Possible Job Change Advice Thread

Vince, Pt. II · 10-17-2011, 06:53 PM

So, I submit myself to the wisdom of the FOFC. Here's the situation:

I work at a utility company, and my job is being phased out. The guarantee is that I will be laid off...the question is when. My lead time will be about 30 seconds ("Hey, uh Vince? Why don't you just...not come in on Monday."). There are 17 of us in the office, and according to my boss in a private conversation "you're one of my top 8." There's no telling how soon they start cutting jobs, how many they cut at a time, etc. So really, I'm stuck on that one. I have reason to believe I'll last a little while - I run safety meetings and develop safety plans for the entire department, so if my boss lets me go, I'm sure his higher-ups will be raising eyebrows - but I don't know how strong or flimsy that protection is. Best case scenario? I'm around for another year or two. Worst case? Something on the order of two months. Boss said he's fairly certain I'll be around at least through the end of the year. I would like very badly to take a new job BEFORE I get laid off - I've known plenty of people who have floundered in this job market not able to find anything for much longer than they anticipated.

Enter job opportunity. I have several friends who work for a local video game company. They have offered me a job as a staffing coordinator that will probably include some facilities/IT stuff in the near future. They apparently have a mentorship program that will allow me, after 6 months, to start working towards another position in the company - probably somewhere as a producer in my case. If I pass a test and do well at the interview, I then can move into that role. The company offers great benefits, is a much shorter commute, and I'd be working with my friends. Also, I can't really imagine a better fit for me as a career than in the video game industry (I asked the Giants, they don't need a third baseman). And as someone with very little in the way of work experience at this sort of thing (my career track has been Pizza, Waiter, Bartender, Teacher, Utility Worker), this HR position pays much better than an entry-level QA job would, and gets me in the door to the video game industry.

Why is this even a question, you ask? The pay. I'll be taking a 60% pay cut. Not only that, the video game industry, as most of you well know, is pretty volatile, and as a new guy in the HR department I'll probably be one of the first on the chopping block if things suddenly go poorly. The company was recently bought by a larger company, and the parent company has given the studio a lot of money to support them, but they want the studio to be self-sufficient within a year or so, or things will probably change a lot. I don't know how much more I can possibly find out about how likely/unlikely that is before I decide to take or leave the job.

As a single, 30-year old male with no kids who rents his house, I have no real responsibilities, and I CAN live on the pay of the new job, although it will be an incredible adjustment in lifestyle. The thing that really worries me about the change is taking the job and then getting laid off anyways in 6 months.

What say ye, FOFC?

SackAttack · 10-17-2011, 07:01 PM

My thought is, if those are the two jobs, you're probably looking at unemployment at some point in the next 6-12 months anyway. Things don't even necessarily need to 'go poorly.' Could just be 'reduce headcount so there are fewer people we need to share this bonus with.'

On the other hand, HR is probably safer from the post-ship axe than the team that's actually working on shipping the game.

wishbone · 10-17-2011, 08:26 PM

I faced a similar situation late 2008. I was part of a helpdesk and knew that the work would be off-shored in the during 2009(maybe 2010). I interviewed for a job with another company in November 2008 and they offered me a position. The pay was about 25% less and it was further away from home - 1 hour commute instead of 15 minutes.
I did not accept the position and was laid off in January 2009. The seniority I had didn't matter, the skills I had didn't matter. Another guy who got laid off said he felt bad for himself until he found out I was let go. At that point he figured "there's no rhyme or reason to it, they must have drawn names out of a hat".
I was unemployed for 6 months before finding something else and in July 2010 was hired back at the company in a different dept. with my old manager. I often regretted not taking the position in Nov 2008 and it wasn't anything that I thought was cool or was excited about, just another helpdesk. Just my 2 cents.

RPI-Fan · 10-17-2011, 08:34 PM

This is a no-brainer. Take the new job. One of the last times in your life you'll be able to make a no-regrets decision without affecting the lives of others.

RomaGoth · 10-17-2011, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

(I asked the Giants, they don't need a third baseman).

Would you be willing to relocate?

Commo_Soldier · 10-17-2011, 09:06 PM

My question is how long will this new job be there for? If your friends work there can you still get this type of job when you get laid off, or does this type of opening not come up much. To me 60% is a big cut, is that with benefits or just pay? It may be best to try finding other jobs and keep the one your friends have for you in your back pocket and move on that in a month or so if you can't land anything else.

Vince, Pt. II · 10-17-2011, 09:45 PM

My understanding is that the job offer is not something that will be around for all that long. They are looking to fill the position soon. Apparently the prior owner of the studio had a hiring freeze, and now that the new owner has infused some money, they're looking to get positions filled and then stop hiring again for a while, at least until things get steady.

My current job offers no benefits, this new job includes all benefits, so the pay is not as dramatic as the 60% would suggest - but it's still a hefty chunk of change to leave on the table.

RPI-Fan · 10-17-2011, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

My understanding is that the job offer is not something that will be around for all that long. They are looking to fill the position soon. Apparently the prior owner of the studio had a hiring freeze, and now that the new owner has infused some money, they're looking to get positions filled and then stop hiring again for a while, at least until things get steady.

My current job offers no benefits, this new job includes all benefits, so the pay is not as dramatic as the 60% would suggest - but it's still a hefty chunk of change to leave on the table.

Even more of a no-brainer then.

Vince, Pt. II · 10-17-2011, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RPI-Fan

Even more of a no-brainer then.

I think you're right, but it just seems like so much money to leave on the table. And if I take this job and end up losing it anyways in a few months...ugh.

MacroGuru · 10-17-2011, 10:36 PM

I traveled for a living....workshop sales...was laid off in July.

Enter my choice of back on the road and not having a life for the same pay...or stay home and take a 50% paycut....for me it was a no brainer...I do not miss traveling.

I do miss my good budget though.

stevew · 10-17-2011, 10:37 PM

Too much money on the table. Even if you get canned at the utility you'll probably get more from unemployment than you'd make at the iffy software job.

Izulde · 10-17-2011, 10:37 PM

Take the job. Even if it only lasts a few months, it's an entry point into a dream field.

Subby · 10-17-2011, 10:39 PM

As long as you can make your rent, I would take the new job.

Have you considered supplementing with a part time job?

Vince, Pt. II · 10-18-2011, 01:13 AM

I've got a bunch of connections in the restaurant world, and could go back to part-time somewhere I'm sure. I really do not do the multi-job thing well, however - I've tried it before. If money becomes an issue, it's definitely an option though.

That being said, to get over from the HR side of things to the Design/Production side of things (where I want to end up), it's probably going to take a lot of extra-curricular activity anyway, so I'm not sure how much free time I'm going to end up with. The typical career path is from QA --> Design/Production. Because of that, I'm going to have to work extra hard to get to know people on that side of things and get noticed. I could probably land a QA job...but they pay even less than this HR job, and I'm not certain I could support myself without selling a bunch of stuff and moving into a shithole of an apartment on that sort of wage.

Vince, Pt. II · 10-18-2011, 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SackAttack

My thought is, if those are the two jobs, you're probably looking at unemployment at some point in the next 6-12 months anyway. Things don't even necessarily need to 'go poorly.' Could just be 'reduce headcount so there are fewer people we need to share this bonus with.'

On the other hand, HR is probably safer from the post-ship axe than the team that's actually working on shipping the game.

Totally missed this the first time through. My impression (from discussions with both HR and Dev side people) is that dev teams tend to be the "talent" in this sort of arrangement. They're much harder to train/acquire/keep. HR people, on the other hand, are rather expendable. So HR seems to be the first to go in that case. Extraneous HR, that is - like assistants.

M GO BLUE!!! · 10-18-2011, 01:28 AM

Don't be so afraid of failure that you miss a chance at success.

Izulde · 10-18-2011, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M GO BLUE!!!

Don't be so afraid of failure that you miss a chance at success.

This. I never applied to Princeton for undergrad and the thought has haunted me ever since.

gstelmack · 10-18-2011, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

Totally missed this the first time through. My impression (from discussions with both HR and Dev side people) is that dev teams tend to be the "talent" in this sort of arrangement. They're much harder to train/acquire/keep. HR people, on the other hand, are rather expendable. So HR seems to be the first to go in that case. Extraneous HR, that is - like assistants.

That depends HIGHLY on the studio and the people involved. What Sack is referring to is once a game ships, if there is no other game in the pipeline to put the team to work on, some studios WILL lay them off, then hire back up when they have another game ready to go that needs the talent. There are certainly a handful of "names" in the industry that are considered key, but everyone else is often considered expendable. There is a LOT of movement in the game industry.

Having said that I've worked at the studio I'm at for almost 15 years, minus one 8 month hiatus, so we're one of the exceptions to that rule. The one you are looking at might be similar.

Also note that the mobility can work to your advantage. If you can gain some experience, that's your foot in the door at another studio if the old one goes under.

JAG · 10-18-2011, 08:20 AM

Whichever choice you make, as much as it sucks, I would continue to look for a job upgrade as neither option sounds ideal.

Barkeep49 · 10-18-2011, 09:50 AM

If you're going to get laid off getting some new skills in an industry you'd like to work in seems like a positive move. You read stories about how companies aren't even considering people who are out of work (which is especially cruel right now) so being employed might make it easier to find a job than being unemployed.

10-17-2011, 08:34 PM	#4
RPI-Fan Pro Starter Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Troy, NY	This is a no-brainer. Take the new job. One of the last times in your life you'll be able to make a no-regrets decision without affecting the lives of others. __________________ Quis custodiets ipsos custodes?

10-17-2011, 09:06 PM	#6
Commo_Soldier College Benchwarmer Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: JBLM, WA	My question is how long will this new job be there for? If your friends work there can you still get this type of job when you get laid off, or does this type of opening not come up much. To me 60% is a big cut, is that with benefits or just pay? It may be best to try finding other jobs and keep the one your friends have for you in your back pocket and move on that in a month or so if you can't land anything else. __________________ I killed a wolf and I liked it.

10-17-2011, 10:36 PM	#10
MacroGuru Coordinator Join Date: May 2003 Location: Utah	I traveled for a living....workshop sales...was laid off in July. Enter my choice of back on the road and not having a life for the same pay...or stay home and take a 50% paycut....for me it was a no brainer...I do not miss traveling. I do miss my good budget though. __________________ "forgetting what is in the past, I strive for the future"

10-17-2011, 10:37 PM	#12
Izulde Head Coach Join Date: Sep 2004	Take the job. Even if it only lasts a few months, it's an entry point into a dream field. __________________ 2006 Golden Scribe Nominee 2006 Golden Scribe Winner Best Non-Sport Dynasty: May Our Reign Be Green and Golden (CK Dynasty) Rookie Writer of the Year Dynasty of the Year: May Our Reign Be Green and Golden (CK Dynasty)

10-17-2011, 10:39 PM	#13
Subby lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: sans pants	As long as you can make your rent, I would take the new job. Have you considered supplementing with a part time job? __________________ Superman was flying around and saw Wonder Woman getting a tan in the nude on her balcony. Superman said I going to hit that real fast. So he flys down toward Wonder Woman to hit it and their is a loud scream. The Invincible Man scream what just hit me in the ass!!!!! I do shit, I take pictures, I write about it: chrisshue.com

10-17-2011, 07:01 PM	#2
SackAttack Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Green Bay, WI	My thought is, if those are the two jobs, you're probably looking at unemployment at some point in the next 6-12 months anyway. Things don't even necessarily need to 'go poorly.' Could just be 'reduce headcount so there are fewer people we need to share this bonus with.' On the other hand, HR is probably safer from the post-ship axe than the team that's actually working on shipping the game.

10-17-2011, 08:26 PM	#3
wishbone High School JV Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Hillsboro OR	I faced a similar situation late 2008. I was part of a helpdesk and knew that the work would be off-shored in the during 2009(maybe 2010). I interviewed for a job with another company in November 2008 and they offered me a position. The pay was about 25% less and it was further away from home - 1 hour commute instead of 15 minutes. I did not accept the position and was laid off in January 2009. The seniority I had didn't matter, the skills I had didn't matter. Another guy who got laid off said he felt bad for himself until he found out I was let go. At that point he figured "there's no rhyme or reason to it, they must have drawn names out of a hat". I was unemployed for 6 months before finding something else and in July 2010 was hired back at the company in a different dept. with my old manager. I often regretted not taking the position in Nov 2008 and it wasn't anything that I thought was cool or was excited about, just another helpdesk. Just my 2 cents.

10-17-2011, 09:45 PM	#7
Vince, Pt. II Pro Starter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Somewhere More Familiar	My understanding is that the job offer is not something that will be around for all that long. They are looking to fill the position soon. Apparently the prior owner of the studio had a hiring freeze, and now that the new owner has infused some money, they're looking to get positions filled and then stop hiring again for a while, at least until things get steady. My current job offers no benefits, this new job includes all benefits, so the pay is not as dramatic as the 60% would suggest - but it's still a hefty chunk of change to leave on the table.

10-17-2011, 10:37 PM	#11
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	Too much money on the table. Even if you get canned at the utility you'll probably get more from unemployment than you'd make at the iffy software job.

10-18-2011, 01:13 AM	#14
Vince, Pt. II Pro Starter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Somewhere More Familiar	I've got a bunch of connections in the restaurant world, and could go back to part-time somewhere I'm sure. I really do not do the multi-job thing well, however - I've tried it before. If money becomes an issue, it's definitely an option though. That being said, to get over from the HR side of things to the Design/Production side of things (where I want to end up), it's probably going to take a lot of extra-curricular activity anyway, so I'm not sure how much free time I'm going to end up with. The typical career path is from QA --> Design/Production. Because of that, I'm going to have to work extra hard to get to know people on that side of things and get noticed. I could probably land a QA job...but they pay even less than this HR job, and I'm not certain I could support myself without selling a bunch of stuff and moving into a shithole of an apartment on that sort of wage.

10-18-2011, 01:28 AM	#16
M GO BLUE!!! Pro Starter Join Date: Sep 2005	Don't be so afraid of failure that you miss a chance at success.

10-18-2011, 08:20 AM	#19
JAG Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: St. Paul, MN	Whichever choice you make, as much as it sucks, I would continue to look for a job upgrade as neither option sounds ideal.

10-18-2011, 09:50 AM	#20
Barkeep49 Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Not too far away	If you're going to get laid off getting some new skills in an industry you'd like to work in seems like a positive move. You read stories about how companies aren't even considering people who are out of work (which is especially cruel right now) so being employed might make it easier to find a job than being unemployed.

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