6.0b CTD

[AlexB]

Just quick simming through from a 1970 start - 1970-1972 seasons went fine, mid 1973 sim had a CTD

Started with yabanci's 1970 fictional roster file, have used gstelmacks suite to add Ivy's lettered experience ratings, used game generated drafts throughout, nothing else running other than IE.

Saved after the first seaon, so will run through and see if it happens again.

[AlexB]

Maybe nothing - I hadn't saved since 1971, after saving at the end of each season, no problems in 1973 2nd run through

[AlexB]

Another one in 1983... :(

[AlexB]

Again 2nd time, no probs.

[Deattribution]

I think the protocol for crashes is to upload the save game somewhere online so Jim can check it out, and send him the link in a support email.

[Ben E Lou]

I think the protocol for crashes is to upload the save game somewhere online so Jim can check it out, and send him the link in a support email.
I'm not sure that a non-reproducible crash that occurred while using an exe that was modified by a third-party utility, and while also using a third-party created roster would be on the "a" list of things that would need to be addressed.


But maybe that's just me.

[Deattribution]

I'm not sure that a non-reproducible crash that occurred while using an exe that was modified by a third-party utility, and while also using a third-party created roster would be on the "a" list of things that would need to be addressed.


But maybe that's just me.

I missed the modified execute part, but 'third party' rosters and draft files should be supported.

[Ben E Lou]

'third party' rosters and draft files should be supported.Just wow.

[Deattribution]

Just wow.

Dude, what's up your ass? shouldn't you be busy stalking jbmagic?

He's using a modified execute, so he doesn't need to send it in, I get it... Whether he's using other roster files should be irrelevant though.

[lighthousekeeper]

Skydog is the Dwight Schrute to Jim's Michael Scott.

[Deattribution]

Skydog is the Dwight Schrute to Jim's Michael Scott.

If only the forums had a cell phone like feature where you could associate a picture with everytime a person post. :)

[yabanci]

Just wow.

If third party rosters are not supported, why does the game come with a player file creator and the option to start with an alternative player file?

A roster file is a roster file, just different letters and numbers in the various fields. Having the name Smith instead of Jones isn't going to crash the game. If anything were out of permissible range, the player file creator wouldn't convert the csv to fdt.

[Ben E Lou]

If third party rosters are not supported, why does the game come with a player file creator and the option to start with an alternative player file?

A roster file is a roster file, just different letters and numbers in the various fields. Having the name Smith instead of Jones isn't going to crash the game. If anything were out of permissible range, the player file creator wouldn't convert the csv to fdt.I was just thinking of the support nightmare of trying to support thousands of possibilities for rosters. I was completely stunned also by the expectation of support for draft files for this version.

[Rizon]

I have had no problems simming with Y's rosters and with a modified EXE.

[Comey]

Does that suite modify the exe? Is that how skydog knows it's modified?

In all honesty, I don't know what that does. Could someone enlighten me?

[Buccaneer]

A roster file is a roster file, just different letters and numbers in the various fields. Having the name Smith instead of Jones isn't going to crash the game. If anything were out of permissible range, the player file creator wouldn't convert the csv to fdt.

Why is there the ability to convert a csv to fdt?

[yabanci]

I was just thinking of the support nightmare of trying to support thousands of possibilities for rosters. I was completely stunned also by the expectation of support for draft files for this version.

Well, the "import draft" feature would lead one to expect that draft files are supported for this version.

[Deattribution]

I was just thinking of the support nightmare of trying to support thousands of possibilities for rosters. I was completely stunned also by the expectation of support for draft files for this version.

When did this become unprecedented? Every version had the ability to support roster and draft files, and has done so. FOF2k4 didn't have CTDs with draft files (commonly anyway), so what exactly gave you the impression this was now not supported with 2k7?

If it's an issue with the game and the way the files are handled, and not the draft files themselves - I'm sure Jim would like to fix it.

[Ben E Lou]

Well, the "import draft" feature would lead one to expect that TCY draft files are supported for this version.Fixed.

[Ben E Lou]

Why is there the ability to convert a csv to fdt?jb, is that you?

[yabanci]

Why is there the ability to convert a csv to fdt?

See help file:

About The Player File Generator

The Player File Generator allows you to create player files for use with Front Office Football 2007.

This generator takes a comma-delimited file, which is usually created using a spreadsheet application like Excel, and turns it into a player file that can be used with Front Office Football 2007. It does not work with any other version of Front Office Football.

[Buccaneer]

See help file:

Exactly. So creating a player file in a spreadsheet application like Excel and importing it into FOF must be supported.

[Ben E Lou]

Maybe so. Wish it wasn't. shurg

[yabanci]

Exactly. So creating a player file in a spreadsheet application like Excel and importing it into FOF must be supported.

Obviously. That's what I said. But SkyDog is shocked that someone would have the audacity to assume that third party rosters are supported. Maybe you inteded to direct this at him, not me.

[Buccaneer]

Maybe so. Wish it wasn't. shurg

Ok, now you see what I was getting at. You said...

I'm not sure that a non-reproducible crash that occurred while using an exe that was modified by a third-party utility, and while also using a third-party created roster would be on the "a" list of things that would need to be addressed.


But maybe that's just me.

While the former is likely not supported, the latter would be since it is using an in-game utility.

(For the record: I have probably played more SP seasons using the 1970 roster/draft files than any other way (as well as had followed HFL). It's a cool option to have.)

[Ben E Lou]

(For the record: I have probably played more SP seasons using the 1970 roster/draft files than any other way.I know. Hence...Wish it wasn't.

[Buccaneer]

Obviously. That's what I said. But SkyDog is shocked that someone would have the audacity to assume that third party rosters are supported. Maybe you inteded to direct this at him, not me.

Yes, it was but I wanted to ask you the leading question since SD would have come back with a snappy quip (as he did anyway). [shurg]

[Buccaneer]

Wish it wasn't

Probably. One would assume, however, that it wouldn't CTD on using such files.

[Deattribution]

Basically this was just Skydog wanting to be a prick, then resisting admiting he was wrong (shock) while having the truth stomped in and reluctantly 'kind of' admitting he was in the wrong.

And that may sound harsh, but I just don't appreciate prick responses, by the board 'leader' of all people when I'm just trying to help a guy out. Despite his smartass response I still didn't say anything negative to him, but that wasn't enough.

[Solecismic]

While I appreciate attempts to provide bug reports, this report is very vague. When there's a crash, there's usually some information available. A report that you can get more information about. The first 20 or so lines of that information report are very useful. Obviously, don't bother sending it to Microsoft. But there is good stuff there.

Also, some sort of description of what happened. I'm gathering this was fast-sim, but is there anything repeatable? Anything notable about when the crash took place? The report as given is the proverbial needle in a haystack - there's just nothing to investigate - I've run hundreds and hundreds of seasons without crashing once.

As far parameters. FOF should handle player files and draft files created by the game's utilities. I can't vouch for files created by third-party utilities because the game's utilities (and TCY itself) set limits to each field.

This res-hacking worries me. Could it cause problems? Absolutely. I wouldn't do it. But is it definitely the problem here? No idea.

Let me give an example. I took a look at the How Acquired crash today, because my back is hurting pretty badly from yesterday's surge of moving activity, and I'm worried that if I push it, it will develop its own bug and I'll end up needing several days in bed when I can't afford that.

I went through line-by-line and there's no bug in the code. It's actually a bug in Microsoft's code, having to do with variable alignment - something that really should be long in the past with today's compilers. Something about the 6.0b compile placed a variable in the wrong spot, and the game perceived a buffer override when the variable was simply defined and not yet even used or changed yet. The fix was to initialize it to zero. Which there was no need for, programmatically. But it fixed the crash.

That scares the hell out of me. That is what's know as hacking a fix. I'm using a relatively new compiler in Visual Studio 2005. I had been using Visual Studio 6.0 for almost eight years, which had been patched a few times. How many problems like this are there? Bugs that only pop up on compile? I knew how to fix this one quickly because I hit a similar one in development elsewhere.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Excellent! Will there be a quicky 6.0c patch to avoid this crash.

[Deattribution]

While I appreciate attempts to provide bug reports, this report is very vague. When there's a crash, there's usually some information available. A report that you can get more information about. The first 20 or so lines of that information report are very useful. Obviously, don't bother sending it to Microsoft. But there is good stuff there.


This is good to know. I thought about doing this when first experiencing the 'how aquired' crash (obviously moot now) but the report looked like such jibberish I didn't think it'd be any use to you.

[AlexB]

While I appreciate attempts to provide bug reports, this report is very vague. When there's a crash, there's usually some information available. A report that you can get more information about. The first 20 or so lines of that information report are very useful. Obviously, don't bother sending it to Microsoft. But there is good stuff there.

Also, some sort of description of what happened. I'm gathering this was fast-sim, but is there anything repeatable? Anything notable about when the crash took place? The report as given is the proverbial needle in a haystack - there's just nothing to investigate - I've run hundreds and hundreds of seasons without crashing once.

As far parameters. FOF should handle player files and draft files created by the game's utilities. I can't vouch for files created by third-party utilities because the game's utilities (and TCY itself) set limits to each field.

This res-hacking worries me. Could it cause problems? Absolutely. I wouldn't do it. But is it definitely the problem here? No idea.

Let me give an example. I took a look at the How Acquired crash today, because my back is hurting pretty badly from yesterday's surge of moving activity, and I'm worried that if I push it, it will develop its own bug and I'll end up needing several days in bed when I can't afford that.

I went through line-by-line and there's no bug in the code. It's actually a bug in Microsoft's code, having to do with variable alignment - something that really should be long in the past with today's compilers. Something about the 6.0b compile placed a variable in the wrong spot, and the game perceived a buffer override when the variable was simply defined and not yet even used or changed yet. The fix was to initialize it to zero. Which there was no need for, programmatically. But it fixed the crash.

That scares the hell out of me. That is what's know as hacking a fix. I'm using a relatively new compiler in Visual Studio 2005. I had been using Visual Studio 6.0 for almost eight years, which had been patched a few times. How many problems like this are there? Bugs that only pop up on compile? I knew how to fix this one quickly because I hit a similar one in development elsewhere.

Whoa! (To the posts before Jim's) Didn't mean to create controversy, just to report an occurrence - I realised that by using outside parties this may well affect things, which is why I listed them.

Jim - nothing in particular on the two occasions, but I amnot paying much attention to the game as a whole - just franchising players, resigning FAs to keep some sort of roster consistency, and trying to generate a history. So something might have happened both times but I likely wouldn't know.

All I can add is that it seemed to be in the season itself rather than pre-season. FWIW I am finding that for often when simming the entire season, the screen sticks on week 1-2, as does the standings screen on the 'simulation window', and will only update after the bowl game. Both times it CTDd this happened, but it has also happened many more times without a CTD. I appreciate this is still pretty vague.

When I get to 2006 the freezing won't be a problem as I will stop the quick sim and take over on a week by week basis, so it doesn't bother me in the slightest.

It wasn't a complaint, but was stating that it happened in case it was any use - if it happens again I will post the report code.

[AlexB]

Ran 6-7 sdeasons without any problems or temporary display freezngs this morning. Thinking about it, when I switched off last night there were some Windows Updates, so maybe that was the root cause, downloading those in the background may have eaten up too much of my memory (I have 1GB).

[CraigSca]

I've noticed the simulation windows sticking when I fast sim a season, but only if I swap out to IE to surf the web. When I come back, it seems to be stuck at the first week, but if I give it some time, it will pop-up with the last game of the playoffs and will have finished.

Are you moving from one app to another when simming?

I've also found problems when doing an initial allocation draft and moving to a new app while it mulls over that process. Again, it doesn't seem to update the display when I come back to FOF2k7.

However, I don't really feel this is a bug. FOF 2K7 is such a huge program, I just have to pick and choose my spots when I alt-tab out of it.

[twothree]

I also had the simulation window get stuck once and only once. FOF 2007 6.0b did not CTD. I had several other applications running. I was quick simming the entire season. The simulation window advanced from week to week normally until week 5 of the preseason then it got stuck there until it finished simming the season. It then jumped to the last week of the season and updated the simulation window with the championship game information.

[AlexB]

However, I don't really feel this is a bug. FOF 2K7 is such a huge program, I just have to pick and choose my spots when I alt-tab out of it.

Neither do I - I mentioned it because Jim asked for more info - that was all I had :)

On a season sim, when ALT+TABbing out of FOF, yep, you get a blank screen until it stops processing, but on occasion I have basically the same as two three describes.

Again, I don't mind, I was just trying to add to the description of the CTD. However, I am now up to 1997, and haven;t had anything else - I'm inclined to think it was the effect of Windows Update.

[Ben E Lou]

The "sticking" thing has been happening since TCY, if not before then. It comes back once the game is finished whatever it is doing, and is heavily (if not always) related to multi-tasking when simming.

[VPI97]

I've noticed the simulation windows sticking when I fast sim a season, but only if I swap out to IE to surf the web. When I come back, it seems to be stuck at the first week, but if I give it some time, it will pop-up with the last game of the playoffs and will have finished.
I've seen this many times with many different apps (including ones that I've developed). I've never really researched it since the app is still running through logic and the screen will be repainted once it finishes the process, but I've seen that type of behavior from programs on Win XP more than operating systems in the past. That leads me to believe that it's an issue with Windows handling screen painting between multiple apps when the CPU is pegged out rather than a bug with each individual app.

Short version - It happens with a ton of things when processing power is maxed out, so I don't think it's an issue specific to FOF.

[Ben E Lou]

I've seen that type of behavior from programs on Win XP more than operating systems in the past. Ah. That would explain my comment about TCY being the first game I remember having that issue with, then.

[CraigSca]

Yeah, I was about to mention that there are some apps that don't even update enough to allow you to swap out at all. This certainly is not an FOF-specific problem.

[Solecismic]

You can force an update/paint message in there. I do that in week 17 because the process of updating the career and single-season records takes a lot of time now with the expanded record books.

In general, it's better to let Windows queue the messages. Last thing you need is a crash in a graphics element initialization routine for something completely unnecessary.

I have noticed that the "not responding" message that Windows slaps on a window title is rather misleading. It's not responding because it's processing data and Windows has chosen not to process the display message queue. There needs to be a more precise message, akin to the hourglass cursor (which I try to use whenever the game is doing something that takes more than a second) that a programmer can force Windows to use in these instances. Just to say "yeah, I know it seems like a while, but it's intentional."

[AlexB]

OK, happened again - I repeat, I know the third party stuff probably has an effect, but Jim asked for the info.

Screenshot of when the game crashed
(http://img489.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screen1ts7.png])http://img489.imageshack.us/img489/7976/screen1ts7.th.png


Contents of txt file referred to by the error reporting screens:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-16"?>
<DATABASE>
<EXE NAME="FrFoot2007.exe" FILTER="GRABMI_FILTER_PRIVACY">
<MATCHING_FILE NAME="cnames.dll" SIZE="49152" CHECKSUM="0xEE5787B6" MODULE_TYPE="WIN32" PE_CHECKSUM="0x0" LINKER_VERSION="0x0" LINK_DATE="08/19/2002 08:50:29" UPTO_LINK_DATE="08/19/2002 08:50:29" />
<MATCHING_FILE NAME="elicen40.dll" SIZE="71680" CHECKSUM="0x826840B5" BIN_FILE_VERSION="4.0.0.0" BIN_PRODUCT_VERSION="4.0.0.0" PRODUCT_VERSION="4, 0, 0, 0" FILE_DESCRIPTION="elicen40.dll" COMPANY_NAME="Viatech Inc. - www.elicense.com (http://www.elicense.com)" PRODUCT_NAME="Elicense System" FILE_VERSION="4, 0, 0, 0" ORIGINAL_FILENAME="elicen40.dll" INTERNAL_NAME="elicen40.dll" LEGAL_COPYRIGHT="Copyright © 1998-2002, ViaTech Inc." VERFILEDATEHI="0x0" VERFILEDATELO="0x0" VERFILEOS="0x40004" VERFILETYPE="0x2" MODULE_TYPE="WIN32" PE_CHECKSUM="0x0" LINKER_VERSION="0x0" UPTO_BIN_FILE_VERSION="4.0.0.0" UPTO_BIN_PRODUCT_VERSION="4.0.0.0" LINK_DATE="09/17/2002 04:39:50" UPTO_LINK_DATE="09/17/2002 04:39:50" VER_LANGUAGE="English (United States) [0x409]" />
<MATCHING_FILE NAME="fnames.dll" SIZE="69632" CHECKSUM="0x76031FC4" MODULE_TYPE="WIN32" PE_CHECKSUM="0x0" LINKER_VERSION="0x0" LINK_DATE="01/30/2005 20:05:54" UPTO_LINK_DATE="01/30/2005 20:05:54" />
<MATCHING_FILE NAME="FrFoot2007.exe" SIZE="21610496" CHECKSUM="0x2C8EF75A" BIN_FILE_VERSION="5.0.0.1" BIN_PRODUCT_VERSION="5.0.0.1" PRODUCT_VERSION="5, 0, 0, 1" FILE_DESCRIPTION="Front Office Football 2007" COMPANY_NAME="Solecismic Software" PRODUCT_NAME="Front Office Football 2007" FILE_VERSION="5, 0, 0, 1" ORIGINAL_FILENAME="FrFoot2007.EXE" INTERNAL_NAME="Front Office Football 2007" LEGAL_COPYRIGHT="Copyright (C) Solecismic Software, 2006" VERFILEDATEHI="0x0" VERFILEDATELO="0x0" VERFILEOS="0x4" VERFILETYPE="0x1" MODULE_TYPE="WIN32" PE_CHECKSUM="0x0" LINKER_VERSION="0x0" UPTO_BIN_FILE_VERSION="5.0.0.1" UPTO_BIN_PRODUCT_VERSION="5.0.0.1" LINK_DATE="11/16/2006 03:27:01" UPTO_LINK_DATE="11/16/2006 03:27:01" VER_LANGUAGE="English (United States) [0x409]" />
<MATCHING_FILE NAME="hcnames.dll" SIZE="339968" CHECKSUM="0x4B14B99D" MODULE_TYPE="WIN32" PE_CHECKSUM="0x0" LINKER_VERSION="0x0" LINK_DATE="02/04/2002 06:28:55" UPTO_LINK_DATE="02/04/2002 06:28:55" />
<MATCHING_FILE NAME="lnames.dll" SIZE="286720" CHECKSUM="0xC444FC78" MODULE_TYPE="WIN32" PE_CHECKSUM="0x52D5D" LINKER_VERSION="0x0" LINK_DATE="10/27/2006 23:19:43" UPTO_LINK_DATE="10/27/2006 23:19:43" />
<MATCHING_FILE NAME="PlayerFile.exe" SIZE="458752" CHECKSUM="0xB20AE32" BIN_FILE_VERSION="1.0.0.1" BIN_PRODUCT_VERSION="1.0.0.1" PRODUCT_VERSION="1, 0, 0, 1" FILE_DESCRIPTION="PlayerFile MFC Application" PRODUCT_NAME="PlayerFile Application" FILE_VERSION="1, 0, 0, 1" ORIGINAL_FILENAME="PlayerFile.EXE" INTERNAL_NAME="PlayerFile" LEGAL_COPYRIGHT="Copyright (C) Solecismic Software 2006" VERFILEDATEHI="0x0" VERFILEDATELO="0x0" VERFILEOS="0x4" VERFILETYPE="0x1" MODULE_TYPE="WIN32" PE_CHECKSUM="0x7732E" LINKER_VERSION="0x0" UPTO_BIN_FILE_VERSION="1.0.0.1" UPTO_BIN_PRODUCT_VERSION="1.0.0.1" LINK_DATE="09/17/2006 01:50:36" UPTO_LINK_DATE="09/17/2006 01:50:36" VER_LANGUAGE="English (United States) [0x409]" />
</EXE>
<EXE NAME="kernel32.dll" FILTER="GRABMI_FILTER_THISFILEONLY">
<MATCHING_FILE NAME="kernel32.dll" SIZE="984064" CHECKSUM="0xF12E1D4A" BIN_FILE_VERSION="5.1.2600.2945" BIN_PRODUCT_VERSION="5.1.2600.2945" PRODUCT_VERSION="5.1.2600.2945" FILE_DESCRIPTION="Windows NT BASE API Client DLL" COMPANY_NAME="Microsoft Corporation" PRODUCT_NAME="Microsoft® Windows® Operating System" FILE_VERSION="5.1.2600.2945 (xpsp_sp2_gdr.060704-2349)" ORIGINAL_FILENAME="kernel32" INTERNAL_NAME="kernel32" LEGAL_COPYRIGHT="© Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved." VERFILEDATEHI="0x0" VERFILEDATELO="0x0" VERFILEOS="0x40004" VERFILETYPE="0x2" MODULE_TYPE="WIN32" PE_CHECKSUM="0xF724D" LINKER_VERSION="0x50001" UPTO_BIN_FILE_VERSION="5.1.2600.2945" UPTO_BIN_PRODUCT_VERSION="5.1.2600.2945" LINK_DATE="07/05/2006 10:55:00" UPTO_LINK_DATE="07/05/2006 10:55:00" VER_LANGUAGE="English (United States) [0x409]" />
</EXE>
</DATABASE>

[AlexB]

The obvious answer is to reinstall the main exe, but the downside is that I can't distinguish between most of the colours.

The previous way of indicating experience was simple to me, but like many, it was too many clicks away. Now it's on every player card, but the colour bases are not as informative, which is why I have used Icy's lettered indicators.

[Icy]

So has the mod anything to do with this? i really doubt it but if you guys have proofs it should be made public, else i would prefer the thread title to be changed before everybody pulls the gun towards the mods. I have seen that already in another board about another game and another mod and it really makes me wonder if i should waste my time anymore.

[Buccaneer]

This res-hacking worries me. Could it cause problems? Absolutely. I wouldn't do it. But is it definitely the problem here? No idea.

I understand the desire to do this (res-hacking) but this should be a huge red-flag. That's why I have advocated (with all games) to use developer's utilities and to support more open-source file exchanges - but not to @%#$! around with compiled executables and dlls. I am really intrigued with Firaxis not only support Pythin scripting but making a SDK available as well. It gets the best of both worlds (I believe) - secure, supported code with supported utilities.

[twothree]

I just wanted to note that when my game got stuck on preseason week 5, I was not using a modified executable.

[Icy]

Jari Rantanen's Shorts, can you please do us a favour? can you install the original exe and run the same text with same rosters etc but without the mod and tell us if you have the crashes?
(http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3930)

[Solecismic]

I don't know the answer. Intuitively, I'd say res-hacking isn't bad. I would require that anyone providing new resources NOT re-distribute the executable for legal reasons as well as for customer support reasons (versioning, primarily). Instead, provide a tool to add the new resources.

So, there's a text file referring to elic40.dll? That's bizarre. That library is not accessed in the middle of a week. It must be a false report of some kind - I would imagine that if that library is really being called at the time of the crash, you'd have a tough time even getting the game to run.

Is there more information, under a heading like technical information, that provides a little bit more? I know there's a report that's several pages long that maps out the memory. The first 20 or so lines of that report contain some register addresses from the primary executable at the time of the crash - that's what's most useful. After that first section, it starts cycling through all the loaded libraries, which isn't needed information.

[Icy]

I don't know the answer. Intuitively, I'd say res-hacking isn't bad. I would require that anyone providing new resources NOT re-distribute the executable for legal reasons as well as for customer support reasons (versioning, primarily). Instead, provide a tool to add the new resources.

Fair enought, i'm going to remove the modded .exe and just keep the graphics in case anybody wants to use them.

[Raiders Army]

You can force an update/paint message in there. I do that in week 17 because the process of updating the career and single-season records takes a lot of time now with the expanded record books.

In general, it's better to let Windows queue the messages. Last thing you need is a crash in a graphics element initialization routine for something completely unnecessary.

I have noticed that the "not responding" message that Windows slaps on a window title is rather misleading. It's not responding because it's processing data and Windows has chosen not to process the display message queue. There needs to be a more precise message, akin to the hourglass cursor (which I try to use whenever the game is doing something that takes more than a second) that a programmer can force Windows to use in these instances. Just to say "yeah, I know it seems like a while, but it's intentional."

This just happened and I've manually rebooted my computer six times now: I get the hourglass of death when I click on "View How Acquired". Here's how I've modified FOF 6.0b:

Changed the bmps for 300, 302, 305, and 323. I did not use a different .exe (although I believe Reshacker changes the .exe anyhow).

I did a new career with a complete draft with the 1970 .fdt file. I then clicked on "View How Acquired" and it hung on me. The only other program I had running (that I could see since there are a lot of programs running in the background like iPodService.exe, etc.) was Excel where I was making notes about my players. Excel was fine and fully operable, but internet explorer was not. I had to manually reboot completely to get internet explorer running again.

I then tried to do this again and the same results.

Third try was the 1970 .fdt file with no draft at all. Same results.

Fourth try was the 1970 .fdt file with no draft at all. I then simmed through the exhibition games. Same results.

Fifth try was the 2006 ybanci file with no draft. Same results.

Sixth try was the file that came with FOF 2007. Same results.

Each time I had to manually reboot my computer. It's a Pentium 4 3.0Ghz, 1 GB RAM, 256 MB Radeon 9800.

[Raiders Army]

doh. Just saw this:

http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showpost.php?p=1309105&postcount=52

I didn't realize it was already reported...and I just sent Jim an email.


edit: Ummmm...or even this thread: http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?t=54332

[AlexB]

So has the mod anything to do with this? i really doubt it but if you guys have proofs it should be made public, else i would prefer the thread title to be changed before everybody pulls the gun towards the mods. I have seen that already in another board about another game and another mod and it really makes me wonder if i should waste my time anymore.

Sorry - didn;t mean to imply that it was a problem with the mod. I changed it to appease others.

I'll change it back again - the letter grades are fantastic.

[gstelmack]

I don't know the answer. Intuitively, I'd say res-hacking isn't bad. I would require that anyone providing new resources NOT re-distribute the executable for legal reasons as well as for customer support reasons (versioning, primarily). Instead, provide a tool to add the new resources.

As a writer of one such utility, I'll chime in now.

My UtilitySuite includes ResourcePatcher, which will patch the various resources for the user. The intent is to allow a player to update the FOF exe with resource patches whenever the exe is updated. This works through standard Windows APIs for doing this and was based on an MSDN sample. Because it's automated, it should be about a safe a way of patching the resources as exists.

However, that doesn't mean it's COMPLETELY safe. If any reliable evidence turns up that patching these bitmaps CORRECTLY (i.e. ResHacker was used without a mistake, or my utility used without an error in the packages) causes instability in the game, I'll yank my utility immediately.

[Icy]

Sorry - didn;t mean to imply that it was a problem with the mod. I changed it to appease others.

I'll change it back again - the letter grades are fantastic.

No problem, can you please check if you have the same crashes with the original file? I can't test myself as i have never had a crash with the original or modded file.

[AlexB]

Ran 11 seasons after uninstalling/reinstalling without any problems, but stupidly clicked on accept the firing, never having been fired before - didn;t realise this equated to 'end game'

Will try the same game file as I had been using...

[AlexB]

But on the fourth season of the old game file, crash.

[AlexB]

Jim, I can't copy & paste the report, so I've got screenshots of the first eight or nine modules listed.

Rereading your post, it's only the start & module 1 info you need?

http://img477.imageshack.us/img477/743/1xu7.th.png (http://img477.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1xu7.png)

http://img477.imageshack.us/img477/1930/2lx0.th.png (http://img477.imageshack.us/my.php?image=2lx0.png)

If you need more I can add to these if needed.

[Solecismic]

The first of those pictures has all the information I need from the report, thanks.

What are your global settings regarding letting the coaches handle depth charts and roster replacements?

If you happen to notice if it's simming a game involving your team when this happens, that would help.

[AlexB]

The first of those pictures has all the information I need from the report, thanks.

What are your global settings regarding letting the coaches handle depth charts and roster replacements?

If you happen to notice if it's simming a game involving your team when this happens, that would help.

As it's pure quick simming, coaches handle everything - signing FAs, rookies, depth charts & game plans.

When simming to get the history, in order to give 'my' team a fighting chance, I'm resigning & franchising some current players, and sending one to summer league. I'm also keeping on top of the stadium and prices, but everything else, including the draft is automated. (Although the last time I was not doing anythign just to get through some years to see if reinstalling had an effect)

Injuries 200, I've changed the salary cap range to narrow it to 25-35 to try and get the cap up to about $102m in 2006.

Three of the four times it's happened in the above game file, it's gone through the point of the crash the second time no problems.

[AlexB]

dola,

And these have all been after hitting the simulate entire season button.

[twothree]

Did this CTD happen at the end of the preseason again? Or, was it at some other point in the quick season simulation?

[AlexB]

Did this CTD happen at the end of the preseason again? Or, was it at some other point in the quick season simulation?

No, it was mid-season. I had the thought I guess you might be having, that it could have been something to do with the reductions in roster sizes from 60-53, but doesn't appear to be the case.

[AlexB]

If you happen to notice if it's simming a game involving your team when this happens, that would help.

The example on page 1 crashed simming the game 2 after my team's game that week, so at least one of the times hasn't been this scenario.

Got bored watching the Jets/Bears, so very quick simmed 25 years doing nothing at all to maintain rosters or finances. Used the rosters that came with the game

Not a single problem. I've only had the problem with that one save game so far out of three attemps:

Game 1 - 4 CTDs in 32 years with mod installed through gstelmack's utility & without mod, which I assume means that there can't be a problem with either the mod or the utility. Started with yabanci's 1970 fictional with a reduced cap, created through the game's roster generator. But as problems have been 1997 and 2001, can't be any problem with the roster file as all players will have well and truly retired after 27&31 years

Game 2 - started with same roster file, but reinstalled unmodded pure FOF. 11 years and no problem, again suggesting no problem with the roster file.

Game 3 - pure FOF & original roster file. 25 years, no problems.

Thanks for looking into this admittedly inconsistent and non-prolific problem: it's not widespread - 4 occurrences in about 75 simmed seasons (as some were resimmed due to the CTDs).

Could it be that the save game has just got slightly corrupted? Don't really understand how these things work, but I note that Marc that this can occur with some other games.

Now Dallas/Indy started, so will try remodding tomorrow and running a new game to help if this was the case...

[Solecismic]

I think, from code inspection, that I can get this one. It should be rare, but I can see a path to a crash from a series of in-game injuries to defensive linemen.

It's too bad crashes prevent looking at the roster afterward to test that hypothesis.

I am not going to be able to get a 6.0c up before my scheduled trip. It's tempting just to patch the How Acquired bug, but I want to take a shot at more difficult issues, like seeing if I can tweak the FA logic so that cap hell won't be so nightmarish for teams. I'm leaving tomorrow, I'll be back to work on Saturday.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Excellent. I can wait on hitting 'how acquired' for a week or more especially if additional things will be tweaked. Don't forget RB carries too.

[AlexB]

I think, from code inspection, that I can get this one. It should be rare, but I can see a path to a crash from a series of in-game injuries to defensive linemen.

It's too bad crashes prevent looking at the roster afterward to test that hypothesis.

I am not going to be able to get a 6.0c up before my scheduled trip. It's tempting just to patch the How Acquired bug, but I want to take a shot at more difficult issues, like seeing if I can tweak the FA logic so that cap hell won't be so nightmarish for teams. I'm leaving tomorrow, I'll be back to work on Saturday.

Good news - I'm guessing I don't need to sim twenty random seasons any more! Thanks for not belittling a very occasional problem with a modified game ;)