Madden NFL 13 News Post

More Passing Game Options Needed in EA Football

02:10 PM - July 5, 2012 by RaychelSnr

In the past, EA Sports Tiburon has focused on the passing game from the perspective of QB Vision. Currently, the team is working on the notion of wide receivers getting open and being ready for the pass. There is also an emphasis on placement and quarterback drops. The community has already started a debate on this. We might look at both as an aspect of timing in the passing game, which is a step in the right direction. To complete the emphasis on timing and rhythm, more option routes should make their way back into the game. Let�s analyze two of the more explosive NFL passing attacks over the past decade for a frame of reference.

What is the process that you use once you hike the football? Do you begin with the left side and scan back to the right? Do you begin with the primary receiver on the play? Chances are you, are only using half of the field which means as a quarterback your options are diminished rather than multiplied. Secondly, generally in Madden/NCAA this can mean that your halfback is your outlet. Third, it also means that half of the defense is basically resting. Let�s take a play from Shotgun Spread Y Flex out of the Baltimore Ravens Playbook from Madden 12. The Play is Smash HB Check.

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# 1 LBzrule @ 07/05/12 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big FN Deal


	I know option routes are the thing more people are clamoring for lately but I don't agree with them being in more stock plays. I can see option routes being the new "hot route" opposed to the User just being able to design a different pass play at the LOS but not having the playbooks implement more of them. Even so, I think before implementing more option routes of any kind, there would first have to be some rating(s) the differentiated how well each receiver "reads" the coverage and also the ball has to be completely untethered from the receiver so the QB and receiver are capable of miscommunication by reacting independently. Also, in the play used as an example in the writeup, I don't have an issue with the set play because the offense should be calling this play expecting to beat a certain coverage. If that coverage they are expecting is not what they defense is in, then they should have to audible to another play, check the ball down or risk the consequences of using that play anyway. I don't want to see option routes used as yet another successful shortcut or bailout for play calling. There is too much ad lib in Madden as is, imo, with little to no true risk/reward attached.

Big, I get that. That's just not how a lot of people are running their offenses these days though. They way they are running them, they are running them with back side tags so that the QB doesn't have to sit there and so that the back side of the defense cannot just rest. With a play like Smash HB Check, you get stuck once that front side is covered.

# 2 yourfavestoner @ 07/05/12 02:45 PM

Big FN Deal:

http://smartfootball.com/passing/how-to-use-backside-tags-to-attack-the-entire-field-in-the-passing-game

This is exactly what is being implemented across the board in football amongst spread-to-pass teams...even at the high school level.

The "reads" are actually fairly easy, and everything is based on MOFO (Middle Of Field Open) or MOFC (Middle of Field Covered) reads...basically the rotation of the safeties (1 high or 2 high).

People call Four Verticals cheese, too. However, Four Verticals in real life is a Base pass concept for many teams (they'll use it 5-10 times per game and their dropback pass game centers around vertical stems so everything looks the same). Not to mention, Four Verts for NCAA/NFL teams have multiple options built in...Fade/Back-shoulder-stop for the outside guys and seam reads for the inside guys.

What many in the video game community define as "cheese" are real issues that real defensive coordinators are having a ton of trouble dealing with in real life. That's why Quarters is such a preferred coverage now, when it was just a hail mary defense a few years ago (again, this is in "real" football).

# 3 SnakeEyez @ 07/05/12 02:50 PM

Excellent analysis... and a good source to use as well (smartfootball.com has a plethora of articles and diagrams.)

NCAA has tried to mimic the Run-and-Shoot (one of the more option route heavy systems) the past few years using option routes, but the game executes them rather poorly due to seemingly random choices by the WRs and no clear attribute being tied to their decision making (or ability to read coverages I guess.) I remember some people saying they believed Awareness was tied to this aspect, but it's hard to tell because EA doesn't elaborate on it at all, and then they rarely give you WR recruits with AWR over 70.

Some high school and college teams would run the "Choice" route 25+ times in a game because it's an isolation play to the weakside receiver who is simply trying to beat his man one-on-one... this is the #1 concept the NFL has adopted from the R&S (other than the back shoulder stop-fade) but you don't see it implemented much (or very well) in EA's football world.

I think another good example of requiring and implementing timing in the passing game is a concept like "Levels" where targets are running crosses at different depths to create the passing windows for the QB. It's a really simple concept for QBs because of the scan left-to-right or right-to-left progression of the play, but I don't see it too much in EA's football games... other than a handful of the most basic variants in NCAA11/12.

# 4 LBzrule @ 07/05/12 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big FN Deal


	@yourfavestoner and LBzrule, I understand what you guys are saying in reference to what is being done currently in the NFL but Madden does not currently have well represented real life NFL parameters. It's sort of like when people say the penalty system in Madden doesn't give you a choice of what to challenge because the NFL currently reviews everything, when in fact, one clearly does not work as the other. I am all for anything NFL realistic being implemented into Madden IF that includes representation of the inherent NFL checks/balances, risk/reward being implemented too. I don't see what difference an option route or backside tag makes, when currently a receivers route can be instantly changed based on where the pass is thrown.

There really are no checks/balances for having back side tags outside of the defense just getting home and not giving the QB time to make the reads. Teams either use them or they do not. The teams that do, like the Saints, Patriots put up a great deal of offense through the air. I get the concern with the WR's route being instantly changed based on where the pass is thrown. My original thinking on this was to actually have a realism setting like NBA 2k, which would mitigate some of these concerns.

# 5 PSUEagle @ 07/05/12 05:55 PM

Actually, what this particular play needs is an option component built into the slot receivers running the corner routes.

To be more specific, the slot receivers should be reading the outside CB to their respective side(s). If the CB is even or deeper than they are when they get to about eight yards up the field vertically (i.e. the defense is playing Cover 3, Cover 4, or soft man), they should hook outside somewhere between 10-12 yards. If the CB is underneath them, though (Cover 2 or tight man), they should break to the corner at a 45 degree angle.

If this adjustment were built in to the route, then Smash would truly be a universal concept that can "work" against all coverages. If the defense plays Cover 3 or Cover 4 with a backer/safety flying to the hitch, then the play is dead IRL if the receiver always breaks to the flag. By allowing him to hook outside though (and that's key, he has to hook outside) the offense has now created a curl flat concept, which will allow the QB to read the flat defender. The back on the checkdown will prevent one of the inside backers from flying out to the curl, again creating an advantageous look for the offense.

All of this isn't to say that I don't think we need more option routes along with more dual tags in both 3X1 and 2X2 formations (we do). Instead, I'm just saying that the basic mechanics of how passing concepts work need to be addressed as well.

# 6 JerzeyReign @ 07/05/12 06:38 PM

Plays in general need an overhaul. I honestly only look at half the field -- not because I'm a terrible QB but because that DT is coming quick

# 7 Skyboxer @ 07/05/12 07:36 PM

Until I can throw anywhere on the field and not Hit X for X.. I wont be happy. Of course after years of saying this I've gotten to the point I doubt I will ever see anything like that from EA.

# 8 SkillzKillz719 @ 07/05/12 09:41 PM

This was actually a bit thought provoking. Not in the front of my mind, but after reading this all of it has valid points!

Realistically, I would give this 5% chance. There just isn't enough of an audience that could appreciate it like we can.

# 9 PGaither84 @ 07/05/12 11:29 PM

As we have said before: The NFL is chess... Madden is checkers.

Madden has a lot of tools and options and features, but it is still an underdeveloped computer program. Offensive and defensive play calls are tied together. The ball is tied to the receiver. Players are either blocked or unblocked. There is no engaged player movement. A lot of important penalties [that 2k has] are still not in the game, let alone the ones that are don't work right most of the time.

Can Madden be entertaining? Sure... and frustrating. But to enjoy it, you have to take most of what you know and expect of football and throw it out the window.

# 10 volwalker @ 07/06/12 08:12 AM

With all this being said, what is the best passing system to use in this game? My passing game has by far been the hardest thing for me to use in this game? I am a pro style guy with an emphasis on the running game. I would like to combine it with a simple yet effective passing game. Any tips?

# 11 CM Hooe @ 07/06/12 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PGaither84


	to enjoy it, you have to take most of what you know and expect of football and throw it out the window.

I disagree with this notion entirely and vehemently.

---

To the blog posted in the topic, I think it has good ideas. I might try to tie in the receiver's ability to read coverage in with an already-existing rating, such as play recognition or awareness, but I like the concept.

I posted an idea to the GameChangers website (see my signature) about changing playcalling in general to further implement the Kinect voice command recognition and to allow for custom plays to be drawn up on the fly. I think that we'd see more creativity from users if such an option were allowed, and it'd instantly provide more passing options, albeit limited to the current play system.

# 12 LBzrule @ 07/06/12 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by volwalker


	With all this being said, what is the best passing system to use in this game? My passing game has by far been the hardest thing for me to use in this game? I am a pro style guy with an emphasis on the running game. I would like to combine it with a simple yet effective passing game. Any tips?

That news story will be out soon. We'll get a chance to see what a lot of guys like to do.

# 13 shttymcgee @ 07/06/12 10:25 AM

Instead of giving pre-play options to tag the backside, I feel like the plays should already be designed with those "backside" routes. Plus, you can still use the hot-route mechanisms to implement some sort of backside combination, whether it be curl-flat, levels, double-slant or just a single dig. The check-releases are what really gum-up the so-called "rush" reads.

I often read suggestions that incorporate a way to spot the ball on the field, instead of at a specific receiver. I just don't know how this could be implemented properly, taking timing into consideration. Giving receivers button icons is the fastest way to get the ball to different parts of the field; if you have to manually control where the ball goes, how will that effect timing? That's why I feel the re-addition of the vision cone would be a better way to go, as you can pre-determine where the cone starts before the snap as well as scan during the drop.

There's no doubt that the passing game needs improvement (starting with pass protections, which do seem a little better in the NCAA demo with the addition of the half-slide pro's) but the 1st thing that needs to change, imo, with the plays themselves is realistic route depth and timing to get to that depth. There are not enough intermediate routes ran (15-20 yds) and the time it takes the receivers to get to their spots does not time up with the QB drops or the rest of the flow of the game. It takes WR's too long to get to the intermediate depths.

# 14 shttymcgee @ 07/06/12 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by misterkrabz


	They need to come up with a way for the end user to control the location of the pass (as well as the speed and trajectory) . Just hitting a button that corresponds with a given receiver and supposedly controlling the lob/bullet is way to simplistic and not very rewarding when you're successful. Not sure if the "cone" was the answer on last gen but it was better than what we have now. Passing needs to be challenging and right now it's not. In 20+ years there really has been no innovation from EA in the passing game (excluding their attempt at the cone which they gave up on and essentially went backwards like they always do). The Microsoft football had cursor passing and it was great and headed in the right direction (with some tweaking) but the franchise is history as it any real innovation. Honestly, passing in EA's footballs games isn't any more challenging or rewarding than passing in Tecmo Bowl. It really is that bad.

I don't know what kind of "cursor" passing you are getting at, but if it's anything like the aiming systems that are used in shooters, then I don't support that idea.

Aiming a gun is nothing like throwing a ball. The only similarity that I can think of is picking out a small target when throwing, but the mechanics of how this is all done are obviously competely different. I agree that users should have more control over where the ball goes, but there has to be some way of speeding up where the ball is going generally, the stick should be used to "fine-tune" where the ball ends up.

Passing is too easy, yes, but that's because of the view users get. You don't have to turn your head, or your feet. Maybe just a way of simulating where the feet of the thrower are would be a good way of doing it. But, lets face it, completing a pass isn't the hardest thing in the world to do irl anyway; well more than half of all passes are completed.

# 15 volwalker @ 07/06/12 03:08 PM

If for some reason NCAA 13 fails due to bugs and glitches, I will go back to playing NCAA 11. Can anybody tell me if the player progression in dynasty mode was ever fixed after all the patches and tuners?

# 16 gamerk2 @ 07/08/12 02:30 AM

Frankly, I only throw to slants, crosses, or comebacks [and ONLY against off coverage]. Until the CPU is smart enough to cover them, there is zero reason to pass to any other route, and risk a pick.

99 times out of 100, I know who the open WR is going to be, and where he will be open, before the play is even called. EA's pass defense has been broken for years, thats why I stopped playing.

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