Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

[scagwi]

Boy oh boy.
Do you guys remember about mid 2015 when this genre of gaming seemed to really be on the come?

Rory was releasing, TGC 1 and Perfect Golf were developing, growing and expanding ...

FF a couple years and we have Rory dead and EA done with golf, Perfect Parallel sold to Trackman and their game "Perfect" Golf was never really finished and is just sort of languishing as the user numbers die off over time and HB and TGC 2019 are "a thing" but missing so much that many would want out of a PGA titled release -- and even their updates have dried up for now.

It's all so sad. I love the golf game genre and have literally been playing it longer than any other sports game genre - and maybe longer than any other gaming genre period (back to very start of 90's).

I really hope there's another renaissance coming at some point.

I thought Perfect Golf had a good general angle of "build a great base" and then expand out the features over time. They seemed to have the wrong leadership that didn't know how to build the business side out unfortunately...and thus they sold.

Sadly they sold to a company that's not a gaming company and likely will just keep all the IP silo'd for their Sim hardware customers (understandable - but sucks for us).

I know some of you love TGC, but I'm really ready for a ground up refresh of what that looks like and how it plays and finally some fixes for the "ugh" parts that have persisted since TGC1, through TGC2 and still exist in 2019.

Maybe 2k will be the savior. I wish EA was still in this space, simply to move things forward and provide competition if nothing else.

Just bummed basically..

[OnlookerDelay]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

2015 was definitely a more promising point in time for computer and video golf games, overall. I had extremely high aspirations for Rory on the XBox One, but was really disappointed at how poorly it played. It just didn't have a cohesive flow about the whole package, IMO.

JNPG got the job done for me until I saw and felt the mo-capped golfers in TGC 2. I don't feel as integrally linked to the Hacker Harry animation in JNPG. TGC 2 and 2019 took some more strides in presenting rough, heavy rough, and sparse rough and that put more distance between it and JNPG. I simply find the carpet underlayment, patchwork rough in JNPG to look too 2004'ish.

I'm still enjoying TGC 2019, but I know it could be a lot better. It's tempo dependent swing interface provides enough of a multifacted feel component that I don't get bored with it. The downside is the way the tempo is utilized by the interface doesn't fully compute in an analogous way. A slow downswing after a perfect backswing tempo results in a 'power fade' that misses the target long!? That one irritates me every time it happens.

Anyway, TGC 2019 will tide me over until something better comes along. I certainly couldn't say that about TGC 1, which I bailed on for JNPG after 9 months, and I don't think I could have said that long term about TGC 2.

[pietasterp]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

I think the troubles and bleak outlook for golf games reflects the overall down-market in sports gaming in general. This has been discussed elsewhere, but you could argue that it's never been worse across-the-board in the sports gaming market than it is right now. I don't see anything on the horizon that is likely to improve the situation, either. These are the dark ages of sports gaming (I mean, graphics aside).

[scagwi]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

I think the troubles and bleak outlook for golf games reflects the overall down-market in sports gaming in general. This has been discussed elsewhere, but you could argue that it's never been worse across-the-board in the sports gaming market than it is right now. I don't see anything on the horizon that is likely to improve the situation, either. These are the dark ages of sports gaming (I mean, graphics aside).

It’s so ironic and depressing that the graphics and hardware capabilities are the best ever...yet sadly sports gaming is in the darkest time ever.

[kp2025]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

The golf game I actually enjoy the most out of all the latest ones is Everybody's Golf on the PS4. It's definitely cartoonish and some of the DLC courses are pretty ridiculous, but it runs very smoothly and I always have fun when I play it.

I just wish they had more swing options like they had in the past Hot Shots Golf games that preceded Everybody's Golf.

[OnlookerDelay]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

I just wish they had more swing options like they had in the past Hot Shots Golf games that preceded Everybody's Golf.

I know... why on earth did they drop the Advanced Swing options from the previous two Hot Shots games? They were real time plus they had an analog component in the swing interface that allowed me to forgive the cartoon look of the game. I'd be playing Everybody's Golf on my PS4 if it had the Advanced Swing options. That horizontal, non-real time 3-click meter is out of the Stone Age!

[inkcil]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

TW 14 Historic Master's Edition coupled with all the additional DLC courses and characters is still the best golf experience to-date, IMO.

Wish I had downloaded all the DLC before it was removed from the stores.

[scagwi]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

TW 14 Historic Master's Edition coupled with all the additional DLC courses and characters is still the best golf experience to-date, IMO.

Wish I had downloaded all the DLC before it was removed from the stores.

It’s definitely hard to argue against it in terms of the complete package and presentation and the licensed content, no question.

I do have to say that the more I have played perfect golf the more I have appreciated their physics model. I’m not sure how great that is in the Tiger Woods series.

When I do fire up my PlayStation and play TW 14 again, I am also struck by how easy the game is off the tee. They really didn’t insert much challenge in putting the ball right where you want off the tee unless the conditions are totally crazy (unrealistic).

[mctrees02]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

It’s definitely hard to argue against it in terms of the complete package and presentation and the licensed content, no question.

I do have to say that the more I have played perfect golf the more I have appreciated their physics model. I’m not sure how great that is in the Tiger Woods series.

When I do fire up my PlayStation and play TW 14 again, I am also struck by how easy the game is off the tee. They really didn’t insert much challenge in putting the ball right where you want off the tee unless the conditions are totally crazy (unrealistic).

agreed about TW14. I don’t play my console much anymore but when I do...I go to TW14 historic edition. I don’t think I have all of the downloadable content (it’s been a while since I turned it on) but it’s really fun playing the original Augusta as opposed to the overly tree lined, second cut blandness that Fazio has turned it into as their resident architect.

Agreed that it’s hard to replicate “real” scoring without using unrealistic conditions...but one workaround I have to that is using a player I’ve created that doesn’t have maxed out abilities. It’s somewhat akin to playing real golf today with hickory clubs.

Every so often I contemplate buying a PS4 to get into TGC (especially after seeing the Sweetens Cove design)...but then I see so much indifference about the gameplay on here and am not sure it’s worth the money.

If only PS4 allowed you to play your PS3 discs...

[ncp10]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

I love the golf game genre and have literally been playing it longer than any other sports game genre - and maybe longer than any other gaming genre period (back to very start of 90's)..

My playing partner and I began playing Links and we would actually send a floppy disk by mail w/ our round on it so the other guy could play against it. And before that it was Apple 2GS w/ its monochrome screen and simple topdown view of the 'hole' which was basically a single outline of the hole and when you hit your tee shot on a long hole the screen would repaint on the receiving end of the shot. FF a very long ways to TW2004 where we were credited beta testers. That was a phenomenal game for its time and we had mega hours of close matches on so many nice courses. We lost interest once the animations started getting a bit cartoonish, and then the other features used to try to garner sales which have zero to do w/ RLG and the passion for serious play. We returned after a 10y hiatus to pick up RMPGA and we play it almost daily still. The game remains phenomenal for us and we simply adjust settings so the challenge remains, and it does. We will occasionally turn in very low rounds which only means we didn't set it up correctly for that match. Our only sorrow is that it as a platform ended as it had so many elements that we fabulous. Fortunately online play is still doable even though it's clearly very limited, it's still very useful. I'm off to play my morning match right now...

[scagwi]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

@ncp10

Great stuff and I echo the sorrow about the Rory platform dying so quickly.

I might well be playing that right now if they were more courses.

I don’t understand why they killed it after they'd already done the hard part and built the core of the game. Now everybody just wanted content and fixes and updates that could’ve dragged out over the years and the base could have built over time.

Given where the golf genre has ended up I think they could have charged a pretty good penny for course pack DLC, etc.

[scagwi]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

agreed about TW14.

Agreed that it’s hard to replicate “real” scoring without using unrealistic conditions...but one workaround I have to that is using a player I’ve created that doesn’t have maxed out abilities.

My main issue is just that I get totally bored off the tee.

It’s just so silly easy to hit everything perfectly straight, it’s almost like they implemented a mode of golf where you don’t even have to bother with the tee shot and are always just proceeding to your perfectly placed drive on the fairway.

It’s a real bummer to me.
They definitely fixed that in Rory

[ncp10]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

@ncp10

Great stuff and I echo the sorrow about the Rory platform dying so quickly.

I might well be playing that right now if they were more courses.

I don’t understand why they killed it after they'd already done the hard part and built the core of the game. Now everybody just wanted content and fixes and updates that could’ve dragged out over the years and the base could have built over time.

Given where the golf genre has ended up I think they could have charged a pretty good penny for course pack DLC, etc.

Well, I doubt they destroyed the evidence, and maybe it will reappear someday but I guess that is very wishful thinking since they gave up the PGA association. We are or were diehard 'serious' golfers in RL and that is all we look for in a franchise. More courses would be nice, but not critical at all for us. Graphics are fabulous on a 4K TV, and it's all about the match ultimately and how well the game simulates RLG. We find RM is very doable as a serious player's sim and yes it's really perplexing they took it to this level then went south. One could easily envision a next release w/ 4-6 more courses and another 4 players, or at least content purchases thru DLC and a fairly simple enhancement to the online H2H play as it's unfortunately so basic as it is now, but thankfully ultimately very useful. Put another way--as long as EAS will allow access to their H2H server for private online play if it never changed at all we'd still be playing 10y from now it's that good. I guess the real issue is just no demand for a 'serious' sim including some pretty nice commentary from the peanut gallery. It seems like what many are after is just more new stuff, regardless of the sim quality itself. EAS must have spent a fortune on it w/ its new 3D engine and it is truly perplexing they dropped it even for adding new content thru DLC.

I just relooked at a video of TGC 2019 and it just doesn't look nearly as well done as RM, but it may have some staying power for a little while anyway.

[scagwi]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

@ncp10

What are your thoughts on the Rory swing and the "fill bubble" and the variables they implemented, particularly in terms of how things impact the shot result?

Do you feel it translates to giving real world results?
Just a good implementation of some challenge for a video game?

Love to hear your expanded thoughts on this.
I've vacillated myself on that a bit over time.


Sidenote...

I feel like I read that the Rory online services were going to be shutting down this year?
Maybe in May?
You heard anything like that?
Maybe I heard that from you here? (I can't remember where I saw it - wasn't that long ago)

[ncp10]

Re: Remember 2015 - When Golf Gaming looked so bright?

@ncp10

What are your thoughts on the Rory swing and the "fill bubble" and the variables they implemented, particularly in terms of how things impact the shot result?...Do you feel it translates to giving real world results? Just a good implementation of some challenge for a video game?

>>>>>> As i say I believe it's very good as a model of RLG outcomes. Neither me nor my playing partner are always truly perfect w/ the swing tempo, backswing and downswing using the JS. Often we will be a few % too fast, too slow, and occasionally a little off back and thru. But we rarely really mi**** shots. Because of this and the fact we use the most difficult settings, leave gusts on, and never play w/ less than a 10-15mph winds, we find shot outcomes are very compatible of what you find on the tour. There are a few goofy things of course, like the repositioning of your ball after it has settled in a deep bunker or what have you, but that I assume is to make the animations work. There real bottom line is we have very tight matches and it's always possible to muff up a shot at the wrong time.

Sidenote...

I feel like I read that the Rory online services were going to be shutting down this year?
Maybe in May?
You heard anything like that?
Maybe I heard that from you here? (I can't remember where I saw it - wasn't that long ago)

Yes you probably heard it from me from May 2018. It had to do w/ them taking it off of EAS Access or something along those lines. H2H play still works thankfully. It takes so little to keep it alive on their servers but people have left the sim in search of something more "entertaining" or whatever you want to call it perhaps they will let it die which will be so sad for us. The very cool thing about TW2004 is you could play H2H by direct IP connection so it still works today for people like me and my playing partner.