Red Sox threaten Japan Boycott

[molson]

This would definitely be an interesting start to the season. The Sox say they're not getting on the plane this afternoon unless the coaches are paid what was originally part of the deal for this trip.

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/2008/03/francona_irked.html

[Oilers9911]

A 40k stipend for going on this trip is ridiculous in of itself. Having said that, if it was promised to them it should be paid. But 40k is still crazy.

[Drake]

1. I think it's a good sign that the team is sticking together on this.

2. I wish someone would pay me $40k to go to Japan.

3. Hell, I wish someone would pay me $40k to go to Hoboken.

[miked]

40k may be a lot for the coaches, but I think the major problem is how much money the MLB stands to make off this. Think of it sort of like profit sharing I guess.

[Ksyrup]

COACHES NEED A UNION!

[vtbub]

If that is what they were promised to make this trip that frankly screws with a shortened spring training and nasty start to the regular seson, then they should get what they were told.

Bravo!

[SirFozzie]

Yup. MLB seems to have majorly shot themselves in the foot by promising that the terms covered coaches and support personell, and then deciding it would be cheaper to take it away.

Fire Selig

[Young Drachma]

40k may be a lot for the coaches, but I think the major problem is how much money the MLB stands to make off this. Think of it sort of like profit sharing I guess.

+1

It's just one of the things that goes along with it. People always look at sports pay or salaries or perks and get outraged. But someone is willing to pay it and the people who do what they do, do it better than anyone else in the world. I don't see what the problem here is.

The players probably don't feel like wasting their time over in Japan anyway, so this is probably a combination of "we don't feel like going anyway" and "MLB is gonna pony up..."

It'll get resolved and the coaches will get their money.

[Lathum]

anyone who is interested the Red Sox game is supposed to be on ESPN right now and they are refusing to take the field but there is alot of coverage of whats going on

[molson]

It's hard to see MLB bending on this, it'd be a horrible precedent to give into a threat like this. But they also stand to lose a ton of money.

And at the moment, they're actually sitting on the bench, refusing to take the field in their last Florida game.

Jason Varitek: "We're not playing until this is resolved."

[molson]

A 40k stipend for going on this trip is ridiculous in of itself.

Agreed, but to find two teams willing to disadvantage themselves with this kind of crazy roadtrip, you're going to need to really make it worth it to them. Schilling and Lowe say there's been other promises taken back since they committed to the trip, so this seems like more of a "last straw" kind of thing.

[Radii]

It's hard to see MLB bending on this, it'd be a horrible precedent to give into a threat like this. But they also stand to lose a ton of money.


It seems like a much worse precedent is set by getting Oakland and Boston to agree to this crazy travel and schedule and then take away part of the compensation that is part of that agreement and still expect the teams to hold up their end of the bargain without incident.

[Lathum]

It seems like a much worse precedent is set by getting Oakland and Boston to agree to this crazy travel and schedule and then take away part of the compensation that is part of that agreement and still expect the teams to hold up their end of the bargain without incident.

exactly.

If there was an agreement in writting I don't see how the Sox are setting a precenent.

[molson]

exactly.

If there was an agreement in writting I don't see how the Sox are setting a precenent.

I doubt it's as simple as a signed contract that MLB is just suddenly deciding not to comply with. I'm sure there was a provision that allowed this kind of change under some kind of circumstances, or that this "promise" was somehow otherwise not legally binding. It doesn't make it right.

[Critch]

Did MLB actually agree to give 40k to the coaches too? The article says that the Red Sox had assumed that it would be the case, but doesn't say that it was ever agreed.

[Lathum]

I think it was cool of Varitek to say that if the game was cancelled they would sit and sign autographs for the fans

[Honolulu_Blue]

exactly.

If there was an agreement in writting I don't see how the Sox are setting a precenent.

Apparently the agreement is not in writing, but was verbal. I assume that's where all of this confusion is coming from.

These players should stop whining, give the coaches their stipends, if it means so much to them, and move. Who needs a $40,000 stipend for a week's trip to Japan?

Boo hoo, we have to go to Japan. Boo hoo, our lives are soooo hard because we have to travel to Japan and play baseball.

I've travelled to Japan from DC for work, had to check into the hotel, drop my bags off, take a 5 minute shower, and head out to interview clients for 12 hours. I didn't get to sleep and got 0$ in a stipend.

Suck it up, bitches.

[Ksyrup]

Why isn't the team stepping in and agreeing to pay the coaches, if the league is balking? Is that not the easiest solution?

[Ksyrup]

HONOLULU_BLUE NEEDS A UNION!

[Jas_lov]

No, they shouldn't suck it up. If MLB promised them a $40,000 stipend for all coaches and players, it should be honored. If they reneged on the deal like the Boston players claim, then they have a right to be angry and boycott. I am a Yankees fan, but I think what they're doing here sticking up for their coahces is awesome. If a deal was agreed to, it should be honored as such.

[SirFozzie]

Fuck that, H_B. They were told the coaches would get the 40K (which is a 40% bonus to these folks), plain and simple. The players did not approve this until it was made clear the coaches would be paid.

Why the fuck should the players make up for MLB's reneging on their deal. I'm listening to the WEEI feed right now, and the coaches on the previous trip got the exact same stipend the players did. MLB thought because it was not in writing, they could save some money and be cheap.

The Fort Myers police are apparently going to line folks up for autographs.. I don't think they're going to play a game today.

[SirFozzie]

Why isn't the team stepping in and agreeing to pay the coaches, if the league is balking? Is that not the easiest solution?

Because why do the PLAYERS have to pay for something MLB won't pay? If players didn't vote clubhouse workers a share of playoff money or something like that, should MLB step in and make it right?

[molson]

Boo hoo, we have to go to Japan. Boo hoo, our lives are soooo hard because we have to travel to Japan and play baseball.

I've travelled to Japan from DC for work, had to check into the hotel, drop my bags off, take a 5 minute shower, and head out to interview clients for 12 hours. I didn't get to sleep and got 0$ in a stipend.

Suck it up, bitches.

This is always my most favorite fan reaction - "my life is so much worse than a professional athlete, so they shouldn't complain about anything".

Your life is better than most in the world HB, I hope you're consistent and never complain about anything yourself.

[Lathum]

Throw me in the anti HB camp.

If they were promised the money they should get it. MLB wants this trip, not the players and coaches.

By all accounts the average coach doesn't make alot of money. 40K is life changing for some of them.

[Lathum]

looks like they may play the game

[DeToxRox]

why didn't Oakland get this same promise? I would be more pissed if I were them because apparently no deal was made with them. Are they bitching?

[molson]

looks like they may play the game

If they're doing that, they're definitely going to Japan no matter what.

[SirFozzie]

1:10 start.

[Lathum]

1:10 start.

thank god, I was afraid I would have to watch Judge Judy instead

[molson]

why didn't Oakland get this same promise? I would be more pissed if I were them because apparently no deal was made with them. Are they bitching?

Apparently the Sox found out about this through the A's coaches, who had known for a while they weren't getting paid. The implication there is that they had the same deal, but nobody can be sure.

[DeToxRox]

I got HBs back. Oakland County rides together and dies together.

[molson]

1:10 start.

So the Sox made everyone wait around for an hour and now it's over.

Maybe this was all just a big scheme to cover up Manny Ramirez getting lost on the way to the park.

[DeToxRox]

so so Oakland knows they got screwed too and decide to sack up? Keep in mind that is a much more notoriously cheap organization then any team in the MLB and could use it more and they are being pros about. Shit happens. Cowboy Up Boston.

[MrBug708]

If Boston doesn't take the field make them forfeit. It's a chance to promote the game in another country on an all expense paid trip. It's to freaking Japan, not Cambodia for crying out loud.

JD Drew should just pay for their salaries. He's taking 14.4 million a season to be average, he should suck it up.

It's funny to see the Red Sox suddenly counting pennies :)

[Ksyrup]

Because why do the PLAYERS have to pay for something MLB won't pay? If players didn't vote clubhouse workers a share of playoff money or something like that, should MLB step in and make it right?

I'm referring to the "team" - the Boston Red Sox - not the players on the team. The team is a part of MLB, and if MLB promised something, the team should step up and pay, and then have a quiet conversation with Selig about getting reimbursed. Instead, they've turned this into yet another ugly PR gaffe for MLB.

[Lathum]

If Boston doesn't take the field make them forfeit. It's a chance to promote the game in another country on an all expense paid trip. It's to freaking Japan, not Cambodia for crying out loud.

JD Drew should just pay for their salaries. He's taking 14.4 million a season to be average, he should suck it up.

It's funny to see the Red Sox suddenly counting pennies :)

do you seriously think this should be considered an all expenses paid trip to Japan?

By the time they get over their jet lag they have to play 2 games, then fly right back to California to play some more and end up being on the road for 19 straight days to start their season.

Anyone who considers this a "trip" is sorely mistaken

[Dr. Sak]

Well that $40,000 covers the extra costs for bringing all those camera on the trip to film Oakland's signs.

[Crapshoot]

If Boston doesn't take the field make them forfeit. It's a chance to promote the game in another country on an all expense paid trip. It's to freaking Japan, not Cambodia for crying out loud.

JD Drew should just pay for their salaries. He's taking 14.4 million a season to be average, he should suck it up.

It's funny to see the Red Sox suddenly counting pennies :)

Man, I always find it money to see other idiots tell ppl they don't deserve the funds they have agreed to. I demand you work for free - its a "privilege".

MLB - aka Bud Selig - always classy.

[Lathum]

I'm referring to the "team" - the Boston Red Sox - not the players on the team. The team is a part of MLB, and if MLB promised something, the team should step up and pay, and then have a quiet conversation with Selig about getting reimbursed. Instead, they've turned this into yet another ugly PR gaffe for MLB.

so should each team have to pony up the money since they are all part of MLB?

[MrBug708]

do you seriously think this should be considered an all expenses paid trip to Japan?

By the time they get over their jet lag they have to play 2 games, then fly right back to California to play some more and end up being on the road for 19 straight days to start their season.

Anyone who considers this a "trip" is sorely mistaken

Ya, those Jet Lagged Coaches are really going to make the Red Sox lose some games. I hope Gary Tuck won't cost them some late inning bullpen strategy...

[MrBug708]

Man, I always find it money to see other idiots tell ppl they don't deserve the funds they have agreed to. I demand you work for free - its a "privilege".

MLB - aka Bud Selig - always classy.

Idiots?

Crapshoot, Giants fan - always classy...:rolleyes:

[Lathum]

Ya, those Jet Lagged Coaches are really going to make the Red Sox lose some games. I hope Gary Tuck won't cost them some late inning bullpen strategy...

the coaches will have to work harder then the players.

Have you ever been to Asia?

It isn't the kind of trip you want to do in a short time span.

[MrBug708]

the coaches will have to work harder then the players.

Have you ever been to Asia?

It isn't the kind of trip you want to do in a short time span.

Oh ya? Enlighten me...

[albionmoonlight]

Gary Bettman has got to be loving this. The race for "biggest PR gaffe by a major league in the last twenty years" has just been reopened.

[molson]

Ya, those Jet Lagged Coaches are really going to make the Red Sox lose some games. I hope Gary Tuck won't cost them some late inning bullpen strategy...

What the hell are you talking about? Why are you debating jet lag? Do you have a comprehension of the issues here?

[DeToxRox]

even this thread is all about Boston. Like I said someone show me where Oakland is acting like children and Ill show the Sox some sympathy but until then guess what you got screwed. Happens to everyone every day.

[Lathum]

Oh ya? Enlighten me...

It can take a while to recover, like I said, it isn't a vacation for these guys

[molson]

even this thread is all about Boston. Like I said someone show me where Oakland is acting like children and Ill show the Sox some sympathy but until then guess what you got screwed. Happens to everyone every day.

Nope, the A's were quite happy to bend over and take it. Their coaches are probably annoyed that their players didn't give a damn (as long as they themselves were taken care of).

The Sox players are yelling about other people not getting paid. How is that not sympathetic?

[MrBug708]

What the hell are you talking about? Why are you debating jet lag? Do you have a comprehension of the issues here?

The thread is about coaches pay right? I'm not following about how it will affect on field performance

[molson]

even this thread is all about Boston.

Right, that was my fault. I did consider putting "A's threaten Japan Boycott" as the thread title, just to not be so Boston-centric, but I figured that might be misleading.

[Lathum]

Nope, the A's were quite happy to bend over and take it. Their coaches are probably annoyed that their players didn't give a damn (as long as they themselves were taken care of).

The Sox players are yelling about other people not getting paid. How is that not sympathetic?

agree 100%

oohhhhh, those crybaby, scumbag Redsox players, standing up for someone else to get paid, how dare they...

[MrBug708]

It can take a while to recover, like I said, it isn't a vacation for these guys

No doubt jet leg will make the coaches suffer but the talk was starting to touch upon on field performance and how jet leg will affect the team.

[Crapshoot]

Idiots?

Crapshoot, Giants fan - always classy...:rolleyes:

Yeah, you are being an idiot. You're saying the coaches should not the get their income because... well because you think its a trip. That's idiocy - as much as it would be if I came to your job and demanded you work for free.

[Lathum]

No doubt jet leg will make the coaches suffer but the talk was starting to touch upon on field performance and how jet leg will affect the team.

because you made it clear in your original post that the players shouldn't bitch because they are going to Japan and I am telling you that the fact they are going to Japan, someplace most people would lke to go, has no bearing.

[MrBug708]

Yeah, you are being an idiot. You're saying the coaches should not the get their income because... well because you think its a trip. That's idiocy - as much as it would be if I came to your job and demanded you work for free.

So now the coaches are working for free? What the hell?

Simple solution is to fine the players and give the money to the coaches

[SirFozzie]

So now the coaches are working for free? What the hell?

Simple solution is to fine the players and give the money to the coaches


Simpler solution is to fine you for utter stupidity.

[MrBug708]

because you made it clear in your original post that the players shouldn't bitch because they are going to Japan and I am telling you that the fact they are going to Japan, someplace most people would lke to go, has no bearing.

Yup. The players don't have any issue with the money they are getting paid right? I wish I could have a job where I'm promised something and if I don't get it, I can say say fuck it, I'm not doing it and nto worry about getting into trouble

You guys must have great jobs

[MrBug708]

Simpler solution is to fine you for utter stupidity.

What's 10% of nothing?

Ah yes, let's make it personal shall we? That'll solve everything :)

[Lathum]

Yup. The players don't have any issue with the money they are getting paid right? I wish I could have a job where I'm promised something and if I don't get it, I can say say fuck it, I'm not doing it and nto worry about getting into trouble

You guys must have great jobs

well I work for myself, but in any job if you are promised something and don't get it you have a right to take action.

[molson]

I wish I could have a job where I'm promised something and if I don't get it, I can say say fuck it, I'm not doing it and nto worry about getting into trouble



Do you work in a coal mine in the 1880's? I think anyone would have a pretty good gripe here.

And they will "get in trouble" if they actually don't make the trip. They'd forfeit the games, no question.

[MrBug708]

well I work for myself, but in any job if you are promised something and don't get it you have a right to take action.

Well, I wish it worked that way :(

[MrBug708]

Do you work in a coal mine in the 1880's? I think anyone would have a pretty good gripe here.


A coal mine huh? I understand the gripe, but I think it's more or less much ado about nothing....

[molson]

Well, I wish it worked that way :(

Maybe you're just also a proponent of the HD theory "everyone who's better off than me doesn't deserve to complain". And again, you're better off than lots of other people, so hopefully you never complain about anything youself.

[Dr. Sak]

This will teach the Sox to get stuff in writing. As much as you want to take someone for their word, you have to protect your best interests and have the promises written down.

[albionmoonlight]

cnnsi says that the trip is on and the complaints have been resolved.

[molson]

A coal mine huh? I understand the gripe, but I think it's more or less much ado about nothing....

Coal Mine was the first thing that came to mind. I almost went with "Russian governmnet worker" but I felt that Coal Miner offered a better visual.

[Masked]

I side with H_B here - it's just a business trip like thousands of others do everyday - the coaches and staff should "deal with it" and do their jobs. Assuming their employer is doing nothing illegal (which doesn't seem to be the case here), they should go find another job if they don't like their current compensation.

[Lathum]

If Boston doesn't take the field make them forfeit. It's a chance to promote the game in another country on an all expense paid trip. It's to freaking Japan, not Cambodia for crying out loud.


this is the original post I have a problem with.

You make it sound like a privledge to go to Japan and I am telling you it isn't.

I have had to go to China and Guam for work and it wasn't an all expenses paid trip as you put it.

I was there to work, just like the coaches and players.

,

[molson]

I side with H_B here - it's just a business trip like thousands of others do everyday - the coaches and staff should "deal with it" and do their jobs. Assuming their employer is doing nothing illegal (which doesn't seem to be the case here), they should go find another job if they don't like their current compensation.

If I ever own a company I'll hire you immediately.

BOSS: "Can you make a trip to Japan, it's inconvieient but I'll pay you $40k"
YOU: "Sure Boss"
(months pass)
BOSS: "I'm not going to pay you that money anymore, but I want you to still make that trip"
YOU: "Sure Boss"

[MrBug708]

MrBug I take it you're not in a union? I think the strength of the MLBPA is one reason why the players felt they have the leverage to do this.

I hate Unions with a passion. They have outlived their usefulness

[Lathum]

I side with H_B here - it's just a business trip like thousands of others do everyday - the coaches and staff should "deal with it" and do their jobs. Assuming their employer is doing nothing illegal (which doesn't seem to be the case here), they should go find another job if they don't like their current compensation.

Exactly, it is a buisness trip.

If you were told you had to go to Japan and your boss said you were going to get $200 a day for food, then at the last minute he tells you that you wil get nothing, wouldn't you be pissed?

Don't be mad at the players because they have leverage

[Dr. Sak]

If I ever own a company I'll hire you immediately.

BOSS: "Can you make a trip to Japan, it's inconvieient but I'll pay you $40k"
YOU: "Sure Boss"
(months pass)
BOSS: "I'm not going to pay you that money anymore, but I want you to still make that trip"
YOU: "Sure Boss"

He never said he'd be a yesman...he said if you don't like it, quit and find another job.

[Masked]

If I ever own a company I'll hire you immediately.

BOSS: "Can you make a trip to Japan, it's inconvieient but I'll pay you $40k"
YOU: "Sure Boss"
(months pass)
BOSS: "I'm not going to pay you that money anymore, but I want you to still make that trip"
YOU: "Sure Boss, here is my two weeks notice"

Fixed ;)

[Lathum]

He never said he'd be a yesman...he said if you don't like it, quit and find another job.

you know who say things like "quit and find another job?"

a yesman

[molson]

Don't be mad at the players because they have leverage

They're also tougher to replace than your average joe who makes business trips.

Mike Lowell isn't going to be fired for speaking his mind here. The players know they're untouchable, know they have a very public voice, and they're using that here to stand up for SOMEONE ELSE.

[MrBug708]

If I ever own a company I'll hire you immediately.

BOSS: "Can you make a trip to Japan, it's inconvieient but I'll pay you $40k"
YOU: "Sure Boss"
(months pass)
BOSS: "I'm not going to pay you that money anymore, but I want you to still make that trip"
YOU: "Sure Boss"

As opposed to...

BOSS: "Can you make a trip to Japan, it's to help promote our company and the games will be played there. It's out of the way but I'll pay you $40k"
YOU: "Sure Boss"
(months pass)
BOSS: "I'm not going to pay you that money anymore, but you still to still make that trip"
YOU: "Ya, uh, I'm not going sorry"
BOSS: "Excuse me?
YOU: "That's right, I'm not going to go, I don't think it's fair now
BOSS: "Too bad, you're going"

I think that's probably a little bit more realistic on how it would go...

[Dr. Sak]

you know who say things like "quit and find another job?"

a yesman

That might be the dumbest thing I have ever heard you say. A yesman would bend over and take it...

[MrBug708]

Fixed ;)

Exactly

[MrBug708]

Not even getting into the fact that baseball players can't exactly quit and "ply their trade" somewhere else, what with the anti-trust exemption and everything.

They can play in Japan :)

[Lathum]

That might be the dumbest thing I have ever heard you say. A yesman would bend over and take it...

oh cmon, I say alot more dummer things ;)


my point is that the people who say "if they don't like it should quit" are the ones who are the first to bend over

[molson]

I think that's probably a little bit more realistic on how it would go...

OK, maybe I muddied the waters with that point I made, but back to the beginning....

The coaches haven't complained about anything or threatened to quit. I'm sure they wouldn't quit over this. You're complaining that the players are sticking up for the coaches. Which just seems like a strange thing to complain about (to me).

[Dr. Sak]

oh cmon, I say alot more dummer things ;)


my point is that the people who say "if they don't like it should quit" are the ones who are the first to bend over

True...i need not mention the power forward :)

[Lathum]

True...i need not mention the power forward :)

lol

[vtbub]

This will teach the Sox to get stuff in writing. As much as you want to take someone for their word, you have to protect your best interests and have the promises written down.


Probably the smartest post in this thread. MLB has really done something quite stupid by even letting this become an issue. No wonder why there are trust issues between the league and the union.

As far as Oakland is concerned, from what I've read today, they did not know that Boston's staff was getting paid until Boston brouht it to their attention.

[Masked]

Clearly, the players/staff of the Red Sox (and not the A's) thought something was promised that wasn't - MLB's legions of lawyers who would have been involved in the negotiations would ensure that they didn't break any contract. The bonus was probably something that got brought up in negotations but was never agreed to - however, someone on the Red Sox presented it to the team and staff as if it was a done deal.

[molson]

It's been "resolved", with neither side saying how (someone's trying to save face). I would guess that the coaches are getting paid now.

[Dr. Sak]

In the grand scheme of things...$40,000 is a drop in the bucket to the MLB.

[molson]

Clearly, the players/staff of the Red Sox (and not the A's) thought something was promised that wasn't - MLB's legions of lawyers who would have been involved in the negotiations would ensure that they didn't break any contract. The bonus was probably something that got brought up in negotations but was never agreed to - however, someone on the Red Sox presented it to the team and staff as if it was a done deal.

Schilling refered to a conference call where stuff, including the coach's pay, was "promised". That might explain why this wasn't an issue for the A's - Schilling is all about this kind of off-the-field stuff and I see him as the instigator not only for this stuff today, but probably as the guy who really pushed this trip to his teamates in the first place (including relaying a lot of these "promises" that weren't really part of the deal).

[Lathum]

In the grand scheme of things...$40,000 is a drop in the bucket to the MLB.

not to the coach who makes 100K

[Dr. Sak]

not to the coach who makes 100K

I think i misphrased it...paying the coaches the $40,000 is a drop in the bucket to the MLB as a whole...not to the coaches getting it.

[Lathum]

I think i misphrased it...paying the coaches the $40,000 is a drop in the bucket to the MLB as a whole...not to the coaches getting it.

someone on TV made the point earlier that there are 6 coaches at 40K per is about the rookis minimum.

[RedKingGold]

I hate Unions with a passion. They have outlived their usefulness

Forget it. He's rolling.

[Ksyrup]

so should each team have to pony up the money since they are all part of MLB?

I don't care where they get the money from. They can take it from the general pot o' gold that funded the Mitchell Report.

[JonInMiddleGA]

someplace most people would lke to go

Umm ... I'd strongly question that, especially if all you're going to do is work while you're there.

[larrymcg421]

This is so stupid. The MLB agreed to pay the money. They went back on that agreement. If someone told you that you were going to get $40,000 for somethign, and then later said you'd get jack shit, I think you'd be pretty pissed. If you weren't, then you're probably the kind of pushover who wouldn't make a good MLB coach, which might explain why the A's coaches are taking it and the Red Sox coaches aren't.

[Radii]

As opposed to...

BOSS: "Can you make a trip to Japan, it's to help promote our company and the games will be played there. It's out of the way but I'll pay you $40k"
YOU: "Sure Boss"
(months pass)
BOSS: "I'm not going to pay you that money anymore, but you still to still make that trip"
YOU: "Ya, uh, I'm not going sorry"
BOSS: "Excuse me?
YOU: "That's right, I'm not going to go, I don't think it's fair now
BOSS: "Too bad, you're going"

I think that's probably a little bit more realistic on how it would go...

followed by

YOU: "Nope. We made a deal and you're backing out on your end. I'm not going, I'd rather quit."

or in the case of baseball players, risk a fine/forfeiture of games.


For once, something going on in baseball actually has valid, simple real world comparisons. A payment was agreed to, one side backed down, the other side played hardball over the original agreement. Seems pretty standard to me.

[darkenigma510]

I side with H_B here - it's just a business trip like thousands of others do everyday - the coaches and staff should "deal with it" and do their jobs. Assuming their employer is doing nothing illegal (which doesn't seem to be the case here), they should go find another job if they don't like their current compensation.

So when you are promised money and don't get it you should just bend over and take it?

[darkenigma510]

Also, MLB is making a lot of money off this. It's not like they are hard up for cash and need to be cheap. They are being greedy. They are making good money and the piggies decided to keep more money in their pockets because they figured the coaches have the least leverage and thus easiest target to take advantage of. They were wrong.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Why are we all assuming that the MLB agreed to this? Because Curt Schilling said so? Has a written agreement come to light?

I think it's good that the Red Sox players decided to stand up for their coaches based on their understanding of what was agreed to. It's a nice move on their part.

[Lathum]

Why are we all assuming that the MLB agreed to this? Because Curt Schilling said so? Has a written agreement come to light?



so you think the players and coaches conspired to do this in order to get an extra 40K for the coaches?

[Masked]

So when you are promised money and don't get it you should just bend over and take it?

Based on my understanding - they were never promised the money though; someone, within the Red Sox, just told them they were. molson's posts, for example, lays out a realistic scenario. The players are just complaining because they didn't get everything they wanted.

[Lathum]

. The players are just complaining because they didn't get everything they wanted.

I have no inside knowledge ( obviously) but if you think this is the players " complaining" you are sorely mistaken.

They are standing up for the rights of others who don't have the power to stand up for themselves.

[Honolulu_Blue]

so you think the players and coaches conspired to do this in order to get an extra 40K for the coaches?

:confused:

That's not at all what I am saying. Maybe the idea was floated by one side or the other and never agreed to. There are lots of ways in which misunderstandings take place, especially when things are not in writing.

[Calis]

I don't understand the people saying that the players should just suck it up and play. The analogies of one of us being sent on a business trip and not having the option to refuse are a huge stretch and really makes it sound like the people are just jealous that the players have the leverage to do something like this and they personally don't.

If the players wanted to boycott it, then I say go for it, and take whatever repercussions come with that. If you have the leverage, and you know you're getting screwed why wouldn't you fight back? If we're talking the situation earlier where your boss offers you cash on a trip and then rescinds, sure I might go if it means my job, but if I know I'm too important for them to get rid of, I'm going to fight it. Maybe he'd think twice before spouting false promises next time.

Now whether this agreement was actually made or not, no idea, but if the players thought it was when they did this then I say good for them. That 40k could be a nice chunk of change for a lot of those coaches as mentioned earlier.

I just don't see where the players/coaches are the bad guys here, unless they're just flat out lying but I don't think that's likely.

[molson]

The analogies of one of us being sent on a business trip and not having the option to refuse are a huge stretch and really makes it sound like the people are just jealous that the players have the leverage to do something like this and they personally don't.



That's it. Envy is a damaging thing, let it go.

[SirFozzie]

Good on the Sox:

Major League Baseball agreed to pay the managers, coaches and trainers on the trip $20,000 each from management's proceeds, a person familiar with the agreement said, speaking on condition of anonymity because details weren't announced. The Red Sox agreed to make up the difference to make the amount equal, and to pay some of the other team personnel making the trip, the person said.

The Athletics also were considering a boycott at one point today.

[CU Tiger]

Jusst a few points I havent read.
While the managers are gone someone has to take care of kids, pets, homes, etc. there is a real cost to them. 40k, probably not, but there is a cost to this "vacation".

Also what about the manager whose teams suffers serious jet lag, goes in a 30 day funk until they finally recover, misses the playoffs and loses his job. Damn sure Id want 40k to hedge my bets.


Finally all the analogies with Boss Employee are not valid. the teams are not telling the managers to go to Tokyo, MLB is.
MLB is not an employer of any of the mangers the Boston Red Sox are.

[DaddyTorgo]

I think the whole thing is stupid. And i'd say that if it was any other team or teams that had to go over there. You're essentially penalizing those two teams at the start of the season, and in some seasons every game counts.

If you really want to do it, why not have it be a "second all-star game" with players from all the teams, to spread the effects out more evenly.

fuck you bud selig & MLB. Another stupidass idea.

[st.cronin]

I loled when I heard about this.

[Logan]

I think the whole thing is stupid. And i'd say that if it was any other team or teams that had to go over there. You're essentially penalizing those two teams at the start of the season, and in some seasons every game counts.

If you really want to do it, why not have it be a "second all-star game" with players from all the teams, to spread the effects out more evenly.

fuck you bud selig & MLB. Another stupidass idea.

While I agree this is stupid and puts the teams at a disadvantage, this was planned better than the Mets-Cubs series that took place in Japan in 2000. The Mets had 4 days off and then played a not-fucked-up Padres team. Both these teams will get 5 days off and then come back and play each other.