2015 NBA Offseason Thread

[miami_fan]

The lottery is tomorrow so I thought this would be as good a time as any to get the offseason thread going. Here is the draft order pre lottery.

1. Minnesota 16-66 (.195) [250 = number of chances in Draft Lottery]
2. New York 17-65 (.207) [199]
3. Philadelphia 18-64 (.220) [156]
4. L.A. Lakers* 21-61 (.256) [119]
5. Orlando 25-57 (.305) [88]
6. Sacramento 29-53 (.354) [63]
7. Denver 30-52 (.366) [43]
8. Detroit 32-50 (.390) [28]
9. Charlotte 33-49 (.402) [17]
10. Miami** 37-45 (.451) [11]
11. Indiana 38-44 (.463) [8]
12. Utah 38-44 (.463) [7]
13. Phoenix 39-43 (.476) [6]
14. Oklahoma City 45-37 (.549) [5]
15. Brooklyn*** 38-44 (.463)
16. Boston 40-42 (.488)
17. Milwaukee 41-41 (.500)
18. New Orleans (To Houston) 45-37 (.549)
19. Washington 46-36 (.561)
20. Toronto 49-33 (.598)
21. Dallas 50-32 (.610)
22. Chicago^ 50-32 (.610)
23. Portland 51-31 (.622)
24. Cleveland^^ 53-29 (.646)
25. Memphis 55-27 (.671)
26. San Antonio 55-27 (.671)
27. Houston (To L.A. Lakers) 56-26 (.683)
28. L.A. Clippers (To Boston) 56-26 (.683)
29. Atlanta^^^ 60-22 (.732)
30. Golden State 67-15 (.817)

* This pick may be conveyed to Philadelphia via Phoenix.
** This pick may be conveyed to Philadelphia via Cleveland.
*** This pick may be conveyed to Atlanta.
^ This pick may be conveyed to Cleveland.
^^ This pick may be conveyed to Chicago.
^^^ This pick may be conveyed to Brooklyn.

[miami_fan]

For a bit of perspective going into the draft, here is the 2010 draft class.

<script type="text/javascript" src="http://widgets.sports-reference.com/wg.fcgi?css=1&site=bbr&url=%2Fdraft%2FNBA_2010.html&div=div_stats"></script>

[stevew]

Any good lotto conspiracies? I really hope that Indy goes top 3 and that ends up forcing the Lakers to 6th and Heat to 11th.

[Logan]

I found myself standing next to actor/director Michael Rapaport in midtown early today as we were waiting to cross the street. Walked with him for a couple blocks. The guy just made a 30 for 30 on the glory days of the Knicks and he had no idea that they had a good shot at getting the #1 pick tonight.

[spleen1015]

I don't see any lights out superstars in this draft.

I hope the Pacers pick someone that's going to be worth a shit instead of another Plumlee.

[mckerney]

Any good lotto conspiracies?

Just the typical, "The League will screw the Timberwolves," conspiracy.

[miami_fan]

Any good lotto conspiracies? I really hope that Indy goes top 3 and that ends up forcing the Lakers to 6th and Heat to 11th.

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/05/19/has-the-nba-stopped-fixing-the-lottery-100-not/

[nol]

Every possible outcome is a conspiracy, but the Lakers losing the pick is the funniest one that has more than a 1% chance of happening.

[MrBug708]

I fully expect the league to continue to dick over the Lakers

[Lathum]

Teams really miss out on a nice PR move when the owner or GM is the one who shows up at the draft lottery as the team representative. #bucksownerhotdaughter

[MrBug708]

Woo!

[Lathum]

LOL Knicks

[mckerney]

Wooooo!!! Tanking works! :)

[miami_fan]

Just the typical, "The League will screw the Timberwolves," conspiracy.

Pop the corks!

Minnesota Timberwolves

Odds of winning the lottery: 25.0% 100%

The NBA wants to tap deeper into the Canadian market. See the league’s flirtation with Montreal. Marketing the Raptors would have been the easy route, but they’re fizzling. The next-best option: Selling Andrew Wiggins, a native Canadian and budding superstar. That gets easier when the Timberwolves get better. (That they also have Canadian Anthony Bennett and Vince Carter‘s closest dunking heir apparent, Zach LaVine, only helps.) The NBA will give Minnesota the No. 1 pick and gain a huge following across an entire country.

[Arles]

Feeling better about the Suns trade for Knight. With a healthy Kobe, Randall, #2 pick and two High priced FAs, that pick lost a lot of value getting pushed to next year.

[stevew]

Can we please never hear about the Wolves "never moving up in the lottery" again. I know first to first isn't moving up but it's close enough.

[jbergey22]

Interesting decision ahead for the wolves. Okafor seems safe and maybe an Amare Stoudamire type player from pre-injury years. KAT on the other hand seems to have the athletic talent to become Anthony Davis or the non interest to become Hasheem Thabeet.

[Izulde]

Feeling better about the Suns trade for Knight. With a healthy Kobe, Randall, #2 pick and two High priced FAs, that pick lost a lot of value getting pushed to next year.

Good luck with that happening. It's Randle, BTW.

The key is going to be the FA pickups. I'm not sold on Clarkson as a long-term answer at all, though the huge Filipino and Laker fan contingent here in town thinks he's amazing. To me he's a 2nd round steal, but also put up inflated stats on a shit team.

I personally don't think Kobe has anything left, and should have retired a year or two ago But we'll have to suffer through another year of him and the obnoxious hyping.

[RainMaker]

Feeling better about the Suns trade for Knight. With a healthy Kobe, Randall, #2 pick and two High priced FAs, that pick lost a lot of value getting pushed to next year.

Lakers are not making the playoffs next year. It's a lottery pick for Brandon Knight. Maybe that's worth it but the Lakers are not going to be good for a couple years.

[RainMaker]

Interesting decision ahead for the wolves. Okafor seems safe and maybe an Amare Stoudamire type player from pre-injury years. KAT on the other hand seems to have the athletic talent to become Anthony Davis or the non interest to become Hasheem Thabeet.

Kind of reminds me of the Wiggins or Parker debate. Parker seems more polished and you know what you're getting. Wiggins had the enormous upside.

Either way, a nice little rebuild for the Wolves. They'll have the last 3 #1 picks on their roster next season.

[digamma]

Teams really miss out on a nice PR move when the owner or GM is the one who shows up at the draft lottery as the team representative. #bucksownerhotdaughter

According to Deadspin, the NBA instituted a no family member rule this year.

[Fidatelo]

"Today was very nerve wracking. I really didn't anticipate that it would go this way," owner Glen Taylor said. "People say you have a 25 per cent to win but I always look at it that there's a 75 per cent chance that someone else is going to win. I just feel very honoured that we have the chance to be in this position."

LOL

[jbergey22]

LOL

double LOL

[molson]

Well hey, that team had a goal and they accomplished it, he has the right to be proud. Unlike say, the Jazz, who cost themselves 4-5 spots in the draft and a better shot at a top-3 pick by committing the gravest sin in the NBA, something that the system deems worthy of punishment - coming together as a team and winning basketball games.

[jbergey22]

Kind of reminds me of the Wiggins or Parker debate. Parker seems more polished and you know what you're getting. Wiggins had the enormous upside.

Either way, a nice little rebuild for the Wolves. They'll have the last 3 #1 picks on their roster next season.

I agree. The debate is very similar. The only thing that will be holding the Wolves back in the next couple of years is Rubio and the PG situation.

[albionmoonlight]

Either way, a nice little rebuild for the Wolves. They'll have the last 3 #1 picks on their roster next season.

That looks like the kind of thing you would do in FBB and decide you need to give yourself some house rules.

[Arles]

Lakers are not making the playoffs next year. It's a lottery pick for Brandon Knight. Maybe that's worth it but the Lakers are not going to be good for a couple years.
Knight is a lottery pick that reached his potential. Given the crapshoot the lottery is, I think trading one that will probably be in the 9-12 range next season for a guy taken #8 who has proven himself in the league (and is still just 23) makes sense. Had the Lakers pick ended up 6, that would have been a tough pill as the #6 player in this draft appears to me a much better prospect than 9-12 next year (plus you get that player a year earlier).

As to the Lakers, I don't think they will make the playoffs, but I can see them being similar to Utah or Phoenix this year (finish in the 36-40 win range). Given they won't be keeping their pick for sure, I'm guessing they will try to hit the end of the lottery or sneak in as the 8th seed.

Here's an interesting question for them, though. Most of the good guards/SF in the FA pool are restricted (Kawhi, Butler, Knight, Reggie Jackson, Middleton). There are a ton of PF/C types that are unrestricted though (Gasol, Aldridge, Jordan, Lopez, Millsap, Monroe, Chandler, Love?). If you take Okafor, you are better at the front court with Okafor, Randle and Hill - but lack guards/SF. So you are forced to try and steal an RFA (not easy) or go after a second tier guy like Monta Ellis (ugh, pairing him with Kobe and Young - ouch), Rondo (who knows where he is physically/mentally) or a 3rd tier option like Lou Williams. On the other hand, you can take D'Angelo Russell to lock down your PG/SG slot for the future and go after a better/more likely FA option in the frontcourt like Jordan, Gasol, Millsap, Monroe, Chandler or one of the Lopez brothers (and maybe even Love).

[mckerney]

I agree. The debate is very similar. The only thing that will be holding the Wolves back in the next couple of years is Rubio and the PG situation.

That and the hole at SG if Kevin Martin opts out after next season. It will poetically be best long term if they can hold onto their pick next year and draft someone who can fill that spot. If they're able to do that they may be able to get by with Rubio.

[JPhillips]

Knight is a lottery pick that reached his potential. Given the crapshoot the lottery is, I think trading one that will probably be in the 9-12 range next season for a guy taken #8 who has proven himself in the league (and is still just 23) makes sense. Had the Lakers pick ended up 6, that would have been a tough pill as the #6 player in this draft appears to me a much better prospect than 9-12 next year (plus you get that player a year earlier).

As to the Lakers, I don't think they will make the playoffs, but I can see them being similar to Utah or Phoenix this year (finish in the 36-40 win range). Given they won't be keeping their pick for sure, I'm guessing they will try to hit the end of the lottery or sneak in as the 8th seed.

Here's an interesting question for them, though. Most of the good guards/SF in the FA pool are restricted (Kawhi, Butler, Knight, Reggie Jackson, Middleton). There are a ton of PF/C types that are unrestricted though (Gasol, Aldridge, Jordan, Lopez, Millsap, Monroe, Chandler, Love?). If you take Okafor, you are better at the front court with Okafor, Randle and Hill - but lack guards/SF. So you are forced to try and steal an RFA (not easy) or go after a second tier guy like Monta Ellis (ugh, pairing him with Kobe and Young - ouch), Rondo (who knows where he is physically/mentally) or a 3rd tier option like Lou Williams. On the other hand, you can take D'Angelo Russell to lock down your PG/SG slot for the future and go after a better/more likely FA option in the frontcourt like Jordan, Gasol, Millsap, Monroe, Chandler or one of the Lopez brothers (and maybe even Love).

Or see what you could get from NY and take Mudaiy?

[whomario]

If they're able to do that they may be able to get by with Rubio.

am i missing sth? Health is an issue, but the wolves looked respectable it even good whenever rubio was on the court the last 2 seasons and clearly better than without him.

[murrayyyyy]

Here's an interesting question for them, though. Most of the good guards/SF in the FA pool are restricted (Kawhi, Butler, Knight, Reggie Jackson, Middleton). There are a ton of PF/C types that are unrestricted though (Gasol, Aldridge, Jordan, Lopez, Millsap, Monroe, Chandler, Love?). If you take Okafor, you are better at the front court with Okafor, Randle and Hill - but lack guards/SF. So you are forced to try and steal an RFA (not easy) or go after a second tier guy like Monta Ellis (ugh, pairing him with Kobe and Young - ouch), Rondo (who knows where he is physically/mentally) or a 3rd tier option like Lou Williams. On the other hand, you can take D'Angelo Russell to lock down your PG/SG slot for the future and go after a better/more likely FA option in the frontcourt like Jordan, Gasol, Millsap, Monroe, Chandler or one of the Lopez brothers (and maybe even Love).

But I think the question of the offseason is what player will sign more than a 1 year deal. Isn't the cap for next year around 65 and then it jumps by 20 million for 16-17 with the new TV deal.

It seems like the Lakers are banking on that scenario happening so when Kobe comes off the books they can rebuild a starting 5 around Randle and the #1 from this season by offering 3 max contracts with the new cap.

[Chief Rum]

am i missing sth? Health is an issue, but the wolves looked respectable it even good whenever rubio was on the court the last 2 seasons and clearly better than without him.

I don't feel like Rubio gets them to the promised land, but I admit that's a gut feel. Flashy passer, but has he learned to shoot yet? And the health issue can't be ignored.

[nol]

Towns over Okafor should not be hard for the Wolves. This year's worst defensive team needs all the help it can get, and Wiggins needs all the spacing help he can get because it's not going to come from a Flip Saunders offense.

The Knicks don't have anything worth trading down for and are probably more likely to trade down themselves.

[whomario]

The wolves are a ways from even thinking about “the promised land“. Have a season of playing to win is the first step and if after a Playoffs apearance of 2 you cant find a way to compensate for his lack of shooting (there were some good signs befindet things went to hell this season i thought...), his contract will be up.
I think there is an attainable Combination of players including rubio that can be successfull. He simply does have an ability to make players better (“flashy“ sells him way short. He is flashy in the same Sense nash was a “flashy passer“. Its not empty antics ...) and is a really good defender who would be even more effective with even a semblance of rim protection behind hin.

[jbergey22]

Rubio would be a nice PG off of the bench. His defense is the quality about him that makes him a liability as a starting PG. He cant defend a decent point guard and the all stars embarrass him. His subpar shooting is only his 2nd worst quality;) He has a place in this league and is fun to watch. Just not as a starting point guard on a playoff team.

[nol]

Rubio would be a nice PG off of the bench. His defense is the quality about him that makes him a liability as a starting PG. He cant defend a decent point guard and the all stars embarrass him. His subpar shooting is only his 2nd worst quality;) He has a place in this league and is fun to watch. Just not as a starting point guard on a playoff team.

You are confusing "white and European" with "not being able to play defense." By all accounts Rubio is somewhere around a top-five defensive point guard. I'd put Paul, Beverly, and Wall above him but after that it's up for debate. It's a lot easier for someone like George Hill or Mike Conley to look like a great defender (and both are good in their own right) when a Paul George/Tony Allen is able to shift over and guard tough PGs and a Roy Hibbert/Marc Gasol is helping to clean up any mistakes.

[jbergey22]

You are confusing "white and European" with "not being able to play defense." By all accounts Rubio is somewhere around a top-five defensive point guard. I'd put Paul, Beverly, and Wall above him but after that it's up for debate. It's a lot easier for someone like George Hill or Mike Conley to look like a good defender when a Roy Hibbert/Marc Gasol is helping to clean up any mistakes.

He is awful on defense. The main reason I stopped following defensive metrics in the NBA. Yes, it certainly doesnt help that the wolves dont have a rim protector but Rubio cant stay in front of a guard with skills. He gets out of position and swipes at the ball and goes for steals. Looks great on the stat sheet getting the steals he does but doesnt help the wolves on defense playing 5 vs 4.

[whomario]

Thats simply not what 99% of people around or watching the nba judge him as. No offense intended, but that assessment seems way out there. He does try to do too much, but technique and instincts are top notch and half the reason in any case lies with the “help“. Heck, dellavedova just checked rose fullcourt with success due to having reliable helpdefense.

He has similar problems perception-wise to prime kirilenko (compared to, say, a battier) in that he overrrotates rather than taking the simple road. He literally is prepared to guard each player every play and i am absolutely sure he is a major boon to the defense even when he gets scored on due to it at times. Kinda like an agressive sweeper keeper in soccer (like Manuel neuer) can look stupid every once in a while and his coach will never mind.

In any case, every pg gets scored on plenty in the modern nba. Theres a reason guys like thibodeau have stuck as coaches, effective defense is a tough thing to achieve under the current rules and 1:1 defense has become near impossible.

[jbergey22]

Well the wolves were 29th in the league at defending point guards last year. Other teams dont have great rim protectors either and arent 2nd worst in the entire league. The previous two years they were 27th and 24th.

NBA Team Opponents Stats 2014-2015 - NBA Fantasy Basketball Stats (http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/opponentstats/15/12/eff/1-1)

[Sublime 2]

Towns over Okafor should not be hard for the Wolves. This year's worst defensive team needs all the help it can get, and Wiggins needs all the spacing help he can get because it's not going to come from a Flip Saunders offense.

The Knicks don't have anything worth trading down for and are probably more likely to trade down themselves.

I don't know, I feel like Okafor over Towns is just as reasonable (maybe not just as reasonable, but not out of this world either). Not that he's someone to build around, but putting Dieng next to Okafor should help cover for Okafor's defensive weaknesses. Offensively...that might be a muddled lane though.

I say this as an outsider, and only watching 5-6 TWolves games a year.

[jbergey22]

Thats simply not what 99% of people around or watching the nba judge him as. No offense intended, but that assessment seems way out there. He does try to do too much, but technique and instincts are top notch and half the reason in any case lies with the “help“. Heck, dellavedova just checked rose fullcourt with success due to having reliable helpdefense.

He has similar problems perception-wise to prime kirilenko (compared to, say, a battier) in that he overrrotates rather than taking the simple road. He literally is prepared to guard each player every play and i am absolutely sure he is a major boon to the defense even when he gets scored on due to it at times. Kinda like an agressive sweeper keeper in soccer (like Manuel neuer) can look stupid every once in a while and his coach will never mind.

In any case, every pg gets scored on plenty in the modern nba. Theres a reason guys like thibodeau have stuck as coaches, effective defense is a tough thing to achieve under the current rules and 1:1 defense has become near impossible.

I agree with your last paragraph completely. The point guard does need a lot of help in todays NBA. Mostly because I watch a few Twolves games every year this myth that he is somehow a top defender in the league when the team stats or really nothing else back it up just really bothers me. Guys like Westbrook, Curry, and Lilliard constantly expose him. He might be able to look like a decent defender against a point guard without great ball skills but other than that he just gets himself out of position chasing steals.

[whomario]

Well the wolves were 29th in the league at defending point guards last year. Other teams dont have great rim protectors either and arent 2nd worst in the entire league. The previous two years they were 27th and 24th.

NBA Team Opponents Stats 2014-2015 - NBA Fantasy Basketball Stats (http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/opponentstats/15/12/eff/1-1)

Well, the wolves were about the worst defensive team in history positions 1-5 by that measure , rubio played only 20% of the minutes in which the wolves were markedly better and if you dont trust defensive stats as clear and basic as any sort of impact/replacement value type stuff then this is basically an impossibly to refute opinion. Which you are of course entitled to, just dont see a way to sway it.

[jbergey22]

Well, the wolves were about the worst defensive team in history positions 1-5 by that measure , rubio played only 20% of the minutes in which the wolves were markedly better and if you dont trust defensive stats as clear and basic as any sort of impact/replacement value type stuff then this is basically an impossibly to refute opinion. Which you are of course entitled to, just dont see a way to sway it.

What defensive stats are you using anyway? I know that website that used replacement value is no longer operating. And Ive never considering DRTG a worthwhile stat since in varies so much from year to year where defense should be fairly consistent if its an accurate measure.

[nol]

What defensive stats are you using anyway? I know that website that used replacement value is no longer operating. And Ive never considering DRTG a worthwhile stat since in varies so much from year to year where defense should be fairly consistent if its an accurate measure.

A good place to start would be that players like Love and Pekovic offered rim protection that was "worst in the league by a substantial margin" rather than "not great."

If you're more inclined to use the eye test, you could look at other players across the league and see whether they're out of position more or less often than Rubio was (if everyone was in position all the time, teams would average like 75 points a game). You could also look at how often Ricky Rubio had to guard a good SG or SF because someone like Kevin Martin is an extremely bad defender.

Or you could look at the just-released all defensive teams, see that Chris Paul (Clippers were 15th in defensive efficiency) was first team all defense, and conclude that a point guard has a lower impact on the team's overall defense than any other position. Or you could reach that same conclusion by seeing how the league's best defensive team has a point guard that is more or less average (I'd say above average, but I tend to get laughed at because Steph Curry doesn't have He-Man upper body strength so I'm allowing for some wiggle room) defensively.

All that to say that if I were writing a list of areas holding the Minnesota Timberwolves back from becoming a playoff team or a championship team or whatever, "Ricky Rubio needs to become a better individual defender" would probably not crack the top 500.

[whomario]

Right now i actually agree that there is simply no really convincibg/robust defensive rating for individual players, much less one that works in a vacuum. I merely see that the wolves go from beyond terrible to decent in basically every stat that differentiates wether a player was on the court. Which matches what i saw in timberwolves matches.

Hoping sports vu data will help, for frontcourt players rim protection looks solid f.e already.

Good article on what might be coming on that front. Department of Defense « (http://grantland.com/features/department-of-defense/)

[nol]

Well hey, that team had a goal and they accomplished it, he has the right to be proud. Unlike say, the Jazz, who cost themselves 4-5 spots in the draft and a better shot at a top-3 pick by committing the gravest sin in the NBA, something that the system deems worthy of punishment - coming together as a team and winning basketball games.

In light of seeing stuff like Josh Smith and J.R. Smith going from playing so poorly on a couple of crappy teams that they were given up for pretty much nothing to almost single-handedly winning playoff games for conference finalists, it's fair to say that bad teams are already punished enough by everything except for the draft.

[stevew]

God I'd love to see Flip try to pair Rubio and Rondo together in a backcourt

[whomario]

https://www.evernote.com/l/AGPN5gXYcPVNFY_AuMI_tsQ0X0UUzgBxVxcB/image.png

:D


Related to this: I think the Spurs will be a huge x-factor in Free Agency, definitely the most fluid situation right now and all depending on wether or not Duncan (and to a lesser extent Manu) retire and if then they want to blow it up or simply try to replace the 2.

[Vince, Pt. II]

I am enjoying that tweet far more than I probably should.

[nol]

Alvin Gentry got hired by New Orleans - if Anthony Davis becomes a 3-point shooter, it will probably be under this guy.

Fred Hoiberg is gonna be the Bulls' coach in all likelihood, which is good for them but will suck for Iowa State. Thibs is probably gonna sit the year out or at least be hovering around for anyone who gets fired midway through the season.

[albionmoonlight]

Alvin Gentry got hired by New Orleans - if Anthony Davis becomes a 3-point shooter, it will probably be under this guy.

I get that 3-point shooting big men are more valuable in 2015 than close to the rim guys. But something seems wrong about a guy with the talent to become David Robinson or Hakeem Olajuwon learning to stand in the corner and waive his hands.

[stevew]

Davis adding a reliable 3 point shot will be the difference between him being a multiple MVP and likely HOFer and him becoming one of the 10 best players of all time.

[nol]

I get that 3-point shooting big men are more valuable in 2015 than close to the rim guys. But something seems wrong about a guy with the talent to become David Robinson or Hakeem Olajuwon learning to stand in the corner and waive his hands.

It's not deciding between close shots and three pointers, it's midrange and threes, and Davis already shoots a lot from 18-20 feet. Nobody has the talent to become Hakeem or David Robinson in 2015 because you can't back somebody down 1-on-1 for 10+ seconds.

[stevew]

Davis was a point guard thru 11th grade, right?

[Alf]

Non surprising moves so far.

[nol]

Oh boy, the Clippers are possibly trading for Lance Stephenson. They'd be giving up Matt Barnes and Hawes.

[stevew]

Sounds like Embiid is still not right.

[Groundhog]

Stephenson's issues are 90% mental and theres a good chance he can bounce back IMO. I'd probably take that gamble if I'm the Clippers.

Doesn't look good for Embiid or the Sixers. Really interested to see what they do in the draft now, PG or maybe trade down for size.

[Chief Rum]

Oh boy, the Clippers are possibly trading for Lance Stephenson. They'd be giving up Matt Barnes and Hawes.

Oof.

[nol]

Stephenson's issues are 90% mental and theres a good chance he can bounce back IMO. I'd probably take that gamble if I'm the Clippers.

I probably would too but it's definitely a gamble. When the Clippers have looked championship-caliber, Matt Barnes is knocking down threes at a respectable rate. He had a rough playoffs and is getting up there in years, so it very well could be the right time to move on (and moving the Hawes contract is nice too), but that 16% three-point shooting in conjunction with how the Clippers lost Game 6 to the Rockets is tough to stomach.


One draft guy I'm really not getting the hype on is Porzingis. Don't think he'll wash out of the league in 3 years or anything, but I'm having a really hard time foreseeing him as an All-Star level player.

To me, the Embiid news seems like a calculated move by the 76ers to give some credence to the idea they would draft someone like Okafor if he's there at 3, which would possibly make some teams contact them with a stronger trade offer.

[stevew]

The Pistons getting Ilysova fofor nothing a few weeks ago seemed like a good trade.

[miami_fan]

Oh boy, the Clippers are possibly trading for Lance Stephenson. They'd be giving up Matt Barnes and Hawes.

Lance and CP3? On the same team?

Interesting.

[Julio Riddols]

Lance Stephenson will never be a member of a championship team.

[cmp]

The Pistons getting Ilysova fofor nothing a few weeks ago seemed like a good trade.

I liked the trade. Basically gave up nothing for him.

[nol]

I liked the trade. Basically gave up nothing for him.

Yeah, that was a pure salary dump for Milwaukee. I don't know what they're gonna do with the cap room beyond re-signing Middleton.

Players like Ilyasova are in kind of an interesting place right now as teams are becoming comfortable with playing 'stretch 4s' who are pretty much traditional small forwards. Guys in that Harrison Barnes/Andre Iguodala mold are going to have the same effect on players like Ilyasova or Ryan Anderson that those players had on the traditional PFs that didn't have much of a perimeter game.

[BishopMVP]

I'm starting to get a little worried about the Celtics actually signing Greg Monroe. I guess if it's like Evan Turner or Paul Millsap and they get him for a shockingly low per year figure, but I wouldn't even pay him 8 figures, and I think he'll sign for above that.

[Brian Swartz]

So now apparently the Sixers will have no management issues, thanks to self-declared 'basketball genius' AI.

[RainMaker]

I'm starting to get a little worried about the Celtics actually signing Greg Monroe. I guess if it's like Evan Turner or Paul Millsap and they get him for a shockingly low per year figure, but I wouldn't even pay him 8 figures, and I think he'll sign for above that.

I think the Knicks will get desperate and pay him a lot of money when they strike out on everyone else.

[Galaril]

I'm starting to get a little worried about the Celtics actually signing Greg Monroe. I guess if it's like Evan Turner or Paul Millsap and they get him for a shockingly low per year figure, but I wouldn't even pay him 8 figures, and I think he'll sign for above that.

Yeah not sure why they are so focused on big guys that is not what the game is built around anymore and the Warriors along with other teams are proving this is a guard especially PG drive league and you need at least one all star on your team. The Celtics have neither of those aspects though they have very strong PGs not sure they have anything remotely near a star. Lastly, all these mid/ late first round and second round picks are nearly worthless unless they can bundle them all for one or two young stars.

[Groundhog]

I think the whole 'bigmen are dead' argument is a bit premature. The Warriors still played Bogut (and Ezeli/Speights et al) a good deal until the finals because of the matchups, and it was the fact that TT and Mozgov just weren't mobile enough to pester Curry and co on the picks that made bigs unplayable and let the Warriors run so long with no traditional post players on the court.

Monroe can easily be a quality starting 5 man in today's NBA IMO, as long as you have the right guys at the 4 and 3 spots to compliment him - versatile tweeners who can stretch the court and do a little bit of everything. I think having him as a 4 man and sharing the court with another big who isn't a stretch shooter runs contrary to what seems to be the winning formula as far as spacing goes these days.

[nol]

Yeah not sure why they are so focused on big guys that is not what the game is built around anymore and the Warriors along with other teams are proving this is a guard especially PG drive league and you need at least one all star on your team. The Celtics have neither of those aspects though they have very strong PGs not sure they have anything remotely near a star. Lastly, all these mid/ late first round and second round picks are nearly worthless unless they can bundle them all for one or two young stars.

The Warriors proved that if you have a 3-4 guys 6'6" or taller who can all guard multiple positions, attack the basket off the dribble, and knock down three-pointers at a passable rate, you can go small and have a lot of success. Teams have tried this with worse players (mid-2000s Atlanta Hawks come to mind) and not done particularly well, so there's still room to get players you think are actually good rather than trying to duplicate whatever the championship-winning team did.

[Groundhog]

The Warriors proved that if you have a 3-4 guys 6'6" or taller who can all guard multiple positions, attack the basket off the dribble, and knock down three-pointers at a passable rate, you can go small and have a lot of success. Teams have tried this with worse players (mid-2000s Atlanta Hawks come to mind) and not done particularly well, so there's still room to get players you think are actually good rather than trying to duplicate whatever the championship-winning team did.

Yep, I think people are getting a little too excited with the "Warriors formula". Green took a big leap forward this year, and he is basically the reason the Warriors are able to play the style that they do and not get killed on the other side of the court. The Warriors are just a hell of a team, and that's why it works. You can win it all with a more traditional lineup, just look at the Spurs last year. They shuffled things around during the playoffs as needed, and sometimes it was a traditional Duncan/Splitter frontcourt, and sometimes it was Duncan/Diaw.

Matchups are the key, and the Spurs last year and Warriors this year were deep enough and skilled enough to counter and beat what the opponents were trying to do.

[stevew]

I think the Knicks will get desperate and pay him a lot of money when they strike out on everyone else.

Someone is going to way over pay Enes Kanter as well

[stevew]

So what's up with the draft? The guy who maybe interests me the most is Kristaps Porzingis. I can't really find a reasonable game film, but he really seems to move well in workouts and has good size and footwork. Obviously he's going to need to hit the gym as he looks like he'd get posted up to death. I'm going to say that he's more likely to be in that Gasol/Dirk/AK47 mode rather than the Tshkivilli/Darko/Wizards guy(name escapes me) mode. Also can't seem to find any wingspan/height measurements but I've seen that he's somewhere between 6'11 and 7'2 Hopefully he somehow avoids going to the Sixers.

[CU Tiger]

One draft guy I'm really not getting the hype on is Porzingis. Don't think he'll wash out of the league in 3 years or anything, but I'm having a really hard time foreseeing him as an All-Star level player.


So what's up with the draft? The guy who maybe interests me the most is Kristaps Porzingis.



lol

2 enter 1 leaves

[stevew]

lol

2 enter 1 leaves

I know. Right?

Maybe I overrate the way big guys move but his footwork looks enticing.

[stevew]

Dola-

Yes there was no chair guarding him in the vids I saw. Maybe he is Yi Jainlain(sp) 2.0

[Groundhog]

nol I'm sure has seen more of him than me, but I've watched a fair bit of video on Porzingis over the last month and a couple of full games. He's going to struggle to finish around the basket with his frame and I didn't see much in the way of ball handling ability with him, but he's got really nice touch and is deceptively athletic, and seems to fit the mould of what you want in a 4 man these days. I'd roll the dice on him at #3 over Russell, but I think the Sixers will probably go Russell as it's probably a close race between the two with PG more of a need.

[Groundhog]

dola

Having said that, I also have a weird feeling that if the Knicks go with Porzingis, he is destined to be a bust.

[Groundhog]

I think Magic might be the most interesting team in the top 5. If I were Orlando and Russell or Mudiay fell to me, I'd be real tempted to look to move Payton - assuming he hasn't magically learnt to shoot. I'm not sure you can be a winning team in the NBA today if defenders don't respect your PGs ability to shoot.

I didn't like Gordon prior to the draft and saw nothing from him as a rookie to convince me that he's their future at PF (or SF), so if I were the Magic I'd be looking for options at his positions too.

If I were Orlando, I'd draft Porzingis, Russell, Winslow, Cauley-Stein, or Hezonja, in that order.

[nol]

I know. Right?

Maybe I overrate the way big guys move but his footwork looks enticing.

My thing is more that every European player has to get compared to every other European player, so people think he can only be Pau Gasol or Dirk if he's good and Darko or Tskitishvili (sp?) if he's bad. I think you can safely rule out Pau/Dirk as best-case scenarios because he does not have anywhere near the creativity or floor vision that Pau or Dirk had, and when you combine that with the likelihood that he won't be finishing at the rim against NBA athletes very well, I don't think he could be any better on offense than someone like Ryan Anderson - aka a good stretch big man whose effectiveness teams can severely limit by running him off the arc.

Now, a version of Ryan Anderson who can play defense at a pretty passable level (Porzingis is decently athletic but appears a long shot to have the kind of basketball IQ necessary to be a top-notch rim protector) is a very solid player, I think players like Russell and Okafor have a better shot at being franchise players.

[stevew]

Lemme clarify. I think Porzingis should go 3rd or 4th due to the uncertainty. Is his frame going to hold some muscle? Can he fall in love with the weight room?

There are so many drafts where a guy with a dash of AK47 and a dash of Ryan Anderson would be a easy top 5 player in the class.

[nol]

Lemme clarify. I think Porzingis should go 3rd or 4th due to the uncertainty. Is his frame going to hold some muscle? Can he fall in love with the weight room?

There are so many drafts where a guy with a dash of AK47 and a dash of Ryan Anderson would be a easy top 5 player in the class.

Just to clarify, he won't be as good a shooter as Ryan Anderson - they're just similar in that even on their best shooting days, you can sell out on defense to prevent them from shooting 3s and live with them trying to put the ball on the floor and make a play.

I think if Mario Hezonja was available to have a 1-on-0 workout (instead he's playing in the Spanish league finals, where he had 18 off the bench in game 1) that focused on threes and dunks, he'd look even more impressive than Porzingis did. If I were the Knicks at 4 and the first three picks were Towns, Okafor, and Russell, I'd very much want to trade down; if some teams honestly think Porzingis is in the conversation for #1 overall and are not just smokescreening there should be some good offers (the Knicks are more than one player away from being good anyways) and I think there will be guys available in the 7-10 range who have just as much, if not more upside than Porzingis.

[BishopMVP]

So what's up with the draft? The guy who maybe interests me the most is Kristaps Porzingis. I can't really find a reasonable game film, but he really seems to move well in workouts and has good size and footwork. Obviously he's going to need to hit the gym as he looks like he'd get posted up to death. I'm going to say that he's more likely to be in that Gasol/Dirk/AK47 mode rather than the Tshkivilli/Darko/Wizards guy(name escapes me) mode. Also can't seem to find any wingspan/height measurements but I've seen that he's somewhere between 6'11 and 7'2 Hopefully he somehow avoids going to the Sixers.Latvian Kelly Olynyk.

Rumors have the Celtics trying to trade up, and I hope they do. Stanley Johnson and Myles Turner are both players I'd love that I think will go in the 9-12 range (and it sounds like Charlotte wants a 2-guard, most of whom would be slight reaches at 9). At 16, Kelly Oubre is my favorite in a vacuum, but seems too similar to James Young for us to develop both at once. I love Bobby Portis's motor, but think Kevon Looney will be a better player. Hollis-Jefferson is a rotation player, but will never develop an offensive game imo. Maybe if he slips to 28. Delon Wright is old, but secretly one of my favorites. A great defender who can guard multiple perimeter positions and probably hold his own off in the post off a P&R mismatch, who can create some offense and will be ready to contribute during his rookie deal? Sign me up. Having said all that, we'll probably draft one of the Wisconsin guys.

At 28 (if we don't trade it) or 33 a lot of fans want Robert Upshaw, but I get less of an "immature" vibe off him and more of an "he's actually a bad person" one. I like Justin Anderson, Richaun Holmes, Andrew Harrison and the two UNLV guys. Or obviously one of Hollis-jefferson/Wright if they slide.

[MrBug708]

Dwayne Wade?

I see Kobe is still trying to get that one last ring..

[nol]

Dwayne Wade?

I see Kobe is still trying to get that one last ring..

I see Dwayne Wade is still trying to get some leverage for that one last contract.

[stevew]

Thanks for the saying the O word, bishop

[Vince, Pt. II]

So I've been hearing rumors that the Warriors are going to have to package their #1 pick to move David Lee. Am I the only one that thinks that is crazy? He's an expiring contract and despite coming off the bench all season, it's pretty obvious he's still a very good player.

[nol]

So I've been hearing rumors that the Warriors are going to have to package their #1 pick to move David Lee. Am I the only one that thinks that is crazy? He's an expiring contract and despite coming off the bench all season, it's pretty obvious he's still a very good player.

No, there are probably a half dozen teams with the cap room to take on $15 million in salary and a future Warriors pick is likely to be very late in the first round.

[miami_fan]

I see Dwayne Wade is still trying to get some leverage for that one last contract.

Pretty much. I also see this as an attempt by the Players Association to end the practice of the best players on individual teams taking less money.

[stevew]

So I've been hearing rumors that the Warriors are going to have to package their #1 pick to move David Lee. Am I the only one that thinks that is crazy? He's an expiring contract and despite coming off the bench all season, it's pretty obvious he's still a very good player.

If we're losing Love, I'd gladly package Haywood and parts for Lee.

[nol]

If we're losing Love, I'd gladly package Haywood and parts for Lee.

The Cavs would need another shooter more than another PF in that situation. Lee is Kevin Love without a three-point shot, and the three was all Love had going for him for a pretty big chunk of last year.

[stevew]

I'm not sure who else we can get for Haywood that would be any better. Would have taken Ilysova but already was dealt.

[RainMaker]

So I've been hearing rumors that the Warriors are going to have to package their #1 pick to move David Lee. Am I the only one that thinks that is crazy? He's an expiring contract and despite coming off the bench all season, it's pretty obvious he's still a very good player.

The going rate for a 1st round pick is $10 million. Lee is over that and it's for the worst pick in the 1st round. So I don't even think that'd be enough to take him off their hands.

I've heard a couple other options. Lee would work out a buyout with another team in advance. Warriors would package their 1st with him to that team who would buy him out. That would then let Lee be able to sign elsewhere before the season. The other option is to just waive him and use the stretch provision.

[nol]

I'm not sure who else we can get for Haywood that would be any better. Would have taken Ilysova but already was dealt.

Marvin Williams is someone I can think of, but I'd guess the more attractive options would be trading Haywood and some other cheap player like Joe Harris for a couple guys who are paid in the $4-5 million range. Especially if some team whiffs in free agency and wants to get into cap saving/tanking mode, Cleveland can pretty much do what they did with the Shumpert/Smith trade.

[stevew]

Lee can't be stretch provisioned. One of few players left. Might be the last.

[Groundhog]

Phil Jackson is now:

http://40.media.tumblr.com/2542c7215e2db26d5a16d6e873c8b204/tumblr_ncn06gYM4f1tvtslzo2_400.jpg

[nol]

Kings are trying to trade Cousins. Between Kings fans' rightful pessimism that the front office will get any kind of decent return and Lakers fans' delusional optimism that their team can acquire superstars at no cost, the trade rumors will be pretty funny.

[RainMaker]

Kings are trying to trade Cousins. Between Kings fans' rightful pessimism that the front office will get any kind of decent return and Lakers fans' delusional optimism that their team can acquire superstars at no cost, the trade rumors will be pretty funny.

I just can't see the Kings trading him for anything less than the 2nd pick in the draft. He's a really good player on a really good deal.

I don't get what the Kings are doing.

[nol]

I just can't see the Kings trading him for anything less than the 2nd pick in the draft. He's a really good player on a really good deal.

I don't get what the Kings are doing.

Kevin Love on an expiring contract got traded for the first pick (and the first overall pick the year before, but that's mostly incidental). It should take a lot more than that.

[Groundhog]

So somehow the Lakers think they can get DMC and still pick in the top 5 this draft? lol

[Groundhog]

...................although having said that, Sac is a frontoffice that wants to explore a 5-on-4 defense.............

[stevew]

Fucking assholes should have traded cousins to the Cavs instead last year. Don't know what the Lakers have, and a starting point is Randall and #2 at the minium I'd think.

[MrBug708]

Need Vlade to do us a solid

[King of New York]

Vlade Divac might be the Manchurian Vice President of Basketball Operations. All Kobe has to do is say "Trade Boogie," and Vlade will be powerless to disobey.

[korme]

Yeah, that was a pure salary dump for Milwaukee. I don't know what they're gonna do with the cap room beyond re-signing Middleton

If Wade opts out, expect a major offer from Milwaukee.

[Brian Swartz]

I don't get what the Kings are doing.

That's ok, you've got company. It's becoming increasingly obvious that they don't know either. Karl should be fired immediately, and others might have to go as well. There's a reason why many players want to play where there's a decent organization in place.

[Chief Rum]

Vlade Divac might be the Manchurian Vice President of Basketball Operations. All Kobe has to do is say "Trade Boogie," and Vlade will be powerless to disobey.

Like McHale in Minnesota.

[miami_fan]

That's ok, you've got company. It's becoming increasingly obvious that they don't know either. Karl should be fired immediately, and others might have to go as well. There's a reason why many players want to play where there's a decent organization in place.

There had to be some discussion about the relationship between Karl and Cousins, right? I can't see how Kings management OR George Karl could agree on Karl becoming head coach without a clear plan on how Karl and Cousins would work together and a clear exit strategy for if (when?) it went wrong.

[whomario]

I think the Chaos in the kings Organisation last season is giving headline hungry journalists a sort of “free play“ for ludicrous rumours in the sense that its hard to call bs in light of past events ...

[whomario]

I was kinda surprised to learn that there have only been 10 true international players (drafted from there, not going the college route like Bogut) drafted in the Top10.

I also find it bizarre that this whole "woa, the mysterious foreigner rises up in the rankings due to 1:0 workouts" is still a thing.

You can be sure that literally every NBA team had scouts out for Porzingis or Hezonja multiple times over the season and have had the large chunk of games available on "tape". They are not playing in Lithuania ca 1997 or the Greek 2nd division but in the ACB and Eurocup in 2015. The thing is that certain things are hard to judge with the professional (and fairly restricted) environment, which is where the workouts come in. Just like for players from teams like Kentucky, where they simply can only be observed in their "role" rather than as complete players.
Good for Porzingis that he is very active in steering clear of that perception. Nothing Hezonja can do about it, since he is still playing for his club team in the spanish league finals.

I have my doubts with Porzingis personally, but being able to shoot the ball is definitely a big thing for a guy like him (and he is not a pure spot up shooter either, can shoot off a drible and coming off screens). Which a guy like Veseley unfortunately could not (where i maintain that he could be a rotation player if you play to his strength, he is a terrific defensive player)

I think a lot will depend on the mindset of the team drafting him. He´s not a guy you can slot into a specific role early on and he´ll struggle with that for a while. On offense he needs oportunities to make mistakes early on if you bank on him taking a feature role there at some point. And defensively he will have an adjustment period, just like all international players do, especially Front Court Players with the different spacing in the NBA game.

Hezonja to me is destined to be a 6th man type of player where you need to take the good with the bad. Not a guy to park in the corner skillset-wise, unlikely to be a guy who is good enough that you let him dictate your offense for a whole game.

I think the Knicks are the big Wild Card in the Top 10, along with the Kings. I am pretty sure the Knicks will trade the pick, imo it would be smart to do it. (which might exclude the possibility ;) ).

Everybody in this draft except maybe Towns seems to be a "system player" in that they need some adjustments for their style to work (Okafor comes to mind first) or guys that are role players you look at team fit again.

[nol]

I think a lot will depend on the mindset of the team drafting him. He´s not a guy you can slot into a specific role early on and he´ll struggle with that for a while. On offense he needs oportunities to make mistakes early on if you bank on him taking a feature role there at some point. And defensively he will have an adjustment period, just like all international players do, especially Front Court Players with the different spacing in the NBA game.

Yeah, he will need a good environment more than most because there's not going to be one thing he does particularly well from the start that ingratiates him with a less patient coach.

I also find it bizarre that this whole "woa, the mysterious foreigner rises up in the rankings due to 1:0 workouts" is still a thing.


That's exactly what happened though. He declared last year, was scouted pretty heavily this year and was in the 5-10 range for pretty much the entire season. Then he had a workout and people were talking about him as the best prospect in the draft.

[Subby]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">ESPN sources say Cavs forward Kevin Love has opted out of the final year of his contract and will be a free agent July 1</p>&mdash; Marc Stein (@ESPNSteinLine) <a href="https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/613773397059870721">June 24, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Kodos]

Watch out. Love bites.

[whomario]

This is no indication on his leanings regarding Free Agency though. Might simply sign a short new deal that actually makes him more money this season. Its pretty rare that players of his caliber not opt out of their deals i would guess.

In the "human interest" department: Steph Curry sending a finals jersey to Drazen Petrovic Mom (who babysat him during the 1992 3point contest) for the museum dedicated to Drazen.

[Groundhog]

Yeah, I think everyone surely expected Love to opt out? I still think it's a good chance he stays, but who knows. He was frustrating enough to watch last season that I wouldn't exactly be heartbroken if he left.

[BishopMVP]

Celtics are going to woo Kevin Love (meh) with a potential package of Paul Pierce (yay) and Robin Lopez (oh god no)??? If it was anyone other than Woj reporting it is dismiss it, but the man is connected. Go for DeAndre if you want, try to steal Middleton or Tobias Harris, don't let SA/Chicago/GS get discounts on their Kawhi/Butler/Draymond, do not overpay for a 2nd/3rd tier big guy.

[Groundhog]

Blazers maybe trading Batum to Hornets for Gerald Henderson/Noah Vonleh? Interesting if true... Vonleh didn't do a lot last year, but he's young and it was a crowded frontcourt in Charlotte. I think he was the guy Orlando should've grabbed over Gordon.

[stevew]

Love will likely sign 1+1 with anyone. I suppose he could be kinda scared after the shoulder. But I doubt he signs for 4 or 5.

Blazers must see Henderson as a reasonably priced Matthews replacement

[stevew]

Dola

I do want Love back but only if we're seriously going to limit LeBron's minutes.

[Young Drachma]

Kings owner not letting Karl trade Cousins.

[Groundhog]

My final random thoughts pre-draft...

Guys that would scare me if my team were picking in the top 4: Porzingis, Mudiay, Hezonja.

Justise Winslow and Stanley Johnson both have those Draymond Green-esque "small-ball 4" builds that have me intrigued.

I'd take WCS over Kaminsky any day of the week. I think I'd take Dekker over Kaminsky, too.

Kelly Oubre looks like the prototypical underachieving Jayhawk who will be out of the league in 3-4 years.

I didn't see anything out of Tyrus Jones at Duke that cried out "NBA PG". He got hot in the tourney, but I wouldn't pick him over Jerian Grant or Delon Wright.

I have a feeling that the Spurs are going to end up drafting one out of Kevon Looney, Delon Wright, or Rondae Hollis-Jefferson and craft them into the perfect rotation player.

[Groundhog]

Love will likely sign 1+1 with anyone. I suppose he could be kinda scared after the shoulder. But I doubt he signs for 4 or 5.

I think this will be the new norm for star players, until they hit that "one last big contract" phase of their career.


Blazers must see Henderson as a reasonably priced Matthews replacement

I like Gerald Henderson as a backup SG, but not so much as a starter. A bit inconsistent offensively, and a mediocre three point shooter (although he's gotten better the last couple of years).

TBH I can't imagine this trade would make Portland a more attractive place for Aldridge.

[Groundhog]

Jeremy Lamb to the Hornets for some sort of deal involving Matt Barnes, but he won't be going to OKC. That's two good deals for the Hornets addressing their biggest needs.... what the hell is going on?!

[murrayyyyy]

Blazers maybe trading Batum to Hornets for Gerald Henderson/Noah Vonleh? Interesting if true... Vonleh didn't do a lot last year, but he's young and it was a crowded frontcourt in Charlotte. I think he was the guy Orlando should've grabbed over Gordon.

I would suspect this mean Charlotte goes with Lyles @ 9.

I'm shocked as Rashad Vaughn is shooting up draft boards but heard lots of people say he was the best shooter at workouts.

[nol]

I think this will be the new norm for star players, until they hit that "one last big contract" phase of their career.



I like Gerald Henderson as a backup SG, but not so much as a starter. A bit inconsistent offensively, and a mediocre three point shooter (although he's gotten better the last couple of years).

TBH I can't imagine this trade would make Portland a more attractive place for Aldridge.

this trade and Ellis opting out yesterday makes it seem like there's a pretty good chance Aldridge goes to Dallas.

[Groundhog]

I would suspect this mean Charlotte goes with Lyles @ 9.

No chance - I suspect that after 2 good value trades, they'll now revert back to the Hornets we know and love and draft Kaminsky here. :D

[Galaril]

I just can't see the Kings trading him for anything less than the 2nd pick in the draft. He's a really good player on a really good deal.

I don't get what the Kings are doing.

Broussard has been reporting for days the Nuggets are offering Lawson and Fahreed for Cousins. But sounds like the Kings are wanting the #7 pick in the draft . From all word around town it seems extremely likely the two nuggets get traded to some one so they can get a second first rounder in the 5-14 range. I am fine with that but not also with the #7 pick.

[Groundhog]

If the Kings are all-in on trading Cousins for whatever reason - I personally would be firing Karl over trading Cousins - Lawson+Faried+7th pick is pretty intriguing. Not without the pick though.

[RainMaker]

Broussard has been reporting for days the Nuggets are offering Lawson and Fahreed for Cousins. But sounds like the Kings are wanting the #7 pick in the draft . From all word around town it seems extremely likely the two nuggets get traded to some one so they can get a second first rounder in the 5-14 range. I am fine with that but not also with the #7 pick.

I'd throw in the 7 pick. Cousins is a legit top-10 player in the league who is under contract for a long time that is well under what his value is. Lawson is an above average PG on a fair deal while Faried is limited a great deal at PF and on a bad contract.

It's incredibly rare for a player at that age, with that much talent, and with that good of a contract to come on the market.

[RainMaker]

The Wolves should offer the #1 pick in the draft for Cousins.

[nol]

The Wolves should offer the #1 pick in the draft for Cousins.

I think Towns is a little bit too good of a prospect, but the main problem would be that the Wolves would have to give back at least $14M worth of players, which would make it much less attractive for the Kings.

[RainMaker]

They could send back Bennett and Buddinger. Both are technically expiring deals and it gives the Kings a flyer on Bennett.

[MrBug708]

Blazers maybe trading Batum to Hornets for Gerald Henderson/Noah Vonleh? Interesting if true... Vonleh didn't do a lot last year, but he's young and it was a crowded frontcourt in Charlotte. I think he was the guy Orlando should've grabbed over Gordon.

Blazers tried to trade for him in the draft

[nol]

They could send back Bennett and Buddinger. Both are technically expiring deals and it gives the Kings a flyer on Bennett.

I wouldn't even trade Towns for Cousins straight up though. Towns can be a top 10 player as well and will be on an even better deal.

[RainMaker]

Towns can be a top 10 player but Cousins already is one. I'd rather have the sure thing.

[Galaril]

If the Kings are all-in on trading Cousins for whatever reason - I personally would be firing Karl over trading Cousins - Lawson+Faried+7th pick is pretty intriguing. Not without the pick though.

So, the Kings get the 6th and 7th picks in the first along with Lawson and Ken Freheed for Cousins. That would mean likely on the Kings roster at least four starters for one? Um no thanks unless at the very least the Kings throw him Collison or at least a PG prospect like McCallum.

[Zinto]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Sources: Lakers, Kings exchange framework of trade centered on DeMarcus Cousins today, discussions could intensify Thursday. Story soon.</p>&mdash; Adrian Wojnarowski (@WojYahooNBA) <a href="https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/613905039262883840">June 25, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Zinto]

I am not sure how any team in the league doesn't inquire about what the Kings want for DeMarcus. I would love to see the Pistons trade Drummond, the 8th pick, and whatever it takes salary wise to get him. He is an elite player.

[Groundhog]

So, the Kings get the 6th and 7th picks in the first along with Lawson and Ken Freheed for Cousins. That would mean likely on the Kings roster at least four starters for one? Um no thanks unless at the very least the Kings throw him Collison or at least a PG prospect like McCallum.

The Kings would probably happily throw in Collison or McCallum (or both). If I were running the Nuggets (or Kings) I still don't know if I would make the deal, but Cousins is really the only super value piece in the whole trade - 6th and 7th picks in a draft which has a clear 2 or 3 top-tier prospects and an average/above-average starting PG and one-dimensional PF. Collison is a serviceable rotation player, and McCallum is a prospect.

It's fairer than the rumoured Lakers deal though, unless they included their #2 pick.

[JPhillips]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Sources: Lakers, Kings exchange framework of trade centered on DeMarcus Cousins today, discussions could intensify Thursday. Story soon.</p>&mdash; Adrian Wojnarowski (@WojYahooNBA) <a href="https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/613905039262883840">June 25, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I hope the Lakers somehow keep the #2 and pick Russell, not because I like the Lakers, but because I'd love to see Philly grab another center. Hinkie could roll with a four C one PG lineup.

[stevew]

Towns has 2 (what look to be) morbidly obese parents. Not a super big deal but gave me a slight pause.

Also saw some cool vid on how Carl Banks kept sending him shoes as he was going thru massive growth spurts.

[RainMaker]

The only way the Lakers deal makes sense is if the Kings are piling on the shitty contracts like Landry too.

[murrayyyyy]

No chance - I suspect that after 2 good value trades, they'll now revert back to the Hornets we know and love and draft Kaminsky here. :D

More likely that Jordan panics when Lyles is gone and takes Stein for his "offense"

[nol]

Towns can be a top 10 player but Cousins already is one. I'd rather have the sure thing.

Maybe a 3-team deal where Bennett and some other Minnesota salary dump goes to the Celtics, Gerald Wallace and no. 1 go to Sacramento, and the T-wolves get Cousins with some fringe players and picks to even things out. Even then, if I were Minnesota I wouldn't want to be dealing with a guy whose agent is making a big stink about getting him to play in Los Angeles (and the agent doesn't want to be dealing with Minnesota either, I'm sure). Also looking ahead to next year's draft, Towns will likely be the youngest, best player on a rookie scale deal before the cap goes up; he'll be on the Wolves for at least 2 years after Boogie's current deal expires.

[murrayyyyy]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Sources: Lakers, Kings exchange framework of trade centered on DeMarcus Cousins today, discussions could intensify Thursday. Story soon.</p>&mdash; Adrian Wojnarowski (@WojYahooNBA) <a href="https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/613905039262883840">June 25, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Vlade is to the Lakers as McHale was for the Celtics... :banghead:

[Galaril]

The Kings would probably happily throw in Collison or McCallum (or both). If I were running the Nuggets (or Kings) I still don't know if I would make the deal, but Cousins is really the only super value piece in the whole trade - 6th and 7th picks in a draft which has a clear 2 or 3 top-tier prospects and an average/above-average starting PG and one-dimensional PF. Collison is a serviceable rotation player, and McCallum is a prospect.

It's fairer than the rumoured Lakers deal though, unless they included their #2 pick.

Good points but Collison was the starting point guard thru the first 45 games of the Kings season and McCallum as a rookie started at Pg for the last 35 games so think either could likely start for the Nuggets with Cousin down low. It want happen and fine with that. If the Nuggets keep the 7th and can get the MOuday kid or so how Winslow I think that is better and then maybe they can trade off Lawson and our Fraheed for a mid round 1st. The draft is not the 1984 draft but it is deep enough through lottery picks.

[RainMaker]

If this is his agent wanting to go to LA, that's a different story. But what I'm reading is that Karl doesn't want him and went to some teammates trying to talk them into the trade. Remember that Karl has a really bad reputation with this kind of stuff.

Cousins coming out with that snake in the grass tweet was telling. And he's said that he likes Sacramento and wants to stay.

A brief history of NBA stars calling George Karl a snake - SBNation.com (http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/6/23/8830539/george-karl-snake-demarcus-cousins-history)

[stevew]

Basically the Kings are that GM that joins your MP league, screws up everything and upsets the balance of power. By the time the Kings figure this out it could be 2020. And the Kings still owe the Bulls a first via Cleveland that may turn into a 2nd cause they're just that awful.

[nol]

If this is his agent wanting to go to LA, that's a different story. But what I'm reading is that Karl doesn't want him and went to some teammates trying to talk them into the trade. Remember that Karl has a really bad reputation with this kind of stuff.

Cousins coming out with that snake in the grass tweet was telling. And he's said that he likes Sacramento and wants to stay.

A brief history of NBA stars calling George Karl a snake - SBNation.com (http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/6/23/8830539/george-karl-snake-demarcus-cousins-history)

Right, I was kind of beating around the bush there - the Wolves don't have the players or coach (the Nick Young/Javale McGee/Andray Blatche Wizards mutinied on Saunders) in place to handle Cousins. Much simpler to just go forward with the two best prospects of the last tow years on rookie deals. A good comparison for Towns is a slightly bigger version of Rasheed Wallace with a good attitude, and that's pretty damn scary.

[nol]

I think if Mario Hezonja was available to have a 1-on-0 workout (instead he's playing in the Spanish league finals, where he had 18 off the bench in game 1) that focused on threes and dunks, he'd look even more impressive than Porzingis did.

Haha, and to speak of the devil, the latest DraftExpress mock draft has the Knicks taking Hezonja at 4. I don't usually watch the draft because people like Woj pretty much tweet it all in advance, but the crowd reaction and Hezonja's subsequent interview would make for must see TV.

[RainMaker]

I'm really hoping the Knicks do something crazy like draft Kaminsky at 4 because Phil thinks he's a better fit for the triangle.

Tomorrow night should be fun!

[Groundhog]

I'm a bit surprised at all the mock drafts that have Willie Cauley-Stein outside the top 10. Given his athleticism and defensive ability, all he is going to need to do on offense is finish at the basket off pick and rolls or lobs.

[RainMaker]

I'm a bit surprised at all the mock drafts that have Willie Cauley-Stein outside the top 10. Given his athleticism and defensive ability, all he is going to need to do on offense is finish at the basket off pick and rolls or lobs.

Me too. I figured at the 7-9 spots he's a solid pick. Won't be an All-Star but potential to be an All-NBA caliber player. I think he's perfect for today's NBA. Kind of a Tyson Chandler type player.

[Izulde]

I would suspect this mean Charlotte goes with Lyles @ 9.

I'm shocked as Rashad Vaughn is shooting up draft boards but heard lots of people say he was the best shooter at workouts.

I'm not shocked at all TBH. It's not a great draft class IMO (probably why Vaughn and Wood declared), and injury aside, he's got a varied skillset. Obviously he needs to develop more, as is typical with Rice's UNLV players (I'm more and more convinced he's a great recruiter who can't do shit outside of that).

I was hoping he'd last to 27 for the Lakers to take him, but that probably doesn't happen now.

[RainMaker]

I'm a bit surprised at all the mock drafts that have Willie Cauley-Stein outside the top 10. Given his athleticism and defensive ability, all he is going to need to do on offense is finish at the basket off pick and rolls or lobs.

Did a little more research and apparently he has some injury concerns.

Report: Willie Cauley-Stein's injury history 'giving teams pause' - CBSSports.com (http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/25221818/report-willie-cauley-steins-injury-history-giving-teams-pause)

[nol]

I'm not shocked at all TBH. It's not a great draft class IMO (probably why Vaughn and Wood declared), and injury aside, he's got a varied skillset. Obviously he needs to develop more, as is typical with Rice's UNLV players (I'm more and more convinced he's a great recruiter who can't do shit outside of that).

I was hoping he'd last to 27 for the Lakers to take him, but that probably doesn't happen now.

Yeah, without the whole sketchy "guardian/mentor gets a high-paying position at Findlay Prep and then player goes to UNLV" thing he probably would have gone to Iowa State, and who knows what he could have done under Fred Hoiberg?

[Groundhog]

Me too. I figured at the 7-9 spots he's a solid pick. Won't be an All-Star but potential to be an All-NBA caliber player. I think he's perfect for today's NBA. Kind of a Tyson Chandler type player.

I think he's probably one of the safest picks in the whole draft, because the things he does best are the type of things that translate to the pro game, and his ability to run the floor in transition and finish at the basket are more important than a back-to-the-basket game. You can easily get away with him as your starting C without affecting spacing as long as you have a PF that can shoot.

I'm lot less confident that Kaminsky's offensive game or that Turner or Lyles will be able to do any one thing as well as WCS does currently.

[Groundhog]

Did a little more research and apparently he has some injury concerns.

Report: Willie Cauley-Stein's injury history 'giving teams pause' - CBSSports.com (http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/25221818/report-willie-cauley-steins-injury-history-giving-teams-pause)

Ahhh.... that makes some sense.

[nol]

Ahhh.... that makes some sense.

Also he's not a beast on the defensive boards. The appeal of players like Tyson Chandler and DeAndre Jordan is that their ability to be a target for lobs on the pick-and-roll gives them enough offensive game to not be a liability on that end, which allows them to stay in to take care of the boards and anchor the defense. As far as league-wide trends, I think this playoffs was less about small ball than it was about showing how defensive players who can't play offense can be exposed in the postseason just as easily as their defensively-challenged analogs traditionally have been. He seems to be a wild card mentally as well, but I think a lot of what's being said about him is an effort to get him to fall to the Pacers.

[murrayyyyy]

I'm not shocked at all TBH. It's not a great draft class IMO (probably why Vaughn and Wood declared), and injury aside, he's got a varied skillset. Obviously he needs to develop more, as is typical with Rice's UNLV players (I'm more and more convinced he's a great recruiter who can't do shit outside of that).

I was hoping he'd last to 27 for the Lakers to take him, but that probably doesn't happen now.

Wood won't go in the top 45 tonight. This kid doesn't even have a 2 cent brain. He trolls every interview during the season, trolled UNLV thinking he was coming back and supposedly has blown every NBA interview. He reminds me of Josh Smith in every aspect of his game but unfortunately he reminds me of Josh Smith when it comes to using his brain also.

As for Vaughn/Rice. It's become clear that Rice just can't coach. If he would just keep recruiting and bring in a asst. coach to run anything that resembled an offense, defense or a player rotation they could be good but Vaughn went down the same path as Bennett IMO. Tried hard for a while and figured out Rice is a joke. Unfortunately he had the knee tear so we didn't get to see that much of him here.

[whomario]

I was initially really excited that Batum was going to play with Anthony Davis, then i remembered the name switch of the two teams :(

Makes sense for Charlotte though. If they are committed to Kemba Walker, then getting a great passer like Batum is a good move. They also traded for Jeremy Lamb (for Luke Ridnour, see below)

David West opts out of his contract with the Pacers, thats a little more surprising than Love.


Also, Luke Ridnour (and his unguaranteed contract) has been traded 3 times in the last 24 hours.

[Izulde]

Yeah, Wood's stunt of saying he was staying, then declaring, really irritated me. I think Vaughn was also stuck in a situation where he was our only true primary scorer. Hopefully Rice is gone after this next season. Been damned frustrating having all that talent and him not able to do anything with it.

[nol]

To me, the Embiid news seems like a calculated move by the 76ers to give some credence to the idea they would draft someone like Okafor if he's there at 3, which would possibly make some teams contact them with a stronger trade offer.

Report: If Lakers take Russell at no. 2, Celtics prepared to make "Godfather offer" to Sixers for Okafor (http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/06/25/report-if-lakers-take-dangelo-russell-at-no-2-celtics-to-make-godfather-offer-to-sixers-for-okafor/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)

Whether or not he's actually hurt, there are sure to be some offers out there. I'd trade no. 3 (assuming no Russell) for Smart and enough of the Nets' future first-rounders.

Aldridge is almost assuredly gone from Portland. San Antonio would have to cut some payroll to land him, and if Danny Green goes teams should definitely be prepared to offer him a good-sized contract.

[Brian Swartz]

And we're off! Minny takes Towns first, to the surprise of virtually nobody. I'm wondering what the next step is in Van Gundy's master plan to reshape the Pistons will be.

[murrayyyyy]

shits about to get interesting. I like the Lakers pick but the phones are going nuts in Philly.

[bulletsponge]

finaly something interesting happening in an NBA draft!

[heybrad]

Love the Lakers pick!

[Groundhog]

I really didn't think the Lakers would pass on Okafor. Wow, this is really interesting.

[murrayyyyy]

So he was 4 months old when Kobe was drafted?

[Groundhog]

Noel-Embiid-Okafor. Sixers stockpiling bigs in contrast to every other team in the league...........

[bulletsponge]

Noel-Embiid-Okafor. Sixers stockpiling bigs in contrast to every other team in the league...........

Okafor isnt injured, they will trade him :D

[EagleFan]

Trade looming large.

[murrayyyyy]

I can't imagine him staying...

[miami_fan]

Noel-Embiid-Okafor. Sixers stockpiling bigs in contrast to every other team in the league...........

So the stretch 4 is...?

[murrayyyyy]

Trade looming large.

Problem is what do they want? Better yet, who would want to go there?

[mckerney]

@WojYahooNBA
The Sixers plan to keep Okafor --- for good, sources tell Yahoo. He won't be auctioned in a trade.

[murrayyyyy]

@WojYahooNBA
The Sixers plan to keep Okafor --- for good, sources tell Yahoo. He won't be auctioned in a trade.

Maybe Noel is out. Send him to New Orleans... (one could hope couldn't he)

[Brian Swartz]

Maybe they don't have confidence Embiid ever does much.

[Eaglesfan27]

Wow. I really thought we were going to get Russell.

[EagleFan]

Problem is what do they want? Better yet, who would want to go there?

More picks... :) I think Hinkie's plan is to have a draft where every pick is his.

[Groundhog]

And thus seals Porzingis' fate as a draft bust. :(

[miami_fan]

Hoo boy

[murrayyyyy]

And thus seals Porzingis' fate as a draft bust. :(

Hello Darko my old freind....

[murrayyyyy]

I should turn Wojbomb off.

Cause the next 2 picks have me wondering if this is a nightmare tonight.

[Groundhog]

The Kings strategy of doing everything possible to piss Cousins off seems to be going remarkably well.

[murrayyyyy]

The Kings strategy of doing everything possible to piss Cousins off seems to be going remarkably well.

Pick hasn't been announced yet but it has me wondering wtf the Kings are doing. :popcorn:

[murrayyyyy]

At this pace does Jordan cave in and take Winslow?

You would have to think the Nuggets and Pistons are trading down these picks if they can find a buyer.

[Groundhog]

Surely they are either picking WCS for someone else, have a trade worked out for Cousins, or are hoping that this is the final straw that leads to Cousins beating George Karl to death.

[miami_fan]

Whatever the next 4 teams can do to get Justice Winslow on the Heat, they have my approval.

[Groundhog]

From Twitter:

"Teams drafting franchise players &the Knicks are ordering appetizers at an Italian restaurant. "Yes we'll start with the Kristaps Porzingis"

:D :D :D

[murrayyyyy]

Whatever the next 4 teams can do to get Justice Winslow on the Heat, they have my approval.

Only team you have to worry about is Charlotte.

And supposedly they flipped to Frank the tank today.

[Groundhog]

I like Stanley Johnson, but surprised he went ahead of Winslow.

[Groundhog]

Now comes Charlotte's Kaminsky pick..................

[bhlloy]

The Kings are a train wreck. Who knows what they are really up to but there's no way that pick makes sense

[bhlloy]

DOLA - what is the point of watching this on TV when they are two picks behind?

[nol]

DOLA - what is the point of watching this on TV when they are two picks behind?

As always, zero.

[murrayyyyy]

I like Stanley Johnson, but surprised he went ahead of Winslow.

Don't they owe a shit load to B-Jenn and R-Jackson now?

[mckerney]

Silver needs to give Goodell some pointers on pronounciating player names.

[Brian Swartz]

I would have much rather had Winslow. I continue to be unimpressed with the Van Gundy regime overall.

[murrayyyyy]

Hornets making the best move is trade rumor is true. When did Jordan get a GM?

[Groundhog]

If Winslow slips to Miami at #10, that's a Paul Pierce-esque steal.

[bhlloy]

Somebody is getting an absolute steal with Winslow

[Logan]

Somebody is getting an absolute steal with Winslow

Are we at the point where we have to question why he's falling? Medical?

[murrayyyyy]

Celtics picks 16 and 28 and Sullinger was what I read today for the 9 maybe.

[Groundhog]

I think it's just need - he should've gone to Orlando at #5 IMO, and I think Detroit was locked in on Stanley Johnson for awhile now.

[miami_fan]

DOLA - what is the point of watching this on TV when they are two picks behind?

Is it just Woj or is it someone else?

[Groundhog]

Chad Ford: With the eighth pick the Detroit Pistons select Stanley Johnson. With Justise Winslow on the board. First big mistake of the night.

[Brian Swartz]

Great, now I'm stuck in the position of agreeing with Chad Ford. There are few worse sentences in the sport of basketball.

[miami_fan]

Not that it matters that much to me, I am used to being behind on this nowadays. Getting old is a bitch:D

[Dutch]

So the Magic draft some dude from Croatia. How does the NBA even find these guys???

[Groundhog]

Great, now I'm stuck in the position of agreeing with Chad Ford. There are few worse sentences in the sport of basketball.

Not so fast - Kings probably made the first big mistake!

[Groundhog]

If I were the Hornets I'd grab Winslow and roll out a small ball lineup with Batum at the 4.

[Groundhog]

And trade MKG to a team that thinks you can play a SF that can't shoot from outside the key.

[Brian Swartz]

Ehh, if they hadn't completely screwed up everything relating to Cousins for the last several months, I don't think it would be that bad of a pick. Cousins/Cauley-Stein in a high-low offense could be very nice.

And trade MKG to a team that thinks you can play a SF that can't shoot from outside the key.

No. Please NO. We already tried that.

[Groundhog]

Cousins/WCS = really lousy spacing, especially if Rudy Gay is still your SF.

[murrayyyyy]

If I were the Hornets I'd grab Winslow and roll out a small ball lineup with Batum at the 4.

What if they can get Marcus Smart and both C's 1st rounders? Then try to sign a 4 in free agency.

[Groundhog]

Annnnnnnd Charlotte is back to being Charlotte! I was getting worried after those logical Batum and Lamb trades.

[murrayyyyy]

or just draft the 4 like they did

[Brian Swartz]

Another reason to dislike the Heat. They win the draft.

[nol]

Are we at the point where we have to question why he's falling? Medical?

Can't shoot and is kind of short to be a stretch 4.

[Groundhog]

Getting probably the 5th best prospect at #10 is incredible value (assuming they don't do something stupid here).

[murrayyyyy]

So does OKC get Lyles or Portis and slide Ibaka to the 5 or just refuse to have a 5.

[Izulde]

Stoked the Lakers took Russell over Okafor.

[Groundhog]

Can't shoot and is kind of short to be a stretch 4.

41% from college 3pt line at nearly 3 attempts per game is pretty promising IMO.

[miami_fan]

That will work

[murrayyyyy]

Also where does Cameron Payne end up? 18 with Houston?

[Groundhog]

Also where does Cameron Payne end up? 18 with Houston?

I'm guessing he goes before Grant and Jones.

[Groundhog]

WHERE'S ALL THESE WONDEROUS TRADES WE WERE PROMISED?!

[murrayyyyy]

I'm guessing he goes before Grant and Jones.

Will have to be a trade because everyone has a PG already in that area. Oh wait, maybe the Suns can draft a 9th PG.

[Groundhog]

Dekker would be the most Utah Jazzish pick ever here.

[murrayyyyy]

WHERE'S ALL THESE WONDEROUS TRADES WE WERE PROMISED?!

I selfishly wish the Grizzlies would trade up for Portis but they seem set on Martin @ 25.

[nol]

41% from college 3pt line at nearly 3 attempts per game is pretty promising IMO.

Doing that on not many attempts per game, against college 4s, while shooting a not great percentage from the free throw line, while having a reputation as a non-shooter going into college, while struggling to make NBA threes in workouts is less so.

Still should have gone a couple spots higher, but he's not a sure fire star. Those were the reasons he fell from the top five, but a lot of it is also the Kings dropping the ball on Mudiay. If they'd taken him the Nuggets would've gotten Winslow.

[Groundhog]

Doing that on not many attempts per game, against college 4s, while shooting a not great percentage from the free throw line, while having a reputation as a non-shooter going into college, while struggling to make NBA threes in workouts is less so.

Still should have gone a couple spots higher, but he's not a sure fire star.

Paul Pierce as a Freshman - 30% 3pt on 3.4 per game, 61% FTs. I don't really think there's a strong similarity between the two, but at #10 it's great value.

[Groundhog]

Strange pick by Utah IMO, they just managed to clear out their glut of bigs by trading Kanter. I wonder if this means Favors is out.

[murrayyyyy]

Suns take a 9th guard, Suns take a 9th guard (okay, maybe not 9 but it seems like it)

[Sweed]

Pleased and surprised at the Lakers pick. I liked Okafor but every time I thought of another guy that makes 50% from the line I just cringed.

[RainMaker]

The Hornets show why they are a garbage franchise.

[Groundhog]

Booker is a pretty solid 3/D prospect. I think #13 is a pretty fair slot for him.

Raps trade Vasquez to Bucks for a future 1st (Clippers pick).

[Groundhog]

Payne goes to the Thunder.

[murrayyyyy]

Payne goes to the Thunder.

Protection for knee surgery # 4 and 5 next season.

[Groundhog]

Waiters, Westbrook, and Payne in the backcourt should do wonders for KD's shot rate.

[murrayyyyy]

Dekker to Boston because it's a Boston type guy or staying home in Milwaukee at the next pick?

[murrayyyyy]

According to WOJO, The Wizards just traded for the pick of Oubre

[Groundhog]

Oubre is destined to bomb IMO...

[murrayyyyy]

Oubre is destined to bomb IMO...

Athletic kid from Findley Prep here in Vegas. Isn't scared to go get a rebound.

[murrayyyyy]

WTF Boston?!?! Another PG? Trading Smart?

[Groundhog]

Boston go with Dozier... a bit surprising, both the position and the fact that they picked him over Grant.

[murrayyyyy]

Well another surprise coming. Bucks go PG.

[Groundhog]

Vaughn to Bucks - his stock got a nice little bump the last couple of days. Grant to Rockets seems perfect on paper at #18...