Question re: 3-4 defense; ROLB = coverage guy and LOLB = pass rusher? Say whaaa?

[Rieux]

So I've never actually played much 3-4 in the NCAA games. For one, the way EA insists on setting up the depth charts to "favor" the 4-3 has always made me feel OCD about using the 3-4, but the bigger issue has been the complete lack of two-gap NT play.

That said, I usually play an OC and the D gets SuperSimmed anyway, and I randomly stumbled on a post that said 3-4 and 3-3-5 were the best defenses for supersimming. I'm a little skeptical that it'd make much of a difference, but at the same time, I can see how the SuperSim engine might put more weight into speed and such than the more super-specific attribs like FMV/PMV. Either way it got me interested in trying a 3-4 school as an OC (just for a change-up in how I recruit) or even as a HC and playing D manually, which I haven't done in a looong time (I think the vast majority of folks lean more toward OFF or DEF in football and I'm very much an offense guy.)

Plus, I like Wade Phillips's one-gap 3-4 scheme a lot, so I don't mind the idea of playing a one-gap 3-4 (the primary and only variety of 3-4 in EA's world, lol.)

Of course, step one was to get on OS and read up on the basics of how NCAA 14 implements the 3-4 and all the stuff to keep in mind, etc. Which brings me to my question, 'cuz that's when I noticed an odd pattern, in posts where folks talk about how they recruit, of people putting a more athletic/coverage guy with a bit of run-stopping skill at ROLB (i.e. weak-side OLB, Jack, Joker, whatever nomenclature you prefer), and putting their primary pass rusher at LOLB (i.e. strong-side OLB).

I'm sure their reasoning for this is due to a quirk in the gameplay, and that's what I'm asking about - for all the 3-4 guys out there, is there some reason for playing the OLBs this way? My understanding of the 3-4 in real-life, non-EA football is that the weak-side OLB is usually the primary pass rusher and the strong-side OLB has to be able to do pretty much everything - cover, since that's usually his weak-side counterpart's biggest weakness, but he also has to be strong enough to beat blocks and play the run since, well, he's on the strong side of the play!

In EA football, though, it looks like people tend to reverse these roles. I've been reading about the 3-3-5 too, and I even see 3-3-5 guys talking about putting their better coverage OLB at LOLB/strong-side and their stronger, better block-shedder/run-stopper at ROLB/weak-side, which causes a similar kind of confusion for me. So my question in a nutshell is, how come? (Asking about the 3-4 specifically but I assume the same sort of reasoning applies.)

Thanks! Looking forward to receiving the wisdom I know the defensive gurus around here can impart.

EDIT: I should clarify that IRL I recognize that these positions can and probably should be shuffled around a bit. But in the game, the roles do have to be more delineated since you don't have much freedom to move guys around outside of formation subbing and maybe audibles (haven't played manual D in years lol) and the like, which is probably an awkward way to do it. So I'm really asking about why folks seem to tend to swap the Jack/Joker with the Sam (who becomes the Wham, maybe? )

[sherrane]

The primary pass rusher in the 3-4 is based on the scheme, rather than the alignment. The top three pass rushers in terms of sacks in NFL History are:


Kevin Greene, LOLB
Terrrell Suggs, ROLB/LOLB
Lawrence Taylor, ROLB

[Rieux]

Quote: Originally Posted by sherrane

The primary pass rusher in the 3-4 is based on the scheme, rather than the alignment. The top three pass rushers in terms of sacks in NFL History are: Kevin Greene, LOLB Terrrell Suggs, ROLB/LOLB Lawrence Taylor, ROLB

Very true, thanks for the reply.

I remember DeMarcus Ware as being primarily a ROLB in Wade Phillips's (and Rob Ryan's, huagh) 3-4 but moving around quite a bit, and when he broke Dallas's franchise record for career sacks he was actually playing strong-side DE in Monte Kiffin's 4-3.

I realized more or less the same thing when it occurred to me to actually *look* at the plays from the 3-4 books/formations, since I realized the specific roles of the Jack and Sam would be dictated by the plays themselves, and neither position has a distinct role - they both do about the same proportion of rushing to dropping into zones or, to a lesser extent, playing man. On one hand it's a relief because it simplifies things somewhat, on the other hand it won't make recruiting any easier since if you want an optimized 3-4 in this game, both of your OLBs need to do pretty much everything well

My only takeaway other than that was that, depending on what kind/how much Dime you play, the ROLB probably needs to be the slightly better player overall because he's the one that stays in (as a down lineman I believe) in the 3-2-6 set, so he might play more snaps. That's for the vanilla 3-4 book anyway, for the 3-4 Multiple I'm sure it's much more frequent.

So after having actually taken a look at the plays, I'll consider the problem solved, but if anyone else cares to share their thoughts on how the OLBs play in the game's 3-4 and/or to what extent they recruit both positions differently, I'd be interested in hearing it!

[Miles Perry]

The biggest problem is that you will very rarely have an OLB who only plays on one side of the formation. Sometimes one will align to the strength of the formation and the other will play weak. Or one will align to the field side while the other aligns to the boundary, etc... Same thing with defensive linemen. Most will move around.

[OBinKC]

I would love to say that I chose the 3-4 for the diversity in assignments like in real life, but the video game world hasn’t implemented those intricacies into its football games. So to be honest, the reason I use the 3-4 is because of the different amounts of zone coverages that the different 3-4 alignments and the Nickel 2-4-5 and Nickel 3-3-5 provide. Once I can recruit a couple of big, run-stuffing down lineman and a couple stud linebackers, those coverages do the rest of the work for me with great success, and all of the really fun things that a 3-4 junkie likes about that defense doesn’t even matter, unfortunately.