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Major League Baseball 2K8 REVIEW

Major League Baseball 2K8 Review (Xbox 360)

Taking one step forward and two steps back isn’t new to sports gaming. Nonetheless MLB 2K8 falls into that exact pitfall this year.

Since I’m a nice guy I’ll start with the step forward. The new pitching system is a lot of fun and harder to master than any other pitching system to date. While most people will master the fastball after a few games, breaking pitches and other off-speed pitches really take some touch and feel to harness effectively.

Taking last year's game and just adding the aforementioned pitching mechanic (plus the new baserunning system) would have been a step in the right direction for the franchise as a whole. This is because the new pitching style is good enough to carry the lack of development in other areas; but, sadly MLB 2K8 isn't just an improved MLB 2K7.

The 800-pound gorilla in the room, of course, is the frame rate issue. Quite simply it is inexcusable and unprofessional to release a game on a console with this kind of problem. To think, at some point somebody at 2K Sports made the decision the game could go to market as is, with gameplay often looking like its waiting for an art school student to draw it on screen for you is hard to fathom. Hopefully a patch is looming, but for those without an Internet connection, well they are just out of luck.

The audio commentary is also among the worst in recent memory. It took all of three innings of play for the tandem of Jon Miller and Joe Morgan to completely botch the play-by-play. In this case a home run was hit that was a good 20-feet toward left center from the foul pole. That didn’t keep Miller from excitedly informing us, "It’s off the pole! It’s a fair ball! Home run!"

I know I know. It’s a lot to ask that the audio match the play on the field. But luckily, unlike the frame rate issue, you can just turn the commentary off.

The game also seems to crash more often than your average title. I’ve had other games crash on me before, but the crashes always registered this thought in my mind:

"Wow that’s odd. Let me get a beer and I’ll just start over."

But five crashes in a week has got me thinking: "Make it a scotch."

What’s worse, I’ve never had another game crash while in the franchise part of a game; it’s always been while on the field of play. Most of my crashes in MLB, however, have been while tooling around inside my franchise - not on the field. The paranoia this brings on can’t be described. I now find myself rushing to save the franchise any time I make a new deal, tweak my rosters or put any elbow grease into my franchise.

To date I’ve done my first free agent signing period twice. I have had to deal El Duque and Moises Alou twice. I’ve had to do my draft…twice. And I’ve had to setup my entire 85 man system…twice.

The kicker is, this year's presentation isn’t drastically different in comparison to last year's offering. The cut scenes and overlays that stutter and pause are very similar to the ones that just last year were smooth as silk.

The commentary also sounds very familiar, and yet last year's game got the action on the field correct. The end game highlights are run the same this year, and yet last year's loaded in-and-out with ease, while this year's have all sorts of problems rendering the action on the field.

It really has to make you wonder what happened over the course of 12 months?

On The Field

Overall, gameplay is pretty solid -- once you get past the presentation and audio issues.

The star, of course, is the previously mentioned pitching system.

The new baserunning system is also a step in the right direction. For the first time in a while I feel like I have complete control over my players who are on the basepaths, and thus I can do what I want with them. I also enjoy the option to send a player on the pitcher's first move. This lets you sneak a few stolen bases for the players who aren’t likely to steal, and that makes it more realistic overall (the super speedsters aren’t the only ones who steal bases after all).

Swing Stick 2.0 is also a step in the right direction. It takes you a while to get the timing down, but once you do you have a lot more control at the plate than in years past. Much like the new pitching system, you’ll find yourself getting into a groove with the timing after a few games.

Like most videogames over the past few years, it is again very tough to work the count and have realistic at bats. So don’t count on drawing many walks or seeing too many 3-2 counts. Most players are just going to go the plate with the typical "grip it and rip it" strategy.

Franchise Mode

The big addition to the franchise this year is the ability to play minor league games. I always enjoyed this feature in the MVP games and it’s a nice change to try out some of your phenoms before deciding whether they can make it on your big league squad.

The GM Goals system is still a nice twist that is sure to drive players batty -- dealing with the crazy whims of a lunatic millionaire who spends too much time thinking he’s a baseball man.

In other words it's completely realistic.

Otherwise the franchise is solid. Nothing is really so incredibly cool and amazing you drool over it, but it's also tough to find a feature the franchise mode should have that it doesn’t.

That being said, the free agent system could use some work. I got all excited before heading into it seeing headlines like, "Hot Stove Alert: Sox Make Offer Ready For Nathan." Sadly there isn’t much give and take or dialogue between you, the players or other teams. You make a bid, wait a few days and chances are you’ll sign the player.

Some of the salaries also seem a little out of control, to the point teams are having problems signing stars later on in the franchise.

Online

Truth be told its very tough to play online. The new hitting and pitching systems that are based largely on perfecting your timing fall apart under the lag of online play.

Simply put, you can throw a pitch that is perfect offline that turns into a meatball online. And a ball you’d make contact with offline ends up being a swing and a miss online.

And those online detriments are a downer because the league options looked promising, with the option to allow trades and tons of other features which people have grown accustom to seeing in 2K Sports games.

Miscellaneous

I have a secret to admit. I like collecting virtual baseball cards. I know it sounds silly, but it's actually kind of fun, mostly because of the in-game aspects tied to unlocking the cards.

For instance unlocking a Johan Santana card by striking out 12 batters is an accomplishment.

You’ll find yourself looking at the box score after the game because you'll be trying to figure out what else you need to do to unlock the next player on your team, and perhaps alter your game plan as a result. Try and win another game? Or try and steal third with Jose Reyes to unlock his card?

The Stadium Beats feature is also pretty cool, especially to fill the void of no audio commentary (since you’ve no doubt turned Jon and Joe off). If you really wanted to spend the time it's possible to have play lists not only for individual players but also a number of different situations.

Final Thoughts

I would imagine the folks at 2K are kicking themselves. This could have been a very solid offering that took the series forward. Instead MLB 2K8 is going to be known as the Slideshow Edition of MLB 2K.

The new pitching system alone would have been grounds for acclaim.

Yet, instead of completely enjoying this game, we’re left wondering “what if.”


Graphics: Pretty run of the mill graphics for a next generation game.

Sound: Yikes. Bad audio commentary that doesn’t match up with on the field action. Lifeless crowds. Stadium Beats is a nice plus though.

Entertainment Value: Despite the game being broke on so many levels, you can turn down off some of the presentation options and enjoy an entertaining game.

Learning Curve: It will take you a number of games to get the hang of everything. With new pitching, new hitting and new baserunning systems you almost have to completely relearn the game.

Online: Yikes, Part II. Lag makes it tough to pitch and hit, in large part because both are completely timing based.


Major League Baseball 2K8 Score
Fun, challenging new pitching system.
Baserunning system also very good.
Who knew collecting cards would be fun?
Framerate issues and crashes. 'Nuff Said.
Online play hampered by lag.
Audio commentary is a joke.
6
out of 10
Member Comments
# 41 muggins @ 03/11/08 11:49 AM
I definitely think the reactions to this game were a little over the top. I agree Madden and NCAA had some pretty game-breaking bugs this year and I don't think they got nearly as much coverage.

That said, without having started my franchise mode yet, I'd say I'd give this game a 7.
 
# 42 Trevytrev11 @ 03/11/08 11:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jim416
The game has so much potential and time could have been better served working on the main core rather than a card system.

Amen. I've felt this way about all the baseball games. Fix what is broken first, fix the glitches, then add stuff. But, the card system probably hyped sales. That's the real bottom line.
Exactly...I'm under the impression that the way they view their product is that:

"We're going to gain more sales by adding new features, then we are going to lose by not fixing what is broken."

But for all we know, the people who created the card system may have not even been involved with other aspects of the game and it may have not made a difference.

I think it's important to understand that a lot of times, we are in the cross of two, three or four different agenda's. You have your fans who want it their way, the developers who think the fans don't know what they want and in turn want it their way, the executive officers and board of directors who want it first and foremost to be as cheap as possible and profitable and the marketing department that wants it to be fresh so they have new something to promote.

Somewhere in the middle, you get a game which has some expected and refreshing changes, some unexpected and unnecessary features and is slightly broken.
 
# 43 bangpow @ 03/11/08 12:02 PM
I have to disagree with a couple comments in this review.

I don't recall MLB 2K7 all that great and even though the game looked better, it played far worse than MLB 2K8, even with 2K8's frame rate issues. Also, MLB 2K7's controls were laggy and not responsive at all.

I think 2K8's gameplay is a huge improvement over 2K7's. Is it perfect? Nope, not at all, but I feel like I am actually in control of my players this year as opposed to last year.

The announcing doesn't bother me as much and I guess I would rather take a downgrade in graphics if it means an upgrade in control and responsiveness.

Sure, there aren't as many people in the stands, the crowd needs some serious work, and they do need to kind of react to foul balls, but again, I have a feeling that was done to improve the FPS, even thought that still needs work.

I would probably give it about a 7-7.5 right now, but will reserve judgement if they happen to patch the framerate issue.
 
# 44 MildlyPsycho @ 03/11/08 12:16 PM
I think 6 is a fair score as you really hit the mark on the positives and negatives. I really think that this game could be a 7 if it wasn't for damn crashes and glitches with framerate.
 
# 45 bangpow @ 03/11/08 12:28 PM
Oh, and I haven't had the game crash on me once....yet.
 
# 46 Zackdawg @ 03/11/08 01:22 PM
I think the distinction between gameplay, graphics and presentation is often an artificial one. I'm a franchise gamer -- I play for immersion in the experience. When the game crashes, it takes me out of the experience of running a franchise. When the game fails to conform to real baseball, as in the case of AI-controlled teams never stealing, it takes me out of the experience. When the tv-style presentation stutters so badly that it is a pain to watch, it takes me out of the experience. Frame-rate stutters do the same thing as does the mismatched or just plain inaccurate play-by-play. While I agree that what is classicly defined as "gameplay" is not nearly as buggy as the rest of the product, the result is the same -- I become aware that I'm playing a bad piece of software and lose immersion in the game.
 
# 47 fistofrage @ 03/11/08 01:26 PM
Why is all of 2k's commentary horrible. In NCAA College hoops, you could be up by 2 and they'll say you are up by 19. Now I'm hearing this? I don't know programming, but I would imagine that lining up the commentary with things like the score and where the ball is hit should be relatively easy.

I think we are finally seeing harsh criticism against 2k sports because in years past, they were "the people's champion" the freedom fighters the one's that went against all odds to fight the evil tyrant EA Sports. They were our voice and they listened to us. They were Robin Hood, fighting for the good of sports sims gamers. That was until this year. Now instead of robbing from the rich and giving to the poor, they're robbing from us, producing subpar games and going bankrupt in the process.
 
# 48 ehh @ 03/11/08 01:33 PM
On the field I think the game is an 8 out of 10, everything else is about a 4 out of 10. Personally I weigh the former much more than the latter, but trying to speak for everyone in general I'd say 6/10 is pretty accurate. However, the notion that this game took one step forward and two back is completely BS to me. This game took a huge step forward this year.
 
# 49 roadman @ 03/11/08 02:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehh
On the field I think the game is an 8 out of 10, everything else is about a 4 out of 10. Personally I weigh the former much more than the latter, but trying to speak for everyone in general I'd say 6/10 is pretty accurate. However, the notion that this game took one step forward and two back is completely BS to me. This game took a huge step forward this year.
That's pretty much how I feel.
 
# 50 Kramer5150 @ 03/11/08 03:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehh
On the field I think the game is an 8 out of 10, everything else is about a 4 out of 10. Personally I weigh the former much more than the latter, but trying to speak for everyone in general I'd say 6/10 is pretty accurate. However, the notion that this game took one step forward and two back is completely BS to me. This game took a huge step forward this year.
I agree with this as well.
 
# 51 Brophog @ 03/11/08 04:01 PM
Slizeezyc, Blygilmore, OS Staff,

Thanks for the discourse on the review. Glad to be a part of it. This thread has been a very good one, not solely on the review of this title, but on the process of reviewing and games in general. Thanks for that.

The big idea that I see here though that a retail product should come out in a state unlike this one......particularly on the framerate issues, is a bit of a tricky one. I agree that a product has to be playable and that an issue like this one should have received more pre-release focus. I don't know if we can continue to take a very hard line approach to this though and keep our senses as console gaming goes forward.

But the other side of it is that this is the reality in 21st century gaming. We're walking a fine line of performance here, unlike I think any time in console gaming history. On the end-user side, we know what we want, and have come to expect that bar to get continually raised, but we don't necessarily know what goes into that. On the other end, there is an entire gamut of people needed to put these things together now, with a lot of conditions dictating when a product can be released, and sometimes in what condition that product is to be released. We on this end need to remember that things are not simple anymore. There is always a PR/marketing side to the decision to push a game back or release and patch. The respective license holders may have a say in it. There are a lot of factors that can dictate the why and how of a gaming release. It may not be so cut and dry as we make it out to be.

The reality side of it is, we're going to see more and more games on the consoles with these kinds of problems requiring patches. In the PC arena, we've become almost completely accustomed to it. We know the game will have several revisions over its lifetime, and the better developers aren't the ones that release the best retail versions, but the ones that address the problems the quickest. I don't know the last PC game I bought that I did not immediately go look for the patches for. We're seeing this on the console end now as well. It seems every day a patch for a new PS3 or XBOX 360 game is coming out. Some to fix major issues like this one. Some for more minor ones.

This conversation isn't excusing the framerate issue, which is why I talked about having 2 reviews. I think it is more than fair to address the framerate in this review, as it is a huge issue. But I also fully expect to see it patched, and therefore what we know the game to be will be different. The reason I bring all of this up like this is that part of the issue, imo, and I'm seeing it all over the web with an entire host of console games, is that we as console gamers are in a bit of a shock right now. We are simply not accustomed to patches. We think of things as being "retail versions" and that's how the game is for eternity. That's a hard mindset to change, but, imo, a necessary one beginning with this generation.
 
# 52 capp34 @ 03/11/08 04:36 PM
Nice review I would have gave it a 5 because its only half of a game. I agree with all the facts you stated tho
 
# 53 russ99 @ 03/11/08 05:46 PM
I'd agree with the 6 as shipped.

With a few slider adjustments, I'd go as far as a 7.

If they get around to fixing the framerate in a patch, it could be worth an 8, as it's really fun to play.
 
# 54 ChaseB @ 03/11/08 06:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brophog
Slizeezyc, Blygilmore, OS Staff,

Thanks for the discourse on the review. Glad to be a part of it. This thread has been a very good one, not solely on the review of this title, but on the process of reviewing and games in general. Thanks for that.

The big idea that I see here though that a retail product should come out in a state unlike this one......particularly on the framerate issues, is a bit of a tricky one. I agree that a product has to be playable and that an issue like this one should have received more pre-release focus. I don't know if we can continue to take a very hard line approach to this though and keep our senses as console gaming goes forward.

But the other side of it is that this is the reality in 21st century gaming. We're walking a fine line of performance here, unlike I think any time in console gaming history. On the end-user side, we know what we want, and have come to expect that bar to get continually raised, but we don't necessarily know what goes into that. On the other end, there is an entire gamut of people needed to put these things together now, with a lot of conditions dictating when a product can be released, and sometimes in what condition that product is to be released. We on this end need to remember that things are not simple anymore. There is always a PR/marketing side to the decision to push a game back or release and patch. The respective license holders may have a say in it. There are a lot of factors that can dictate the why and how of a gaming release. It may not be so cut and dry as we make it out to be.

The reality side of it is, we're going to see more and more games on the consoles with these kinds of problems requiring patches. In the PC arena, we've become almost completely accustomed to it. We know the game will have several revisions over its lifetime, and the better developers aren't the ones that release the best retail versions, but the ones that address the problems the quickest. I don't know the last PC game I bought that I did not immediately go look for the patches for. We're seeing this on the console end now as well. It seems every day a patch for a new PS3 or XBOX 360 game is coming out. Some to fix major issues like this one. Some for more minor ones.

This conversation isn't excusing the framerate issue, which is why I talked about having 2 reviews. I think it is more than fair to address the framerate in this review, as it is a huge issue. But I also fully expect to see it patched, and therefore what we know the game to be will be different. The reason I bring all of this up like this is that part of the issue, imo, and I'm seeing it all over the web with an entire host of console games, is that we as console gamers are in a bit of a shock right now. We are simply not accustomed to patches. We think of things as being "retail versions" and that's how the game is for eternity. That's a hard mindset to change, but, imo, a necessary one beginning with this generation.
So the first thing I think of is sort of a chicken or the egg type deal. Was patching necessary because of technological/marketing/programming advances and pitfalls, or because the Internet is there and it's possible to fix a game after it ships? Have people accepted patching as just a part of gaming now and that's also a contributing factor? There's certainly room to argue each side of that argument.

The other thing I think about though is: In what other tech consumer world do people accept "broken" products? It's the same argument that's raged in the PC world for a while really. When a game ships on the PC and then it doesn't work or you need to DL a ton of patches or drivers, in what other tech market would that be accepted? I have trouble really thinking of one where people just accept buying a "broken" product.

Continuing on with that PC point. Consoles have thrived in large part due to standardized components and thus little to no need to upgrade. It's a flat fee and you know all the games will work the same and all developers can develop with the same tools. I would say that mindset means that patching post-release won't ever really be an acceptable excuse -- at least in the near future. PC gamers are in a constant state of change as it comes to hardware and PC devs have to develop for many different hardware combos, and all that mixed just leads to a more acceptable atmosphere for tweaking post-release. Even so you're starting to see some more standardization even in the PC market.

But returning back to the original point of the review. I think Dave/Bly certainly took into consideration how the actual game itself played (obvious to say I know but nonetheless), and while the frame rate was a detriment on the experience itself, if he didn't at least enjoy the core of the game he wouldn't have given it an above average score -- that's what I get from the review at least.
 
# 55 Diesel3649 @ 03/11/08 07:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brophog
Slizeezyc, Blygilmore, OS Staff,

Thanks for the discourse on the review. Glad to be a part of it. This thread has been a very good one, not solely on the review of this title, but on the process of reviewing and games in general. Thanks for that.

The big idea that I see here though that a retail product should come out in a state unlike this one......particularly on the framerate issues, is a bit of a tricky one. I agree that a product has to be playable and that an issue like this one should have received more pre-release focus. I don't know if we can continue to take a very hard line approach to this though and keep our senses as console gaming goes forward.

But the other side of it is that this is the reality in 21st century gaming. We're walking a fine line of performance here, unlike I think any time in console gaming history. On the end-user side, we know what we want, and have come to expect that bar to get continually raised, but we don't necessarily know what goes into that. On the other end, there is an entire gamut of people needed to put these things together now, with a lot of conditions dictating when a product can be released, and sometimes in what condition that product is to be released. We on this end need to remember that things are not simple anymore. There is always a PR/marketing side to the decision to push a game back or release and patch. The respective license holders may have a say in it. There are a lot of factors that can dictate the why and how of a gaming release. It may not be so cut and dry as we make it out to be.

The reality side of it is, we're going to see more and more games on the consoles with these kinds of problems requiring patches. In the PC arena, we've become almost completely accustomed to it. We know the game will have several revisions over its lifetime, and the better developers aren't the ones that release the best retail versions, but the ones that address the problems the quickest. I don't know the last PC game I bought that I did not immediately go look for the patches for. We're seeing this on the console end now as well. It seems every day a patch for a new PS3 or XBOX 360 game is coming out. Some to fix major issues like this one. Some for more minor ones.

This conversation isn't excusing the framerate issue, which is why I talked about having 2 reviews. I think it is more than fair to address the framerate in this review, as it is a huge issue. But I also fully expect to see it patched, and therefore what we know the game to be will be different. The reason I bring all of this up like this is that part of the issue, imo, and I'm seeing it all over the web with an entire host of console games, is that we as console gamers are in a bit of a shock right now. We are simply not accustomed to patches. We think of things as being "retail versions" and that's how the game is for eternity. That's a hard mindset to change, but, imo, a necessary one beginning with this generation.
I have to respectfully disagree with your view that it's our mindset that needs to change. My mindset when buying a video game or anything for that matter, is that I expect it to perform as advertised on day one. For example we where told that the game would perform near 60fps most of the time, and at worst would not drop much below that. This is not what we got. Now I don't think the problem here is my mindset. In order to get the game to play with a better frame rate than the game 2K gave me, I had to disable my VIP, which inturn disabled my card collecting feature. Thats not what was advertised. That is unacceptable.

If I purchased a brand new car, which only ran correctly if I kept the headlights, and the wipers off, it would damn well not be acceptable, and definetly not tolerated. Now I understand that the comparison between cars and video games is apples and oranges, my point is still the same, I expect quality, fully functioning products when I plop my money down, that's my mindset. Expecting a consumer to change that, and accept anything less, is very dangerous in my opinion.
 
# 56 Blzer @ 03/12/08 02:18 PM
Well, 2KLA, I must say... yet another year where virtually every video gaming company rates your game lower than your competition. I only hope you know where you need to prioritize next year so that you're no longer "playing second fiddle" to your opponent.
 
# 57 Zackdawg @ 03/12/08 02:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel3649
I have to respectfully disagree with your view that it's our mindset that needs to change. My mindset when buying a video game or anything for that matter, is that I expect it to perform as advertised on day one. For example we where told that the game would perform near 60fps most of the time, and at worst would not drop much below that. This is not what we got. Now I don't think the problem here is my mindset. In order to get the game to play with a better frame rate than the game 2K gave me, I had to disable my VIP, which inturn disabled my card collecting feature. Thats not what was advertised. That is unacceptable.

If I purchased a brand new car, which only ran correctly if I kept the headlights, and the wipers off, it would damn well not be acceptable, and definetly not tolerated. Now I understand that the comparison between cars and video games is apples and oranges, my point is still the same, I expect quality, fully functioning products when I plop my money down, that's my mindset. Expecting a consumer to change that, and accept anything less, is very dangerous in my opinion.
Very well said. Why would any consumer demand less?
 
# 58 Trevytrev11 @ 03/12/08 02:23 PM
Two people in, or formerly in, the industry (Kush Gamer and DrJones) have both said that there is pressure from the higher ups for high review scores. I wonder what kind of reaction is going on behind the scenes with both the development team as well as the Take Two/2K executives. While I appreciate the overall direction this game is going, I wonder if the company has the same confidence.
 
# 59 fistofrage @ 03/12/08 03:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoyceBrown
People NEVER should accept a half finished product needing MAJOR fixing.

In the software industry (outside of video games) there is a common idea involving beta testing. Why video game companies can't get privy to this concept is beyond me.

In essence we all paid 2KLA $59.99 to be a bunch of beta testing monkeys for MLB 2K8.

This game should have never gone to market in its current state, future patching notwithstanding.



This game should have been released as a FREE beta test, and the community could have made the observations/suggestions/criticisms that obviously sites like OS didn't/couldn't make.
I think that all sports games are Beta tests at this point. The games come out every year so all we're doing is giving them feedback for next year. All of these sports games have always had flaws in them that keep them from being a sim, but now it seems like 2k is putting flaws in the game that prevent them from even being fun. Its a crying shame too, because they have a community of 5000 here that would do their Quality Control for them for free, but Anyway.

I am glad that 2k Hoops isn't going to be produced next year. The patch made the game good enough and now I don't have to worry about what they'll foul up next year. I am also sure too that if the Members of OS didn't chirp so much about the flaws, there wouldn't have been a patch. So in those regards my 50+ hours of free Beta Testing went to good use. So keep squawking about this game too and hopefully they'll fix it. They are killing themselves though by not putting out a good game in the first place. Couple this with their atrocious marketing and its no wonder why 2k is circling the drain.
 
# 60 phatboy54 @ 03/15/08 04:53 AM
This will forever be remembered as the game that led me to sell my 360. After a fun but repetitive (hey, six interceptions again!) run with NCAA Football, I was fired up for this release. It took about 5 games and countless hours dissecting the sliders on this message board to give up. As an older gamer (early 30's), I just don't care enough about spending the time to get a perfect sim these days. I'm buying a Wii and some beer. Something was lost when we jumped to the Next Gen systems and that was the fun factor.
 


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