The Thread In Which Foz blows his top about Copy Protection Schemes..

[SirFozzie]

Like this lovely email I got from Shrapnel Games...

Replacement manuals with a new CD key is available for $6.50 plus
shipping ($3.85 via USPS priority mail). If you'd like one I can bill the
cc used for your original order with your permission.

This is why I fucking hate Copy Protection schemes that automatically assume that I am a pirate and require me to spend another $10+ to play the game I legally purchased bcause I cleaned up the computer room and now can't find the @)$$&@) manual.

*sighs*

[Chubby]

could be worse, they could you make you buy the game again.

[Franklinnoble]

Bah. Google around for a CD key on the internet someplace.

[SirFozzie]

Trust me. I'm tempted.

[SirFozzie]

could be worse, they could you make you buy the game again.


If they tried that routine, they'd never see one cent from me ever again. I bought the game, I should be able to use it fairly (No, I'm not distributing the game to hell and back.. personal use). Invasive Copy protection schemes like this absolutely suck.

I can kinda dig Neverwinter Nights placement of the CD key, on the Fold out CD Holders. if you keep the CD's in them, you can always re install. But in a book.. arrrrgh..

[Chubby]

If they tried that routine, they'd never see one cent from me ever again. I bought the game, I should be able to use it fairly (No, I'm not distributing the game to hell and back.. personal use). Invasive Copy protection schemes like this absolutely suck.

I can kinda dig Neverwinter Nights placement of the CD key, on the Fold out CD Holders. if you keep the CD's in them, you can always re install. But in a book.. arrrrgh..
I agree. My Diablo 2 cd keys are on the case so I can't lose them. My FFXI keys are in the booklet grrr so I'm worried about those. It's just another example of why I like electronic distribution better, I can always forward the email with the keys to a secure account that I can always get to even after a computer crash.

[Samdari]

Another method that is secure in the event of a computer crash.

Write them down. All of them.

[rkmsuf]

Another method that is secure in the event of a computer crash.

Write them down. All of them.

Brilliant!

[Chubby]

Another method that is secure in the event of a computer crash.

Write them down. All of them.

Except for me that's about as useful as having them in the instruction booklet. :D

[corbes]

Except for me that's about as useful as having them in the instruction booklet. :D
Actually throwing that paper out immediately will save a step sometime in the future.;)

[Maple Leafs]

Dammit, I am so sick of this copy-protection crap from these businesses.

I just wish all the cheap warez doodz and entitled upper-class college kids would stop pirating everything under the sun. These losers ruin it for the rest of us who actually understand the concept of making your work available for sale.

(What? Not the direction some of you wanted to go with this? Oh.)

[rkmsuf]

Dammit, I am so sick of this copy-protection crap from these businesses.

I just wish all the cheap warez doodz and entitled upper-class college kids would stop pirating everything under the sun. These losers ruin it for the rest of us who actually understand the concept of making your work available for sale.

(What? Not the direction some of you wanted to go with this? Oh.)

I remember way back when trying to obtain cracked C64 games. At least now they don't make you go to page 37 of the instruction manual, count down 19 words to find the password.

[corbes]

I remember way back when trying to obtain cracked C64 games. At least now they don't make you go to page 37 of the instruction manual, count down 19 words to find the password.
Heh, I remember that. I also miss code wheels.

My friend once misplaced his codewheel for Starflight and had to COPY the entire codewheel on a copier. In short, it sucked.

[fantastic flying froggies]

Ah Starflight... the name brings a tear to my eyes... Those were the days...

[corbes]

Ah Starflight... the name brings a tear to my eyes... Those were the days...
I know. Between this and the G.I. Joe thread, I feel like it's 1988 again.

[rkmsuf]

Omni Play basketball and hockey would prompt you each time to turn to a different page in the manual and find a word. Rage would define the experience of misplacing the manual...

[corbes]

Omni Play basketball and hockey would prompt you each time to turn to a different page in the manual and find a word. Rage would define the experience of misplacing the manual...*warning: semi-gratuitous Pirates! reference*

I had a lot of games like that. I remember Pirates! used to make you identify the type of ship that was on page __. (Or was it the name of the pirate on page __?)

[Chubby]

Omni Play basketball and hockey would prompt you each time to turn to a different page in the manual and find a word. Rage would define the experience of misplacing the manual...
My friend had a football and baseball game for his comp (the football one showed the plays run out with x's and o's) that made you use the manual for passwords.

He lost the manual so we started putting random words in there and it worked anyways :)

[corbes]

My friend had a football and baseball game for his comp (the football one showed the plays run out with x's and o's) that made you use the manual for passwords.

You speak of NFL Challenge???

[Ragone]

you know if you made a duplicate of the exe file of omni play basketball and hockey.. and replaced it after every time you run.. you'd get the same page/line/word everytime :)

i made a .bat file to automatically do that everytime i ran.. was great :)

[rkmsuf]

you know if you made a duplicate of the exe file of omni play basketball and hockey.. and replaced it after every time you run.. you'd get the same page/line/word everytime :)

i made a .bat file to automatically do that everytime i ran.. was great :)

Unlike you I guess I wasn't that bright in 7th grade.

[Celeval]

NFL Challenge was awesome.

[fantastic flying froggies]

*warning: semi-gratuitous Pirates! reference*

I had a lot of games like that. I remember Pirates! used to make you identify the type of ship that was on page __. (Or was it the name of the pirate on page __?)
Pirates ! asked you in which city the Silver Train or the Treasure Fleet was on a particular month. I managed to get all of them down with trial and error and a handmade spreadsheet listing all months AND towns...and god knows there was a shipload of towns in Pirates ! my spreadsheet was like 6 pages long !!!

[ISiddiqui]

I just wish all the cheap warez doodz and entitled upper-class college kids would stop pirating everything under the sun. These losers ruin it for the rest of us who actually understand the concept of making your work available for sale.

I agree totally! It just takes a few bad apples to fuck it up for the rest of us. It ISN'T the fault of the computer game companies, but rather of the idiots that will download games for free. You can't expect game companies to just shrug and say oh well to that!

[corbes]

Pirates ! asked you in which city the Silver Train or the Treasure Fleet was on a particular month. I managed to get all of them down with trial and error and a handmade spreadsheet listing all months AND towns...and god knows there was a shipload of towns in Pirates ! my spreadsheet was like 6 pages long !!!
ooohhhhh yeh... the Silver Train and Treasure Fleet. That's right.

edit- I just kept the book instead of doing all that work, though.

[Maple Leafs]

Omni Play basketball and hockey would prompt you each time to turn to a different page in the manual and find a word. Rage would define the experience of misplacing the manual...God bless Omni Play games. They were my first ever experience with career play in a sports game.

The copy protection was annoying though. Admit it, how many times did you retype the same word three times, only to wind up yelling at your monitor "What do you mean, it's on the reference card, not the manual?"

[Samdari]

Except for me that's about as useful as having them in the instruction booklet. :D

Not if you have one sheet of paper taped to the side of your machine with all of your codes :)

[rkmsuf]

God bless Omni Play games. They were my first ever experience with career play in a sports game.

The copy protection was annoying though. Admit it, how many times did you retype the same word three times, only to wind up yelling at your monitor "What do you mean, it's on the reference card, not the manual?"

I played those to death...looking back they were pretty well done. You could change team names, players would develop ect...I can still recall some of the legends from my basketball team.

Hockey was a bit of a drag when your guys stamina ran low.

[Chubby]

Not if you have one sheet of paper taped to the side of your machine with all of your codes :)
hmmm {note to self}

[Maple Leafs]

I played those to death...looking back they were pretty well done. You could change team names, players would develop ect...I can still recall some of the legends from my basketball team.You have to admit, after seeing the struggles that franchises like OOTP and FOF have had with trade AI, the whole concept of "trading points" still looks pretty good.

[corbes]

You have to admit, after seeing the struggles that franchises like OOTP and FOF have had with trade AI, the whole concept of "trading points" still looks pretty good.
This wasn't the same series as Mindscape, was it?

edit: research reveals I am talking about Ed Ringler's "Superstar Ice Hockey" from Mindscape.

[Samdari]

Not to imply that I particularly like being subjected to copy-protection schemes. But, I did lose the ability to play a game I loved once (to which the answer was buy it again). I just figured that the first time I 'lost' a game this way was a crappy way to give customers value for their purchase. A second time would have been me not learning to protect myself.

[rkmsuf]

This wasn't the same series as Mindscape, was it?

I don't think so...this was by Sporttime?

http://pirates.emucamp.com/a/o/omnipb/c64/main.html

[corbes]

Yeh...designed by Ed Ringler.

Wow. Had I only known that he made a basketball game, too...

[rkmsuf]

This wasn't the same series as Mindscape, was it?

edit: research reveals I am talking about Ed Ringler's "Superstar Ice Hockey" from Mindscape.


same family of games I think

[Franklinnoble]

I still miss the Leisure Suit Larry series... you'd think they'd have done a re-make by now, with all the advancements in graphics technology...

[SirFozzie]

MindScape was the distributor for some of the stuff (as was Virgin, they did the Sport of Kings module for Omni Play Horse Racing)

OmniPlay would haave been the ultimate company if they could have just supported all the games ;) (all the modules they promised would have been AWESOME)

[SirFozzie]

I still miss the Leisure Suit Larry series... you'd think they'd have done a re-make by now, with all the advancements in graphics technology...

They are :)

With Larry's cousin I think (also named Larry Laeffer)

[rkmsuf]

MindScape was the distributor for some of the stuff (as was Virgin, they did the Sport of Kings module for Omni Play Horse Racing)

OmniPlay would haave been the ultimate company if they could have just supported all the games ;) (all the modules they promised would have been AWESOME)

I'm still waiting for that damn trainer and jockey module. Any updates?

[rkmsuf]

I still miss the Leisure Suit Larry series... you'd think they'd have done a re-make by now, with all the advancements in graphics technology...


http://www.gamespot.com/pc/adventure/leisuresuitlarrymcl/preview_6085360.html

[Maple Leafs]

OmniPlay would haave been the ultimate company if they could have just supported all the games ;) (all the modules they promised would have been AWESOME)No kidding. The list of modules you could order was stunning, but virtually none of them ever materialized.

I wonder if Ed Ringler is still doing games these days. I'd buy one just on principle.

[SirFozzie]

Ugh tell me about it.

Horse Racing is a sport that would very much use an update. I'd suggest the success of SimulatedSports's Horse Racing sim shows that if you do it RIGHT (owner, trainer, jockey, with the options to do any/all), people will buy it :)

[sachmo71]

Railroad Tycoon had cool copy protection. I like trains.

[Surtt]

Not if you have one sheet of paper taped to the side of your machine with all of your codes :)

Write them on the cd label.
If you have the cd to install it, you have the code.

[sabotai]

This is why I write down all of my CD keys (and e-license order IDs) if it's in a book or the case on a piece of paper that is inside of a binder. No chance of me losing it.

[corbes]

I would lose that binder pronto.

[tucker342]

Omni Play basketball and hockey would prompt you each time to turn to a different page in the manual and find a word. Rage would define the experience of misplacing the manual...
Games used to do that shit all the time... there was nothing more annoying then wanting to play a game but of course not being able to because the manual had been lost.

Makes me pissed off just thinking about it.

[sterlingice]

I remember way back when trying to obtain cracked C64 games. At least now they don't make you go to page 37 of the instruction manual, count down 19 words to find the password.
I miss those, too. "On page 47 about terraforms, what is the 17th word" (SimEarth) :D

SI

[SlapBone]

I think this funny due to the fact that you cock-blocked Druez in the game you are talking about.

On another note I had a CD damaged (2 year old played with it on the linoleum for a bit) and Shrapnel replaced it free.

[BishopMVP]

I would lose that binder pronto.Type them up in an e-mail and send it to yourself. Even if your computer crashes, you have them all saved in the e-mail server.

[SirFozzie]

I think this funny due to the fact that you cock-blocked Druez in the game you are talking about.

On another note I had a CD damaged (2 year old played with it on the linoleum for a bit) and Shrapnel replaced it free.

*grumbles some more*

I am truly sorry for holding up the game. But apparently the CD and the book are two seperate things to shrapnel.. If I had the book but not the CD, that's apparently cool.. (free replacement) but $10+ for a missing book, sigh. (I did order the replacement, and it's coming via USPS priority

[druez]

its called karma and its biting you in the ass.

[NoMyths]

its called karma and its biting you in the ass.And he speaks as one who knows.

[druez]

And he speaks as one who knows.

exactly take it from me... I've gotten bit in the ass many times.

[SirFozzie]

Well, just to bring Closure to this thread, (and to bring it fulll circle)

I sent this to Annette (through Shrapnel Games's customer desk)

Please do so. I do not like this policy, but of course, if I don't, I have a $50 drink coaster :) Same address and everything, and need the CD-key asap for an online game on the FOFC message boards

and her response..

Usually the replacements ship from our fulfillment center and key assignment is random. I've snagged the one coming to you so you don't have to wait for the key. Please use:
(CD-Key Redacted.. I've lost one, but won't lose two ;))

I'm sorry, too, we have to do it this way. Unfortunately, the threat that piracy poses to the health of our industry influences the way we handle replacements. $10.35 has billed to your credit card and the manual is shipping to you today.


I disagree with her rationale, but I'm just glad it's over.

[sachmo71]

I'm sorry too, but joyous at the same time! Let the first Front Office Football multiplayer Dominions II game begin!!! :)

[WSUCougar]

I think we should all celebrate SirFozzie's return to Dominions II by wiping him off the face of the map.

But that's just me. ;)

[SlapBone]

I think their (Shrapnel) way to curb this piracy threat is to have software registration with key retention (sort of the way Bioware does it). This way it would be sort of like opting in for the key insurance. If you don't want the key associated with your name it's simple...don't register the software.

Edit: they just built the key-checking into the software in the last patch anyway.

[Poli]

Every time I look at this thread in the forum, I think:

The Thread In Which Foz blows his top about Pass Protection Schemes..

[Mac Howard]

Unfortunately some form of protection is necessary. I first released SaaP with no protection. About four months later I found 22 warez sites handing out the latest version of the game :rolleyes:

A great way to prevent buyers passing the game on is to include the name and credit card number prominently on the opening screen. No need to limit re-installation etc then.

Never had the guts to do it though :D

[SlapBone]

Unfortunately some form of protection is necessary. I first released SaaP with no protection. About four months later I found 22 warez sites handing out the latest version of the game :rolleyes:

A great way to prevent buyers passing the game on is to include the name and credit card number prominently on the opening screen. No need to limit re-installation etc then.

Never had the guts to do it though :D

I think the way the the sports sim industry has handled piracy is the best way. I have everything I need with ELicense registration.

1. I can have it installed on any 2 computers I want (in my case the home PC and my work laptop).

2. I can have it immediately.

3. I can constantly download the latest full version and not have to keep up with multiple patches.

[Draft Dodger]

*warning: semi-gratuitous Pirates! reference*

I had a lot of games like that. I remember Pirates! used to make you identify the type of ship that was on page __. (Or was it the name of the pirate on page __?)

The first Railroad Tycoon was like that - I didn't have the manual, and had to indentify the train. I think there were like 2 I identified by trial and error, so I had to just restart a few times until one of them came up.