World Series, Game 1

[Celeval]

Damn. That might have been the best-sounding national anthem since Whitney Houston's Super Bowl.

[vtbub]

He did well.

Radio on, TV on mute.

[Eaglesfan27]

I'm not a fan of his, but that was a very good rendition.

Time to play ball!

[terpkristin]

I need to chime in with this now. Since my boys (Boston) didn't make it very far in the post-season, I'm cheering for one of my two favorite NL teams, the Astros (who I don't follow anywhere nearly as close as I do the BoSox).

GO ASTROS!!!!!!!!!!!!

/tk

[LoneStarGirl]

Good, the Astros could always use some more fans.

And where is Jeeber? I need somebody to talk to throughout the game!

[terpkristin]

Uh oh.
2 outs, Clemens throws a HR pitch. :(

/tk

[vtbub]

Smart hitting.

[LoneStarGirl]

Good grief. And Clemens is pissed, a couple of those balls were close

[terpkristin]

Wow, and they get one right back!
/tk

[Rizon]

This doesn't look like the pitching duel they were making it out to be.

"Don't... don't... don't sit on the hood. That hood will dent. I told the kids not to get on the hood! Just see if you can bounce it loose, and I'll... ah... just bounce it loose."

[Galaxy]

Who sang the national anthem?

[LoneStarGirl]

What is happening to Roger?
And why the hell did Everett not throw the ball to home?!

[LoneStarGirl]

Who said what about a pitching duel? 6 runs in 2 1/2 innings is pretty impressive

[mauchow]

Who sang the national anthem?
Josh Groban

[LoneStarGirl]

And Clemens is out after 2 innings. Beautiful.

[vtbub]

TTweaked the hammy

[LoneStarGirl]

He better be able to pitch Thursday.

[mauchow]

I was wondering when he'd go to the bullpen. *shakes head* Mannnnn

[LoneStarGirl]

If Crede hadn't have made those 2 great plays the Astros would be up 5-4.
He's a good player.

[mauchow]

Here come the Stros.

[mauchow]

Sheesh. Huge K's there.

[Mr. Sparkle]

That sure was an annoying show plug there.

[Cards4ever]

The White Sox were able to hold on, I thought for sure the Stros were going to tie it up. Should be interesting to see what Guillen does when the games get to the Juice Box.

[ISiddiqui]

Bobby Jenks was a monster!

The White Sox bullpen seems to be just as good as their starters!

[sterlingice]

Great game- just really well played baseball. Sure, the starting pitching wasn't quite the caliber people were expecting but there was quite a bit of good pitching and the game was really entertaining.

SI

[MizzouRah]

Great game- just really well played baseball. Sure, the starting pitching wasn't quite the caliber people were expecting but there was quite a bit of good pitching and the game was really entertaining.

SI
I agree.

[Karlifornia]

Houston blew quite a few chances (or..CWS found ways to get out of trouble)

[sterlingice]

Well, I don't see a WS Game 2 thread so how about building off of this one. A couple of thoughts:

I swear- this is how baseball should feel
That last half inning was just... "wow"
I know sabermetricians have attempted to prove that there's no such thing as clutch, but 1) I think they are missing the point with small samples sizes and looking at it as "who is consistently clutch" rather than "who is affected by stress" and 2) Berkman is clutch

SI

[ISiddiqui]

I know sabermetricians have attempted to prove that there's no such thing as clutch, but 1) I think they are missing the point with small samples sizes and looking at it as "who is consistently clutch" rather than "who is affected by stress"Doesn't that mean Berkman is affected by stress less, rather than he is more 'clutch'. Clutch is supposed to mean that you turn it up during pressure situations, rather than not being as affected by stress.

[McSweeny]

fwiw

Bill James has said that he cannot prove that clutch exists. Lack of proof does not disprove clutch

[sterlingice]

Doesn't that mean Berkman is affected by stress less, rather than he is more 'clutch'. Clutch is supposed to mean that you turn it up during pressure situations, rather than not being as affected by stress.
I suppose in other sports, yes, that's how you'd define clutch. I think in baseball, that's just not possible to quantify and, yes, you've described what I claim is "baseball clutch". Due to the fact that 10% of performance (.250 to .350 average) separates the best players from the worst, there's just not enough sample and too much noise to mathematically prove it, however.

SI

[sterlingice]

fwiw

Bill James has said that he cannot prove that clutch exists. Lack of proof does not disprove clutch
Rob Neyer has argued on numerous occasions that clutch hitters do not exist.

SI

[ISiddiqui]

fwiw

Bill James has said that he cannot prove that clutch exists. Lack of proof does not disprove clutchPerhaps, but the onus of proof is one those who make an assertion. It's like saying that if you can't disprove that God exists then he must.

I suppose in other sports, yes, that's how you'd define clutch. I think in baseball, that's just not possible to quantify and, yes, you've described what I claim is "baseball clutch". Due to the fact that 10% of performance (.250 to .350 average) separates the best players from the worst, there's just not enough sample and too much noise to mathematically prove it, however.I think you are changing definitions, frankly, to make a point. I've heard, quite often, that Derek Jeter gets BETTER in the playoffs or 'clutch' situations. Not that he isn't affected by stress, but that he becomes an even greater player when pressure is in play.

[WrongWay]

Anyone know what kind of heating system they have for the dugouts? Because, it looks very cold there. Not to mention wet. I wonder if anyone will come up sick, because they are not going to stop this game.

You always here about the NFL's heated benches and heaters, but you never heare about MLBs heating system.

[McSweeny]

Rob Neyer has argued on numerous occasions that clutch hitters do not exist.

SI

oh i know

i'm just saying that Bill James never came out and said "clutch does NOT exist". He's just said that he can't prove or disprove it

[WrongWay]

actually, it looks like the rain has stopped

[ISiddiqui]

actually, it looks like the rain has stoppedNo way! It's still pouring.

[WrongWay]

ODoes this mean more replay talk?... Sure looked like it hit the Bat to me.

[ISiddiqui]

HOLY CRAP! Grand Slam Konerko!

[kingfc22]

Damn, when it's your year it's your year. http://dynamic.gamespy.com/%7Efof/forums/images/smilies/mad.gif

[sterlingice]

Wow http://dynamic.gamespy.com/%7Efof/forums/images/smilies/eek.gif

SI

[Rizon]

ODoes this mean more replay talk?... Sure looked like it hit the Bat to me.

No doubt in my mind baseball will have replay by the end of this decade. I'd have been against it before, but I think the game is just moving too fast now for umps. Takes away from the "purity" of the ... oh wait, baseball has purity still?? :D

[sterlingice]

Tim, John get off the ump's ass already. There's a game going on. You can abuse that clip later.

SI

[kingfc22]

Ughh. Can we stop giving early christmas gifts to the Sox please.

[WrongWay]

Either way it should be easy to spot the bruise tomorrow.

[sterlingice]

WOOT!

SI

[ISiddiqui]

WOW... looks like we may be headed into extras! Vizcaino comes up big!

[kingfc22]

I can't believe that Burke was able to score on that hit. WOOT!!!

I just scared my cat shitless.http://dynamic.gamespy.com/%7Efof/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Rizon]

I can't believe that Burke was able to score on that hit.

He looked like he was going to be nailed. Was he even to third yet before the LF had the ball?

[Logan]

He looked like he was going to be nailed. Was he even to third yet before the LF had the ball?

Nope...he was about a stride and a half away.

EDIT: For anyone who is reading this and isn't watching...Podsednik fielded that ball in short left center. He couldn't have been more than 50 feet past the dirt.

EDIT #2: Retribution :).

[sterlingice]

aw. hell.

SI

[ISiddiqui]

WALK OFF HR!! Posednik!!

Makes up for the weak throw last half-inning, eh?

[kingfc22]

boo

[ThunderingHERD]

"I don't think that taste is there."

[PilotMan]

makes me wonder if Lidge's career is going to go the same way that Mitch Williams did. Esp now that he has lost it twice in the same post season.

[LoneStarGirl]

That pisses me of soo much, I dont even know what to say.

Awww well, at least we made it this far.

[MizzouRah]

"I don't think that taste is there."
As soon as that idiot said that I thought, "Here it goes." Talk about sticking your foot in your mouth. lol

[ISiddiqui]

Lidge is going all Byung Young Kim on us, isn't he?

[sterlingice]

makes me wonder if Lidge's career is going to go the same way that Mitch Williams did. Esp now that he has lost it twice in the same post season.
I don't see it as a good comparison. Mitch Williams was one of those "always an adventure" closers while Lidge has been one of those "lights out" types the past couple of years. For instance, if Mike MacDougal here for the Royals had some big playoff problems (hey, stop laughing!) he would go the MacDougal route whereas, say, K-Rod could recover.

SI

[Cards4ever]

But it makes you wonder if those 2 inning saves are starting to affect him, no?

I think the White Sox had to have those 2 games to win the series, cause I have a feeling Guillen is going to be outmanaged down in Houston.

[Rizon]

makes me wonder if Lidge's career is going to go the same way that Mitch Williams did. Esp now that he has lost it twice in the same post season.

Oakland can always use another choker.

[PilotMan]

I don't see it as a good comparison. Mitch Williams was one of those "always an adventure" closers while Lidge has been one of those "lights out" types the past couple of years. For instance, if Mike MacDougal here for the Royals had some big playoff problems (hey, stop laughing!) he would go the MacDougal route whereas, say, K-Rod could recover.

SI
All I am saying SI, is that things like this do things to a pitchers confidence. I was wondering if he was going to start to question himself. Hell, Donnie Moore killed himself for less. At least he only allowed one game losing homer.

[JasonC23]

Scotty P comes to bat. My wife says, "Hey, maybe he'll hit a homer and win it!" I look at her like she's crazy. We both laugh. What a silly jokester she is.





Women are smart.

[sterlingice]

All I am saying SI, is that things like this do things to a pitchers confidence. I was wondering if he was going to start to question himself. Hell, Donnie Moore killed himself for less. At least he only allowed one game losing homer.
I'm not saying it can't happen but before we buy him a bowling alley to retire to in a couple of years maybe we should give it more than one game. Just as the Astros weren't magically finished by the Pujols homer or the Diamondbacks being Byung-Hyun Kim'd- this just seems like one of those things that sounds like an overdramatic story ("now he'll implode and go drive off a bridge") for now.

SI

[Young Drachma]

makes me wonder if Lidge's career is going to go the same way that Mitch Williams did. Esp now that he has lost it twice in the same post season.

I was saying that tonight to a friend. Lidge seems to have far better stuff and isn't as wild as Williams was. He's more in the mold of an Eck as a closer. Eck gave up some big hits, but of course, he had been around a long time. Lidge probably doesn't even know what to do.

But if he comes back next season and is dominant again, he'll get over it, I think.

[Cards4ever]

I'm not saying it can't happen but before we buy him a bowling alley to retire to in a couple of years maybe we should give it more than one game. Just as the Astros weren't magically finished by the Pujols homer or the Diamondbacks being Byung-Hyun Kim'd- this just seems like one of those things that sounds like an overdramatic story ("now he'll implode and go drive off a bridge") for now.

SI


The difference is, the Stros were still up 3 games to 2 when he gave up the Pujols shot, the homer last night put the Stros in a 0-2 hole.

[Raven Hawk]

I was listening to some sports radio this morning and the consensus is that Lidge pitched Podsednik correctly. In something like 600 at bats during the season he didn't hit 1 home run. He's a lead-off hitter, and on-base guy. You throw him the heat and you throw him strikes. Don't let him get the walk. Podsednik just got a huge piece of it and put it out. Shit happens.

Additionally, Jermaine Dye commented that the ump told him to take first base . . . who was he to argue?

[TazFTW]

The Astros were looking good with a 4-0 lead heading into the 5th. The Sox bat around and now lead 5-4.

[JeeberD]

I turned on the TV and the Astros were up 4-1 with a man on first and one out. Now look at the score.

I think I'm bad luck this series...

[JeeberD]

Come on, Wily...

[sterlingice]

Tim McCarver is such a moron (ok, already known). But to walk a guy with 1 out and the infield in, you just open up a gaping hole on the right or concede letting the runner go to 2nd which is a big deal in case the runner at 3rd gets thrown out at the plate.

SI

[WrongWay]

Question: Bases loaded, 2 outs, tie ball game, and bottom of the 9th why is there someone with a bat in the on deck circle?

[ISiddiqui]

Question: Bases loaded, 2 outs, tie ball game, and bottom of the 9th why is there someone with a bat in the on deck circle?LOL! Good question.

Btw, that inning was what is sooo good about the playoffs. Wow...

[sterlingice]

Question: Bases loaded, 2 outs, tie ball game, and bottom of the 9th why is there someone with a bat in the on deck circle?
You know, I kindof like that question

SI

[hukarez]

Huh...did anyone know about this? I would have thought this would have been covered in the news to some extent.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/playoffs2005/news/story?id=2203060

[JeeberD]

Calm down, Lane!

He nearly ran too far in before he WAY overthrew that ball...

[JeeberD]

Huh...did anyone know about this? I would have thought this would have been covered in the news to some extent.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/playoffs2005/news/story?id=2203060


Read about it on Clutchfans this morning. Meant to bring it up here but forgot...

[hukarez]

Read about it on Clutchfans this morning. Meant to bring it up here but forgot...
Wow. It was that, and the ESPN article about the "Astros' being the first World Series team in 52 years without a black player" that caught my attention.

(which, by the way, is here: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/playoffs2005/news/story?id=2203760 )

[mauchow]

What a snore fest.

:rolleyes:

Edit: Although it is getting late..

[JeeberD]

Dammit, I need some sleep. End this now, 'Stros!

[kingfc22]

Never thought I would get home from work to see the game still on. Go 'Stros

[JeeberD]

Fuck. I need sleep, but not that badly...

[TazFTW]

Blum goes yard. 6-5 Chi Sox.

[kingfc22]

Bleh

[kingfc22]

Pistachio is killing me right now.

[JeeberD]

Come on, Zeke! We can't afford a meltdown right now!

[JeeberD]

ZEKE!!! :mad:

[kingfc22]

PULL HIM

[Neuqua]

Ouch

[mauchow]

Garner should've pulled him after the dinger imo.

[Young Drachma]

I want to see Houston tie this up.

Imagine a WS game that is still being played at 6am...

I was hoping they'd still be playing when I got off work. Hehe..isn't there a curfew though?

[ThunderingHERD]

When I woke up 5 minutes ago, I really wasn't expecting the game to still be on.

[cthomer5000]

wow... what a bailout to keep this going at least one more batter.

[sterlingice]

Unfortunately that batter is Adam Everett... :(

SI

[JeeberD]

Dammit.

I don't want to say that the series is over, but 3-0 is a hell of a hole to climb out of...

[Young Drachma]

Nice. 3-0 Series lead. Awesome.

[Ksyrup]

When I woke up 5 minutes ago, I really wasn't expecting the game to still be on.
That happened to me. I must have fallen asleep around 12:15 or so, and when I woke up at 1:50, the game was still on. I saw the last out of the 13th and turned off the TV. I wish I could have lasted another 10 minutes or so.

[Buccaneer]

Wow. It was that, and the ESPN article about the "Astros' being the first World Series team in 52 years without a black player" that caught my attention.

(which, by the way, is here: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/playoffs2005/news/story?id=2203760 )
I saw that when I watched parts of the NLCS and saw the celebration after Berkman's HR, as well as the jumping up and down after game 6. I thought my eyes were deceiving me. But it's no surprise, I don't think. Baseball will be the domain of whiteys, Latinos and Asians while bball and football will be predominately black. Been trending that way for some time now.

[JeeberD]

Well, Willy Tavares and Zeke Astacio are black Latinos and are on the club. We also had Charles Gipson and Charleton Jimerson, black americans (or African Americans, I suppose) on the 40 man roster, but they didn't make the playoff roster...

[MizzouRah]

Hats off to ChiSox, they did what the Cardinals couldn't do, HIT THE BALL!!!

[SackAttack]

Hats off to ChiSox, they did what the Cardinals couldn't do, HIT THE BALL!!!

Are we talking about the 2004 WS or the 2005 NLCS? :D

[Cards4ever]

Are we talking about the 2004 WS or the 2005 NLCS? :D

After how they played in both those series, sadly, we deserve those cheap shots. :(


On the bright side, we can now adopt that famous Dodger saying, "Wait til next year"! ;)

[Poli]

This is one long pregame.

[st.cronin]

It's quarter to ten on the east coast and the game isn't even half over.

[Neuqua]

Freddy Garcia = The Rock?

[kingfc22]

Is the NL central contractually obligated to a max of 4 games in the world series???

[mauchow]

This one is ovah.

[Young Drachma]

Is the NL central contractually obligated to a max of 4 games in the world series???

haha...

[Galaril]

So, in the last 18 1/2 innings so 18 for each team, 111 outs a total of 3 runs have been scored between both teams. Houston 0 runs and 4 HITS in 15 innings! What a pathetic series this has been.

[Easy Mac]

**Easy Mac holds up 3 fingers**

God I hate Chicago. I really don't care about the series, I just don't feel like going to bed, and Cinemax is scrambled.

[Easy Mac]

That play was Jeter-esque... all he needed to do was catch it, run 20 feet, then dive into the stands for drama.

[ISiddiqui]

That was a freaking amazing catch... with his back to the field, falling into the stands. WOW.

[ISiddiqui]

So, in the last 18 1/2 innings so 18 for each team, 111 outs a total of 3 runs have been scored between both teams. Houston 0 runs and 4 HITS in 15 innings! What a pathetic series this has been.Pathetic? Wha? If you mean exciting and ultra-tense. Not every game has to be a homer fest. Pitcher's duels can be just as exciting.

[Young Drachma]

So, in the last 18 1/2 innings so 18 for each team, 111 outs a total of 3 runs have been scored between both teams. Houston 0 runs and 4 HITS in 15 innings! What a pathetic series this has been.

I think it was good, because it all the games were close.

[Easy Mac]

There was also about 15 walks. Not great pitching, more poor hitting.

[Neuqua]

A lot of people around here are going to consider this the biggest sports day in Chicago since the Bears pummeled the Patriots in the SuperBowl.

[Neuqua]

Congratulations White Sox

[ISiddiqui]

WHITE SOX WIN! Uribe with another fine defensive play!

Boston wins last year. White Sox this year. Are the Baseball Gods on strike?!

[Easy Mac]

Wow, great last inning by Uribe to win it.

So all these hurricanes, earthquakes, floods, tsunamis, the red sox win, the white sox win... what else can happen in the world? If the US or England win the World Cup next year, I'm investing in a bomb shelter.

[hukarez]

Wow.

Congratulations, White Sox!

[ISiddiqui]

There was also about 15 walks. Not great pitching, more poor hitting.There may have been walks, but the pitchers were able to get out of the jams. Often in spectacular ways.

[MikeVic]

I'd LOVE to see the Cubs win next year.

[ISiddiqui]

I'd LOVE to see the Cubs win next year.No, because that would mean the world was ending ;).

[jbmagic]

is the White Sox the best playoff team in history?

they went 11-1 in the playoffs

[JonInMiddleGA]

is the White Sox the best playoff team in history?

they went 11-1 in the playoffs

"They were trying to match the 1999 New York Yankees as the only teams to go through the postseason with just one loss since the extra round of playoffs was added in 1995."

[Neuqua]

The thing about this squad is, if anybody had told me in Spring Training that the White Sox were going to win the World Series, I would have laughed in their face. I don't ever remember a team who was so overlooked in the preseason to win the world series, am I wrong?

[Cards4ever]

Say it ain't so, the Sox are the World Champions! Congrats Sox and your fans!

[Young Drachma]

Kenny Williams is the first minority GM to win a series. Unless Bob Watson won one with the Yankees before he left the Boss's den. And Guillen, the first Hispanic manager to win a series, only the 2nd minority manager ever to manage a World champion. But I'm sure his fate will be far better than Cito Gaston, ironically one of the men he beat out for this job he's won two.

[Young Drachma]

Jermaine Dye MVP. Wow, a former Braves prospect makes good. :)

[Hammer755]

The thing about this squad is, if anybody had told me in Spring Training that the White Sox were going to win the World Series, I would have laughed in their face. I don't ever remember a team who was so overlooked in the preseason to win the world series, am I wrong?

They reminde me of the 2004 Cards. Everybody knew they had the offense, but the pitching went from unknown to superb.

[st.cronin]

Astros need some fast african-americans if they ever hope to compete in the World Series.

[Young Drachma]

Astros need some fast african-americans if they ever hope to compete in the World Series.

yeah, in the front office maybe.

[Hammer755]

They reminde me of the 2004 Cards. Everybody knew they had the offense, but the pitching went from unknown to superb.

Uh, scratch that. After seeing the numbers, their offense was downright mediocre. That pitching carried them pretty much completely.

[Young Drachma]

I think it's good to see that a strong bullpen and good pitching can win a series, not just big names either, but just solid all around players. The Angels proved that in '02, but they had hitters too. Not that the Sox don't, but..they weren't hitting the ball or playing the power game you'd expect from an AL team.

[Young Drachma]

And good to see that a Wild Card team LOST in the Series, rather than always winning it.

[sovereignstar]

The thing about this squad is, if anybody had told me in Spring Training that the White Sox were going to win the World Series, I would have laughed in their face. I don't ever remember a team who was so overlooked in the preseason to win the world series, am I wrong?

Weren't the '87 Twins longshots? I was 6, so I don't remember.

[vtbub]

And good to see that a Wild Card team LOST in the Series, rather than always winning it.

Here Here.

(said by last year's wild card champs)

[ISiddiqui]

And good to see that a Wild Card team LOST in the Series, rather than always winning it.AMEN to that!

[Fonzie]

Poor Brad Lidge.

[ISiddiqui]

The thing about this squad is, if anybody had told me in Spring Training that the White Sox were going to win the World Series, I would have laughed in their face. I don't ever remember a team who was so overlooked in the preseason to win the world series, am I wrong?I think the 2003 Florida Marlins were similarly overlooked in the spring.

And don't forget the worst to first, 1991 Minnesota Twins.

[Neuqua]

As a Cubs fan, the only reason it was even possible for me to root for the White Sox this year was because of how humble the team seemed to be and the good guys it consisted of. Usually in years past there were always certain players whom I could not stand which made it so easy to root against them but not this year.

Congrats again to the White Sox.

Cubs in '06!

[sovereignstar]

Usually in years past there were always certain players whom I could not stand which made it so easy to root against them but not this year.

Carl Everett??

[Neuqua]

Ok, I've heard bad things about him and also AJ Pierzynski but atleast this year they have been relatively tame. Or atleast I don't remember any incidents involving them in the new stories in Chicago.

[Young Drachma]

Carl Everett??

He wasn't that bad this year, though. At least, not compared to his past.

[SackAttack]

After how they played in both those series, sadly, we deserve those cheap shots. :(


On the bright side, we can now adopt that famous Dodger saying, "Wait til next year"! ;)

Well, sure, if you want to win one playoff game every 17 years, that'd be the thing to do. ;)

[JeeberD]

Congrats to the Sox. Our TOTAL lack of hitting with runners in scoring position doomed us this series...

[Cards4ever]

Well, sure, if you want to win one playoff game every 17 years, that'd be the thing to do. ;)


I said we would adopt the saying, not the playing!

[Raven Hawk]

Shortest World Series Thread. Ever.

[Pumpy Tudors]

is the White Sox the best playoff team in history?
Baseball has much too long of a history for me to even guess about that, but it's an interesting question. I know football a little better than baseball these days, so I'll demonstrate my question from a football standpoint. Which is considered a better team? A team that wins in the playoffs by making dramatic plays at the end (the 2001 New England Patriots, for example) or a team that wins in the playoffs by completely dominating their competition (the 1985 Chicago Bears, for example)?

Sure, this year's White Sox only lost one playoff game, but the Astros were with them stride-for-stride throughout the entire World Series. Are the White Sox necessarily a better playoff team than last year's Red Sox? I know the Red Sox lost 3 playoff games last year, but they dominated the Angels and dominated the Cardinals, and, in between, there was the comeback against the Yankees, of course.

For all I know, there could be many other teams that could be considered the best baseball playoff team ever. Again, the history is so long that I have no idea. I'm just opening up some discussion and prolonging the shortest World Series thread ever. :)

[Galaril]

Baseball has much too long of a history for me to even guess about that, but it's an interesting question. I know football a little better than baseball these days, so I'll demonstrate my question from a football standpoint. Which is considered a better team? A team that wins in the playoffs by making dramatic plays at the end (the 2001 New England Patriots, for example) or a team that wins in the playoffs by completely dominating their competition (the 1985 Chicago Bears, for example)?

Sure, this year's White Sox only lost one playoff game, but the Astros were with them stride-for-stride throughout the entire World Series. Are the White Sox necessarily a better playoff team than last year's Red Sox? I know the Red Sox lost 3 playoff games last year, but they dominated the Angels and dominated the Cardinals, and, in between, there was the comeback against the Yankees, of course.

For all I know, there could be many other teams that could be considered the best baseball playoff team ever. Again, the history is so long that I have no idea. I'm just opening up some discussion and prolonging the shortest World Series thread ever. :)

Last years playoff Red Sox's would of crushed this years White Sox.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Last years playoff Red Sox's would of crushed this years White Sox.
OK, now how about a related comment from somebody who's not in Boston? :D

[McSweeny]

OK, now how about a related comment from somebody who's not in Boston? :D

last year's red sox team would totally crush this year's white sox team

:)

[JeeberD]

That play was Jeter-esque... all he needed to do was catch it, run 20 feet, then dive into the stands for drama.


I don't know how the fans in the stands let him catch the ball. He's coming into the stands, he doesn't have priority! Knock the ball out of the air, hit his fucking glove, don't just back away from the play!!!

[Pumpy Tudors]

last year's red sox team would totally crush this year's white sox team

:)
Aw, shit, I should have known. Oh, well, I asked for it. :)

[JasonC23]

This thread is useless without Pumpy Tudors pics.

;)

THE WHITE SOX WON THE WORLD SERIES!! HOLY CRAP!!

This is the most surreal feeling I've ever had. The team I follow...that never wins...that usually isn't even any good...that almost coughed up a 15-game lead...that is ignored even in its own home town 99% of the time...that team won the damn World Series.

[Faints]

[Wakes up, looks around, realizes Hell hasn't frozen over]

[Faints again]

[Fonzie]

[Faints]

[Wakes up, looks around, realizes Hell hasn't frozen over]

[Faints again]
[Steals Jason's wallet]

[Looks around]

[Steals Jason's kidney]

[Fonzie]

Dola-

JeeberD/Astros fans:

What do you think will become of Brad Lidge?

[JeeberD]

I think Lidge will be just fine. He's been used HARD all season long and was probably just becoming fatigued. The Astros will hang on to him and homefully not use him for as many two-inning saves now that Qualls and Wheeler have proven themselves effective...

[Celeval]

Is it just me, or did nobody really care about this years's WS?

Honestly. I say this as slightly-more-than-average baseball fan, usually go to a half-dozen games a season, watch about a game a week on television; keep up with scores, stories, am able to have a relatively intelligent discussion at any point during the season as to what's going on.

And it just seems to me that nobody was talking about the World Series this year. I mean, the White Sox haven't won it since the Black Sox, the Astros were in for the first time... dunno, just didn't mark much of a mark.

[rkmsuf]

Is it just me, or did nobody really care about this years's WS?

Honestly. I say this as slightly-more-than-average baseball fan, usually go to a half-dozen games a season, watch about a game a week on television; keep up with scores, stories, am able to have a relatively intelligent discussion at any point during the season as to what's going on.

And it just seems to me that nobody was talking about the World Series this year. I mean, the White Sox haven't won it since the Black Sox, the Astros were in for the first time... dunno, just didn't mark much of a mark.


agreed. very underwhelming overall.

[Ksyrup]

Actually, Garner let up on him this year as opposed to last year, and he also worked pretty hard the year before as mainly a set-up man. He pitched 24 less innings this year than last year, in 10 less games.

[JeeberD]

Playoffs included?

[Pumpy Tudors]

it just seems to me that nobody was talking about the World Series this year. I mean, the White Sox haven't won it since the Black Sox, the Astros were in for the first time... dunno, just didn't mark much of a mark.
Really, I don't think baseball makes that much of a mark anymore. When the playoffs come, these seem to be the big questions every year:

Will the Yankees win it again?
Will the Red Sox finally win it? (until last year, of course)
Will the Cubs finally win it? (if they're in the playoffs)
When will the Braves choke?
Who else is in the National League playoffs besides the Braves?

Given that none of those four teams were involved in the World Series this year, I'm not surprised at all. The Cubs didn't make the playoffs, while the other three teams got bounced in the first round.

Even about the NLCS, with baseball's best record going up against the one LCS team that had never been to the World Series, there really wasn't much fanfare about it. Yeah, it was a nice story that the Astros had never been to the World Series and got into the playoffs after starting the season horribly. Even so, I get the impression that, on a national level, nobody really cares about the NL Central unless it involves the Cubs. The Cardinals consistently win in the regular season, but the Central is generally regarded as being so weak that St. Louis is going to win it by default. It doesn't really mean anything.

The only teams in the American League that will get any major attention are the Yankees and Red Sox, at least once the playoffs start. The only reason that the Angels and White Sox got any attention is because - you guessed it - they beat the Yankees and Red Sox. If they would've beaten Toronto and Oakland, the ALCS would've been damn near invisible.

Maybe I'm wrong, but this is the impression that I've gotten for the past few years. I don't hate any of the teams I mentioned just because of all the attention they get. That's just the way it seems to be. I just don't expect anything huge to happen when the World Series (or even the LCS) didn't involve any of them.

[Ksyrup]

I watched the games, or most of them until I fell asleep toward the end of at least three of the four games. I was excited simply because it was the WS, but the teams involved really didn't help matters. Let's face it - the Astros and White Sox had the double-whammy of NOT being NY/Boston AND being pretty blah organizations overall. No one hates them, but very few people outside of their cities love them, either. As much as I hate having the Yankees in the WS, at least people care one way or other if they win or lose. As a non-fan/hater of both of these teams, I found myself rooting differently by inning, based on who was pitching, who was hitting, and what the score was.

On the surface, the White Sox story seems just as compelling as the Red Sox last year. But while the surface story was similar (team hasn't won in 85+ years), the back story was sl much different. Boston has always had die-hard fans, and they have suffered through various defeats at the hands of an arach-enemy as well as been self-destructive at key moments, during the past 8 decades. The White Sox...pretty much sucked for 8 decades. No close calls, no agonizing defeats, no storied rivalry. Any time they did well, they exited the post-season quickly and without huge controversy or memorable plays/games. The story looked and felt like last year, but there just wasn't enough juice to make it compelling and draw even big baseball fans like myself. I was drawn simply because it was baseball, not because I wanted the White Sox to win.

And the Astros - I can't even think of anything to say about them, that's how uninteresting the organization is. They've always been competitive - never great, but never horrible. Their post-season history looks a lot like the White Sox, in that they made it a few times (more than the Sox), but never really did much until last year and this year. Bagwell and Biggio made it to the WS 5 years too late, as if the Broncos had made it in 2001 with Elway, a shell of himself, sitting on the bench as a backup instead of an every day contributor (moreso Bags than Biggio, but even Biggio isn't the player he was a few years ago).

All of that, combined with a sweep, made this a pretty forgettable WS. The White Sox deserved to win and I congratulate the Astros for finally making it, but I'm ready for spring training already. Or at least free agency.

[Ksyrup]

Playoffs included?
No, but he pitched in the playoffs last year, didn't he?

[Ksyrup]

I see he pitched a combined 7 games, 12.1 IP last year in the playoffs. I'm having trouble finding this year's combined numbers, but he couldn't have pitched many more innings.

[Ksyrup]

Lidge pitched in 10 games, 12.2 IP this year. Not much difference. He still threw 24 more innings the year before.

[JasonC23]

I'd respond to these silly "World Series--who cares?" posts, but I have this strange, long incision on me that wasn't there a few hours ago...

[Passacaglia]

I feel bad...in my 8:00 class today, I gave a test. I had it scheduled for over three weeks now, I didn't know the Series would end the night before!

[LastWhiteSoxFanStanding]

Hey Jason,

Congratulations!

We did it :-)

[ISiddiqui]

Is it just me, or did nobody really care about this years's WS?

Honestly. I say this as slightly-more-than-average baseball fan, usually go to a half-dozen games a season, watch about a game a week on television; keep up with scores, stories, am able to have a relatively intelligent discussion at any point during the season as to what's going on.

And it just seems to me that nobody was talking about the World Series this year. I mean, the White Sox haven't won it since the Black Sox, the Astros were in for the first time... dunno, just didn't mark much of a mark.
I think you're right. Wasn't this like the lowest rated World Series EVER? I guess people don't care so much about the White Sox (2nd team in their own city... and not like the Mets are the 2nd team in NY) or the Astros. I watched every game, but I know a bunch of baseball fans that didn't give a damn one way or the other.

[Ksyrup]

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y140/aquariumdrunk/soxwrigley1.jpg
.

[MizzouRah]

After how they played in both those series, sadly, we deserve those cheap shots. :(


On the bright side, we can now adopt that famous Dodger saying, "Wait til next year"! ;)
HAHAHAHAHHA!!!! Dodgers suck dude!@

[JonInMiddleGA]

... but I know a bunch of baseball fans that didn't give a damn one way or the other.

Like, oh, say 90%+ of those outside of Chicago & Houston?

I'm in the same camp as Ksyrup pretty much -- I checked the scores, kept track of the WS, was curious who won & what happened but I didn't really care what happened, if that makes sense.

[miami_fan]

I think a great number of people who claim to be a fan of baseball are in it more so to hate the Yankees than to be a fan of their own team. You would be suprised at how many fans talked non stop about the fact that the Yankees (and to a slightly lesser extent, the Red Sox) were out of the playoffs. However, when given the opportunity to discuss the rest of the playoffs or even to discuss the moves their own teams needed to make in order to improve for next season, these "fans" barely had a passing interest.

[ISiddiqui]

Like, oh, say 90%+ of those outside of Chicago & Houston?

I'm in the same camp as Ksyrup pretty much -- I checked the scores, kept track of the WS, was curious who won & what happened but I didn't really care what happened, if that makes sense.Yeah, and I just don't get it. I mean is miami_fan correct, most baseball fans aren't really fans of the game, but fans of their own team and fans of beating the Yankees? If so, I find that not only sad, but very alarming for the the future of baseball.

And I don't think you have to care about which team won, but caring about the great games in this World Series, even though it was a sweep? Baseball fans should care about that!

[JonInMiddleGA]

Yeah, and I just don't get it. I mean is miami_fan correct, most baseball fans aren't really fans of the game, but fans of their own team and fans of beating the Yankees? If so, I find that not only sad, but very alarming for the the future of baseball.

And I don't think you have to care about which team won, but caring about the great games in this World Series, even though it was a sweep? Baseball fans should care about that!

{shrug}

I've been a baseball fan pretty much my whole life, and much of that was in the "fanatic" sense of the word, but "Hmm" as in "well, how 'bout that" says pretty much what I have to say about this WS.

I started thinking about what thoughts went through my mind during the WS, what I thought was interesting even briefly, here's what I come up with (random order):
Nice that the Astros finally made it I guess; good for B&B + Rocket; Will Lidge ever be the same again, certainly not much mystique left; good pitching still beats good hitting ... unless it ATL pitching in the WS; damn these games start too late & end even much too later; which trade sent Dye out of Atlanta; wonder if LA wishes they'd held on to Konerko now; checking game log on Yahoo is a lot easier than trying to put up with broadcasts, commercials, etc.;

And that's about it.

I watched at least pieces of 100 or so games this season, some Braves some not. I listened to all or part of another, I dunno, 50 games on mlb.com. I checked box scores every day from April to October while taking part in the closest fantasy league action I've ever been a part of (4 teams separated by 2 points when the dust settled).

By the time we get to late October, and its a couple of teams that I'm essentially totally neutral about ... {shrug} ... WS just wasn't that interesting to me.

[Ksyrup]

Yeah, and I just don't get it. I mean is miami_fan correct, most baseball fans aren't really fans of the game, but fans of their own team and fans of beating the Yankees? If so, I find that not only sad, but very alarming for the the future of baseball.

And I don't think you have to care about which team won, but caring about the great games in this World Series, even though it was a sweep? Baseball fans should care about that!
As I steam roll toward my mid-30s, I'm finding myself more a fan of games (not just baseball, but football and hockey as well) moreso than a fan of certain teams. I still have my long-standing rooting interests (Phillies/Tigers, Broncos/Lions, and Red Wings), but I don't live and die by those teams' fortunes the way I used to. I have the DirecTV packages for all 3 of those sports, and rarely find myself watching only the games of those teams. I'm pretty much flipping around looking for the best game or pitching matchup on a nightly basis. I will admit to hating the Yankees and rooting for them to lose, what ever the situation will be. But it's not why I enjoy baseball.

As far as this particular WS, they may have been great games, but I fell asleep before the end of 3 of the 4 games. The only reason I even saw the last out of Game 4 was because my 6 year old just happened to have had a bad dream and woke me up 5 seconds before the last pitch. I woke up, saw the pitch and Uribe's play, figured out that the game was over, and took my daughter back to bed. I'm not a teen who's in bef by 8:30 to go to school, but even I can't stay up past midnight every night to watch sports. So much for getting to actually see the exciting games of this WS.

[JasonC23]

Hey Jason,

Congratulations!

We did it :-)
I rewatched the end of Game 4 last night, as well as about 2 hours of the postgame coverage. It is actually starting to feel more real than surreal. But I still get goosebumps when I hear someone say, "The World Chamption Chicago White Sox." Awesome. :) :) :)

Actually, someone somewhere on the Internet (I've been reading a lot of Sox coverage) made a good point--how cool will it be next year when Gene Honda says, "And now, the starting lineup for your World Champion Chicago White Sox"?? :D

Are you going to the parade today?

[ISiddiqui]

As far as this particular WS, they may have been great games, but I fell asleep before the end of 3 of the 4 games. The only reason I even saw the last out of Game 4 was because my 6 year old just happened to have had a bad dream and woke me up 5 seconds before the last pitch. I woke up, saw the pitch and Uribe's play, figured out that the game was over, and took my daughter back to bed. I'm not a teen who's in bef by 8:30 to go to school, but even I can't stay up past midnight every night to watch sports. So much for getting to actually see the exciting games of this WS.
That's a valid complaint. The games DID go on waaay into the night. I couldn't see the longest game (which I REALLY tried to see... but at 1:00... bed time). And a lot of the game went to, if not over midnight.

That is something baseball has to address. Games need earlier start times. I realize primetime is big ratings material and the West Coast has the game start at 6, if I have it start at 9, but at least one game should be a late afternoon/early evening game for East Coast guys. Maybe start it at 4 (1 in the Pacific time zone) or something.

[sterlingice]

It's not only that- the World Series games are really effing long. The breaks are longer (and even then Fox would sometimes not get back from them in time), yes. But I just don't see that adding up the the extra 30 minutes to an hour that these games are taking.

But the players are much slower and much more deliberate. For instance, during the regular season for the Royals, there's one player who takes 15 seconds between each pitch to adjust everything and get back into the box and he's making $11M per year and has a C on his shirt. Teams playing them are similar- there might be a player or two, but, for the most part, the game moves along at a decent pace. In the playoffs, it seems every player from Lance Berkman down to Scrubby McScrub takes 15-30 seconds per pitch while the pitchers do the same and it just slows the game down to a grinding halt. Unfortunately, I don't have an answer to that.

SI

[Professor58]

Are you going to the parade today?

Only a Block Away ! Very cool.