Why is it "okay" to cheat?

[HowDareI]

*So listen, full on rant mode incoming. Lol I'm sorry but this game is outlandish today with how much trash I've seen.*

Let me preface this by saying, I been playing games online for a while; I've seen cheaters, hackers, exploiters, modders, etc. Now I've never, ever been one to cheat, or exploit anything.
In 2K, I'd much rather lose a game while playing "sim" than to stoop down to someone's level and zig zag, charge cheese, spam steal, etc. to win the game.

Over the past two years playing Xbox One and dealing with next-gen's new park mode, I can't even believe the level of cheap play I've seen. I played Crew in 2K10 and 11 and seen the hackers and had this same point (that I'll get to shortly) so I'm not new to getting frustrated with 2K. But even then the fun outweighed the anger and frustration. There was cheesy moves in older games too, but I don't remember them being so prominent.

Basically what I'm getting at is:
the 3 point corner stepbacks
the zig zag (despite being "patched") still working
the online delay seeming to effect all my shots but not on the other side
the spamming of dribble moves
baseline driving
screening in the paint
etc.

These are all EXPLOITS.

This is from Xbox Live's Code of Conduct:

F. Cheating & Tampering

Do not cheat in a game unless the developer has deliberately enabled cheats.
Do not use unauthorized hardware or modifications.
Do not exploit game vulnerabilities or glitches.
Do not make unauthorized modifications to your account profile or its contents, including but not limited to tenure, Avatar, saved games, Gamerscore, or achievements.
Do not intentionally play with someone who is using unauthorized software or methods.
Do not play any illegitimately obtained software or pirated games.
Do not take any action to cause degradation of service for Microsoft or other users, including but not limited to network interference or manipulation.
Do not play a game before it has been authorized for play on the service.

It is a direct violation to do them things, right? So why is 2K so lax when it comes to people abusing them? This online "community" is a joke..as said before.
People play games literally doing nothing but all of them exploits over and over to get wins and rank up, directly effecting the fun I and my friends could be having.

Reporting to Xbox seems to do nothing; I see the same names over and over in the parks abusing the same things. I'm not even usually like this, I don't go reporting people for every little thing they do, but come on I wanna play a fair game just once.

We as a community, on here at least, (that play online) need to stop just "taking it" and allowing people to basically cheat. No more, "oh well they're not gonna fix it" kind of attitude. No, none of that.
If 2K isn't going to patch these exploits, then they need to start issuing temp. bans to people who abuse these things.

Basically what I'm getting at, is if there's no plans to fix these issues, start showing people it's not okay to exploit these things. Show some pride.
I know full well if it was my profession to create the most sim, lifelike representation of the NBA, and you had snotty 15 year olds who didn't even buy the game with their own money abusing it, I'd want them off it.

To me, it's sad that such a beautiful (graphically, and fundamentally) game can be so frustrating because of bad eggs who can't be bothered to take the time and play right.
Offline, this game is a dream. Even online (once you're past the lag/delay) against friends or sim opponents, the game's great...
Go online to play My Team, Park, or Rec ? And it's just a headache trying to out-cheese your opponent.

[2K15 PC]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

You act like guys on here are not part of the problem. I played with many guys from here last year on PS4 and many cheese, few don't. We are the same guys who play the game on-line with you and die hard enough to visit a forum about this game. If anything OS has the biggest cheesers and that's why some visit this forum, just to stay up to date on every glitch and to learn new (cheeese) moves and tactics to win games. Lord knows if there is anything wrong with the game it will be cried about on here until everyone does it.

[HowDareI]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

You act like guys on here are not part of the problem. I played with many guys from here last year on PS4 and many cheese, few don't. We are the same guys who play the game on-line with you and die hard enough to visit a forum about this game. If anything OS has the biggest cheesers and that's why some visit this forum, just to stay up to date on every glitch and to learn new (cheeese) moves and tactics to win games. Lord knows if there is anything wrong with the game it will be cried about on here until everyone does it.

Yea but there's more people here who care about the game than anywhere else.

We know there's guys from 2K on here that read this stuff, and I just wanna know how this stuff can slide.

[tetoleetd]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

i mean its not really cheating. sure its cheesy, but its not cheating. you have to remember that people can play the game how they please and theres a lot of people who just play to win using gimmicky stuff or theres a lot of casuals who play who dont even understand how basketball is really played.

best thing to do is dont play against randoms. if you want to play online, play with the sim people on here.

i have completely ignored online this year. i played about 5 games online and said screw this. im having much more fun doing myleague

[Andreas85]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

[SIZE="1"]

Basically what I'm getting at is:
the 3 point corner stepbacks
the zig zag (despite being "patched") still working
the online delay seeming to effect all my shots but not on the other side
the spamming of dribble moves
baseline driving
screening in the paint
etc.

These are all EXPLOITS.

Only exploits here imo is screening in the paint and maybe corner stepbacks.

Exploiting to me is when u abuse something thats not intended. ex screening in the paint.

zig zag isn't really exploiting imo its cheese but not an exploit and to be clear im talking about zig zag 3 now, someone let me know how to get an open 3 1v1 by not going left then right or right then left by running or dribbling. People can easily say "well with ball movement and screens u can easily get open shots" this stuff doesn't work if u actually play against people who know how to defend and what to do.

Spamming of dribble moves might be cheesy its not exploiting. Ur simply dribbling.

Baseline driving isn't exploiting however its cheesy but only because 2k made it op.

"the online delay seeming to effect all my shots but not on the other side" this part i dont even know why u called it an exploit, myself i've noticed some games i just wont hit even tho i shoot like i always do. ex i had a 3 day period where i was pretty much the splash brothers baby, but after that i couldn't hit at all. they just need to fix the input delay.

Spamming the square/x button as u mentioned earlier is cheesy. however its nothing wrong it since i could be reaching 24/7 irl aswell tho i would be punished for it which 2k has failed to make it so u actually get punished for reaching.

[Jv160]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I agree, all this bs needs to stop.

[BellSKA]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I agree with everything except that 2K has to take full responsibility on this. I know you didn't say that, but that's the vibe you're putting across. 'Should' 2K make the corrections and put a stop to the shenanigans, sure. Will they, no. They have the next version they are working on. On the current version they need to update lineups, keep current players looking like their actual selves, update new shoes that are dropping, etc. The list is endless. Is all this necessary, not really. But you can't please all the people all the time, yada yada.

I do not cheat, exploit, whatever you want to call it. When I find myself screening down low for our 7'2" C I feel guilty I'm holding my nuggets near the rim. I don't want people to think I'm being cheesy. I'm guilty of creating a 7' SF after Patch 3. I wanted to get every single badge, that was my goal. I will admit to that.

I disagree that everyone on OS cheats as much as some may think. Are there complete and total A-holes on here, YUP! But I've said it a few times. Those on here, don't be cheesers. Don't cheat, exploit, be lazy. Play ball, work hard. Don't cheese cheesers either. Don't cheat just because they do, you're better than that.

Maybe I'm naive, but does anyone buy into the fact that current consoles are still new enough that some of these corrections may take a long time to correct?

[steelers99_58_36]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

It's not cheating, just lack luster programming and laziness.

[HowDareI]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

i mean its not really cheating. sure its cheesy, but its not cheating. you have to remember that people can play the game how they please and theres a lot of people who just play to win using gimmicky stuff or theres a lot of casuals who play who dont even understand how basketball is really played.

best thing to do is dont play against randoms. if you want to play online, play with the sim people on here.

i have completely ignored online this year. i played about 5 games online and said screw this. im having much more fun doing myleague

Exploiting things that are borderline unstoppable isn't allowed.

I know people who got banned doing a glitch in Modern Warfare 2 and it didn't even do much harm..but as much as people crap on Call of Duty, they actually care about the state of their game.

[HowDareI]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

It's not cheating, just lack luster programming and laziness.

It is cheating, it's using known exploits in the game to gain unfair advantages and win.

There is laziness on 2K's part, not patching these things and not taking action; that's what I'm talking about...

If they don't want to put the time in to patch it, then maybe they should show it's not okay to abuse that cheese and start issuing bans.

It's extreme but other games do it all the time.

[HowDareI]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I agree with everything except that 2K has to take full responsibility on this. I know you didn't say that, but that's the vibe you're putting across.

I didn't exactly say that, more along the lines of Microsoft/Sony getting notified that people abusing these things are to be banned for 24 hours every offense.

I don't know how it works, but if 2K's not taking the measures to clean up the mess that online's becoming then maybe they need to do this.

Like I said, I know someone who got banned for a week in Call of Duty for being able to run a little faster...it wasn't a hack, or mod, just certain equipment..but the devs realized it was an exploit and started suspending people for a couple days if they did it...
This was 5 years ago...so it can definitely still happen now with more resources.

Obviously it sounds extreme, but why would any of us want these cheesers online anyway? Send a message, let these guys know that sitting in the paint setting screens while the other two bums run back and forth setting moving screens and jacking 30 foot three pointers is abusing the game.
We all know that's not how basketball's intended to be played, we all know they're exploiting crap that been in 2K for years now but has never been stopped...

So stop it? Right? lol or maybe I just actually wanna see the game get cleaned up and I'm wrong somehow..

There's always them people in the community who couldn't care less because it doesn't directly effect them..they're just as bad.

[itchyroll_51]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I didn't exactly say that, more along the lines of Microsoft/Sony getting notified that people abusing these things are to be banned for 24 hours every offense.

I don't know how it works, but if 2K's not taking the measures to clean up the mess that online's becoming then maybe they need to do this.

Like I said, I know someone who got banned for a week in Call of Duty for being able to run a little faster...it wasn't a hack, or mod, just certain equipment..but the devs realized it was an exploit and started suspending people for a couple days if they did it...
This was 5 years ago...so it can definitely still happen now with more resources.

Obviously it sounds extreme, but why would any of us want these cheesers online anyway? Send a message, let these guys know that sitting in the paint setting screens while the other two bums run back and forth setting moving screens and jacking 30 foot three pointers is abusing the game.
We all know that's not how basketball's intended to be played, we all know they're exploiting crap that been in 2K for years now but has never been stopped...

So stop it? Right? lol or maybe I just actually wanna see the game get cleaned up and I'm wrong somehow..

There's always them people in the community who couldn't care less because it doesn't directly effect them..they're just as bad.

I agree with you. This was one of the reasons why I started making tutorials on YouTube. I wanted to reeducate some of the younger 2K ballers out there on the more beautiful parts of the game. Maybe make them allergic to 2K Cheese like us SIM guys haha

Sam Pham

[steelers99_58_36]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

It is cheating, it's using known exploits in the game to gain unfair advantages and win.

There is laziness on 2K's part, not patching these things and not taking action; that's what I'm talking about...

If they don't want to put the time in to patch it, then maybe they should show it's not okay to abuse that cheese and start issuing bans.

It's extreme but other games do it all the time.

Exactly, 2K just doesn't put the time in to fix the obviously known issues in their game. But it's just not cheating it's abusing exploits at the fault of the developer. I guess cheating to me is having to actually do something like putting in a cheat code that the developer has actually coded for making the game easier or sometimes harder to play.

[jots]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

*So listen, full on rant mode incoming. Lol I'm sorry but this game is outlandish today with how much trash I've seen.*

Let me preface this by saying, I been playing games online for a while; I've seen cheaters, hackers, exploiters, modders, etc. Now I've never, ever been one to cheat, or exploit anything.
In 2K, I'd much rather lose a game while playing "sim" than to stoop down to someone's level and zig zag, charge cheese, spam steal, etc. to win the game.

Over the past two years playing Xbox One and dealing with next-gen's new park mode, I can't even believe the level of cheap play I've seen. I played Crew in 2K10 and 11 and seen the hackers and had this same point (that I'll get to shortly) so I'm not new to getting frustrated with 2K. But even then the fun outweighed the anger and frustration. There was cheesy moves in older games too, but I don't remember them being so prominent.

Basically what I'm getting at is:
the 3 point corner stepbacks
the zig zag (despite being "patched") still working
the online delay seeming to effect all my shots but not on the other side
the spamming of dribble moves
baseline driving
screening in the paint
etc.

These are all EXPLOITS.

This is from Xbox Live's Code of Conduct:

F. Cheating & Tampering

Do not cheat in a game unless the developer has deliberately enabled cheats.
Do not use unauthorized hardware or modifications.
Do not exploit game vulnerabilities or glitches.
Do not make unauthorized modifications to your account profile or its contents, including but not limited to tenure, Avatar, saved games, Gamerscore, or achievements.
Do not intentionally play with someone who is using unauthorized software or methods.
Do not play any illegitimately obtained software or pirated games.
Do not take any action to cause degradation of service for Microsoft or other users, including but not limited to network interference or manipulation.
Do not play a game before it has been authorized for play on the service.

It is a direct violation to do them things, right? So why is 2K so lax when it comes to people abusing them? This online "community" is a joke..as said before.
People play games literally doing nothing but all of them exploits over and over to get wins and rank up, directly effecting the fun I and my friends could be having.

Reporting to Xbox seems to do nothing; I see the same names over and over in the parks abusing the same things. I'm not even usually like this, I don't go reporting people for every little thing they do, but come on I wanna play a fair game just once.

We as a community, on here at least, (that play online) need to stop just "taking it" and allowing people to basically cheat. No more, "oh well they're not gonna fix it" kind of attitude. No, none of that.
If 2K isn't going to patch these exploits, then they need to start issuing temp. bans to people who abuse these things.

Basically what I'm getting at, is if there's no plans to fix these issues, start showing people it's not okay to exploit these things. Show some pride.
I know full well if it was my profession to create the most sim, lifelike representation of the NBA, and you had snotty 15 year olds who didn't even buy the game with their own money abusing it, I'd want them off it.

To me, it's sad that such a beautiful (graphically, and fundamentally) game can be so frustrating because of bad eggs who can't be bothered to take the time and play right.
Offline, this game is a dream. Even online (once you're past the lag/delay) against friends or sim opponents, the game's great...
Go online to play My Team, Park, or Rec ? And it's just a headache trying to out-cheese your opponent.

As someone who is trying to play sim ball as much as possible, I definitely understand your frustration.

The problem with your suggestion of "cleaning up" by tempbanning is how it would be enforced in a fair way.

Who decides what is exploiting and what is just bad gameplay? I'm guessing some people are just doing the baseline drives or spamming dribble moves because they just don't know basketball.

[ItsJustaGame]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

Basically what I'm getting at is:

the 3 point corner stepbacks

I would actually agree that this is an "exploit," the success rate is far too high, regardless of excellent/poor defensive pressure. However, I've only seen a few guys who have been able to take over a game shooting step-back corner 3's, and even those guys will miss a couple (by that I mean the shot is certainly not 100%). Point is, this one isn't that bad by and large.

the zig zag (despite being "patched") still working

Not an exploit. Annoying? Yes. Tough to stop? Yes, but it can be done, and done regularly. Patience..

the online delay seeming to effect all my shots but not on the other side

Definitely not an exploit, not even "cheese." Online delay swings from bad to good all the time, and for everyone. If your shots aren't going in, I can almost guarantee that it's because you didn't set your feet, or pause before pulling it. Sometimes the other guy will just be hitting when your not, that's basketball.

the spamming of dribble moves

I'd agree with you here that this is an exploit, but again, this one isn't a game-changer. Plus, the best time to steal the ball is when the other guy makes a dribble move, and of course there will always be that one dribble that hits someone's leg and the ball is loose.

baseline driving

Crash the paint, and swat from the opposite side of the driving player. Baseline drives are definitely more cheesy than most of the others, but it's hilarious how bad you can make these guys fail.

screening in the paint

Completely cheese, and of course an exploit. No argument here, but don't expect anything to change. If you're at the Stage, I highly recommend jumping on the bandwagon.

etc.

Mid-range shots, purposely quitting as soon as the game starts to give your buddies 3 over-powered AI players (Rec), post-fadeaways, post-fadeaways from 3-point range, double-dribble glitch, players at any position over 7' tall with every badge and 98-rated shooting (boosting in general, I've seen a guy with 98 Shooting, Inside Scoring, Athleticism, Playmaking, and Defense, not to mention 5 bars in Rebound to boot), drawing more charges in one game than any NBA team would in ten, staying out of bounds under the backboard until someone shoots on offense. The list goes on and on... Is it all cheesy? Yes absolutely. Does it ruin the game in the big picture? Absolutely not.

The stuff in bold are just my thoughts on the exploits you mentioned. Don't get me wrong, all of it (and much more) is completely and utterly annoying, but I say things like "game-changing" and "taking over a game" because most of them aren't bad enough to keep a good team of sim players from winning (which is all that matters).

I should also mention that everything I say is in reference to the Rec, not the Park or Stage (except for the screens). I only play Rec. I've said this before but there is no rhyme or reason in the Park, it's a small step up from NBA Jam. You'll see everything at the Park and that will never change, but who cares? It's a Park game, it's supposed to be the 'ole hack-n-slap, high-flying, completely ridiculous blacktop pick-ups, don't take it too seriously, you will be disappointed.