Joey Harrington finally shipped to Miami [Archive]

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:09 PM

a sixth round pick is pretty bad. it's like we'll take a guy that has a 90% chance of never playing an nfl game for harrington.

The Lions didn't have a choice. Joey had his tiny brain set on Miami, and there was nothing that the Lions could do about it since Joey could refuse to renegotiate his contract somewhere else.

It's actually a miracle that Miami even gave the Lions anything, since Detroit would have had to cut him on June 15th anyway. The only reason Miami did the trade was to get Joey's sorry ass in mini-camp.

QuikSand

05-12-2006, 02:10 PM

rkmsuf

05-12-2006, 02:11 PM

A pretty bad job by the Lions to me. They did a horrible job positioning this guy regardless of their internal evaluation.

wade moore

05-12-2006, 02:11 PM

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:12 PM

I wouldn't bet on Culpepper being the starter for the next five years.

I wouldn't count on Harrington being more than a spot starter and career back-up. I watched every single game he's ever played, and yes, the talent around him has been poor, but he constantly makes bad decisions, gets too impatient in the pocket, and has terrible accuracy (see his career 54% completion % as proof).

cthomer5000

05-12-2006, 02:13 PM

I cannot possibly find fault with this move from the Dolphins perspective.

rkmsuf

05-12-2006, 02:13 PM

The Lions didn't have a choice. Joey had his tiny brain set on Miami, and there was nothing that the Lions could do about it since Joey could refuse to renegotiate his contract somewhere else.

It's actually a miracle that Miami even gave the Lions anything, since Detroit would have had to cut him on June 15th anyway. The only reason Miami did the trade was to get Joey's sorry ass in mini-camp.

True but I think this stems from prior years. The Lions never stuck up for this guy even if they only did it to increase his market. His stats are almost the same as Carr.

Just your sorry ass comment speaks to what has been proliferated about the guy.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:15 PM

I have no idea if there's anything that can be reclaimed from this guy... but it certainly does seem that the spite he gets is out of proportion. I know, he singlehandedly hurt all the receivers and everything, and he probably was in cahoots with Maurice Clarett (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?t=12430) in his many misdeeds, but really now.

There reason he gets so much heat now, is because he's a quitter. Marinelli and Martz told him that he was the starter and were looking forward to meeting with him. Then Harrington came to QB camp, didn't pay attention, sulked, and generally acted like a douche. Then he asked for a trade.

Maybe we are being spiteful, but after all we've dealt with as Lion fans, I don't think people understand the frustration. The Lions have won 1 playoff game since 1956. One.

Desnudo

05-12-2006, 02:16 PM

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/14565048.htm

Joey quicky decided on Miami, refusing to negotiate with anyone else, when they promised a lifetime supply of strawberries and champagne as a part of his contract.

Goodbye Joey. Have fun sitting behind Culpepper for the next 5 years.

I'm sure sleeping on a large pile of money with many beautiful women in a tropical city will cushion the blow a little.

sovereignstar

05-12-2006, 02:16 PM

albionmoonlight

05-12-2006, 02:16 PM

A pretty bad job by the Lions to me. They did a horrible job positioning this guy regardless of their internal evaluation.

Yup. David Carr and Joey Harrington are both highly drafted quarterbacks who went to sucky teams that have been managed poorly--making it hard to know how good they really are. The big difference between them, from what I can see, is that the Texans have not gone out of their way to say that Carr sucks. Which means that if/when they have to trade him, his value should be higher than Harrington's.

Butter

05-12-2006, 02:17 PM

Maybe we are being spiteful, but after all we've dealt with as Lion fans, I don't think people understand the frustration. The Lions have won 1 playoff game since 1956. One.

Yep, there are no other bad teams out there that people root for.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:19 PM

I'm sure sleeping on a large pile of money with many beautiful women in a tropical city will cushion the blow a little.

I think that fulfilled his entire set of goals in the NFL. :)

seriously, I'm bitter, but if he can succeed, more power to him. I'm not going to root against the guy, I just think he's capable of being nothing more than a Ty Detmer type of back-up without the leadership skills.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:21 PM

Yep, there are no other bad teams out there that people root for.

Not in the NFL as far as length of futility.

Besides, I'm not saying people can't feel the same way about their teams, or not feel that way. I'm just saying how I feel.

My grandpa went 50 years hoping that the Lions would win again but they never did. The only teams that could relate are the Cubs, Red Sox (until 2004), and maybe the Blackhawks. I'm sure there are others, but that's all I can think of right now.

GoSeahawks

05-12-2006, 02:22 PM

I have no problem with Harrington wanting out of Detroit. If I worked at a job where everyone hated me I wouldn't want to stay.

wade moore

05-12-2006, 02:23 PM

I think that fulfilled his entire set of goals in the NFL. :)

seriously, I'm bitter, but if he can succeed, more power to him. I'm not going to root against the guy, I just think he's capable of being more than a Ty Detmer type of back-up without the leadership skills.

Which, even if that is all he is, is a decent pickup for a 6th round pick.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:24 PM

Which, even if that is all he is, is a decent pickup for a 6th round pick.

I suppose.

Desnudo

05-12-2006, 02:25 PM

I think that fulfilled his entire set of goals in the NFL. :)

seriously, I'm bitter, but if he can succeed, more power to him. I'm not going to root against the guy, I just think he's capable of being more than a Ty Detmer type of back-up without the leadership skills.

It's certainly possible. I'm sure there's a lot of guys in the NFL doing it purely for the paycheck/women/fame rather than the game. Maybe he's one of them.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:25 PM

Which, even if that is all he is, is a decent pickup for a 6th round pick.

By the way, I meant "nothing more than a Ty Detmer type.."

albionmoonlight

05-12-2006, 02:25 PM

Not in the NFL as far as length of futility.

My grandpa went 50 years hoping that the Lions would win again but they never did. The only teams that could relate are the Cubs, Red Sox (until 2004), and maybe the Blackhawks. I'm sure there are others, but that's all I can think of right now.

The New Orleans Saints have won one playoff game EVER. I think that they belong in the conversation at least.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:27 PM

The New Orleans Saints have won one playoff game EVER. I think that they belong in the conversation at least.

Yeah, like I said, I'm sure I forgot some.

Crapshoot

05-12-2006, 02:29 PM

There reason he gets so much heat now, is because he's a quitter. Marinelli and Martz told him that he was the starter and were looking forward to meeting with him. Then Harrington came to QB camp, didn't pay attention, sulked, and generally acted like a douche. Then he asked for a trade.

Maybe we are being spiteful, but after all we've dealt with as Lion fans, I don't think people understand the frustration. The Lions have won 1 playoff game since 1956. One.

Spare me. There are limits to the abuse. I'm a Giants fan (San Fran) - they haven't won a world series in 50 years, and they were 3 innings away from it - before blowing it. Its not a license for abuse, especially of the kind Harrington gets.

Moreover, not to be rude Schmidty, but how exactly are you a judge of how an athelete is a "quitter" ?

Raiders Army

05-12-2006, 02:30 PM

I'm surprised that the phrase "thrown under the bus" hasn't been used yet in this thread. Dadgum.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:32 PM

Moreover, not to be rude Schmidty, but how exactly are you a judge of how an athelete is a "quitter" ?

Someone who would be given the right to start, but decides to not take the challenge and asks to be shipped off to be a back-up somewhere.

Seriously, that's a good question. I'm not really sure that there's a definitive answer to that.

stevew

05-12-2006, 02:33 PM

I'm surprised that the phrase "thrown under the bus" hasn't been used yet in this thread. Dadgum.

"Drinking the Kool Aid" is also noticeably absent.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:34 PM

I'm just amazed by how much non-Lion fans (and a small portion of Lion fans) want to coddle the guy. He DID NOT produce, and he was the 3rd pick in the draft. He has to be held accountable.

Sure, he probably doesn't deserve all of the venom, but it comes with the territory.

stevew

05-12-2006, 02:35 PM

Harrington looked good for a bit in the Lions/Steelers game. I thought it was a bit odd that he didnt want to go to Cleveland and compete for their starting job.

Gary Gorski

05-12-2006, 02:36 PM

A pretty bad job by the Lions to me. They did a horrible job positioning this guy regardless of their internal evaluation.

And you expected something else from this organization? Millen has not handled this team very well. First he hires a bad coach with a bad system and then realizing that...hires the guy who was the one who taught him the system in the first place. Can't imagine why bringing the same kind of coach in to replace the one you fired didn't work.

Then of course he was responsible for things like making the Lions the punchline of every draft coverage show when witty analysts sarcastically suggested they will take a WR and there was the incident when he went on Ditka's radio show and talked about how one of the players has no balls. And of course there was the whole business about what a liar one of the local Lions cover guys was when the organization was trying to cover up what they were going to do with Joey. Then there was the story with Joey tanking QB camp...its just been one huge trainwreck.

I'm not a Joey supporter - I think he was an average QB here. I don't understand why people give him such a hard time though - he wasn't that great but who was? I can't honestly look at this team and say now that Joey is gone everything will be great. We're lucky we got anything for him after the way the situation was handled. The Lions signed three QBs this offseason already - it wasn't exactly a secret that they were done with Harrington yet they still expected to get something decent in return when they practically announced to the world they were going to just give him away for nothing.

Millen and the Lions have done a terrible job both internally and from a public stance - they should take a look across town and see how Dumars and the Pistons run their organization. When it was time to move Darko I didn't see anyone hanging him out to dry. Then again maybe that is why the Pistons are the best team in the NBA and the Lions the punchline of the NFL and that's too bad because I'd give anything for the days of Wayne Fontes and Barry Sanders right about now.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:37 PM

Harrington looked good for a bit in the Lions/Steelers game. I thought it was a bit odd that he didnt want to go to Cleveland and compete for their starting job.

I agree. I think it just goes along with his whole make-up.

Anyway, off to lunch. Don't chew me up too much while I'm gone guys. I mean, it's not like I'm joey Harrington. :D

Desnudo

05-12-2006, 02:37 PM

I'm surprised that the phrase "thrown under the bus" hasn't been used yet in this thread. Dadgum.

I am suprised that the "dadgum" was used, gramps.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 02:39 PM

The Lions signed three QBs this offseason already - it wasn't exactly a secret that they were done with Harrington yet they still expected to get something decent in return when they practically announced to the world they were going to just give him away for nothing.

They didn't sign Kitna and McCown until right after the QB school thing, and the trade request, so I don't think that's the Lions fault as far as that goes.

JS19

05-12-2006, 02:40 PM

I am suprised that the "dadgum" was used, gramps.

I am thrilled this word was used, and i hope to see more of it.

Raiders Army

05-12-2006, 02:41 PM

I am suprised that the "dadgum" was used, gramps.
I'm referring to another thread, doggone it. And I'm still young enough to whip you pesky kids and your dumb dog!

stevew

05-12-2006, 02:42 PM

I agree. I think it just goes along with his whole make-up.

Anyway, off to lunch. Don't chew me up too much while I'm gone guys. I mean, it's not like I'm joey Harrington. :D

Cleveland is obviously not as nice as miami. But Harrington can grow a mean looking beard. I think Joey could have beaten out Frye pretty easily. Plus he'd have Braylon Edwards and the fuckin' Soldier to throw to, as well as Joe Jerevicious. Their line is probably going to be okay, so I don't think he would get killed. I would have put up with 2 years starting in Cleveland, to try to get a better starting job and a big money contract elsewhere. Somewhere like Green Bay, where you could face the Lions 2 times a year.

Gary Gorski

05-12-2006, 02:46 PM

They didn't sign Kitna and McCown until right after the QB school thing, and the trade request, so I don't think that's the Lions fault as far as that goes.

It was being reported back in January that the Lions were considering his release. I don't know if they leaked that intentionally as some suspect but it's not like this QB school thing just came out of the blue and they all of a sudden had to change their plans with Joey.

MalcPow

05-12-2006, 03:14 PM

Cleveland is obviously not as nice as miami. But Harrington can grow a mean looking beard. I think Joey could have beaten out Frye pretty easily. Plus he'd have Braylon Edwards and the fuckin' Soldier to throw to, as well as Joe Jerevicious. Their line is probably going to be okay, so I don't think he would get killed. I would have put up with 2 years starting in Cleveland, to try to get a better starting job and a big money contract elsewhere. Somewhere like Green Bay, where you could face the Lions 2 times a year.

For some reason, I did a lot of laughing at the Soldier line. Slow day. :D

AlexB

05-12-2006, 04:35 PM

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/14565048.htm

Joey quicky decided on Miami, refusing to negotiate with anyone else, when they promised a lifetime supply of strawberries and champagne as a part of his contract.

Goodbye Joey. Have fun sitting behind Culpepper for the next 5 years.

Noooooooooo!!!! Tell me it ain;t true - so this off season we've traded for a QB who fumbles every other snap, and when we bench him we've got a QB who throws to the opposition every other snap?

My life is complete :( :D

Bubba Wheels

05-12-2006, 06:35 PM

I wouldn't count on Harrington being more than a spot starter and career back-up. I watched every single game he's ever played, and yes, the talent around him has been poor, but he constantly makes bad decisions, gets too impatient in the pocket, and has terrible accuracy (see his career 54% completion % as proof).

Harrington is a down-field passer, something the Lions haven't seen since the days of Wayne Fontes and the 'Silver Streak' offense. Many pointed out that it was a big mistake drafting him for the West-Nile offense.

Marriucci had taken the prehistoric '3yards and a cloud of dust' offenses from the Woody Hayes/Bo Schembeckler days and perfected it in passing form. A feat that ranks up there with, maybe, adding cupholders on motorcycles...in other words completely needless and useless.

I pointed out before in this forum Nick Saban is a first-rate coach (which means, of course, that any pro/college team in Michigan would have no use for him, like Michigan State) so it will be very interesting for me to watch the Dolphins. I would expect great and surprising things from Harrington/Saban this year.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 06:48 PM

I would expect great and surprising things from Harrington/Saban this year.

Just like you believe aliens are behind the gas crisis because you heard it on Coast-to-Coast. They both have the same odds of being true.

edited to as a semi-heartfelt ;)

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 06:50 PM

Just so you know Bubba, I'm just ribbing. No real offense intended. :)

Rizon

05-12-2006, 06:55 PM

Wow, in years past the Dolphins would have traded a 2nd round pick for him. This is a definate improvement on our trade AI.

chinaski

05-12-2006, 06:57 PM

Bubba Wheels

05-12-2006, 07:40 PM

Just like you believe aliens are behind the gas crisis because you heard it on Coast-to-Coast. They both have the same odds of being true.

edited to as a semi-heartfelt ;)

Well, while I do listen to coast-to-coast the only aliens I really care about are the undocumented ones. And if you dig up my previous post you'll find I was absolutely right about Saban, because he be the man!

Bubba Wheels

05-12-2006, 07:43 PM

im probably the only Harrington fan still alive. Joey has what it takes, you will see - mark my words :) Sucks he couldnt end up some place where he could start now, but more than likely Culpepper will implode or get hurt.

Word I heard is that Culpepper's knee is worse than reported and he could be out the first five games. Joey will get some game time. I really am interested to see what he can do under a real coach and a real pro offense.

Eaglesfan27

05-12-2006, 07:52 PM

Wow, in years past the Dolphins would have traded a 2nd round pick for him. This is a definate improvement on our trade AI.

I'm glad the Eagles dealt with them when they had their Beta AI ;)

TroyF

05-12-2006, 08:05 PM

I'm not sure if Harrington will ever be even an average QB. But I'm not sure Detroit ever really gave him a fair shake.

I'll never forget that Thanksgiving game. Joey is doing ok. Not great, but OK. The play calling is ridiculous. The Lions abandoned the run about fifteen seconds into the game. Joey has a drive that looks pretty good. They get inside Atlanta territory. Then the RT forgets how to block. (OK, I'm not sure he ever really knew how to block)

Patrick Kearney comes clean three straight plays and Harrington is drilled everytime.

Then we go to the sideline reporter. "The Lions are bringing in a new QB. The offensive coaches told the Lions WR to stay on their toes because the ball is going to be coming out quicker"

Ummmm. . . if you liked Garcia better, you should have started him. Joey didn't play that badly. Yet the Lions seemed to want to place the blame on him. As I said up there, I'm not sure he's ever going to be anything. But I don't think he got a fair shake either.

Bubba Wheels

05-12-2006, 08:09 PM

BTW, the Dolphins play the Lions on Thanksgiving in Detroit. Think this year the Lion's game gets bigger ratings than the Dallas one?

thesloppy

05-12-2006, 09:59 PM

As a lifelong Lions fan, who also happens to live in Joey's hometown of Portland, I've always been a fan of the kid, and I'm somewhat ashamed of the constant and instantaneous beating he took from Lions fans. Yes, we've lost for a long time and have been starved for a decent QB for eons, but I don't understand how that somehow equates to exceedingly high expectations. The kid came onto a crapass team and didn't light the world on fire immediately so he gets to shoulder the blame for the inevitable collapse of the modern world and he's apparently a piano-playing transexual who molests retarded children in his spare time.

If the guy was walking down the street in Detroit today he'd probably get stoned to death for the horrible crime of taking over a 2-14 team, and becoming the 5th highest scoring QB in the 80+ years of the franchise in the space of four seasons. What nerve.

http://withteeth.com/pass.gif

Daimyo

05-12-2006, 10:18 PM

For this non-Detroit fan the Harrington thing always seemed weird. I don't think anyone can really say if Harrington had enough talent or not because Detroit handled him about as poorly as possible in every way possible. It may well be too late at this point for him to ever develop into a good QB, but its good that he was able to get out of Detroit and go to a team that actually wants him and won't expect so much out of the gate.

Eaglesfan27

05-12-2006, 10:23 PM

I think the Joey bashing is over the top, but it is also misleading to say he is the 6th best QB in Lions History. Sure, he has the 6th best yardage, but his QB Rtg is far from 6th best in their history. That being said, I think he was hampered by poor coaching and could do quite well in Miami.

M GO BLUE!!!

05-12-2006, 10:44 PM

When I saw Harrington play in college I thought he had an arm that bailed him out on every play he made. I saw some of the worst footwork I ever saw. But then he would throw the ball and just gun it to the receiver. I didn't understand why he was even mentioned as a Heisman candidate... Oh yeah. He had a PR company that put up a five story billboard. That worked great. I should have known then that the Lions would take him, just as I should have known when Marino went down and I laughed "Let's see what the hell Miami has as a backup!" then saw Scott Mitchell throw a pick that was returned something like 93 yards for a score. Yup. He's gonna be a Lion!

As the QB for the Lions I saw a guy that was put completely in the wrong offense for him. The short-passing game offense was designed in Cincinnati by Bill Walsh to compensate for an intelligent QB who had no arm. They installed it mid-season one year when their QB who had a major league gun went down for the season. Until that point, Walsh was all about BOMBS AWAY! So you take a QB with an arm, but nothing in between the ears and make him throw into the flat on every throw. Perfect sense!

So what did I see out of Harrington to make me want him out of Detroit, rather than coaches who could tailor an offense to his strength? I saw a QB who threw behind receivers, threw above receivers, threw it anywhere he could avoid a pick, then would just turn off his senses altogether and throw it to the other team. Sure, he didn't get much help from the guys catching the ball or the blockers, but after one loss I heard him flat out say "We didn't clock and we didn't catch balls." That may have been true, but what about your performance Mr. Harrington? Maybe if he would have accepted some of the blame, his teammates would have played harder too. If the QB is willing to lay his ass on the line for you, you are much more likely to lay yours out there for him. Joey flat out would never lay his out for anyone, but expected everyone else to play their ass off for him.

Even when he would go no-huddle and get the team in a position to win... (too much, too little too late...) Remember the game where the long snapper blew the snap, ending the game? Several players including Roy Williams were over trying to console the snapper who just flat out looked like he wanted to die. Joey sat on the bench looking pissed.

Now that is leadership.

I just hope he starts the Thanksgiving game. (I didn't say I hope he finishes it...)

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 11:00 PM

The kid came onto a crapass team and didn't light the world on fire immediately so he gets to shoulder the blame for the inevitable collapse of the modern world and he's apparently a piano-playing transexual who molests retarded children in his spare time.

I think hyperbole is effective when used conservatively, but apparently you think it is a prerequisite to making a point.

I know Detroit fans. I am a Detroit fan, and have been my entire life. Hyperbole has always been a useful tool, but in my opinion, it has generally been used at least a tiny bit fairly.

I've never heard ANYONE say that Joey was a "transexual" or anything to that effect. People (including me) think that he is soft, hence the strawberries and champagne thing (thanks Siragusa). If you want to say that people who disagree with you are saying that he is gay or a gay basher, that's your own issue. I believe that 90% of the time people are just saying that he isn't a competitive guy or a leader. The other 10% are the typical idiotic troglodytes who roam from shore to shore viscerally despising certain real people and wishing them true harm.

If the guy was walking down the street in Detroit today he'd probably get stoned to death for the horrible crime of taking over a 2-14 team, and becoming the 6th best QB in the 80+ years of the franchise in the space of four seasons. What nerve.

Ditto my above quote.

Blade6119

05-12-2006, 11:06 PM

Harrington is a down-field passer, something the Lions haven't seen since the days of Wayne Fontes and the 'Silver Streak' offense. Many pointed out that it was a big mistake drafting him for the West-Nile offense.
I actually felt strongly oakland should have swooped in. Harrington fits the bill perfectly there, and would give brooks and walter the competition everyone seems to think they need. After seeing Harrington play in person back in college a few times and throw that deep ball, im convinced he has to tools in the right setting.

thesloppy

05-12-2006, 11:07 PM

I think the Joey bashing is over the top, but it is also misleading to say he is the 6th best QB in Lions History.

I fixeded my post. ;)

Blade6119

05-12-2006, 11:08 PM

Even when he would go no-huddle and get the team in a position to win... (too much, too little too late...) Remember the game where the long snapper blew the snap, ending the game? Several players including Roy Williams were over trying to console the snapper who just flat out looked like he wanted to die. Joey sat on the bench looking pissed.

Now that is leadership.
You dont want a guy who is pissed about losing? I think that is exactly the problem, you guys are too soft. Do you remember the colts game against the steelers where vanderjagt missed the kick to win the game? What did payton do, he got pissed and refused to deal with him..not console him...im sorry, trying to say its ok our long snapper just cost us the win is the wrong attitude.

Blade6119

05-12-2006, 11:10 PM

http://withteeth.com/pass.gif
I think all that chart teaches us is if you want to be a good QB in the NFL, avoid detroit...damn, i dont see any stars on that chart

Adamski47

05-12-2006, 11:12 PM

"We didn't clock and we didn't catch balls." That may have been true, but what about your performance Mr. Harrington? Maybe if he would have accepted some of the blame, his teammates would have played harder too.

Joey never took the blame for loses? Did you actually listen to the press conferences or just read blogs from Sean Beligian (local (horrible) sports radio personality)?

Remember the game where the long snapper blew the snap, ending the game? Several players including Roy Williams were over trying to console the snapper who just flat out looked like he wanted to die. Joey sat on the bench looking pissed.

This is not pop-warner football. The man had one job to do, and you want Harrington to bring him an orange slice and pat him on the back?

Adamski47

05-12-2006, 11:13 PM

Dola,

Harrington will prove his doubters wrong. A chip on one's shoulder can be a great inspiration.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 11:15 PM

You dont want a guy who is pissed about losing? I think that is exactly the problem, you guys are too soft.

I'm going to go easy on you Blade.

Look at his QB rating. Look at the record of the lions while he was the starting QB.
+
What is the most important position of a team?

He's not pissed about losing. He's pissed because he's a sub-par QB who has been called out on it even though he was the "Golden Boy" 3rd overall pick in 2002.

thesloppy

05-12-2006, 11:16 PM

I think hyperbole is effective when used conservatively, but apparently you think it is a prerequisite to making a point.

I know Detroit fans. I am a Detroit fan, and have been my entire life. Hyperbole has always been a useful tool, but in my opinion, it has generally been used at least a tiny bit fairly.

I've never heard ANYONE say that Joey was a "transexual" or anything to that effect. People (including me) think that he is soft, hence the strawberries and champagne thing (thanks Siragusa). If you want to say that people who disagree with you are saying that he is gay or a gay basher, that's your own issue.

Don't knock hyperbole if you're going to slip straight into literalism and strawmen.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 11:20 PM

Don't knock hyperbole if you're going to slip straight into literalism and strawmen.

Ok, deal.

Blade6119

05-12-2006, 11:27 PM

I'm going to go easy on you Blade.

Look at his QB rating. Look at the record of the lions while he was the starting QB.
+
What is the most important position of a team?

He's not pissed about losing. He's pissed because he's a sub-par QB who has been called out on it even though he was the "Golden Boy" 3rd overall pick in 2002.
Thank you for going easy, i could not have taken much harsher comments...i never get those around here ;)

In my mind, it became a situation where he was let down by the team and people decided to blame him. No QB can be great without good WRs, or a run game, or an O-Line...all 3 really...all of the top QBs in the league have had at least 2 of the three, usually 3. Peyton has edgirrin and marvin, brees had gates and LT, mcnabb had TO and that o-line...hell, aikman had irvin and smith, young had rice and TO, as well as a strong line.

Im just saying, the QB, while important, can only do so much(especially a pocket passer). And while people rip on him for not producing since he was a high pick, he had 4, count them 4, first round picks starting in the backfield who were highly dissapointing/always hurt. In my mind, he has to tools...did he recognize them in detroit, no...but i dont think it was more a case of blame joey instead of realizing that our latest first round busts have so far been just that.

Only time will tell, and he may be just a terrible bust. But garcia was a pro-bowl player is SF before he came over, and harrington beat him out.

Schmidty

05-12-2006, 11:50 PM

Thank you for going easy, i could not have taken much harsher comments...i never get those around here ;)

In my mind, it became a situation where he was let down by the team and people decided to blame him. No QB can be great without good WRs, or a run game, or an O-Line...all 3 really...all of the top QBs in the league have had at least 2 of the three, usually 3. Peyton has edgirrin and marvin, brees had gates and LT, mcnabb had TO and that o-line...hell, aikman had irvin and smith, young had rice and TO, as well as a strong line.

Im just saying, the QB, while important, can only do so much(especially a pocket passer). And while people rip on him for not producing since he was a high pick, he had 4, count them 4, first round picks starting in the backfield who were highly dissapointing/always hurt. In my mind, he has to tools...did he recognize them in detroit, no...but i dont think it was more a case of blame joey instead of realizing that our latest first round busts have so far been just that.

Only time will tell, and he may be just a terrible bust. But garcia was a pro-bowl player is SF before he came over, and harrington beat him out.

First, no one forced Joey to rush so many throws, and (for the most part) no one forced Joey to be so inaccurate, or throw so many interceptions. Granted there were a lot of drops, but not so many that his % would have risen to even an acceptable level.

Secondly, Garcia was aging and declining before he even got to the Browns. When he got to the Lions, he was just..........awful. Even if you ask pro-Garcia fans (last year), they will admit that he was terrible. Joey only lasted 5 games before the horrific Garcia took over for the year. The only reason he lasted that long was because Millen was basically forcing Mariucci to keep him there.

Sweed

05-13-2006, 12:09 AM

I've been watching football for about 40 years and as I read this thread I keep thinking of another high draft pick QB that was a bust and was pretty much run out of town..

JIM PLUNKETT :)

When Plunkett left NE he was much worse than Harrington is now. The guy was shellshocked and had to sit on the bench for a year just to let his nerves settle down. Hell, we all laughed at Oakland when they brought him in.

I know the chances of Harrington being another Plunkett are slim to none but..

I hope for the sake of you Detroit fans I am wrong.

judicial clerk

05-13-2006, 04:18 AM

I've been watching football for about 40 years and as I read this thread I keep thinking of another high draft pick QB that was a bust and was pretty much run out of town..

JIM PLUNKETT

When Plunkett left NE he was much worse than Harrington is now. The guy was shellshocked and had to sit on the bench for a year just to let his nerves settle down. Hell, we all laughed at Oakland when they brought him in.

This gave me a warm fuzzy.

Raiders Army

05-13-2006, 04:36 AM

The good ole days.

st.cronin

05-13-2006, 09:15 AM