Front Office Football 2007 - Page 4

yabanci · 10-26-2006, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daimyo

Boo. Log files and box scores no longer appear to be stored in plain text format. IMO that's actually a huge step backwards for MP immersion. Hopefully the MP html export will include them...

but solevision is a huge step forward.

cuervo72 · 10-26-2006, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daimyo

Boo. Log files and box scores no longer appear to be stored in plain text format. IMO that's actually a huge step backwards for MP immersion. Hopefully the MP html export will include them...

How are they stored? Or are they just generated on the fly more or less from pieced together db information (lines of player/game data)?

cartman · 10-26-2006, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daimyo

Boo. Log files and box scores no longer appear to be stored in plain text format. IMO that's actually a huge step backwards for MP immersion. Hopefully the MP html export will include them...

I don't get this. How does HTML vs TXT affect immersion? One you view with notepad in black and white, the other you view in a brower that has the capability for color coding. It would seem to me that if anything HTML would be more immersive.

gstelmack · 10-26-2006, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

There is an option in Global Options to turn off sim results to avoid seeing spoilers.

That option doesn't seem to do anything? I still see scores in the Simulation Window and when pressing "Simulate". Is it broken, or did I miss another place that I should be looking at to see the game results?

Edit: Never mind. Bug in the demo where changing it with a game loaded has no effect. Off to report...

heardie · 10-26-2006, 08:22 PM

So Solevision is basically this: I can sim through a week and record all scores, but not view them

Then I can do into Solevision and watch the PBP of the game, and check all other games?

Mad...

cuervo72 · 10-26-2006, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cartman

I don't get this. How does HTML vs TXT affect immersion? One you view with notepad in black and white, the other you view in a brower that has the capability for color coding. It would seem to me that if anything HTML would be more immersive.

Hrm. It might depend on how Jim stores these after the fact. If only the current one is kept around as "lastboxlog.html", that's not good. But it is very easy for instance to upload txt files to a site, they are of a standard format, and are small. Easily parseable. One reason I've wanted to develop things for the FOFL website isn't because Jim's html doesn't have info in there - there is a good amount of info there. But it isn't flexible. It isn't always easy to navigate. And quite frankly...it's usually pretty darned ugly. If the html was coded with css, this might be easily fixable. Looks like there are font tags and bgcolor tags all over the place though.

Samdari · 10-26-2006, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yabanci

but solevision is a huge step forward.

Yeah, if you can indeed just load a league file and watch the week in solevision, it is definitely the best presentation improvement in the series.

I'll be honest, I have been hankering for a TCY update, and was lukewarm on a new FOF, but the feature list and demo have wowed me like no other version of this game since the first one I played.

Congratulations on the release Jim, this looks to be an amazing piece of work.

RedKingGold · 10-26-2006, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gstelmack

That option doesn't seem to do anything? I still see scores in the Simulation Window and when pressing "Simulate". Is it broken, or did I miss another place that I should be looking at to see the game results?

It worked for me.

Notice how the scores are blanked out and there is no indication of the winner (this is after the sim was run)

Daimyo · 10-26-2006, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cuervo72

How are they stored? Or are they just generated on the fly more or less from pieced together db information (lines of player/game data)?

It looks like they are stored in proprietary binary files in the universe folder in files like the following:

gameid1.2006
gameid2.2006
gameid3.2006

When you click on view log or view box score in game it creates an html file with the info for that one specific game. Hopefully the MP html export will have a single html for each game log and box score.

Buccaneer · 10-26-2006, 08:27 PM

Quote:

but the feature list and demo have wowed me like no other version of this game since the first one I played.

I would expect the feature list of adding MP was up there.

Daimyo · 10-26-2006, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cartman

I don't get this. How does HTML vs TXT affect immersion? One you view with notepad in black and white, the other you view in a brower that has the capability for color coding. It would seem to me that if anything HTML would be more immersive.

The thing is that they are not stored in html... the html is generated only for the most recent box score or log file you view. The actual info is stored in binary files. The new system works well for people who only ever look at them in game, but it makes it much harder to write utilities to parse them and thus stifles 3rd party tools. I'm sure Jim had to move to the binary files to implement Solevision so I can understand why he did it, but I wish there was an option to also store them the old-fashioned way or to at least export them out of the binaries.

Daimyo · 10-26-2006, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heardie

So Solevision is basically this: I can sim through a week and record all scores, but not view them

Then I can do into Solevision and watch the PBP of the game, and check all other games?

Mad...

There is an option in the Global Options screen that will disable showing scores in the schedule overview screen.

cartman · 10-26-2006, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daimyo

The thing is that they are not stored in html... the html is generated only for the most recent box score or log file you view. The actual info is stored in binary files. The new system works well for people who only ever look at them in game, but it makes it much harder to write utilities to parse them and thus stifles 3rd party tools. I'm sure Jim had to move to the binary files to implement Solevision so I can understand why he did it, but I wish there was an option to also store them the old-fashioned way or to at least export them out of the binaries.

Oh, that's where I was mistaken. I thought that they were a straight HTML file, not generated on the fly. We'll have to wait until tomorrow to see, but maybe there is a way to generate the straight file to post on a website.

cuervo72 · 10-26-2006, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daimyo

It looks like they are stored in proprietary binary files in the universe folder in files like the following:

gameid1.2006
gameid2.2006
gameid3.2006

When you click on view log or view box score in game it creates an html file with the info for that one specific game. Hopefully the MP html export will have a single html for each game log and box score.

Ah, I see. 'gameid' is 'foflfoot' or 'ihof0001' for instance, and then the number is the number of the game? If so that's a big improvement at least (both from a log naming standpoint, and that there might be id's somewhere that can be pulled and used as keys in a db).

kingfc22 · 10-26-2006, 09:01 PM

So any chance of breaking the record of most users online tomorrow when the game is released?

gottimd · 10-26-2006, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kingfc22

So any chance of breaking the record of most users online tomorrow when the game is released?

Who will be online in the forum? Everyone will be playing the game, not on the forum.

gottimd · 10-26-2006, 09:04 PM

I assume the IHOF will be the first MP league to convert over that has an extensive history to the league. Can the commishes and GM's let the rest of us know how the transistion goes and what to expect?

wade moore · 10-26-2006, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gottimd

I assume the IHOF will be the first MP league to convert over that has an extensive history to the league. Can the commishes and GM's let the rest of us know how the transistion goes and what to expect?

Silly, silly man...

We're going to wait to see what happens with everyone else

.

RedKingGold · 10-26-2006, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gottimd

I assume the IHOF will be the first MP league to convert over that has an extensive history to the league. Can the commishes and GM's let the rest of us know how the transistion goes and what to expect?

Probably a bad assumption. They're about to start a new season over there and will probably not switch over until at least that is done (probably about another 3 months real time).

We're in the same boat over at the GEFL as we're about to wrap up our off-season.

So, its very likely another league would switch over before they did first.

Ben E Lou · 10-26-2006, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

Probably a bad assumption. They're about to start a new season over there and will probably not switch over until at least that is done (probably about another 3 months real time).

We're in the same boat over at the GEFL as we're about to wrap up our off-season.

So, its very likely another league would switch over before they did first.

Playoffs start this Monday, and IHOF Bowl is the following Monday.

Joe · 10-26-2006, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gottimd

I assume the IHOF will be the first MP league to convert over that has an extensive history to the league. Can the commishes and GM's let the rest of us know how the transistion goes and what to expect?

most of us probably want to wait at least another season before that happens.

Galaxy · 10-26-2006, 09:11 PM

This is almost as good as getting laid.

gottimd · 10-26-2006, 09:14 PM

Well damn was I wrong. Who will be the first MP league to transistion? We are mid-season so that is not a good point to do it either. Any Leagues about to end the post season?

Joe · 10-26-2006, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gottimd

Well damn was I wrong. Who will be the first MP league to transistion? We are mid-season so that is not a good point to do it either. Any Leagues about to end the post season?

make the PFL do it

cthomer5000 · 10-26-2006, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gottimd

I assume the IHOF will be the first MP league to convert over that has an extensive history to the league. Can the commishes and GM's let the rest of us know how the transistion goes and what to expect?

do we look like guinea pigs? we'll make you all do the testing for us, baby. we just be that elite. maybe the fastfl is available.

wade moore · 10-26-2006, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gottimd

Well damn was I wrong. Who will be the first MP league to transistion? We are mid-season so that is not a good point to do it either. Any Leagues about to end the post season?

I think the likely candidates really are leagues 1/2 - 3/4 through the season. Leagues about to go into the off-season are bad candidates because the game is so new still, it's the people going to the off-season 4-6 weeks from now that I expect to go first.

gottimd · 10-26-2006, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

do we look like guinea pigs? we'll make you all do the testing for us, baby. we just be that elite. maybe the fastfl is available.

Ok.....it works fine. Your turn.

Raiders Army · 10-26-2006, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galaxy

This is almost as good as getting laid.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe

make the PFL do it

Heh.

Daimyo · 10-26-2006, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Ah, I see. 'gameid' is 'foflfoot' or 'ihof0001' for instance, and then the number is the number of the game? If so that's a big improvement at least (both from a log naming standpoint, and that there might be id's somewhere that can be pulled and used as keys in a db).

I was thinking of that earlier trying to think positively about this... moving to binary log files could mean he uses player IDs instead of names which would be pretty sweet once we decode the files.

Poli · 10-26-2006, 09:30 PM

Sigh. I'm happy with FOF, though I'd much rather have TCY.

Ksyrup · 10-26-2006, 09:31 PM

You last visited: Today at 05:07 PM

OK, now that that's out of the way...time to read about the great news!

General Mike · 10-26-2006, 09:54 PM

This announcement made a pretty shitty day for me a little better.

wade moore · 10-26-2006, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by General Mike

This announcement made a pretty shitty day for me a little better.

ditto.

I could personally be responsible for people like Dutch and ae not being very happy, but I can't really talk about what I mean here..

nilodor · 10-26-2006, 10:35 PM

Sounds great, can't wait.

SunDevil · 10-26-2006, 10:37 PM

Is there going to be an option to have different graphical skins, like FM?

Schmidty · 10-26-2006, 10:37 PM

Meh.

We needed TCY2. I probably won't buy FOF2004.5 for any reason other than nostalgia.

Eaglesfan27 · 10-26-2006, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Meh.

We needed TCY2. I probably won't buy FOF2004.5 for any other reason other than nostalgia.

2004.5? Seems like this feature list is the biggest upgrade outside of the addition of MP. I feel like I will be getting great bang for my buck based on this feature set.

wade moore · 10-26-2006, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

2004.5? Seems like this feature list is the biggest upgrade outside of the addition of MP. I feel like I will be getting great bang for my buck based on this feature set.

Agreed. I can't see how this can be considered 2004.5 at ALL. I can maybe see how someone who plays SP might not be as interested in many of the features, but it is certainly a pretty dramatic feature list to me.

DaddyTorgo · 10-26-2006, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wade moore

Agreed. I can't see how this can be considered 2004.5 at ALL. I can maybe see how someone who plays SP might not be as interested in many of the features, but it is certainly a pretty dramatic feature list to me.

even as a SP player I am very interested in this feature set. so that's not even a thought wade.

i think the "blah" people are really just jonesing for a new college football game and wouldn't be happy with anything but that.

wade moore · 10-26-2006, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

even as a SP player I am very interested in this feature set. so that's not even a thought wade.

i think the "blah" people are really just jonesing for a new college football game and wouldn't be happy with anything but that.

I think even for SP it's impressive too, but I see for a certain style of player (like my interpretation of Bucc's style) that it may not have a ton more for them. What I mean by that is the quick-simmers.

That being said, not sure what you add for them.

Warhammer · 10-26-2006, 10:55 PM

Agreed. After playing around with it, the changes are huge. Looks like I am whipping out the credit card tomorrow.

Warhammer · 10-26-2006, 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wade moore

I think even for SP it's impressive too, but I see for a certain style of player (like my interpretation of Bucc's style) that it may not have a ton more for them. What I mean by that is the quick-simmers.

That being said, not sure what you add for them.

The problem with the quick sim crowd is what exactly are you looking for? The main purchasers of a text sim are pretty hardcore, so they are going to eat this up. If you are looking for just a sim engine without a lot of meat to it, I don't know where you go.

RGunner · 10-26-2006, 10:57 PM

any idea how much this will cost? just downloaded the demo and im having a blast...

DaddyTorgo · 10-26-2006, 10:58 PM

well quick simmers definately get more stats tracked and added, more immersive "universe" if you will.

game will cost 39.95 according to the FAQ on the website

wade moore · 10-26-2006, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warhammer

The problem with the quick sim crowd is what exactly are you looking for? The main purchasers of a text sim are pretty hardcore, so they are going to eat this up. If you are looking for just a sim engine without a lot of meat to it, I don't know where you go.

Yeah, that's essentially what I'm trying to say.

Since I'm not one of those, I'm not sure what could be added.

Deattribution · 10-26-2006, 11:10 PM

Personally, I quick sim mostly til the playoffs - extended statistics (playoffs is big addition), transaction list and the draft additions sound like they should be fun and add to the game.

More importantly, I'm hoping that the game has a tighter FA AI, if the other teams more correctly control their caps and the players they have I'm happy with that alone.

sabotai · 10-26-2006, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wade moore

I think even for SP it's impressive too, but I see for a certain style of player (like my interpretation of Bucc's style) that it may not have a ton more for them. What I mean by that is the quick-simmers.

I guess I fall into that camp (I don't call my own plays in SP), but I see the value in this new version. The added stats (which will be very helpful since I don't actually watch my games) and the new gameplan (which, on the surface, looks to be a HUGE improvement over the last one, which got very cumbersome very quickly for me) will make it a worthwhile purchase IMO. With the gameplans, I just let the AI handle them since I didn't want to deal with it. This looks oh so much better. The other features are added gravy.

amdaily · 10-26-2006, 11:16 PM

I think the "blah" is attributed to the fact that the game just seems static. The immersion factor hasn't changed since FOF1.

While stat tracking and accuracy remain unmatched, even games like Baseball Mogul are surpassing it in terms of having player personalities that actually mean something, the TPB series in terms of interaction with the owners, and of course FM.

Won't stop me my buying, but was sort of expecting more.

wade moore · 10-26-2006, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sabotai

I guess I fall into that camp (I don't call my own plays in SP), but I see the value in this new version. The added stats (which will be very helpful since I don't actually watch my games) and the new gameplan (which, on the surface, looks to be a HUGE improvement over the last one, which got very cumbersome very quickly for me) will make it a worthwhile purchase IMO. With the gameplans, I just let the AI handle them since I didn't want to deal with it. This looks oh so much better. The other features are added gravy.

fwiw, you don't sound like what i call a "quick-simmer". I'm talking about people that run through 4 and 5 seasons a sitting. They mainly do the GMing and really gloss-over a lot of the gameplanning details, etc.

DaddyTorgo · 10-26-2006, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amdaily

I think the "blah" is attributed to the fact that the game just seems static. The immersion factor hasn't changed since FOF1.

While stat tracking and accuracy remain unmatched, even games like Baseball Mogul are surpassing it in terms of having player personalities that actually mean something, the TPB series in terms of interaction with the owners, and of course FM.

Won't stop me my buying, but was sort of expecting more.

i can see that, and i agree. but personally i play each of the different games expecting different things (well except for FM which is really the granddaddy and has it all, with the exception of the sheer time needed to invest in it). otherwise i select the game i'm playing based on what i want to get out of it.

10-26-2006, 09:01 PM	#165
kingfc22 Head Coach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Morgan Hill, CA	So any chance of breaking the record of most users online tomorrow when the game is released? __________________ Fan of SF Giants, 49ers, Sharks, Arsenal

10-26-2006, 09:04 PM	#167
gottimd Dearly Missed (9/25/77-12/23/08) Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: DC Suburbs	I assume the IHOF will be the first MP league to convert over that has an extensive history to the league. Can the commishes and GM's let the rest of us know how the transistion goes and what to expect? __________________ NAFL New Orleans Saints GM/Co-Commish MP Career Record: 114-85 NAFL Super Bowl XI Champs In memory of Gavin Anthony: 7/22/08-7/26/08

10-26-2006, 09:14 PM	#173
gottimd Dearly Missed (9/25/77-12/23/08) Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: DC Suburbs	Well damn was I wrong. Who will be the first MP league to transistion? We are mid-season so that is not a good point to do it either. Any Leagues about to end the post season? __________________ NAFL New Orleans Saints GM/Co-Commish MP Career Record: 114-85 NAFL Super Bowl XI Champs In memory of Gavin Anthony: 7/22/08-7/26/08

10-26-2006, 09:30 PM	#180
Poli FOFC Survivor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wentzville, MO	Sigh. I'm happy with FOF, though I'd much rather have TCY. __________________ Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum.

10-26-2006, 09:31 PM	#181
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	You last visited: Today at 05:07 PM OK, now that that's out of the way...time to read about the great news! __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete."

10-26-2006, 08:22 PM	#155
heardie n00b Join Date: Feb 2005	So Solevision is basically this: I can sim through a week and record all scores, but not view them Then I can do into Solevision and watch the PBP of the game, and check all other games? Mad...

10-26-2006, 09:11 PM	#172
Galaxy Coordinator Join Date: Apr 2005	This is almost as good as getting laid.

10-26-2006, 09:54 PM	#182
General Mike Pro Starter Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: The State of Rutgers	This announcement made a pretty shitty day for me a little better.

10-26-2006, 10:35 PM	#184
nilodor College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: calgary, AB	Sounds great, can't wait.

10-26-2006, 10:37 PM	#186
Schmidty Coordinator Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Early, TX	Meh. We needed TCY2. I probably won't buy FOF2004.5 for any reason other than nostalgia. Last edited by Schmidty : 10-26-2006 at 10:54 PM.

10-26-2006, 10:55 PM	#191
Warhammer Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Dayton, OH	Agreed. After playing around with it, the changes are huge. Looks like I am whipping out the credit card tomorrow.

10-26-2006, 10:57 PM	#193
RGunner High School JV Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Fort Worth, Texas	any idea how much this will cost? just downloaded the demo and im having a blast...

10-26-2006, 10:58 PM	#194
DaddyTorgo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Massachusetts	well quick simmers definately get more stats tracked and added, more immersive "universe" if you will. game will cost 39.95 according to the FAQ on the website

10-26-2006, 11:10 PM	#196
Deattribution College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2003	Personally, I quick sim mostly til the playoffs - extended statistics (playoffs is big addition), transaction list and the draft additions sound like they should be fun and add to the game. More importantly, I'm hoping that the game has a tighter FA AI, if the other teams more correctly control their caps and the players they have I'm happy with that alone.

10-26-2006, 11:16 PM	#198
amdaily College Prospect Join Date: Nov 2003	I think the "blah" is attributed to the fact that the game just seems static. The immersion factor hasn't changed since FOF1. While stat tracking and accuracy remain unmatched, even games like Baseball Mogul are surpassing it in terms of having player personalities that actually mean something, the TPB series in terms of interaction with the owners, and of course FM. Won't stop me my buying, but was sort of expecting more.

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