NFL Week 10 discussion

[BishopMVP]

Bears@49ers gives us the 2nd Thursday night NFL game of the year, and an opening for people to complain who (still) don't get NFL network. Cincinnati@Pittsburgh is the pick of the 1pm games, and gives Cincy an effective 2-game division lead if they win. Dallas@GB is a nice 4pm game, with Philly@SD providing a nice side game in the leadup to the Pats@Indy Sunday night that is going to get the hype. Somehow Cleveland gets to host Baltimore in a lackluster Monday Night game, but it sounds like now that Brady Quinn can't reach his contract escalator clauses he'll finally start over Anderson.

The other reason I wanted to start the thread was to place a link to this website - ProFootballFocus.com - Home (http://www.profootballfocus.com/home.php?tab=home) . Saw a link to it on FO, and while they're behind a couple weeks and I'm sure we'd argue their methodology, it's interesting to see players rated on every play. For the Patriots, Moss/Mayo's (average) and Adalius Thomas's (poor) numbers jump out at me, but I'm guessing Moss doesn't get enough credit for opening up other guys by having safeties roll over his side every play, and Mayo is coming back from injury. No idea on Thomas. It matches up with a lot of other thoughts I've had from watching - Joey Galloway being terrible, Darius Butler, and to a lesser extent Patrick Chung, looking good as rookies and combining with the addition of Leigh Bodden to solidify the secondary. Gostkowski being one of the league's best at kickoffs, etc. Again, I haven't even looked for their methodology, but it's probably the most interesting (free) link I've come across since finding FO a few years back.

[Greyroofoo]

You should probably rename the thread to the "Colts/Patriots Week Extravaganza Thread"..


However I do love that there are apparently rumors as that Mangini is hiding which QB will start...again.

[whomario]

Quinn starts, just when it´s nearly impossible to hit the 70% mark on the year (although i´m no expert here, just read that in some reports) : http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/11/cleveland_browns_brady_quinn_w.html

Magini Interview though to be fair :

Q&A: Under fire, Mangini opens up about Browns, Quinn, Belichick - NFL - CBSSports.com Football (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/12493344/qa-with-judge-mangini-talks-jets-browns-belichick)

[Travis]

Seattle/Arizona to decide if the NFC West will still be an attainable goal for the Seahawks. A win puts them a game back of the Cards, a loss and they're staring a 3 game hole in the face with just 7 to go.

Yeah, I'm crossing my fingers, but if the Seahawks can win this week I can't help but feel like they'll be taking a very big step towards getting the confidence necessary to pull together and make a legit run at the division title (and yes I know, weak division, etc, etc, but that's what they're dealing with right now).

[jeff061]

I love Pats/Colts games. Seems like the media portrays the Pats as having a rival with damn near every team in the league. It's all BS, except for the Colts games. As good as it gets.

[Honolulu_Blue]

I love Pats/Colts games. Seems like the media portrays the Pats as having a rival with damn near every team in the league. It's all BS, except for the Colts games. As good as it gets.

I too love these games.

I am pretty sure the Pats don't have a rivalry with the Lions. No one really does.

[DataKing]

Is there still talk in Cleveland about getting fans to show up late for the game so it's empty during the MNF pre-game hooplah, as a means of protest?

[JAG]

Quinn starts, just when it´s nearly impossible to hit the 70% mark on the year

Good luck throwing those clauses in any future contracts Cleveland.

[spleen1015]

I wonder how the Pats do against the Colts now that all of their star defensive players are outta there.

[jeff061]

"Star" just mean old. Their defense is better this year than the past couple.

[Greyroofoo]

I wonder how the Pats do against the Colts now that all of their star defensive players are outta there.

Well the real stars of the Colts defense are Freeney and Mathis.

[spleen1015]

I mean the Patriots defense guys.

[DaddyTorgo]

haha - funny question - you can answer it from both sides!

[spleen1015]

haha - funny question - you can answer it from both sides!

Yeah, I didn't word that very well.

[jeff061]

I meant the Patriots defense as well. It's been years since it was a strength with them. Something people bemoaning the loss of their aging "stars" forget for whatever reason.

They hands down got better everywhere except Seymour, and while they don't have a singular talent to replace him they are loaded with depth. While in the end they got younger so they hopefully won't get gassed come playoffs like they had been lately.

I mean their defense still isn't scary, but it's a significant step up over that last couple seasons. And has a much higher upside than it did a year ago.

[Samdari]

I meant the Patriots defense as well. It's been years since it was a strength with them. Something people bemoaning the loss of their aging "stars" forget for whatever reason.

They hands down got better everywhere except Seymour, and while they don't have a singular talent to replace him they are loaded with depth. While in the end they got younger so they hopefully won't get gassed come playoffs like they had been lately.

I mean their defense still isn't scary, but it's a significant step up over that last couple seasons. And has a much higher upside than it did a year ago.


So, two years ago, in the 16-0 season, when they were top 4 in the league in yardage and scoring defense, that was not a strength?

Or by "in years" did you mean last year alone?

[jeff061]

Not to hard when you are forced into a pass every down situation by the second quarter. Read the stats all you want. I've watched every game.

The only player they lost over the last several seasons that has hurt them is Asante.

[Samdari]

I've watched every game

And you think the Pats defense was not a strength in 2007? You really could not be more wrong.

I am curious exactly what you thought the defense was poor at. They were good at keeping the other team from gaining yards and scoring points, but other than that they sucked.

[Bearcat729]

Is there still talk in Cleveland about getting fans to show up late for the game so it's empty during the MNF pre-game hooplah, as a means of protest?

I think since Lerner met with the two fans the talk has quieted down a bit.

[Daimyo]

I'm really surprised the Colts are favored. I'm a Colts fan, but they're just too beat up right now and the Pats have been playing better for several weeks.

[jeff061]

Dude, if you think their 07 defense was anywhere near as good as the 5 years previous to it, I'm just done arguing.

2007 was dominated by offense, not good or great but legendary offense. It won their games and certainly made their defensive stats look better. Opposing teams were put in tough situations and forced to drop back and pass every play before half time damn near every game. By the time the second half rolled around most of them had given up.

07 they were old, 08 they were older.

[Samdari]

Dude, if you think their 07 defense was anywhere near as good as the 5 years previous to it, I'm just done arguing.


I love these statements - "the facts completely disagree with my preconcieved notions, but if you don't agree with them anyway, you're an idiot"

[Daimyo]

Patriots Defensive DVOA and rank over the last 10 years (negative values are good for defensive DVOA)

<table border=1><tr><td>Year</td><td>DVOA</td><td>Rank</td></tr><tr><td>2000</td><td>9.5%</td><td>25</td></tr><tr><td>2001</td><td>-7.7%</td><td>13</td></tr><tr><td>2002</td><td>2.9%</td><td>21</td></tr><tr><td>2003</td><td>-27.8%</td><td>2</td></tr><tr><td>2004</td><td>-10.4%</td><td>7</td></tr><tr><td>2005</td><td>7.2%</td><td>25</td></tr><tr><td>2006</td><td>-13.5%</td><td>4</td></tr><tr><td>2007</td><td>0.9%</td><td>19</td></tr><tr><td>2008</td><td>5.9%</td><td>16</td></tr><tr><td>2009</td><td>-8.3%</td><td>6</td></tr></table>

[Honolulu_Blue]

I can't believe that we're only halfway through the NFL regular season. I am sure it has to do with being a Lions fan (or maybe it has to do with my Red Zone Channel acces), but it really feels like there should only be 3-4 games left in the season.

[BishopMVP]

I love Pats/Colts games. Seems like the media portrays the Pats as having a rival with damn near every team in the league. It's all BS, except for the Colts games. As good as it gets.Colts, Steelers, Jets, Broncos, Dolphins, everyone else imo. The front office considers the Eagles a rival, and the fans would obviously love to beat the Giants after 2007, but there just isn't frequent enough interleague matchups to have cross-conference rivalries. The Bills are in the division and as competitive against us as the Dolphins, but they don't talk nearly as much, so people forget about them.I wonder how the Pats do against the Colts now that all of their star defensive players are outta there.Vince Wilfork is still an all-pro at the most important position on the field. Brandon Meriwether and Jerod Mayo are two youngsters who will probably be getting pro-bowl consideration after the season (and imo Darius Butler will be too by next year). We've also replaced the huge, gaping holes in coverage (CB's, LB's and S's) that plagued us in recent seasons with at least average players.

Daimyo pulled up the exact stats I was looking for.

[DeToxRox]

Jimmy the Greek's 30 for 30 inspired me, so I am going to just say it:

Detroit Lions 24
Minnesota Vikings 13

Go to your local bookmakers!

[cuervo72]

Mmm, does the NFL Network use the voice of Pat Summerall for its intro, or Madden Pat Summerall?

[Rizon]

Jay Cutler ... lmao

[mauchow]

Whoa. My Thursday night has been saved!!!!

I just found the game and just realized there was actually a game tonight. WOOHOO!

[jbergey22]

Keep up the good work Cutler. You are making me proud.

[Tigercat]

Lets not continue to call Cutler things like "marquee QB" in the middle of yet another 3 INT game.

[Coffee Warlord]

Please don't let Cutler play night games anymore, k?

[RendeR]

I will openly admit that I really thought Cutler would improve the Bears. I was wrong. The Bears suck.

[Rizon]

Cutler would only improve ... wait, he wouldn't improve anyone.

[jbergey22]

They actually arent playing completely moronic tonight in that they have atleast tried to control Cutler a little bit. Even though he has still found a way to throw a goaline int and 2 others. He is throwing to the RB's and TE instead of forcing everything into the WR's which is a promising sign for the Bears.

[jbergey22]

The other reason I wanted to start the thread was to place a link to this website - ProFootballFocus.com - Home (http://www.profootballfocus.com/home.php?tab=home) . Saw a link to it on FO, and while they're behind a couple weeks and I'm sure we'd argue their methodology, it's interesting to see players rated on every play. For the Patriots, Moss/Mayo's (average) and Adalius Thomas's (poor) numbers jump out at me, but I'm guessing Moss doesn't get enough credit for opening up other guys by having safeties roll over his side every play, and Mayo is coming back from injury. No idea on Thomas. It matches up with a lot of other thoughts I've had from watching - Joey Galloway being terrible, Darius Butler, and to a lesser extent Patrick Chung, looking good as rookies and combining with the addition of Leigh Bodden to solidify the secondary. Gostkowski being one of the league's best at kickoffs, etc. Again, I haven't even looked for their methodology, but it's probably the most interesting (free) link I've come across since finding FO a few years back.


Interesting site. Im surprised that Brady is the 15th rated QB, Allen is the 9th rated DE and Winfield is the 1st rated corner. I cant wait to look into the Offensive Linemen rankings.

I think Rodgers is one of the best passing QBs I have ever seen but they need to be docking him something for all the sacks he eats.

[MikeVic]

lol 4 INT game apparently.

Please make Greg Olsen useful!! That's all I ask.

[Atocep]

Ron Turner is making me wish the bears still had John Shoop as OC.

That's not a good thing.

[DataKing]

Ron Turner is making me wish the bears still had John Shoop as OC.

That's not a good thing.

Bite your tongue!

[RedKingGold]

49er's OL is bad right now, really bad.

I can't believe Smith has looked as good as he's looked while getting pressure on the outside on just about every play.

[DataKing]

Illegal formation because Hester's not up on the line....IT'S THE 10TH WEEK OF THE SEASON YOU F*CKING MORON!!! :banghead::banghead::banghead:

[stevew]

Why is San Fran punting on the bears 34 on 4th and 6. Nice 14 yard net.

[Greyroofoo]

Looks like Cutler was very gutsy tonight, a true gunslinger.

....if being judged by Favre standards.

[jbergey22]

I cant recall Favre being this terrible.

Has a QB ever cost a team more points in the Red Zone over a single season than he has gotten them? Cutler has to be close.

14 Tds 17 ints this year. Pathetic Im not sure but Im thinking around 10 of them have been in the red zone.

[stevew]

The Bears really need to drop all their plays where the QB lines up over top of an ancient Indian Burial ground. It is going on like 30 years of cursed QBs now.

[mckerney]

Now with a 3.5 game lead over the Bears, 4 games over the Packers, and the Lions the rest of the division seems focused on letting the Vikings lock up a division title pretty early this year.

[DataKing]

Now with a 3.5 game lead over the Bears, 4 games over the Packers, and the Lions the rest of the division seems focused on letting the Vikings lock up a division title pretty early this year.

Yeah...Vikings can pretty much mail it in as far a the division goes, and just focus next on a first-week bye.

[Galaxy]

Thanks to Time Warner, I wasn't able to watch. Was Cutler that bad? What is going through his head this year.

[RainMaker]

As I said in the Week 1 thread, Jay Cutler is Jeff George 2.0.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Amazing. Last week the 49ers lose the turnover battle 4-0 and still manage to keep it close to the end. This week, they win 5-1, and still manage to keep it close until the end. Our offensive line is so putrid it's laughable.

[Swaggs]

Did he sign a huge contract extension after the deal?

I'd say he looks like he is turning into a coach killer, with Shanahan as a casualty already, but there is no way they can blame Lovie for this. Is there?

[Vince, Pt. II]

I think the Bears losing that game was 50% Offensive Line, 45% Cutler, and 5% Stupid Penalties.

[RainMaker]

Did he sign a huge contract extension after the deal?

I'd say he looks like he is turning into a coach killer, with Shanahan as a casualty already, but there is no way they can blame Lovie for this. Is there?
It wasn't huge, but he did sign a decent sized extension this year. Kind of crazy, but that's Jerry Angelo for you.

I don't know how you can't blame Lovie for the mess that is the Bears. Lovie fired Ron Rivera after the Super Bowl run and wanted the defense run his way. It has been bad since then. The team is one of the least disciplined teams in football and gets killed with dumb penalties every week. They haven't been able to develop a defensive player since Lance Briggs and decided that Devin Hester was a #1 receiver.

If this was a Raheem Morris or someone else not making much, I'd let it pass. But he's one of the highest paid coaches in football and he has to provide some return on the investment.

[Sun Tzu]

Our offensive line is so putrid it's laughable.

this

[Samdari]

Thanks to Time Warner, I wasn't able to watch. Was Cutler that bad? What is going through his head this year.

Two of the interceptions were inexcusable decisions, forced into coverage, and 100% Cutler's fault.

Two were him throwing to where his WR (both times Hester) was supposed to be, and him not getting there. Once Hester fell down, once he lacked the desire or strength to fight his way through the unpire. These are the kind of throws you have to make in the NFL, and if the receiver doesn't get there, its not the QBs fault.

The 5th was 50/50. On one hand, he threw the ball to a well (but single, good job Jay) covered receiver. The DB bumped the receiver off the ball before catching it. This is often called pass interference, and was or was not depending on your interpretation of the rules. Call it half Cutler's fault.

He was clearly frustrated many times by the lack of his teammates', what's the word here, oh yeah, talent and ability. The OL is terrible and the WR are worse. On the other hand, he doesn't appear bothered by throwing INTs. And he made some pretty amazing throws the rest of the night. He really is Jeff George 2.0.

This was not a good game if you're a 49'er fan. The Bears defense has been giving up teams best offensive performance of the year with amazing regularity. If this is the 49ers best, they're going to need 5 TO to have any chance to win.

[RendeR]

As I said in the Week 1 thread, Jay Cutler is Jeff George 2.0.


Jeff George was never as bad as Cutler is being this season.

[fantom1979]

Jeff George was never as bad as Cutler is being this season.

Jeff George of 1992 is knocking on the door. In 10 starts, he did not have a single game where he threw more tds than picks. Somehow, the Colts went 6-4 in those games.

[JAG]

Interesting site. Im surprised that Brady is the 15th rated QB, Allen is the 9th rated DE and Winfield is the 1st rated corner. I cant wait to look into the Offensive Linemen rankings.

I think Rodgers is one of the best passing QBs I have ever seen but they need to be docking him something for all the sacks he eats.

Their weighting system seems to heavily favor balanced players at a number of positions. I don't think I would say a WR's blocking ability is of equal importance to their receiving ability which is of equal importance to their ability to do end arounds. So while I didn't care for the site as far as them comparing the sum of players' abilities together, I did enjoy it for comparing all defenders' pass rushing for example.

[BishopMVP]

Thanks to Time Warner, I wasn't able to watch. Was Cutler that bad? What is going through his head this year.Oh god, why isn't anyone blocking that guy?

Seriously, Cutler's one of the best in the league at avoiding sacks due to his quick release, but it leads to lots of interceptions because he's throwing it to what should be open/happening on a play instead of letting it develop and see who is open. The fact his O-Line is possibly the worst in the league isn't helping.

[jbergey22]

Their weighting system seems to heavily favor balanced players at a number of positions. I don't think I would say a WR's blocking ability is of equal importance to their receiving ability which is of equal importance to their ability to do end arounds. So while I didn't care for the site as far as them comparing the sum of players' abilities together, I did enjoy it for comparing all defenders' pass rushing for example.

True I will have to look at it in that aspect. Thanks for the reply back.

It did seem odd to me that some players were being docked more for penalties they have had this year than how important they were in the passing game like that Garcon for the Colts.

Its the first site I have seen that tries to break down offensive linemen for that they deserve an A.

[JAG]

True I will have to look at it in that aspect. Thanks for the reply back.

It did seem odd to me that some players were being docked more for penalties they have had this year than how important they were in the passing game like that Garcon for the Colts.

Its the first site I have seen that tries to break down offensive linemen for that they deserve an A.

Good call, that was another thing I took issue with that I forgot, the amount they docked players points for penalties I think was overly extreme, although I didn't get into how they figured out how much to take off for that.

[wade moore]

The fact his O-Line is possibly the worst in the league isn't helping.

Have you watched a Redskins game?

There is no competition for worst OLine in the league, I promise.

[fantom1979]

I think Aaron Rodgers would like to have a vote

[bulletsponge]

As I said in the Week 1 thread, Jay Cutler is Jeff George 2.0.

i always knew he was overrated, but damn 17 picks in 9 games!! thats horrible. still watch the media give him a verbal BJ and blame everyone else for his screw ups

[JPhillips]

I saw this over at Bengals.com:

Steelers quarterback Ben Roethlisberger leads the league with a 158.3 rating on play-action on 29-of-30 for 459 yards, four touchdowns and no interceptions.

Christ almighty!

[Matthean]

I think Aaron Rodgers would like to have a vote

Oddly enough, Green Bay, Chicago, and the Lions can all throw their hat into the ring for this. It's no wonder why Minnesota is running away with the division so soon.

<input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

[remper]

It will be interesting to see how Cutler does next year assuming the Bears can assemble some kind of offensive line worth a shit. I still have faith in Cutler. He does need help to succeed though. Is Cutler blameless? No. But we CANNOT run the ball. Defenses do not have to respect that at all and can just tee off on the pass rush.

I think that Cutler can gel with the receivers and will be able to improve things next season. That is.. if he gets time, and if we can run the ball at least a little bit.

[Mustang]

Fuck you Mike McCarthy.

That is all.

[Atocep]

Rollout (http://miamiherald.typepad.com/rollout/2009/11/patriots-fan-reveals-a-side-of-dolphins-qb-pat-white-you-should-hear.html)

This is the type of thing that become expected of Pat White from WVU fans and is a big part of why they think so highly of him.

[Dr. Sak]

He also does one heck of a cat impression.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/7cocDhwnzhg&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/7cocDhwnzhg&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

[RedKingGold]

OK, which teams have a good offensive line?

[DataKing]

OK, which teams have a good offensive line?

Cowboys, Giants, Vikings, Colts, Patriots, and Steelers jump immediately to mind. I know the Steelers give up a ton of sacks, but those are mostly Big Ben's fault for holding the ball so damn long.

And it's no great surprise that these teams are a combined 38-11.

[Galaxy]

So T.O. said he has a sore hip due to sleeping on the couch?

Fantasy Football Breaking News - Rotoworld.com (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/playerbreakingnews.asp?sport=NFL&id=718&line=158736&spln=1)

[MikeVic]

Cowboys, Giants, Vikings, Colts, Patriots, and Steelers jump immediately to mind. I know the Steelers give up a ton of sacks, but those are mostly Big Ben's fault for holding the ball so damn long.

And it's no great surprise that these teams are a combined 38-11.

lol, I've heard the Steelers have a bad offensive line. And then when Mendenhall had a couple of good games, now they have a good one?

[cartman]

I saw this over at Bengals.com:



Christ almighty!

They only run play action 4 times per game?

[DataKing]

lol, I've heard the Steelers have a bad offensive line. And then when Mendenhall had a couple of good games, now they have a good one?

If people were saying the Steelers had a bad O-line early in the season, they were just looking at the stats and weren't watching the games. Ben even came out and said he felt bad for the O-line because of the sacks they were giving up because he kept holding onto the ball.

[MikeVic]

They only run play action 4 times per game?

Maybe they only throw out of it four times per game?

[BishopMVP]

Have you watched a Redskins game?

There is no competition for worst OLine in the league, I promise.So Jason Campbell isn't the problem you say? :lol: (And sorry, but there is sadly quite a bit of competition for it this year, probably led by the Chefs at this point.)OK, which teams have a good offensive line?It's not the be all, end all, but this is a good place to start - FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | 2009 OFFENSIVE LINES (http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol)

[Abe Sargent]

Rollout (http://miamiherald.typepad.com/rollout/2009/11/patriots-fan-reveals-a-side-of-dolphins-qb-pat-white-you-should-hear.html)

This is the type of thing that become expected of Pat White from WVU fans and is a big part of why they think so highly of him.

Totally true

[fantom1979]

Maybe they only throw out of it four times per game?

Can you run out of play action? I guess you can with a trick play (like an end around or something out of the wildcat)

[BishopMVP]

Can you run out of play action? I guess you can with a trick play (like an end around or something out of the wildcat)Would a fake-slip screen/slant and then handoff for a draw count as play-action?

[tucker rocky]

Eagles visit SD for 1st time since 1998.
That day the Eagles lost 13-10, to that QB what's-his-name.

That QB what's-his-name was Ryan Leaf. :D

[Abe Sargent]

Sanchez already throws a pick to Mathis on first play of the Jets. Awesome!

[Swaggs]

Bengals have come out throwing and the Steelers are getting no pass rush.

[Abe Sargent]

I totally don;t get why you onside kick there.

[Abe Sargent]

Wow Vikings you suck

[cougarfreak]

Polamalu out and doubtful for return is great news for the Bengals (I think).

[Radii]

Carolina looking great so far today, up 14-3 on Atlanta.

[Abe Sargent]

Jags score - 14-10 in the 2nd quarter vs the Jets

[Tigercat]

Rams playing tough and going up and down the field on a much depleted Saints D. Reggie Bush is finally showing up though, Saints lead 14-7 on two Reggie (run, reception) TDs.

[Radii]

Michael Turner was tearing up the Carolina defense, 9 carries/111 yards at the 8 minute mark of the second quarter, but he turned his ankle and is questionable to return. Atlanta scores to make it 14-10 Carolina but if Turner can't come back that will be huge.

[Abe Sargent]

Vikes just keep screwing up but it won;t matter. The lions never take advantage

[Radii]

Steve Smith with his 2nd touchdown on the day, 21-10 Carolina! This is the 3rd week in a row that Carolina has put together a very solid first half performance.

[larrymcg421]

Dolphins get a break on an INT that should have been ruled a catch and down by contact. They take advantage and go up 16-6.

[cougarfreak]

Cedric Benson looks hurt for Cincy..........I'm betting LJ is a Bengal by morning.

[Radii]

Injuries all over in Carolina. In addition to Michael Turner being questionable to return, Carolina LT Jordan Gross is out with a leg injury that looked kinda bad, and Steve Smith got hurt on his 2nd TD catch and is questionable to return as well.

[larrymcg421]

Meh. Fins drive to the 10 yard line with 10 seconds left and kick the FG there instead of taking a shot at the end zone.

[rowech]

Cedric Benson looks hurt for Cincy..........I'm betting LJ is a Bengal by morning.

Let's hope not.

[jbergey22]

Lions getting a lot of breaks this game. Vikings should be up 40-3

[jbergey22]

Thi ref sucks put the damn flags away!

[mauchow]

This game is going to be done at about 6:00 at this rate...

Of course being next to Green Bay, they're going to cut out the end of this game if it goes too late. Fuck.

[Radii]

This feels just like last week... Carolina plays a great first half and builds up a nice lead and watches the other team wake up and take it all back in the 3rd quarter. Atlanta dominating the game now, still 21-19 Carolina thanks to stopping a 2 point conversion, but it really feels like its Atlanta's game to lose now.

[jbergey22]

Vikings just have no desire to play this week. Im not sure if they think they've clinched or what but they are playing horrible with all these mistakes.

[Radii]

Atlanta starts inside their own 5 and moves downfield before messing up everything at the end... QB sneak on 3rd and 1 comes up short, they challenge the spot and give up a timeout, then Elam misses the field goal. Carolina ball still up 2, under 7 minutes to go.

[JonInMiddleGA]

but it really feels like its Atlanta's game to lose now.

And Jason Elam -- he of the lowest FG% in the league this season -- is doing his part to help them do just that.

[DeToxRox]

How long does Matt Ryan get a free pass for? I rarely hear much about him but it seems like he's been very much a key part of all their losses this year with his bad decision making.

[Abe Sargent]

Yay, Jags win on last second FG - 5-4 against the leagues 2nd rated defense going into this week. Awesome.

[DeToxRox]

Broncos losing to the Skins seems pretty inexcusable considering how awful the Skins are. Denver has a tough stretch of games coming up, with that game vs SD next week looming very large now.

[TroyF]

The Broncos should simply eat the money they gave Chris Simms and release him after this game. The Broncos loss today is all on him. He should be ashamed to take money after a performance like this. What an F'n joke.

This was a well deserved loss for Denver, but the refs continue to be an abomination this year. A clear sack/fumble is a QB forward progress stopped whistle. (even though the replays clearly showed the whistle hadn't blown until after the play.) Denver deserved a call like this as they got a break in the Patriots game for the same ridiculous reason. These guys make a LOT of money to do this. If they can't even get close to getting the calls right, they should either be paid like volunteers or replaced by people who can do the job.

This loss sets up a monster game for Denver next week. Chargers will come in fired up. Denver's season will be on the line. (and if Kyle Orton can't play, it will be OVER, because Chrissy Simms cannot play football)

[Abe Sargent]

Why the HELL is my station showing the KC-Oakland game? Seriously? Was nothing else avaliable for thr 4 o clock slot?

[hoopsguy]

The Dolphins are on the verge of a pretty hideous loss.

[larrymcg421]

Dolphins choking another one away. Sometimes I really hate football.

[cougarfreak]

Bengals sweep the Steelers...........HUGE, HUGE win.....

[RainMaker]

Marc Bulger is a moron.

[jbergey22]

Saints escape against the lowly Rams.

[larrymcg421]

Dolphins with a good drive here. They need about 10 more yards.

[dbd1963]

Brees has not be his stellar self this last 4 weeks, and the D is completely depleted. Thank goodness it was only the Rams this week.

[larrymcg421]

Ricky Williams!

[jbergey22]

The Bengals defense has really surprised me. I keep waiting for them to fall apart and it just doesnt seem like it is going to happen. That team made huge strides this year.

[DeToxRox]

Impressive game from Stafford today. Yes the completion percentage looks bad but on 51 attempts he was hit over 30 times, and had no turn overs.

[JPhillips]

I never expected sweeping Baltimore and Pittsburgh. Now the Bengals just need to avoid a letdown against the next three pushovers. 10-2 with four to play and at least a two game lead in the division would be damn nice.

[jbergey22]

Impressive game from Stafford today. Yes the completion percentage looks bad but on 51 attempts he was hit over 30 times, and had no turn overs.

I agree he appears to be getting better every game. I think the Lions found a QB.

[larrymcg421]

Ricky Williams with a 27 yard run from with less than 30 seconds left sets up the winning FG. Dolphins escape 25-23.

[Matthean]

Oddly enough, Green Bay, Chicago, and the Lions can all throw their hat into the ring for this. It's no wonder why Minnesota is running away with the division so soon.

<input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

I didn't watch much of the Lons game and granted it was the Vikings, but that was as much of a sieve of an OL that you could ask for. It's one thing if you are getting sacked because the QB holds the ball too long. It's another thing if the DL repeatedly looks unblocked.

<input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

[rowech]

I never expected sweeping Baltimore and Pittsburgh. Now the Bengals just need to avoid a letdown against the next three pushovers. 10-2 with four to play and at least a two game lead in the division would be damn nice.

Agreed....the next three games scare the crap out of me. There's no excuse to lose any of them.

[larrymcg421]

Just saw the awesome play in the Jags-Jets game. Maurice Jones-Drew picks up the first down with a minute left and has a chance to score the game winning TD, but kneels at the 1. Jets had no Timeouts, and the Jags ran the clock out to kick the winning FG with no time left.

[DeToxRox]

Just saw the awesome play in the Jags-Jets game. Maurice Jones-Drew picks up the first down with a minute left and has a chance to score the game winning TD, but kneels at the 1. Jets had no Timeouts, and the Jags ran the clock out to kick the winning FG with no time left.

Wouldn't have been awesome if there was a bad snap on that FG.

[larrymcg421]

Wouldn't have been awesome if there was a bad snap on that FG.

Still would have been awesome. Chances of missing a 21 yard FG vs. chances Jets drive back down the field with a minute left. I'll take the former. Wouldn't have been his fault if the FG was missed.

[Travis]

Nice to see the Seattle D showing up early in a game that could end their season if they don't win it. Now for the offense to help them out and change the field position battle.

[Travis]

Okay, so for my next wish...

[tucker rocky]

Dallas fumbled the ball.
KC leads Oakland 13-10.
Eagles losing 14-3 to SD.
Sea winning 14-0 over Arz.

[tucker rocky]

GB fumbled, Dallas recovers.

[RainMaker]

Abilene Christian is producing a lot of NFL talent for being a D2 school.

[tucker rocky]

Whast is wrong with the Eagles and playing on the west coast this season?

[EagleFan]

Why did they not go for 2 points there? They could have made it an 11 point game and only need a touchdown and field goal, instead they need 2 touchdowns now.

[hoopsguy]

I've hated Jeff Triplett and his crew for years. Always feels like too many penalties and too many lousy calls in his games.

[tucker rocky]

For the numbers McNabb has, Eagles should have more points than 16.

[tucker rocky]

Eagles didn't need that holding call.

[tucker rocky]

Horrible call to run there by the Eagles.

[Eaglesfan27]

Sad to hear Westbrook has another concussion. :(

[RainMaker]

Not sure why the refs didn't overturn that call in the Dallas-Green Bay game. Maybe they have the Packers and the points.

[Front Office Midget]

As a Packers fan, I don't understand why they couldn't review that fumble call? It seems like the wrong call.

[tucker rocky]

Eagles staying alive, down 28-23

[tucker rocky]

Sad to hear Westbrook has another concussion. :(

Time for Westbrook to retire.

[Abe Sargent]

Good 1 games, but suckys 4 games on my station.

[rowech]

As a Packers fan, I don't understand why they couldn't review that fumble call? It seems like the wrong call.

That's because it is. At this point, I think it's safe to say replay is a waste. What the heck is the point of having it if you can't change what is clearly, and I mean clearly, a horrible call.

[tucker rocky]

Dallas is done for the day,

[M GO BLUE!!!]

God Bless Tony Romo. He comes through again for the fans of true, hearty laughter.

[Apathetic Lurker]

I love seeing trainwrecks....ergo I love watching the Raiders...or is it the raiderettes? They need Losman..He isnt that good but he likes Davis ball and he is an upgrade to what they have

[Lathum]

And there is your first round pick Al Davis :lol:

[tucker rocky]

Such sadness in Oakland.

[Abe Sargent]

I heart Lathum

[tucker rocky]

And there is your first round pick Al Davis :lol:

"With their pick in the 1st round, Oakland selects Tim Tebow, with the condition that Urban Meyer coaches the Raiders."

[miami_fan]

And there is your first round pick Al Davis :lol:

I would laugh but that first round pick had one more reception than the Dolphins' 2007 1st round pick today.


Fuck Ted Ginn!

[jeff061]

Zipper McZipperee on the sidelines.

[jeff061]

Think he got about 4 steps in on that one.

[DaddyTorgo]

poop

[Lathum]

Moss is sick

[DaddyTorgo]

Moss is ridiculous!!

he's just eating those corners for lunch and the safeties can't cover him.

what'd they say? 4 for 144??? ridiculous

and like they pointed out - Vollmer is huge in giving Tom time to throw...

[jeff061]

I can't remember the last time Brady's had this kind of time against Freeney/Colts. Same with Taylor last week.

As much as I love Light, I never thought he was more than average. Volmer's been raising the bar in only a few games.

[SirFozzie]

That was a fucking awesome pass, Brady couldn't have placed the ball better. If Brady and Moss are on the same page again, UH OH for everyone playing the Pats.

[jeff061]

What I think is interesting with Moss is just that hes all over the place this season. Running the deeps, short, over the middle, anything to get open. He didn't do any of that in 2007 and his production had dropped to almost nothing by the end of the year. Presumably once defenses started figuring things out.

[SirFozzie]

Go deep again first play, see if they've come up with the counter?

[SirFozzie]

Another big play by the Pats!

[DaddyTorgo]

edelman's first nfl td!!!

[SirFozzie]

Double Dola: Brady 9-14, 243 yards. Wow

[Lathum]

anyone get the feeling the Pats aren't going to let up

[kingfc22]

Nice play by Brady there for the TD.

Indy getting manhandled.

[DaddyTorgo]

I can't remember the last time Brady's had this kind of time against Freeney/Colts. Same with Taylor last week.

As much as I love Light, I never thought he was more than average. Volmer's been raising the bar in only a few games.

+1

SeaBass has been huge.

Cya later Light.

[DaddyTorgo]

anyone get the feeling the Pats aren't going to let up

i hope not. can't give Payton a chance to come back...he's a great QB.

[jeff061]

No kidding. 2.5 quarters? Might as well be a 3 point game now, as far as I'm concerned.

[Abe Sargent]

I am officially turning it off and putting in Doctor Who: Terminus, which just came out on Region 1 DVD recently.

[DaddyTorgo]

legit flag...unfortunately

[SirFozzie]

Can't stop him forever...

[DaddyTorgo]

bah - bad 3-and-out

now PM's gonna lead them on a drive and it'll be 3pts by halftime

[jeff061]

This has been an oddly paced game.

[Karlifornia]

The Patriots played a good first half, but I just don't know if they're going to maintain a lead without more production from Wes Welker. Tom Brady should really start throwing it to Wes Welker. Specifically in the red zone. Throwing to Randy Moss would be too predictable. They're expecting that now.

/fantasy team on the edge of losing a key game

[jeff061]

I was going to critique you then saw the slashie. You evil fantasy junkie :D.

[Karlifornia]

The Blind Side still hasn't even come out? I feel like I've been seeing ads for it since before Michael Oher was even born.

[DaddyTorgo]

lol i was going to point out to Karl that Welker will get his for sure by the end of the game

[DaddyTorgo]

see that clock on moss?

33yds in 3.3 seconds

[jeff061]

Ok, who didn't chuckle at the cleft chin joke.

Edit: Ugh. Thought they were gonna have it with that time.

[jeff061]

I hate Maroney.

[Buccaneer]

What a bad ending to a masterful drive.

[DaddyTorgo]

ugh - that fucking sucks

how come we're not seeing a replay of that?

[Racer]

Pats fumbling the ball at the goalline - that's what the Colts RBs usually do against the Pats.

[Neuqua]

I love watching these two quarterbacks go at eachother.

[DaddyTorgo]

WES WELKER!!!!

[jeff061]

Don't see Welker running for that distance too often. Quick and instinctive as hell, but Brady may be able to beat him in a straight sprint ;).

[DaddyTorgo]

69yd punt return...back to 1st and goal thanks to that!

[DaddyTorgo]

td...moss!

he had to SKY to get that

[Sublime 2]

Huge INT there...Make Them Pay!

[DaddyTorgo]

Huge INT there...Make Them Pay!

nope.

poop.

[Izulde]

Fucking Randy Moss. His 40 fantasy points probably cost me this week. I'm down by 20 and while I have Ray Rice tomorrow, my opponent also has Joe Flacco.

FML.

[DaddyTorgo]

anyone nervous yet? bah

[DaddyTorgo]

fuck. i don't like this at all

[Lathum]

Here we go...

[Eaglesfan27]

Wow. Can't believe they actually went for it.

[DaddyTorgo]

first down? ohhhhh fuck me

[jeff061]

Don't like the call. I don't know what he was thinking. He should have run it on 3rd if he was prepared to go on 4th.

[Karlifornia]

LOL....

[henry296]

They can't even challenge because they have no timeouts.

[DaddyTorgo]

gonna be pissed if we lose this because of maroney's goal-line fumble

[Galaxy]

That has to be one of the gustiest calls I've seen in football.

[DaddyTorgo]

They can't even challenge because they have no timeouts.

they have 1 i think

[Racer]

Pats can't challenge the spot. They are out of timeouts.

Edit: Guess someone beat me to it by two minutes.

[mauchow]

unreal that they went for it.

[henry296]

DT - I think they took the last one before 4th down... I don't see a mark on the screen.

[jeff061]

Belichick gives the finger to his defense then loses the game.

[DaddyTorgo]

or not

[DaddyTorgo]

Belichick gives the finger to his defense then loses the game.

defense is just gassed...better to let payton have a shot at winning and then get the ball back for a FG attempt maybe

[DaddyTorgo]

poor pats

outplayed them for 57 minutes

[Galaxy]

poor pats

outplayed them for 57 minutes

:D

[Eaglesfan27]

Belichick gives the finger to his defense then loses the game.

Yep, way to instill confidence in the defense.

[jeff061]

Awful call on 4th. Horrible.

They should have just sat down and given them the TD.

[Galaxy]

TD!

[Karlifornia]

unbelieveable...this is absolutely heartbreaking for my fantasy team

[Eaglesfan27]

Tonight was a great game to watch as a neutral fan.

[jeff061]

Now I'm annoyed they didn't just let them score on the 1st play.

If you don't think the defense can stop them from driving 80 yards. Why bother trying on 35.

I still can't believe he made that call. Blows my mind.

[Neuqua]

Peyton's an f'ing killer.

[jeff061]

Maybe so. The victim gave the killer a loaded gun and followed it up by sucking on the barrel.

[jeff061]

Third and 2, you have 2 downs and your in the lead. Two fucking passes? Really?

[Galaxy]

Third and 2, you have 2 downs and your in the lead. Two fucking passes? Really?

I thought Dick Jauron was coaching the Pats.

[jbergey22]

What the hell is Bellichek doing? Ive never seen anything so stupid.

[bhlloy]

defense is just gassed...better to let payton have a shot at winning and then get the ball back for a FG attempt maybe

IF this is your logic you cannot tackle Addai on the one yard line when Indy still has a timeout and enough time to run 3-4 plays easily. Terrible, terrible decision. Really unprecedented to not trust your defense enough to stop a team from going 60+ yards in 2 minutes with only 1 time out. Only time will tell but that kind of decision can really lose the locker room.

[EagleFan]

That has to be one of the stupidest calls I've seen in football.

fixed it for ya. :)

[jbergey22]

Awful call on 4th. Horrible.

They should have just sat down and given them the TD.


Exactly if you dont have enough confidence in your defense to stop them from going 60-80 yards with 1 timeout left why the hell not just let them score and go for the game winning FG. Something about that whole thing didnt make sense.

[Arles]

I thought Dick Jauron was coaching the Pats.
Be fair, it was more like Mike Tice ;)

As an aside, Reggie Wayne's late TD is giving me a chance in fantasy (need 12 combined points from Mason and the Balt D).

[EagleFan]

I LOVE it, Bellichek's arrogance cost him the game!!!!

[Big Fo]

Good game, awesome ending. Belichick's face on the sideline after the failed fourth down play had me laughing pretty good.

[Galaxy]

What the hell is Bellichek doing? Ive never seen anything so stupid.

Maybe that's because you knew it was being filmed.

[jeff061]

His face should have been in the dirt after Wilfork put him in it.

[jeff061]

You have any idea how much it pains me to listen to Dungy speak the truth about something, like anything, at all?

[MizzouRah]

I LOVE it, Bellichek's arrogance cost him the game!!!!

Me too!

[DaddyTorgo]

Exactly if you dont have enough confidence in your defense to stop them from going 60-80 yards with 1 timeout left why the hell not just let them score and go for the game winning FG. Something about that whole thing didnt make sense.


yeah - that didn't make any sense to me either.

wtf

[Galaxy]

Post-game conference on ESPN2.

[Radii]

Tonight was a great game to watch as a neutral fan.

+1, that was awesome

[Kodos]

Awesome finish. How sweet is it that Belicheck basically gave the game away. GREAT GAME. Go Colts!

[larrymcg421]

Peyton did that to the Fins earlier this year, so I'm glad he was nice enough to return the favor and do the same to the Patriots.

[jeff061]

I mean Manning only really tore them up on two drives before that last one. I just can't wrap my mind around Belichick's sudden insanity. I'm usualy ok with his shitty press conferences, but that fucker should explain himself this time. I'm expecting the "Look, we are just trying to win the game" with a look of disgust on his face.

[Kodos]

gonna be pissed if we lose this because of maroney's goal-line fumble

Welp, I think you have a different scapegoat now. :)

[cartman]

Belichick must have been watching game film from the 90s when Switzer made the exact same boneheaded call on 4th down against the Eagles.

[Abe Sargent]

Welp, I think you have a different scapegoat now. :)

Heh

[Antmeister]

I LOVE it, Bellichek's arrogance cost him the game!!!!

Wow....now if anyone tries this is Madden, I won't say it's unrealistic. Watching Rodney Harrison in the post game say it was the worst call they had seen was great. You could see it hurt him to say it.

[jeff061]

Fucking Belichick said it was a bad spot? Someone just put that guy out of his misery.

I'm not overreacting damn it.

[Wolfpack]

I mean Manning only really tore them up on two drives before that last one. I just can't wrap my mind around Belichick's sudden insanity. I'm usualy ok with his shitty press conferences, but that fucker should explain himself this time. I'm expecting the "Look, we are just trying to win the game" with a look of disgust on his face.

A variant of "You play to win the game!" ? (Yes, I've compared Belichick to Herm Edwards....)

To be fair, if they had converted, everyone would still think it insane, but an insanity usually ascribed to geniuses. And yes, he gave a colossal no-vote of confidence for his defense against Peyton Manning. Should come in quite handy at playoff time should the teams meet again.

[Racer]

Interesting article regarding Belichick's decision to go for it.

hxxp://www.advancednflstats.com/2009/11/belichicks-4th-down-decision-vs-colts.html

[Groundhog]

Even before reading that, I didn't think it was a particularly stupid decision. Like it says, you make those 2 yards and you win the game. It's easier to gain 2 yards than it is to stop a Peyton Manning 2-minute drill IMO.

If it works, you're a genius, if it doesn't, you're crucified.

[Big Fo]

That was interesting. I wouldn't have guessed the likelihood for getting a TD from your own 30 with two minutes left would be over 50%.

[Groundhog]

That was interesting. I wouldn't have guessed the likelihood for getting a TD from your own 30 with two minutes left would be over 50%.

I always find it surprising how efficently some teams run a 2-minute drill, especially just before the half. You see them sputter on offense all half, and then suddenly a no-huddle, all-pass 2-minute drill has them putting points on the board.