Interceptions

[AUTiger1]

Successful NFL QB's throw with anticipation. They throw their WR's open because the windows for successful completions are so small. But on Madden it is absolutely impossible to do this because of the way the defense reacts to the ball in the air. Why in all the years of Madden this continues to be an issue, I'll next figure out. Madden will always be frustrating when interceptions like this happen so frequently.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMUybfqeCgw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLr-6aAjSmo

[bcruise]

Re: Interceptions

Those examples weren't really what I was expecting to see when I clicked on this thread (I've seen far worse, such a a defending player running the route ahead of a WR). So that changes how I was going to respond.

But I'll go ahead and ask what I was going to anyway because it's still informative - what difficulty?

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[AUTiger1]

Re: Interceptions

Those examples weren't really what I was expecting to see when I clicked on this thread (I've seen far worse, such a a defending player running the route ahead of a WR). So that changes how I was going to respond.

But I'll go ahead and ask what I was going to anyway because it's still informative - what difficulty?

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I play on All-Pro. I couldn't begin to imagine playing on All-Madden.


And, yes, I've seen those far worse ones too. But these are bad too.

[bcruise]

Re: Interceptions

I play on All-Pro. I couldn't begin to imagine playing on All-Madden.


And, yes, I've seen those far worse ones too. But these are bad too.

Yeah, that's what I figured when I watched them - they didn't look like the nonsense you sometimes see on all-madden.

You don't have to agree (and I'm sure you won't) but those look to me like good football players making good football plays. It's very indicative of what I typically see on all-pro. I don't know who the players are (on my phone and no audio) so I can't say how ratings are being applied. The defenders are trailing, but they go into what looks like a smooth catch animation - even the standing still one doesn't warp - and jump the routes. Seemed like maybe the QB could have led the receivers a bit more too (though that ability, again, comes down to ratings and not just stick skills)

Maybe they look more natural to me because I've seen the more extreme examples of All Madden? I dunno.

If someone can identify the players involved it would be a big help. If these are upper-tier defensive players I personally wouldn't have a problem with it.

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[AUTiger1]

Re: Interceptions

Yeah, that's what I figured when I watched them - they didn't look like the nonsense you sometimes see on all-madden.

You don't have to agree (and I'm sure you won't) but those look to me like good football players making good football plays. It's very indicative of what I typically see on all-pro. I don't know who the players are (on my phone and no audio) so I can't say how ratings are being applied. The defenders are trailing, but they go into what looks like a smooth catch animation - even the standing still one doesn't warp - and jump the routes. Seemed like maybe the QB could have led the receivers a bit more too (though that ability, again, comes down to ratings and not just stick skills)

Maybe they look more natural to me because I've seen the more extreme examples of All Madden? I dunno.

If someone can identify the players involved it would be a big help. If these are upper-tier defensive players I personally wouldn't have a problem with it.

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It's Matt Ryan throwing to Julio Jones on both of them.


My issue with them is why does the defense always react to the ball when it's in the air but the receivers never do? They keep running their route or whatever with absolutely no awareness. Why doesn't the receiver show the same awareness as the defender?



Also, I did try to lead them, I had the stick pointing them towards the open area of the field.

[bcruise]

Re: Interceptions

Okay, I see what you're asking, and I don't really have an answer to that other than that's the way it was designed. I've seen aggressive catches that try to come back to the ball sometimes which can create the effect you want to see, but it's difficult for those to activate on quick, short passes like these - and it's also difficult to hit Triangle fast enough for a user aggressive catch to take effect).

You could argue that the CPU controlled WR's need to have better awareness of that situation and come back to fight for the ball themselves, but that spirals down the rabbit hole of the devs philosophy of maximum user control and why (IMO) it's bad for sim play, and that is where my involvement in the topic ends.

I was more curious about who the defenders were, though that doesn't matter in the context of your complaint.

Appreciate the civil discourse about the actual game as it currently is. It's too rare these days.

It's Matt Ryan throwing to Julio Jones on both of them.


My issue with them is why does the defense always react to the ball when it's in the air but the receivers never do? They keep running their route or whatever with absolutely no awareness. Why doesn't the receiver show the same awareness as the defender?



Also, I did try to lead them, I had the stick pointing them towards the open area of the field.

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[edgevoice]

Re: Interceptions

Successful NFL QB's throw with anticipation. They throw their WR's open because the windows for successful completions are so small. But on Madden it is absolutely impossible to do this because of the way the defense reacts to the ball in the air. Why in all the years of Madden this continues to be an issue, I'll next figure out. Madden will always be frustrating when interceptions like this happen so frequently.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMUybfqeCgw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLr-6aAjSmo

No question, the DB does appear to speed boost somewhat, but it doesn't appear to me that it's over-the-top. Just my opinion.

On the first play you showed, the DB was in tight man coverage and undercut your throw. You needed to lead the receiver away from the defender.

On the second play, and I've had the same thing happen to me after recent updates, you were facing what I believe was a form of Cover 3 Match. Therefore, the corner was squared up, yet carried your receiver inside when you made your throw. The defender was in position to drive on the ball. You're timing was almost perfect, just needed to wait a tick more. Again, you didn't lead your receiver enough. Look at the WR's catch animation. The ball was thrown to him, rather than him being led.

[Shosum13]

Re: Interceptions

Honestly, and I could be wrong but in both of those videos it looks like you threw a bullet pass in to tight coverage and the DB made a good break on the ball underneath the WR. I may be seeing it that way because of the same reason as bcruise and I usually play on All Madden so I'm used to worse.



In both of these the DB's were using either an underneath or trail technique in coverage and you'll find bullet passes don't often work in these situations. In tight coverage like this try using touch passes by double tapping the button corresponding to the WR you are throwing to. Also play around with the high pointing and low pointing throwing mechanics. I'll admit that I largely ignored those until this years Madden and it has really helped my pass game. You can almost throw a WR open in tight coverage or allow someone like Julio to go up and get the ball using a high pointed touch pass by double clicking the button for the WR while holding L1 on the PS4 or LB on the Xbox one.


Similarly use L2/LT to throw a low pass, these really help in tight coverage that is over the top of the WR. I really starting practicing these different passing mechanics once I joined a 32 man online CFM. You end up going up against guys that can user the MLB or one of the safeties and are able to take away 2 and sometimes 3 routes at a time just by lurking over the middle. The user coverage over the middle is incredibly over-powered once somebody has mastered it and the strategy in the passing game becomes trying to avoid the user defender.

You could argue that the CPU controlled WR's need to have better awareness of that situation and come back to fight for the ball themselves, but that spirals down the rabbit hole of the devs philosophy of maximum user control and why (IMO) it's bad for sim play, and that is where my involvement in the topic ends.

I was more curious about who the defenders were, though that doesn't matter in the context of your complaint.

Appreciate the civil discourse about the actual game as it currently is. It's too rare these days.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

It definitely is a fine line between for balancing user control and how much the computer does for you. But I do think on the Sim setting they could program the WR to come back on a route and fight for the ball. Maybe just tie it in to the catch in traffic rating? Or a combo or CIT and the spectacular catch rating? Then they could make sure on competitive settings the user would have to activate an aggressive catch to get that animation.


Also agree on the statement about civil discourse, it needs to happen more often. We already are each dealing with our own frustrations with this game then when you come to this forum and have to argue with someone it gets exhausting.

[canes21]

Re: Interceptions

I'd agree that both throws need to be led more effectively. Now, the issue I've come across a lot is the game won't let you do that. You can hold the stick all the way to the right at times and get throws like both of those where you didn't even lead them at times. I wish the total control passing wasn't as tethered to the WR as it is. I'd love to see it be very sensitive so that you can purposefully lead guys too far. It would make it to where on those throws you put it in a place where your WR was the only one with a chance to make a play.


It's extremely irritating when you see a guy on a streak beating his man and you go to throw it over top, but since his button was not lit up yet the ball is practically throw to where he is at that moment so the DB ends up in perfect position to get his hands on it.



Less tethering to the WR, more letting us throw it anywhere along the route that we want to.

[ForUntoOblivionSoar∞]

Re: Interceptions

Successful NFL QB's throw with anticipation. They throw their WR's open because the windows for successful completions are so small. But on Madden it is absolutely impossible to do this because of the way the defense reacts to the ball in the air. Why in all the years of Madden this continues to be an issue, I'll next figure out. Madden will always be frustrating when interceptions like this happen so frequently.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMUybfqeCgw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLr-6aAjSmo

I do not have this problem. On All Madden. In fact, because I have nerfed pass blocking equally for both user and AI, I HAVE to throw with anticipation most the time to avoid sacks, and I successfully do so all the time.


Your first video was LATE. You did NOT throw with anticipation. You threw three steps after he made his cut. That is why you got intercepted.


Your second throw was timed better, but you've got to lead the WR.

[ForUntoOblivionSoar∞]

Re: Interceptions

I do not have this problem. On All Madden. In fact, because I have nerfed pass blocking equally for both user and AI, I HAVE to throw with anticipation most the time to avoid sacks, and I successfully do so all the time.


Your first video was LATE. You did NOT throw with anticipation. You threw three steps after he made his cut. That is why you got intercepted.


Your second throw was timed better, but you've got to lead the WR.

Here, I'm not just going to say it. I'll show you how to do it.


https://forums.operationsports.com/f...post2049634145


That link explains what I do and I posted a video showing how it works. If you work on doing these things, you're interceptions will decrease, guaranteed.

[roadman]

Re: Interceptions

I've seen much worse, but I feel these are bad. I'm not talking about from the Madden perspective. I'm talking about real football. The first video - that's wiiiiiide open in the NFL. Wide. Open. Not to say a defender can't and shouldn't ever make a play on that, but it shouldn't be each and every play. In the NFL QB's throw into very tight windows. 3 yards of separation in the NFL is considered wide open - an absolute gift. In Madden 3 yards, in some scenarios (way too many) 3 yards is the bare minimum needed. The psychic defenders, the warping, the speed boosts, the untimely inaccurate throws, the horrible ball trajectory, the lack of physics and other things all add up.



It's been this way for too long. Watch the opening movie/cut scene (yes I know it's AB) and if that were in game and not on rookie, the defender would just put his hand up and deflect each pass and a safety would come over at the exact time AB was reaching and make a play also. Or he'd catch it only to have the safety do the strip ball animation. If those awesome catch animations are in the game, why would we not want to see them? Great catches are made all the time in the NFL and not always by the best receivers. I'm tired of seeing (knowing) that on this crossing route, unless I have exactly x amount of separation, the 240lb LB is going to jump at the precise time my receiver does, sail through the air like a winged champion and knock the ball down. Meanwhile my defenders are standing still watching receivers blow past them wondering if they left the stove on.


It needs an overhaul. You can only paint the barn so many times.

I disagree with the first paragraph and agree with the second one.

The throw from the 1st one was well after the WR made the break and as others have said, if it was led more, the pass would have been better.

Agree with the last paragraph where some defenders stand around and other players sometimes show matrix like abilities out of nowhere. That needs to be taken out.

[k1ngofny]

Re: Interceptions

I agree that both are egregious, the issue with both is that the receivers are not being pass led far enough away from the defender. I also agree that even if you do pass lead, it sometimes can be insufficient and doesn't happen anywhere near to the extent that you need it to. I don't agree that timing is the issue here, both receivers have separation and just need to be led away from the trailing defender.

On a separate note, there really is no way to consistently "throw your receiver open" in this game unfortunately. In my experience, back shoulder fades and downfield 1 on 1 jump balls have every risk of being intercepted as they do of being aggressive caught by the receiver. The big difference in this game vs real life is that the corners in madden have equivalent ball skills as the receivers, whereas in real life, not many corners have anywhere near the ball skills as receivers do.

In real life, there's a reason they are a corner and not a receiver. It's actually pretty difficult to simultaneously keep an eye on the receiver in man coverage while also finding the ball when it arrives. This is why you see so often that when the corner has their head turned, the QB can just puts the ball up and it either gets caught by the receiver or it's a contested catch or pass breakup. It almost never gets intercepted. In madden, it's almost 50/50 reception or interception. The contested catch/break up animation doesn't trigger anywhere near enough as it should.

[canes21]

Re: Interceptions

It's actually pretty difficult to simultaneously keep an eye on the receiver in man coverage while also finding the ball when it arrives. This is why you see so often that when the corner has their head turned, the QB can just puts the ball up and it either gets caught by the receiver or it's a contested catch or pass breakup. It almost never gets intercepted. In madden, it's almost 50/50 reception or interception. The contested catch/break up animation doesn't trigger anywhere near enough as it should.

I agree with this part 100%. I do wish that when you see 1 on 1 downfield you could throw it up and not expect to be picked off more than half the time. Too often the CB will jump up and snag it while the WR hardly fights for it even with attempting to aggressive catch.

[AUTiger1]

Re: Interceptions

No question, the DB does appear to speed boost somewhat, but it doesn't appear to me that it's over-the-top. Just my opinion.

On the first play you showed, the DB was in tight man coverage and undercut your throw. You needed to lead the receiver away from the defender.

On the second play, and I've had the same thing happen to me after recent updates, you were facing what I believe was a form of Cover 3 Match. Therefore, the corner was squared up, yet carried your receiver inside when you made your throw. The defender was in position to drive on the ball. You're timing was almost perfect, just needed to wait a tick more. Again, you didn't lead your receiver enough. Look at the WR's catch animation. The ball was thrown to him, rather than him being led.

Again, I did try to lead the receiver away from the defender. Unless I just don't know how to properly do that.