Werewolf XLIV: The Fightin’ Fundies vs. Them Gays - GAME OVER

[st.cronin]

dola, I don't think it makes a difference though. Since she's the only one on the list, my guess is that even one vote gets her stoned.

[Blade6119]

VOTE ST. CRONIN LIBERAL

[Tyrith]

Yeah...the voting rules are really weird....but I'm getting out of it what cronin is, at the moment. Which is kind of scary.

[Blade6119]

Ill say this to cronin, just in case the small chance happened. If you failed, that does not make it a bad thing.

[st.cronin]

hmmm, that makes it 2-2 me and Chief for the list.

Very bizarre move by Blade there - he endorses my strategy, and votes to put me on the subversive list, putting me in the position of maybe my vote off him.

[Blade6119]

I didnt support your strategy at all..LSG is dead...if we have to vote a person onto the liberal list as well, im toying with who i want there. Unless i hear a certain response, i see no reason for it not to be you

[Tyrith]

Rules clarification would be really nice...otherwise I'm probably going to retract my vote on Rum because it's highly pointless and was designed only to stop us from having another day where nothing useful happens.

[st.cronin]

I didnt support your strategy at all..LSG is dead...if we have to vote a person onto the liberal list as well, im toying with who i want there. Unless i hear a certain response, i see no reason for it not to be you

A certain response to what? Go ahead, put me on the liberal list. It would be a good thing for the village to see that I am a red-blooded god-fearing American, because then the fingers will be pointing at you. Me getting stoned with a wolf leading the charge would be the best contribution I can make to the village.

[Blade6119]

If you dont know in response to what, it greatly eases my mind about voting you.

[Tyrith]

UNVOTE RUM

I'm staying out of this now.

[st.cronin]

*shrug*

You play your game, I play mine. I'm not taking my vote off you, even if I could save myself.

[Blade6119]

Save yourself? Im not voting to kill you...

I hope you know, this is all a game...you know im not serious, im just having fun and working the mental game

[Abe Sargent]

Rules clarification would be really nice...otherwise I'm probably going to retract my vote on Rum because it's highly pointless and was designed only to stop us from having another day where nothing useful happens.

You can vote for one or the other. Liberal list subs for stoning if no stoning goes forth.

[st.cronin]

Save yourself? Im not voting to kill you...

I hope you know, this is all a game...you know im not serious, im just having fun and working the mental game

What I mean is, I have no fear of being put on the list. In fact, I welcome it.

[Blade6119]

Oh...so both dont take place....well then your as safe as could be cronin, whether thats good or bad

[st.cronin]

dola

I know that sounds like I'm hinting at a Duke role, but I'm not.

[DaddyTorgo]

UNVOTE STONE LSG


so what can I do with cronin? vote him liberal?

VOTE LABEL ST. CRONIN LIBERAL

[DaddyTorgo]

explanation:

I don't see why cronin is trying to point the finger at me, let alone all thse other people. I feel better about that then stoning LSG.

[st.cronin]

explanation:

I don't see why cronin is trying to point the finger at me, let alone all thse other people. I feel better about that then stoning LSG.

good, bring it on ... I love it when the guys I'm suspicious of come after me

[DaddyTorgo]

suspicious? what have I done to raise suspiscion?

[Abe Sargent]

Just finished watching a major game winning play by my WVU! I'll get caught up in a second

[st.cronin]

suspicious? what have I done to raise suspiscion?

"3rd", followed by an unconvincing explanation.

[Abe Sargent]

Okay results to follow.

[Abe Sargent]

During the day, your eyes turn towards your neighbors with suspicion. No one slips up, and with no additional information, the sun winds its way across the sky with alacrity.

However, late in the day, one of your membership slips. It’s just a crack, but it’s enough to put her on the liberal list. One of you affirms that she is disharmonious.

Although only one or two of you begin the stoning, the rest of you quickly add your strength to the few that began. Within minutes, skin bursts, blood flows, and a modest cairn covers the spot where LoneStarGirl fell.


Day Two has ended. Night Two has begun and will end at 2:00 am.


Okay let’s talk about the rules for a second. When I created the concept of the liberal list, it was merely a tweak of a previous existing werewolf mechanic, the jail, wherein only people in jail may be killed. The liberal list is a jail.

I added several game mechanics to make sure that there were enough people on the list to keep the game flow going. Some of those mechanics you know about, others you do not. I had created behind the scenes rules in case things didn’t go right, and that included what I called the “J’accuse” rule, which you have now seen.

However, things behind the scenes have gone very unpredictably, including Night Zero. So I am stopping and writing this for a few seconds. Let’s get all of the uncertainty out of the water, and I’ll tweak the J’Accuse rule. All tweaks below are designed to replace previously stated rules.

During the day, you may vote to stone or vote to place a person on the liberal list. Not both. Stone votes may only be cast for someone already on the liberal list.

If a person is placed on the liberal list, you may change your vote to stone that person at any time during the day.

At the end of the day, you will stone the person on the liberal list with the greatest amount of stone votes. In the case of a tied stone vote, an undisclosed method will be used to determine the victim. Even one stone votes trumps J’accuse.

If there are no stone votes, either because you chose not to vote for someone on the list or because no one is on the list, then the highest vote getter gets placed on the liberal list. In the case of a tie, no one does.

Okay, hope that helps. If you need more questions answered, please ask.

[Lathum]

NICE. WE GOT ONE!

[st.cronin]

Well, I was definitely not expecting that. She was gay!

[hoopsguy]

What??? A Day 1 (OK, technically Day 2) kill for the good guys? Inconceivable!

[Ironhead]

Our community is one step closer to purity! Surely this was divine guidance.

[Tyrith]

Well, take providence when it is given to us.

[ImTheCrew]

been awhile since we got a bad guy on the first day

[st.cronin]

okay, well if there is anything i learned in the past couple of days is that NTN is a hell of a bad guy. so my initial vote goes to him

vote ntndeacon

But if i am on in the next two hours and can prevent a tie, I will do so.

This post strikes me as important. "past couple of days," what does that mean?

[Lathum]

This post strikes me as important. "past couple of days," what does that mean?

I'm assuming she meant games but it could be a slip up

[st.cronin]

I'm assuming she meant games but it could be a slip up

That was my assumption at first, as well. LSG only made like 6 posts in the entire thread, and I haven't really found anything else.

[Blade6119]

cronin...i know you dont want me to say it, but you stating you wouldnt even consider lynching LSG at a time when she had no votes looks pretty bad now

[st.cronin]

cronin...i know you dont want me to say it, but you stating you wouldnt even consider lynching LSG at a time when she had no votes looks pretty bad now

duh

[LoneStarGirl]

well fuck :D

[KWhit]

I didnt support your strategy at all..LSG is dead...if we have to vote a person onto the liberal list as well, im toying with who i want there. Unless i hear a certain response, i see no reason for it not to be you

I can't say that I understand what you mean by that statement. Can you elaborate for the rest of us?

[DaddyTorgo]

excellent! one of those god-hating fags down!!

do we want to look at ntn anyways, based on the fact that that may have been an actual slipup by LSG?

[Blade6119]

I can't say that I understand what you mean by that statement. Can you elaborate for the rest of us?

To be honest, im not sure how to at the current time...i was moderately worried cronin had a certain role that had a reason to suspect me(a good role, and a small chance). I made a comment to him before that to test my theory, and he had no idea what i was talking about. Therefore, cronin was not the good role i thought possible and as such i felt better about my vote. I was trying to understand his seeming crusade for me 2 days on now, had an idea, and it was proven false.

I know this all doesnt make much sense...it will when i reveal later in the game(which based on my role im pretty sure i will have to) i hope. Until then, you simply have to trust im not a outcast of gods perfect flock.

[st.cronin]

If I had a role that could interact with you, Blade, you would probably have known about it by now.

[Blade6119]

No, i wouldnt

[st.cronin]

I see. No, sorry, I don't.

[KWhit]

*Shakes head in confusion*

[st.cronin]

*Shakes head in confusion*

No kidding.

[Blade6119]

Cronin, i dont think your in a position to be judging me...i was the first person to say openly we should lynch LSG, you were the one defending her.

So be confused, but dont try to spin this around on me. Ive tried to drop hints all game long to my role, and you continue to seem to be pro-role reveal. You will say your not, of course...but ive seen a few comments now that were pro role reveal. Ive already said too much, and i dont intend to say more for the time being.

[Abe Sargent]

The morning sun brings a scream of fear from Almost Heaven, West Virginia. A bolt of adrenaline tears through your bodies. All of you spring forth, hastily put on clothes, and dash out the doors of your houses.

Just inside the treeline you find the place where the scream came. The doors are wide open, and you enter Marie O’Connolly’s house. You follow the sounds of crying and enter her bedroom. There you find her hatchet buried in her head. Her hands have been tied together in a praying formation, and the Bible is open to a particular page. Underlined in the blood of the victim is the passage:

Hebrews 10:30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.

The group of you quietly bury her body and say a quick service over her body. Many of you refuse to trade glances or talk much about her. You see, on the way out of her house, you stepped over cluttered cassette tapes and CDs. Someone accidentally kicked down a stack and they were all over the floor. As you gaped down, you saw titles like, “Iron Maiden,” “Slayer,” and “Metallica.”


Night Two has ended. Day Three has begun and will end at 9:00 pm EST Wednesday night.

[st.cronin]

but ive seen a few comments now that were pro role reveal.

This is an outright lie. I know what statements you are talking about, and the fact you continue to not understand what I am saying makes me more and more sure that you are a wolf. This is not a case of disagreeing about strategy; if you were NOT a wolf, I believe you would understand the points I have made. That you have not greatly worries me.

[st.cronin]

VOTE BLADE

[Blade6119]

Cronin, i am not a simple villager...if you are claiming to have no role, thats fine. But my role is unique in this game, of that im fairly sure. So if you believe yourself to have the universal role, i hope others can clear you. But dont expect me to believe a word you say any time soon.

VOTE TO THE LIST ST. CRONIN

Was vehemently against the LSG lynch, and has hinted at a special role all game...but is now hinting that he is the universal role all good guys should know. I just cant keep track of all his flip-flops.

[Blade6119]

Evil is either trying to set up NTN, or clear him...i cant tell which...not only did LSG vote NTN, but it was NTN who was aggresively pursuing bulletsponge yesterday. It seems to be a little to coincidental for my tastes

[st.cronin]

and has hinted at a special role all game.


This is also not true. Either another lie, or you have not understood me at all. Either way, wolfish.

[Blade6119]

You told me you had special knowledge of game mechanics...how else would you like me to percieve that?

[st.cronin]

Evil is either trying to set up NTN, or clear him...i cant tell which...not only did LSG vote NTN, but it was NTN who was aggresively pursuing bulletsponge yesterday. It seems to be a little to coincidental for my tastes

I'm pretty sure its a setup. I have ntn as 75% cleared based on his comments.

[st.cronin]

You told me you had special knowledge of game mechanics...how else would you like me to percieve that?

No, I didn't - all I ever said was that you didn't understand the game mechanics. THAT'S WHY I WAS SUSPICIOUS OF YOU. If I had *special* knowledge, I wouldn't think it suspicious that you didn't understand them, right?

[Blade6119]

Your right, you said you were "more aware." Im sorry to misspeak there...you did say you were dropping hints though, i can quote you on that...and i totally dont understand your hints, so i hope others do. Until then i guess we can just sit and here have a fun little chat.

How did the first week of recruiting go? A lot of competition?

[st.cronin]

More than I expected, but less than I found last year, and its all from the big12. So if they don't sign with me they'll just transfer over in a year or two.

[Blade6119]

lol, i envy you...even if they do sign with me, they will just transfer in a year or two :)

I was suprised...a top 30 FS got 2 offers, a top 30 SS got 7. Just interesting to see the choices other humans made. I picked the wrong QB of the two interested, and now its too late to swap. That one mistake is likely going to hurt me in a year or two pretty badly. I wish we could scout then offer in week 2 ;)

[Blade6119]

Just to clarify, i just IMd 2 players of this game for outside of the game reasons...didnt get a response from either though, sadly. Just thought id say in case they got the wrong idea.

[Chief Rum]

Congrats to us townfolk for bringing LSGAY down. She slipped with her foul, Satan-driven tongue, and our stones made sure she didn't egt up again.

I am confused by the interplay between Brothers st. cronin and Blade. It seems they are quibbling about behind the scenes roles and hints that I haven't caught (not that that would be a first). I'm inclined to put them both on the liberal list, just so we have the option to discuss them with more on the line.

Anyone else find it curious that the wolves picked bulletsponge as their target?

[hoopsguy]

So Bullet was a Fundie, but listened to Devil music? I hate to lose a true member of the flock, but suspect that this one may have had liberal tendencies. May god have mercy on her soul.

[hoopsguy]

Also, it doesn't look like there are any updates to the list of liberals. So for now we are looking to vote on that rather than a stoning.

[DaddyTorgo]

well I'm still alive. so that's a plus! headed home to the computer. gather bullet is dead which is a shame. more in a bit

[ImTheCrew]

Vote Bullet to liberal list

[hoopsguy]

Crew, I don't think you need to vote the dead person to the liberal list. Particularly when they show up as a Fundy.

Get in the game, Dad!

[DaddyTorgo]

so you have NTN as 75% cleared cronin? despite the fact that between when you posted that and your earlier comment about "what did LSG mean about NTN being a good wolf the past couple of days" NTN didn't say anything? and LSG wasn't exactly a lock to be stoned at that point either...

[ImTheCrew]

LOL sorry VOTE BLADE TO LIBERAL LIST

had bullet on mind

[st.cronin]

so you have NTN as 75% cleared cronin? despite the fact that between when you posted that and your earlier comment about "what did LSG mean about NTN being a good wolf the past couple of days" NTN didn't say anything? and LSG wasn't exactly a lock to be stoned at that point either...

Yep, my guess about that post is that there was some discussion amongst the homos about who to take down, and that something ntn said had alarmed them, so they were looking to frame him up.

I think ntn is on God's side.

[hoopsguy]

One game mechanic that I'm wondering about is the ability for people to end up on the liberal list overnight - not based on something they say, but on some other action taken either by them or against them.

So far we have not seen this come into play - I guess I expected it to based on how I read the rules initially. So without LoneStarGirl's misstep, we would be playing a game with very, very limited information. That just doesn't seem like how Anxiety presented the game at the outset. Which makes me think I'm clearly missing something. Anyone have thoughts (that they are willing to share) on this that might help make a little more sense out of this?

[path12]

LSG was bad with ntn in the Marvel game and IIRC correctly in one of the small games also, so that could have been what she meant. The fact that she was calling him out so early leads me to explore other options.

Not sure what to think of the cronin/blade discussion. Tend to believe it's the usual early game misunderstanding that ends up becoming more of a drama than it deserves, though it strikes me that there might be something there one way or the other. I need to go back through some of those statements.

No access at night sucks, understand that is the reason why I'm quieter than normal.

[path12]

One game mechanic that I'm wondering about is the ability for people to end up on the liberal list overnight - not based on something they say, but on some other action taken either by them or against them.

So far we have not seen this come into play - I guess I expected it to based on how I read the rules initially. So without LoneStarGirl's misstep, we would be playing a game with very, very limited information. That just doesn't seem like how Anxiety presented the game at the outset. Which makes me think I'm clearly missing something. Anyone have thoughts (that they are willing to share) on this that might help make a little more sense out of this?

As a vanilla role I'm not sure I can help much, but I am working off the assumption that some of the night roles can investigate and if liberal tendencies are found (ie Bullet's metal records) that they could then place that person on the list. I'm also assuming a traditional seer role that could out them gays.

[hoopsguy]

I have no inside knowledge about how game balance would work here, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if both sides had a night ability to put people on the Liberal list. Which is why I'm surprised that with three night phases so far (we had a Night 0) that no one has made their way onto the list yet.

[hoopsguy]

Also, now that we have seen a night kill I'm definitely intrigued about what might have happened on Night 1. If there were any fireworks, both sides kept a pretty low profile.

A Night 1 conversion seems like a pretty likely result. If that is the case, there were probably 2-3 gays to start the game. I don't think it is at all likely, at this point, that there were a high number (like six) starting gays.

[st.cronin]

One game mechanic that I'm wondering about is the ability for people to end up on the liberal list overnight - not based on something they say, but on some other action taken either by them or against them.

So far we have not seen this come into play - I guess I expected it to based on how I read the rules initially. So without LoneStarGirl's misstep, we would be playing a game with very, very limited information. That just doesn't seem like how Anxiety presented the game at the outset. Which makes me think I'm clearly missing something. Anyone have thoughts (that they are willing to share) on this that might help make a little more sense out of this?

I have no inside knowledge about how game balance would work here, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if both sides had a night ability to put people on the Liberal list. Which is why I'm surprised that with three night phases so far (we had a Night 0) that no one has made their way onto the list yet.

Exactly the sort of thing I've been wondering.

[hoopsguy]

As a result, no one is seconded, no one has a plurality of votes, every nomination ends at one perpson, and no names are written on teh board.

You are not dismayed, however, for the Lord provides. Somehow, you know a name will be there in the moning.

Day One has Ended. Night One has Begun and will end at 2:00 am est Tuesday.

This is why I expected to see a name on the list overnight - maybe a case of me reading a little too much into the moderator text ...

[Tyrith]

This feeling of cluelessness I have right is just wonderful, I'll tell you.

[st.cronin]

I said on day 1 that I expected within a few days that the entire roster of players would be on the list. So, yeah. Anyway.

[Lathum]

I think it odd Cronin was trying to save LSG yesterday, almost like trying to hide out in the open.

VOTE ST.CRONIN

[st.cronin]

Except, as I pointed out Lathum, it would have been impossible to save her - one vote and she would have been stoned.

At any rate, I wish I *would* end up on the liberal list, and get stoned. It might finally point some people in the right direction.

[hoopsguy]

and FTR...i didn't vote last night because it was clear that nothing was going to happen. We weren't going to get to lynch anyone, and honesty I expected multiple people to end up on the liberal-list after night-actions so we'd have a choice today and didn't see any reason to put a 3rd person up there without any actual reason.

OK, coming back around to this. While I have said that I thought we would have seen a name on the "Liberal List" overnight by now, why did you think we would see two names on the list at the start of Day 2?

Also, would the names on the list have been "without any actual reason" as your vote potentially would have been on Day 1? You have also suggested earlier that you do not have any particularly meaningful abilities, so I'm really puzzled where you were headed with these comments. Suggesting two people sounds like you have a reason for the belief, but what?

[Ironhead]

This I what it looks like the final count was from last night:

Stoners
3 - LoneStarGirl - hoopsguy (232), Lathum (233), Ironhead (242)

Liberal Votes
3 - st.cronin - Chief Rum (179), Blade (252), DaddyTorgo (267 - changed stone vote)
1 - Chief Rum - path12 (185)
1 - bulletsponge - ntndeacon (182)
1 - Blade - st.cronin (183)
1 - DaddyTorgo - bulletsponge (199)
1 - ntndeacon - LoneStarGirl (205)

No Vote
Tyrith (unvoted for Chief Rum as liberal - cast no further vote)(260)
ImtheCrew
KWhit


ImtheCrew feels very under the radar to me. He did not cast a vote at all two days in a row. I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt due to confusion the 1st day, but I at this point I think I really need to hear why he didn't vote.

[bulletsponge]

http://www.smileyhut.com/sad/rip.gif

[DaddyTorgo]

what I MEANT cronin, was that the common way things work (as you know) is that we'll end up with a "runoff" or sorts between two different people, and try to use that to gain insight via voting records. So I had assumed that if were going to put one person on the list we'd then try to get another on there and have a "showdown" of sorts between them, and I didn't see any reason (with the added mechanic of having to get them on the list) to put a 3rd person in there to "muddy the water"

[Chief Rum]

Vote Bullet to liberal list

Hon, you're making the family look bad.

[KWhit]

Color me confused.

I think the blade - cronin thig is about the only thing I have to go on at this point. They're both acting suspicious, so I'll likely place a vote on one of them if nothing else happens today.

[Blade6119]

Here a very unbased in fact guess of evil for me right now:

LSG
Cronin
Kwhit

Just stating that publicly right now so i can go back to it later and see how wrong/right i was

[Blade6119]

Also, now that we have seen a night kill I'm definitely intrigued about what might have happened on Night 1. If there were any fireworks, both sides kept a pretty low profile.

A Night 1 conversion seems like a pretty likely result. If that is the case, there were probably 2-3 gays to start the game. I don't think it is at all likely, at this point, that there were a high number (like six) starting gays.
I dont have any evidence to back it up, but night 1 might have been a failed attack or conversion on me. Just putting that out there, as it is a possible explanation for night 1

[Chief Rum]

My gut says st. cronin isn't bad (or Blade), so I won't vote for them to the list just yet. But people have been too quiet. If he weren't my husband, I would probably be all over Crew.

I doubt LSG outed a wolf when she made the ntn comment. It was too early for her to play that card. It doesn't clear him, but it moves him down my list for now. hoops, Lathum and Ironhead get passes right now because they voted to stone LSG, and it was unclear at the time if they were voting against a liberal list vote (meaning all three votes were meaningful, even though only one was needed for the stoning, as it turned out).

That leaves Kwhit, path12, DaddyTorgo and Tyrith. Although Tyrith voted for me, a good, God-fearing woman, I think he is just misguided. So I will go with the one drawing the most suspicion right now in DaddyTorgo.

VOTE LIBERAL LIST DADDYTORGO

[Chief Rum]

I dont have any evidence to back it up, but night 1 might have been a failed attack or conversion on me. Just putting that out there, as it is a possible explanation for night 1

Did you see something to lead you to believe this?

[st.cronin]

Here a very unbased in fact guess of evil for me right now:

LSG
Cronin
Kwhit

Just stating that publicly right now so i can go back to it later and see how wrong/right i was

You think LSG is bad? Based on what?

[KWhit]

And why would you suspect me?

[hoopsguy]

I'm borrowing from Ironhead's list of votes from last night:


Stoners
3 - LoneStarGirl - hoopsguy (232), Lathum (233), Ironhead (242)

Liberal Votes
3 - st.cronin - Chief Rum (179), Blade (252), DaddyTorgo (267 - changed stone vote)
1 - Chief Rum - path12 (185)
1 - bulletsponge - ntndeacon (182)
1 - Blade - st.cronin (183)
1 - DaddyTorgo - bulletsponge (199)
1 - ntndeacon - LoneStarGirl (205)

I'm guessing that the wolves looked to spread out their votes at this point. The above list does not include the "No Votes".

So, would a wolf have the courage to hide their vote on LSG? If so, then I would guess it is Lathum - would be very audacious for a newcomer (Ironhead) to make that play in their first game. If not, I'm pretty sure we'll find one on the list of three voting for Cronin yesteday.

Other option would be to pick at some of the solo/non voters, but that leaves about half of our town.

[st.cronin]

Hoops, if Lathum is a wolf, I agree he would absolutely have stoned LSG. He would have played it exactly the way he did, in my opinion.

[Lathum]

You think LSG is bad? Based on what?

I would assume based on the fact that the player list on page one says "them gays" next to her name.:D

[Lathum]

Hoops, if Lathum is a wolf, I agree he would absolutely have stoned LSG. He would have played it exactly the way he did, in my opinion.

your kidding, right?

casting what equates to the first vote on someone( hoops and I voted the same exact time) is hardly burying your vote.

[st.cronin]

I would assume based on the fact that the player list on page one says "them gays" next to her name.:D

Yeah, I forgot to put rolly eyes or something in the post.

[st.cronin]

your kidding, right?

casting what equates to the first vote on someone( hoops and I voted the same exact time) is hardly burying your vote.

Not kidding. I'm not particularly suspicious of you, but don't try to convince me that you would have played it any differently if you were a wolf. You'd be wasting your time.

[Lathum]

Not kidding. I'm not particularly suspicious of you, but don't try to convince me that you would have played it any differently if you were a wolf. You'd be wasting your time.

likewise you were trying to talk people out of it.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Lathum
So St. Cronin. Are you saying we shouldn't lynch LSG?



Yes, that is exactly what I am saying.



...

[st.cronin]

likewise you were trying to talk people out of it.

Yep. Looks bad now, doesn't it. I fully expect to land on the subversive list and get stoned within a day or two - that would be the strongest play for the village.

[ntndeacon]

I'm borrowing from Ironhead's list of votes from last night:



I'm guessing that the wolves looked to spread out their votes at this point. The above list does not include the "No Votes".

So, would a wolf have the courage to hide their vote on LSG? If so, then I would guess it is Lathum - would be very audacious for a newcomer (Ironhead) to make that play in their first game. If not, I'm pretty sure we'll find one on the list of three voting for Cronin yesteday.

Other option would be to pick at some of the solo/non voters, but that leaves about half of our town.

I was wondering about the same thing. I would not be as quick to throw out the idea of a newcomer making that move. remember that wolves in general talk to each other. ANd if a newcomer was a wolf, they would probably let others take the lead on strategy decisions and follow those desicions where they lead.

[Blade6119]

Did you see something to lead you to believe this?

No, but i wouldnt see anything if it did happen...just the way my role works. Im just saying, based on knowledge the rest of you dont have, that it is a possiblity. Nothing was going to hurt me on night one, and since we didnt have a night kill its a possibilty they attempted to kill me.

[Blade6119]

I'm borrowing from Ironhead's list of votes from last night:



I'm guessing that the wolves looked to spread out their votes at this point. The above list does not include the "No Votes".

So, would a wolf have the courage to hide their vote on LSG? If so, then I would guess it is Lathum - would be very audacious for a newcomer (Ironhead) to make that play in their first game. If not, I'm pretty sure we'll find one on the list of three voting for Cronin yesteday.

Other option would be to pick at some of the solo/non voters, but that leaves about half of our town.

Remember though, 1 vote and LSG was dead...so it didnt matter if there were 1 or 50, anything past the first vote is off. Ill even say the first vote was, seeing as how it came after i said i was going to vote her for sure. Basically, every vote to kill LSG came after it was pretty clear she was dead. So i dont give anyone much credit for the vote. About all i learned yesterday is that cronin looks very bad(and doesnt have a better understanding of game mechanics either it appears)

[Blade6119]

And why would you suspect me?

You just seem to be making similar moves to cronin...in regards to information about my role last night, when you two played off each other to some extent when inquiring about it...as i said, not based on fact...just a guess for my own amusement post game.

[st.cronin]

You just seem to be making similar moves to cronin...in regards to information about my role last night, when you two played off each other to some extent when inquiring about it...as i said, not based on fact...just a guess for my own amusement post game.

You might put hoops in that group as well. My guess is that Kwhit and hoops are good, and understand the game much the same way that I do.

[Blade6119]

You might put hoops in that group as well. My guess is that Kwhit and hoops are good, and understand the game much the same way that I do.

No, i dont...hoops is interacting with you, but kwhit is playing off you...like a few posts ago, when you made your LSG joke about my list...kwhit came in next, and extended your question(obviously playing off your post). It could be unintentional, could be on purpose.

Hoops is conversing with you, not playing off you...its a key difference

[hoopsguy]

Blade, in regards to the LSG vote yesterday I would have felt significantly better about you if you had immediately put your vote on her after saying earlier that you planned to stone whoever was on the list. That is why I asked you about it after it took place - I wanted to see where you would go with it. In the end, you did not put your vote there. I don't see this as some kind of hanging offense, but I was surprised at the time that you did not place your vote immediately.

On Cronin, I'm obviously in agreement that looking at his statements now look bad for him. That said, I've put myself in bad positions a couple of times as a villager - much worse than I would have as a wolf with knowledge of what could transpire. I've actually got him on a "slightly more trusted" state right now.

So those are my thoughts on the two most active chat participants in the game. It's been awhile since I published a full "trust/untrust" list in a game, but I'll probably go through that exercise when I get home tonight.

[Blade6119]

Hoops, i didnt place a vote on LSG because i was still under the impression we would have a double vote(one for lynch, one for the list). So i figured if even 1 person voted LSG, my vote would be more valuable deciding who got put on the list for today. I placed my vote accordingly, and it was supported by another of cronins suspects(he thinks both DT and i are prob. wolfs) and we got him to be the top vote getter. It was after all of this that anxiety told us only one vote would count, and the list only came into play if we had no stoning.

At the time, i felt i was utilizing my vote to ensure we got favorable results in both votes(instead of chief hitting the list, like was the case at the time). It turned out to be a moot point, but thats my reasoning.

[DaddyTorgo]

*shrug*

well i'm good. So putting me on the liberal list is a waste.

think about how I play as a wolf, it's definitely not how i'm playing this game. my one comment was explainable, barely suspicious. But if the village wants to waste it's time stoning me that's y'all's choice.

[Tyrith]

Blade's little dance personally scares the heck out of me -- this is how it goes before he pulls one of those amazing stunts he tries. I don't know. The cronin/blade mess is one of those things I don't really know about -- blade's play is hard to predict, meaning I'd lean towards siding with cronin. I would mostly disregard the cronin case yesterday -- he's made the same argument about villagers in previous games, so it wasn't out of character at all. Neither is what blade is doing...but his tactics are generally much harder for us to cope with as a wolf.

[Blade6119]

By my count, and correct me if im wrong. We have:

Liberal List:
Blade - 2(Cronin, ITC)
Cronin - 2(Blade, Lathum)
DT - 1(Chief Rum)

[Blade6119]

Blade's little dance personally scares the heck out of me -- this is how it goes before he pulls one of those amazing stunts he tries. I don't know. The cronin/blade mess is one of those things I don't really know about -- blade's play is hard to predict, meaning I'd lean towards siding with cronin. I would mostly disregard the cronin case yesterday -- he's made the same argument about villagers in previous games, so it wasn't out of character at all. Neither is what blade is doing...but his tactics are generally much harder for us to cope with as a wolf.

Oh, if you only knew...i expect quite a few people will view my play later this game as a crazy stunt as a wolf. I promise you, these feelings will likely resurface when i try to explain my situation later. I dont intend to now, but i will be stunned if most people believe my story later in the game

[hoopsguy]

Blade, if I used the word "ectoplasm" would you know what I mean? Because I've gotten the idea from your posts so far that this might be applicable to your situation.

[ntndeacon]

If Cronin is one of them Blade, I think I can see Kwhit as a cohort of cronin's

[st.cronin]

By my count, and correct me if im wrong. We have:

Liberal List:
Blade - 2(Cronin, ITC)
Cronin - 2(Blade, Lathum)
DT - 1(Chief Rum)

I'm happy with that list. Me and the two players I suspect the most. I encourage people to vote only for players on that list.

[hoopsguy]

I'm bummed that there haven't been people around this afternoon when today was the first time this week I've had my normal availability.

Cronin, I'll probably take you up on your request to keep the liberal vote limited to that group unless I hear some kind of late-breaking news today. Like I mentioned yesterday, I don't view putting someone on the list as a particularly scary proposition since they are a good bet to be scanned that night - assuming we have an active seer role in the game.

Stoning? That is an entirely different scenario ...

[st.cronin]

Hoops, I disagree. If anybody is on the liberal list, somebody is getting stoned. The only way I don't get stoned if I'm on the list is if somebody else ends up on the list via night action.

[Tyrith]

I'm gonna have to cast a vote and leave here...long term having blade on the list makes the most sense to me, in case we need to get rid of him. And I'm fairly suspicious of him right now.

VOTE LIBERALIZE BLADE

[Blade6119]

Blade, if I used the word "ectoplasm" would you know what I mean? Because I've gotten the idea from your posts so far that this might be applicable to your situation.

I dont think so...if your referring to the game you and i first played together, when certain things occured, i dont see any correlation to that and my current situation. If you remember what i originally suggested to you for my character in marvel, as far as his powers might go, its in that general region. Its not the same, but its the same basic principle.

[Blade6119]

I'm gonna have to cast a vote and leave here...long term having blade on the list makes the most sense to me, in case we need to get rid of him. And I'm fairly suspicious of him right now.

VOTE LIBERALIZE BLADE

For now, until we have multiple people on the list, putting me on the list today is like killing me tomorrow...and the fact you would rather kill me(for being the first to support an LSG lynch) instead of cronin(who flat out told you not to lynch LSG) is simply stunning. The fact you were around last night(as evidenced by you removing your chief vote) yet finished with a no vote may be telling in itself.

[Blade6119]

And im still intrigued by the whole NTN circle of coincidences....so i have like 5 suspects id like explored...dont really think one is evil over the other, but i think i have my best chance of avoiding the list with cronin.

[Abe Sargent]

I dont think so...if your referring to the game you and i first played together, when certain things occured, i dont see any correlation to that and my current situation. If you remember what i originally suggested to you for my character in marvel, as far as his powers might go, its in that general region. Its not the same, but its the same basic principle.


I'm vaguely uncomfortable to you using private information to share about yourself. If you said, "In an earlier WW game its an identical role" or somehting similar, that'd be okay. Everybody could do the research if they cared. But to say, its in an pm I sent you a while ago about this subject, that I have an issue with.

[Blade6119]

Ok, ill change what i said...its similar(again, to some extent) to a role in Horus Heresy...that better anxiety?

[hoopsguy]

Anxiety, FWIW I don't recall what Blade is talking about - I went through maybe 100 different "powers" when designing that game, and I can't remember what his initial suggestion is (or whether it was even Moon Knight, which I don't think it was).

Back to the game at hand ...

[st.cronin]

Can you save us the work and describe your role in that game, please?

[Blade6119]

It wasnt my role in that game i was referring to. I dont intend to reveal it, just giving hoops a better idea(and everyone now). So no cronin, again i will not reveal my role(which in essence is what your asking).

[Abe Sargent]

That's fine, Blade.

[st.cronin]

It wasnt my role in that game i was referring to. I dont intend to reveal it, just giving hoops a better idea(and everyone now). So no cronin, again i will not reveal my role(which in essence is what your asking).

I'm not asking you to reveal your role, I'm asking you to save me the work of looking up what you're obliquely referring to. If you didn't want to give anything away, you shouldn't have said anything. If you're trying to mislead me, I'm asking you to make it easier for me to understand what fiction you're writing.

[Blade6119]

I'm not asking you to reveal your role, I'm asking you to save me the work of looking up what you're obliquely referring to. If you didn't want to give anything away, you shouldn't have said anything. If you're trying to mislead me, I'm asking you to make it easier for me to understand what fiction you're writing.

Hoops asked me a question about a game we played together(or so i believe) that might help him understand my situation...i explained to him a different situation that better described it. He didnt follow, and anxiety didnt like it. So to comply with rules(i wouldnt have said anything about horus otherwise, as i dont like even narrowing it that much for everyone) i made a suitable pucic correlation so everyone could be just as confused as hoopsguy now is im sure. Me telling you what role it is similar too would give away far too much, and as such i must deny. If you think im trying to mislead you(which you have done since day one), frankly i dont care. Your not the one any of this was intended for, and i hope you have a nice day. :)

[st.cronin]

dola, just realized you said "a role" in horus heresy, instead of "my role."

So I guess I need a list of roles from that game, but never mind.

[Blade6119]

public*...not pucic

[hoopsguy]

Day 3 Trust/Distrust List
1. KWhit - Sister Thelma Snider (Female) - very few posts, hard to have a real read on him yet. No vote yesterday. Suggested closeness to St. Cronin? Slight distrust.

2. Tyrith - Brother William Tyler (Male) - less engaged than I expect him to be in games. No vote yesterday. Moderate distrust.

3. ntndeacon - Sister Sandra Cotton (Female) - bad vote yesterday (for the Fundy Bulletsponge), took vote from gay LoneStarGirl. No meaningful trust or distrust yet.

4. path - Sister Mary Czinski (Female) - very typical game so far, for either side. Expect more involvement as days go by. Very slight distrust.

5. Blade - Brother James McKinnon (Male) - lightning rod as usual, suggested having a role that has weaknesses (my interpretation), combative with Cronin. Pro-stoning, but did not vote to stone LSG. Despite this, slight trust as I don't think he alludes to vulnerability as a bad guy.

6. st.cronin -Brother Leroy Czinski (Male) - gunning for Blade from early in game, also distrusts DaddyTorgo. Was opposed to stoning without proof, which looks poor in light of LSG yesterday. Moderate trust.

7. Lathum - Brother Tanner McFlannery (Male) - low profile, cast early vote to stone LSG. Knowing how he plays as a wolf, this doesn't mean much at all to me. Slight distrust.

8. hoopsguy- Brother Elijah Shepherd (Male) - I trust myself 100%.

10. Chief Rum - Sister Elizabeth Shepherd (Female) - typical Chief game so far, waiting for the long post ending in "Elementary, Watson" sometime around Night 4. No trust or distrust yet.

12. ImtheCrew - Brother Roger Shepherd (Male) - cast a vote for the dead guy this morning, very few posts, no vote yesterday. Slight trust, as gays should know who they killed, right?

13. DaddyTorgo - Brother Peter Czinski (Male) - posted that he thought two people would be put on liberal list overnight, still don't understand it. Late switch away from LSG to Cronin yesterday. Person I'm most confused by in the game at this point. Slight distrust.

14. Ironhead - Brother Richard Baker (Male) - his vote for LoneStarGirl as a newer player carries more weight with me than Lathum's because I'm not giving him credit for advanced gamesmanship on his 2nd day. A shaky 1st in trust.

[hoopsguy]

I would be interested in hearing people's thoughts on the trust list - on other people as well, not just a self-defense :)

Seriously, I haven't done one of these in a game for quite some time and I'm not really sure why. I find that it helps provide clarity for later conversations and a good tool to see where my assumptions are at a given point in time.

Like after the game, to see how wrong/dumb I was, for example ...

[DaddyTorgo]

hoops...i've had a lot of stuff going on. My head hasn't necessarily been in the game, which may be why i'm confusing. Then again, you once said that you thought you had a read on me, so i'm happy that i've managed to confuse that. I'll have to keep that in mind for the next time I'm evil.

which isn't this game FWIW

I still think cronin is suspicious. And Tyrith with his vote today and lack of a vote yesterday is raising my eyebrow.

I agree with you about ITC and Ironhead FWIW hoops.

[st.cronin]

Hoops, I don't have a real feel for most players yet. I have ntn a notch above everybody else, but that is because of assumptions, and my assumptions have not yielded much so far.

[DaddyTorgo]

i guess if you had to pin me down, i'd say I find cronin suspicious because something in his play this game reminds of mafia when we were both evil, and how he came out playing that game early on. But it's more a "feeling" than anything I can point to. I guess it's...coming out and trying to be very clean-cut and declarative at a point in the game when everyone else is kinda...waffling and unsure.

since the liberal-list is slightly different than jail, in that there's no penalty for being on it (as far as I can tell) like there is with jail, wouldn't it make sense for all of us to put ourselves on the liberal list once we reach a certain point in the game? otherwise stoning someone becomes a 2-step process...and we could lose the game on that 2nd step. It doesn't necessarily make sense for now, but it's just a strategic option to consider for later...

[DaddyTorgo]

Hoops, I don't have a real feel for most players yet. I have ntn a notch above everybody else, but that is because of assumptions, and my assumptions have not yielded much so far.

and they're wrong about me

[st.cronin]

since the liberal-list is slightly different than jail, in that there's no penalty for being on it (as far as I can tell) like there is with jail, wouldn't it make sense for all of us to put ourselves on the liberal list once we reach a certain point in the game? otherwise stoning someone becomes a 2-step process...and we could lose the game on that 2nd step. It doesn't necessarily make sense for now, but it's just a strategic option to consider for later...

I like this idea.

Shoot, I'll go first - to hell with the liberals.

[st.cronin]

By the way, DT just jumped up quite a bit in my eyes - I think he's seeing the game the right way (for a conservative).

[Abe Sargent]

I like this idea.

Shoot, I'll go first - to hell with the liberals.

st.cronin is now on the liberal list.

[Lathum]

I think your list is awefull

[DaddyTorgo]

the fact that you are seeing the game in somewhat the same light cronin makes me think you're either a heterosexual or a very crafty and devious homosexual.

anxiety...can you confirm that there is indeed no penalty for being on the liberal list? if the entire village is on the liberal list but we erradicate the gay scourge, do we still win a complete victory??

[DaddyTorgo]

hoops, what do you think of my reasoning?

[hoopsguy]

Cronin, I don't think a wolf would willingly put themselves on the chopping block like you just did. Like I said earlier, you have been too backwards to make sense to me as a wolf. But it is only going to take one vote to kill you and we don't have someone put on the liberal list that can be set up for a potential seer tonight. I really hate this strategy - if you were going to execute it I wish you had done so right at the deadline.

[DaddyTorgo]

I think the only possible downside I see would be something where like...the gays can only convert those already on the liberal list, so by doing this we're opening a lot more people up for conversion...but i doubt that's a game mechanic, because it would severly limit their choices of who to convert, so I feel pretty good that's not the case.

[hoopsguy]

hoops, what do you think of my reasoning?

It only works if the gays are putting themselves in harms way or the remaining villagers are not particuarly bloodthirsty. Given that this is werewolf, and conventional wisdom suggests not wasting lynch opportunity (bad guys have clear cut night edge) I expect he will get that one vote.

I'm not sure if there is any point in the game where you can have enough trust within the group to pull it off.

[DaddyTorgo]

so wait. Once someone is on the liberal list it only takes one vote to kill them? so we could have multiple people off the liberal list killed tonight?

that does wrinkle things a bit...because the wolves can take out multiple people by voting for them. But if they do, they end up standing out.

I think this strategy only works if we all trust in the lord. If everyone puts themselves on the liberal list and agrees to follow the stoning directions of one person, then anyone who deviates from that will be found out as a wolf, and it would seem to me (maybe i'm wrong though, I havn't actually done the actual math) that the odds would dictate that we'd find the wolves long before we reached 1-1 or 2-1.

[Abe Sargent]

the fact that you are seeing the game in somewhat the same light cronin makes me think you're either a heterosexual or a very crafty and devious homosexual.

anxiety...can you confirm that there is indeed no penalty for being on the liberal list? if the entire village is on the liberal list but we erradicate the gay scourge, do we still win a complete victory??

Winning conditions for the Fightin' Fundies - Get rid of all Them Gays. That's it.

[hoopsguy]

Well, I believe it is top vote getter on Liberal List. But it doesn't take a majority of people, just one vote is sufficient and it keeps us from getting to vote on the Liberal List (see last night).

[Abe Sargent]

so wait. Once someone is on the liberal list it only takes one vote to kill them? so we could have multiple people off the liberal list killed tonight?

that does wrinkle things a bit...because the wolves can take out multiple people by voting for them. But if they do, they end up standing out.

I think this strategy only works if we all trust in the lord. If everyone puts themselves on the liberal list and agrees to follow the stoning directions of one person, then anyone who deviates from that will be found out as a wolf, and it would seem to me (maybe i'm wrong though, I havn't actually done the actual math) that the odds would dictate that we'd find the wolves long before we reached 1-1 or 2-1.

No, plurality wins in a stone vote with multiple candidates received votes. I even mention that it my clarification last night. However, stone votes trump J'Accuse votes.

[DaddyTorgo]

cronin wont necessarily die. How's this. We say "we believe cronin to be good. Anyone who votes for him will immediately draw the wrath of the village."

use the "liberal list" as sort of a...visible COT. Reverse it's purpose.Since we'll be able to see if the wolves vote for anyone on it. Of course it requires everyone to buy into that "well I won't vote for someone once they get moved there."

[DaddyTorgo]

and it won't protect them at night of course.

I'm just throwin stuff out there, tryin to get us an edge.

[Lathum]

cronin wont necessarily die. How's this. We say "we believe cronin to be good. Anyone who votes for him will immediately draw the wrath of the village."

use the "liberal list" as sort of a...visible COT. Reverse it's purpose.Since we'll be able to see if the wolves vote for anyone on it. Of course it requires everyone to buy into that "well I won't vote for someone once they get moved there."

what would stop the gays from getting themselves put on the list?

[st.cronin]

so wait. Once someone is on the liberal list it only takes one vote to kill them? so we could have multiple people off the liberal list killed tonight?



No, my understanding is everybody on the liberal list is a candidate. Whoever gets the most votes gets stoned. If one person gets one vote, that person gets stoned if nobody else gets any votes. If one person gets three votes, and somebody else gets two votes, only one person gets stoned - the one with more votes.

If I am wrong, Anxiety, please correct me.

Also I apologize for my foul language before.

[DaddyTorgo]

I need a coffee. I'm going to go now so that i'll be back in time for anything last minute.

VOTE LIBERALIZE TYRITH

for now. Because his lack of votes is curious, and he hasn't been playing a normal tyrith-game. Plus he's gunning for blade seemingly out of the blue (or so it feels like).

[DaddyTorgo]

what would stop the gays from getting themselves put on the list?

the declaration that we'll immediately stone anyone who puts themselves on the list without the general approval of the village?

getting coffee now. Like I said, twas just an idea. Might have been a bad one, I dunno.

[hoopsguy]

I'm going to see if we can leave Cronin on the list rather than stoning him.

VOTE LATHUM

[Lathum]

Hoops is playing the "helpfull villager" role to much

Unvote St. Cronin
VOTE HOOPS TO LIBERAL LIST

[Lathum]

I am a little confused. Do we still vote someone to liberal list if we already have someone on that list?

anyone have a vote count?

[st.cronin]

I am a little confused. Do we still vote someone to liberal list if we already have someone on that list?

anyone have a vote count?

I believe each day either somebody gets stoned or put on the list. So if nobody votes to stone me, somebody gets added to the list.

[Lathum]

UNVOTE HOOPSGUY
VOTE STONE ST.CRONIN

[Lathum]

dola-
I just don't trust him and the way he was selling the don't vote for LSG.

[hoopsguy]

Hoops is playing the "helpfull villager" role to much

Unvote St. Cronin
VOTE HOOPS TO LIBERAL LIST

I'm being very helpful if you are gay. Not as much if you aren't.

On a serious note, I don't like the candidates that we are bandying about as much as some others, you included. There are people I would move the vote to late to try and get someone I distrust on the list instead of someone I trust.

[st.cronin]

Good, bring it on. I don't trust you one bit, and I'll enjoy the heat this will bring you starting tomorrow.

[Lathum]

Good, bring it on. I don't trust you one bit, and I'll enjoy the heat this will bring you starting tomorrow.

Well I would rather be the only person in this game willing to take a shot as opposed to sitting around waiting for something to happen.

[st.cronin]

For what its worth, I have ntn at the highest level of trust. Blade and Lathum somewhere at the bottom. Everybody else pretty much neutral, although I think hoops and DT can be trusted.

I have no special role, so let's have no speculation about that.

[Abe Sargent]

I am a little confused. Do we still vote someone to liberal list if we already have someone on that list?

anyone have a vote count?

Under my new tweaked rules laid out yesterday, yes.

[Lathum]

Under my new tweaked rules laid out yesterday, yes.

what if there is a tie?

[Abe Sargent]

WHy don't I just quote my rules, posted yesterday, here for ya? :)

[st.cronin]

On day 1 there was a tie for the liberal list, and nobody got added. Abe said that ties for stonings get broken through some secret process.

[Abe Sargent]

During the day, you may vote to stone or vote to place a person on the liberal list. Not both. Stone votes may only be cast for someone already on the liberal list.

If a person is placed on the liberal list, you may change your vote to stone that person at any time during the day.

At the end of the day, you will stone the person on the liberal list with the greatest amount of stone votes. In the case of a tied stone vote, an undisclosed method will be used to determine the victim. Even one stone votes trumps J’accuse.

If there are no stone votes, either because you chose not to vote for someone on the list or because no one is on the list, then the highest vote getter gets placed on the liberal list. In the case of a tie, no one does.



^
|
|

[st.cronin]

So if Lathum doesn't unvote me, nobody gets added to the liberal list.

[DaddyTorgo]

hrmmm...so what are we looking at happening as of now?

[Abe Sargent]

I'm going to need a serious vote recap.

[Abe Sargent]

Let me see fi I can figure out what's going on.

[Ironhead]

At this point I am still neutral on most people, but I think Blade & Cronin's over the top approach is actually making me trust both of them more, Cronin moreso than Blade though. Blade is making some strange comments but I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt at this point. I'm starting to get the feeling that ntn is also probably good. The voting patterns surrounding him just seem too convenient.

I still think that ImtheCrew is being a little too quiet and his original post today was suspicious, but a vote on him gets the village nowhere. Tyrith was in my original suspect list and he is still there after his no vote last night. Given that a vote on ImtheCrew gets me nowhere I am going to place my vote on Tyrith.

VOTE TYRITH - LIBERAL

[st.cronin]

hrmmm...so what are we looking at happening as of now?

I get stoned, and nobody gets added to the list. Which when I turn up good will make Lathum and Blade look bad.

[st.cronin]

Just you all keep in mind that Blade has been consistently misleading you, and Lathum is playing his typical wolf game. Cheerio village!

[Lathum]

Just you all keep in mind that Blade has been consistently misleading you, and Lathum is playing his typical wolf game. Cheerio village!

typical wolf game?

what is a typical wolf game?

[DaddyTorgo]

lathum can still save you...if he's not a wolf

[Lathum]

lathum can still save you...if he's not a wolf

why is that?

if anything the wolves are laying back, I'm willing to go out on a limb.

[Abe Sargent]

Time stamp

[Abe Sargent]

That is time, let me go count votes and whatnot.

[DaddyTorgo]

because cronin putting himself up there would be VERY ballsy for a wolf, especially considering they were already down LSG. ergo he is most likely not a wolf, and you're going to get him stoned. You're too smart to make that play without a reason

[st.cronin]

too late

I've done the best I could for the village, I encourage you to enforce DT's strategy - having more than one choice on this list is important.

[Lathum]

because cronin putting himself up there would be VERY ballsy for a wolf, especially considering they were already down LSG. ergo he is most likely not a wolf, and you're going to get him stoned. You're too smart to make that play without a reason

if I'm a wolf why put myself out there like that?

I have always said no lynch is the worst possible thing that can happen.

[DaddyTorgo]

if I'm a wolf why put myself out there like that?

I have always said no lynch is the worst possible thing that can happen.

put yourself out there like that because you figure you can explain it away and duck away from the heat.

so let me get this straight. No lynch is worse than lynching someone who we are 95% certain is good?

[st.cronin]

I have always said no lynch is the worst possible thing that can happen for the wolves.

fixed, I've said this in many games

[Lathum]

put yourself out there like that because you figure you can explain it away and duck away from the heat.

so let me get this straight. No lynch is worse than lynching someone who we are 95% certain is good?

absolutly.

and why are we sure he is good, he tried to get us to not lynch LSG?

[hoopsguy]

I'm nowhere close to 95% sure Cronin was good. But I do think that a liberal could have been seer-scanned tonight to help with building a circle of trust.

[DaddyTorgo]

rob stone: "the field is borderline immaculate"

[DaddyTorgo]

ballz. Wrong tab. sorry

[Abe Sargent]

"It's Leroy," Mr. Summers said, and his voice was hushed. "Show us his paper, Peter. "

Peter Czinski and his wife went over to their son and and forced the slip of paper out of his dark skinned hand. It had a black spot on it, the black spot Mr. Summers had made the night before with the heavy pencil in the coal company office. Peter Czinski held it up, and there was a stir in the crowd.

"All right, folks." Mr. Summers said. "Let's finish quickly."

Although the villagers had forgotten the ritual and lost the original black box, they still remembered to use stones. The pile of stones the boys had made earlier was ready; there were stones on the ground with the blowing scraps of paper that had come out of the box Delacroix selected a stone so large she had to pick it up with both hands and turned to Mrs. Dunbar. "Come on," she said. "Hurry up."

Mr. Dunbar had small stones in both hands, and she said, gasping for breath. "I can't run at all. You'll have to go ahead and I'll catch up with you."

The children had stones already. And someone gave little Davy Hutchinson a few pebbles.
Leroy Czinski was in the center of a cleared space by now, and he held his hands out desperately as the villagers moved in on him. "It isn't fair," he said.

A stone hit him on the side of the head. Old Man Warner was saying, "Come on, come on, everyone." Steve Adams was in the front of the crowd of villagers, with Mrs. Graves beside him.

"It isn't fair, it isn't right," Leroy Czinski screamed, and then they were upon him.



Day Three has ended. Night three has begun and will end at 2:00 am EST Thursday.

[Lathum]

rob stone: "the field is borderline immaculate"

what was that?

[Abe Sargent]

ballz. Wrong tab. sorry


Since this does not technically go against the rules (I checked before posting this), this is a warning. Any further mention of testacles as a form of curse word will result in liberalization.

[Abe Sargent]

You get a gold star for the day if you know what I did in my stoning post.

[Ironhead]

Wait, I'm confused. Who actually voted to stone Cronin?

[Lathum]

Wait, I'm confused. Who actually voted to stone Cronin?

Me.

and I don't regeret it at all

[KWhit]

You get a gold star for the day if you know what I did in my stoning post.

Quoted part of The Lottery?

[KWhit]

Me.

and I don't regeret it at all

Well, you should. He was a Fightin Fundie after all.

[Lathum]

Well, you should. He was a Fightin Fundie after all.

well he didn't act like one.

[ntndeacon]

Quoted part of The Lottery?

Yup looks like it... Shirley Jackson would be proud.

[Blade6119]

I didnt vote to stone cronin, but ill be frank and say if i was around cronin would have recieved 2 lynch votes. I dont have any problem admitting i would have voted him as well, despite the fact he turned up good. LSG made a mistake and got killed, i dont see why cronin openly telling us not to lynch LSG should be viewed much differently. Didnt come out like we wanted, but i can easily see the wolves sticking up for lsg on day 2 when there were no votes on her yet, but it was being tossed around.

Interesting dynamics forming as far as bonds between players...odd, yet interesting

[hoopsguy]

Blade, at one point you thought Cronin had a certain role - can you share what you thought it was, if it wouldn't make life too easy for the wolves? Because I thought he might be playing a Duke role by putting himself on the list, but that must not have been the case. I have no idea why he would put himself in that position if he had a meaningful role for the church.

[Blade6119]

I thought it possible he was the seer, and scanned me on night 0...that turned out not to be the case

[Tyrith]

There's a very good, sane reason I'm not as engaged as normal : there's been nothing TO engage. We've done three full days and there's not even 500 posts. Nothing is going on, so it's very hard for me to talk a lot when nothing is really happening.

[Abe Sargent]

One of you is walking along a forest trail minutes before the sunrise. You want to see God’s Eye as it breaks the horizon. You come across a damp spot on the ground, but that shouldn’t be It was too warm for dew last night.

The dampness is a sticky, dark mess. A fear grips your heart and all thoughts of sunrise escape your head. You follow the trail of blood to its origin, behind a bush. There you find the old body of KWHIT. Her sixty odd years seem so much greater in death than in life. As before, her hands are tied in a praying formation by nearby vines.

This time, her prayerbook is open to a page, underlined in dirt. It is the following passage:

Nahum 1:2 God is jealous, and the LORD revengeth; the LORD revengeth, and is furious; the LORD will take vengeance on his adversaries, and he reserveth wrath for his enemies.




Night Three has ended. Day Four has begun and will end at 9:00 pm EST Thursday.

[DaddyTorgo]

dammit. Good luck village.

(umm...i thought I was a guy?)

[Abe Sargent]

dammit. Good luck village.

(umm...i thought I was a guy?)

DT - you are still alive. It was KWhit that died, sorry.

[Tyrith]

Is DT dead or KWhit dead? I'm kind of confused.

[Abe Sargent]

I wrote it correctly on the front page, just put your name on the front here by accident. DT is on the liberal list, KWhit is dead.

[Abe Sargent]

I am a bad GM :(

[DaddyTorgo]

yay! i'm alive! YAYYY

and i'm on the liberal list for my curse? if I was worried about that i'd complain, seeing as how I thought I was dead and out of the game and it shouldn't count. But i'm not afraid of the liberal list so it's okay.

[DaddyTorgo]

I am a bad GM :(


it's ok abe.

[st.cronin]

I am a bad GM :(

lies, lies
I love your games

[KWhit]

You get a gold star for the day if you know what I did in my stoning post.

Quoted part of The Lottery?

KWhit is dead.


That's a hell of a gold star.

[Abe Sargent]

No I got my night actions mixed up, DT is on as a result of a NA not because of his curse, but I put his name down in teh final draft, the front page is accurate, and the above post is accurate, but I want to verify that DT is NOT on the LL because of his post, but for another unknown reason. (Well,I know...)

[hoopsguy]

I hope that I would be able to restrain myself from cursing as I read my own autopsy, but only the Lord knows if I would have that fortitude.

So KWhit wanted vengeance - assassin role? Bodyguard? Not sure I can think of any others that would emphasize wrath.

[hoopsguy]

DaddyTorgo, do you know of any character flaw that may have led to your appearing on the Liberal list today?

[Tyrith]

I have enough now to reveal myself to the world. For, see, at night I have been doing some investigations of some people that concern me.

It saddens me that cronin fell yesterday, because I knew he was still of the light, although circumstances dictated that even if I were here I probably would not have said so at the time. And we were fortunate, because his death allowed one of our real enemies to be known...Lathum is one of...one of THEM! HE'S A GAY!

N0: hoops, clean
N1: blade, I couldn't find him
N2: cronin, clean
N3: lathum, quite gay

[hoopsguy]

If someone has an ability that allows us to move Lathum to the Liberal list during the day, now might be a good time to exercise it.

[ntndeacon]

if not I suggest we let DT fester on that vile liberal list and add Lathum onto the list post haste so we might eradicate another foul creature from Almost Heaven. I bet Lathum is really a ....Methodist too!

[ntndeacon]

to quote the good book... "dola"
Vote Lathum to Liberal List

[hoopsguy]

VOTE/LIST LATHUM

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE LATHUM TO LIBERAL LIST

*cough* looks like I was right about my saying that he could have saved cronin if he wasn't a wolf hmm?

as for why i'm on the list...are we allowed to reveal that? my PM did tell me of a reason I could end up on the list. I suppose I might be comfortable revealing it, but I'd rather hold onto it for a little and see if whoever was snooping around wants to hint at it and gain my trust.

well done tyrith

[DaddyTorgo]

blade...can anyone account for your whereabouts on night 2?

[Tyrith]

VOTE LIST LATHUM

Although I doubt it'll stick, but why not.

[ntndeacon]

I think it should stick Tyrith. and here is why. those that vote for stoning DT today when we have a verified one of them ready to go on the list is sure to draw the ire of many faithful believers.

[DaddyTorgo]

well how's this for hoping it sticks.

I am the Deacon of the Church. I have no special powers. I know why I'm on the list, it's a relatively benign liberal leaning. It has to do with ensuring that all God's children retain all civil liberties under the laws of this great country and the laws of the lord.

If you are truly of the village you will not vote to stone me. A vote to stone me, or an attempt to convince people to vote for me ought to be tantamount to an admission of wolfishness. Therefore, if someone votes for me, they should be the other wolf.

I doubt that will be enough to save me however, but at least it's all out there. It's the best thing I can do...unless someone has an action that can move me off the list or immobilize lathum.

[path12]

Catching up. Feel bad for missing the vote, but it was unavoidable...

[path12]

well he didn't act like one.

I couldn't disagree more, and I'm one who finds Cronin suspicious at least 75% of the time. You will be getting my vote tomorrow.

[path12]

Well, darn it....Tyrith nailed it right after that, and now it just looks like piling on instead of a good call. Good thing my ego isn't wrapped up in this.

VOTE LATHUM LIST/STONE/WHATEVER

[path12]

By the way, why couldn't Blade be found when you looked for him?

[Blade6119]

DT, why do i need to account for my night actions on night 2? What happened night 2 to warrant me telling?

Hey tyrith, why do you go back to my exchange with cronin about his potential role and the question i asked him. Does it make more sense now(and my remarks about how i could have been attempted to be night killed night one, since nothing was touching me that night)? I remarked to cronin about a failure not meaning i was evil, and now as it appears i should have been addressing you i hope you can cross-check that info with when it was posted(long before your reveal)

[Blade6119]

DT, do me a favor...explain to me the liberal leaning. What makes you liberal?

[path12]

DT, do me a favor...explain to me the liberal leaning. What makes you liberal?

Do you think they would know? I don't. I think that is the kind of thing that would be kept from you until x event happens.

[DaddyTorgo]

because blade: tyrith came looking for you but couldn't find you. I'm just wondering if anyone else can vouch for what you were up to that night. it's the same question you'd ask of anyone else in that situation, so your defensiveness is raising my eyebrow a little.

As for what landed me on the list...as I said...i'd prefer to wait to see if whomever discovered it wants to hint at it and thus gain my trust before I come out and say it myself.

[Blade6119]

because blade: tyrith came looking for you but couldn't find you. I'm just wondering if anyone else can vouch for what you were up to that night. it's the same question you'd ask of anyone else in that situation, so your defensiveness is raising my eyebrow a little.

As for what landed me on the list...as I said...i'd prefer to wait to see if whomever discovered it wants to hint at it and thus gain my trust before I come out and say it myself.

It wont happen, so dont hold you breathe...i will never be cleared this game.

And as for that, id like a time frame before you reveal...as if it doesnt come in time, im going to have to press the issue

[Blade6119]

Do you think they would know? I don't. I think that is the kind of thing that would be kept from you until x event happens.
Trust me, they know...at least those that are telling the truth and are good but still liberal know. Thats a major reason im pressing DT for details on this, as i have a check of sorts.

[Blade6119]

VOTE LATHUM TO THE LIST

Tyrith earned a fair amount of trust with his reveal, but not 100% from me. I told everyone in public nothing evil was touching me night 1, which was true. But i didnt say good too, which would be quite a jump for him to make if he was lying...so his claims fit with what i know would happen, and as such i trust him the most in the game right now.

[Chief Rum]

So is Tyrith saying he is the seer? He never actually said it in so many words, so I want to be sure.

DT, it is rather convenient for you to come up with this explanation. If you're one of them gays, obviously, this could be a sign you have been outed. If what you say is true, it could still mean you could be converted. I'm not sure your reveal (regardless of its timing) makes a difference ultimately on whether we should stone you or not. I don't have aclue right now, though, which way I am leaning with you.

[Chief Rum]

VOTE LATHUM TO THE LIST

Tyrith earned a fair amount of trust with his reveal, but not 100% from me. I told everyone in public nothing evil was touching me night 1, which was true. But i didnt say good too, which would be quite a jump for him to make if he was lying...so his claims fit with what i know would happen, and as such i trust him the most in the game right now.

Refresh my memory, if you could, Blade. When you say Night 1, do you mean Night One or the first night (Night Zero)? Just wanted to clarify.

[Chief Rum]

I know it's likely that Tyrith is on the up and up and Lathum is sexually immoral. That said, does anyone think this is all a little too convenient? Lathum makes an odd decision with cronin and really puts himself out. Could be a veteran wolf play. But it's still a little early to be playing that sort of game, especially with one wolf already gone. Lathum could indeed be gay, but it seems to me we could also be led down that path rather easily with what Lathum did yesterday. Is it not the perfect opportunity for the wolves to throw someoen they know is good under the bus?

I am very suspicious with how Lathum immediately received a good string of liberal votes, and everyone has bought into the reveals so readily so far. I think we should be a little less hasty and see if we can get more confirmations on these roles or ask some people some hard questions about the natures of their roles. I can't put my finger on it yet, but this feels a little too easy.

[Blade6119]

I actually had convinced myself that tyrith was trying to save DT with this story, seeing as how he would buy DT 4 days(2 to kill lathum, and then 2 to kill himself). But, his story(or few words) about me fits what i expected the seer to say after scanning me(and the resulting distrust...i just had the wrong person of the two after me pegged as the seer).

I suppose he could be evil, but if he is the real seer needs to reveal. We are late enough in this game, where a 1-1 swap(and likely 2 if you factor DT) is worth it. So until someone else comes out, i believe him both based on the merit of his story in regards to me and the fact no one has contradicted him.

[Blade6119]

Refresh my memory, if you could, Blade. When you say Night 1, do you mean Night One or the first night (Night Zero)? Just wanted to clarify.

Well, the night tyrith claims to scan me is night one. That is also the night we dont have a evil kill(which could say something, as any kill attempt on me that night was going to work). On night 1, or the second night in this game, nothing good or evil was going to do anything to or with me. Thats why i offered up the idea i might have been the night kill target(and why i hinted strongly that day i had the seer role, so i could draw an attack). I dont know if that actually happened, and i dont know if tyrith is lying or telling the truth. But his story should be easily voidable if we have a real seer who can come out.

DT can also ease my mind by telling me why he is a liberal, as i have a nice check. I know for a fact that there are good players with liberal tendencies, and they know they have liberal tendencies, and they know why they have them. I cant say it any more clearly then that without putting myself on the list.

[Chief Rum]

Well, the night tyrith claims to scan me is night one. That is also the night we dont have a evil kill(which could say something, as any kill attempt on me that night was going to work). On night 1, or the second night in this game, nothing good or evil was going to do anything to or with me. Thats why i offered up the idea i might have been the night kill target(and why i hinted strongly that day i had the seer role, so i could draw an attack). I dont know if that actually happened, and i dont know if tyrith is lying or telling the truth. But his story should be easily voidable if we have a real seer who can come out.

DT can also ease my mind by telling me why he is a liberal, as i have a nice check. I know for a fact that there are good players with liberal tendencies, and they know they have liberal tendencies, and they know why they have them. I cant say it any more clearly then that without putting myself on the list.

Not sure I agree it's a good time for a seer to reveal. Remember, no one died at all for two days. We only have four players gone from an original 14, meaning we have ten left. I think there has to be at least two wolves left, with maybe more and/or conversion possibilities. I don't think a seer or a BG should reveal for at least another day, maybe two. The timing seems thrown a bit by the fact it is Day Four now, but, really, it's like it is Day Two without the kills.

If the seer feels that it is too soon to reveal normally, is it too much of a trade off for him to reveal now to get Tyrith? I would rather not lose the seer tonight with eight players still left in the game (meaning another three full day-night cycles at least, if it goes to the wire).

All this is assuming Tyrith is fake revealing. It could be he is telling the truth. But this is just too convenient, IMO.

[ImTheCrew]

Blade care to share where you were last night?

[hoopsguy]

Hmm, I took Tyrith's statements as "I'm the seer" and went along because I don't see a particularly compelling 1:1 trade at this point in the game for him. I would be more skeptical later in the game, frankly.

We have ten players left, we have finished off one wolf and Tyrith is giving us another one. I like our position at the moment. And, of course, I like that Tyrith is clearing me and condemning the guy that I've suspected. From that standpoint it is pretty easy for me. But if Lathum shows up as a Fundy, then we go after Tyrith and Daddy Torgo next.

Does anyone see a scenario where neither Tyrith nor Lathum are gay? If not, lets do this. Heck, I'm willing to vote nightfall on it to move the game along ... I know next week is going to be challenging for me timewise so I would like to cram as much gameplay in as possible now. And this really does seem pretty straight-forward. I don't know what Lathum would say that would deter me from heading in this direction today.

[DaddyTorgo]

Blade...I will happily be explicit about what caused me to end up on the liberal list. If you'll notice my earlier post about the subject I did hint about it. Probably a bit too hidden, but then again as we all know, that's my MO. I will say again that it's not anything related to being one of "them".

As for CR...I don't have a feel on him one way or the other. I think he raises some valid points certainly about how this is all falling into place rather easily, but I am not comfortable saying "well he must be good because he raises these points and is worried."

[Lathum]

I can't believe you all bought into Tyrith's "reveal" so fast. I know I am good so this must be Tyrith making a wolf play.

With 10 people left it is possible there is a 8-2 or even a 7-3 split.

Did anyone consider the fact that Daddy Torgo could be bad and this is a move by Tyrith to save him?

Think about it, DT stays alive today and you waste a day putting me on the liberal list. They get a night kill tonight then it is 7-2 or even 6-3.

Lynch me tomorrow and it is 6-2 or 5-3 putting us right on the endgame cusp.

This move by Tyrith not only buys them gays time but gives them a chance to get 3 fundies killed before Tyrith could be bought to justice.

If you don't want to believe me that is fine, but I only ask one thing. After the deadline tonight I assume I will be on the liberal list, I ask Tyrith gets himself added to the liberal list during the night phase. Once I come up good he is already on the list and you don't have to waste an extra day by voting him to the list. This could be the difference for us.

[Lathum]

dola- The real seer shouldn't reveal at this point