Nevada, Duke, and Bowling Green
      Washington State played Montana State, Boise State, and Nevada
      Virginia Tech played West Virginia, Delaware, East Carolina, and Old Dominion
      USF played San Jose State, Stony Brook, and Illinois
      Mississippi State played Charleston Southern, Louisiana Tech, BYU, and UMass
      Boise State played Troy, Washington State, and Virginia

      There's your Top 25 and their stellar OOC schedules.
      Last edited by TripleCrown9; 01-03-2018, 06:10 PM.
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      • WaitTilNextYear
        Go Cubs Go
        • Mar 2013
        • 16840

        #6168
        Re: College Football Off Topic

        Originally posted by TripleCrown9
        Alabama also played Fresno State and Mercer
        Georgia also played App State and Samford
        Auburn also played Georgia Southern, Mercer, and Louisiana-Monroe
        South Carolina also played Louisiana Tech and Wofford
        Clemson played Kent State and The Citadel
        Miami played Bethune-Cookman and Toledo
        Notre Dame played Temple and Miami (OH)
        Oklahoma played UTEP and Tulane
        Ohio State played UNLV and Army
        Wisconsin played Utah State, FAU, and BYU
        USC played Western Michigan
        Penn State played Akron and Georgia State
        UCF played FIU, Maryland, and Austin Peay
        Washington played Montana and Fresno State
        TCU played Jackson State and TCU
        Stanford played Rice

        There's your Top 15 and their stellar OOC schedules.
        All well and good until you start comparing in-conference schedules. Overcoming that is why mid-majors are held to a different standard for OOC in the first place. Because they have a lot of ground to gain by not playing the most talented teams 8 and 9 times per season.

        Weird to see that TCU played themselves, but good info. Even if you're purposely omitting all the strong opponents from that list--like not mentioning that OU and Ohio State played each other, lol. So selective it hurts.
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        • TripleCrown9
          Keep the Faith
          • May 2010
          • 23620

          #6169
          Re: College Football Off Topic

          Originally posted by WaitTilNextYear
          All well and good until you start comparing in-conference schedules. Overcoming that is why mid-majors are held to a different standard for OOC in the first place. Because they have a lot of ground to gain by not playing the most talented teams 8 and 9 times per season.

          Weird to see that TCU played themselves, but good info. Even if you're purposely omitting all the strong opponents from that list--like not mentioning that OU and Ohio State played each other, lol. So selective it hurts.
          Lol I was purposely posting the weak teams that everyone played, so that is in fact what I was doing.

          It was said that UCF didn't play enough quality OOC opponents. Neither did most of the other 24 ranked teams.
          Last edited by TripleCrown9; 01-03-2018, 06:14 PM.
          Boston Red Sox
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          • KSUowls
            All Star
            • Jul 2009
            • 5827

            #6170
            Re: College Football Off Topic

            Originally posted by TripleCrown9
            Alabama also played Fresno State and Mercer
            Georgia also played App State and Samford
            Auburn also played Georgia Southern, Mercer, and Louisiana-Monroe
            South Carolina also played Louisiana Tech and Wofford
            Clemson played Kent State and The Citadel
            Miami played Bethune-Cookman and Toledo
            Notre Dame played Temple and Miami (OH)
            Oklahoma played UTEP and Tulane
            Ohio State played UNLV and Army
            Wisconsin played Utah State, FAU, and BYU
            USC played Western Michigan
            Penn State played Akron and Georgia State
            UCF played FIU, Maryland, and Austin Peay
            Washington played Montana and Fresno State
            TCU played Jackson State and TCU
            Stanford played Rice

            There's your Top 15 and their stellar OOC schedules.
            And here are the in conference opponents that UCF isn't getting because they aren't part of the P5.

            -Georgia also played Auburn (twice) and South Carolina in conference
            -Clemson played Miami, VT & NC State in conference
            -Miami played Clemson and VT in conference
            -Notre Dame doesn't have a conference but they played Georgia, USC, Stanford, NC State & Miami
            -Oklahoma played TCU & Oklahoma State in conference
            -Ohio State played Penn State, Mich State, Wisconsin in conference

            -Wisconsin played OSU in conference (interestingly, Wisconsin was also a team that despite being in the P5 and undefeated for most the year the committee did not give a lot of credit to because their schedule was crap until their CCG)
            -USC had Wash State and Stanford in conference
            -Penn State had OSU and Mich State in conference
            -Washington had Wash St & Stanford in conference
            -TCU had Oklahoma and OK State in conference
            -Stanford had USC (2x), Washington, Wash State in conference


            It's not that OOC is the end all be all. It's that UCF needs 2 or 3 high quality OOC matchups to equal what all of those top 15 teams are getting inside their own conferences (before any big OOC games those teams may be scheduling on top of it).

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            • KSUowls
              All Star
              • Jul 2009
              • 5827

              #6171
              Re: College Football Off Topic

              Originally posted by WaitTilNextYear
              I think you meant South Bend. I would remember a UGA-Michigan game, lol. Point is still well taken. People trying to extrapolate 1 game Bama played against Mercer into a 'nobody plays good teams OOC' position is baffling and very obviously selective.
              Oops. I saw your avatar and Michigan was in my head lol.

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              • TripleCrown9
                Keep the Faith
                • May 2010
                • 23620

                #6172
                Re: College Football Off Topic

                Originally posted by KSUowls

                It's not that OOC is the end all be all. It's that UCF needs 2 or 3 high quality OOC matchups to equal what all of those top 15 teams are getting inside their own conferences (before any big OOC games those teams may be scheduling on top of it).
                Originally posted by KSUowls
                The one place I'd say it is their fault is that their OOC schedule is crap. If they went undefeated while playing LSU, Michigan and USC in a season instead of FIU, Maryland and Austin Peay then then it would be much harder to keep them out. Those big OOC schools don't want to do a home/home with UCF though so UCF doesn't want to schedule them....Sorry, if want to be be included in the party then you're going to have to go on the road and play a big OOC schedule even if it means you don't get a home date with that team later on.
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                • KSUowls
                  All Star
                  • Jul 2009
                  • 5827

                  #6173
                  Re: College Football Off Topic

                  Originally posted by TripleCrown9
                  Lol I was purposely posting the weak teams that everyone played, so that is in fact what I was doing.

                  It was said that UCF didn't play enough quality OOC opponents. Neither did most of the other 24 ranked teams.
                  No, it was said that UCF didn't play enough quality opponents period, because unlike the P5 teams they don't have them on their schedule by default. Nearly all of the top 25 teams from the P5 had 2, 3, or even 4 more quality opponents just within their own conference. UCF doesn't get them in conference so they have to get them elsewhere.

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                  • KSUowls
                    All Star
                    • Jul 2009
                    • 5827

                    #6174
                    Re: College Football Off Topic

                    Originally posted by TripleCrown9
                    Below


                    Originally posted by countryboy
                    That's a cop out response that is used by the Power 5, and playoff committee, to keep teams like UCF out of the chance to play for a National Championship.

                    They can't help the conference they are in. They can't help that schedules are made years in advance. They can't help if a Power 5 team decides to buyout a game vs them rather than risk taking a loss to an "inferior" team.

                    The conference a team plays in doesn't, at least it shouldn't, equate to the worthiness of a team to play for a National Championship.

                    UCF beat every team that was put before them, including a team from the powerhouse SEC.

                    What more are they supposed to do?
                    They don't control the lack of quality opponents in their conference. They can control who they schedule OOC.

                    Comment

                    • WaitTilNextYear
                      Go Cubs Go
                      • Mar 2013
                      • 16840

                      #6175
                      Re: College Football Off Topic

                      Originally posted by TripleCrown9
                      Lol I was purposely posting the weak teams that everyone played, so that is in fact what I was doing.

                      It was said that UCF didn't play enough quality OOC opponents. Neither did most of the other 24 ranked teams.
                      They didn't and also didn't play enough quality conference opponents either, because they play in a 2nd tier conference. I'm not sure why this is so difficult for people to understand: a strong OOC schedule is needed to overcome a weak conference schedule--kinda like how Notre Dame does it in overcoming a no-conference schedule. Yet, UCF's OOC schedule was arguably worse than any playoff contender's was. In addition to having the weak conference schedule.

                      So, now here we are blaming other teams for not scheduling UCF and blaming the committee for not giving UCF the benefit of a doubt when they didn't earn it. Especially not before the playoff teams had to be decided on. Move that Auburn win before bowl season and it's potentially a whole different animal. If Bama or UGA or OU or Clemson had gone 12-0 against UCF's schedule, the CFB world would've been set ablaze with hot takes about a ridiculously weak schedule. And none of them would've got in either, probably. In college football, it's not just about 'did you win'? It's also heavily about 'against whom did you win'?

                      As for you posting just the bad parts of OOC schedules, that could've been made clearer what your intent was. You seemed to be just wanting to lampoon the other teams with no acknowledgement that they, almost without exception, played 1 or 2 stronger OOC opponents than UCF did. So it came off as disingenuous or as an attempt to obscure, imo.
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                      • TripleCrown9
                        Keep the Faith
                        • May 2010
                        • 23620

                        #6176
                        Re: College Football Off Topic

                        Originally posted by KSUowls
                        Below




                        They don't control the lack of quality opponents in their conference. They can control who they schedule OOC.
                        Except the OOC opponents are scheduled YEARS in advance (except for FCS teams, idk). Ohio State has a home and home with Boston College in 2026 and 2027.

                        When UCF scheduled Maryland, Maryland could've been good (which, fun fact and not super relevant to this conversation at all, Maryland also decided to claim a national championship after being the only team to finish undefeated and not finish #1).
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                        • dickey1331
                          Everyday is Faceurary!
                          • Sep 2009
                          • 14372

                          #6177
                          College Football Off Topic

                          It’s also hard to schedule good OOC teams when a lot of the better P5 teams won’t play good non P5 teams. Why would Alabama want to play UCF when they can play say Idaho for example and still make the playoffs. Alabama could play all FCS team OOC and still make the playoffs if the NCAA didn’t have that rule about only 1 FCS win counting. It’s an unfair advantage and has been pretty much forever.


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                          • countryboy
                            Baseball is back! 3/14/25
                            • Sep 2003
                            • 52627

                            #6178
                            Re: College Football Off Topic

                            For those claiming that strength of schedule matters and there is no bias in the selections, let me ask this:

                            How do you explain Alabama getting in over Ohio State based on these credentials:

                            * Ohio State won the Big 10. Alabama not only didn't win the SEC, they didn't even win their division

                            * Ohio State had a stronger strength of schedule than Alabama.

                            Or even Alabama getting in over Auburn when Auburn had the tougher ranked schedule and beat Alabama head to head?

                            The selection process and the credentials needed are an uneven playing field. What is required of one team to get in is not required of another.

                            Forget UCF and teams from the group of 5, the selection process isn't even fair/even amongst the power 5 conferences.
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                            • KSUowls
                              All Star
                              • Jul 2009
                              • 5827

                              #6179
                              Re: College Football Off Topic

                              Originally posted by TripleCrown9
                              Except the OOC opponents are scheduled YEARS in advance (except for FCS teams, idk). Ohio State has a home and home with Boston College in 2026 and 2027.

                              When UCF scheduled Maryland, Maryland could've been good (which, fun fact and not super relevant to this conversation at all, Maryland also decided to claim a national championship after being the only team to finish undefeated and not finish #1).
                              It's not an easy fix for sure. Most OOC games are scheduled at least a year or 2 (in some cases even several years), but that is the kind of proactive scheduling a G5 team is going to need if they want a legitimate shot at a title.

                              And unless they scheduled Maryland at the turn of the century when they had a string of 10+ win seasons then it's not going to cut it scheduling teams that have only managed even 9 wins twice in the last 14 years (with the most recent occurrence being 2010).

                              Had they been able to play the GT game then that would just be bad luck since GT is usually an above average team, but there isn't any excuse for having FIU & a FCS School to round out the non-conference schedule.

                              It's not fair for the talented group of kids who went 13-0 against the schedule their administration gave them, but it would hardly be fair for UCF or any G5 team to be able to go through a conference schedule where you're lucky if you have 1 or at most 2 other teams which barely crack the top 25.

                              Originally posted by dickey1331
                              It’s also hard to schedule good OOC teams when a lot of the better P5 teams won’t play good non P5 teams. Why would Alabama want to play UCF when they can play say Idaho for example and still make the playoffs. Alabama could play all FCS team OOC and still make the playoffs if the NCAA didn’t have that rule about only 1 FCS win counting. It’s an unfair advantage and has been pretty much forever.
                              It's only unfair in the sense that the default schedule of a team like Alabama provides them an inside track to getting a shot at the title if they have a good season while a good season by a team like UCF doesn't have that inside track. All things are not equal though because while Alabama has that inside shot advantage by the default schedule, it's much more difficult for them to have that good season because of the default schedule.

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                              • KSUowls
                                All Star
                                • Jul 2009
                                • 5827

                                #6180
                                Re: College Football Off Topic

                                Originally posted by countryboy
                                For those claiming that strength of schedule matters and there is no bias in the selections, let me ask this:

                                How do you explain Alabama getting in over Ohio State based on these credentials:

                                * Ohio State won the Big 10. Alabama not only didn't win the SEC, they didn't even win their division

                                * Ohio State had a stronger strength of schedule than Alabama.

                                Or even Alabama getting in over Auburn when Auburn had the tougher ranked schedule and beat Alabama head to head?

                                The selection process and the credentials needed are an uneven playing field. What is required of one team to get in is not required of another.

                                Forget UCF and teams from the group of 5, the selection process isn't even fair/even amongst the power 5 conferences.
                                -Ohio State had 2 blowout losses (1 of them at home against a good team, 1 on the road against an average team). IMO that's what it ultimately came down to.
                                -Alabama lost 1 game on the road, at night, against a top 10 team.
                                -Alabama decimated every team on the schedule until the finally week of the season.
                                -Auburn had 3 losses at that point
                                -And Alabama has street cred. Like it or not they earned it, but even still a lot of teams had to lose in front of them to make that happen.

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