Battlestar Galactica Season 4.5 - The end is near!

[Kodos]

I don't understand why SFL and bad-example continue to watch if these "gaffes" are so unbearable. BSG, a cable TV program, has a limited budget. They can't just create new cars and musical instruments and whatever just for the sake of it not being a contemporary item due to money and time constraints. Hell, they've admitted that they had to do things like the boxing episode from last season just to save money that was spent on special-effects laden episodes.

If those things bother you that much, do yourself a favor and watch something else. Although I don't see many movies or shows out there that don't have similar problems. Just about any action movie these days is made up of a series of utterly unrealistic fight sequences. Guess I'll have to stop watching them and stick to The Price Is Right.

[Bad-example]

I don't understand why SFL and bad-example continue to watch if these "gaffes" are so unbearable.

Well, I watch because the show is still entertaining. The flaws detract from my enjoyment but I am as hooked as many of you.

[Tigercat]

Multiple cultures separated in development on Earth envisioned dragons, a mythical creature that never existed.

Why is it impossible to accept hummer like vehicles or the same fashions and musical instruments in other cultures? Especially if this culture may be a decedent from ours or some sort of alternate timeline?

I don't think its about turning a blind eye, it is about having an active enough imagination or not.

[Edward64]

Missed the first half, but the second half is pretty frakkin good so far!

[kcchief19]

Holy hell this is awesome!

[Tigercat]

Well, friends, you have your answer, more or less, on how we miraculously developed the same clothes, tools, culture, ect as the BSG universe.

One thing is obvious: Bob Dylan a direct decedent of one of the Cylon lines. :D

[Edward64]

Well, the last 2 minutes really sucked.

[Tigercat]

Wow. Maybe the most satisfying series finale of all time for me. Moore and company deserve serious props on this one.

[Tigercat]

Well, the last 2 minutes really sucked.

The only thing I didn't like about it was the goodbye to Kara's character. I liked the tongue in cheek fast forward.

[ISiddiqui]

Awesome, awesome, awesome! So BSG actually becomes the first Earthlings and head Baltar and Caprica (as well as Starbuck it seems) were angels.

Great battle sequences and then everything coming together to frame a story of them forming the civilization of our Earth.

[ISiddiqui]

Well, the last 2 minutes really sucked.

Disagree... All has happened before and all will happen again. Loved the final scenes :D

[Raiders Army]

Welp, it was a great finale. Good deal and nice wrap up. More plotlines were wrapped up than I thought.


1. I honestly thought that the mental Six and Baltar were God and the Devil. I suppose not at the end.
2. Was Kara just a ghost then?
3. Nice wrap-up with the dream sequence and having it come true with Caprica and Balta taking Hera away from Athena and Laura.
4. It was a little unbelievable that people would give up comfort. What's the first thing you build, a distillery? Would you give up a sleeping bag? That part I found hard to swallow.

[Tigercat]

In regards to 4 The one thing specifically they might have been able to do better is use the threat of the Cylons returning to the planet as another reason not to build technology up again right away. But by that part in the finale they were into happy ending mode.

[kcchief19]

Well, the last 2 minutes really sucked.
I think only the last 20 seconds sucked. I didn't like the montage of news clips of robots. For a show that I thought always handled cultural commentary so well and subtlety, I felt like that segment was just a little over the top. I had no problem with the Baltar and Caprica scene.

Otherwise, one of the best series finales ever and one that for once lived up to the hype. The only thing I didn't really like was the Anakin Skywalker-esque missile attack on the base ship. The battle scenes were spectacular, and the scene when Tyrol turned on Tory was utterly fantastic.

I'm still not sure what to make of the fates and roles of Starbuck, Baltar and Caprica. Were they "angels?" I need Ronald Moore to explain it to me -- and nice cameo at the end for him.

It was a sad ending for some of the characters. I though I wasn't going to like the direction Adama was going but it turned out well.

And kudos to Moore for some nice head fakes along the way. I was fully on board with the theory a long time ago that this was in the past and we would find that the colonies were our ancestors. The discovery of the Cylon Earth was a great psych out and I fell for it. Tigercat nailed out -- you can't criticize the show know for using Earth beliefs, cultural and conventions.

Tremendously well done. Aces.

[Raiders Army]

In regards to 4 The one thing specifically they might have been able to do better is use the threat of the Cylons returning to the planet as another reason not to build technology up again right away. But by that part in the finale they were into happy ending mode.

I can sort of understand that but where do you draw the line? No fire? No wheel? No needle and thread? No guns? Hunting is going to be near impossible for them without guns.

This is being picky and I can swallow it. Overall, the series was great and it's good that it went out well.

[kcchief19]

And can't wait for Battlestar Galactica: The Plan -- the attack on humanity from the Cylon side. More questions will be answered!

[ISiddiqui]

I had no problem with the Baltar and Caprica scene.

I thought that was absolutely delicious. A high point to end... but I wonder about that "You know he hates that name. Silly me..." part. Very mysterious. I doubt they were saying Hendrix was God (the song came on right after), but who knows?

[Tigercat]

That line re-enforced what Baltar(real Baltar) said earlier, that some force had to be interfering with and guiding what was happening. But that final line also reiterated that God as we think of him may not be that force. They are either leaving it up to the viewer or teasing it as something that will remain an ambiguous idea throughout the spin-offs.

[ISiddiqui]

Well they are leaving it up to the viewer, I'm sure... but an interesting sentence there.

[Tigercat]

Well they are leaving it up to the viewer, I'm sure... but an interesting sentence there.

What I mean as the alternate of purely leaving it up to the viewer is that Moore may have something specific in mind that has been interfering (and isn't "God.") Maybe some kind of Cylon like consciousness that has seen the cycle happen before. Something that could show up more significantly in a spin-off one day.

[ISiddiqui]

Interesting thing I just read. Last 2 minutes were also important to show why Hera was so important.

[ISiddiqui]

Interesting interview with Ron Moore:

Battlestar Galactica's Ron Moore Answers Our Burning Questions - Today's News: Our Take | TVGuide.com (http://www.tvguide.com/News/Battlestar-Galacticas-Ron-1004256.aspx?rss=breakingnews)

Seems to indicate that Starbuck was more Jesus part 1 than an angel and that the last 2 minutes was something they thought was very important to make it current and applicable to us.

[ISiddiqui]

Btw, anyone else reminded of "Good Omens' by Pratchett & Gaiman in the final scene? :D

[Eaglesfan27]

Interesting interview with Ron Moore:

Battlestar Galactica's Ron Moore Answers Our Burning Questions - Today's News: Our Take | TVGuide.com (http://www.tvguide.com/News/Battlestar-Galacticas-Ron-1004256.aspx?rss=breakingnews)

Seems to indicate that Starbuck was more Jesus part 1 than an angel and that the last 2 minutes was something they thought was very important to make it current and applicable to us.


I like that more than her being an angel. Her ending was the only thing that really bothered me with the episode.

Edit: Just read that interview, and I still don't like her ending. Loved the rest of it.

[Edward64]

Is the assumption that BSG crew or their descendents mated with the natives? If so I think that's pretty bogus ... it would be like "animalistic".

Baltar and Caprica head versions ... angels, demons WTF? I know God works in mysterious ways, but the slaughter of billions of innocent people to do what, to break what cycle? sheesh.

Story of Job and the unnecessary cruelty to a human to win a bet and prove a point.

[Tigercat]

Is the assumption that BSG crew or their descendents mated with the natives? If so I think that's pretty bogus ... it would be like "animalistic".



My impression of it is that the inter-mating would be a long term thing, after they had begun to interact with the natives and taught them to be more "civilized." At least a few generations down the line.

[kcchief19]

Baltar and Caprica head versions ... angels, demons WTF? I know God works in mysterious ways, but the slaughter of billions of innocent people to do what, to break what cycle? sheesh.
But I think that goes to the question of why does God (in whatever form you worship) allow massive pain and suffering.

One thing I forget to mention about the episode that I thought was a very nice touch ... the incorporation of the original show's theme song into the scene where the Galactica is flying into the sun. I think they did the something similar in the miniseries. Very nice.

[kcchief19]

I like that more than her being an angel. Her ending was the only thing that really bothered me with the episode.

Edit: Just read that interview, and I still don't like her ending. Loved the rest of it.
I initially was neutral on her ending but after reading Moore's concept I buy it. At first I really wanted to know specifically what she was, but now I'm comfortable leaving it open to interpretation. Part of me wanted Kara and Lee to get a chance but clearly that was a fairy-tale ending I give them kudos for not going that route.

Two other things I keep forgetting to mention but the interview reminded me of: (1) I was glad to see Helo survive and make it to the end -- my heart just sank when he got shot because I didn't think he was going to make it; (2) the shot of Galactica flying over the moon and the screen panning to show Earth was just breathtaking.

Edit: Last addition, I swear. It's been mentioned early but the scene intercutting the dream of Roslin, Boomer, Caprica and Baltar chasing Hera with the battle sequence was frakkin' brilliant.

[Apathetic Lurker]

Well I had no problem with the clothing and things of that nature but did notice the similarities to modern things too but got to thinking that since modern humanity is the offshoot of cylon/human interbreeding(in the BSG Universe) it actually makes some sense. Didnt some models of cylons have a group memory imprint or something like that? So in the intervening years the encoded imprint from those thoughts stayed and every once in a while a trigger would release a snippet from those early settlers. That would explain the similar clothing styles, similar vehicles ,the piano, the Greek diety names etc etc.. Well, crap..Thats what i'm using to enjoy the damn fine series.

After all, I enjoyed Enemy at the Gates as an entertaining movie, discounting the fact the right rear drive sprocket spacing was wrong on the PzIII's and the PzIII's were in reality Swiss Pz 61's..If crap like that bothered me I would never enjoy any movie. Lighten up. Its just a show, not reality. Add some stuff to make it semi plausible and enjoy

Its 5am.... i've been up all night and cranky..if I rambled incoherently to damn bad

[Raiders Army]

My impression of it is that the inter-mating would be a long term thing, after they had begun to interact with the natives and taught them to be more "civilized." At least a few generations down the line.

Were we watching the same show??? There was at least one sex scene in every episode! :)

[Edward64]

My impression of it is that the inter-mating would be a long term thing, after they had begun to interact with the natives and taught them to be more "civilized." At least a few generations down the line.
The excessive body hair, bad teeth, semi-high brow ain't going away in a few generations.:)

[Bad-example]

That well and truly sucked. Zero interest in spin offs. They never explained the stuff that didn't belong and they blamed all the mystical bullshit on some type of god character. Completely lame.

[ISiddiqui]

The excessive body hair, bad teeth, semi-high brow ain't going away in a few generations.:)

Yeah, but with Ellen and Baltar... ;)

Amusing stuff on the Twitterverse to the last 2 minutes, like warning people about the Roombas :D.

[Edward64]

But I think that goes to the question of why does God (in whatever form you worship) allow massive pain and suffering.

Too gentle. In the context of this story, slaughter of x billions, a fair number of children and therefore true innocents.

I guess its a redeeming, uplifting story if you are one of the 30K+ that survived but otherwise, sheesh ... the religious overtones and how it ended with demons/angels/God's plan etc. really screwed it up for me.

[Raiders Army]

I truly think that this finale will be judged much better than other serialized television finales like Lost.

[Galaril]

Too gentle. In the context of this story, slaughter of x billions, a fair number of children and therefore true innocents.

I guess its a redeeming, uplifting story if you are one of the 30K+ that survived but otherwise, sheesh ... the religious overtones and how it ended with demons/angels/God's plan etc. really screwed it up for me.

Yeah, I agree I never so the story foundation to be based on such strong religious undertones.

[Galaril]

I thought that was absolutely delicious. A high point to end... but I wonder about that "You know he hates that name. Silly me..." part. Very mysterious. I doubt they were saying Hendrix was God (the song came on right after), but who knows?

I agree I actually liked the last two minute scene more than the character wrap up stuff preceding it.

[Galaril]

I thought that was absolutely delicious. A high point to end... but I wonder about that "You know he hates that name. Silly me..." part. Very mysterious. I doubt they were saying Hendrix was God (the song came on right after), but who knows?

I am going to go back and listen to that part but I believe Baltar said "IT hates that name "not him which adds even more mystery but certainly could point to some super being or supercylon like entity something like that. Unfortunately we may never know but I am sure Moore put it there for a reason and he at least plans on explaining someday if given the chance by the networks to of course. I like that for once a series has ended in reasonable amount of time and has answer 80-905 of the shows open questions...major ones at least.

[ISiddiqui]

I did go back and it sounds like "He" ;)

[kcchief19]

Too gentle. In the context of this story, slaughter of x billions, a fair number of children and therefore true innocents.

I guess its a redeeming, uplifting story if you are one of the 30K+ that survived but otherwise, sheesh ... the religious overtones and how it ended with demons/angels/God's plan etc. really screwed it up for me.
Despite billions versus million, spiritually is there really much of a difference between the fictional holocaust of the colonies and the real holocast of Nazi Germany? To me a holocaust is a holocaust, and you're still left with the question of why a god would allow death on such a massive scale.
Yeah, I agree I never so the story foundation to be based on such strong religious undertones.
I didn't see it that way. In fact, I thought the finale underminded the religious overtones quite a bit.

I'm being overly simplistic here, but essentially there were four essential belief systems portrayed in the series: monotheism, polytheism, agnosticism and atheism. In the end, the show doesn't really answer the question of whether any of those answers are correct -- which is fine by me because we do not know. I understand that people who are committed to one of those belief systems will find a problem with the fact that the show doesn't definitively come down on their side. But I thought it was handled extremely well.

Oddly, discounting the blasphemy that was Galactica 1980, I think this show ended up honoring and connecting to the religion and mystical overtones of the original extremely well. The original series laid the groundwork for the concept that life here began out there, and that our cultures and religions were tied to Kobol. The original Galactica found pyramids and ruins that all tied in with ancient human civilizations.

I think it's accidental but ingenious that all the beliefs of found with the humans and Cylons are represented in our culture. Very well done in my mind.

[ISiddiqui]

In the end, the show doesn't really answer the question of whether any of those answers are correct

Though it seems to indicate the atheist one is incorrect ;).

[SFL Cat]

I don't understand why SFL and bad-example continue to watch if these "gaffes" are so unbearable.

Because I'm married with children and my ideal Friday night, unless I'm going out on a date with the wife, or going out with friends, is sitting at home channel surfing. Every now and then I come across BSG, watch some or most of it, and have always remained underwhelmed. If my wife is with me, she'll usually chime in with a "can we watch something else?"

[Crapshoot]

That well and truly sucked. Zero interest in spin offs. They never explained the stuff that didn't belong and they blamed all the mystical bullshit on some type of god character. Completely lame.

It turned into mysticism and pseduo-religious bullshit. I felt cheated out. The show I fell in love with in Season 1 rejects technology so completely? Really?

[Tigercat]

They never explained the stuff that didn't belong.

Well you have officially shown what kind of viewer you are. Sorry, but if you didn't get satisfactory Sci-Fi answers to that after the finale, there is something wrong with you as a viewer, not something wrong with the show.

[Edward64]

I did stay up to watch the last frakkin special (missed it last Mon?). Pretty fun. I really am going to miss those characters.

Instead of Caprica, I wish they spun off a BSG - next generation series, it would be fascinating to see how their descendents went on.

Also, forgot to mention the Galen scene with Tory was great.

Even with all its faults (i.e. Baltar), its been a while since another series has caught my attention. Kudos to the BSG crew ... I think 'frak' will stay in my vernacular for a while.

[ISiddiqui]

Great (looong) interview with Ron Moore:

See you on the other side: 'Battlestar Galactica's' series finale, 'Daybreak' | The Watcher (http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2009/03/battlestar-galactica-daybreak-finale-moore-mcdonnell-olmos.html)

I like this about Starbuck:


MR: I know that you don’t let yourself be guided by what you think the fan reaction might be, and you do what you feel is right for the show, but the ending of Kara – her just disappearing like that. That’ll certainly be a starting point for debate.


RDM: Oh yeah, it’ll be controversial. There will be people who will absolutely hate it and think that we failed in our mission. We debated it in the [writers] room, I thought about it a long time, and I had sort of the same answer. And the more I struggled to give definition to it, the less satisfying it became. There various avenues we went down, discussions, saying she’s specifically this or that. And every time it felt uninteresting and kind of pedestrian.


It felt like, if she’s truly connected to the Eternal, if she’s connected to this other power, this other thing in the universe, as long as you know she’s connected to it and she’s fulfilled her destiny, brought us to this place, brought us to two Earths, really, that’s enough. That should just be left to your imagination, left to your inquiry, left you to try to fill in the blanks we leave. That was my answer and I’m sure -- I know – people will debate it
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[ISiddiqui]

It turned into mysticism and pseduo-religious bullshit.

What do you mean "turned into"? The mysticism and religion was always there.

And it didn't reject technology as much as saying that technology and people have to move together. And, of course, one can easily see building the Cylons and then they try to destroy the human race to be more anti-technology.

[Neon_Chaos]

It has all happened before, but it does not need to happen again.

T'was a great end to a great show.

[Bad-example]

Well you have officially shown what kind of viewer you are. Sorry, but if you didn't get satisfactory Sci-Fi answers to that after the finale, there is something wrong with you as a viewer, not something wrong with the show.

Burn.

[Neon_Chaos]

Awesome, awesome, awesome! So BSG actually becomes the first Earthlings and head Baltar and Caprica (as well as Starbuck it seems) were angels.

Great battle sequences and then everything coming together to frame a story of them forming the civilization of our Earth.

Methinks Kara was a "Christ" character. In that she had actually died, was resurrected (by "God"), and led humanity to its future.

[Galaril]

I did stay up to watch the last frakkin special (missed it last Mon?). Pretty fun. I really am going to miss those characters.

Instead of Caprica, I wish they spun off a BSG - next generation series, it would be fascinating to see how their descendents went on.

Also, forgot to mention the Galen scene with Tory was great.

Even with all its faults (i.e. Baltar), its been a while since another series has caught my attention. Kudos to the BSG crew ... I think 'frak' will stay in my vernacular for a while.

All due respect but if you mean a spin off of the descendants on earth walking around in loin clothes and picking berries no thanks;)

[Galaril]

Methinks Kara was a "Christ" character. In that she had actually died, was resurrected (by "God"), and led humanity to its future.


That for me seems a tough pill to swallow I mean Starbuck as a living breathing human was a real son of a bitch. I think abetter person for a biblical comparison would of been Abraham or Saint Paul I think who was a Roman soldier and later found God and became a christian or one of the various characters from the old testament that slips my mind right now that weren't the greatest people and found god and turned it around. I did like the whole stuff with her Dad that was cool.

[ISiddiqui]

Methinks Kara was a "Christ" character. In that she had actually died, was resurrected (by "God"), and led humanity to its future.

After thinking about it, I must agree. She's the messiah of the fleet.

[Neon_Chaos]

That for me seems a tough pill to swallow I mean Starbuck as a living breathing human was a real son of a bitch. I think abetter person for a biblical comparison would of been Abraham or Saint Paul I think who was a Roman soldier and later found God and became a christian or one of the various characters from the old testament that slips my mind right now that weren't the greatest people and found god and turned it around. I did like the whole stuff with her Dad that was cool.

Christ was considered as the messiah. Thrace is the messiah of the fleet.

[Neon_Chaos]

I always thought that RDM would have been painting himself into a corner what with all the references to a "higher power" manipulating behind the scenes throughout the series:

- The Pythian prophecies coming true (at first, everthing seemed coincidental, but it soon became clear that a higher power was at work)
- Baltar's "hand of god" moment in season one.
- Baltar's praying and saving of a young boy afflicted with meningitis in exchange for his life.
- Kara Thrace leading them to Earth
- Everything else falling into place.

I never expected RDM actually pointing out and saying "Hey, it's the God character I've been inserting into the storyline for the past four years. Hello. I've been hinting at it for the past four seasons, it's just that you refuse to see it or believe it."

Sure, I can understand people not liking the finale, but I loved it. It was a fitting and tongue-in-cheek end to the best show on TV in the past five years.

[RendeR]

But I think that goes to the question of why does God (in whatever form you worship) allow massive pain and suffering.

One thing I forget to mention about the episode that I thought was a very nice touch ... the incorporation of the original show's theme song into the scene where the Galactica is flying into the sun. I think they did the something similar in the miniseries. Very nice.

I loved that touch. I always loved the original show, grew to dislike its camping "everything has a happy ending" way of writing (thanks dumbass 80's life) but still loved the show itself. The theme song was something I used to play on my tape player as a kid to help me go to sleep at night

Well you have officially shown what kind of viewer you are. Sorry, but if you didn't get satisfactory Sci-Fi answers to that after the finale, there is something wrong with you as a viewer, not something wrong with the show.

I've been saying this all along. Its been pretty obvious. I'm sorry you couldn't move beyond these issues BE.

I did stay up to watch the last frakkin special (missed it last Mon?). Pretty fun. I really am going to miss those characters.

Instead of Caprica, I wish they spun off a BSG - next generation series, it would be fascinating to see how their descendents went on.

Also, forgot to mention the Galen scene with Tory was great.

Even with all its faults (i.e. Baltar), its been a while since another series has caught my attention. Kudos to the BSG crew ... I think 'frak' will stay in my vernacular for a while.

Definitely a show I will go back and watch numerous times. Agree wholeheartedly with these points (bold)

All in all I loved a lot of things they did at the end. I felt they rushed it a bit but there was SO much storyline built up in this series and they only had so many episodes to end it in so I think they did the best they could with the time they had.

I noted someone disliked the missile attack that destroyed the colony, can you explain why? I thought the dead body accidentally eliminating or at least severely damaging the colony (aka a plot point that keeps the cylons from following the human/cylon group) was a nice touch?

I've never bee one to collect a TV series on DVD but this will probably be the first one I add. There is just so much in this series to enjoy, whether its the first season and the "escape at all costs" direction, the second season and its weaker but just as interesting "survival of the race" angle, or the last 2 where it becomes more philosophical and a "thinker's" story.

I love it. It was more than I could have ever expected from a remake of one of my favorite shows of all time.

Best Science Fiction Series ever created for television.

[Bad-example]

I've been saying this all along. Its been pretty obvious. I'm sorry you couldn't move beyond these issues BE.

Yeah, it sucked they never came up with a reasonable explanation for all the anachronisms. But really, nothing is ever out of place is a show where "well, god did it" is used as an explanation. No need for logic when you have holy magic to justify your ridiculous costuming, etc.

[sachmo71]

Btw, anyone else reminded of "Good Omens' by Pratchett & Gaiman in the final scene? :D

And Bedazzled?

[RendeR]

Yeah, it sucked they never came up with a reasonable explanation for all the anachronisms. But really, nothing is ever out of place is a show where "well, god did it" is used as an explanation. No need for logic when you have holy magic to justify your ridiculous costuming, etc.


The "show" isn't saying anything of the kind, its leaving up to your interpretation.

As for the so called anachronisms there is a very plausible and sensible reasoning. "this has all happened before and it will all happen again" its the basis for the entire show.

If as the show suggests, our Earth and its human population have a direct connection with the survivors of the 13 tribes, it makes perfect sense that creatures developing from the same genetic stock develop tools, items, customs and styles that are very similar to their ancestors.

In that vein the use of such props in the show is perfectly acceptable because, as has been said over and over again, They're just representations that the show uses to allow us to understand what they're supposed to be.

I'm sorry You can't see or understand that or that you seem to think every single item should look and feel completely different, but as I and others have said, thats your problem not the shows.

[Bad-example]

Meh. If you think they were justified in using all those anachronisms, more power to you. I say they were being lazy and cheap and illogical. I guess I didn't appreciate the fanboy ability to overlook glaring errors. It is one thing to recognize and acknowledge mistakes and claim they don't bother you. It is an entirely different scenario to bend over backwards to try and explain things that clearly have no reasonable explanation.

Sorry, this show triggered my bullshit detector on a regular basis. They ultimately ended with the biggest piece of bullshit, the god angle. Turns out this show was little more than John from Cincinnati with rocket ships.

[JonInMiddleGA]

{scratches head}

Pretty much throughout the life of the show I was aware that there was likely to be a significant role for some higher power, whether they go with God, Ronzoni, or whatever. And I don't watch the frackin show but I knew that. And now there's apparently some sort of upset because they stuck with it? Huh?

Heck, the original concept starting with Glen Larson had a number of theological influences, Mormonism in particular.

[ISiddiqui]

I believe, JIMG, that a lot of people hoped the religious parts were just a sideshow and not central.

And why do people keep responding to Bad-example? Let him stay in his strange bubble alone, k?

[JonInMiddleGA]

I believe, JIMG, that a lot of people hoped the religious parts were just a sideshow and not central.

That kind of seems like watching Seinfeld and thinking there would eventually be a plot isn't it? Whatever I guess, just strikes me a little strange.

[kcchief19]

I noted someone disliked the missile attack that destroyed the colony, can you explain why? I thought the dead body accidentally eliminating or at least severely damaging the colony (aka a plot point that keeps the cylons from following the human/cylon group) was a nice touch?
That was probably me. I called it the Anakin Skywalker moment. It was a complete fluke that happened to occur at the exact precise moment it needed to occur. It was a convenient and lazy way toward resolution, and that was something the show didn't do very frequently. It didn't ruin the show for me but there's no good way to justify it.

While there may be a "hand of god" guiding things, that's typically what we saw in the show. While the show suggests there is a higher power, it all embraces free will. That moment undermineded the case for free will because it would suggest that god put in motion the events rather than just influencing them.
And why do people keep responding to Bad-example? Let him stay in his strange bubble alone, k?
Exactly. No need to feed the trolls. He's said his piece and hates the show so it begs the question why he still wanders in. I'm sure he'll wander in here and explain that too. This has all happened before, and it will happen again.

[Bad-example]

Exactly. No need to feed the trolls. He's said his piece and hates the show so it begs the question why he still wanders in. I'm sure he'll wander in here and explain that too. This has all happened before, and it will happen again.

Call me a troll and then predict I will return to the thread and post. You must have some kind of future sight! Amazing! :rolleyes:

[ISiddiqui]

That kind of seems like watching Seinfeld and thinking there would eventually be a plot isn't it? Whatever I guess, just strikes me a little strange.

Oh, I agree fully. I just remember all the discussions I've had (mostly online) where people would sigh and say something like another episode with the mystical crap. Made me wonder when anyone said BSG was a show just about 'spolsions.

[Galaril]

I guess from what Moore said in that TV Guide interview that Glen Larson is making a feayure film that will be based on the original BSG not Moore creation so for any of the folks like my brother who refused to watch or did not like the new BSG they have that to look forward to.

[Galaril]

I guess from what Moore said in that TV Guide interview that Glen Larson is making a feature film that will be based on the original BSG not Moore creation so for any of the folks like my brother who refused to watch or did not like the new BSG they have that to look forward to.

[Galaril]

I guess from what Moore said in that TV Guide interview that Glen Larson is making a feature film that will be based on the original BSG not Moore creation so for any of the folks like my brother who refused to watch or did not like the new BSG they have that to look forward to.

[RendeR]

Meh. If you think they were justified in using all those anachronisms, more power to you. I say they were being lazy and cheap and illogical. I guess I didn't appreciate the fanboy ability to overlook glaring errors. It is one thing to recognize and acknowledge mistakes and claim they don't bother you. It is an entirely different scenario to bend over backwards to try and explain things that clearly have no reasonable explanation.

Sorry, this show triggered my bullshit detector on a regular basis. They ultimately ended with the biggest piece of bullshit, the god angle. Turns out this show was little more than John from Cincinnati with rocket ships.


I think the thing you're missing here is the general consensus approach.

If 20 out of 30 people think somethings wrong, it probably is. if 2 do, its probably not the thing thats mistaken, but the 2 that think so.

I honestly hope you just stop caring and move on. The show had its issues. The nit picky bullshit you've ranted about for 7 pages and a couple years really isn't one of the problems. That issue is yours. I'm sorry you have such a limited ability to suspend disbelief.

*** end of responses to BE's glaring inability to move on


As for the "god" angle, what have you been watching for 5 years? Did you never see the original show either? Faith is at the very heart of this show from the time Larson wrote the first short story of "Ark". If you went into BSG thinking it wasn't going to have a major religious theme I'm really not sure what you were thinking.

I'm not sold on the "hand of God" idea for the missile attack either. They were sitting in the middle of an asteroid field around a singularity, I was sort of stunned the missiles didn't go off much sooner. Its not like they needed to go off "right then" either, they could have been fired after Galactica left and would have done the same effect. Having the rock hit the raptor and make the controls get pushed when they did was just some added drama.

I gotta ask though. Did anyone else get emotional when Galactica jumped blind away from the colony and upon reappearing basically cracked and caved in? My stomach just did flip flops. Its such a sad scene. Very well done, but gah, its GALACTICA damnit, she's not supposed to die! *sigh*

[RendeR]

I guess from what Moore said in that TV Guide interview that Glen Larson is making a feayure film that will be based on the original BSG not Moore creation so for any of the folks like my brother who refused to watch or did not like the new BSG they have that to look forward to.


I'm just as excited to see something like this too. Moore's vision of the storyline is much more along the lines of what I would expect such a story to follow, but I loved the old show in its day too. I just thought it was far too campy and "happy go lucky everything will be ok" type of thing. Seeing something knew in that vein would be a very interesting contrast to Moore's creation.

[RendeR]

Oh, I agree fully. I just remember all the discussions I've had (mostly online) where people would sigh and say something like another episode with the mystical crap. Made me wonder when anyone said BSG was a show just about 'spolsions.


I always wondered about this for most all Sci-Fi shows. the Original Star Trek had numerous philosophical angles and took on modern day current events in damned near every episode and you really didn't see anyone tearing it down for doing so. The newer versions of star trek all did so as well, just dressing them up differently. Yet no one tore them down for it either. I just don't get why people seem to think a "space based" TV show (for those who complain that BSG really isn't Sci-FI, not that that makes ANY sense) shouldn't deal with the human condition.

[ISiddiqui]

I gotta ask though. Did anyone else get emotional when Galactica jumped blind away from the colony and upon reappearing basically cracked and caved in? My stomach just did flip flops. Its such a sad scene. Very well done, but gah, its GALACTICA damnit, she's not supposed to die! *sigh*

It was sad, but then again it was a dying leader (My opinion is that Galactica and not Roslin is the dying leader the prophacy spoke of).

[Daimyo]

I always wondered about this for most all Sci-Fi shows. the Original Star Trek had numerous philosophical angles and took on modern day current events in damned near every episode and you really didn't see anyone tearing it down for doing so. The newer versions of star trek all did so as well, just dressing them up differently. Yet no one tore them down for it either. I just don't get why people seem to think a "space based" TV show (for those who complain that BSG really isn't Sci-FI, not that that makes ANY sense) shouldn't deal with the human condition.

I'm stunned that anyone would argue that. I'm not really a sci-fi fan, but I've always thought that the beauty of good sci-fi is that it can tackle the tough issues of the day without all the bias and baggage you'd get if it was about real people, groups, nations, etc.

[Kodos]

I thought prior to the finale that the Galactica would be used to ram the Colony with Adama at the helm as part of the final battle. As it turns out, it was used to ram the Colony, but not with the force that I was imagining. :)

And yes, it was tough watching the old ship crumble.

[Raiders Army]

I think the thing you're missing here is the general consensus approach.

If 20 out of 30 people think somethings wrong, it probably is. if 2 do, its probably not the thing thats mistaken, but the 2 that think so.
In BE's defense, maybe 20 out of 30 regular people think something is wrong. The other 10 are sci-fi fans. :)

I gotta ask though. Did anyone else get emotional when Galactica jumped blind away from the colony and upon reappearing basically cracked and caved in? My stomach just did flip flops. Its such a sad scene. Very well done, but gah, its GALACTICA damnit, she's not supposed to die! *sigh*
Nah, I didn't get emotional when Galactica cracked and caved in a little. I did get a shiver though as the original theme music came on as the fleet went into the sun though.

I agree, she's not supposed to die! :(

[Neon_Chaos]

It was sad, but then again it was a dying leader (My opinion is that Galactica and not Roslin is the dying leader the prophacy spoke of).

I went bananas when, after the jump, I recognized the background as OUR moon, and the slow pan to OUR Earth. :)

[RendeR]

It was sad, but then again it was a dying leader (My opinion is that Galactica and not Roslin is the dying leader the prophacy spoke of).


I agree with this completely. That ship LED the fleet throughout this story. Even when Pegasus was with them, Galactica was the lead ship. I've thought this all through the series and never figured out how to vocalize it. Thanks!

[RendeR]

In BE's defense, maybe 20 out of 30 regular people think something is wrong. The other 10 are sci-fi fans. :)


Nah, I didn't get emotional when Galactica cracked and caved in a little. I did get a shiver though as the original theme music came on as the fleet went into the sun though.

I agree, she's not supposed to die! :(

I too shivered when the old theme song played. it was a fantastic touch.

And I agree with the sentiment about sci-fi fans, but if you aren't a sci-fi fan why would you watch this series anyway? Its like setting yourself up to fail.

[kcchief19]

It was sad, but then again it was a dying leader (My opinion is that Galactica and not Roslin is the dying leader the prophacy spoke of).
I personally think Roslin was the dying leader but it's worth noting that the three most critical people or objects that led them to Earth were Roslin, Galactica and Starbuck and they all died/vanished/destroyed at the end.

[Antmeister]

Nah, I didn't get emotional when Galactica cracked and caved in a little. I did get a shiver though as the original theme music came on as the fleet went into the sun though.

Ditto....fitting theme song for the end of that ship. The only thing that bothered me about the whole scene is that I couldn't understand how Sam was leading all the ships to the Sun.

[flere-imsaho]

Btw, anyone else reminded of "Good Omens' by Pratchett & Gaiman in the final scene? :D

Absolutely! :D

Is the assumption that BSG crew or their descendents mated with the natives? If so I think that's pretty bogus ... it would be like "animalistic".

One theory is that the "natives" are actually Neanderthals, and so don't have a further involvement in human evolution. So we all really are the descendants of the humans and cylons, and Hera is the first "missing mitochrondrial link" to be found.

That kind of seems like watching Seinfeld and thinking there would eventually be a plot isn't it? Whatever I guess, just strikes me a little strange.

On another forum I frequent the consensus is that the finale was terrible. Reading between the lines, the consensus seems to rest upon the idea that BSG should have been more about space battles and man vs. cylon this whole time. Which, let's face it, would have led to it being pretty boring by the time we got to the end of the 4th season.

Ditto....fitting theme song for the end of that ship. The only thing that bothered me about the whole scene is that I couldn't understand how Sam was leading all the ships to the Sun.

I would presume it wouldn't be difficult to network all of their command systems into Galactica's.

[ISiddiqui]

Ditto....fitting theme song for the end of that ship. The only thing that bothered me about the whole scene is that I couldn't understand how Sam was leading all the ships to the Sun.

Well at that point he was a hybrid and I'm sure would be able to control all of the fleet if they allowed him to.

[flere-imsaho]

From Page One:

Also, I'm not sure if that's "Earth", to be honest. Moore's response in the Tribune interview is very lawyerly. The only thing he says categorically is that the 13th tribe called it Earth.

Called it! :D

[flere-imsaho]

I had no problem with the ending for Kara. After her crash, she was an entity created by "God" to have a specific influence on humanity and the cylons that was fulfilled when they got to the "real" Earth. Clearly she understood that just before she disappeared, but prior to that was not self-aware (unlike, say, Head-Baltar and Head-Caprica).

Another point of confusion I'm seeing on the Interwebs regards Adama and why he'd leave Lee forever like that, not just go away, bury Roslin, and then come back. Well, I think Adama is about to die as well, given how much his health clearly deteriorated in the last season. I'd imagine he has only months left to live, and perhaps not that long if he doesn't bother to build the cabin. So he really was leaving Lee for the last time.

Of all the images that strike me from the finale, the one I keep coming back to is Lee's last scene (with Kara). His reaction after his talk about exploration and right after she disappears really sums up the loneliness, but good loneliness he feels, and perhaps all the survivors feel, now that they've made this decision to stop here, and to live the way they're going to live.

[flere-imsaho]

dola - the only "big" unanswered question for me is: what/who exactly where the Lords (Gods) of Kobol? Completely fictional? Super-Cylons? AIs? Actual Gods (but not "God")?

Everything else, I think, is more-or-less explained.

[Antmeister]

...I would presume it wouldn't be difficult to network all of their command systems into Galactica's.

Well at that point he was a hybrid and I'm sure would be able to control all of the fleet if they allowed him to.

Well I had a hard time wrapping my head around that considering they kept everything pretty low-tech to prevent the Cylons from controlling their systems as it was alluded to many times in previous episodes. If he was leading a group of Cylon ships into the Sun, it would have made more sense since Galactica had some Cylon technology.

[Daimyo]

I thought they said they set all the ships to autopilot into the sun.

[kcchief19]

dola - the only "big" unanswered question for me is: what/who exactly where the Lords (Gods) of Kobol? Completely fictional? Super-Cylons? AIs? Actual Gods (but not "God")?
Not having read anything Moore claims in this regard, I'll throw out a pitch that I know not everyone will like.

BSG largely embraces religious plurality. There are archetypes for many religions among by the humans and cylons. If anything, it's the humans who believe in multiple gods and the cylons who believe in the one true god, so it could be said that monotheism in Earth cultural derives from the cylons. It makes sense that the religions of the colonies would be the roots of religions on Earth.

My belief is that the Lords of Kobol were akin to the Gods of Olympus. Essentially, classic mythology is a descendant of the Lords of Kobol. Clearly based on the stories of the Temple of Five and whatnot is that humans/cylons were the ones who created and made those places not gods, just like similar icons on Earth.

I think the message the show delivers is generally that "god" exists but not the way we envision it. Note "angel" Baltar's line about about how "god" doesn't like to be called that. Of course, I come to the conclusion because it more closely resembles my own belief system that there is a higher power but we do not understand it. Your mileage may vary.

And of course maybe some of these will be addresed in The Plan movie, since maybe we may learn more about the cylon religion and Temple of Five.

[flere-imsaho]

I like it, as a theory. :D

The way I see it, the "god" behind the series is probably an incredibly advanced AI or (more likely) an ascended being.

Further, my real guess is that the Lords of Kobol were either a) advanced AIs in human form (similar to the humanform cylons, but considerably more powerful) or (again) b) ascended beings in human form.

[cthomer5000]

I thought the ending/final season was 'OK.' I'll admit that the show didn't really ever fulfill the potential I felt it had in seasons 1/2, but it's one of the better TV series I've ever watched.

[kcchief19]

I like it, as a theory. :D

The way I see it, the "god" behind the series is probably an incredibly advanced AI or (more likely) an ascended being.

Further, my real guess is that the Lords of Kobol were either a) advanced AIs in human form (similar to the humanform cylons, but considerably more powerful) or (again) b) ascended beings in human form.
Remember, this all happened before, and it will happen again. Everything suggests that there is a cycle that has repeated itself more than once. We know the 13 tribes left Kobol for the colonies and Earth (perhaps due to a rebellion & holocaust) and that the colonies and Earth both created their own cylones that rebeled. That's only three cycles. It is strongly suggested that the cycle has gone longer than that, perhaps millions of years.

Kobol seems to have some significance because of the religious importance for the 12 colonies, the cylons and the 13th tribe. Perhaps Kobol has been the interesecting point over the millenia. Which might be another clue that the cycle is broken because Kobol has been destroyed.

RDM is the only one who knows. I believe the Lords of Kobol were just mythology.

[timmynausea]

The finale was a mild disappointment for me. It had moments, but it came across very rushed, and I didn't buy the reasoning for giving up on technology (again, there probably just wasn't enough time for that to seem like a natural conclusion for them to reach.) There were 6 or 7 episodes worth of material and character development, possibly more, crammed into a 2 hour finale.

I also didn't really care for the robot montage, though I understand the intent. I actually think the show had already made itself relevant to us in the parallels to terrorism and occupation and etc. The super literal robot angle was silly and actually took away from that.

Still, it was good enough to do the series justice. It was only a disappointment in that the earlier finales really blew me away. I don't expect to ever like a scifi show more than this.

[cthomer5000]

I also didn't really care for the robot montage, though I understand the intent. I actually think the show had already made itself relevant to us in the parallels to terrorism and occupation and etc. The super literal robot angle was silly and actually took away from that.

The whole last 2 minutes to me were far, far, far more on-the-nose than this show has been before. I always liked the fact that it spoke to problems in our real world without making them crystal clear. I agree that the ending was much too literal, and didn't really match the tone of the whole series.

[Edward64]

Thought I would post the link which has RDM answering some questions at scifi.com
Ron Posts - SCI FI FORUMS (http://forums.scifi.com/index.php?showtopic=2329378)

[Galaril]

I don't know if there was ever a thread on the new pilot movie for BSG spinoff "Caprica"? I saw the first half of the movie after renting it. I guess I missed it on SyFy channel. Anyways, I can not imagine this being even remotely successful for more than a season and consider it to be very pedestrian compared to the first series (BSG). That being said I had a tough time turning it off half way through to go to bed. It is interesting to see the start of the Cyclons and all. This very well may shed more light on areas left open from BSG like the real orgins of the Cylons personality/ego and the monotheist/single god stuff. I am really curious what other thought of the the movie who saw it and the shows premise in itself.

[RendeR]

Nice set of Q and A's there.

[Kodos]

I don't know if there was ever a thread on the new pilot movie for BSG spinoff "Caprica"? I saw the first half of the movie after renting it. I guess I missed it on SyFy channel. Anyways, I can not imagine this being even remotely successful for more than a season and consider it to be very pedestrian compared to the first series (BSG). That being said I had a tough time turning it off half way through to go to bed. It is interesting to see the start of the Cyclons and all. This very well may shed more light on areas left open from BSG like the real orgins of the Cylons personality/ego and the monotheist/single god stuff. I am really curious what other thought of the the movie who saw it and the shows premise in itself.

So is Caprica worth seeing?

Also, I stumbled on this while searching on Caprica:

http://operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?t=18208

[cthomer5000]

So is Caprica worth seeing?

Also, I stumbled on this while searching on Caprica:

So, How bad is the new Battlestar Galactica going to be? - Front Office Football Central (http://operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?t=18208)


1. Caprica is worth watching I would say. It's interesting.

2. Wow, great find on that thread. Prediction FAIL.

[Thomkal]

Are you ready for a remake? No not the series we mostly all loved till the horrible ending...but a remake of the original as a movie rather than a series:

New 'Battlestar Galactica' movie will completely reimagine the sci-fi tale | The Verge (http://www.theverge.com/2014/4/7/5591894/new-battlestar-galactica-movie-will-be-a-reboot)

[flere-imsaho]

Well, I wouldn't mind an actually coherent version of the story, which I suppose could be done with a movie.

I really enjoyed the modern series, of course, and I'm not a big hater of the ending, but I do think there was a lot more meandering than was necessary, especially since a lot of questions were left unanswered.

Maybe a movie would be more succinct, while retaining the interest of the basic story concept (that is: humans flee cylons, then find safety / redemption).

[kcchief19]

Also, I stumbled on this while searching on Caprica:

So, How bad is the new Battlestar Galactica going to be? - Front Office Football Central (http://operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?t=18208)
Five year delayed reaction ... that thread was awesome! We're all a bunch of idiots! :)

I hate to be too much of a negative Nancy after that thread from 2003. I'm not opposed to a reboot, but the timing seems odd. Seems too soon. The last reboot probably ended a bit early, and SyFy clearly wasn't done with the franchise given their attempts at creating prequels and sequels that never took off.

If you're going to climb back into the BG business, a reboot is the way to go. Strikes me as funny that again they are talking a movie/miniseries, which is exactly how the original and the first reboot got started before turning into series.

I'm just puzzled given how good the Ronald Moore reboot was why you would try it again so quickly. I'd stay away from Battlestar for at least 10 more years.

[BillJasper]

I'm just puzzled given how good the Ronald Moore reboot was why you would try it again so quickly. I'd stay away from Battlestar for at least 10 more years.

As someone who isn't into the Moore version, I'm more than happy to see a new reboot.

[Kodos]

Amazon.com: Gold Box Deal Of The Day: Battlestar Galactica: Movies & TV (http://www.amazon.com/b/ref=gbsl_tit_l-1_0942_f0ac1a58?node=9302517011&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_t=701&pf_rd_s=left-new-1&pf_rd_r=0TGAJ1DHEX8BA1N82WTZ&pf_rd_i=20&pf_rd_p=1740370942)

[Blackadar]

Amazon.com: Gold Box Deal Of The Day: Battlestar Galactica: Movies & TV (http://www.amazon.com/b/ref=gbsl_tit_l-1_0942_f0ac1a58?node=9302517011&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_t=701&pf_rd_s=left-new-1&pf_rd_r=0TGAJ1DHEX8BA1N82WTZ&pf_rd_i=20&pf_rd_p=1740370942)

One of the more eminently bangable female casts in recent years.

[Kodos]

The President!

[NobodyHere]

The President!

Sarah Palin?

[Kodos]

Man, I miss this show. This is one of my favorite scenes where Galactica is getting attacked by three Cylon basestars, and then Pegasus comes in guns blazing to save the day.

<iframe frameborder="0" width="480" height="270" src="//www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/xc5epd" allowfullscreen></iframe><br /><a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xc5epd_battlestar-galactica-the-destructio_shortfilms" target="_blank">Battlestar Galactica - The Destruction of the...</a> <i>by <a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/WinuX79" target="_blank">WinuX79</a></i>

[Thomkal]

Well Kodos, if you wait about 150,000 years or so, it will probably be back on for you to watch. God that ending was just horrible.

[Kodos]

Yeah, the ending could have been better, but the journey was great. Ending when they found the nuked planet might have been better.

[Kodos]

A BATTLESTAR GALACTICA Marathon is Coming to SYFY | Nerdist (http://nerdist.com/a-battlestar-galactica-marathon-is-coming-to-syfy/)

[Edward64]

I'm a BSG fan but still don't quite understand the deeper story line but enjoy each episode as-is. I've googled on it and still not quite grasping it.

Bought the DVD set when it first came out.

[tarcone]

There is the religious element. Monotheism v. Polytheism.
And them landing in the cradle of civilization.

That was a great ending in my opinion.