It's Here! The Thread For the 2003-04 NHL Regular Season!

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by sterlingice
Aw, nothing like a game against the Hawks to get the Wings healthy again. And then they go and beat the Stars silly by hanging a 6 spot on my fantasy goalie. *sigh*

SI

Nice to see the Wings put together a nice little winning streak, especially against the upstart Hawks and villainous Stars.

Way to go Stumpy! A goal a game pace. Keep it up, old man!

[sachmo71]

F the Wings....

Anyone want some of my grapes? :D

[ice4277]

Originally posted by sterlingice
Aw, nothing like a game against the Hawks to get the Wings healthy again. And then they go and beat the Stars silly by hanging a 6 spot on my fantasy goalie. *sigh*

SI

Well there goes your hockey season down the drain :p

[bbor]

Interesting that the Pens have decided to keep Fluery with the big club all season.I wonder if they will let him go to play in the world JR championship.

[chrisj]

Originally posted by bbor
Interesting that the Pens have decided to keep Fluery with the big club all season.I wonder if they will let him go to play in the world JR championship.

Well... they can still send him back to Junior. They've just used up the first year of his contract.

I highly doubt they'll let him play in the World Jr's unless they decide to send him back.

[sachmo71]

Dallas trades defenseman Stephane Robidas to Chicago for defenseman
Jon Klemm. Stars assign Antti Miettinen to Utah; call up Steve
Gainey and Rob Valicevic.


Ok, we've established that the Stars are taking the New York Rangers approach to hockey...great on paper, shit on the ice. But to go and trade on of the few guys who shows up and plays hard every night is downright evil!
F-ING STARS!!! GHAAAAAAAAA!

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by sachmo71
Ok, we've established that the Stars are taking the New York Rangers approach to hockey...great on paper, shit on the ice. But to go and trade on of the few guys who shows up and plays hard every night is downright evil!
F-ING STARS!!! GHAAAAAAAAA!

John Klemm was everyone's hero a few years back. The most unheralded free agent signing of the year. The stablizing force of the Chicago blue line. The +/- leader on the team. He's a winner. Been on Stanley Cup teams. A leader. A worker. He's got two "Ms" in his name when one would suffice. His first name and last name are both one sylable long. The Stars called up Rob Valicevic. That's a pretty cool name, Valicevic. Then again, so is Antti Miettinen. Looks like a wash now...

[Chief Rum]

Nice...

After the bad start, the Ducks have finally gotten things together somewhat and have moved into a tie with the first place Kings. Of course, we're still a game or two ahead of most teams in the NHL, and I am sure that will eventually come to bite us. Hopefully, we have a good run coming here. Giguere still hasn't really heated up yet the way he can (although he has been playing much better).

And we stopped the Blues' win streak. :)

CR

[sachmo71]

Don't forget that the Heritage Classic will be played this weekend. First outdoor NHL game...ever? Anyway, looks like hockey doesn't rank high enough for this sporting extravaganza to be shown on regular TV, so it's CBC or Center Ice for you. Unless someone knows something that I don't?

[Honolulu_Blue]

Also, the Oilers went out and signed ex-Red Wing Adam Oates. Not a bad pick-up by all accounts. Clearly at over 40, he isn't the same player he once was, but he's still a threat. A great, great playmaker, especially on the power-play. It's interesting because he doesn't fit the "skating" mold of your typical Oiler team. He was never fast and is even less so today. Still, he wont hurt and steps in on the 1PP and can fill the role of the 2nd/3rd line center. He's also ace on faceoffs.

There was some talk of Oates ending up back in Detroit. The Wings went with Stumpy which isn't too surprising. Oates was traded years and years ago because (allegedly) he didn't get along with Steve Yzerman. It was really the worst trade in Red Wings history (since I've been following them) Adam Oates and Paul MacLean for Bernie Federko (an aged Bernie in his last year in the league) and Tony McKegny. It sucked.

[sterlingice]

Originally posted by sachmo71
Don't forget that the Heritage Classic will be played this weekend. First outdoor NHL game...ever? Anyway, looks like hockey doesn't rank high enough for this sporting extravaganza to be shown on regular TV, so it's CBC or Center Ice for you. Unless someone knows something that I don't?

Oh, that sucks. I really wanted to see the game. Sounded like a very cool idea.

SI

[Chief Rum]

Tonight, the Ducks play the Avalanche in Colorado. Of course, Kariya is hurt and won't play. :(

Oh well...next possible meeting is one I have circled on the ole calendar: Dec. 19, Colorado at Anaheim, Kariya's return home.

CR

[sterlingice]

Ok, boys and girls. We have some serious issues here. I found this all the way down on page 18. I know hockey takes on an unreal significance in the post season and I tend to watch a game or two every single night then (if possible) but the regular season has its moments, too. Plus, I keep seeing hockey threads but nothing in here. Shape up, folks

(The preceeding was brought to you in sarcasm-vision)

SI

[Maple Leafs]

It's panic time here in Ottawa. Apparently the fans have realized that the league doesn't plan to just hand the Cup over the Sens, and that maybe just maybe the team was overrated heading into the season.

My inside sources (cough) are telling me that Bonk and Havlat have become cancers on the team. Apparently Bonk is the last guy in and the first guy out for practices and games. The team would love to move him, but can't find anyone who wants to give up anything for him.

Meanwhile, Havlat is still pulling a suck routine after the contract negotiations and aborted hold out. He apparently tried to pull himself out of the Rangers game with a phantom injury, forcing Alfreddson to slap him in the head and tell him to smarten up. Unlike Bonk, there are still some teams out there who haven't figured out that Havlat is a passenger, so he's likely the one to get moved.

The rumor now, for whatever it's worth, is that Havlat will go to the Coyotes for Shane Doan.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Havlat for Doan sounds like a decent deal for the Senators if Havlat is the turd he seems to be. Doan is tough, big, strong which is exactly what the Sens seem to be missing.

On the Wings front they are back in first place in the Central Division where they belong. They beat Blues in St. Louis 2-1 and have played decent, but by no means great, hockey. Stumpy Thomas has been a godsend. Playing really well so far.

[bbor]

We had a Stanley cup parade last nigth here in Toronto.It was nice.....although i choked on some rice:)

Seriously,it seems the closed door players only meeting the Leafs had after the loss to the Oilers has turned some things around.Still need a big D-man in Toronto,but a rumour swirling around herenow is the Leafs kicking the tires on the Isle to see what it would take to get peca in the blue and white.

Nice move by Barnaby last night to nod to the linesmen during a fight that he was ready to end it,so Nolan drops his hands and Barnaby labels him with a haymaker.Look for retrebution tonight when the rematch is played in Toronto,unless Barnaby gets a mysterious *illness* .

[Chubby]

Branaby is a punk, he was when he was in Buffalo and he always will be.

I'm happy with the Sabres season so far, they are hanging around .500 and 7th/8th place in the conference and Miro seems to have gotten his head out of his ass (for now). All we need is to trade a goalie for some more O :)

[sterlingice]

When he came to Chicago, I thought Thibault was overrated and a liability. A couple of years ago, I decided he was neutral- an average goalie who didn't hurt the team but also didn't win games. Two years ago, he finally won me over. Now, I'm starting to think he's invaluable.

I don't think it's any coincidence that the Hawks have an 11 game winless streak and that the last game Jocelyn played in was 12 games ago. That 6-5-3-0 record was so long ago as they are now 1 point ahead of the Blowjackets for last in the conference with 2 more games played.

SI

[Chief Rum]

Originally posted by bbor
We had a Stanley cup parade last nigth here in Toronto.It was nice.....although i choked on some rice:)

Good to see the NHL is trying to get the Cup to Toronto anyway it can. :D

Out in the Pacific Division, everything is screwed up. All five teams are hovering at or just above .500, including the Stars. The division lead and the entire set of standings seems to change daily. I have no idea when someone is finally going to put it together and pull away. Right now, the Sharks are listed in second, ahead of both the Stars and the Ducks (although they all have the same number of points).

The Ducks have been playing this maddening game. Maybe you noticed. It's called "let's see how many overtime losses we can have this year!" We have 5 overtime losses, far more than anyone else. It's extremely annoying to see the team come so far in a game, only to lose it in overtime. Yes, we get a point, but the other team (usually a key Western Conference foe) gets two points.

I am loving having Federov around right now. He is playinbg very well now after a slow start. The entire offense is clicking pretty good. Andy McDonald is showing the playmaking skills I said he would. Guys like Neidermayer and rookie Lupul are being more offensive. Rucchin is staying on the ice (albeit barely). I am annoyed that Chistov can't find a way to score a goal (although he has a ton of assists...as a winger), and we really need Petr Sykora to get on track--he hasn't been the goal scoring machine we need. And then there's Jiggy, who still hasn';t really gotten into the full flow of the season yet, although he's playing much better now than he was earlier in the season. He is developing a reputation as a slow starter.

Big game coming up on Dec 19. Avalanche vs Anaheim at Anaheim. Paul Kariya's return home. I just hope he doesn't get hurt again...at least before he gets to Anaheim. Just kidding. ;)

CR

[Maple Leafs]

Originally posted by bbor
Nice move by Barnaby last night to nod to the linesmen during a fight that he was ready to end it,so Nolan drops his hands and Barnaby labels him with a haymaker. I think Barnaby could take as many free shots as he needed at Nolan and not do much damange. He always has been more sizzle than steak.

Although it was hilarious to watch Nolan laugh at him, continually asking him if he was done. You could read Nolan's lips... "Are you done?" (weak Barnaby punch) "OK, now are you done?"

[Karim]

I went to the Canucks/Flames game on Saturday. OMFG! Sold out, playoff atmosphere. It was freakin' awesome! I can only imagine the atmosphere if we had a team like Ottawa, but Sutter definitely has them on the right track. Even with Iginla only having four goals, and Conroy only 1 or 2, everyone else is picking up the slack, especially Donovan and Lombardi.

One of the chants heard at the game:

Who ate all the pie?
Who ate all the pie?
Todd Bertuzzi, you fat bastard,
You ate all the pie.

:D

[Honolulu_Blue]

The Anaheim Mighty Ducks are in Detroit tonight. On any other night, this wouldn't be newsworthy. However, the Ducks unceramoniously dumped the Wings in the first round of the playoffs last year, sweeping them 4-0. And, much more importantly, this marks the return of Sergei Fedorov to Detroit.

There has been some debate as to how the fickle fans of Hockeytown will respond to his return. Well, to use Jim Rome lingo, here is my take:

Being in Brussels, I certainly wont be at the game. But I will be seriously, no, SERIOUSLY disappointed if Fedorov is jeered or receives anything less than a standing ovation for this 12 glorious years in Detroit. What did he do for the team? Lead the team, nay, the league in play-off scoring during that time? Check. Win a Hart Trophy? Check. Win a Selke? Check. Help bring three Stanley Cups to a city who hadn't seen one in 42 years? Check. Check. Check.

He may have taken games off from time to time, he may have been a bit flighty, he may have had a most unfortunate obessession with a certain Russian tennis star. All these things may be true. That being said he was at the core of perhaps one of the greatest runs in Red Wings history, the winningest team of the decade, and the beforementioned three Cups.

He didn't bolt the town for money. He bolted the town to get out from under Yzerman's shadow and try his shot at being "The Man." It's a perfectly understandable human response after being #2 for over a decade.

The mercurial forward played his heart out (the best he knew how, I think) for this team and brought results (THREE FREAKING CUPS) and some very, very good and exciting times for us all.

Shame on all those who boo the man when he returns tonight.

It's time to put wounded pride behind us all, reflect back on the last twelve years and realize much of the success would not have been possible without good, ole #91.

[sterlingice]

Originally posted by Honolulu_Blue
he may have had a most unfortunate obessession with a certain Russian tennis star.

Oh, but who in the NHL hasn't? I believe Jim Rome calls her "the NHL Pegboard" or something like that.

SI

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by sterlingice
Oh, but who in the NHL hasn't? I believe Jim Rome calls her "the NHL Pegboard" or something like that.

SI

Poor girl. It's been what? Two players? (Bure and Fedorov) who have gone out with her and all of a sudden she's "the NHL Pegboard"? That's nice. That's real nice. I guess there's a reason I don't listen to Rome.

[sterlingice]

Originally posted by Honolulu_Blue
Poor girl. It's been what? Two players? (Bure and Fedorov) who have gone out with her and all of a sudden she's "the NHL Pegboard"? That's nice. That's real nice. I guess there's a reason I don't listen to Rome.

And I would have thought it's because he's a pompous ass.

SI

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by sterlingice
And I would have thought it's because he's a pompous ass.

SI

Eh, that too. I would imagine that goes without saying though.

[Draft Dodger]

well, I'm happy with my Avs

[bbor]

WHo's winning the bet...I think it was between CR and...??? Who?

I forget...iknow last year it was DD....who is CR's victom this season?

[Chief Rum]

Jim Lynch. :)

It's borderline right now, though. The Ducks are on the fringe of the playoffs, and I need them to make the playoffs to win the bet. :)

Go Ducks!

CR

[Honolulu_Blue]

Well, looks like Mr. Domi paid Mr. Barnaby back the old fashioned way...

[chrisj]

Looks like Fleury make give up his bonuses in order to remain in the NHL...

<a href=http://www.herald.ns.ca/stories/2003/12/03/fSports171.raw.html>http://www.herald.ns.ca/stories/2003/12/03/fSports171.raw.html</a>

[Maple Leafs]

Originally posted by Honolulu_Blue
Well, looks like Mr. Domi paid Mr. Barnaby back the old fashioned way... Twice. Three ass-kickings for Barnaby in two games, not bad.

P.S. Didn't Chris Simon used to be a tough guy? Since when does he go with midcard guys like Marchement while his teammates are getting smoked by Domi? Did he decide he was too good for the job after he had his 20 goal season, or did he just lose his superpowers when he cut his hair?

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by Maple Leafs
Twice. Three ass-kickings for Barnaby in two games, not bad.

P.S. Didn't Chris Simon used to be a tough guy? Since when does he go with midcard guys like Marchement while his teammates are getting smoked by Domi? Did he decide he was too good for the job after he had his 20 goal season, or did he just lose his superpowers when he cut his hair?

I think it's the latter.

Simon was one of the most feared tough guys for a short spell. He had that breakout 20 goal year in Washington when he became all the rage. Then he suffered numerous shoulder injuries. I think that hurt his physical style of play and toughness. He was critized earlier in the year for not taking on his roll as team "enforcer". Seems like that's still the case.

[bbor]

Have you seen Simon recently?

They interviewed him last night......he looks like a nancy-boy now...hair all coloured and stuff...Bring back the hockey hair Simon...you pussy:)

All hockey players should have hair like Mike Ricci :D

[Chief Rum]

Sergei back in Detroit...ETA 1 hour. Looking forward to the fans' reaction as much as H_B is.

CR

[Draft Dodger]

Originally posted by Chief Rum
Sergei back in Detroit...ETA 1 hour. Looking forward to the fans' reaction as much as H_B is.

CR

6-1 after 2. ouch.

so, what was the reaction like?

[Chief Rum]

Can you believe I got a phone call and had to turn the TV off for a minute? And wouldn't you know it was that minute where they finally did introductions? Ugh. I turned it on again and it was just over a minute into the game. :(

And then I watched the Wings take my Ducks apart. Ouch.

CR

[Sloan]

7-1 now,Federov has the Ducks goal. Federov gets booed everytime he touches the puck. :D

[Draft Dodger]

Originally posted by Sloan
7-1 now,Federov has the Ducks goal. Federov gets booed everytime he touches the puck. :D

that's too bad. similar to the Rob Blake in LA thing.

except that Detroit fans have a clue about hockey and really should know better.

[sachmo71]

Originally posted by bbor

All hockey players should have hair like Mike Ricci :D


But then they wouldn't mate, and we would have no hockey for our childrens! :eek:

bbor, when we start our EHM:FE league, I am going to trade Simon to you for a first round pick. Would you take it?

[Sloan]

He probably deserves better, but it isn't really a suprise. Hell, there were many times during his Red Wings career the fans wanted to boo him.

[sachmo71]

Originally posted by Draft Dodger


except that Detroit fans have a clue about hockey and really should know better.


*cough*
*cough*
*sputter*

[bbor]

LOL@Sach


CR....Jiggy is a shadow of himself.What is going on with him?

Does he miss Kariya or something?

[Chief Rum]

Every now and then, Jiggy has a night like this. He got blown out by Dallas last year, for instance. The guy just picks a night every now and then to implode. I saw Roy do it a few times, too (Jiggy's bad nights remind me of Roy's bad nights).

Jiggy has actually been playing very well for the past month or so after a poor start. The only time recently he has been bad is in overtime (five overtime losses? God Lord...). So I don't know what got into him. I would normally say nerves, but after last year's playoffs, I don't think nerves affect this guy. I think he just had a bad night.

I know he doesn't miss Kariya. Kariya's absence means he has a better fedensive group in front of him most of the time. Kariya was simply too small and offensive-minded to be as much of a factor as he needed to be on the defensive end (although I think for what he is, Kariya does a decent job defensively).

CR

[bbor]

Anyone besides me think that the Penguins are slowly shutting down operations and will cease to excist after this season?

May be a good bargaining chip for the owners to retract a team as they go into the cba negotiations.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Well, I am very happy with the result. 7-2. Very happy. This doesn't make up for the first round sweep, but it's a start. We must pay them back tenfold!

As for the reaction Fedorov got. Bah! It's ridiculous. It just goes to further lower my opinion of Joe Average Red Wing fan, which, to be honest, was pretty freaking low to begin with. I have never been more enraged watching a hockey then being at Joe Louis Arena or a Detroit sports bar. The things I hear from the people around me... Rage.... building.....

[sachmo71]

Uh oh...Chief is comparing Jiggy to Roy...

:D

[Karim]

Pittsburgh looks like the first team to go. I know Winnipeg people are really hoping for a team after a new CBA. There were actually quite a few Winnipeg fans in Jets gear at the Flames' game the other night.

I miss the Jets and Nordiques.

[bbor]

i would love to add another Canadian team,but i just don't see it happening.

Why is Winnipeg so big for hockey yet they could'nt support their team?

[Honolulu_Blue]

Phew, thanks to a four goal third period, I can rest easy.

Hasek. This word. You keep saying it. I do not think it means what you think it means...

Well, he still hasn't shaken off the rust, that's for certain. The groin injury didn't help, but he needs to improve. Hopefully he will.

Datsyuk has been on fire. Playing exceptionally well right now. He's got good chemistry with Hull. I remember watching him in an NHL prospect tournament many years ago. I pegged him as a potential NHL regular very quickly. Outside of Heatley and Kovalchuk he was by far the best player in the tourney. Can't say enough about Stumpy either. The guy's been just fantastic since coming aboard. Solid acquisition.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Interesting.

In one of the FOFC fantasy hockey leagues (in which my glorious team is currently in first place, mind you), I am playing what appears to be Chief Rum's squad (I assume this becuase the name of the team is something along the lines of "Stars Suk! Ducks Rule!"). At the moment, two of my players, Datsyuk and Weight are beating CR's entire team. No one else on my crappy team has a point this week. It's embarassing. Almost as embarassing as the fact that I benched Belfour in favor of Giguere. Should have known that Giguere would stink up the joint against CR's squad. BAH!

[chrisj]

Originally posted by bbor

Why is Winnipeg so big for hockey yet they could'nt support their team?

I don't really agree with that statement. When the Jets were in the NHL, they were a profitable team. Their owner just wanted to make some money and sold off the team. Ignoring their last season, their average attendance at the time was around the same as the Oilers, Canucks and Senators.

I'm not sure how big their arena was, but that may have been a limiting factor. In fact, I certainly hope it was, because as attendance has increased over the years, the Jets would be at the bottom of the barrell - even lower than Pittsburgh.

Winnipeg is now building (built?) a new arena. And there is talk that they'll go after an NHL team if the CBA improves things for smaller market cities.

[Karim]

Capacity at the new arena is a little small but it might work with a revamped CBA. But, I thought I read that the Moose already have dibs on it which would pretty much kill the Jets coming back.

[Karim]

dola,

Support for the Jets or Nordiques has never been an issue. It's the lack of an NHL-calibre arena combined with high tax rates and a local/provincial government that won't kick in any funding for a new arena. How can you compete with US locales who are offering public subsidies and no taxes for 25 years? It's ironic really, when Canada is considered "socialist".

[chrisj]

Marc-Andre Fleury will be playing Junior Hockey this month... but it will be World Junior hockey, as Pittsburgh has agreed to let Fleury play in the tournament (and who can blame them, anything to keep him under 25 games).

Now if only they could get Pierre-Marc Bouchard, Rick Nash, Patrice Bergeron among others...

[bbor]

Hey...H_B...You catch that Leafs/Wings game saturday night ?


:)

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by bbor
Hey...H_B...You catch that Leafs/Wings game saturday night ?


:)

No. For once this whole Brussels thing seemed to workout for me. :(

[sterlingice]

Ok, someone want to explain to me who Miikka Kiprusoff is since I just picked him up for my fantasy team? He's just kindof burst onto the scene, winning 6 of 7 and giving up exactly 1 goal in each of the 6 wins.

SI

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by sterlingice
Ok, someone want to explain to me who Miikka Kiprusoff is since I just picked him up for my fantasy team? He's just kindof burst onto the scene, winning 6 of 7 and giving up exactly 1 goal in each of the 6 wins.

SI

He was the backup in San Jose for a few years. He was really highly rated and expected to challenge Nabokov as starter. Last year, when Nabokov held out, Kiprusoff got his change to be #1 and flamed out. He really didn't play well at all. I think San Jose sort of gave up on him as a future #1 at that point and shipped him to Calgary.

That's my take on Kiprusoff.

[bbor]

I agree with HB.

For some reason goalies flame out in SJ after a few seasons...i wonder why that is?

They apparently haveplenty of depth in net there......they have a few guys in the minors they also project as future NHL starters.

Moose Hedberg was also a Shark before he was moved to Pittsburgh 2 yearsd ago.

[Karim]

It's quite clear here in Calgary that Sutter is grooming him to be #1. He's only 27 with Turek and McLellan quite a few years older. Jamie's contract is up at the end of the year and it's unlikely he'll be back.

He's been "flashy" good because he's given up too many rebounds. Mikka gets the stats but our defense is where the credit should be given. That, and Shean Donovan.

[bbor]

Washington fires Cassidy this morning.Glen Hanlon takes over for him

Leafs 8 game win streak ends last night as they lose to the Bluenotes in OT


Wow...are the Wings eating humble pie or what?Having to recall Joseph because of injuries to both Hasek and Legace...OUCH!

Do you think they would have resigned Hasek if they knew it would cause THIS much trouble? I mean obviously they knew it would cause some unrest,But i think it is becoming a major distraction now.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by bbor
Washington fires Cassidy this morning.Glen Hanlon takes over for him

Leafs 8 game win streak ends last night as they lose to the Bluenotes in OT


Wow...are the Wings eating humble pie or what?Having to recall Joseph because of injuries to both Hasek and Legace...OUCH!

Do you think they would have resigned Hasek if they knew it would cause THIS much trouble? I mean obviously they knew it would cause some unrest,But i think it is becoming a major distraction now.

I am sure Hanlon is only an interim coach, but good for old "Fly." He and Greg Stefan were the Wings' goalies when I first started watching hockey seriously. Will always have a special place in my heart.

One game back in 1987 or 1988 Hanlon took a shot right to the nuts. A full on slapper. He went down and, understandbly, didn't get up for a long, long time. The shot basically shattered his cup. From that moment on we often referred to old family jewels as "The Hanlons." I am sure he'd be honored to know that.

Humble pie? It's not humble pie we're eating it's injury cake or injury crackers or something like that. Fer fook's sake, man. Hatcher, McCarty, Hasek, Legace, Chelios, Thomas, Zetterberg, Yzerman, Whitney. Probably one or two I am missing. All of them, out. It's ridiculous.

Hasek certianly hasn't been the Hasek of old. That being said, he's been injured for most of the season. One of those chronic goalie injuries. It hasn't helped his performance. There was no real option for the Wings. It would have been insane to let Hasek walk and sign for anyone he'd like (see: THE FORCES OF DARKNESS(tm)).

[Chief Rum]

Originally posted by Honolulu_Blue
Humble pie? It's not humble pie we're eating it's injury cake or injury crackers or something like that. Fer fook's sake, man. Hatcher, McCarty, Hasek, Legace, Chelios, Thomas, Zetterberg, Yzerman, Whitney. Probably one or two I am missing. All of them, out. It's ridiculous.

Hasek certianly hasn't been the Hasek of old. That being said, he's been injured for most of the season. One of those chronic goalie injuries. It hasn't helped his performance. There was no real option for the Wings. It would have been insane to let Hasek walk and sign for anyone he'd like (see: THE FORCES OF DARKNESS(tm)).

The understanding NHL fan in me thinks you have a point about all those injuries.

But the realist in me notes that almost all of those guys are pretty damn old (Zetterberg excepting), so you get what you pay for. Maybe it's about time the Wings realized there is a downside to throwing money at older stars.

CR

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by Chief Rum
The understanding NHL fan in me thinks you have a point about all those injuries.

But the realist in me notes that almost all of those guys are pretty damn old (Zetterberg excepting), so you get what you pay for. Maybe it's about time the Wings realized there is a downside to throwing money at older stars.

CR

Well, less than half of those listed can really be considered "old:" Chelios, Yzerman, Hasek, and Thomas. Then again a Wings' fan perception of "old" for a NHLer is likely drastically different than your typical NHL fan.

That being said, the old, aged Wings have held up pretty well the last few years. Yzerman's knee troubles (and Chelios as well) aside. The other elder statesmen have been surprisingly healthy.

And, by the way, the upside of "throwing money at older stars" is worth it... Trust me. ;)

[bbor]

Old to a Leaf fan means 45 :D

35 is still a prospect:)

[sterlingice]

Since this had made it to page 2 I figured it would be nice to say something about the Hawks-Wings game tonight. But the way the Hawks have been playing lately, I can't do a damn thing.

SI

[klayman]

Did anybody hear about Kevin Lowe asking Comrie to pony up $2.5 million in order to be traded?

Personally, I think it's a great idea by Lowe. Comrie should pay back most of his salary from last year (including bonuses) since he took the last half of the year and the playoffs off. But then I'm a mean spirited bastard.

And what about the reports about Cujo going to Bruins that claim the Wings will take him back at the end of the season, free of charge? That seems like a pretty good deal for the Bruins.

[Chief Rum]

If Comrie wasn't playing, the Oilers shouldn't have been sending him checks, IMO. The bonuses I can understand returning a portion of, although it should be noted that the reason bonuses are given is as an incentive to sign the contract, which Comrie did. The only reason I think the bonuses could be touched is because they were an inducement to a contract Comrie partly didn't honor.

I understand Lowe's position, because this was a crappy situation for the Oilers, but he also was rather double-handed on this one. He worked out a deal with the Ducks, and then allowed them to negotiate a contract with Comrie. It was all settled and ready to go. Not once over the past several months or since Cmorie began his holdout has he mentioned pulling this last second card. And, now, after it's all set, he does this? That's just B.S.

CR

[klayman]

Unfortunately, the NHLPA takes a rather dim view of not paying your players, no matter how crappy they play. And just to clarify, Comrie was on the roster during the last half of the season and the playoffs, but he was busy practicing his magic act (he's got the disappearing act down pat). But it's not about paying back his salary. There is no justification for asking a player to pay back anything he earned from the previous year, and that's not what Lowe is asking for (that's just what I am asking for). The reason Lowe wants the money is the trade only nets the Oilers a prospect and a draft pick, yet he needs something right now, and that 2.5 will go toward bringing another center in. Because Comrie refuses to be reasonable (and he pulled this same shit when he came out of juniors), he's left the Oilers in a horrible situation.

As far as the deal goes, the trade isn't final until both parties agree with it. Lowe has every right to add stipulations to the trade until it is finalized (meaning until he agrees to the trade). It sucks for the Ducks but this happens all the time in the NHL with teams pulling out or changing the deal at the last minute. At least he didn't trade him to two teams at the same time.

Nobody wants to see him go as much as I do and that should tell you what kind of player he is.

[Chief Rum]

I don't know enough about Comrie to say what kind of person he is, although he is going to find the Ducks to be a pretty tight group, and if he comes in with an attitude, he's going to get put in his place pretty quick.

How much was he supposed to make up until now (from September to now)? If it was $2.5 M, then I can understand the stipulation at least.

I still don't think Comrie should have been getting checks, and screw the NHLPA if they think otherwise. You don't play, the team doesn't pay. Breach of contract. That's the way it should be. If the NHLPA somehow finagled this into being legal, then the NHL execs are dumb as shit. Of course, for that same reason, the Oilers don't have any right to get that money back, because they offered that contract under those rules and accepted the risks of Comrie holding out.

As for the stipulations of the trade, there's a difference between the technicals here and the way one goes about things. The Oilers and Ducks had a deal in place, agreed to, to the point that the Ducks actually worked out a contract settlement with Comrie. You don't get to do that unless a trade in principle has been agreed to. Lowe basically shook Murray's hand and said, "He is yours, soon as you work out a deal with him."

Then when the deal was done, and everyone came back to Lowe to sign the official deal, and he drops this? Sure, the paper isn't signed, but that is just plain lowball. Had Lowe mentioned something like this before, so that all parties were aware he would want some compensation in this form, and they went into the deal fully expecting that, well, that is one thing. But he didn't even mention it. No one knew a thing about this until the deal was about to become official.

Neither Comrie nor the Ducks are responsible for finding the Oilers a replacement center. If the Oilers want a center, then they need to find someone who will give them a center for Comrie. Or get a center on their own, above and beyond any deal involving Comrie. Apparently, the Ducks' offer is the best they can get. And if Lowe keeps it up, pretty soon he won't have the Ducks' deal in place anymore, and the Oilers will continue to pay a player a lot of money while he sits on his ass and does a whole lot of nothing.

CR

[Chief Rum]

dola,

BTW, I'm not trying to be unsympathtetic to the Oilers' plight. I think this whole thing sucks for them. I don't like holdouts. IMO, you sign a contract, you play it out.

But then we also know that the NHL gives a player's rights to that team all the way until he's 31, and that's a heck of a long time to not have any leverage. I am more on the Oilers side than Comrie's in the holdout, but I can at least understand Comrie's side of it.

CR

[Draft Dodger]

Originally posted by Chief Rum
How much was he supposed to make up until now (from September to now)? If it was $2.5 M, then I can understand the stipulation at least.

it's my understanding that Comrie was due to make ZERO between september and now. Comrie does not have a contract.

he is not Yashin. he is not refusing to honor an existing contract, he has not been able to agree on a dollar amount with the Oilers, and so remains unsigned.

not directing this at anyone at all, but I get tired of these "holdouts" getting blasted, with the suggestion that they are somehow neglecting their contractual obligations.

[Chief Rum]

Thank you, DD. Well, then that turns me pretty much completely against Lowe on this one. His one "sympathy card" from me just went out the window.

That's just complete BS. Bad form, Kevin Lowe. That's Lowe-ball.

CR

[klayman]

Sorry Chief. All the reports I have read have said nothing of a done deal. All they say is that Lowe and Murray worked out which players would be involved, and the Ducks were able to negotiate a contract with Comrie, which they would have wanted to do before any trade was finalized anyway. If you've seen different, than I'll agree that it's low of Lowe to do, but it is still in his rights as a GM to do that. But I've seen nothing that said Lowe said the deal was done and final.

And you are right, it's not the Ducks or Comrie's responsibility to find a replacement player. It's Lowe's. And I do believe that's what he is doing. Since he can't find the right offer, he is making the best of the situation.

As for blasting 'holdouts', I will say that I am almost always on the teams side (even though it wasn't directed at me ;)). Especially small market teams in Canada, where every sub-mediocre talent thinks he can hold the team hostage since they can't afford to pay for real stars. Comrie grew up in Edmonton. He knew the financial situation of the team before he signed. He could have gone back into the draft, since he's so concerned about money now. However, he signed a pretty good contract, and the Oilers own his rights. Fair or unfair, that's the reality. And since he doesn't want to play here, too f$%#ing bad for him. He doesn't like the $2.5 million price tag? He doesn't have to play for the Ducks this year then...in fact he doesn't have to play anywhere for all I care. It's his choice, the Oilers offered their deal and he refused. The Oilers followed the rules regarding his contract, why should they be punished cause some spoiled rich kid wants a bigger piece than he is entitled to? Had Comrie shown just a tiny bit of interest in playing hockey last year, maybe the Oilers would have offered more money, or maybe they wouldn't find it so difficult to deal him right now. Instead he didn't, and his value has dropped so low it is more profitable for the Oilers to hold on to him. He made his own bed, he'll get no sympathy from me.

[sachmo71]

Here is something interesting that I saw in The Hockey News...

Florida has 11 first rounders on their roster right now.

Nathan Horton: 3rd overall by Florida in 2003
Jay Bouwmeester: 3rd overall by Florida in 2002
Olli Jokinen: 3rd overall by LA in 1997
Stephen Weiss: 4th overall by Florida in 2001
Roberto Luongo: 4th overall by Islanders in 1997
Viktor Kozlov: 6th overall by San Jose in 1993
Branislav Mezei: 10th overall by Islanders in 1999
Vaclav Nedorost: 14th overall by Colorado in 2000
Marcus Nilson: 20th overall by Florida in 1996
Mathieu Biron: 21st overall by Los Angeles in 1998
Mike Van Ryan: 26th overall by New Jersey in 1998

Crazy, no?

[bbor]

Lowe asking Comrie to pay 2.5 mil to make this trade happen is just f'n crazy.Lowe is out of his freakin tree,and this will NOT help during CBA negotiations.

[Chief Rum]

klayman,

The Canadian Football Guy (FOFC poster) posted up a poll earlier today that had a Sporting News story on this. I don't know where he got it, but I assume it was the Sporting News web site. Anyway, the deal seems confiremd in the article, as well as the fact the Ducks have an agreement with Comrie. I don't know if the Ducks can even talk to Comrie without Edmonton's permission (isn't that tampering?), so the Oilers must have had some assurance they were doing a deal with the Ducks, if they allowed them to talk to Comrie and his agent to work out a deal.

There was also a long article about the situation in the OC Register, the local paper that covers the Ducks. I'll see if I can find it online in a second.

Here was Canadian Football Guy's copied text:

10/2003

EDMONTON (CP) - Mike Comrie's agent had a contract agreement with the Anaheim Mighty Ducks to conclude a trade from the Oilers but everything is on hold.

"We had a done deal with the Ducks," Rich Winter told the Edmonton Sun on Tuesday. "We'd concluded an agreement."

But Edmonton GM Kevin Lowe introduced a financial component as a condition of completing a trade that would have seen the Oilers get top prospect Corey Perry of the OHL's London Knights and a first-round draft pick.

In effect, Comrie was being asked to pay his own way out of Edmonton.

"I'm not going to comment on that," Lowe replied when asked if he'd sought a cash payment from Comrie as part of the trade. "I'm trying to get a deal that will address the Oilers' needs of the future and present needs."

Winter declined comment on a rumour that the Oilers were asking for as much as $2.5 million. But he did verify that a financial component had entered the equation.

Trades are difficult and circumstances change along the way, said Lowe.

Comrie, 23, earned $5 million in bonuses over the term of a three-year contract. He became a restricted free agent last July 1. He was locked out of the start of training camp Sept. 12 because he didn't have a contract.

He had 20 goals and 31 assists in 69 games last season. He scored 33 goals the previous year.

Perry is a six-foot-two, 185-pound right-winger who was drafted 28th overall by Anaheim in 2003.

The Register site asked me to register (starngely enough :) ), so I don't know if I can link straight to the OC Register article. So I will just post the article in its entirety here.

Deal for Comrie hits new Lowe

The Oilers GM wants the center to pay back some salary before going to the Ducks.

By Dan Wood


ANAHEIM – Just when the Mighty Ducks thought they had erstwhile Edmonton Oilers center Mike Comrie signed and sealed, they learned that Edmonton general manager Kevin Lowe was not prepared to deliver.

"We've agreed to the terms of a trade," Ducks general manager Bryan Murray said Wednesday. "We've agreed to the terms of a contract (with Comrie). Now it's between the Oilers and Comrie to get their differences settled."

Edmonton, which paid Comrie approximately $8 million in salary and bonuses during his 21/2 seasons with the Oilers, wants a large chunk of that money, apparently $2.535 million, back now that Comrie wants out of Edmonton.

"Because the Oilers can't set fair market value for Mike Comrie at this time, and because Mike is pushing us to make a deal, we're asking for him to top up this deal," Lowe told the Edmonton Journal. "If he doesn't want to do that, we'll wait."

Indications are that Comrie has no interest in giving in to Lowe's apparently unprecedented desire for a player to buy his way into a trade.

"I'm very shocked," Comrie told the Edmonton Journal. "I've never heard of something like this. There was no mention of this from September until now. I've heard of things happening at the 11th hour to hold up deals. This is beyond that. It's like the 13th hour. It's frustrating and very disappointing. Hopefully, we'll get through this like professionals."

While the Oilers might be willing to hold off on trading Comrie, the Ducks won't wait indefinitely.

"I haven't put a time line on it, but it certainly can't go on much longer," Murray said. "What happens all the time in our business is trade opportunities are out there if you want to pursue them. I've been kind of holding off on anything else because I knew I had a chance to do this deal."

Murray was unaware that Lowe wanted a kickback from Comrie until after the teams had agreed to the trade, and the Ducks had worked out terms of a multiyear contract with Comrie.

Murray and Lowe had discussed a potential Comrie trade for more than a month. The Ducks balked at Edmonton's initial request for rookie right wing Joffrey Lupul, as well as a later Oilers bid for left wing Andy McDonald, before the sides agreed last weekend on a deal that would involve no one from the current Ducks roster.

Right wing Corey Perry, the Ducks' second top-round selection in this year's NHL entry draft who is currently playing for London of the Ontario junior league, and a first-round pick next year appear headed Edmonton's way if the Oilers are able to resolve finances with Comrie.

A two-year University of Michigan standout who left college in 2000 to play junior hockey with Kootenay of the Western league, Comrie had 61 goals and 133 points in 192 games after signing a free-agent contract with Edmonton midway through the 2000-01 season.

Comrie, 23, nixed a $1.1275 million qualifying offer from the Oilers, his hometown team, last summer.

CR

[sterlingice]

All I have to say is "WOO!"

SI

[klayman]

Well it certainly sounds like Lowe was in the wrong then, from those articles. I'll still contend that it's his right to do that and at no point did he finalize the trade and then back out it. He should have been a little more forthcoming with the Ducks, however.

Originally posted by Chief Rum
I don't know if the Ducks can even talk to Comrie without Edmonton's permission (isn't that tampering?), so the Oilers must have had some assurance they were doing a deal with the Ducks, if they allowed them to talk to Comrie and his agent to work out a deal.


A contract negotiation does not mean a finalized trade. The Ducks wouldn't agree to any trade for Comrie's rights unless they knew they would be able to sign him. So allowing the Ducks to negotiate with Comrie is just good faith on the Oilers part. Just because the Ducks and Comrie worked out a deal, doesn't mean the Oilers couldn't turn around and ship him off somewhere else at the last minute. You could argue about the ethics of such a stunt, but as far as I know there is nothing in the league charter to prevent it.

[Fidatelo]

Originally posted by Karim
dola,

Support for the Jets or Nordiques has never been an issue. It's the lack of an NHL-calibre arena combined with high tax rates and a local/provincial government that won't kick in any funding for a new arena. How can you compete with US locales who are offering public subsidies and no taxes for 25 years? It's ironic really, when Canada is considered "socialist".

As a Winnipegger I feel this isn't 100% true. Although the Jets didn't have terrible attendance, we didn't sell the place out every night or anything. Furthermore, with NHL ticket prices the way they are now (more than double what they were when we still had the Jets) I don't see any way a new NHL team could succeed here. Winnipeggers love hockey, but we are also notoriously cheap. Trying to sell seats at $50 a pop to sit in the nosebleeds isn't gonna cut it here. I can't speak to the levels of corporate sponsorship however, which I understand is a large factor in the success of a team in todays NHL.

The only way I feel a team would work in Winnipeg is if the new CBA placed a fairly low cap on salaries, such that ticket prices could fall to more reasonable levels. Interest in the new team plus the cool new downtown arena we are building would fill the house for a couple years regardless, but for longterm success a family of 4 needs to be able to go to the game for somewhere not much higher than $100. It also wouldn't hurt if the new team made it past the first round of the playoffs more than once every 20 years :D

[bbor]

Toobad a good guy gets the can tied to him.Paul Maurice let go by the Canes.Obviously he had to be let go...cause the team is doing shit....But...to replace him with Laviolette?Why?....i don;t see what that accomplishes?

BTW...Maurice is supposed to be one of the uber nice guys in the NHL,expect him to get another coaching job real fast.While i'mon that topic...Laviolette is upposed to be one of the all time Assholes.Maybe that's why they made the change.

Maybe Rutherford should figure out why he has a tender in the ECHL making over 2 mil a season(Irbe),Perhaps THAT's what's wrong in Carolina.

[bbor]

DOLA.

R.I.P Keith Magnusson...killed in a car crash yesterday in Toronto.The car was driven by former NHL'er Rob Ramage.Ramage has been charged with impared driving causing death.They were coming back from a funeral for a former collegue.

Another sad day for the NHL.:(

[Draft Dodger]

damn

[klayman]

Wow. What's wrong with the Flames lately?

[Karim]

In Sutter We Trust.

[Maple Leafs]

A quick Christmas carol for everyone:
http://www.gravylegs.com/cartoons/santadomi4.html

[sachmo71]

Santa,

Please let the Stars last three games be an indicator for a turn around. Thanks.

Sachmo

[Karim]

The Iginla rumours are rampant these days in Calgary. Everyone knows that he needs to be qualified at $7 million before July 1st, 2004 in order for the team to retain his rights. The options:

1) qualify him @ $7 million
2) trade him at the trade deadline
3) let him be an UFA and try and resign him post-CBA
4) let him be an UFA and use the $7 million elsewhere
5) work on renegotiating a long-term deal (around $25 million/5 years is the number that keep popping up)

The vultures have been flying from other teams. Frankly #5 is what the team should be trying to do. Unfortunately, I highly doubt that Don Meehan will be amenable to restructuring the deal. Iginla has held out before on Meehan's advice (it was only a short while during training camp so people might forget that).

I might be of a minority opinion in Calgary but I think losing him would be devastating, even more so that any of Gilmour, MacInnis, Nieuwendyk, Roberts, Fleury. Iginla IS the franchise, and for whatever reason, one of the most popular players to ever play here. I have heard people refer to him as "our Steve Yzerman" with the hope he remains here his entire career.

$7 million is a lot of money for a small-market team but I think losing him would cost the organization even more. Cancelled season tickets, less game-day walk up, less merchandising (the only new jerseys I see anyone wear are with #12), and generally less notoriety around the league translating to less interest in showing the team on TV. Yes, we're on a roll but the fans still want to see #12. We could be winning without him but the team loses any drawing card without him.

Unless the offer is outstanding, I wouldn't be trading him either. The best I've heard is something like Gagne/Handzus/Comrie, Williams and Vandermeer from Philly for Iginla and Conroy/Gauthier. Frankly, no trade will satisfy me and I think the Flames should shock the NHL and pony up the $7 million if they can't renegotiate. I'd offer a base salary of $25 million/5 years with HUGE team and personal bonuses that would make up or exceed the difference.

Fleury left on bad terms; I'd hate to see Iginla do the same.

[bbor]

Can't see them letting Iggy go.CBA will help the Flames for sure,or else you will see some teams like the Fames fold.

BTW..Sutter has got those boys playing their asses off.Where is Turek gonna go when he gets back?h

[klayman]

Originally posted by bbor
Where is Turek gonna go when he gets back?h

Another team...

[bbor]

St.Johns?

:D

[bbor]

Dola or is it St.john

I always get those 2 mixed up:)

[klayman]

It was Saint John, but I think they folded that team and are operating without an AHL farm team. Besides, I don't think Turek would clear waivers anyway. I hear the Flyers are really interested in him, why I don't know.

[Karim]

Yeah, we're sharing an affiliate with Carolina - the Lowell Lock Monsters.

Turek will get his playing time when he comes back and odds are McLellan is the odd man out.

[klayman]

I would think that they would unload Turek's salary to support the Keep Iggy Fund, especially since the way they've played during the last month. Of course, they might wait and see if Kiprusoff comes down to earth, but I think they will bite on the first half decent offer that comes in for Turek.

[Chief Rum]

I thought I would talk a little about last night's Avs-Ducks game. It was one us Ducks fans had had circled on our calendars for months. Considering that was the first time Kariya was supposed to come back to Anaheim.

Of course, the bastard has got himself hurt and hasn't been playing hardly at all this season, so we didn't get to see him. We did get to see the first performance by Jiggy this year that was reminescent of last year's playoffs and his first shut out. He saved 38 shots and was fantastic. He also had to deal with a razor-thin edge because Aebischer was also fantastic. If it wasn't for a fantastic give-and-go between Federov and Sykora after a lengthy power play from a major that included numerous Ducks' shots and a one-minute-plus stint of 5-on-3 hockey, I'm not sure we would have even gotten that, and this one would have gone down to a 0-0 tie.

The reason for this post, though, isn't to talk about that so much as to talk about the fans' reaction to Selanne, who was an integral part of Kariya moving to Colorado. Two or three weeks ago, the Ducks played the Wings in Detroit, and big Wings fan Honolulu Blue talked about being disappointed in the Wings fans booing Federov every chance they got. I have to say I feel the same about the heartless fans last night.

They booed Selanne mercilessly. I was disgusted. It disheartens me that I am int he same fan group as the people who attended last night's game. I think booing Paul would have been justified--not only was the whole affair of his signing with Colorado rather sneaky, but the guy promised to bring a Cup to Anaheim--as a Duck. Selanne, though, left the Ducks almost three years ago by another's decision--he was dealt to San Jose. He made no promises to Ducks fans this past offseason, and was free to go wherever he chose. I don't like that he ended up in Colorado, but that's his decision to make and I am fine with that.

It troubles me that these fans would not remember what that guy meant to this team. He has been a fan's true dream. The guy is always smiling and joking around. He loves Orange County (and yes, the fans), and still has a place out here. He has always gone out of his way to do charity work and to sign autographs and be the ultimate hockey promoter. I met him once at an autograph signing, and the reason I met him was because he ignored a team official pleading with him to leave and go to the team bus at the end of a fan event, and instead continued signing autographs for a long line of fans, well after he was obligated to do so.

There were a lot of classless Ducks fans in that arena last night, and I am ashamed to be in some way related to them. :(

To me, Selanne represents everything that si right about hockey. Hopefully, they will eventually come to see that.

Chief Rum

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by Chief Rum


There were a lot of classless Ducks fans in that arena last night, and I am ashamed to be in some way related to them. :(

To me, Selanne represents everything that si right about hockey. Hopefully, they will eventually come to see that.

Chief Rum

They never will.

[sterlingice]

Originally posted by Chief Rum
They booed Selanne mercilessly. I was disgusted. It disheartens me that I am int he same fan group as the people who attended last night's game. I think booing Paul would have been justified--not only was the whole affair of his signing with Colorado rather sneaky, but the guy promised to bring a Cup to Anaheim--as a Duck. Selanne, though, left the Ducks almost three years ago by another's decision--he was dealt to San Jose. He made no promises to Ducks fans this past offseason, and was free to go wherever he chose. I don't like that he ended up in Colorado, but that's his decision to make and I am fine with that.

This always bugs me as well. I've never understood why you boo someone who was traded away from your team unless they were publicly criticizing them or yelling to be traded. It's out of their hands if the owner/GM decide to do something like that and it really gets me when fans hold that against a player.

SI

[Karim]

On a completely unrelated note...

I was listening to a hockey show up here and someone brought up the fact that Gretsky once commented that the sweetest hands he had ever seen belonged to the Magic Man, Kent Nilsson. Apparently, Nilsson could, from the opposing blue line, hit a pop can resting on the cross bar. HNIC got a wind of this and wanted to get it on TV show the camera crew showed up and he did it on his first take.

686 points in 553 games, and still holds Flames' records in most assists and points in one season. Everyone I've ever heard speak of him always comment that he had as much talent as Wayne but very little heart and only played when he wanted to.

[Honolulu_Blue]

I finally go to see my first live NHL game in just under two years tonight. Got some tickets to the Wings/Blues game. A decent game, nothing too thrilling, but good to see the Wings pull it out. It must be said that St. Louis was without some big guns (e.g., Tkachuk).

I keep reading about Datsyuk. Leading the league in points. Completely on fire. Playing perhaps the best hockey in the league at the moment. I haven't been able to confirm it until now, but the kid is playing out of his mind. He got a goal and assist tonight (Wings won 2-1). His goal was unassisted and he basically created the second goal all on his own. He looks incredibly composed and does amazing, amazing things with the puck. It's a sight to see. I can't say I am all that surprised. I saw him at a prospect tournament back in 2000. While watching the tournament it was clear that Datsyuk was one of three best players in the tournament. The other two being Heatley and Kovalchuk. He was that good. Good to see him develop and really become one of league's brightest young stars.

[Draft Dodger]

Originally posted by sterlingice
This always bugs me as well. I've never understood why you boo someone who was traded away from your team unless they were publicly criticizing them or yelling to be traded. It's out of their hands if the owner/GM decide to do something like that and it really gets me when fans hold that against a player.

SI

I hate to see this too - really a turnoff to me to watch a Kings/Avs game and see Rob Blake get bood mercilessly everytime he touches the puck, all because he was TRADED after he and the Kings couldn't work out an extension agreement.

[Draft Dodger]

Originally posted by Honolulu_Blue
I finally go to see my first live NHL game in just under two years tonight. Got some tickets to the Wings/Blues game. A decent game, nothing too thrilling, but good to see the Wings pull it out. It must be said that St. Louis was without some big guns (e.g., Tkachuk).


kind of a long drive from Belgium, isn't it?

[bbor]

Originally posted by Draft Dodger
kind of a long drive from Belgium, isn't it?

He took the subway...got there in no time...no traffic ya know :D

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by bbor
He took the subway...got there in no time...no traffic ya know :D

That trans-Atlantic subway is great. Brussels is one of the first stops in Europe so you're basically guaranteed a seat. So long as you have a good book, time flies right on by.

[bbor]

How old is the paper by the time you finish it? :D

[sterlingice]

Time to bump because the world demanded it.

SI

[Karim]

Congratulations to the US World Junior Team on winning the silver medal. ;)

[bbor]

Originally posted by Karim
Congratulations to the US World Junior Team on winning the silver medal. ;)

ROTF!!!

Great competition so far...i hope the finals live up to the rest of the tourny.

[Honolulu_Blue]

The Wings beat the Ducks. Fedorov appeared to be a non-factor, but that was based only on a reading of the box score. I am still not 100% convinced that this Red Wings team has what it takes to win it all. I still don't know what to make of the goaltending. Legace and CuJo have played well, but neither instill great confidence come April. As for Hasek, who the hell knows. He hasn't been healthy in the NHL since 2002.

[klayman]

Originally posted by Honolulu_Blue
The Wings beat the Ducks. Fedorov appeared to be a non-factor, but that was based only on a reading of the box score. I am still not 100% convinced that this Red Wings team has what it takes to win it all. I still don't know what to make of the goaltending. Legace and CuJo have played well, but neither instill great confidence come April. As for Hasek, who the hell knows. He hasn't been healthy in the NHL since 2002.

This all sounds good to my ears :D

[Karim]

I should probably eat crow but no one in the US knows they've won gold. ;)

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by Karim
I should probably eat crow but no one in the US knows they've won gold. ;)

Though "technically" not in the U.S. at the moment, I know. :D A good win for the U.S. who went unbeaten in the tourney. Sad to see it come on a total fluke goal, but what can you do?

The Vice President of the tournament said it was like the 1980 "Miracle On Ice." Well, yes it was a big and somewhat surprising win for the U.S., but that's going a wee bit overboard, methinks. It's not like the Miracle on Ice for many, many, many reasons. 1) Karim's right. No one knows about it. 2) This wasn't a bunch of college kids against a bunch of world-class veterans. This was a bunch of kids versus a bunch of kids. 3) The Canadian junior team, while good, isn't anything close to the Soviet Machine of that era. How many Olympic gold medals had they won in say, the 20 year span between 1960 and 1980? Hell if I know, but a lot. 4) It was at the height of the Cold War. A battle between opposing nations. This was a battle between America and it's 51st state.

Anyway. U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A! :D

[chrisj]

I don't think it was surprising at all, Team USA was one of the favourites heading into the tournament. I have to admit, I knew little about the American team before the tournament, but Zach Parise was amazing. He should have a very bright future (and now that I think about it, with him and Petr Vrana... the Devils had an amazing draft).

One thing that still confuses me is why Canada didn't play Crosby more in the gold medal game (and the tournament in general). He was barely given a chance. Yes, he's the youngest player on the team, but he's also one of the best.

[bbor]

I concor..The US was the favorite going into this tourny,So saying it was a miricle on ice is a huge strech...but it may have the same impact that the miricle on ice had...which is perhaps more kids will be interested in playing hockey instead of other games.

The "hothouse" program the US has set up in Michigan has been a huge success if they can keep producing kids like this.

[Cards4ever]

Originally posted by bbor

The "hothouse" program the US has set up in Michigan has been a huge success if they can keep producing kids like this.

I watched the Canadian feed of the game yesterday on my Center Ice package. USNTDP is valuable, but, Parise, Murray and Stafford never had anything to do with it, they all came out of Shattuck-St Mary's which Crosby played at last year. Murray played his senior year of HS hockey with Salmon Arm in the BCHL. What has changed in US hockey the last 10 years or so is the mindset of HS hockey players going to the USHL or leagues similar to this to get more games in before they go to college hockey. Minnesota HS hockey, which is the crown jewel of HS hockey in the US has had to establish a fall "Elite League" to keep players from fleeing to Ann Arbor or to the USHL.

I'm sure that most don't know about the gold, most US hockey people are into the NHL only, here in Minnesota though, we have paid attention to the tournament, so a gold isn't so shocking, we knew that the team was favored. We see it as a victory for College Hockey. Maybe more kids will see that our college programs can be just as good of a springboard to NHL careers as Major Junior hockey.

[Blade6119]

Originally posted by Honolulu_Blue
I keep reading about Datsyuk. Leading the league in points. Completely on fire. Playing perhaps the best hockey in the league at the moment. I haven't been able to confirm it until now, but the kid is playing out of his mind. He got a goal and assist tonight (Wings won 2-1). His goal was unassisted and he basically created the second goal all on his own. He looks incredibly composed and does amazing, amazing things with the puck. It's a sight to see. I can't say I am all that surprised. I saw him at a prospect tournament back in 2000. While watching the tournament it was clear that Datsyuk was one of three best players in the tournament. The other two being Heatley and Kovalchuk. He was that good. Good to see him develop and really become one of league's brightest young stars.

And to think that i drafted this guy into my FOFC fantasy hockey team and dropped him after poor performance the first couple games...what a dumb ass move that was...

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally posted by Blade6119
And to think that i drafted this guy into my FOFC fantasy hockey team and dropped him after poor performance the first couple games...what a dumb ass move that was...

Hmmm... Dunno which FOFC league you're in or I'm in, but I picked Datsyuk on waivers shortly after the season began. If we're in the same league, thanks for cuttin' him, my man. :)

[Draft Dodger]

bumping this back - this is the 4th longest thread at the FOFC. 3rd is in site. (Call it the Ron Francis thread?)

Next week we are going to Rochester NY for a wedding. We'd been planning to go a day early to give us time to drive. Well, my wife revealed tonight that she has tickets for the Bruins/Sabres game next Thursday. We're actually going to Buffalo that day, staying over, then zipping over to Rochester the next day.

Looking forward to it - the seats seem pretty good. Any tips on parking or other things I should know about Buffalo?

[NoSkillz]

originally posted by Draft Dodger
Looking forward to it - the seats seem pretty good. Any tips on parking or other things I should know about Buffalo?
Hey DD,

I just got back from the Sabres/Senators game tonight (my Sabres just ended their 11 game unbeaten streak!). There's great parking just off the Elm Street exit at Seneca Street, right across the road from Dunn Tire Park (where the Bisons play). It's a short walk to the HSBC Arena from there. I suggest parking a bit away from the building if you want to get out of there without the traffic and still see the end of the game and it's only $5.00. If you're not concerned about that, there's parking right beside the arena for a reasonable fee (about $10.00).

Lots of great places to eat around the HSBC. A favourite spot is Pettybones Bar and Grille, which is on the second floor of Dunn Tire Park (great chicken wings).

Any other questions, just ask away. Enjoy the game!

[bbor]

HSBC is a great place to watch the game....saw the Pens with Jagr play there a few years ago....btw..Rob Ray can't skate to save his life...you can't notice it on tv...but up close he skates like a 10 yerar old.

hrm...maybe thats wht he no longer plays :)

[Karim]

7 million people watched the Gold Medal Game in Canada. Considering it was the first work day of the new year, that's pretty impressive.

[Draft Dodger]

HSBC is a great place to watch the game....saw the Pens with Jagr play there a few years ago....btw..Rob Ray can't skate to save his life...you can't notice it on tv...but up close he skates like a 10 yerar old.


ditto Peter Worrell.

and thanks, Noskillz - that info is very helpful

[chrisj]

7 million people watched the Gold Medal Game in Canada. Considering it was the first work day of the new year, that's pretty impressive.


Not sure where you got that info from... but only 1.31 million watched. Last years game was watched by 3.45 million.

[Karim]

Not sure where you got that info from... but only 1.31 million watched. Last years game was watched by 3.45 million.
Local sports radio reported that but it wouldn't be the first time they've been wrong... They probably recanted later in the day like they usually do.

[bbor]

What the hell is wrong with Mike Modano???

[Draft Dodger]

Not sure where you got that info from... but only 1.31 million watched. Last years game was watched by 3.45 million.

maybe that didn't take into account the exchange rate?

[Honolulu_Blue]

What the hell is wrong with Mike Modano???

The burden of leadership is just too great for the young man...

[sachmo71]

The Stars are not going to make the playoffs.

[Draft Dodger]

The Stars are not going to make the playoffs.

Not sure I'd go that far yet. They certainly have played crappily (the only teams who have scored less goals is Columbus, Pittsburgh and Carolina), and they certainly aren't the elite team people have been saying they are for the last two years. But they still are a good team, and could definitely pull it all together in the second half - way too many guys underperforming on this team right now not to.

Speaking of "what the hell happened to"...Pierre Turgeon? This guy has cracked 80 points 8 times in his career...currently on pace to maybe hit 25.

[sachmo71]

Turgeon is misused in Dallas. He can't get the ice time he needs to get going, hence he's always stuck in low gear. Shame really, since we pay him 8 million dollars a year.

On paper, the Stars are an elite. Guerin, Arnott, Modano, Zubov, Turco, et all. In reality, they are just names. Sort of the New York Rangers for the Southwest.

[Draft Dodger]

Turgeon is misused in Dallas. He can't get the ice time he needs to get going, hence he's always stuck in low gear. Shame really, since we pay him 8 million dollars a year.

On paper, the Stars are an elite. Guerin, Arnott, Modano, Zubov, Turco, et all. In reality, they are just names. Sort of the New York Rangers for the Southwest.

I would take Dallas ANY day over the StRangers.

[klayman]

The Stars are not going to make the playoffs.
Seems only fitting since the Oilers aren't going to make the playoffs for sure. :p

[Draft Dodger]

well, my wife and I are back from our Buffalo/Rochester trip. The Sabres/Bruins game we went to wasn't much of a game...but I'll give my observations anyways.

Buffalo seemed to be a nice little city, at least the downtown part where we were. We weren't all that far from HSBC, but, as it was -22 fucking degrees, we drove down and parked at the lot NoSkillz recommended (completely by accident). I can't get over paying only $5 to park - it's $20 in Boston. To see our AHL games it's freaking $10.

Nice arena - I really liked the look of the place. Our seats were pretty good - the last row of the lower bowl, behind one of the nets. One thing though - the seats were REALLY crammed together. I know I had a small man, but I'm not freaking Louie Anderson - even just standing for the anthem, I couldn't stand straight without seriously getting in the way of the guy next to me (who looked like he weighed 120 lbs). We ended up sitting pretty much right in front of where Danny Gare and Rob Ray did their intermission broadcast stuff. I thought about challenging Ray to a fight...but thought better of it.

There were probably about as many Bruin fans there as Sabres fans - probably more B's jersey's, to be honest. There was some sort of Canadian promotion going on, so there was a lot of people down from across the border, including almost everyone in our section. There was one large group - apparantly a youth hockey team from Owen Sound. They all sang the Canadian anthem together, which was kind of nice...but then it went downhill from there and they became pretty annoying. Most got tossed about halfway through though for underage drinking (never seen that at the game).

The guy next to me was a Sabres fan and didn't shut up the entire game (I hate that). His running commentary on the game was annoying to both me and my wife. One hilarious moment though - when the only real excitement of the game happened (Andrew Peters fighting Doug Doull...well, pummelled is more like it). Anyways, the fight starts and this little guy next to me jumps up and starts shadow boxing a mile a minute for the entire duration of the fight. Then, he just stopped and sat back down to resume his endless commentary.

So, that's it - nice arena, nice city...wish the game had been a bit more exciting though

[NoSkillz]

DD,

Glad you enjoyed the atmosphere (except for the bonehead Sabres fans! ;) ). I too enjoy the HSBC arena; big corridors, nice views of the ice surface, etc. You are right about the small seats, although I haven't had the privilege of going anywhere else with bigger seats (for instance, in Toronto at the ACC, seats are about the same size but with no cup holders...oh yeah, they're also $120.00 per ticket more expensive there too!).

Yeah, the Bruin/Sabre game was crap...but that's my Sabres for ya!

NoSkillz

[klayman]

The guy next to me was a Sabres fan and didn't shut up the entire game (I hate that). His running commentary on the game was annoying to both me and my wife. One hilarious moment though - when the only real excitement of the game happened (Andrew Peters fighting Doug Doull...well, pummelled is more like it). Anyways, the fight starts and this little guy next to me jumps up and starts shadow boxing a mile a minute for the entire duration of the fight. Then, he just stopped and sat back down to resume his endless commentary.


Sorry, I was just excited to see you ;)

[Draft Dodger]

DD,
Yeah, the Bruin/Sabre game was crap...but that's my Sabres for ya!


well, I think my wife's Bruins can share some of that blame.

[bbor]

Damn,Flyers spanked our asses this weekend.Major deficencies were shown.

Go Cliff Ronning......2 goals tonight :)

[klayman]

Looks like Salo asked for some talent this Christmas.

[Maple Leafs]

Rumors flying here in Ottawa that the Sens are about to deal for Bondra.

[bbor]

Rumors flying here in Ottawa that the Sens are about to deal for Bondra.


For who?

[Maple Leafs]

For who?Don't know. One guy here swears it's Shane Hnidy, but I think he's been drinking paint thinner.

My sources (and yes, I do have sources, thanks very much) are saying that the Sens and Caps are talking, but that the rumors of a done deal are pre-mature.

[bbor]

Hnidy for Bondra sound way out of whack.

[Maple Leafs]

Hnidy for Bondra sound way out of whack.Exactly. Hnidy tries hard, but he couldn't play for the Leafs. And yes, I mean that as an insult.

Unless it was Hnidy, a pick and a prospect. And even then...

[bbor]

i could see Bondra for Fischer

[Karim]

Isn't Alfredsson and Hossa enough depth at right wing or has Bondra been playing LW/C for a while? I don't really follow the Caps that closely.

[Draft Dodger]

Bondra added to the Senators forwards is just plain sick. He needs to go to the Avs :)

[bbor]

Apparently it will be a 3 way deal involving the Caps'Rangers and Sens.....Bondra and Jagr are supposedly changing adresses.

[Draft Dodger]

Apparently it will be a 3 way deal involving the Caps'Rangers and Sens.....Bondra and Jagr are supposedly changing adresses.

rumors about Gonchar as well. would the Caps really move their 3 best skaters? does it really make sense to overhaul? I know they are tubing this year, but hell, they are in the weakest division in hockey. Any given year, they would have a chance to make the playoffs just because of that.

[sterlingice]

rumors about Gonchar as well. would the Caps really move their 3 best skaters? does it really make sense to overhaul? I know they are tubing this year, but hell, they are in the weakest division in hockey. Any given year, they would have a chance to make the playoffs just because of that.
Ooh! For the sake of my fantasy team's plus/minus, please move Gonchar :)

SI

[bbor]

Ooh! For the sake of my fantasy team's plus/minus, please move Gonchar :)

SI

Won't help if he goes to the rangers

[sterlingice]

Won't help if he goes to the rangers
I dunno. With a -22, he can't be any worse.

SI

[bbor]

He could be on the Pens :)

[moore4807]

Philly press reports Clarke is looking at Caps goalie as replacement for Hackett -Great another washed up goalie we'll overpay for too - just trade Gagne next!

Team Schizo- shitso- phrenia strikes again!
Somebody get Clarke away from the trade phones before we drop to 7th seed like Bill Clement said tonite!

[Maple Leafs]

Well, TSN is reporting that the Jagr deal is done, pending league approval.

[bbor]

Details?

If it needs leag ue approval it must mean assloads of cash exchanged hands.

[Maple Leafs]

Details?

If it needs leag ue approval it must mean assloads of cash exchanged hands.Apparently it's for Anson Carter. The Caps pick up $20M of the $44M left on the rest of his contract. Jagr also defers $1M a year for the rest of the deal.

[cincyreds]

Yep, it is a done deal pending league approval.

The Rangers are so loaded....and watch. I bet they don't even make the playoffs.

[klayman]

As if being a Capital's fan wasn't bad enough...

Link (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A50620-2004Jan26.html)


Capitals' Owner Clashes With Fan at Game<!--plsfield:stop-->



<!--plsfield:byline-->By Jason La Canfora
<!--plsfield:credit-->Washington Post Staff Writer
<!--plsfield:disp_date-->Tuesday, January 27, 2004; Page A01

<!--plsfield:description--><NITF>Washington Capitals owner Ted Leonsis was involved in a physical altercation with a season ticket holder at MCI Center on Sunday night after being taunted and jeered by fans during the team's loss to Philadelphia, the Capitals' first home game since Leonsis traded all-star winger Jaromir Jagr to the New York Rangers.</NITF>

<SCRIPT><!--if ( (adTemplate&HALFPAGE_LEFT) == HALFPAGE_LEFT || (adTemplate&TOWER_LEFT_160) == TOWER_LEFT_160 || (adTemplate&BIGBOX_LEFT) == BIGBOX_LEFT ) document.write('<TABLE CELLPADDING="0" CELLSPACING="0" BORDER="0" BGCOLOR="#FFFFFF" ALIGN="left"><tr><td align="center">http://media.washingtonpost.com/wp-adv/images/advertisement_1.gif</td><td width="8" rowspan="2"><spacer type=block width="8"></td></tr><tr><td>')// --></SCRIPT>The fan, Jason Hammer, 20, a resident of the District, said Leonsis grabbed him by the neck and threw him to the ground after he had led a mocking chant of Leonsis during the game and hoisted a sign chiding him. Some witnesses explained the confrontation differently, offering varying accounts of the severity of the clash.</NITF>

<NITF>Even so, Leonsis called Hammer yesterday to apologize for putting his hands on him and invited Hammer to join him in his owner's suite for the team's next home game. Leonsis declined to comment publicly on the matter. Hammer said he would not press charges against Leonsis.</NITF>

<NITF>"Ted called me personally to apologize and was very honest and gentleman-like, and I appreciated the call," Hammer said. "I think both he and I are going to drop it and continue on and have it be like that."</NITF>

<NITF>The incident is out of character for Leonsis, 48, a gregarious team owner who routinely speaks with fans during games and responds to hundreds of e-mails from Capitals' followers -- many of them critical -- each day. But Leonsis has been under increasing pressure, on and off the ice, this season as the Capitals have skated to the second-worst record in the National Hockey League and are projecting losses of close to $30 million. He traded Jagr on Friday largely to partially ease the burden of his $11 million annual salary.</NITF>

<NITF>Hammer sits across the ice from Leonsis's box at MCI Center and Sunday night carried a sign to the arena saying, "Caps Hockey; AOL Stock -- See a Pattern?" to the game. Leonsis is vice chairman of America Online, whose stock value has dropped precipitously since Leonsis bought the Capitals in 1999.</NITF>

<NITF>Hammer was also among those in his section chanting at Leonsis through the game, cheering, "Thank you, Ted, Thank you, Ted, You Suck," to voice their displeasure over the Jagr trade.</NITF>

<NITF>"I will admit we were jeering him," Hammer said in a telephone interview. "But it wasn't just me, I'll put it to you like that."</NITF>

<NITF>Various fans who said they were seated in the lower bowl at MCI Center said they saw Leonsis respond to their chants by standing and waving them over, as if inviting Hammer into his box to talk.</NITF>

<NITF>"I thought it was kind of a gesture like, 'Bring it on,' " said Elliot Golden, a college student who said he witnessed the taunting as well as the confrontation between Leonsis and Hammer.</NITF>

<NITF>Hammer said he did not intend to venture over to Leonsis's box and did not think much of the situation, and left the game with his father and some friends. As he walked through the concourse Hammer said he was holding his sign above his head, but not chanting at Leonsis. He said Leonsis then approached him.</NITF>

<NITF>"The next thing I know we're near the owner's box exit [to leave the arena] and Ted comes running up," Hammer said. "I didn't even know he was on me until his hands were strangling me. He was saying he was going to 'kick my [butt].' . . . The security guards came and broke it up, and pulled me away to the side, but Ted was still trying to come at me again."</NITF>

<NITF>Capitals sources offered a different version. They said Leonsis was outside his box talking to fans and signing autographs when Hammer thrust his sign near Leonsis's face and derided him. Leonsis then shoved Hammer aside, the sources said.</NITF>

<NITF>MCI Center security personnel and spokesmen said they were aware of an incident between Leonsis and a fan after the Capitals' 4-1 loss, but declined to comment further. Frank Brown, an NHL spokesman, said he was unaware of the incident and declined to comment.</NITF>

Richard Hayden, a 20-year season ticket holder and area attorney, said he saw the incident from the onset and recalled that the scuffle ensued after Leonsis tried to take Hammer's sign. </NITF><SCRIPT><!--if ( (adTemplate&HALFPAGE_LEFT) == HALFPAGE_LEFT || (adTemplate&TOWER_LEFT_160) == TOWER_LEFT_160 || (adTemplate&BIGBOX_LEFT) == BIGBOX_LEFT ) document.write('<TABLE CELLPADDING="0" CELLSPACING="0" BORDER="0" BGCOLOR="#FFFFFF" ALIGN="left"><tr><td align="center">http://media.washingtonpost.com/wp-adv/images/advertisement_1.gif</td><td width="8" rowspan="2"><spacer type=block width="8"></td></tr><tr><td>')// --></SCRIPT>"Ted tried to grab the sign out of [Hammer's] hands and at one point the security guards had to pull him off," Hayden said. "Ted was livid like you wouldn't believe; he was like a bulldog. He really went after him. Ted was really, really agitated."</NITF>
<NITF>Golden, who said he has never met Hammer before, said that Leonsis pushed his friend, Cyrus Tavaria, aside to get to Hammer.</NITF>

<NITF>"Ted grabbed [Hammer] and threw him across the concourse," Golden said in a telephone interview. "He grabbed him, it looked like around the collar, and had him by his jersey and drove him backwards and pushed him down. . . . That guy wasn't trying to hit Ted at all, and the security people came in and the victim was saying, 'I didn't hit him, he pushed me, he pushed me.' Ted made at least a half-dozen lunges at the guy and was escorted back to his suite."</NITF>

<NITF>In a separate telephone interview, Tavaria said: "I didn't catch what they were saying, but Ted and this guy [Hammer] started going back and forth [verbally]. They were pretty close to each other -- within 10 or 15 feet -- and the guy showed Ted his sign and then all of a sudden Ted shoves me aside -- he didn't shove me hard but he moved me aside -- and then he went at the guy.</NITF>

<NITF>"The thing I remember most is they were pushing and shoving back and forth trying to knock each other over and the guy got shoved back into the wall. There were a whole bunch of security guards and it took about three of them to restrain Ted. They really had to hold him back."</NITF>

<NITF>Tavaria said Leonsis never put his hands on Hammer's neck. "I definitely would remember if I had seen that," he said.</NITF>

<NITF>Hammer said he explained to security personnel that he did not instigate the contact and that he was allowed to leave after deciding not to press charges. Hammer said he has a cut on face and a bruise on his knee, which Hammer said he used to break his fall.</NITF>

<NITF>Sources close to Leonsis said they expect the Capitals' owner will significantly alter his relations with fans in the wake of the incident and anticipate there will be more security personnel outside his box during games.</NITF>

[JonInMiddleGA]

ESPN.com news services
<!-- template inline --><!-- insertinlineAd --> NEW YORK -- The NHL has suspended Washington Capitals (http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/clubhouse?team=was) owner Ted Leonsis for one week and the team has been fined $100,000 following an incident between Leonsis and a fan.



<!-- BEGIN INLINE UNIT --> http://adsatt.espn.starwave.com/ad/sponsors/blank/blank-espn.gif (http://transfer.go.com/cgi/atransfer.pl?name=141468&srvc=sz&context=1331:228:141468:65&guid=F41DA32A-BE53-4B6F-A58B-98519404035B&goto=)<!-- InContent Blank -->
<!-- END INLINE UNIT --> Jason Hammer told The Washington Post that Leonsis placed his hands on his neck and tossed him down to the ground after the Capitals' home loss to Philadelphia.

Leonsis, a vice chairman of America Online, later apologized to Hammer, a 20-year-old Caps season-ticket holder who had taunted the owner.

In issuing the penalties to Leonsis and the Caps, NHL commissioner Gary Bettman said, "I have been briefed by NHL Security on the incident and understand that Ted Leonsis and Jason Hammer have amicably put this matter behind them.

"Nevertheless, as in other instances involving players, coaches or managers, we hold all members of the NHL family to a higher standard than the general public. Even in those cases when there were instances of alleged provocation, we have made it clear that NHL personnel need to do everything possible to avoid a confrontation with fans and the failure to do so is not acceptable."

Leonsis can have no contact with the team, including attending any games or other team functions, for a week.


http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=1721387

[JonInMiddleGA]

Meanwhile, watching Blues-Thrashers on TurnerSouth.

Heatley looks better than I anyone could have hoped at this point, although it seems to me that he's only 85-90 percent at most. Not so much the injury itself, IMO, more an issue of looking like he's not really in game shape just yet.

And in the 2nd intermission, there was tape of some classy comments by various Blues players (I caught Pronger & Weight, there were a couple of more before that I believe) about the respect they have for Heatley's rapid rehab, wishing him well (just not tonight) and so forth. I don't know exactly how to explain why the short clips made an impression with me, they just seemed very sincere in their comments & I thought it showed some class on their part.

[timmae]

There was nothing but respect while Heatley was in Madison. The way that I look at it is that the whole accident was just that, an accident. I don't think it reflects on his character overall. Just a truly horrible accident. He was correct in showing remorse and trying to piece his life back together even though his friend was no longer there. I hope Heatley continues to improve.

[sachmo71]

Glad to see Heatly back. I hope he can put everything behind him, because he is one of the most exciting players I've ever seen.

Also glad to see the Stars score 4 in the third to beat the Senators! #1 GPG vs. #28 GPG and they lose 5-3. Check it out on Sportscenter if you get a chance...total meltdown.

[bbor]

Dear Stars..

thx for the help

yours in hockey
the leafs

:D

[sachmo71]

Well bbor, if you can't beat 'em, let someone else do it! Poor Lalime...he's getting raked over the coals up there in capitol of leaf-land, isn't he?

[bbor]

I hope so...the more turmoil in Ottawa the better...But ...ya know..Alfredsson has already "Guarenteed" the Sens a cup...so the rest of us may as well not even try.

[Maple Leafs]

I can confirm that fans here in Ottawa are flipping out.

Which is odd, because Lalime is the same goalie he's always been, and two months ago they all thought he should be on Team Canada.

[bbor]

I can confirm that fans here in Ottawa are flipping out.

Which is odd, because Lalime is the same goalie he's always been, and two months ago they all thought he should be on Team Canada.

Is Ottawa turning into Toronto?

We go through this with Belfour/Quinn/Sundin almost daily.

[Maple Leafs]

Not good times up here in Ottawa after Saturday night.

If you missed the game... well, the Leafs did everything short of pee on the Sens bench, and Ottawa didn't fight back at all. Just a pitiful performance. But the way folks up here are taking it, you'd think they just lost game seven of a playoff series. They want Muckler to trade for George Laraque, call up the minor league goons, bring Rob Ray out of retirement... you name it. With the Leafs in town on Thursday, the normally docile Ottawa media is calling the Sens' manhood into question.

With the way Saturday's game ended, and with the two teams playing again so soon, and with all the hype, this one looks like a bloodbath. Which, if you've watched hockey for any amount of time, you know can mean only one thing: nothing at all will happen.

[bbor]

JD was on the radio in Toronto today saying Muckler has been burning up the phone lines trying to get a tough guy in Ottawa before Thursday.

The Oil want a 1st round DP for Laraque.Kinda steep for him i'd say.

[Maple Leafs]

The Oil want a 1st round DP for Laraque.Kinda steep for him i'd say.That is steep. But if I'm Ottawa, I might pull the trigger.

[Honolulu_Blue]

That is steep. But if I'm Ottawa, I might pull the trigger.

Far too steep. If they just need someone to fight, they have to be able to get someone servicable in the minors, off the street, or for a very low pick. Hell, they should talk to those idiots putting together that Gladiators On Ice nonsense and see if anyone is available. Tony Twist? Link Gaetz?

[Maple Leafs]

Far too steep. If they just need someone to fight, they have to be able to get someone servicable in the minors, off the street, or for a very low pick. That's the problem. They have guys who can fight. Shane Hnidy can fight. But he got his ass kicked by Domi on Saturday. Chris Neil can fight. But when trouble broke out in the third, he was nowhere to be found (even though he was on the ice).

It's clear that the Leafs, among other teams, don't respect the Sens in the toughness department. This is a case where perception is reality. Nolan ran Spezza, and nobody did anything. McCabe bloodied Hossa, and nobody did anything. Martin put Hnidy and Neil on the ice at the end of the game on Saturday to stop Domi and Perrot from causing trouble, and they went ahead and did it anyways. It was as if Neil wasn't even there.

They have minor league goons they could bring up. What would that solve? One more guy to be a punching bag for the Leafs? They need a top heavyweight, and they need one now.

[Honolulu_Blue]

That's the problem. They have guys who can fight. Shane Hnidy can fight. But he got his ass kicked by Domi on Saturday. Chris Neil can fight. But when trouble broke out in the third, he was nowhere to be found (even though he was on the ice).

It's clear that the Leafs, among other teams, don't respect the Sens in the toughness department. This is a case where perception is reality. Nolan ran Spezza, and nobody did anything. McCabe bloodied Hossa, and nobody did anything. Martin put Hnidy and Neil on the ice at the end of the game on Saturday to stop Domi and Perrot from causing trouble, and they went ahead and did it anyways. It was as if Neil wasn't even there.

They have minor league goons they could bring up. What would that solve? One more guy to be a punching bag for the Leafs? They need a top heavyweight, and they need one now.

That they may need, but for a first rounder? How much did Bashear go for a few years ago? A semi-skilled guy, if I recall. Hlavac or someone like that? I dunno.

A Scott Parker type would come cheaper and still get the job done, I reckon.

[Maple Leafs]

Brashear went for a second round pick, I believe. Keep in mind the Sens will finish in the top five of the league, so you're looking at a #25 at the lowest.

Now, given that the Sens are the favorite to win the Cup this year but have now been exposed as possibly lacking the toughness to do it, do you pay the steep price? If landing Laraque gives you a better chance to win the Cup, you do it. Don't worry about some first rounder who won't play for five years. You have a window now.

Remember, Muckler dealt a first rounder for Smolinksi last year. Right now the Sens need an enforcer a lot more than they need yet another talented, soft forward.

A Scott Parker type would come cheaper and still get the job done, I reckon.I'm not sure he would get the job done. The bottom line is that the Sens have played like a team that's scared of Tie Domi. Twice in two years, Domi has gone after one of their players and nobody has done a thing. Neil won't go near him. Hnidy did, and got hammered. And because of that, the rest of the Leafs play a little bigger. They know their big dog is bigger than the other teams', so they run around.

Compare that to how the Leafs play against the Flyers. Domi has a tough time against Brashear, so he can't run around without being held accountable. The rest of the Leafs don't either. It sounds like caveman thinking, but sometimes that's the way it works.

So the question is: can the Sens get a guy who'll put Domi in his place? Laraque could. Simon probably still could. Parker is a maybe. Some minor leaguer won't. Rob Ray last year definetely couldn't.

[bbor]

I guess the Sens trade of Roy a few years ago is biting them on the @ss now.

Jeez..ijust feel dirty...a guy with a Maple Leaf handle trying to make the Sens a better team:D

If Braeshear went for a 2nd round pick then Laraque definatly is'nt worth a 1st.I find Braeshear a usable player that won't hurt you when he's on the ice.I can't say the same for Laraque.Having said that....as a Leaf follower i hope the Sens DO make that trade:)

Chara did a nice number on Mccabe on Saturday night...that was hilarious...he swung Mccabe around like he was a doll..that dude is STRONG!.

[Maple Leafs]

Chara did a nice number on Mccabe on Saturday night...that was hilarious...he swung Mccabe around like he was a doll..that dude is STRONG!.Yeah. Would have been nicer if he hadn't hurt himself doing it.

[Karim]

I would try to get both Ryan Smyth and Georges Laraque out of Edmonton. Both would add a lot of toughness and character to Ottawa and neither would back away from the Leafs. I think Smyth might welcome a change and a chance to play for a legitimate cup contender.

It sure would be a better acquisition than Bondra, IMO.

[Honolulu_Blue]

And the answer is....

Todd Simpson.

Yes, Todd Simpson, rugged defensemen and one time Flame, Panther, Coyote, Duck and likely something else along the way.

I guess this is a start. It sure as hell beats bringing Rob Ray out of retirement. I've always liked Todd Simpson, seems like a solid, tought defensemen. There has to be some knock on him though, as he seems to get shipped around a lot.

Karim, any thoughts?

Should be interesting to see what happens. I reckon Simpson will go out and fight right away. A good sign for his new team and it was why he was brought to Ottawa.

[Maple Leafs]

Chief, can we get a scouting report on Todd Simpson?

[Draft Dodger]

Sens / Leafs and Avs / Wings tonight...and I have to work... :(

[Chief Rum]

Sure thing, guys.

Todd Simpson has the tough pedigree you excpect from a stay at home defensman who leans on a veteran career and associated savvy. He doesn't back down from the other toughs, he knows how to play dirty if he needs to, and he has a good functional understanding of defense and where he needs to be. He's also big and uses that size to block shots.

Now the bad, and the reasons I was deliriously happy to see him go. Guys, he wasn't even going to make the Yotes top six, you realize that? He only went to us in the waiver draft, because Carney broke his foot in the last exhibition game (setting off an endless stream of defense injuries that have kept Simpson in the lineup the whole season).

Anaheim's defense has been plagued by the horribly ill-advised turnovers at just the wrong time this year. Simpson was Exhibit A in why this was. The guy is a horrible passer out of the zone. I mean, really frickin' bad. And he can't skate out well either. He's too slow to beat an even mediocre forechecking forward, and his stickhandling is subpar. Speaking of his slowness, he also can't keep up with quick forwards (in fact, they make him look like a statue). He can get by doing the crease-clearing stuff, but as part of a moving defensive system, let's just say not all the parts are moving with him on the ice. This also causes him to make some dumb penalties, which isn't toughness but him trying to save his own ass.

He also contributes very little on offense. His slapshot isn't very good, and as noted neither is his passing ability. He checks good, and every now and then he steps forward and acts like a big forward (good, because he's good at that grunt forward type of thing; bad, because if he does it and it doesn't work, the other team practically has a full power play before he can get back to the defensive zone).

As I mentioned in another hockey thread, I went to the Kings-Ducks game last week. The Kings won in overtime because Simpson tried to skate a puck out on the right. He could have dumped it to the defensman on the left (I think it was Havelid, too, a much better puck-moving blueliner), but instead Simpson skated up on a forechecking Jozef Stumpel at the blueline instead and seemed to be trying to pass it forward to center ice. Instead, Stumpel poke-checked the poke away, got to it along the line, and fed a center-ice flying Joe Corvo, who blasted the winning score over Martin Gerber's shoulder before Gerbs likely knew that Simpson had turned the puck over.

And that was the fourth or fifth stupid turnover I saw Simpson make that night (although this was the only one that got the Kings a score).

I am extremely satisfied to see this guy gone and amazed we got a guy who seems able to put a point every two games for him (heck, this Russian winger is even relatively young at 24).

Ottawa loses a lot more in actual defensive skill and athleticism and speed than they make up for by adding Simpson's grit and savvy.

CR

[bbor]

Wow...Great Sens?leaf game....Sens score 13 seconds into the game.,..then go up 3-0...Leafs battle back to tie the game 4-4 with 5 minutes left.Then in OT Nolan scores on a 40 foot slapshot to win .Ottawa must be losing their collective minds right now.

[Ksyrup]

How about the end of the Avs/Red Wings game? Two 4 minute minors in the final 1.6 seconds! I hope Yzerman is OK - that was painful to watch. A 5 on 3 in OT...you knew the Red Wings weren't going to let that opportunity get away.

[Draft Dodger]

I hate both of you

[Draft Dodger]

so - do I read that right? two seperate high-sticking double minors in the last 2 seconds? how does that happen?

[bbor]

Ya...how does that happen?

[Ksyrup]

The first call appeared to be a BS call (they never did show a good shot of the high stick), then on the face off to get the game to OT, Adam Foote hit Yzerman squarely in the face. It didn't appear to be intentional, since he tried to help him as he went down, but it looked brutal.

[Draft Dodger]

lovely triple whammy - my Avs lose...to the Wings...and they injure the one Wing I have on both my fantasy teams...

[Honolulu_Blue]

Both calls were correct. The only bullshit aspect of the first call was that it was Kariya, and not Konowalchuk, who highsticked Draper. That and I think the linesmen called it. Kariya drew blood though. That's an automatic 4 minutes. Nothing BS about that.

The call on Foote was definitely the right one. Yzerman lost a tooth, got 8 stitches, and had some other teeth damaged. Oh yeah, blood was drawn. Another 4 minutes.

It was good to see. Class act by Avs fans (those on this board excluded of course, because they are cool despite the fact they support the Forces of Darkness), they once again as always show thier true colors.

[ice4277]

Yee-ha, go Wings :D

[Ksyrup]

Both calls were correct. The only bullshit aspect of the first call was that it was Kariya, and not Konowalchuk, who highsticked Draper. That and I think the linesmen called it. Kariya drew blood though. That's an automatic 4 minutes. Nothing BS about that.
I only said that because on the DirecTV feed, which I think was the Avs broadcast crew, they kept showing replays that showed nothing. By the time the game ended and DirecTV signed off, I still hadn't seen anything that looked like a penalty.

Doesn't matter though...they called it and we won!

[Honolulu_Blue]

I only said that because on the DirecTV feed, which I think was the Avs broadcast crew, they kept showing replays that showed nothing. By the time the game ended and DirecTV signed off, I still hadn't seen anything that looked like a penalty.

Doesn't matter though...they called it and we won!

Amen to that, my brother!

[Honolulu_Blue]

I only said that because on the DirecTV feed, which I think was the Avs broadcast crew, they kept showing replays that showed nothing. By the time the game ended and DirecTV signed off, I still hadn't seen anything that looked like a penalty.

Doesn't matter though...they called it and we won!

I must admit, I am only going off what I read from the Detroit and Colorado papers (good to get both sides). I cannot watch the game. I am in Belgium. This makes H_B sad and unhappy. :(

[Karim]

Chief's summary of Simpson was quite accurate. He's rugged, a hard worker, well-like by both teammates and fans, but he's at best a #5 or 6 defenceman. He's definitely not the answer to Ottawa's problems.

[Maple Leafs]

That Leafs/Sens game was... interesting.

If you only saw the highlights or the boxscore, you missed the real story: both teams were hit so badly by the flu that there were barely enough players left to finish the game. Players were going back and forth the dressing room to.. um... well, not for equipment problems. It was especially bad on the Ottawa side.

Which was nice, because for once the Sens were shitting themselves and it didn't have anything to do with Tie Domi.

[klayman]

Back to the theme of fixing the NHL...

Fixing the grand ole game

Hockey eggheads will meet once gain in hopes of finding ways of making the greatest game on ice even better. Or not.

ST. PAUL, Minn. (CP) -- With the NHL's 30 general managers meeting this week to explore ways to open up hockey, talk of `fixing the game' was the overwhelming topic of choice during the weekend's all-star festivities.

Most players, however, sounded less than enthusiastic about making major changes to the game, saying that it isn't quite as bad as everyone is making it out to be.

Then again, they're not the ones paying $150 a ticket to watch dull, defensive hockey.

"I'm a traditionalist," Vancouver Canucks winger Todd Bertuzzi said. "I like the way the game is. I don't want to see a lot of changes."

League commissioner Gary Bettman will also attend the meetings Monday to Wednesday at the Ritz-Carlton in Lake Las Vegas with the NHL's director of hockey operations Colin Campbell introducing a full slate of issues for discussion.

Among them:

-- Making the ice surface larger.

-- Reducing goalie equipment.

-- Eliminating the red centre-ice line.

-- Limiting the goaltender's ability to play the puck.

-- Moving the nets back where they were before 1990, 10 feet (three metres) from the end boards instead of 13 feet (four metres).

-- Making the blue-line wider as experimented in the AHL this season.

-- Resurrecting tag-up offsides.

-- Eliminating the instigator fighting penalty.

-- Playing a full two-minute power play regardless of whether a team scores.

And there's more, Bettman said this weekend, pointing to a large black folder every GM will have in their hands.

"Their mandate from me is to take a look at the game and to begin the discussion," Bettman said. "There are a whole list of aspects of the game that they are going to discuss."

The bottom line is to improve a game that has seen a steady decrease in scoring over the last few years.

"People want to see more goals but I wouldn't like 9-8 games. That's too high," said New York Rangers superstar Jaromir Jagr. "I do like the idea to play the full two minutes on a power play, whether a goal is scored or not. I like that a lot. That's the best thing I've heard so far."

Former superstar goalie Patrick Roy raised some eyebrows Sunday with his thoughts on goaltender equipment.

"I may not have a lot of friends after I say this but I think goalies should go back to 10-inch pads," said Roy, referring to today's 12-inch width on pads. "There's no more fear in goalies in today's game.

"The shooter needs to see a bit more of the mesh in the net."

Calls to reduce the size of goalie equipment was not welcomed by the men wearing the mask.

"I don't think they should only look at us as ways to improve the scoring," Montreal Canadiens netminder Jose Theodore said. "I just recommend not to change anything with goalies."

Forget the goalies, said Florida Panthers netminder Roberto Luongo, just call the game by the book.

"The main thing is the trap and the clutch and grabbing," Luongo said. "That slows the game down and brings down scoring."

The elimination of the centre-ice line, seen by some as a measure to open up the ice, wasn't a popular idea with most players this weekend.

"No, teams would adjust, the coaches are too good," Vancouver Canucks captain Markus Naslund said. "It shows in Europe (where there's no red-line). There hasn't been a drastic change in scoring there."

Fellow Swede Daniel Alfredsson, who like Naslund grew up playing without the red-line, also doesn't think it would have much of an impact.

"I don't think that's the key," the Ottawa Senators captain said. "Maybe short term it would open up the game but teams would adjust. In Europe you just move the trap back and you still have problems scoring."

Alfredsson's No. 1 priority would be to drop the two-referee system, a comment echoed by several players over the weekend. He feels the flow of the game would improve when players aren't confused by what two different refs consider to be penalties.

"I think it's easier for one referee to set a standard and the players know what his standard is," Alfredsson said. "You just know what's going to be called."

Never one to hold back with his thoughts on the game, Jeremy Roenick had the most radical idea of making the nets bigger.

"If you increase it by one inch, you'd see more goals," the Flyers centre said. "It wouldn't even be a visual thing for the fans, but to a shooter, it would."

Alfredsson says hockey may just be going through a low-scoring cycle and may come out of it on its own.

"Soccer went through the same problems in Europe a few years ago. People complained there wasn't enough scoring in soccer," he said. "There's always going to be trends in the league. The '80s were high scoring, the '90s were kind of half and half."

The success of the defensive-minded New Jersey Devils is a factor as well, Alfredsson said.

"We need a couple of offensive teams win the Stanley Cup," he said. "When New Jersey started playing really well defensively, teams looked at that. It worked. Now everybody knows how to play well defensively."

Philadelphia Flyers head coach Ken Hitchcock thinks the situation is not as bad as some think.

"I think everyone wants to make the game better," he said. "But when you start complaining about it so much, everybody thinks there's a lot that's wrong with that, and I don't agree."

The GMs' suggestions this week will be further re-examined this summer by a blue-ribbon panel of hockey experts including coaches, players, media and some GMs.

Any changes must be approved by the league's owners at a board of governors' meeting in September. I gotta agree with Roenick with making the nets bigger. That will help a lot if they also widen the ice surface and get rid of the space behind the nets. Then we will be back to high flying 80's hockey.

[sterlingice]

Back to the theme of fixing the NHL...
I gotta agree with Roenick with making the nets bigger. That will help a lot if they also widen the ice surface and get rid of the space behind the nets. Then we will be back to high flying 80's hockey.
A bigger net just doesn't feel right. The goalie pads, maybe, that might be an ok change. I agree with Luongo (and many others): call the holding penalties so people go away from doing it, then the game will speed up. If you do that, it negates the trap which is what slows the game down most. I'm not sure why the 2 minute penalty is met with such wide appeal but it always is whenever it comes up- I'm basically indifferent to that.

SI

[sachmo71]

Make it illegal to hold another player for any reason. Call it every time.

[klayman]

Make it illegal to hold another player for any reason. Call it every time.Might as well just reduce the number of players to 4 a side :)

I understand what you guys are saying, but I just don't see the NHL letting the game fall into an endless parade of penalties while the players get re-accustomed to how the game should be played, or worse yet, have the refs call it through the regular season, only to see it disappear in the playoffs. Bigger nets are easy to implement, don’t require interpretation from the refs, and are the same size in the 1<SUP>st</SUP> period as they are in the 3<SUP>rd</SUP>. It doesn’t fix the problem of holding, but it at least brings some offence back into the game.<O:p</O:p

[bbor]

Bigger ice surface.It really is the most unobtrusive change that can be made.IMHO>

[Draft Dodger]

I say get rid of the rule against the 2-line pass...

[sachmo71]

I have no problem with bigger nets, but if you want to get rid of the "clutching and grabbing", get rid of it. I'll bet it wouldn't take too long at all.

While we're on the subject, I think they should make the powerplay last the full 2 minutes. It would be an easy way to chip in 40-50 more goals per year.

[Draft Dodger]

While we're on the subject, I think they should make the powerplay last the full 2 minutes. It would be an easy way to chip in 40-50 more goals per year.

I suspect this would lead to more diving, and possibly even less penalties called, as refs are already loathe to call penalties in certain situations.

but, more importantly, this might inflate the scores, but it wont make the games that much more exciting for me. The powerplay isn't usually the most exciting part of hockey.

[Draft Dodger]

gotta love that Bobby Clarke guy...

gives up a good prospect and two picks to get Mike Comrie...and trades him 2 months later for Sean Burke. Why did he need to trade for Sean Burke? Because he'd already run Brian Boucher and Roman Checmanek out of town to go with Robert Esche and Jeff Hackett (who retired today).

then he trades Eric Weinrich to St Louis for a draft pick. and why did he trade Weinrich? because he has a glut of defensemen...this coming just 2 weeks after the knee-jerk reaction trade of Justin Williams for Danny Markov because they were desperate for defensemen.

Do Flyers fans think this man is sane? I mean, lately he's been making Mike Milbury look like Pierre Lacroix

[bbor]

Well...at least Clarke finally fixed the problem correctly by getting Burke...instead of stop gaping it again.

[Draft Dodger]

Well...at least Clarke finally fixed the problem correctly by getting Burke...instead of stop gaping it again.

he's 37. how permanent of a fix do you think he is? :D

I've never been a big Burke fan - he's only had 4 winning seasons in his career, and in two of those he played in 13 and 22 games respectively. I think Phoenix did extremely well to get Comrie for him.

[bbor]

I like Burke a hell of a lot more than i liked Esche or Hackett.I think Comrie was a steep price to pay,but really,what other choice did he have?Mind you...he painted himself into this corner so he hasno one else to blame but himself.He could have had Cujo or Richter a few years ago,but he cheaped out.

[k0ruptr]

bah the NHL blows. well that is until the playoffs, cause thats when i start watchin

[Karim]

bah the NHL blows. well that is until the playoffs, cause thats when i start watchin
Great. Thanks for coming out. :rolleyes:

[bbor]

LOL

[k0ruptr]

:) anytime!!! oh, as long as its playoffs ;)

[Honolulu_Blue]

I totally missed this Danny Markov trade. Freakin' Belgium. Burke is definitely an upgrade, especially given Jeff "Scottie" Hackett's retirement. Comrie didn't seem to mesh in Philly. Though he had sat out for a while, so I am sure he would come around. Philly also got two prospects, they I have no idea who they are or what type of potential they have.

At least Burke is traded. The "where will Sean Burke go" stories have been going on and on and on for the last two or three years. I'm glad it's done.

[Honolulu_Blue]

bah the NHL blows. well that is until the playoffs, cause thats when i start watchin

*grabs leather pouch full of pingpong balls*

LIGHTNING BOLT!
LIGHTNING BOLT!
LIGHTNING BOLT!
sleep!
LIGHTNING BOLT!
LIGHTNING BOLT!
LIGHTNING BOLT!

[k0ruptr]

lmao. hahahaha sleep

[sachmo71]

Yikes.

[klayman]

You can't cast that many lightning bolts!

[Honolulu_Blue]

You can't cast that many lightning bolts!

I have a wand. I have a wand of lightning bolts with unlimited charges. No casting time. Just simply point and...

LIGHTNING BOLT!
LIGHTNING BOLT!
LIGHTNING BOLT!

[klayman]

oh...ok then. carry on.

[Honolulu_Blue]

oh...ok then. carry on.

Will do.

[Ksyrup]

Hasek's out for the season.

[ice4277]

Hasek's out for the season.
You know what, this may be a blessing in disguise. You know that as the playoffs would draw closer, there would be another round of discussion/debate over who should be playing in net, and after every loss, you will hear arguments against the losing goalie, regardless of the situation. Cujo will be just as good if not better than Hasek would have been if he had come back from injury; lets not forget he was just beginning to get back to his playing form when he went down with the injury. It would take him a while to get back into shape and they still would be giving minutes to Cujo to keep him sharp just in case. At least now the situation is stabilized and Cujo and Legace will know where they stand heading into April.

[chrisj]

Hmm... no posts about <a href=http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story.asp?id=71686>NHL rule changes?</A>

- Goalies can no longer handle the puck behind the back-end red line (behind the net);

- The width of goalie pads will be reduced to 10 inches from the current limit of 12 inches; also, the league's head office will act as a clearing house for goalie's equipment before they can wear it;

- The nets will be brought back to 10 feet from the back boards from the current 13 feet;

- The tag-up offsides will be brought back;

- AHL will try out three points being awarded for a victory in regulation time with NHL possibly going to that format in 2005-06 if it works well in the minors; that would also include two points for an overtime win, it may also include two points for a penalty shootout win.

[Pyser]

Goalies can no longer handle the puck behind the back-end red line (behind the net);


my beloved brodeur will continue to be a fantastic goalie...but this would severely hurt his game.

therefore, i am opposed to it.

just make the damn rink bigger. stop shrinking everything else.

[Draft Dodger]

Goalies can no longer handle the puck behind the back-end red line (behind the net);

My first reaction is that this is dumb...it's my second and third reaction as well. So, essentially, we want to encourage the dump and chase?

The width of goalie pads will be reduced to 10 inches from the current limit of 12 inches; also, the league's head office will act as a clearing house for goalie's equipment before they can wear it;

definitely a good idea. I swear, Dwayne Roloson looked like a tank at the all-star game. I still have to chuckle that Patrick Roy recommended this idea...

The nets will be brought back to 10 feet from the back boards from the current 13 feet

moving the nets up never had the impact they thought it would, and now that Gretzky's retiring and Forsberg's days are numbered, no one needs that space back there anyway.

The tag-up offsides will be brought back;

I don't know what this is - can someone fill me in?

- AHL will try out three points being awarded for a victory in regulation time with NHL possibly going to that format in 2005-06 if it works well in the minors; that would also include two points for an overtime win, it may also include two points for a penalty shootout win

no, please no. this is a TERRIBLE idea. I wish they'd stop fucking around with the point system. The stupid point for overtime losses is dumb enough. I don't even want to think about a shootout.

[klayman]

I don't know what this is - can someone fill me in?


A delayed offside where if the offensive team retreats from the zone, the offside is cancelled and they can go back in to forecheck.

[corbes]

Do Flyers fans think this man is sane?

No, most definitely not. We gave up on that issue a long time ago. Now it's kind of a science experiment about the effects of insane people running a hockey team, except we're the experimental group, not the control group.

Mike Comrie was obviously unsuited to play in Philadelphia. The question is not so much why did we trade him to Phoenix, but why did we trade for him in the first place? (That Clarkie is obsessed with centers is, while correct, not a valid answer. You must be more creative than that.)

And also, we were really hurting for future 5th round draft picks, which is why we traded Weinrich. That should be obvious. :cool:

[sterlingice]

My first reaction is that this is dumb...it's my second and third reaction as well. So, essentially, we want to encourage the dump and chase?
I'd just like them to put goalies on par with everyone else outside the crease. If they're inside the crease, they're still the protected goalie and you shouldn't mess with them. But if they want to go chasing the puck down, they're fair game. If you're the keeper and you're out far enough that you have to worry about being taken down and not being able to get back, then you probably shouldn't go out that far. I'm sure you'll get your ass beaten in on the other side of the ice with the refs conveniently not watching after you take out the goalie which will cut down on the cheap shots but this should cut out on the egregious net leaving.

SI

[bbor]

I think goalies should still be alowed to handle the puck...i just don't think they should be able to make a forward pass...unless their team is on the PP.

[klayman]

I'd just like them to put goalies on par with everyone else outside the crease. If they're inside the crease, they're still the protected goalie and you shouldn't mess with them. But if they want to go chasing the puck down, they're fair game. If you're the keeper and you're out far enough that you have to worry about being taken down and not being able to get back, then you probably shouldn't go out that far. I'm sure you'll get your ass beaten in on the other side of the ice with the refs conveniently not watching after you take out the goalie which will cut down on the cheap shots but this should cut out on the egregious net leaving.

SI
http://dynamic2.gamespy.com/~fof/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif

As far as reverting to dump and chase, the dump and chase is an effective offensive strategy. It was used a lot in the 80's with great success. Remove the space from behind the net, and you remove the cycling behind the net that it creates, and as such the dump and chase becomes more alive as players make quicker passes into the slot or back to point, instead of freezing and cycling behind the net. Removing the goalies ablitity to stop the dump and chase removes the constant parade of dump, turnover, clear the zone, dump, turnover, ..., repeat for 58 of 60 mins. I think that is what the GM's are trying to do, although true to form, they only went at it half-assed (bigger nets or bigger ice surface would guarantee results).

[corbes]

No truth to the rumor that Clarke's looking to pick up Eric Weinrich from the Blues in exchange for Antero Niittymaki.

[klayman]

No truth to the rumor that Clarke's looking to pick up Eric Weinrich from the Blues in exchange for Antero Niittymaki.
I heard he is willing to go as high as a 2nd round pick to get him back. :)

[ice4277]

just make the damn rink bigger. stop shrinking everything else.
Regardless of the positives or negatives of doing this, one thing to remember is that, if the owners decide to do this, it will eliminate a row or two of the most expensive seats in the rink. Seeing as many teams live and die by their ticket revenues, this may not pick up enough steam to pass through.

[Maple Leafs]

Regardless of the positives or negatives of doing this, one thing to remember is that, if the owners decide to do this, it will eliminate a row or two of the most expensive seats in the rink. Seeing as many teams live and die by their ticket revenues, this may not pick up enough steam to pass through.Not to mention the costs with making the actual change.

If it costs each owner a million bucks to make the change to their arena, you can bet they'll look elsewhere. And some arenas physically can't accomodate bigger ice, because of the way they're built.

The NHL had it's chance to move to a bigger ice surface a few years ago when half the teams had new buildings on the way. They didn't do it. The opportunity is lost.

[bbor]

Leafs trade Rik Jackman to the Pens for Drake Berehowsky...who originally was a 1st round draft pick of the Leafs....funny how things work out.

We are still planning a parade:D

[Maple Leafs]

Hmm... when Berehowsky was first drafted, he was very popular with the female fans. Um... very popular.

Should be an interesting homecoming for him. If I were him, I'd start practicing the phrase "Um, yeah, of course I remember you..."

[Pyser]

The NHL had it's chance to move to a bigger ice surface a few years ago when half the teams had new buildings on the way. They didn't do it. The opportunity is lost.

bingo. they blew it big time.

[sterlingice]

Leafs trade Rik Jackman to the Pens for Drake Berehowsky...who originally was a 1st round draft pick of the Leafs....funny how things work out.

We are still planning a parade:D
Aw crap. I just picked up Berehowsky on the fofc fantasy hockey waiver wire since I was in need of a 4th defenseman. Is this good news or bad news? He'd been getting decent points regularly (and lots of power play points) but, of course, on the Pens, his +/- was awful. Is he about to lose a lot of his power play time (and thus points)?

SI

[bbor]

Aw crap. I just picked up Berehowsky on the fofc fantasy hockey waiver wire since I was in need of a 4th defenseman. Is this good news or bad news? He'd been getting decent points regularly (and lots of power play points) but, of course, on the Pens, his +/- was awful. Is he about to lose a lot of his power play time (and thus points)?

SI


I imagine this will help his +/- considerably...i can see him being on the 2nd PP unit for the Leafs.

[klayman]

Hahaha! Eddie Belfour is great. RE: Proposed Rule Changes:


"That is not even the worse one I heard. The worse one I heard was every time a goalie goes down in a butterfly, they will give him a two-minute penalty and one foul and you get three fouls you are out of the game. They are trying to change the game too much. It is ridiculous."

Just offer them 1 billion dollars, Eddie and it will all go away. :D

[sterlingice]

Hahaha! Eddie Belfour is great. RE: Proposed Rule Changes:


Just offer them 1 billion dollars, Eddie and it will all go away. :D
That story is why Eddie is on of my favorite players ever. That and the 'hawks connection.

SI

[Travis]

Anybody watch the Oilers/Thrashers game tonight? If you didn't, check out the highlights. In the end, the Thrashers didn't have a choice but to play without a goalie, well, because they didn't have any left :D

[Travis]

Dola, we also got to find out just what kind of fighter Sutton is, when he turtles away from fighting Laraque, then ducks him again during the big melee, then grabs Brewer before Georges can find him. What a pansy.

The bit with Bishai in the Atlanta bench was great, as was the Conklin/Nurminen tussle. I'm curious if Conklin realized what getting Pasi to fight would mean for Atlanta, if so, head's up move Ty.

[sachmo71]

And Jackman was a first round pick of the Stars.

[Blade]

Anybody watch the Oilers/Thrashers game tonight? If you didn't, check out the highlights. In the end, the Thrashers didn't have a choice but to play without a goalie, well, because they didn't have any left :D

All I can say is DAMN!!! I was at the game last night, and when all Hell broke loose, every fan in the building was on their feet. It felt like a playoff game out there! The air was electric!

Fun game to be at, that is for sure!

[Maple Leafs]

All I can say is DAMN!!! I was at the game last night, and when all Hell broke loose, every fan in the building was on their feet.You mean, "on their feet" so they could get up and leave the building, right?

I mean, hockey fans don't like fighting, right? Isn't that what the holier-than-thou types keep telling us?

[Blade]

You mean, "on their feet" so they could get up and leave the building, right?

I mean, hockey fans don't like fighting, right? Isn't that what the holier-than-thou types keep telling us?

Oh, of course...I would never cheer very loudly during hockey fights...laugh as players get beaten to the ice...

Nothing like that...

:D

[Draft Dodger]

tell that to the little guy sitting next to me at that Sabres game....

:)

[klayman]

Hey, it's Honolulu_Blue's birthday today! Happy Birthday!

[Draft Dodger]

Hey, it's Honolulu_Blue's birthday today! Happy Birthday!

which one?