Who is the NL Cy Young?

[Bomber]

I'm betting Clemens runs away with it, even though Johnson has had a better season. When will people learn that wins aren't the proper stat to be comparing pitchers with?

[Cuckoo]

I think the sentimental vote alone will carry Clemens to the win, although you're right that Johnson has better stats. His WHIP is incredible.

[Crapshoot]

Johnson should be in a canter- will be is a different story.

[rkmsuf]

Wow, so it is.

[Bomber]

That's not to say Clemens hasn't been very very good. He's had an outstanding season and with his wins/playing for a contender, will easily win the award I think, but RJ is slightly better in ever stat but W/Ls.

[hhiipp]

Simply incredible!

[JeeberD]

This Astros fan endorses Roy Oswalt...

[samifan24]

Johnson has simply been the most dominant pitcher in the National League this season. Look beyond wins.

[Crapshoot]

I cant believe the support Clemens is getting- its supposed to be the best pitcher in the league.

[Huckleberry]

The question was "Who is the NL Cy Young Winner?"

The probable correct answer to that question is Roger Clemens. In another thread, for example, the question is "Who is the NL MVP?" which asks me to declare who the most valuable player in the National League is.

[Crapshoot]

correct- but i believe its asking you make an assesment of who the Cy Young winner should be (based on the recent trend), not who you think it will be. But that's semantics- I think Clemens will win it as well- I just think that he shouldnt.

[rkmsuf]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

The question was "Who is the NL Cy Young Winner?"

The probable correct answer to that question is Roger Clemens. In another thread, for example, the question is "Who is the NL MVP?" which asks me to declare who the most valuable player in the National League is.

Hey, it's Semantic Man!

[Huckleberry]

You got that right.

[Blackadar]

Tough call.

Johnson edges out Clemens in every category but wins. But then again, Clemens really helped carry Houston most of the year. Pavano has had a great year too.

I'd almost be tempted to give it to Armando Benitez and his 1.18 ERA.

Probably the Rocket because of the more wins and better team.

[John Galt]

I agree that Benitez should at least be listed. If people gave it to Gagne last year, there is a better argument for Benitez this year (especially due to the competition). I thought Schmidt should have won last year, so I went with Johnson this year.

[Crapshoot]

roffle- Wins are a horrible measure of a pitcher's performance.

Player         Team   POS    Bat  Pitch Field  ExpWS    WSP   WSAA Total
R Johnson      ARI    P     -2.3   25.2   0.0     11  1.026     12    23
R Clemens      HOU    P     -0.8   20.1   0.0     10  1.002     10    19
C Zambrano     CHC    P     -1.4   20.0   0.0      9  1.002      9    19
C Pavano       FLO    P     -0.8   18.6   0.0     10   .904      8    18
J Schmidt      SFG    P     -1.6   19.5   0.0     10   .877      8    18
B Sheets       MIL    P     -2.2   20.6   0.0     11   .856      8    18

NAME                TEAM LG   G  GS    IP  H/9 BB/9 SO/9 HR/9 BABIP   ERA    RA PK_RA RA+     RP   VORP
Randy Johnson        ARI NL  34  34 237.7  6.3  1.7 10.7  0.6 0.266  2.65  3.11  2.85 164   48.9   70.6
Carlos Zambrano      CHN NL  30  30 204.0  7.3  3.5  8.1  0.6 0.275  2.60  3.00  3.03 155   37.8   63.0
Carl Pavano          FLO NL  31  31 222.3  8.6  2.0  5.6  0.6 0.287  3.00  3.24  3.45 136   31.0   62.8
Ben Sheets           MIL NL  33  33 228.0  7.6  1.2 10.0  1.0 0.290  2.80  3.32  3.25 144   36.7   62.4
Roger Clemens        HOU NL  33  33 214.3  7.1  3.3  9.2  0.6 0.283  2.98  3.19  3.10 151   38.1   61.6

How Clemens wins that so easily over Schmidt, zAmbrano, Pavano, I;ll never understand- and then there's Johnson, who's been the best by far.

[k0ruptr]

Jake Peavy.

[Bomber]

I voted for Clemens because I think he's going to win. Recent history and what I've been hearing from the media says that Johnson's got no chance. Just like the MVP hardly ever goes to the Most Valuable Player, the Cy Young doesn't necessarily go to the best pitcher, just the one with the best glamour stats (ERA and Wins mainly, plus he's the best pitcher of his generation). Awards aren't given out the way they should, you've got to factor that into the discussion.

[Bomber]

Originally Posted by John Galt

I agree that Benitez should at least be listed. If people gave it to Gagne last year, there is a better argument for Benitez this year (especially due to the competition). I thought Schmidt should have won last year, so I went with Johnson this year.

With the year Clemens and the other starters have had I don't think there is any question a closer won't be in the running this year. That's why Benitez isn't on the list.

[John Galt]

Originally Posted by Bomber

With the year Clemens and the other starters have had I don't think there is any question a closer won't be in the running this year. That's why Benitez isn't on the list.

Benitez 2004: 68.2 IP 46 SV 61 K 1.18 ERA 0.79 WHIP
Gagne 2003: 82.1 IP 55 SV 113 K 1.20 ERA 0.69 WHIP

Clemens 2004: 214.1 IP 18 W 218 K 2.98 ERA 1.16 WHIP
Schmidt 2003: 207.2 IP 17 W 208 K 2.34 ERA 0.95 WHIP

If Gagne beats Schmidt in 2003, I have to think Benitez should at least be in the running with Clemens. I doubt Benitez will get many votes, but I think voters are being hypocritical if they voted for Gagne and don't give Benitez similar consideration.

[Bomber]

Gagne had his saves streak going. That played a huge role in his winning the award. I also didn't realize Schmidt's stats were that good a year ago. Kind of shocking he didn't win with numbers like that.

[John Galt]

Originally Posted by Bomber

Gagne had his saves streak going. That played a huge role in his winning the award. I also didn't realize Schmidt's stats were that good a year ago. Kind of shocking he didn't win with numbers like that.

I know the streak mattered to voters, but I never understood why. He had 3 loses that year - it wasn't like he never lost his team a game. I just think it is a double standard with Benitez this year.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by John Galt

Benitez 2004: 68.2 IP 46 SV 61 K 1.18 ERA 0.79 WHIP
Gagne 2003: 82.1 IP 55 SV 113 K 1.20 ERA 0.69 WHIP

Clemens 2004: 214.1 IP 18 W 218 K 2.98 ERA 1.16 WHIP
Schmidt 2003: 207.2 IP 17 W 208 K 2.34 ERA 0.95 WHIP

If Gagne beats Schmidt in 2003, I have to think Benitez should at least be in the running with Clemens. I doubt Benitez will get many votes, but I think voters are being hypocritical if they voted for Gagne and don't give Benitez similar consideration.

10 less saves with an additional 4 blown saves and 50 K is a big deal for closers. Particularly with Gagne's amazing 0 blown saves last year.

SI

[dixieflatline]

If you are going to add Johnson to the list you should also include Ben Sheets. 2.80 ERA with 253 K's and 31 BB in 228 innings. Sure he only has 11 wins but look at his team. I'm not saying he is the winner but he should be in the discussion.

[Suicane75]

I would vote for Ben Sheets, so I'm abstaining from voting.

[Crapshoot]

I really wish this was a public poll- I'd be curious who voted for Clemens (or Beltre in the others, or Schilling )...

[tucker342]

Johnson should win, even though he won't...