Alright boyz, it's the BBCF First Impressions thread.

[Arles]

i hate that too.

there should be an unactive box we can placed injured players there, so they dont get into the game at all.
Just remove them from the depth chart.

[Arles]

I have caught the AI putting players who were yellow (often) or RED(once or twice) in the game late when it was a blowout. I had the CPU set to put in subs but geez not my star SLB who wa sout for a few weeks. H e got hurt was Red I took him off the depth chart and when I played out the game I see a message he was reinjuried. i ddin't know he was in the game. I guess the AI decide sine the score was 27-6 that it was ablowout and subbed him in. So, he was injuried for the rest of the season 7 games including the bowl game which we lost.
That seems odd given that the game only looks at your depth chart (not your roster) when subbing. Still, I will certainly look at this for update 1.1. For now, removing a player from the depth chart should be a pretty safe way to avoid this.

[Arles]

Strange to me that the suggestions for offensive and defensive strategies change with more than one click of the suggest button--kind of like a pitcher shaking off a sign, I guess.
There's a certain degree of variance for this. But, I can see how this would annoy people. I will work at removing this for the next update.

[Eaglesfan27]

Arlie, I think he did remove the player from the depth chart and the player was still brought in. I've seen this happen once as well. I think it was because my defensive line was SO decimated that I didn't have much depth at the position and my two guys who were in the slot at DT on the depth chart were both hurt during the game. I guess I could have avoided it, by putting more guys in the slot (I was already playing guys out of position at the DT slot) but I would hope the game could somehow look at picking players to play out of position rather than playing guys who are definitely out for the game.


Edit to clarify:

My DT's were so beat up that I put 2 linebackers at the DT slot (since my DE's were beat up as well) and both linebackers were injured during the game. The game then proceeded to put my DT with a broken ankle into the game (despite him being out for 6-8 weeks.)

My DT was not anywhere on my depth chart when he was subbed into the game.

[Arles]

I see how Arlie is explaining it now, but you're right -- that is very confusing. He's saying essential the timeout is applied to the play correctly, but it doesn't show up as called until after the next play is run. I wouldn't have gathered that either.
No, the timeout occurs at the end of the play you called before calling the timeout. Essentially, you could run an inside running play with playcalling enabled. Once it ends, go eat a sandwich, read a good book and come back and click timeout. That timeout will prevent any time from coming off AFTER the last play you ran and before the start of the next play.

[Arles]

Arlie, I think he did remove the player from the depth chart and the player was still brought in. I've seen this happen once as well. I think it was because my defensive line was SO decimated that I didn't have much depth at the position and my two guys who were in the slot at DT on the depth chart were both hurt during the game. I guess I could have avoided it, by putting more guys in the slot (I was already playing guys out of position at the DT slot) but I would hope the game could somehow look at picking players to play out of position rather than playing guys who are definitely out for the game.
I certainly agree and will fix that in the next update. My comment was for a vast majority of cases, removing the player from the depth chart should resolve the situation.

[kcchief19]

No, the timeout occurs at the end of the play you called before calling the timeout. Essentially, you could run an inside running play with playcalling enabled. Once it ends, go eat a sandwich, read a good book and come back and click timeout. That timeout will prevent any time from coming off AFTER the last play you ran and before the start of the next play.Ok ... that's what my understanding was, but now I'm confused again. Where does the timeout occur in the PBP?

I was inferring that this is what happens:

You run play > PBP displays results of play
You call time out
Clock stops
You call next play > PBP displays results of play
PBP displays that timeout occurred before the play

If that is not what is happen, then I think there are serious issued with AI timeout usage. Timeouts -- at least AI timeouts -- appear to be taken correctly, but they seem to appear following the next play. Is that correct?

[Arles]

Ok ... that's what my understanding was, but now I'm confused again. Where does the timeout occur in the PBP?

I was inferring that this is what happens:

You run play > PBP displays results of play
You call time out
Clock stops
You call next play > PBP displays results of play
PBP displays that timeout occurred before the play

If that is not what is happen, then I think there are serious issued with AI timeout usage. Timeouts -- at least AI timeouts -- appear to be taken correctly, but they seem to appear following the next play. Is that correct?
I'll have to look at that. The timeout should always match the clock stop but I will make sure it's displayed before the next play. It could be a display issue for the AI.

[Bonegavel]

Would be nice to be able to multi-select guys on the watch list and remove them from it. When a bunch of players commit to other teams in a week, I have to go into each player and remove them one-at-a-time.

[Flasch186]

Would be nice to be able to multi-select guys on the watch list and remove them from it. When a bunch of players commit to other teams in a week, I have to go into each player and remove them one-at-a-time.

yup

[dubb93]

I see that you added the ability to add your alma mater ala FBCB, anyway you can add a way to set your age? It kinda kills the realism to try and take over a small school and work my way up the ladder only to see that I'm in my mid 50's and already have 22 years of coaching experience somehow. At this pace I'll be in my 90s by the time I take over my alma mater.

[Arles]

OK, I think we found the issue with the stability issues for recruiting. if you have more than 100 people on your watch list, you will get an RTE. I will have it fixed for 1.1, but for now try to stay below that number.

[dubb93]

12 penaltys for 195 yards for my team last game...sigh

and I don't even know how that works out, 12 x 15 = 180

[WSUCougar]

*sigh*

I've had to abandon my current career (coaching New Mexico) due to overwhelming injuries. This is with the most recent, updated version of the game.

Top two QBs (questionable and doubtful)
Top three RBs (out, doubtful, questionable)
Starting FB (doubtful)
Reserve WR (out)
Reserve TE (out)
Starting center (out)
Reserve guard (out)
Starting DE (questionable)
Starting DT (out)
Starting ILB (out)
Two top safeties (both out)

And we had no depth to begin with.

No fun...:(

[Sweed]

12 penaltys for 195 yards for my team last game...sigh

and I don't even know how that works out, 12 x 15 = 180

Pass interference?

[KWhit]

*sigh*

I've had to abandon my current career (coaching New Mexico) due to overwhelming injuries. This is with the most recent, updated version of the game.

Top two QBs (questionable and doubtful)
Top three RBs (out, doubtful, questionable)
Starting FB (doubtful)
Reserve WR (out)
Reserve TE (out)
Starting center (out)
Reserve guard (out)
Starting DE (questionable)
Starting DT (out)
Starting ILB (out)
Two top safeties (both out)

And we had no depth to begin with.

No fun...:(I had a similar situation in the first year of my first career (the only year I've played so far). My top 2 QBs were lost for the season along with my top RB, DT, and somebody from my secondary (can't remember who and I don't have the game in front of me right now). The QB situation was extremely tough cause I had to play my #3 guy all year who was horrible. I either got very unlucky in my first season or injuries could use more tweaking.

[Celeval]

College PI isn't a spot foul.

[Bee]

*sigh*

I've had to abandon my current career (coaching New Mexico) due to overwhelming injuries. This is with the most recent, updated version of the game.

Top two QBs (questionable and doubtful)
Top three RBs (out, doubtful, questionable)
Starting FB (doubtful)
Reserve WR (out)
Reserve TE (out)
Starting center (out)
Reserve guard (out)
Starting DE (questionable)
Starting DT (out)
Starting ILB (out)
Two top safeties (both out)

And we had no depth to begin with.

No fun...:(

Same here. Downloaded the patch and played through most of a season. Had 15 injuries when I quit (most of the players were out similar to what Cougar reported above).

I also noticed a lot of the plays still didn't make sense. My first two plays with the patch characterized it for me... a very slow DT makes a tackle 19 yds down field on an outside run. Second play, the SS makes a tackle for -1 on an inside run while playing a deep zone. :( After the first game, I once again abandoned the pbp approach. After the 15 injuries, I shelved the game again.

I'll probably give the game another try when the update comes out.

[WSUCougar]

I had a similar situation in the first year of my first career (the only year I've played so far). My top 2 QBs were lost for the season along with my top RB, DT, and somebody from my secondary (can't remember who and I don't have the game in front of me right now). The QB situation was extremely tough cause I had to play my #3 guy all year who was horrible. I either got very unlucky in my first season or injuries could use more tweaking.
I think injuries definitely need more tweaking. This was with maxed budget for both injury settings and play-time set to lower levels. Also distressing, many of these injuries occurred early in games, so they were not related to endurance.

On another note, it appears that all penalties on kickoff and punt returns are being assessed from the end of the return. (i.e., kickoff return to the 33, holding against the return team, offense's ball on the 23). I don't know if this has been addressed before, but it seems quite artificial and does not have the impact that such penalties due in real life, as I believe these are spot fouls. I could be wrong but I feel it's worth checking.

Another minor note: I'm still having depth chart issues with the positional listings at the bottom of the screen. If I click the bar on the right side to scroll down it tends to screw things up such that I need to exit the screen and go back in (players vanish, etc.). I also have seen some improper numbering on the list as well (i.e., WR who's number is #80 listed as #77).

Preference-wise, if manual lineups are enabled during play-by-play, I'd like to see the endurance % more prominently displayed.

[WSUCougar]

Dola:

I should add that I think this game has loads of potential, and I'm only mentioning the flaws for Arlie's attention. :)

[Bee]

Dola:

I should add that I think this game has loads of potential, and I'm only mentioning the flaws for Arlie's attention. :)

I agree about the potential of the game. There are a lot of things the game does very well.

[KWhit]

I think injuries definitely need more tweaking. This was with maxed budget for both injury settings and play-time set to lower levels. Also distressing, many of these injuries occurred early in games, so they were not related to endurance.
Good point. I too had max budget for the medical settings and used the AI recommended playing time %, so I don't think there was anything else I could do to prevent these injuries from happening.

[Galaril]

I lost three quarterbacks in the first half of a game all out 7-9 weeks. I had my other two qb's already out for the season. So, took my last qb off redshirt and he got hurt next game along with two running backs two DE and a safety my whole secondary starters are out. This is with max medical and strength. I stopped the season (first) and put this on the shelf until the 1.1 update.

[Arles]

I think injuries definitely need more tweaking. This was with maxed budget for both injury settings and play-time set to lower levels. Also distressing, many of these injuries occurred early in games, so they were not related to endurance.
Endurance isn't a big factor for injuries - it's more durability. Endurance comes in on injuries for RBs if you give them a ton of carries, but most injury issues are related to durability.

On another note, it appears that all penalties on kickoff and punt returns are being assessed from the end of the return. (i.e., kickoff return to the 33, holding against the return team, offense's ball on the 23). I don't know if this has been addressed before, but it seems quite artificial and does not have the impact that such penalties due in real life, as I believe these are spot fouls. I could be wrong but I feel it's worth checking.
I'll check that out.

Another minor note: I'm still having depth chart issues with the positional listings at the bottom of the screen. If I click the bar on the right side to scroll down it tends to screw things up such that I need to exit the screen and go back in (players vanish, etc.). I also have seen some improper numbering on the list as well (i.e., WR who's number is #80 listed as #77).
Yeah, I'm looking at this as well.

[Arles]

As to injuries, we are going to be putting out the injury settings in update 1.1. It will have a "High", "average" and "low" setting. I'm thinking the current setting will be "High" based on the feedback I have been getting - with "average" and "low" each having relatively fewer injuries.

[Tim Tellean]

Losing a few players to injuries is painful but should be expected, look at the Packers they lost 4 RB and 3 WR.

[Bee]

It's been more than 15 years since I played in college, but I can't remember having more than a handful of guys miss games because of injuries. A lot played with minor injuries, but you had to be pretty seriously hurt to miss a game.

[John Galt]

It's strange. I've had all sorts of problems with the game, but notsomuch in the injury department. I don't think I've have had a QB miss a start. Even with bad teams and low medical budgets, I've had more problems at positions like FB than anything else.

[A-Husker-4-Life]

*sigh*

I've had to abandon my current career (coaching New Mexico) due to overwhelming injuries. This is with the most recent, updated version of the game.

Top two QBs (questionable and doubtful)
Top three RBs (out, doubtful, questionable)
Starting FB (doubtful)
Reserve WR (out)
Reserve TE (out)
Starting center (out)
Reserve guard (out)
Starting DE (questionable)
Starting DT (out)
Starting ILB (out)
Two top safeties (both out)

And we had no depth to begin with.

No fun...:(


What do you have your players starting time%...????? Don't use 100% or you will feel the injury pain..

I set mine on about 67% for everybody but the Starting QB and runner they get an 80 or 85%. Also, I up the starting time of the special positions (3rd down runner, pass rushing DE, etc....) to 85%.

With these settings, I only have about 1 or 2 guys with serious injuries and a handful of players with minor injuries. Also, make sure to take your Doubtful & questionable players off the depth or move them far down the list...

Last, make sure to spend $100k on medical budget and 100K on Str & Cond, this should help prevent and rehabilitate injuries...

Try them out, they should help... BTW, you really need to watch injuries on this game, it's not like TCY...

[GreenMonster]

I hardly have any player playing 100%. If they are hurt, I move them down the depth chart to the bottom or I just right click them right of the chart. I really haven't had that bad injuries problems, although a few times I took a risk with a guy and they got hurt worse.

[WSUCougar]

What do you have your players starting time%...????? Don't use 100% or you will feel the injury pain..

I set mine on about 67% for everybody but the Starting QB and runner they get an 80 or 85%. Also, I up the starting time of the special positions (3rd down runner, pass rushing DE, etc....) to 85%.

With these settings, I only have about 1 or 2 guys with serious injuries and a handful of players with minor injuries. Also, make sure to take your Doubtful & questionable players off the depth or move them far down the list...

Last, make sure to spend $100k on medical budget and 100K on Str & Cond, this should help prevent and rehabilitate injuries...

Try them out, they should help... BTW, you really need to watch injuries on this game, it's not like TCY...
Thanks for the insights, but unfortunately I already had all of those in effect.

Incidentally, I played my original starting QB - who was probable at the time with a foot injury - only because my second stringer went down. He then went down again, aggravating the injury.

Arlie, I think there needs to be a clearer delineation between injuries that are "playable" with merely reduced effectiveness, and those with the ample threat of aggravating them and making them worse. That's a trap I've fallen into, and I think if it were more clear that I was rolling the dice with an injury (despite the player being "probable" or whaetver) I wouldn't even have him on the depth chart. This is tied to the Injury Report e-mail, of course.

[HoosFan]

Has anyone seen any real standout defensive teams from a yards allowed perspective (scoring defense isn't in the game... yet?)

VT leads the NCAA with something like 240 yds allowed per game. The best I've seen in BBCF is 300 ypg. I'm not complaining, just wondering if anyone has seen any truly defensive minded teams (their own or cpu controlled)

[A-Husker-4-Life]

Has anyone seen any real standout defensive teams from a yards allowed perspective (scoring defense isn't in the game... yet?)

VT leads the NCAA with something like 240 yds allowed per game. The best I've seen in BBCF is 300 ypg. I'm not complaining, just wondering if anyone has seen any truly defensive minded teams (their own or cpu controlled)

I can't seem to it a grip on the Defense, like I've had with the offense. I've spent alot of time adjusting my own gameplan but now I just try and employ the best d.Cordinator, then I hit suggest. This method seems to work OK but it make me feel less connected to the D then the O.

[Eaglesfan27]

Has anyone seen any real standout defensive teams from a yards allowed perspective (scoring defense isn't in the game... yet?)

VT leads the NCAA with something like 240 yds allowed per game. The best I've seen in BBCF is 300 ypg. I'm not complaining, just wondering if anyone has seen any truly defensive minded teams (their own or cpu controlled)
Before my defensive line all went down to injuries, I was holding teams to about 250 yards per game with my USC team running a 5-2 with a very good secondary.

[johnnyshaka]

Has anyone seen any real standout defensive teams from a yards allowed perspective (scoring defense isn't in the game... yet?)

VT leads the NCAA with something like 240 yds allowed per game. The best I've seen in BBCF is 300 ypg. I'm not complaining, just wondering if anyone has seen any truly defensive minded teams (their own or cpu controlled)

Are team stats of prior seasons available anywhere??

[Galaril]

My Air Force teams have had pretty good defense usually only giving up around 300 yards a game. But they have really held the points. I love this game though I had a team come down to my 4 yrad line with 1st and goal down by 4 points and only a 2 minutes left. They got two yards on a screen play, a one yard counter run and I stuffed them at the goal on 3rd down so 4th and goal. aND IT IS A BROKEN PLAY THE QB of the other team BYU runs around and is in trouble he desperately throws to the endzone .........................interception. I was yelling at the computer monitor.Now , my Korea Mother-in-law , who is visiting for the holidays from Korea thinks I am menatlly ill.:) Great game a lot of fun.

[TazFTW]

Has anyone seen any real standout defensive teams from a yards allowed perspective (scoring defense isn't in the game... yet?)

VT leads the NCAA with something like 240 yds allowed per game. The best I've seen in BBCF is 300 ypg. I'm not complaining, just wondering if anyone has seen any truly defensive minded teams (their own or cpu controlled)
I have not had a sub-300 yard defense in my three seasons of playing.

http://img284.imageshack.us/img284/3364/defrank4pk.th.jpg (http://img284.imageshack.us/my.php?image=defrank4pk.jpg)

[Icy]

I'm doing some reseach for Arlie and have found some interesting info that i would like to share here for you stat freaks :)


....................................................................................................

NATA Injury Surveillance Study (National Athletic Trainers Association)
Football Injury Severity Lessening, Study Shows

For Immediate Release
Contact: Teresa Foster Welch (d)214.637.6282

DALLAS - Approximately 39 percent of varsity high school football players were injured during the 1995 season, but the severity of those injuries may be lessening, according to the first phase of a study by the National Athletic Trainers' Association (NATA).

The three-year study researched injuries recorded by certified athletic trainers for 123 high school football teams. The study - the first of its kind since 1988 - is designed to show trends on what, when, how and where injuries occur to high school football players. It is conducted by John Powell, PhD, ATC.

"While results for the 1995 football season are similar to those we found during the earlier study, there were some very encouraging findings that we will be watching more closely over the next two years to determine whether they are, in fact, trends," Powell said.

Powell said the number of moderate and major injuries appears to have decreased, while minor injuries have increased. "There is no noteworthy change in the number of overall injuries; however, in games during 1995, players suffered approximately 8.5 percent more minor injuries; about 5.7 percent fewer moderate injuries; and 3 percent fewer major injuries than the three-year average of our previous study," he said.

A second encouraging area for certified athletic trainers is the lower portion of re-injuries compared to first-time injuries.

"Nearly 93 percent of football injuries in the study are characterized as `new injuries'," Powell said. "It is impossible to prevent all injuries in sports, although good medical care and preventive techniques can help to reduce the risk of injury.

"In the case of re-injury, early intervention and appropriate rehabilitation by a comprehensive sports medicine team can have an even greater impact, resulting in fewer re-injuries."

The hip/thigh/leg continues to be the area of the body most frequently injured (17.3%), followed by the forearm/wrist/hand (15%), knee (14.5%), and ankle/foot (14.2%). General trauma is the most common type of injury (29.3%), with sprains following (27.4%) and then strains (21.7%).

In games, the offensive lineup receives the largest number of injuries, with 55.5%, while the defensive team sustains 35.8% of the injuries, and special teams receive 4.3%.

The majority of injuries occur during practice, with only about 39% happening in games. Powell attributes the statistic to the fact that practices occur much more frequently than games.

NATA President Kent Falb, ATC, PT, head athletic trainer for the Detroit Lions, said the study will help reduce the risk of injury for football players.

"We believe the information from this study will provide direction for researchers who are seeking ways to further minimize the risk of injury in high school athletics, as well as for those working to develop enhanced treatment and rehabilitation for injuries that do occur."

The NATA, based in Dallas, provides the latest research and techniques to its 17,000+ certified members, who are experts in providing quality healthcare for the physically active.

The NATA was founded in 1950 and today serves more than 23,000 athletic trainers worldwide.



1995 High School Football Injury Results

What are the most common injuries in high school football?

<TABLE><TBODY><TR><TD>General Trauma</TD><TD> </TD><TD>29.3%</TD></TR><TR><TD>Strains</TD><TD></TD><TD>21.7</TD></TR><TR><TD>Sprains</TD><TD></TD><TD>27.4</TD></TR><TR><TD>Musculo-Skeletal</TD><TD></TD><TD>1.5</TD></TR><TR><TD>Neurotrauma</TD><TD></TD><TD>8.1</TD></TR><TR><TD>Fractures</TD><TD></TD><TD>5.7</TD></TR><TR><TD>General Illness</TD><TD></TD><TD>4.7</TD></TR><TR><TD>Thermotrauma</TD><TD></TD><TD>1.6</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Where do high school football injuries occur?

<TABLE><TBODY><TR><TD>Forearm/Wrist/Hand</TD><TD> </TD><TD>15.0%</TD></TR><TR><TD>Shoulder/Arm</TD><TD></TD><TD>10.4</TD></TR><TR><TD>Hip/Thigh/Leg</TD><TD></TD><TD>17.3</TD></TR><TR><TD>Face/Scalp</TD><TD></TD><TD>2.9</TD></TR><TR><TD>Ankle/Foot</TD><TD></TD><TD>14.2</TD></TR><TR><TD>Knee</TD><TD></TD><TD>14.5</TD></TR><TR><TD>Head/Neck/Spine</TD><TD></TD><TD>11.3</TD></TR><TR><TD>Torso</TD><TD></TD><TD>8.8</TD></TR><TR><TD>Other</TD><TD></TD><TD>5.6</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

What are the percentages of major, moderate and minor injuries?

<TABLE><TBODY><TR><TD>Major</TD><TD> </TD><TD>8.4%</TD></TR><TR><TD>Moderate</TD><TD></TD><TD>11.0</TD></TR><TR><TD>Minor</TD><TD></TD><TD>80.6</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Are injuries more likely to occur during practices or games?

<TABLE><TBODY><TR><TD>Practices</TD><TD> </TD><TD>61.2%</TD></TR><TR><TD>Games</TD><TD></TD><TD>38.8</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

National High School Sports Injury Registry
1995 Football Exposure Summary Table

1986-1988, 1995 NATA Football Injury Surveillance Results

<TABLE><TBODY><TR><TD></TD><TD align=middle> 1986</TD><TD align=middle> 1987</TD><TD align=middle> 1988</TD><TD align=middle> 3-Year</TD><TD align=middle> 1995</TD></TR><TR><TD>Schools</TD><TD align=right>105</TD><TD align=right>134</TD><TD align=right>112</TD><TD align=right>117</TD><TD align=right>123</TD></TR><TR><TD>Games</TD><TD align=right>1,513</TD><TD align=right>2,007</TD><TD align=right>1,740</TD><TD align=right>1,753</TD><TD align=right>1,540</TD></TR><TR><TD>A-E</TD><TD align=right>55,921</TD><TD align=right>71,264</TD><TD align=right>56,048</TD><TD align=right>61,078</TD><TD align=right>52,700</TD></TR><TR><TD>Practices</TD><TD align=right>8,120</TD><TD align=right>10,426</TD><TD align=right>8,742</TD><TD align=right>9,096</TD><TD align=right>7,857</TD></TR><TR><TD>A-E</TD><TD align=right>369,345</TD><TD align=right>476,393</TD><TD align=right>361,804</TD><TD align=right>402,514</TD><TD align=right>327,622</TD></TR><TR><TD>Total Sess.</TD><TD align=right>9,633</TD><TD align=right>12,433</TD><TD align=right>10,482</TD><TD align=right>10,849</TD><TD align=right>9,397</TD></TR><TR><TD>Total A-E</TD><TD align=right> 425,266</TD><TD align=right> 547,657</TD><TD align=right> 417,852</TD><TD align=right> 463,592</TD><TD align=right> 380,322</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

....................................................................................................

[Icy]

This is a resume about my own observations from the game, the above studio and the boards comments, i just wrote this to Arlie.

']
In my opinion, the number of injuries is more or less ok, if in injuries we include every time a player is on pain and can't play for a few minutes, days or weeks. It happens a lot in football and in every sport.

The main problems i see are:

- The spread of the injuries: In 1.02 lots of QB's get injured, even 3 in the same game for one team. I also suffered the injury of my top 4 WR in one game. That is really rare in football, a QB can be injured after a big hit but they are usually protected by the line and also they don't expose themselves a lot. Linemen should be injured more than QB's for example, but i don't have the real injuries spreads stats between different player’s positions in football, maybe that is available somewhere and we can take a look at it. (I have found that info now, look above post)

- The players re-injured: In 1.02, if you play an injured player, you can know for sure that he will suffer a worst injury in the game. In real life, some injuries could aggravate with more play time, especially injuries in the knees, etc. But both in pro, and probably more in college football, almost all the players end the season in pain with minor injuries. If a player is probable with a bruise for example, the risk to be re-injured badly should be really low, of course if he is questionable with a sprained knee the risk should be higher, but right now you can't play probable players even when the suggest button puts them in the deep chart.

I think that two issues are the ones causing most of the complains about the amount of injuries, and not the amount itself.
What do you guys think?

[Eaglesfan27]

I would add that the severity of injuries should be reduced some. As you mentioned in that study, over 80% of injuries are minor. Just looking at my one career right now, over 40% of my injuries are serious (I have 8 guys out for 6-8 weeks or longer.) I think the overall number of injuries are fine, but they need to be less severe, and as you mentioned not all probable players should be reinjured upon playing.

[Havok]

I would add that the severity of injuries should be reduced some. As you mentioned in that study, over 80% of injuries are minor. Just looking at my one career right now, over 40% of my injuries are serious (I have 8 guys out for 6-8 weeks or longer.) I think the overall number of injuries are fine, but they need to be less severe, and as you mentioned not all probable players should be reinjured upon playing.


what he said

[Galaril]

Great research Icy and I also, agree the number is not the problem maybe alittle lower but the biggest problem is an injury any injury a guy is out period and needs to stay out of games until 100% healthy. That is not realistic and not fun to play with as a game feature.

[kingfc22]

...the biggest problem is an injury any injury a guy is out period and needs to stay out of game suntil 100% healthy. That is not realistic and not fun to play with as a game feature.

I agree with this 100%!

[BYU 14]

Great research Icy and I also, agree the number is not the problem maybe alittle lower but the biggest problem is an injury any injury a guy is out period and needs to stay out of games until 100% healthy. That is not realistic and not fun to play with as a game feature.

This does need to be looked at...There should be some chance of aggravating an injury, but when a player is probable it should be very minimal. Lots of Players play through minor injuries including sprains, contusions, some types of fractures and minor joint injuries....

[Bonegavel]

Most injuries that occur in RL are of the type where they hobble off to the bench, get taped up or whatever, and are back in by the next QTR.

You'd be amazed at what those trainers can do with tape!

When I played in college, just about every starter played with "injuries" but they still played. The end result was usually a VERY busy training room after practices. Ice packs galore. Ankles and knees submerged in ice/hot tubs. You learn quickly the rules of ice.

Lots of fingers are broken or strained and they just get taped up. You don't tackle as well with injured fingers, but you still play.

Most times you have to have a Willie McGahee injury to not suit up for a game.

The result was that most players had season long nagging injuries that healed in plenty of time to be re-aggravated come spring football.

The usual rule is that an injured player is most likely to be more "careful" during a game and will most likely avoid further injury with a slight drop off in performance.

College ball isn't a nancy-boy game. That is the role of high school programs: weed out the guys that are always using crutches come Monday.

[Eaglesfan27]

Just got another RTE 91. In this game, I was blowing out my opponent and I shrunk down the window. I don't think I did that in the other game where I got a RTE 91, but I can't be sure. I wonder if minimizing the game has anything to do with the RTE's?

In any case, I've been saving every week (after the last incident) and I can send you the save file if you want, Arlie.

[Arles]

That would be great. In the meantime, I will try doing that as well.

[SFL Cat]

Wow...great research Icy.

[TazFTW]

Now THIS is running up the score. :eek:

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/5893/blowout2ef.jpg


Oregon's starting QB played the entire game. He went 35 for 37 for 378 yards and 6 TDs. He also ran the ball 8 times for 55 yards and 2 TDs.

[MJ4H]

good heavens

[WSUCougar]

Oregon's starting QB played the entire game. He went 35 for 37 for 378 yards and 6 TDs. He also ran the ball 8 times for 55 yards and 2 TDs.
Yeah, but just think: if/when the Lions draft him, he'll really suck balls.

[I. J. Reilly]

But if he goes at #3 overall to Cincy he'll be just fine.

[bigdawg2003]

I have a question about recruiting (sorry if it's been asked before);

If a player commits to your school and you used a recruiting pitch, if your school doesn't live up to what you pitched will that make the player more likely to transfer. Example, if you pitch playing time then the guy rots on the bench for two years, or you pitch a chance to win but don't even make a bowl game.

[digamma]

One other minor complaint...

Two point logic may also be a bit off.

I scored to go up by 11 in the fourth quarter. We went for two instead of kicking the field goal to go up by 12. The two point conversion was no good, so I was left with an 11 point lead and the possibility that a touch down and field goal could still tie.
I saw this again. This time my opponent did score and go for two to make it a field goal game.

[digamma]

*sigh*

I've had to abandon my current career (coaching New Mexico) due to overwhelming injuries. This is with the most recent, updated version of the game.

Top two QBs (questionable and doubtful)
Top three RBs (out, doubtful, questionable)
Starting FB (doubtful)
Reserve WR (out)
Reserve TE (out)
Starting center (out)
Reserve guard (out)
Starting DE (questionable)
Starting DT (out)
Starting ILB (out)
Two top safeties (both out)

And we had no depth to begin with.

No fun...:(
I'm getting close to this point as well.

Starting QB injured (Questionable, but hurt within 5-10 plays if I play him)
Three top RB's are injured to some degree.
3 WR's injured.
Top TE out.
3 OT's injured
1 OG out.
Center just back from injury.
2 DE's out.
2 DT's questionable or worse.
1 FS injured.

Frustrating.

[TazFTW]

Is there any benefit from running a coordinator's preferred system? I've seen AI teams run the option or smash mouth and their OC prefers west coast, run n gun, or vertical passing. AI teams also change their philosophies yearly, which I don't think is realistic.

Why do I need to hire a new coaching staff every year? At the end of every season, I get an email each from my OC, DC, and ST coach saying they feel they're not being paid enough and have decided to opt out of their contract. There'll need to be contract lengths for coaches and if they want to opt out, the school should get some money back in return.

I think 5 star recruits should wait longer to make their decision. From what I have seen, all 5 star recruits have committed by the halfway point of the recruiting period.

[Galaril]

This game is in bad need of this update very soon people seem to be losing that fun factor. For me it still is fun but if I keep losing 4 qbs in game.

[Easy Mac]

Is there any benefit from running a coordinator's preferred system? I've seen AI teams run the option or smash mouth and their OC prefers west coast, run n gun, or vertical passing. AI teams also change their philosophies yearly, which I don't think is realistic.

Why do I need to hire a new coaching staff every year? At the end of every season, I get an email each from my OC, DC, and ST coach saying they feel they're not being paid enough and have decided to opt out of their contract. There'll need to be contract lengths for coaches and if they want to opt out, the school should get some money back in return.
Well, from my limited experience, I tried to run an offense my OC was not made for (he was smash mouth, I was spread) and i went 2-9 even though he was one of the better coordinators in the game. The next year my budget was slashed almost to the bone, and the bare bones OC I picked up who shared the philosophy I wanted and I finished 7-4. I think it does matter, but I'm not sure how much

[MizzouRah]

This game is in bad need of this update very soon people seem to be losing that fun factor. For me it still is fun but if I keep losing 4 qbs in game.
Mine's on hold until a new patch, but my enthusiasm is definitly there. I have one day of work left this week and then I'm off until 01/04!! I might even start a new dynasty thread in hopes I can actually keep it going for more than a week. :D

[ThunderingHERD]

Why does the PBP seem so intent on frustrating you? Do "perfect passes" ever get caught? etc, etc. Seems like there's about 10 could have been 6s for every 6.

[jbmagic]

Is there any benefit from running a coordinator's preferred system? I've seen AI teams run the option or smash mouth and their OC prefers west coast, run n gun, or vertical passing. AI teams also change their philosophies yearly, which I don't think is realistic.

Why do I need to hire a new coaching staff every year? At the end of every season, I get an email each from my OC, DC, and ST coach saying they feel they're not being paid enough and have decided to opt out of their contract. There'll need to be contract lengths for coaches and if they want to opt out, the school should get some money back in return.

I think 5 star recruits should wait longer to make their decision. From what I have seen, all 5 star recruits have committed by the halfway point of the recruiting period.



yes.

if you match the same offense or defense of your coordinator, you get a bonus arlie said.

no penalty if you dont match.

[ThunderingHERD]

North Carolina ball, Q2, 1-10-CLEM40 (00:17) 0-7
Roy Rosenbach misses the 58 yard field goal. It will be Clemson ball at the CLEM 40


I still had two time outs here, btw. It seems like the computer will always go for a FG with 20 seconds or less left regardless of the timeout situation or how ridiculous a distance.

North Carolina ball, Q4, 4-1-CLEM5 (02:34) 13-14
Offense: Short Pass, Set: Pro Set, Play: PS-HB-screen
Defense: Normal, Set: 5-2, Play: 52-norm-ZoneBlitz
QB I. Wycheck completes a 5 yard screen to RB G. Barton ****Touchdown!*****

Down by 1 with two and a half minutes left the computer passes on the field goal. I guess this one is halfway believable, but it happens all the time in BB. Fortunately I made it, but man was I pissed when I saw the screen drawn up. I'm like 10% on screen attempts.


North Carolina ball, Q4, 3-6-CLEM23 (00:22) 19-14
Offense: Inside Run, Set: SingleBack, Play: SB-HB-counter-LG
Defense: Stop Pass, Set: 5-2, Play: 52-pass-DZ
The QB takes a knee.

North Carolina ball, Q4, 4-7-CLEM24 (00:00) 19-14
Roy Rosenbach has his 42 yard field goal blocked by Randy Coolbaugh! The ball is recovered
by Sylvester Jones (CLEM) at the CLEM 30. He returns it to Clemson 33 for 3 yards.


My favorite. This was the ACC championship, btw. I think if that block had been returned for a TD I would never have played the game again. Ever. :)

[Galaril]

The game AI overall is quite good, Great job Arlie. I had a game last night where Air Force was up on Unlv 14-3 in the late 3rd quarter. UNLV scored aTD and went for the two point conversion. They did make it got the ball back later in the game and kicked a fieldgoal that tied up the game. There might still be some problems with the 2 minutes at the end of half, game and ot.

[Toddzilla]

Will the update - which is addressing the magnitude of injuries - also address the AI's propensity to put injured players in the game wheter ot not they are on the depth chart? If I lose one more starter for the year after the AI subs them when I take them off the depth chart completely, my head will a-splode.

[Tim Tellean]

todd the update will address your issues

[Toddzilla]

Tim - thanks

(gratuitios effort to hit post #200 - nyah)

[ThunderingHERD]

Game just froze when I tried to say during training camp, set coaching philosophies stage. Lost hours. :mad:

[John Galt]

Rankings issues continue to confuse me. I'm playing Notre Dame (which is painful for me to admit, but it was the best job offer available) and this is what has happened so far. I started out ranked in the teens.

I beat a ranked Michigan State team at home (they are currently ranked 20th).
I beat an unranked Air Force team at home.
I lose to a ranked Michigan team on the road by a TD (they are currently ranked 11th).
I beat a then number one ranked USC team on the road (they are currently ranked 7th after the loss).

After all this, the computers have me at 17th. So what do the coaches rank me? 28th. The media? 31st. After knocking off a number 1 USC team on the road and with another victory against a ranked opponent, Notre Dame (of all places) can't break into the top 25 (even when the computers have them easily within). Very strange.

[John Galt]

dola. After beating an unranked Navy team at home (to go 4-1 total), the coaches dropped me to 29th and the media moved me up one slot to 30th. I'm still not in the top 25.

[John Galt]

double dola.

So, I go on to beat Temple at home (that finally puts me in the top 25).

Then, I face another number 1 team in Purdue. This time it is at home, and I am victorious. So, my team is now 7-1. We have beaten two teams that were ranked number 1 at the time. One was at home and one on the road. Purdue is currently ranked 2nd even after the loss. USC is 9th (they have lost a 2nd game). My only loss is to Michigan who is ranked 3rd overall and that loss was on the road. There is only 1 undefeated team in the country. So, you would expect Notre Dame to be jockeying for a championship bid. No, the team is ranked 13th in both polls behind 3 2-loss teams. Notre Dame is actually the 2nd lowest ranked 1-loss team (ahead of only TCU).

I think the game rankings are paying way too much attention to offense and defense rankings. My biggest jumps in the poll are when my underachieving defense plays a good game. Right now, my defense is ranked 82nd (my offense is 17th). Quality of opponents beaten should matter a lot more. And if the game really wanted to be realistic, program prestige would figure more prominently.

[duckman]

I just bought the game yesterday and have been enjoying it so far.

One thing I've noticed is that when you hit Suggest on the gameplan that I would occasionally get values greater than 100 on some of the situations. I would have to manually adjust them in order to continue.

[KWhit]

I had a crash to desktop at the end of recruiting the other night in my first offseason. It was very late, so I haven't done any trial and error to see if I can go back to an earlier save or anything like that.

But I did start a new career on my laptop and while simming game 3 of the first season I noticed on the boxscore that my #3 QB has the most attempts. I check my depth chart and, what do you know, my top 2 QBS were injured in the same game. Again. In the 3rd game of a new career. Ugh...

My #1 QB is out 6 weeks with a ruptured spleen (same injury that knocked one of guys out in my last career). The other guy is questionable with a knee injury for 4 weeks.

So I have played 2 careers and a total of only 14 games so far in those careers and have lost 4 QBs to injury - each for at least 4 weeks (most for longer than that). And in both the careers, I had to go to my #3 QB.

So there is still definitely work to be done with injuries.

[WSUCougar]

So, I go on to beat Temple at home (that finally puts me in the top 25).
Well, DUH. Everyone knows that taking down the Owls is a key indicator of greatness.

[bhlloy]

Any plans to allow us to change players numbers in the update Arles? I had my star WR wear #69 all year and i couldn't change it, which sucked

[Tim Tellean]

duckman what type of offense were you using?
kwhit the reason for the crash is you have more then 100 players on your watch list, its a known issue.

Could anyone with issues with the game post at the actual game site www.greydogsoftware.com (http://www.greydogsoftware.com)

[KWhit]

kwhit the reason for the crash is you have more then 100 players on your watch list, its a known issue.
Yes, I saw that posted above. I don't think I have that many on my list, but it's possible. I haven't had a chance to check it out yet.

[John Galt]

Well, DUH. Everyone knows that taking down the Owls is a key indicator of greatness.

:)

So, after championship week, these are the media rankings:

1. Oklahoma 12-0
2. Purdue 10-1 (Notre Dame is their one loss)
3. Florida State 10-2 (having just lost in the ACC title game to Virginia Tech)
4. Oregon State 10-2 (despite having just lost to unranked Oregon)
5. Florida 10-3 (at least they won their title game, but they have 3 losses!)
6. TCU 11-1
7. Notre Dame 10-1

That’s right. Notre Dame is now the lowest ranked 1-loss team despite having just beaten then ranked 17th Boston College. TCU with its 100th ranked strength of schedule moved ahead of the Irish.

The things the Irish have against them:

1. 72nd SOS. This is a result of all the crappy (Army, Navy, Rutgers, Temple) pre-scheduled games. I can’t help that, but it doesn’t seem to hurt the Irish in the real world. Either way, TCU is higher with an even worse SOS, so I’m not sure that is the key.
2. 41st ranked defense. Not that bad given were it was earlier. Still, I think most of my gains in the polls were due to defensive improvement and not winning big games.

In the real world, there would be a big argument about whether Notre Dame or Purdue should be in the title game since Notre Dame beat them head-to-head. If Purdue went before the Irish, that would upset me, but in a realistic way. Being behind 3-loss Florida, 1-loss TCU, and two 2-loss teams that just lost their last game makes ZERO sense to me.

At least in the GDS rankings, Notre Dame is 4th (still behind 2 loss Florida State). But the reason we are 4th and not 3rd or 2nd is the bizarre media and coaches polls. Oh well, the team plays 15th ranked Virginia Tech in a BCS game.

[Bee]

Could anyone with issues with the game post at the actual game site www.greydogsoftware.com (http://www.greydogsoftware.com)

No, but thanks for asking. :D

[Ben E Lou]

No, but thanks for asking. :D:D

[digamma]

Another minor quibble...

I'm not sure if YAC in the game are realistic, or perhaps better stated, they don't match up with the PBP. I didn't save the PBP here, but in the game it was something like "he was off to the races." Game log:

Georgia Tech ball, Q2, 3-9-GT35 (02:40) 3-6 Offense: Medium Pass, Set: Trips, Play: TR-FL-slant-SE-post Defense: Stop Run, Set: 4-3, Play: 43-run-SZ-B5 QB T. Kitchings completes a 65 yard cross to WR B. Avery ****Touchdown!*****

In the box score, though, he only has 16 YAC for the game. (He only had one other catch on a curl, so the bulk of his YAC had to come from this play.) If he only got 16 YAC on this play, then my QB threw a 49 yard cross on a medium pass call.

Maybe we're back to the end result is ok, but how we're getting there is a bit off.

[KWhit]

1. Oklahoma 12-0
2. Purdue 10-1 (Notre Dame is their one loss)
3. Florida State 10-2 (having just lost in the ACC title game to Virginia Tech)
4. Oregon State 10-2 (despite having just lost to unranked Oregon)
5. Florida 10-3 (at least they won their title game, but they have 3 losses!)
6. TCU 11-1
7. Notre Dame 10-1

Yikes.

[digamma]

A couple of other minor gripes:

punt return yard averages seem to be a bit high.

On the roster page, sorting by status doesn't group all of my injured players together--they are in clumps of 3 or 4 injured players across my roster. Is there another way to group my injured players, so I see them all?

[John Galt]

My 2nd season with the Irish (7th overall in my career) ends a little better with the polls, but there are still major problems, IMO. This is the top of the media poll:

1. Virginia Tech 10-1
2. LSU 11-1
3. NC State 10-2 (despite just losing the ACC championship to Virginia Tech)
4. Ohio State 10-1 (despite just losing to #17 Michigan)
5. Notre Dame 10-1

TCU is the only other 1 loss team and they are 9th this time.

My only loss was to Purdue on the road in week 4 by 5 points. They were then ranked 7th and I was ranked 12th. It seems to me that the game acts in the opposite of reality in punishing loses. Teams that lose late rarely fall from their ranking. I lost to Purdue, had already beat #5 USC, and unranked Bowling Green (who had been to bowl games the last couple years). After losing to Purdue, I disappear from the rankings entirely and don't again reach my preseason ranking of 14th until my team is 7-1. On the other hand, teams that lose in the later half of the season don't seem to fall more than a couple ranks.

A couple other notable facts about the 1 through 5 rankings:

1. Virginia Tech, 11-1, SOS 4, Top 25 2-1
2. LSU, 11-1, SOS 6, Top 25 3-1
3. NC State, 10-2, SOS 14, Top 25 1-1
4. Ohio State, 10-1, SOS 74, Top 25 3-1
5. Notre Dame, 10-1, SOS 67, Top 25 3-1 (Alabama finished 26th or it would be 4-1)

Basically, with Notre Dame's schedule, it is hard to ever get a decent SOS. I added Alabama, Arkansas, and Bowling Green to my schedule and couldn't get any better teams to play me. Ohio State and NC State wouldn't be ahead of me in the real world since they are coming off loses. The rankings aren't nearly as bad as my first season with ND, but they are still problematic.

[Arles]

Here's patch 1.03:

http://72.29.67.246/GDS/BBUpdate.exe

Changes:
1. Crash To Desktop due to watch list/scouting over 100 players.
2. Fixed issue of 2 year players declaring early.
3. Depth chart interface issues (bottom grid - ST players card).
4. Fix the in-game issue of "Out" players sometimes playing.
5. Adding in the injuries option (5 levels).
6. Reduced the seriousness of injuries.
7. Button for "Suggest all" in training.
8. Option to turn off academics.
9. Fix the default OR and IR gameplans for certain offensive philosophies. (only good for new careers)
10. Fix the FG max range issue - it now is the actual FG length, not the yardage to the endzone.
11. Added 1-100 numerical value for prestige.
12. Adjusted engine for making Field goals.
13. Suggest for option now includes I-Form instead of Pro Set.
14. Both saves on the offensive gamplan screen now save Max FG and 4th down preferences.

Update 1.1 will focus on the polls, play by play, editor, HTML and a playoff bracket (as well as other issues that come up). Based on some great feedback from some users here (specifically CraigSca), I am going to redo the polls for 1.1 to be more like real life. The tradeoff will be it will become very difficult for unranked teams at the start of the season to ever make a BCS game, but we'll see how it goes. Still, that's how it is in real life and I will do my best to mimic that. But, polls are not an exact science and it's one of these things where it will undoubtedly be criticised no matter how they are done. Still, that's no reason to stop trying.

[WSUCougar]

Great stuff. Thanks, Arles, for your continued hard work.

[VPI97]

Thanks Arlie.

[wbatl1]

Here's patch 1.03:

http://72.29.67.246/GDS/BBUpdate.exe

Changes:
1. Crash To Desktop due to watch list/scouting over 100 players.
2. Fixed issue of 2 year players declaring early.
3. Depth chart interface issues (bottom grid - ST players card).
4. Fix the in-game issue of "Out" players sometimes playing.
5. Adding in the injuries option (5 levels).
6. Reduced the seriousness of injuries.
7. Button for "Suggest all" in training.
8. Option to turn off academics.
9. Fix the default OR and IR gameplans for certain offensive philosophies. (only good for new careers)
10. Fix the FG max range issue - it now is the actual FG length, not the yardage to the endzone.
11. Added 1-100 numerical value for prestige.
12. Adjusted engine for making Field goals.
13. Suggest for option now includes I-Form instead of Pro Set.
14. Both saves on the offensive gamplan screen now save Max FG and 4th down preferences.

Update 1.1 will focus on the polls, play by play, editor, HTML and a playoff bracket (as well as other issues that come up). Based on some great feedback from some users here (specifically CraigSca), I am going to redo the polls for 1.1 to be more like real life. The tradeoff will be it will become very difficult for unranked teams at the start of the season to ever make a BCS game, but we'll see how it goes. Still, that's how it is in real life and I will do my best to mimic that. But, polls are not an exact science and it's one of these things where it will undoubtedly be criticised no matter how they are done. Still, that's no reason to stop trying.

YEeeeeeeeeeehhhhaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwww....Thanks so much for this unexpected patch Arlie.

[sovereignstar]

Curious, what did CraigSca have to say about the polls? Perhaps something in this thread that I missed?

[George]

Nice work, Arlie!

[CamEdwards]

awesome. thanks arlie.

[Eaglesfan27]

Excellent. Now, I can't wait to get off work and start a new career :)

[Arles]

Curious, what did CraigSca have to say about the polls? Perhaps something in this thread that I missed?
It was in a PM to me.

[Cuckoo]

Great stuff. I've been enjoying the game quite a bit, and this is great to see. For that reason, I hate to make another request.

But is there any way we can get healed players included in the injury e-mail? :)

[duckman]

duckman what type of offense were you using?
I am running a vertical passing offense.

[duckman]

I just finished updating my copy and it shows the original and the 1.03 in my Add/Remove Software under my Control Panel. Is it safe to remove the "old" version?

[digamma]

Is there a way to view recruiting rankings? I know how to see how my team ranked, but I'm not finding a complete list. Am I just missing it?

[Ben E Lou]

Is there a way to view recruiting rankings? I know how to see how my team ranked, but I'm not finding a complete list. Am I just missing it?I don't think there is. That's a report that I'm requesting for the 1.1 update, though.

[Emiliano]

Here's patch 1.03:

http://72.29.67.246/GDS/BBUpdate.exe

Changes:
1. Crash To Desktop due to watch list/scouting over 100 players.
2. Fixed issue of 2 year players declaring early.
3. Depth chart interface issues (bottom grid - ST players card).
4. Fix the in-game issue of "Out" players sometimes playing.
5. Adding in the injuries option (5 levels).
6. Reduced the seriousness of injuries.
7. Button for "Suggest all" in training.
8. Option to turn off academics.
9. Fix the default OR and IR gameplans for certain offensive philosophies. (only good for new careers)
10. Fix the FG max range issue - it now is the actual FG length, not the yardage to the endzone.
11. Added 1-100 numerical value for prestige.
12. Adjusted engine for making Field goals.
13. Suggest for option now includes I-Form instead of Pro Set.
14. Both saves on the offensive gamplan screen now save Max FG and 4th down preferences.

Update 1.1 will focus on the polls, play by play, editor, HTML and a playoff bracket (as well as other issues that come up). Based on some great feedback from some users here (specifically CraigSca), I am going to redo the polls for 1.1 to be more like real life. The tradeoff will be it will become very difficult for unranked teams at the start of the season to ever make a BCS game, but we'll see how it goes. Still, that's how it is in real life and I will do my best to mimic that. But, polls are not an exact science and it's one of these things where it will undoubtedly be criticised no matter how they are done. Still, that's no reason to stop trying.
Great! Thanks Arlie.

[MizzouRah]

Great news indeed!! Tomorrow is vacation day 1 (only 11 to go) :) and I'm kicking off my Troy dynasty. Thanks!!!

[Arles]

I just finished updating my copy and it shows the original and the 1.03 in my Add/Remove Software under my Control Panel. Is it safe to remove the "old" version?
No, doing that will remove 80% of the files you need to run. The reason there are multiple versions in your add/remove is that each update adds new files.

[duckman]

No, doing that will remove 80% of the files you need to run. The reason there are multiple versions in your add/remove is that each update adds new files.
Cool, I was just making sure that one of them was a phantom and was taking up another 268 megs of hard drive space.

[Eaglesfan27]

Been playing this for the last 5 hours, and having so much fun. Now that injuries are much more reasonably handled, this is just a blast to play. I'm watching every game, and there are still some things that need to be fixed in the PbP, but they don't significantly hamper my enjoyment of the game.

My only gripe is that USC's starting roster in each of my careers (I've started one after each of the patches) has been relatively weak ;)

However, this time, I do have a very good (although not a stud) RB.

[Johnny93g]

i just want to say im really enjoying this game. Arlie, you did a great job. I'm in my 3rd season with Notre Dame....currently 4-1....my 1st 2 recruiting classes were ranked 8th, and 29th....it's definatly a challenge.....MY top recruit this year, a CB ranked 29th in the nation, has already become a superstar...8 interceptions in 5 games!!!!!....nice way to start a career.

A quick question......I've had 5 players transfer away so far....Each player was a freshman who redshirted, with skills ranging around 50 current, and 75 potential....These are all players i pegged as future stars, who were behind pretty talented vetarns. Im now afraid to redshirt any freshman with a nice potential for fear of a transfer. Meanwhile, Miami is recruiting QB's like crazy. They have last years #1 QB, and this year's number 2, and number 3. Last year's #1 redshirted, and was a 76/85......seems like he would be more likely to transfer. Are other people having this problem....I actually wouldnt call it a problem, more of an annoyance.

Im also having a difficult time getting anyone to transfer here....I have a huge recruiting budget, so i offer a few transfer's each year.....noone has any interest in coming to Notre Dame. Maybe that needs to be adjusted. My prestige is 74, so id assume thats pretty high. Great game

[CamEdwards]

i just want to say im really enjoying this game. Arlie, you did a great job. I'm in my 3rd season with Notre Dame....currently 4-1....my 1st 2 recruiting classes were ranked 8th, and 29th....it's definatly a challenge.....MY top recruit this year, a CB ranked 29th in the nation, has already become a superstar...8 interceptions in 5 games!!!!!....nice way to start a career.

A quick question......I've had 5 players transfer away so far....All players who were freshman, with skills ranging around 50 current, and 75 potential....These are all players i pegged as future stars, who were behind pretty talented vetarns. Im now afraid to redshirt any skilled freshman for fear of a transfer. Meanwhile, Miami is recruiting QB's like crazy. They have last years #1 QB, and this year's number 2, and number 3. Last year's #1 redshirted, and was a 76/85......seems like he would be more likely to transfer. Are other people having this problem....I actually wouldnt call it a problem, more of an annoyance.

Im also having a difficult time getting anyone to transfer here....I have a huge recruiting budget, so i offer a few transfer's each year.....noone has any interest in coming to Notre Dame. Maybe that needs to be adjusted. My prestige is 74, so id assume thats pretty high. Great game

I've always had at least one player transfer, but no more than two per year. Check the player's morale during the course of the season. If you don't want to lose them, you might have to play them. Taking off the redshirt and having them sit on the bench won't really help their morale, however.

I was also playing as Notre Dame in my last dynasty and never had anybody want to transfer. I just assumed it was because ND is evil. :)

[Honolulu Blue]

Bugs, features and such I've seen:

* I haven't seen a junior college player in several years, since the 1.02 patch. What happened to them?
* It's irritating to only be able to cut players during one specific point during the offseason, and not at all during the season.
* Equally irritating is the very limited availability of position changes.
* The "I want to go to Troy" guy is nothing but a hook and snare. He always teases me with his ability, then whether I pursue him or not, he loses interest around week 12. I never, ever get those guys and have given up trying.
* Slightly more realistic is the fact that no one wants to transfer to Troy (nothing but "Low" interest). The good news is that no one has ever transferred out.
* Kickers are listed under punting stats when they have no punts.
* I had one super stud named Jose Brinson. He was an OLB that was rated as the #1816 player in the land in his year. He wasn't on my list of recruits that year; must've walked on and we gave him a scholarship. Good move. He graded out at 5/9 (out of 10) his freshman year, made the NATIONAL third team, the Sun Belt 1st team, and took Sun Belt FOTY honors for good measure. My coaches couldn't screw him up and he grew to a 6/9 his sophomore year. He had 111 tackles, 15(!) sacks, 14 stuffs, and 2 picks. He made the Sun Belt 1st team, of course, was named Sun Belt Defensive POTY, and made the national 1st team. Alas, this was before the last patch, and you know what happened - he declared for the draft. We've had good players after that, but nothing like good old Jose.

[MizzouRah]

Go Troy! ;)

[digamma]

It looks like kick offs out of bounds are being spotted at the 40 yard line instead of the 35:

Mark Hamilton kicks the ball out of bounds! Penalty against Florida State, the ball will be spotted at the 40 yardline. Georgia Tech ball, Q3, 1-10-GT40 (10:06) 17-31

They are still spotted at the 35, right?

[John Galt]

More 4th Down Wackiness:

Notre Dame ball, Q4, 4-2-MIST2 (02:52) 24-24
Offense: Inside Run, Set: Pro Set, Play: PS-HB-power-LG
Defense: Stop Run, Set: Goal Line, Play: GL-run-SZ-R
RB R. Fauria runs left guard for 0 yards (DT J. Walker).

With a tie game, you don't kick the FG?!?! And I have go for it on 4th down set at 30. I guess I'll have to even go lower.

[digamma]

Been playing this for the last 5 hours, and having so much fun. Now that injuries are much more reasonably handled, this is just a blast to play. I'm watching every game, and there are still some things that need to be fixed in the PbP, but they don't significantly hamper my enjoyment of the game.
BTW, I echo this. I'm having a blast with the game.

My main frustration is the two minute logic on trying field goals with ample time to take a shot at the end zone. Other than that (and the minor nits I've pointed out throughout the thread), I'm having a blast.

[Anguscl]

Quick question, are only tailbacks eligible for the Doak Walker award in the game, I have a fullback that is in the top 15 in rushing, and he doesn't appear on the award watch for the award and thier are players with less stats on that award watch page?

[bhlloy]

I had a nice little game going with San Diego state, 3-0 with a win over a ranked Utah team, and then week 6 comes along - starting QB and RB suspended. Neither were on the "danger" list last time so I didn't have the option to give them any hours. In fact, the "danger" list in week 3 only contained three players, and only a backup FB was suspended which had led me to hope that academics had been toned down. I love the game but I hate the way academics were designed. It just seems so arbitrary. For a text sim I have to say TCY got way it handled academic suspensions right on, even if it wasn't as realistic.

I don't want to take academics off because it seems like a "cheat" (allows me to spend more cash on other areas of my budget - I presume?) but I think I may have to for my next game.

On a positive note, injuries seem much better. Only three players injured, all for less than 7 weeks and two "doubtful" and one "probable" which he has been playing through and hasn't reinjured.

[Eaglesfan27]

I had a nice little game going with San Diego state, 3-0 with a win over a ranked Utah team, and then week 6 comes along - starting QB and RB suspended. Neither were on the "danger" list last time so I didn't have the option to give them any hours. In fact, the "danger" list in week 3 only contained three players, and only a backup FB was suspended which had led me to hope that academics had been toned down. I love the game but I hate the way academics were designed. It just seems so arbitrary. For a text sim I have to say TCY got way it handled academic suspensions right on, even if it wasn't as realistic.

I don't want to take academics off because it seems like a "cheat" (allows me to spend more cash on other areas of my budget - I presume?) but I think I may have to for my next game.

On a positive note, injuries seem much better. Only three players injured, all for less than 7 weeks and two "doubtful" and one "probable" which he has been playing through and hasn't reinjured.
I won't turn off academics, but I agree that the ability to add hours to guys needs to be expanded in that I should be able to offer guys hours who are anywhere within the realm of being suspended within the next 3 weeks. I just had my starting FS and SS suspended when they weren't even on the list the last period. I like most aspects of academics, and it definitely influences who I recruit to an extent, but that aspect needs to be finetuned imho.

[KWhit]

About how many guys should I expect to be suspended in a given year? It's only half way through the season and I've already had 5 guys declared academically ineligible. Is this normal???

FYI: I have my staff handling academics.

[Icy]

I have been programming today as somebody requested this in the past. It's an online tool to get a random team for those who want an extra challenge not choosing themselves the team they want to manage.


Random team selector for BBCF (http://www.prodeportes.com/bb/randteam/index.php)

There you can get a fully random team or a random one in a selected conference or/and with a selected prestige. Also added some extra info like the the conference average prestige.

[bhlloy]

I won't turn off academics, but I agree that the ability to add hours to guys needs to be expanded in that I should be able to offer guys hours who are anywhere within the realm of being suspended within the next 3 weeks. I just had my starting FS and SS suspended when they weren't even on the list the last period. I like most aspects of academics, and it definitely influences who I recruit to an extent, but that aspect needs to be finetuned imho.

Yeah, I agree I don't want to turn it off, definitely needs toning down though. I mean IRL you just don't see 8-10 players suspended in a season, and especially not in 3 week "chunks". God knows a lot of football players aren't smart, but generally teams do a good job of keeping them eligible. In BBCF it seems like over half my team could potentially be under the line at one point in the season.

Case in point - this years USC team lost Manny and Eric Wright before the season started because of academic problems last year, and a couple of incoming freshmen never qualified, but to the best of my knowledge not a single player has been suspended for grades during the season. And USC is barely above the new NCAA graduation guideline, so they are nothing special. I don't know for a fact, but I'd guess most of the worst academic schools don't have more than 5 guys a year suspended. In BBCF, that seems to be a pretty good year if you spend the max on academic tutors.

[GabeRivers]

I hate to turn off academics, because picking recruits who are not stupid adds more strategy to the game. But I'm bothered with the way the game handles academics, because it is unrealistic. In real college football, guys don't get hit for 3-week, mid-term suspensions.

Being academically ineligible in real life is a semester to semester issue, so if a guy is eligible at the beginning of the fall semester, he'll be eligible for the whole season (and vice versa). Conversely, in real life some guys end up academically ineligible for the spring semester and therefore miss their bowl games. BBCF sort of handles all of this backwards.

[Eaglesfan27]

About how many guys should I expect to be suspended in a given year? It's only half way through the season and I've already had 5 guys declared academically ineligible. Is this normal???

FYI: I have my staff handling academics.
I had 3 guys (Starting FB and 2 backups) suspended the first period, and 2 (both starting safeties) more the second. At the 2nd period, I only had 4 guys on the danger list and spent plenty of hours on them, so I'm interested to see what happens when I hit the 3rd suspension period.


I forget who said they aren't seeing Junior College players anymore, but I'm seeing them fine. Actually 2 of the top 3 recruits on my list in-season list are JC players.

[Eaglesfan27]

Dola -

No guys were suspended in week 9, much to my surprise. If the system can just be changed to allow us to give hours to anyone who might even be close to being suspended, I think I'll be reasonably happy with the academic system.

[WSUCougar]

Little niggle on the AI penalty logic: early in the game, the AI declined a 15-yard crack-back penalty (which would have made it 1st and 25) for a 1-yard loss (2nd and 11).

Also, I had a PBP call that was an INT that read something like:
FALSE19 yard return.

[Tim Tellean]

WSUCougar could you post the full PbP to the int. play. Arlie can find the error that way.

[TazFTW]

I had a crash during the offseasone training part of the game when I was looking at a player's card and the close button for the card was missing. I couldn't click anywhere else to get out of that screen so I had to ctrl-atl-del to shut down BBCF.

It was then that I realized that the last time I saved was in the last week of the postseason. I guess the good thing that came out of it was that Hawaii gave me an even bigger budget (original increase was $90000, redo was $150000).

[Tim Tellean]

Academics need $$ spent on academic tutors and hours devoted to the player. A player around a 1.7 gpa with a good WE and INT (>70) probably needs 10-15 hours.
Note also that players listed in week1,4 and 7 nee to be dealt with before weeks 3,6 and 9.

[Tim Tellean]

TAz do you have mods installed? If so which ones?

[WSUCougar]

WSUCougar could you post the full PbP to the int. play. Arlie can find the error that way.
That WAS the full PBP. ;)

[Eaglesfan27]

In my game against Arizona, they just returned a kickoff for 95 yards and a TD. However, on the play, Arizona was called for illegal use of the hands. We accepted the penalty. However, the game had the TD count and then had Arizona kick an extra point from their own 5 yard line (at least it looked that way in the on-field representation. The XP was good, and the game incorrectly credited Arizona with a TD to make it 10-7 in the 1st quarter.

[Eaglesfan27]

I've had so much fun with this game the last 2 days. I'm now 10-1 and about to face my rival, the lowly Bruins. If we beat them, we should go to the National Championship game. I've become absorbed with my team watching the PbP slowly in each game over the past 10 hours (spread out over the past 2 days.) As previously mentioned, the diagram doesn't always seem to match up with the result of the play, but I'm finding it very engrossing to watch my coaches call plays and watch the results. I feel like I'm getting more attached to my team as a result as well (akin to how I do in FM.) Horace is a great all around back, William is a shifty back, and Andre runs over guys. I've watched my QB mature and just saw my first blowout as we threw for over 350 yards and ran for another 100 yards in the 1st half against an 8-2 Washington team and won 63-13.

I'm really enjoying myself. That being said, I think the blowout logic might need to be re-visited. My coaches kept my star RB, my star QB, and my star WR in the game all the way to about 1 minute left in the 4th quarter despite a 50 point lead.

[TazFTW]

TAz do you have mods installed? If so which ones?
I use Icy's pstats 1.5, ixnay's bowl and team logos.

I think I know what the problem is though. During the recruiting period, I 'print' the recruiting service email and it opens it another window. If I click on the advance week button, the print out goes on top of BBCF while BBCF is still processing the week. If I click on the 'X' to close the print out, windows will show BBCF as not responding. I am still able to run BBCF but after a certain amount of time the game will do what I mentioned earlier.

I've been able to recreate it using those steps, so chalk that up to user error.

[DaddyTorgo]

so much fun post-patch here too. Year 1 with BC, letting the coaches handle everything (I find I don't want to get attached until at least year 3 or so and just want to handle recruiting until then, until i get a bunch of "my guys" in place)...so just simming completely and everything...finished the year 12-2, ACC champions, destroyed WVU in the Orange Bowl 48-15 and ended the season ranked #2 in both polls (was #3 before the Orange Bowl unfortunately http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/images/smilies/frown.gif ). #19 offense, #27 defense.

next year: we gun to stay in the top-5 and prove this wasn't a fluke

[DaddyTorgo]

dola

or do we?? Michigan offered me their head coaching gig...

[Eaglesfan27]

I lost to the $!%*&! Bruins as my QB chose this game to have his worst game of the season throwing 2 picks and completing under 45% of his passes. Hope I didn't wake Mrs. Eaglesfan upstairs as I was yelling at the stupid QB most of the game.. :(

Their star RB was too tough to stop with my depleted linebacker corp (2 guys out with injuries.) We lost 23-17. Only if Karsten could have played like he did in the previous game, or even halfway decent :(

We still finished 3rd in the polls and 6th in the GDCS Standings as we were the top ranked 2 loss team. One 1 loss team, Boise State, finished lower than a bunch of 2 losses team with a final ranking of 12th place. An undefeated LSU team is facing a 1 loss Miami team in the National Championship game.

So much fun.

[MrBug708]

ABout freaking time

[Godzilla Blitz]

Humm. This is getting interesting. Couple of quick questions. I apologize if this has been asked before, but I'm interested in hearing people's impressions after this new patch...

Any comments on the game's difficulty? I'm reading about people having great seasons in their third year. Is it perhaps too easy? Are people feeling challenged?

With this new patch (1.03), is the game in a state now where you'd recommend getting it, or would it make sense to wait for some more fixes?

[MrBug708]

I've wondered how many really top notch talent transfers in real life? Im sure there are some, but how often does a potential talent as Brock BErlin, really transfer to a different school?

[astrosfan64]

Humm. This is getting interesting. Couple of quick questions. I apologize if this has been asked before, but I'm interested in hearing people's impressions after this new patch...

Any comments on the game's difficulty? I'm reading about people having great seasons in their third year. Is it perhaps too easy? Are people feeling challenged?

With this new patch (1.03), is the game in a state now where you'd recommend getting it, or would it make sense to wait for some more fixes?

If you pick up a top prestige school 3 years sounds about right to have a real top tier team.

The difficulty is taking a mid to lower prestige team and building a program. As a lower prestige school it took me three recruiting years with steady progress, before I landed my first 4 star recruit. Overall, I find the games challenge perfect. I've played close to 40 to 50 seasons and I still find the game challenging and rewarding.

I want the play-by-play cleaned up a bit more and the academic module to be changed around. But, to me they are minor issues.

[Eaglesfan27]

Humm. This is getting interesting. Couple of quick questions. I apologize if this has been asked before, but I'm interested in hearing people's impressions after this new patch...

Any comments on the game's difficulty? I'm reading about people having great seasons in their third year. Is it perhaps too easy? Are people feeling challenged?

With this new patch (1.03), is the game in a state now where you'd recommend getting it, or would it make sense to wait for some more fixes?
Personally, I think this game is a definite buy if you are a college football fan.

I think many people who have mentioned great seasons have started out with very good teams. Certainly, once I realized the talent level expectations, I realized USC's team is very good (although they don't have a true stud RB in my league ala Reggie Bush, but they did have 2 very good RB's and a 3rd decent RB.)

Even with a very talented roster, I lost 2 games this year, and I certainly feel that I'm being challenged. Pre-patch, recruiting was VERY competitive with the AI making some really smart choices. I imagine that is the same post-patch, and I think it is going to be sufficiently challenging to keep me interested in this career for a good long time. Also, I tried a low prestige team and that was a GREAT challenge. I think Skydog had quite a tough challenge when he was playing with his created independent school as well..

As I previously said, I think this is a must-buy if you are a college football fan, but there are a few flaws still in the game that will annoy some. The PbP could use a bit of tightening, academics might be handled a bit better, kicking stats still seem a bit off, but none of those things are significantly hampering my enjoyment. I haven't wanted to stop playing the last 2 days since the patch came out, and this is beating out some heavy competition for my gaming time.

[dubb93]

Was up 14-13 untill I just got burnt on a 27 yard TD pass on a screen. I called 3-4 SZ B5, 6. For some reason my team ran Dime DZ.

[Ben E Lou]

Dola -

No guys were suspended in week 9, much to my surprise. If the system can just be changed to allow us to give hours to anyone who might even be close to being suspended, I think I'll be reasonably happy with the academic system.Yeah. It needs to open a window with everyone who is, say, 2.25 or lower (or just open the whole roster and allow a sort on current GPA).

[bhlloy]

Academics need $$ spent on academic tutors and hours devoted to the player. A player around a 1.7 gpa with a good WE and INT (>70) probably needs 10-15 hours.
Note also that players listed in week1,4 and 7 nee to be dealt with before weeks 3,6 and 9.

Tim - if this is really the case I think people playing smaller schools are going to find it very hard to keep players active. Especially as apparently you also need big $ $ to spend on keeping injuries at bay. A 50,000 a year budget on academic tutors is the absolute max I can spend as SD State and that only gives me something like 76 hours to spend all year and I'm seeing between 2-5 starters on the danger list most weeks.

I don't like the design decision, but as long as I'm given the option to tone it down it's an OK implementation. If Arlie can just put a slider in like he did with injuries, everyone is happy IMO.

[bhlloy]

Yeah. It needs to open a window with everyone who is, say, 2.25 or lower (or just open the whole roster and allow a sort on current GPA).

This would be a good start, but I don't see why we can't give hours to anybody we like.

For example, playing as a small school I might have a stud RB or QB that I wanted to make absolutely sure didn't get anywhere close to suspension, and I might want to spend a few hours on each period just to make sure his GPA stays up around 3.0.

I don't see what there is to gain by limiting us in this case?

[ThunderingHERD]

Just had the opponent twice go for it on 4th down in OT, the 2nd time on a 4th and goal at the 3. They were up first, btw. They missed the 2nd one. Then I got the ball, and despite only needing 3 to win, the computer decides to throw a pass that is picked off and returned for a TD. :mad:

[MizzouRah]

I've had so much fun with this game the last 2 days. I'm now 10-1 and about to face my rival, the lowly Bruins. If we beat them, we should go to the National Championship game. I've become absorbed with my team watching the PbP slowly in each game over the past 10 hours (spread out over the past 2 days.) As previously mentioned, the diagram doesn't always seem to match up with the result of the play, but I'm finding it very engrossing to watch my coaches call plays and watch the results. I feel like I'm getting more attached to my team as a result as well (akin to how I do in FM.) Horace is a great all around back, William is a shifty back, and Andre runs over guys. I've watched my QB mature and just saw my first blowout as we threw for over 350 yards and ran for another 100 yards in the 1st half against an 8-2 Washington team and won 63-13.

I'm really enjoying myself. That being said, I think the blowout logic might need to be re-visited. My coaches kept my star RB, my star QB, and my star WR in the game all the way to about 1 minute left in the 4th quarter despite a 50 point lead.
Played my first game and was up 29-10 late in the game and the AI brought in their 2nd string QB and RB. :confused: Weird.

[Flasch186]

i hate to be the first to broach the subject but I will...I havnt touched the game after hearing of the AI issues. The reason is definitely partially my own. I hate getting too deep into these career sims when something is amiss. I will continue to wait to make sure the OT and 4th qtr bugs are fixed ebfore diving in as I would like to be a part of it but cant right now...WWSM it is.

[WSUCougar]

Couple more blips on the radar, playing as New Mexico (UNM):

First, a strange PBP results, as follows
QB Walt price drops back to set-up the screen pass.
.Oh! he's hammered to the ground! OLB Lovett Brantley timed the snap perfectly and was in the backfield before the QB could react. He returns it 0 yards.

Result:
UNM Interception 0 yard return
We actually retained the ball on offense.

Second, the AI (on offense) declined a 5-yard defensive offside penalty and accepted a 5 yard rushing gain, thus taking a 2nd & 5 over a 1st & 5.

[Eaglesfan27]

Yeah. It needs to open a window with everyone who is, say, 2.25 or lower (or just open the whole roster and allow a sort on current GPA).
I would like to see it 2.50 or lower, but I agree that would solve my main issue with academics. I really do like how the academics makes me pass up on some kids who are very talented, but are dumb as a brick. If there are two guys similar in talent level, I'm usually going to go with the guy with the better GPA and/or test scores. I love the calculated risk of going after a few extremely talented less intelligent guys as well.

[Godzilla Blitz]

Eaglesfan, Astrosfan: Thanks for the input! Much appreciated. I think I might wait a patch or two to see some of the remaining rough edges cleaned up, then pick this up.

I must say, though, that after having taken a look at the screen shots, this is a sharp-looking game.

[GrantDawg]

Already, I finally have the time and money to pick this up. Any recommendation on downloads I should get to soup it up before I get started?

[Eaglesfan27]

Already, I finally have the time and money to pick this up. Any recommendation on downloads I should get to soup it up before I get started?I recommend picking up the Pstats 1.5 file that is being done by Icy. I'd also pick up the helmet pack done by him, although there are a few other helmet packs that might be as good. Also, I think it is ixnay that did the bowl logos which I'd recommend picking up. Finally, I forget who did it, but there is a endzone logo pack that is fun as well.

All of these can be found on Greydog's forum, but there is also a link to Icy's work somewhere in this thread.

[GrantDawg]

I recommend picking up the Pstats 1.5 file that is being done by Icy. I'd also pick up the helmet pack done by him, although there are a few other helmet packs that might be as good. Also, I think it is ixnay that did the bowl logos which I'd recommend picking up. Finally, I forget who did it, but there is a endzone logo pack that is fun as well.

All of these can be found on Greydog's forum, but there is also a link to Icy's work somewhere in this thread.
Got 'em. Thanks.

[MizzouRah]

The guy who did the end zone logos, has some nice helmets on his site as well. You'll have a helmet in the top right of the screen and ixnay's logos on the bottom of the screen.

[Eaglesfan27]

After 3 weeks of bidding, I just convinced the best offensive coordinator in my game universe to leave West Virginia and come to USC!!! He is only 40, and he evens runs my preferred offense. :)

Just had to share.

[ThunderingHERD]

Second, the AI (on offense) declined a 5-yard defensive offside penalty and accepted a 5 yard rushing gain, thus taking a 2nd & 5 over a 1st & 5.

Yeh, that's another thing that bugs me. They do that kind of thing all the time.

[Eaglesfan27]

Yeh, that's another thing that bugs me. They do that kind of thing all the time.
I guess I've been lucky, but I've only seen that sort of thing happen once or twice in about 2 dozen games of watching the PbP.

[ThunderingHERD]

I've watched maybe 15 games in total and have seen that or a variation of it (computer not recognizing the value of the down) happen at least a dozen times.

[ThunderingHERD]

From the game I'm watching now:

My computer coach decided to take a run of 6 (2nd & 4) over an offsides penalty (1st & 5) in the first quarter. In the 3rd, my coach decided to give Duke a 4th and 1 at my 25 instead of a 3rd and 18 at the 43. Duke, of course, went for it on 4th down despite being up by 14. They scored a touchdown.

Also, I am inexplicably getting blown out by a bad Duke team.

[MizzouRah]

I would like to manually choose whether or not to accept a penalty or decline it. Not sure if that can be implemented into a patch. :)

[dubb93]

I would like to manually choose whether or not to accept a penalty or decline it. Not sure if that can be implemented into a patch. :)

You get to if you call your plays. The only ones you don't have a choice on are the no brainers such as false start, face mask, and things like holding and piling on during kickoffs/punts.

[MizzouRah]

You get to if you call your plays. The only ones you don't have a choice on are the no brainers such as false start, face mask, and things like holding and piling on during kickoffs/punts.
Ah-ha, thanks. I don't call plays, so that must be it. Would be neat to have an option to call those though.

[MizzouRah]

Eaglesfan, Astrosfan: Thanks for the input! Much appreciated. I think I might wait a patch or two to see some of the remaining rough edges cleaned up, then pick this up.

I must say, though, that after having taken a look at the screen shots, this is a sharp-looking game.
So far, only two games in.. I'm loving this game quite a bit. I've seen a goofy thing or two, but the pbp is so much fun to read and nothing far fetched has happened.

I will say this, the immersion in this game is top notch.. period.

Read some of the dynasties GB, you should really get a good idea from them, especially mine. ;)

[duckman]

One thing that has been annoying me:

Yesterday, I had adjusted my depth chart due to injuries. I moved all of those that were too serious to chance. Anyways, when I went to sim the game, the game said I had a seriously injured player in the split end position. I went to make the changes, but the Save Changes button would not work. I had already saved the game prior to the playing the week, so I reloaded the game and found that my entire depth chart had changed. I got so frustrated that I just stopped playing it for the day.

Tonight, I'll reopen it and fix the changes.

[MizzouRah]

One thing that has been annoying me:

Yesterday, I had adjusted my depth chart due to injuries. I moved all of those that were too serious to chance. Anyways, when I went to sim the game, the game said I had a seriously injured player in the split end position. I went to make the changes, but the Save Changes button would not work. I had already saved the game prior to the playing the week, so I reloaded the game and found that my entire depth chart had changed. I got so frustrated that I just stopped playing it for the day.

Tonight, I'll reopen it and fix the changes.
Are you sure you don't have your coaches doing that on the game setup screen?

[Johnny93g]

I actually havent had any depth chart issues with the game....I play all my games out, but if i have removed them from the depth chart, they havent played, injured or not.

[duckman]

Are you sure you don't have your coaches doing that on the game setup screen?
Yes, I wanted to do all the actions myself. I double checked after it happened. When I reopened the game this morning, the receiver was no longer injured (he was not on my injury list when he suddenly became "injured"). I fixed the depth chart and it has been going good ever since.

*shrug*

[Eaglesfan27]

I actually havent had any depth chart issues with the game....I play all my games out, but if i have removed them from the depth chart, they havent played, injured or not.Before the patch, I had this happen a few times. Since the patch, it hasn't been a problem at all.

[jbmagic]

is the suggestion button for gameplans, calling plays, depth chart, etc based on your own coach ratings or overall AI opinion?

[hoopsguy]

Had a moment just now that nearly had me jump out of my chair:


Florida ball, Q4, 1-10-FLO48 (00:11) 26-28
Offense: Short Pass, Set: Pro Set, Play: PS-TE-rollout-SE-in
Defense: Stop Pass, Set: 3-4, Play: 34-pass-MZ
QB T. Reed completes a 15 yard in to WR D. Williams (CB B. Guliford, SS J. Holmes).

Florida ball, Q4, 1-10-FLO48 (00:05) 26-28
Offense: Short Pass, Set: Pro Set, Play: PS-TE-rollout-SE-in
Defense: Stop Pass, Set: 3-4, Play: 34-pass-MZ
The QB spikes the ball to stop the clock!

Florida ball, Q4, 2-10-USC37 (00:02) 26-28
Eric Scott misses the 55 yard field goal. It will be Southern Cal ball at the USC 37


Florida had no timeouts. They get a 15 yard pass play that doesn't go out of bounds, run up and stop the clock all in the space of nine seconds? I call bullshit. This was a playoff game - if we had lost on a 55 yard FG I would have been about as mad as I can be over a computer game while still being a someone rational person.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Hoopsguy -- Is that a cut-and-paste straight from the pbp file or did you type that? Because the LOS is wrong on the spike play (the way it reads, the 15 yd gain doesn't come until after the spike).

[Eaglesfan27]

Hoopsguy -- Is that a cut-and-paste straight from the pbp file or did you type that? Because the LOS is wrong on the spike play (the way it reads, the 15 yd gain doesn't come until after the spike).
I think the display appearance of both timeouts and spikes are wrong in the PbP sometimes. As far as that play goes, maybe the guys moving the chains were really fat and slow? ;)

[sooner333]

Had a moment just now that nearly had me jump out of my chair:



Florida had no timeouts. They get a 15 yard pass play that doesn't go out of bounds, run up and stop the clock all in the space of nine seconds? I call bullshit. This was a playoff game - if we had lost on a 55 yard FG I would have been about as mad as I can be over a computer game while still being a someone rational person.

In college football the clock stops at the completion of a play that results in a first down. Six seconds does seem like a short time, and it probably is a second or two short, but still, you get the quick strike in five or six seconds, and sometimes they are pretty slow on restarting the clock back up, waiting until everything is ready on the sidelines before blowing the whistle...it can usually be spiked about a second after that whistle blows to restart the clock, if everyone gets to the line (which usually can happen if its not way down the field.

[MizzouRah]

In college football the clock stops at the completion of a play that results in a first down. Six seconds does seem like a short time, and it probably is a second or two short, but still, you get the quick strike in five or six seconds, and sometimes they are pretty slow on restarting the clock back up, waiting until everything is ready on the sidelines before blowing the whistle...it can usually be spiked about a second after that whistle blows to restart the clock, if everyone gets to the line (which usually can happen if its not way down the field.
Correct, good call.

[WSUCougar]

Enjoying my season coaching the New Mexico Lobos, but here's a few more noted issues:

> QB rolled away from presure and threw an incomplete pass that sailed high (long PBP description), but the result was a 9-yard loss.

> My reserve center who played one game and gave up a sack as his only stat was named 3rd team all conference

> #2 Florida was a 16-point favorite over #1 Wisconsin in the championship game (and lost)

> My staff's ratings are different colors depending upon which screen you look at (staff screen or coach hire/fire screen).

Having fun, though! :)

[MrBug708]

Im still trying to figure out how transfers work. Im in 2012, as Florida State, and I've never had one kid with an interest higher then low.

[hoopsguy]

Jon - cut and paste
Eagles - no timeouts. Trust me, given the importance of the game I was positive about the timeout situation. They had to burn them to get the ball back.
Sooner - great point, and I didn't even think of that as I've been watching a lot more pro football than college lately. Upon further review perhaps my beef was not as serious as originally thought.

We got hosed by Michigan in the next game, anyways :( Have now lost to the champs in 3 of our 4 playoffs.

[Eaglesfan27]

I was answering the issue that Jon brought up when I talked about the display of timeouts and spikes being incorrect sometimes in that they are listed in the wrong location relative to the play.

As far as what happened in your situation, I was implying the same thing as Sooner. Hence, the comment about the chain guys being slow and fat which would give the team time to get up there and spike the ball as soon as the clock was re-started. I guess Sooner's answer was much more helpful ;)

[Eaglesfan27]

Dola -

Was it wrong that while I was sitting at a REALLY boring dinner with my in-laws, I was dreaming up game plans for my next game in BBCF?

[MizzouRah]

Dola -

Was it wrong that while I was sitting at a REALLY boring dinner with my in-laws, I was dreaming up game plans for my next game in BBCF?
Not at all. I'm finally home and once we get everything unloaded and put away, BBCF it is. :)

[Eaglesfan27]

Not at all. I'm finally home and once we get everything unloaded and put away, BBCF it is. :)
I just finished putting everything away, and am firing it up now :)

[MizzouRah]

I just finished putting everything away, and am firing it up now :)
Lucky base-tard. ;) Coming honey.....

[Arles]

Tim - if this is really the case I think people playing smaller schools are going to find it very hard to keep players active.
One thing to remember is that lower talented players tend to be smarter (like real life). Sky Dog has posted a few times on his low prestige teams on this and lower prestige teams shouldn't have that many academics issues.

[miked]

Man, I'm so into this now. I just took Rutgers and am off to a 6-2 start including an upset win at #20 Syracuse. It's the first time in a while I jumped up and down after winning a game. Very strange. Love the game.

Gonna be a tough few seasons after this as my 4.5* QB (65%, 2500, 18/2) is about to graduate. But I took a chance and redshirted my 1.5/5 RB, so next year might be a new plan. Oh yeah, I have like the #30 ranked offense and #100 ranked defense. Guess where I'm recruiting...

[miked]

Gonna have to start a dynasty thread. Finished 8-4 (5-2) with a 2nd place Big East performance. QB was 3rd team All-American and defeated #13 USC in the Insight Bowl. Getting into this game (helps when you are winning).

What was pretty retarded was that my performance was graded a C and expectations was a B, when my program just didn't want me to embarass the program and not finish last.

[Eaglesfan27]

I'm very into this game too (which is obvious from several threads.) Where do you see how your performance was graded?

[TazFTW]

I'm very into this game too (which is obvious from several threads.) Where do you see how your performance was graded?When you finish the post season, there is a report card looking thing.

[edit]It appears when you advance to the next stage and you can see it during the job offers part.

[BuffaloHuskey]

Is the QB rating calculated differently than in the pros. My crappy QB was geting ratings in the 120-130 range but completed less than 50% of passes and threw as many picks as td's?

[ThunderingHERD]

Gonna have to start a dynasty thread. Finished 8-4 (5-2) with a 2nd place Big East performance. QB was 3rd team All-American and defeated #13 USC in the Insight Bowl. Getting into this game (helps when you are winning).

Have funning losing 5+ for the next 5 years despite fielding teams that get better and better.

[Eaglesfan27]

Is the QB rating calculated differently than in the pros. My crappy QB was geting ratings in the 120-130 range but completed less than 50% of passes and threw as many picks as td's?
Yes, I don't know the formula offhand, but it is significantly different from the pro's. 110-120 is an average rating and 140-150 is considered good, imo.

[Eaglesfan27]

Dola -

Vince Young has a 168.6 QB rating this year and most of the elite QB's have a rating over 150.

[bhlloy]

What was pretty retarded was that my performance was graded a C and expectations was a B, when my program just didn't want me to embarass the program and not finish last.

Yeah, my first year I finished 5-6 with a conference mark of 4-4, and got graded a D for performance and D for expectations, and I got the "don't embarrass us and don't lose heavily to Air Force" expectation at the start of the year. I even beat Air Force and finished fourth in the conference and still got graded a D.

Conversely, in a game with USC in the demo I was expected to finish top 10, and I think I went 9-3 and went to a minor bowl (ranked around #18-20), and got B performance and C expectations.

Performance I guess is graded on an absolute scale (win the national title get an A+, go 0-11 and get an E) but I have absolutely no idea what expectations is graded on.

[bhlloy]

DOLA - the other wierd thing is for "prestige" I was rated a B, but i think my prestige went down a couple of points. What is the prestige grade for?

[Galaril]

Yeah, my first year I finished 5-6 with a conference mark of 4-4, and got graded a D for performance and D for expectations, and I got the "don't embarrass us and don't lose heavily to Air Force" expectation at the start of the year. I even beat Air Force and finished fourth in the conference and still got graded a D.

Conversely, in a game with USC in the demo I was expected to finish top 10, and I think I went 9-3 and went to a minor bowl (ranked around #18-20), and got B performance and C expectations.

Performance I guess is graded on an absolute scale (win the national title get an A+, go 0-11 and get an E) but I have absolutely no idea what expectations is graded on.


I noticed that teams usually have the expectation to win a few conference games and don't get embaraassed against the rival" not much selection.

[Godzilla Blitz]

So far, only two games in.. I'm loving this game quite a bit. I've seen a goofy thing or two, but the pbp is so much fun to read and nothing far fetched has happened.

I will say this, the immersion in this game is top notch.. period.

Read some of the dynasties GB, you should really get a good idea from them, especially mine. ;)
Thanks. Yup, I've been reading your and EaglesFan's dynasties. They definitely have helped get a better feel for the game.

The game is definitely on my "to-buy" list. I'm going to wait a bit for the little things to get cleaned up, though, and wait for the playoff bracket improvement as well.

I'm not in any hurry, and I've had better luck with text-sims when I wait for things to get polished before starting a long game. I tend to over analyze games; I don't want to get into my "bug-finding/reporting" mode, which ends up feeling more like work to me. I just want to play and have fun, and that's easier for me to do when a lot of the little glitches are gone.

I must say, though, that I am excited about digging in. Somewhere in my head I had the impression that only Solecismic could make a solid football text-sim, and I am pleasanly surprised to see that I appear to have been wrong.

[jbmagic]

i hope all the play by play glitches gets fix soon in BBCF. Because TPF still has them after patch 1.43.

[MizzouRah]

Thanks. Yup, I've been reading your and EaglesFan's dynasties. They definitely have helped get a better feel for the game.

The game is definitely on my "to-buy" list. I'm going to wait a bit for the little things to get cleaned up, though, and wait for the playoff bracket improvement as well.

I'm not in any hurry, and I've had better luck with text-sims when I wait for things to get polished before starting a long game. I tend to over analyze games; I don't want to get into my "bug-finding/reporting" mode, which ends up feeling more like work to me. I just want to play and have fun, and that's easier for me to do when a lot of the little glitches are gone.

I must say, though, that I am excited about digging in. Somewhere in my head I had the impression that only Solecismic could make a solid football text-sim, and I am pleasanly surprised to see that I appear to have been wrong.
Smart move. I waited until 1.03 myself before digging in. :)

[GrantDawg]

I haven't been able to spend a whole lot of time with it so far, but here's my problems so far:

1) I thought we had an option to skip through the first year? I didn't see that option.

2) Why do the coaches refuse to recognize injuries? They still want to start players listed "doubtfull" when there are other players readily available. It is the most severe on special teams where it is much harder to know who should replace whom on the screen (I hate the special teams line up screen).

[ScottVib]

I haven't been able to spend a whole lot of time with it so far, but here's my problems so far:

1) I thought we had an option to skip through the first year? I didn't see that option.

Under the options menu you can either choose sim full season or sim multiple seasons.

[MizzouRah]

I haven't been able to spend a whole lot of time with it so far, but here's my problems so far:

1) I thought we had an option to skip through the first year? I didn't see that option.

2) Why do the coaches refuse to recognize injuries? They still want to start players listed "doubtfull" when there are other players readily available. It is the most severe on special teams where it is much harder to know who should replace whom on the screen (I hate the special teams line up screen).
Drag your injured guys to the last position on each position he's listed on, click to lock them, then hit suggest. After that, I right click on my injured player which takes him out of the game for that particular position.

[GrantDawg]

Drag your injured guys to the last position on each position he's listed on, click to lock them, then hit suggest. After that, I right click on my injured player which takes him out of the game for that particular position.

Thanks for the tip, but that still needs to be fixed. Is the AI starting "doubtfull" listed players on other teams?

[MizzouRah]

My first "bug"

North Texas ball, Q2, 3-10-TROY17 (01:14) 13-7
Offense: Long Pass, Set: Pro Set, Play: PS-RB-cross-FB-str
Defense: Stop Pass, Set: 3-4, Play: 34-run-Man-B5,7
QB C. Holmes scrambles out of the pocket and gets sacked for a 9 yard loss (ILB N. Brinker).

North Texas ball, Q2, 4-2-TROY9 (01:04) 13-7
Marcus Barlow has his 27 yard field goal blocked by Greg Semple! The ball is recovered by
Steve Bacon (TROY) at the TROY 18. He returns it to Troy 23 for 5 yards.


It said he was sacked, gained 8 yards (pbp) on the play, but he was actually sacked for a 9 yard loss and the ball should have been on my 26 yard line.

[GrantDawg]

Under the options menu you can either choose sim full season or sim multiple seasons.

Ummmmm....where? The options menu once you start the league doesn't have it, and you can't open the options menu in "Create League."

[GrantDawg]

Never mind. Found it. It would be nice if it where on the league setup page.

[GrantDawg]

Well, that just sucks. I'm waiting 30 minutes for the stupid thing to sim through the season, and it sims right through the hiring and recruiting process. So I'm supposed to sit there and wait forever for it to get through the bowl games and then stop it right before it begins the off-season just so I can have a realistic game? Well, this one is finished for me.

[Arles]

Well, that just sucks. I'm waiting 30 minutes for the stupid thing to sim through the season, and it sims right through the hiring and recruiting process. So I'm supposed to sit there and wait forever for it to get through the bowl games and then stop it right before it begins the off-season just so I can have a realistic game? Well, this one is finished for me.
Advance to the season and click "Sim Season" on the weekly schedule screen. That will sim weeks 1 to 15. Once that is finished, you can click "Sim Postseason" and the full season will be complete. Then, all you need to do is click the "Advance" button on the main checklist screen to go to week one of the offseason.

[I. J. Reilly]

Has anyone done much experimenting with the off-season training values? Like how much time is needed for each position. Also, has anyone determined the benefit for adaptability beyond position changes? Does adaptability make players more effective when they are playing out of position, like a backup OLB moving inside when a starter goes down? I’ve only played a few seasons so far and am still just guessing about most of this stuff, any observations from others would be appreciated.

[MizzouRah]

Anyway when going to the recruit watch screen to have it default to sort by interest instead of overall rating? I really could care less who's the top talent as my first concern is who's interested in coming to my school. Everytime I go into the screen after a game, it defaults to talent instead of interest.

[TazFTW]

Anyway when going to the recruit watch screen to have it default to sort by interest instead of overall rating? I really could care less who's the top talent as my first concern is who's interested in coming to my school. Everytime I go into the screen after a game, it defaults to talent instead of interest.
From what I have seen, their interest never changes during the season.

[MrBug708]

I just had a freshmen QB win the Heisman. We are going into the ACC championship game undefeated. About time too as I was slowly losing it....

[MrBug708]

Oh and Im in 2013 and I dont ever see any transfers

[rexallllsc]

Anyway when going to the recruit watch screen to have it default to sort by interest instead of overall rating? I really could care less who's the top talent as my first concern is who's interested in coming to my school. Everytime I go into the screen after a game, it defaults to talent instead of interest.

Does it even help to monitor this stuff? Or can you just check it once the recruiting starts?

[ThunderingHERD]

Does it even help to monitor this stuff? Or can you just check it once the recruiting starts?

I never check it out. It always seems like the interest drastically changes once the offseason starts anyway.

[DaddyTorgo]

Advance to the season and click "Sim Season" on the weekly schedule screen. That will sim weeks 1 to 15. Once that is finished, you can click "Sim Postseason" and the full season will be complete. Then, all you need to do is click the "Advance" button on the main checklist screen to go to week one of the offseason.
what Arles said. And really...even if you had to sit there and wait...to put down a perfectly good game because of that...well I guess your time must be HUGELY valuable then. Damm.

[Easy Mac]

ok....

[GrantDawg]

what Arles said. And really...even if you had to sit there and wait...to put down a perfectly good game because of that...well I guess your time must be HUGELY valuable then. Damm.
You know, funny thing but it is. It is the most valuable thing any of us have. On top of that, I don't particularly like wasting it. There are plenty of enjoyable games on my computer I can be playing. I would like to include this one, but so far it hasn't gotten there. There is no way any game is worth sitting and watching it do nothing for 25-30 minutes to just stop it so you can play the game like it should have been set up in the first place. Even considering Arles' fix, I'm wondering if it is worth the 20 minutes of nothing time to get started. If this was Football Pro on a 286AT it would be one thing, but this is a text sim on a Pentium 4 3.0 HT with a gig of memory. There really is something not right about this game being so stinking slow.

[Arles]

To sim from week 1 to week 1 takes about 25 minutes on most systems (maybe less on yours).

In your case, to sim weeks 1-15 takes about 12 minutes. The postseason would take about 2 minutes and the advance to the offseason would take another 2 minutes. So, click sim regular season on the weekly schedule screen, go get a drink and a sandwich. Come back 10 minutes later and click "sim postseason". Open up FOFC and find a thread you like (about 2 minutes). Finally, click advance to go to the offseason and two minutes later you are right where you wanted to be. Click "Save" and you can continue to play or do something else.

[Eaglesfan27]

Hmmmmm.. a sandwich. Perhaps that will dull the sting of another USC loss (in BBCF) :(

[MizzouRah]

Does it even help to monitor this stuff? Or can you just check it once the recruiting starts?
Well, it gives me an idea on whom I'm going to go after. I just think it should default to most interested on down, not how good the athlete is. Purely cosmetic and annoying. :)

[ThunderingHERD]

Jesus fucking christ. On week 16 of recruiting I get stuck on a "Would you like to take teh following recruiting actions?" popup. It will highlight yes or no when I scroll over them, but neither button works. Can't click anywhere else on the screen. Any ideas, or did I just lose another 2 hours?

[ThunderingHERD]

So I was able to get rid of that window by right clicking BBCF in the task bar, minimizing it, then maximizing it. Of course, the first thing I do when I get it back up is save the game. Only it's been frozen on "Saving Game 0%" for 5 minutes now. Can't play the game through without worrying about it crashing and can't save without the same...

[ThunderingHERD]

Ok, as a break from bitching, I'll offer something useful. It appears that for whatever reason the game just wasn't doing any operations when it was in the foreground. When I minimized it the first time, then popped it back up, the window was gone. For the save thing, it wouldn't minimize from the task bar, so I went into task manager and minimized it from there. When I popped it back up a few seconds later it was at 100% save, but wouldn't budge from there. Minimized again, popped up again, and the save game popup was gone and I could navigate the game again.

[MizzouRah]

Might have been mentioned, but FGs need to be toned down, at least for my 1/4 rated kicker (using 1-20 scale) who makes a ton of FGs - some 40+ range.

[Poli]

I think I had a horrible kicker in the demo mode make a 59 yarder.

[ThunderingHERD]

Agreed, far too many long kicks.

[Easy Mac]

I mentioned the kicker thing about 5 or so pages back. Hadn't heard anything about toning it down.

[MizzouRah]

I mentioned the kicker thing about 5 or so pages back. Hadn't heard anything about toning it down.
I think Arlie knows about it... Louisana-Laf's kicker just nailed a 51 yarder - no friggin way.

..and does some if the AI's suggestions for depth charts seem goofy? I know we can do our own, but I've noticed the AI making some weird lineups.

[Eaglesfan27]

Yeah, I still think the kickers need to be fine-tuned (punters too)

Also, I'm wondering if it could possibly be changed so that the clear action button isn't required to add a pitch to the recruit. I just had to clear about 40 recruit's actions so I could add pitches to them.

I understand that it was probably designed that way so that people don't accidently add a pitch to a recruit, but maybe something else could be done?

[QuikSand]

So, I'm late to the party (as is often the case). Just getting this fired up, after giving up fairly quickly on the beta demo.


Anyway -- I have started up a career with Kent State (fairly randomly selected lousy school in smallish conference). My initial expectations were to finish 7th of 7 teams, and my AD asked that we just "try not to embarass the program." That's what I'm looking for -- basically empty cupboard.

My first season, rather than get too deep into gameplanning and such, I just let my staff (and they are horrible, too) take everything over... and I basically QuikSimmed the entire first year. The result? An 8-4 regular season, a solid second place in our side of the MAC, a big win in a minor bowl game, and we end the season among the "others receiving votes" in the Top 25 polls. Wha???

So, I am into season two, after bumbling through a recruiting class not getting anyone of any serious significance, and our expectations are right back at the cellar. And so far, still without much input from me, we are off to a 5-1 start and actually look like a good team, with my top RB among the national leaders.


Is this happening to other people, too? Have I missed some setting somewhere that has my game set to "kindergarten" level? Is my team the beneficiary of some sort of in-game cheating to give me inflated results?

I'm looking for a project, where I need to do a lot of building to get to respectability. If we can go win bowl games with a roster full of stiffs, why bother actualy getting any good players?

(Incidentally, this follows an earlier career where I aw much the same thing in one QuikSim season with Navy, where that team went 8-3 and won a decent bowl game, after being picked to struggle also)



Sorry if this has been brought up already and resolved in the hundreds of preceding posts... I started to wade, but didn't see anything along these lines, really. I'll keep looking, and if I see this issue raised, I'll delete my post and just offer an echo instead.

[Ben E Lou]

So, I'm late to the party (as is often the case). Just getting this fired up, after giving up fairly quickly on the beta demo.


Anyway -- I have started up a career with Kent State (fairly randomly selected lousy school in smallish conference). My initial expectations were to finish 7th of 7 teams, and my AD asked that we just "try not to embarass the program." That's what I'm looking for -- basically empty cupboard.

My first season, rather than get too deep into gameplanning and such, I just let my staff (and they are horrible, too) take everything over... and I basically QuikSimmed the entire first year. The result? An 8-4 regular season, a solid second place in our side of the MAC, a big win in a minor bowl game, and we end the season among the "others receiving votes" in the Top 25 polls. Wha???

So, I am into season two, after bumbling through a recruiting class not getting anyone of any serious significance, and our expectations are right back at the cellar. And so far, still without much input from me, we are off to a 5-1 start and actually look like a good team, with my top RB among the national leaders.


Is this happening to other people, too? Have I missed some setting somewhere that has my game set to "kindergarten" level? Is my team the beneficiary of some sort of in-game cheating to give me inflated results?

I'm looking for a project, where I need to do a lot of building to get to respectability. If we can go win bowl games with a roster full of stiffs, why bother actualy getting any good players?

(Incidentally, this follows an earlier career where I aw much the same thing in one QuikSim season with Navy, where that team went 8-3 and won a decent bowl game, after being picked to struggle also)



Sorry if this has been brought up already and resolved in the hundreds of preceding posts... I started to wade, but didn't see anything along these lines, really. I'll keep looking, and if I see this issue raised, I'll delete my post and just offer an echo instead.I haven't seen this issue raised, but here's my take on it: initial starts have a tendency to be a little too random, and your "expectations" are based on Prestige, not your talent. I've done tons of gamestarts, and have noticed this at times, too. If you get a few good players in key positions, you'll have a season or two of playing above your Prestige level. However, the good news is that Prestige rises *much* more slowly than in TCY or even FBCB, meaning your first few recuit classes should be of pretty low caliber no matter what. Combine that with the very high potential for scout error that you'll have with your bad coaches, and I'd be very surprised if you're not in/near the cellar once you graduate a few key players.

[QuikSand]

I haven't seen this issue raised, but here's my take on it: initial starts have a tendency to be a little too random, and your "expectations" are based on Prestige, not your talent. I've done tons of gamestarts, and have noticed this at times, too. If you get a few good players in key positions, you'll have a season or two of playing above your Prestige level. However, the good news is that Prestige rises *much* more slowly than in TCY or even FBCB, meaning your first few recuit classes should be of pretty low caliber no matter what. Combine that with the very high potential for scout error that you'll have with your bad coaches, and I'd be very surprised if you're not in/near the cellar once you graduate a few key players.

Thanks... exactly what I was hoping to hear.

[Bee]

I haven't seen this issue raised, but here's my take on it: initial starts have a tendency to be a little too random, and your "expectations" are based on Prestige, not your talent. I've done tons of gamestarts, and have noticed this at times, too. If you get a few good players in key positions, you'll have a season or two of playing above your Prestige level. However, the good news is that Prestige rises *much* more slowly than in TCY or even FBCB, meaning your first few recuit classes should be of pretty low caliber no matter what. Combine that with the very high potential for scout error that you'll have with your bad coaches, and I'd be very surprised if you're not in/near the cellar once you graduate a few key players.

My experience over 3-4 careers before shelving the latest version was similar to Quiksand and I attribute it to what I see as too much parity in the game. Perhaps the very top teams have considerably more talent (I never played a top team), but the starting talent difference between a borderline top 25 team and a bottom feeder is very little in every career I've started. Perhaps after 4-5 years this levels out due to recruiting, but I haven't had the patience to test it out.

[QuikSand]

Regrettably, I am finding this thread to be very difficult to get much from... the first few pages all seem to be full of complaints that may or may not have been patched since then. It's tough going to try to get any insight into the game this way, really.

Maybe I should just try reading a couple of dynasty threads... this is really tedious.

[QuikSand]

Incidentally, in my first two years at Kent State:

2005: projected to finish last, finished 2nd at 8-4, won bowl game
2006: projected to finish 5th, finished 2nd at 8-4, lost bowl game

...and in both seasons, I got low marks for "performance." In 2006, I was awarded a D for our effort that put this miserable team into the Top 35 nationally for the second straight year. Nice. Maybe they will fire me for doing such a lousy job.

[Ben E Lou]

Incidentally, in my first two years at Kent State:

2005: projected to finish last, finished 2nd at 8-4, won bowl game
2006: projected to finish 5th, finished 2nd at 8-4, lost bowl game

...and in both seasons, I got low marks for "performance." In 2006, I was awarded a D for our effort that put this miserable team into the Top 35 nationally for the second straight year. Nice. Maybe they will fire me for doing such a lousy job.I'm not sure I like it, but the "Performance" grade is based on an absolute: only the national champ gets an A+, I think, and grades drop pretty quickly from there.

With regard to reading this thread, Quik, I'd check at GreyDog for when the 1.03 patch was released, and start reading at that point. A large number of posts up to then were bug-related.

[Arles]

I'm not sure I like it, but the "Performance" grade is based on an absolute: only the national champ gets an A+, I think, and grades drop pretty quickly from there.

With regard to reading this thread, Quik, I'd check at GreyDog for when the 1.03 patch was released, and start reading at that point. A large number of posts up to then were bug-related.
Performance is absolute, as is recruiting and talent. The "board" and "prestige" grades are the ones to look at for grading on a scale.

The problem with some initial talent bases is the wide ranges in prestige for some of the conferences. A team like Buffalo or Akron is 15-20 points lower than a team like Bowling Green. So, if one of the better teams (Miami (OH), Kent, BG) get a decent initial roster, they will probably run away with the division for the first year or two. But, they will probably be playing schedule strengths in the 90+ range. Plus, given their initial prestige in the 35-40 range, their board expectations will be pretty low.

All that said, I am going to look at toning down the starting talent for the teams with prestige in the 30-45 range. There is a chance they could get a few 65-75 rated players that can really throw off the balance if they are in key spots. I should probably just remove that chance to keep these teams where they are expected to be.

[miked]

Yeah, I took RU to a win in the Insight Bowl over #13 USC and got a C for performance...even better, I just got a B for expectations...hilarious considering my board asked me not to finish last and get embarrassed by Syracuse (a ranked team that I beat). The grades make no sense, I hope they aren't actually used for anything.

[Ben E Lou]

Plus, given their initial prestige in the 35-40 range, their board expectations will be pretty low....and therein lies another issue that just hit me: expectations should be relative to conference strength, not absolute. Vandy's current 46 prestige in my career is well below most of the SEC, yet the board is talking about finishing around .500 in the conference. They should be "avoid finishing last in the SEC," or "win two conference games" or something more reasonable, considering they're by a good margin dead last in Prestige in their conference. I'm assuming that the .500 conference expectation for Vandy is based on their middle-of-the-road-OVERALL prestige. Similarly, the highest-prestige teams in weak conferences should be expected to compete for the conference championship.

[MizzouRah]

I guess I'm glad I took Troy then, we stink. :)

[QuikSand]

I'm not sure I like it, but the "Performance" grade is based on an absolute: only the national champ gets an A+, I think, and grades drop pretty quickly from there.

I guess that explains it, but it seems just absurd. Is there any circumstance where a team going 8-5 should get a D for performance?

I really don't care about such window dressing... but that doesn't make any sense to me.

[MrBug708]

I think that if RL USC went 8-5, they'd probably get a D

[Poli]

I don't like all the NFL last names I keep seeing.

How many Wychecks or Sikahemas are playing collegiate football right now?

[Arles]

I guess that explains it, but it seems just absurd. Is there any circumstance where a team going 8-5 should get a D for performance?
It's a combination of where you rank on the computer, media and coaches polls. It looks like the C is a little too tight and should be extended. But, falling in the 70-100 range should earn a D. I will probably tweak this though as there's a chance you could be a D if you in the 60s with a poor SOS.

[Arles]

From reading this thread, it seems that team expectations and the polls need to be looked at, as well as a tweak to the initial talent pool. All three of these are on my 1.1 list now.

[Tim Tellean]

could you add a ham and cheese on rye with grey poupon to the list for 1.1.
thanks

[SFL Cat]

I noticed a big difference when you actually play a game as oppossed to sim a game. As FAU, I scheduled Florida for my first game...when I actually played the game the score was something like 48-0 midway through the third quarter. We played them tough for the first few series of the game, and the Owls moved the ball pretty well on our first drive (we ended up fumbling in Florida territory), but after that the Gators just started to dominate us and we simply couldn't hold on to the football (4 turnovers). I had to to go out before finishing the game, so I thought I saved it in progress. However, when I restarted, the game was back at the beginning of week 1, so this time I just simmed the game. Florida still won, but the score was something like 27-13...much closer.

[Toddzilla]

From reading this thread, it seems that team expectations and the polls need to be looked at, as well as a tweak to the initial talent pool. All three of these are on my 1.1 list now.

Hooray! My thoughts on the polls are well documented, so this is fantastic news. Still enjoying the daylights out of this game!

[digamma]

A quick question......I've had 5 players transfer away so far....Each player was a freshman who redshirted, with skills ranging around 50 current, and 75 potential....These are all players i pegged as future stars, who were behind pretty talented vetarns. Im now afraid to redshirt any freshman with a nice potential for fear of a transfer. Meanwhile, Miami is recruiting QB's like crazy. They have last years #1 QB, and this year's number 2, and number 3. Last year's #1 redshirted, and was a 76/85......seems like he would be more likely to transfer. Are other people having this problem....I actually wouldnt call it a problem, more of an annoyance.

Im also having a difficult time getting anyone to transfer here....I have a huge recruiting budget, so i offer a few transfer's each year.....noone has any interest in coming to Notre Dame. Maybe that needs to be adjusted. My prestige is 74, so id assume thats pretty high. Great game
Revisiting this issue. I usually lose one RS freshman a year or so as a transfer. I haven't tracked it to see if it correlates to guys who had playing time as very important in their recruitment. Anyone else looked at this?

I like the transfer feature, but I wish there was a way for me to have a shot to convince my guy to stay.

I think the redshirt is a valuable tool in college football, but like Johnny, I might be getting trigger shy to use it, if it is going to frustrate my players.

[digamma]

Dola...

On the transfer bidding screen, it doesn't seem that I can sort by School to quickly monitor my players who are seeking transfers.

[SFL Cat]

Does anyone know off the top of their head what the number of transefers per year for a Div I program would be considered average?

[MrBug708]

2-5 probably, but none of them would be 5 star potential.

[digamma]

2-5 probably, but none of them would be 5 star potential.
That might be a tad high...I'd put it in the 1-3 range, but I agree with Bug that there are too many high profile guys transferring. I'd say there are probably 10-20 high profile transfers a year in college football (maybe I'm underestimating), and in my current dynasty transfer list there are 50 guys at 4.0 potential or better looking to transfer.

[Bee]

I'm guessing the transfer rate in the game is probably low, but most of the guys who transfer are fringe guys going to smaller schools (often non DI schools). Believe me, it's an eye opener when you were a stud in high school and then go to a Div. I college and find out you ain't all that. :D

[digamma]

I'm guessing the transfer rate in the game is probably low, but most of the guys who transfer are fringe guys going to smaller schools (often non DI schools). Believe me, it's an eye opener when you were a stud in high school and then go to a Div. I college and find out you ain't all that. :D
I agree with you. There is a ton of attrition amongst college football recruiting classes, and you're exactly right that it is mostly fringe guys who realize they are going to be practice players for four years, or guys who can't make grades after a year or two. The Brock Berlin/Brent Schaeffer type transfers should be fairly less common.

[rjolley]

Very long thread here, so I'll just ask...is there a way to view emails while going to other screens? I remember seeing this mentioned and the way around it was to print the email to a file, but was this fixed in game?

If not, is it planned?