Of Chicago the Band, and My Love Thereof

[Abe Sargent]

Hello folks!

As many of you might know, I know Chicago. It's one of my favorite bands of all time. In my teens and early 20s, it was my favorite, then that shifted to Depeche Mode, and then to Pet Shop Boys and finally to Schiller today. All of those artists are in my top five. Only DJ Roger Shaw and The Echoing Green are in there as well.



So that's who I be


Now, Chicago is very popular band, which was just put into the Rock and Roll HOF which was long deservedly so. It was past its due.

Chicago started out as an avante garde Jazz Fusion band with some blues in there. It's first album defines Jazz Rock, as songs like Does Anyone really Know What Time it Is line up with South California Purples. (And if you haven;t ever heard SCP, I'd recommend it highly. In the first 25 seconds you are done with other music).

Now Chicago began as that. But by the time their light left the spotlight (mostly) they were a very different band, in a very different place.

Chicago did a genre shift from a Jazz band in the 1969-1970s to one of the most definable and best selling pop power ballad outfits in the 80s. Because they were (arguably) the most successful in this shift, they are often seen as the worst of the lot, but a lot of bands did this too (Jefferson Airplane to Starship's remedial Sara and We Built this City or Genesis and Yes going from prog rock to something not even close).



So it's common for Chicago fans to typically be fans of a particular era. I'm a fan of Chicago, but only the early stuff, or only the 80s. Whatever. Not there's not one album that you can put your finger on and say, this is where it changed. Chicago III is the last of the purely experimental, avate garde, socially conscious stuff. By chicago 16, they have embraced the Hard to Say I'm Sorry era. But when? A lot of the bbig hits at the 7-s progress is more and more easy going - Just You N Me, No Tell Lover, If You leave Me became their first #1. Etc. And early on you have the fun, fast, bopping, socially conscious stuff like Dialogue, or the fun stuff like Make me Smile and Beginnings (my favorite song by them btw).

But I still like this era a lot.


Anyways, the band had to replace one of their major initial members in the late 70s when their lead guitarist, leader singer, and songwriter Terry Kath accidentally killed himself with a loaded gun.

Now they could. They are Chicago. It's a band of (at the time) 8 people, and two horns, one wind, two guitar, two percussion, and one keyboards. You have many songwriters, and three major leads - Cetera, Lamm, and Kath. And Lamm is clearly the major musical influence of the group as well as the keyboardist.

So they bring in Donnie Dacus as thus young, charismatic guy, but that experiment doesn;t work out shortly. They let him go. Then drummer Danny Seraphine starts working with producer David Foster for an album by Bill Champlain. And he thinks Bill could be their guy. They bring him in, and they love each other. (And Bill was a good choice, no question - experienced, veteran, good musician, songwriter, singer, etc).

Bill is the first major new member to replace another. Then Peter Cetera leaves for a solo career after Chicago 17 and the You're the Inspiration album. He that takes off with two #1 hits on his first post-Chicago album. And they replace him with a guy Champlain knows - Jason Scheff, the son of the famous basist for Elvis for a lot of his albums and can do the various roles Cetera did for them. And Scheff will be a good choice too. Very good musician. And Chicago 18 even sees Scheff with a hit that he sings.

And then Chicago decides they need a new lead guitarist. They bring in...Dawayne Bailey, a former lead for Bob Seger and other groups. He's younger, very talented, and feels a little out of place. Chicago 19 is made, and it has major hits, and they lead with the guitar as expected by Bailey. Look Away is the biggest hit of 1989 from this album. After, Danny Serpahine, a founding member of teh group is let go, and session drummer Tris Imboden is brought in to replace him. (Tris is just alright. He's fine, but he's not a creative force on the group)


And then the 1990s hit.

Chicago, continuing their role of trying to churn out hits, is making a (poor) Chicago 21. It's weak' It's biggest hit is Chasin' the Wind, sung by Chaplain, and penned by no less a wuss-but-hit-maker-machine than Diane Warren. (afterall she wrote Look Away for them too). And that was a major bomb for the band and the label.

Warner Brothers had signed Chicago away from Colombia, and Chicago 16 - 21 had all been from Warner Brothers. They had the same management, the same people who had pushed to sign them in the first place and more. And they had one more album on their deal, and they still trusted and believed in Chicago for that last album. So Chicago set out to do something very different, as a genre shift back to their roots, and created an album that would be one of the classic, mythical albums of all time. And that album, I want to discuss in my next post.


In the meantime, Chicago - what are your thoughts? Sellouts? Hit Makers? Market savvy? Good horn group but not great later? Only good in the Kath era?

[thesloppy]

I probably wouldn't go so far as to say they were "only good in the Kath era", but I personally prefer that period. I loved Kath's tone, and Danny Seraphine is a bad ass. Coincidentally, I found this show on youtube a couple months ago and have watched it a half-dozen times recently:



My favorite Chicago fact: Their first album was a double record. So was their second. And their third. The fourth was a live box set. That takes some balls.

[Abe Sargent]

Yeah it does. They cared more about music back then, they were just churning it out.


Thanks for sharing btw, I'm watchign it right now

[JAG]

Also strongly prefer the Kath era. For a while they were my favorite band and I listened to the heck out of Group Portrait in college (4 album collection of pre-1982? or so stuff). First time I heard South California Purples was on a live album from 1970 and it was awesome (also loved that version of I'm a Man).

[Abe Sargent]

I have the Group Portrait collection too, and then slowly rounded out my collection of the albums included that I didn;t already have like VI or VII. They did a powerful; variant of Im a Man too, yup!

[Abe Sargent]

Let's let's delve into the history, and the details, of this album. It;s one of the iconic "missing albums" of popular music.

So Chicago set out to write a new album. They felt released from the constraints of the previous albums due to the failure of that formula on Chicago 21.



In fact, their producer reframed them. Don't write hits. Just write about what you love, and what's on your mind. That's it. Mayne you'll write a hit, and maybe you won't, but the song will be worth it.

So they were freed from stuff.

The founders of the band still with them (Lamm, and then the horns and winds - Pankow, Parazaider, and Loughnane) were the major voices of pushing for keeping things churning, and now that they formula had unfolded poorly, many of the newer members felt comfortable contributing.



This led to the creation of the first, socially conscious, jazz inspired album the band had made in a long time. The Stone of Sisyphus. The title track was written by Dawayne Bailey, his first for the group, and another, Get on This was added. Jason Scheff penned a song about watching his father on TV growing up performing next to Elvis, and how his father was Bigger than Elvis to him, and his father will even play bass on the song for them. The ballads are a bit less formulaic - like Plaid. But the best song, in my opinion, for what it means to me as a fan of the band, is All the Years, penned by Lamm himself, about how the band has wasted all these years having done nothing. He ties the song musically to the song Someday, August 29, 1968, a song that commemorates their generation's fights, struggles, and were attacked back, culminated in the 1968 Democratic National Convention riots in Chicago. The song from their first album was one of many socially conscious ones, so what happened? It's sort of a nostalgic look back at one's life and saying, "What happened? Where did I go off the tracks?"

It's a punch in the gut.


The album was initially embraced warmly by Warner Brothers. They had seen how much the band has faltered by keeping to the Warner Brothers play. They knew they needed to change. They had a loyalty and fidelity to Chicago too. And they felt that the album had some potential hits, including Bigger than Elvis and Stone.

So they agreed to make it. They moved it to A&R, began marketing, created an album cover and more. Stone of Sisyphus was going to get released. And then everyone would see what there was to see.


A few months later, Warner Brothers experienced a major shift in management. Older managers who had a lot of experience were let go, and the new management was doing a basic cost/benefit analysis of the album. The alum was too risky. It wasn't formulaic enough. After the failure of Chicago 21, Chicago was deemed past it's sell-by date

Normally in the industry, there would be a standard of renegotiation, cutting some songs and asking for others, remixing it, rerecording and so forth. None of that happened. The album was rejected, even though it has been accepted, and Chicago was let go from their contract.



And Chicago was basically ended as a band.

It created a huge rift in the band, and some players felt on the outside looking in, like Bailey. Bailey wasn;t a major contributor in his other projects, and it took founder Loughnaine to get his songs out there this time and sell them to the others. But two of his songs where there. He was a big contributor This album was more Scheff/Champlain.Baieys than it was Lamm's and


After this, Chicago would do basically three more albums. They'd do a mid-90s take on classic Big Band hits like Night and Day. They'd do a mid 2000s album on their own label they created so they could put all of their music from multiple companies on one release. Chicago XXX is not that good, don't really need to worry about it. And then they did an album in 2014 called Now which is a little different. It's more politically motivated, more jazz-ish in many good ways, and it's not a bad buy


But Stone of Sisyphus. What if?



What if Stone had been the major genre shift back to the basic concept of the band? What if Chicago had fully embraced these new members, and gave them total creative control to continue to write good, compelling, and very Chicago-y music?

So in 2008, on their own label, Chicago released Stone. Now they made some changes. They pulled Get on This for no ever officially released reason (I think it was because there was bad blood between them and Bailey post-split up). They added some demos and such to it as well. So the album is a little different. But it is a very different album



Now there are some misses. I would never subject you to Sleeping In the Middle of the Bed where the old white guys on this jazz group try to...gasp....rap. Although I'm glad they tried to do something different, even if it failed. Better to try and fail then to have never have tried.

But man, this is a good album even with that. They really pushed themselves.



What if?

[Abe Sargent]

Anyways, I thought we could post and share videos, concerts, songs we loved that never really got the right press, songs from Stone or other later albums that people might not know, and so forth.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

South California Purples

Ooh, nice.


Chicago is a band whose catalog I should dig into, but for whatever reason don't. I LOVE horns, so you'd think that would be a no-brainer. But...I never really do.

I mean, this is one of my top 10-20 songs already.

Chicago Feelin' Stronger Everyday - YouTube

That energy...

(and those horns!)

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Ooh, nice.


Chicago is a band whose catalog I should dig into, but for whatever reason don't. I LOVE horns, so you'd think that would be a no-brainer. But...I never really do.

I mean, this is one of my top 10-20 songs already.

Chicago Feelin' Stronger Everyday - YouTube

That energy...

(and those horns!)

I love it yup. I know that track is singled out for Seraphine's drumwrok as truly awesome. But my favorite part is Lamm's just tearing up the piano in the end.

[Suicane75]

Call me a heretic, but I love their 80's stuff. Of course being a child of that era gives me an excuse. I will still hum Along Comes A Woman when I'm feeling particularly randy. I love their older hits too, don't get me wrong, but I've never delved into their catalog per se.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

Call me a heretic, but I love their 80's stuff. Of course being a child of that era gives me an excuse. I will still hum Along Comes A Woman when I'm feeling particularly randy. I love their older hits too, don't get me wrong, but I've never delved into their catalog per se.

You certainly don't have to apologize for that! You are fine. Chicago defined one of the major genres of popular music for a decade in the 80s.

Have you listened much to some of Chicago's older love songs? Like Colour my World?

And frankly, I think Bigger than Elvis, off Stone of Sisyphus, mentioned earlier, might be something you'd really dig, especially after realizing that it's about the lead singer and songwriters dad who played for Elvis's band on stage


Here, if you don't mind, allow me:



Here's Colour My World from 1972, arguably their first, major slow hit. And with a flute solo you have you love. It's simple, and elegant, and it's not even in the normal verse/chorus format.




And then here's Bigger than Elvis, from the long lost, but then found again SOS:




Supposedly, when recording this song, they invited Jason Scheff's father to come and play the tracks without telling him the title of the song, and then tricked Jason into missing that session, and presented it to them as a gift from the band. I honestly think it';s the "hit" on the album that would have been the typical ballad esque win. Anyways, enjoy.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Ooh, nice.


Chicago is a band whose catalog I should dig into, but for whatever reason don't. I LOVE horns, so you'd think that would be a no-brainer. But...I never really do.

I mean, this is one of my top 10-20 songs already.

Chicago Feelin' Stronger Everyday - YouTube

That energy...

(and those horns!)

So I'm interested in hearing what songs from Chicago you've heard but don;t like that much. Because if you're willing, I'd be happy to share a couple of horn friendly jazz tracks that would make you explode, if that's your thing. But I kind of want to get a feel for what you've heard and don't like already, you know?

[thesloppy]

This is another favorite clip. Everbody gets a piece, but Kath is casually going nuclear for the whole 6 minutes.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

So I'm interested in hearing what songs from Chicago you've heard but don;t like that much. Because if you're willing, I'd be happy to share a couple of horn friendly jazz tracks that would make you explode, if that's your thing. But I kind of want to get a feel for what you've heard and don't like already, you know?

Honestly it's just a case of not really having heard that much besides what gets played on the radio. The standards - Saturday in the Park, 25 or 6 to 4, etc. I've thought about listening to more, but never have sought it out (and YouTube hasn't served any out, not in what is a heavy soul/motown mix). I'd probably dig more of their earlier stuff.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

This is another favorite clip. Everbody gets a piece, but Kath is casually going nuclear for the whole 6 minutes.

He's definitely a man


Chicago does have a lot of solid guitar centric stuff too. One of the lesser appreciated ones is this Kath/Cetera number from Chicago VIII. It wasn't hit or a single, but blast me if it isn;t every bit as iconic as a 25 or 6 to 4 to me:






Edit - And man, I love Lamm here too just rocking that keyboard like a mother. I even like Cetera's vocals, and that's not something you'll often hear me say.


I think Terry Kath is crimillay underappreciate for his gutar at times. There's a reporter that claimed when he interviewed Jimi Hendrix and asked if anyone was better than him, he told them that Kath was. Walt Parazadar, the woodwin guy for the band, tells the stry that Hendrix personally complimented Kath at a show they did in 68/

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Honestly it's just a case of not really having heard that much besides what gets played on the radio. The standards - Saturday in the Park, 25 or 6 to 4, etc. I've thought about listening to more, but never have sought it out (and YouTube hasn't served any out, not in what is a heavy soul/motown mix). I'd probably dig more of their earlier stuff.

Thanks, that helps!

I'm going outside of the box on this one. I thing you might like the horn-centric stuff of some early stuff, yup, totally. Now when you mentioned that leading horns was your thing, the first song that popped into my head in Beginnings, which is a hit single from their first alum, that does get some airplay, has downright epic horns at the bridges, and ends with drummer Saraphine hitting the drums for like a two minutes solo of ungodliness.

Now if you've heard the major songs, and they've not sold you, then that includes Beginnings so I'm skipping it. I'm going to the jazzier stuff on the 2nd album., not singles, not hits, just good, horn-centric stuff I think shows off some different stuff from the group. In fact, I'm not sure many Chicago fans would have these on their top ten lists, but they are demonstrative of the era in a way that 25 or 6 to 4 isn't;


The first song is a quick two and half minutes Wake up Sunshine, a song that I love from a lot of angles. It's just total jazz fusion fun times. It;s a slower paced, fun, simple little fusion song.



Then I was trying to figure out if I wanted to do the first, second, or third song from the album for you to hit up and see if it's your thing. I'm doing Movin; On, the first song from the album, cause I think it's teh best horn piece of the lot. It's not even my top five from the album (although, to be fair, it is a double album with an epic amount of songs). But I think if you don;t see the horn after this freak of a song, then I don't know what;s happening...




Let me know if that's more your taste. Or I can try again.

And if you haven;t heard Beginnings, then oh my god. Here it is in its epic glory and majesty. The song is great, and starting around 4:13 you are going to experience what I can only classify as a horn orgasm. My favorite horn bridge, middle, center section of any song ever, period, game over. (And then you get Seraphine owning a cowbell. One of the few songs where it already has enough cowbell!)

[thesloppy]

Yeah, I agree about Kath being underrated. His reputation seems to live in that space where he seems to be known and appreciated by other guitarists/musicians, but he's pretty much invisible to the casual listener and/or music fan. I had no idea who he was, until bothering to pay attention for a second, and thinking "that dude's kinda good", just a couple years ago.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

Yeah, I agree about Kath being underrated. His reputation seems to live in that space where he seems to be known and appreciated by other guitarists/musicians, but he's pretty much invisible to the casual listener and/or music fan. I had no idea who he was, until bothering to pay attention for a second, and thinking "that dude's kinda good", just a couple years ago.

Yeah I hear ya. At least he's now in in the R&R HOF with the other founding Chicago members. I'm trying to think of the definitive Kath piece. Liberation maybe? It's like a 14 minute instrumental piece off their first album, but holy crap does Kath just murder it. Welcome to the shred Olympics.

If someone wants to try it out it's here:

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

I'm trying to think of the definitive Kath piece.

Always been partial to the first half of this song for Kath's guitar, especially about 3:30 to 4:40.

[Butter]

Saw them with Earth, Wind, and Fire last summer here in Cincinnati. 3 hours of horn-y goodness. They started with Beginnings with both groups on stage together, and that was a hell of a way to kickoff the show. They each played an hour, and then started and ended with a half hour together each.

My wife is a much bigger Chicago fan than I... she likes both the 70's and 80's era (probably more the 80's), but I can say they earned a fan that night in me.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by JAG

Always been partial to the first half of this song for Kath's guitar, especially about 3:30 to 4:40.

It's good too. And I think you can just play Free Form Guitar from that album too. CTA features Kath more than any other album. And that's probbaly why it was such an odd success.


So Chicago released CTA and it was a double album, with a lot of non-radio friendly pieces. Reviewers loved it, people who bought it loved it. It hit the Top 100 albums and held it. A single, Questions 67 and 68 was released, and only went to like 71 or something. That was the last single released from that album. People assessed and put Chicago in that category of great albums, not great hits.

And then Chicago II, another double hits. And there is this long suite of songs called Ballet for a Girl in Buchanan that blends into each other. One of the mini sings from that was cut out and released as a single called Make Me Smile, which surprisingly hits. And it hits hard - top 10 hit.

Then you have 25 or 6 to 4 and Colour My World hitting too. And people begin to take another look at CTA. And it begins to rise up the charts again. Then they release singles from it and both Does Anyone Really Know what Time it is ? and Beginnings hjit #7. Questions is released again and gets to 24. Their remake of Im a Man is a solid hit. They are in the unusual place of having both albums making top ten hit singles at the same time. Anyway, because of this, CTA sets a record for the most weeks in the Top 100 (which I think was broken by The Wall).

And I think part of the reason for that is because a lot of folks after hearing 25 or 6 to 4, a definitive rock single, were entranced, and then happy with what the heard from this Kath guy on CTA.



Oh, by the way, did you know that my former nick on here, and elsewhere, Anxiety, is from the song Anxiety's Moment, on the Ballet for a Girl in Bucahnan suite of songs? Yup! That suite is written about a girl from a small town in WV and also features a song called West Virginia Fantasies. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ballet...l_in_Buchannon

[Abe Sargent]

I thought it would be cool if I ranked my favorite of the hits of Chicago released in the 80 virtually all power ballads of some sort. 4 albums, and ton of hits. Take Chicago 19 with it's four top ten hits and a #1, or 17's 4 top 20. So lots of stuff.

For the record, I am only considering those songs that hit at least 40 - so stuff like What You're Missing at 81 or 25 or 6 to 4's 1986 version at 48 aren't considered.


Chicago 16 -

Hard to Say I;m Sorry
Love me Tomorrow

17 -

You're the Inspiration
Along Comes a Woman
Hard Habit to break
Stay teh Night

18 -

We can Last Forever
If She Would Have Been Faithful

19 -

Look Away
I Don't Want to Live Without Your Love
We Can Last Forever
You're Not Alone


Here they are, in order from my least favorite to most:

Stay the Night - Horrible. Chicago at it's lowest for me. The lyrics are downright sexual assault-esque, the concept is immature, even the video is ungood. It's all about asking a women, is a very unfortunate manner for sex. It's not even that good musically. It's an abomination that I can;t stand.


Love me Tomorrow - It's not that LMT is bad. It's just not very good. It's not very memorable. It's not great. It's not a song you remember. It just is. Meh. About teh best I can say is that it doesn;t suck.


Along Comes a Woman - Im sorry Suicane, but I find Along slightly better than LMT. And that;s not that much. Of the four hits from 17, Stay the Night is just yuck, and this is...okay. I usually just fast forward it, but not always.


Now the rest of the songs are good enough to actually really like and are harder to suss out.


You;re the Inspiration - Overplayed. I know it's the consensus enduring mega-hit from the era, more than stuff like H2SImS or Look Away, but man is it just overplayed. Sorry Chicago 17.


Will You Still Love Me? - And right behind that is this solid but ultimately not-good track. It's alright. It's better than the other stuff! But that's not a huge endorsement from me either. But don't worry, I;m about to switch gears in a major way, so get ready to hold onto your butts

We Can Last Forever - Solid. This is where the good begins for my taste. We can last forever! It takes a while to warm up, and then pop! Good stuff funnels. And Scheff is past the whole "trying to be Cetera" era of 18.



If She Would Have Been Faithful - And this entry ends 18s trip on this list. I really do like the concept of talking about how if the woman you are with would have been faithful, then you would never have broken up, and subsequently found true love. I give that props. But Scheff's singing is in its new side, and it's really where I want it to be yet, more emulating Cetera than his own singing he develops into later. That keeps this down.

Hard to Say Im;s Sorry - And this does it for 16. Look, Hard is the first of this era, it's more innocent and interesting than a lot of songs that follow, but it's also less polished than the stuff that'll come later as well, so there's a little fun to it. I also like it a lot more than Chicago's 1976 #1 hit If You Leave Me Know.


And now it's time. Four songs that are great, that I'd put next to anything, and that I love. One song from Chicago 17 and THREE from 19, when they are firing on all cylinders.



You''re Not Alone - I adore You're Not Alone. A lot. I think Champlin is on vocals really nicely as well. It's good. Plus there are times, like right now as I'm typing this, that I will just sing the absolute crap out of this song. So I like it. It's the beginning of the top quality of the list to me.

Look Away - Love it. Think it's an awesome song. Love the concept, love the words, Chaplain is at his best. I know it's a Diane Warren ballad - don't care. It's good. Go away now. There have been times I have cried when listening to this song. So literally, Look Away

Hard Habit to Break - I think this is the true winner of the four Chicago 17 hits. I guess I thought you'd be here forever. Another illusion I chose to create. I honestly don't know how Cetera who wrote the song and lyrics for Stay the Night can write this too on the same album. Crazy.

Which leaves


I Don't Wanna Live without Your Love - My favorite of the power balled era of the 80s. Dawayne Bailey is owning this guitar on this track. It's downright epic in quality, musicianship, singing, and more. It's awesome.



So there are my choices.

Now there are a few songs from teh albums I want to highlight. Remember the Feeling from 17 si part of the core Cetera power balled era, he sings and writes it, but it's better than most. I'd put it in my top stuff from the time.

I also want to give props to the second single off Chicago 21, another power ballad from the album that flopped. Explain it to my Heart. It's just as good as the other top stuff, although i think Chasin the Wind is the lower section of this stuff. You Come to My Senses from 21 is also another strong song in this genre.

Also honorable mention to Hearts in Trouble off the Days fo Thunder soundtrack.


So if you like this era, what are your rankings?


EDIT - More on Scheff:


I didn't want to post-bogard too much more:

Peter Cetera left after 17 for a solo career. He offered the ban d split deal like Collins has with Genesis, but the band didn;t want to do that. Cetera had just penned, and lead sung the four Top 20 hits from Chicago 17, written and sung the #1 hit off 16, had gone solo, and just had two more #1 hits with Glory of Love and Next Time I Fall. From 1985-1986 popular music is the Era of Cetera off those efforts. So Scheff had huge shoes to fill.

so it seems like in 18 he's trying to evoke the Spirit of the Cetera or trying to ward off the inevitable hate that would grow out his replacement by a basic unknown.

Now here is Will You Still Love Me? Listen to how he sings. I don;t know if it;s conscious ir not, but he';'s trying to be Peter.




That's not really what he can do.

Here's, You Come to My Senses from Chciago 21, which is my second favorite balled on the Warner Brothers era after IDWLWYL. And you can hear Scheff just doing a fine job with the music. He's good to go. He's not doing a Cetera impersonation for Amateur Hour at the Apollo Night




It might be too smarmy for some folks in teh room, but I'm okay with that. It's good for me! Meanwhile, the point is to hear Scheff is his own element.

EDIT 2 - I do think it's interesting that the band needed two people to be brought in to replace Kath (Chaplain + Bailey) but just one for Cetera.

[Suicane75]

But it's so catchy!!

[RomaGoth]

Thanks for this thread. I often forget about Chicago (sorry!) but they really are a great band and have a great sound. I grew up with many of the titles you listed above.

My all time favorite is Look Away.

[Abe Sargent]

Sure thing!

According to Rolling Stone, Billboard, etc, these are the top five best selling bands of all time in the R&R era:

01. The Beatles
02. The Rolling Stones
03. The Beach Boys
04. Chicago
05. The Bee Gees


So we often forget #4, but we shouldn't, you know? Cause it's awesome!

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

But it's so catchy!!

I know it is. And that''s the awesome thing about Chicago. There's so many freankin' genres and experiments in here, and sometimes they just aren't that successful. And often they are. And then ou have songs that appeal to different folks. I love You Come tomy senses and Explain it to my Heart, but others may not. You like Along, but it's not my fav from the list.

Here let me give you two sample genres styles. One I think is a strong song, and the other...not to much.



Here's Chicago doing disco as the lead song of their Chicago 13 album. That was not a typo. And Street Player is arguably the most sampled song in Chicago's repertoire. Get ready.





And then from Chicago VI is What's This World Coming To? a funk song. And I think it's a good one. It just unleashes percussion everywhere.





Now it;s important to remember that Chicago had added Laudir de Oliverera to their lineup, a Brazilian percussionist from Rio de Janeiro who had moved to the US in 68. They felt that the deeper percussions and layered textures were something really special. So from VI through 14, they have Laudir performing with them too, and there's a clear impact and influence here.

Every. genre.


And if you liked that, maybe you want a live version?

[BillyNYC]

Near the start of my stint in Chicago (the city), used to stop by Demon Dogs a lot. Owned by the manager of Chicago (the band), it had lots of their memorabilia and gold records. The band's music was always playing as well.

Alas, the city shut it down to renovate the El stop above it.
CTA carryout order: Demon Dogs to go - tribunedigital-chicagotribune

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by BillyNYC

Near the start of my stint in Chicago (the city), used to stop by Demon Dogs a lot. Owned by the manager of Chicago (the band), it had lots of their memorabilia and gold records. The band's music was always playing as well.

Alas, the city shut it down to renovate the El stop above it.
CTA carryout order: Demon Dogs to go - tribunedigital-chicagotribune

That is so freaking cool!!!

Sad that it closed down though. Must have been fun to have gone to

[Abe Sargent]

Why not post a video a day of lesser known stuff that's, well, strong.

On Chicago VIII, often considered of the weakest albums by the original lineup, we have Terry Kath writing, signing, and playing the crap out of a Jimi Hendrix tribute. Kath and Hendrix were like music buddies. Each talked about their respect for the other, and Kath played on stage with Hendrix at a couple of his live shows. So Kath creates this paean for The Great Spirit in thanks. The song is Kath at his mid-70s form. Even Cetera's bass is good. Lamm's piano. Percussion pounding the crap out of stuff. It;s all there. But Kath? this is Terry Kath's piece from beginning to end.




Enjoy!

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

Sure thing!

According to Rolling Stone, Billboard, etc, these are the top five best selling bands of all time in the R&R era:

01. The Beatles
02. The Rolling Stones
03. The Beach Boys
04. Chicago
05. The Bee Gees


So we often forget #4, but we shouldn't, you know? Cause it's awesome!

They could have done better by being named "The" Chicago, maybe.

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by Alf

They could have done better by being named "The" Chicago, maybe.

Started out as The Big Thing. (Then came Chicago Transit Authority, then Chicago.)

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Alf

They could have done better by being named "The" Chicago, maybe.

I suppose?

[Abe Sargent]

So yesterday we talked about Terry Kath and his guitar inspired fun times. Even as late as Chicago VIII, this guy is making, and creating, and chruning out these great, guitar heavy pieces. Now, as Chicago moved through the 70s, we see a slow shift towards the easy listening side of life, with Cetera becoming more central to that role. Both Robert Lamm, keyboards and vocals, as well as Kath are fighting against this shift internally. Then after Chicago XI, Kath accidentally kills himself, and that's the end of a dynasty.

Many people honestly feel that Chicago died with Kath. Kath was experimental - he would learn different way to play teh guitar, he would use acoustic guitar on some pieces, he;d flip bass and lead with Cetera and such. That's all gone.

But, despite that, Chicago decided to have a call, auditioned some folks, and ultimately decided on Donnie Dacus. Donnie could sing and play guitar. He was a session musician, teen heart-throb of the early 70s after being in Hair, younger than the rest of the band, energetic, charismatic, and was teaching kids his own age how to pay guitar when he was like 10. He played on some big name artists and recordings. Like Stills.

Anyways, Dacus steps up to the plate. And the problem is that no one can replace a legend. That's just too hard. He'll get let go two albums later, and Chicago won't give any official reason until years and years later, when they'll say that he didn;t musically mesh with them, wasn;t on their level, etc .


But Dacus wasn;t nothing.

The album after Kath passed away was called Hot Streets, and got rid of the normal Chicago ___ trend. New producer. It also had a different cover style, led with a single called "Alive Again" that hits 11, and is an upbeat, almost club level of energy, in the late 70s.

So I want to introduce you to two Dacus tuns from the Hot Streets album. He is playing guitar, and signings. In both cases, he's singing is not bad, and his guitar is not bad. Anyways, one wanders what would have happened had Chicago trusted their gut, and just stayed with Dacus. Cause it's not like Chicago XIV was this amazing al;bum sans Dacus. In fact, it's their worst album of the Colombia years.


Anyways, the first song from Hot Streets is a song that's pretty heavy, has Cetera with a solid bass and backup vocals by him, with Dacus leading on vocals. Dacus has his own style of singing. It works. It's a little blues, a little rock, and a lot of energy.



Dacus is documented as wanting a more energetic push. And you can feel it here certainly. Although Cetera's signing almost becomes this odd parody of itself for the next few albums. You can hear that here. But you have seriously stuff here, no question.

And just to show what I mean with Dacus, here's a concert with Chicago and this song, led by good ol' Donnie that I just found in YouTube:




Watch Donnie do a solid job picking that 'tar.

Now let's look at the other Dacus song:





Dacus is channeling his best Billy Joel, the song is a little more laid back. But it's lighter in a very different way that the Cetera anthems of the day like Baby What a Big Surprise, No Tell Lover, and If You Leave me Know. And then the Dacus will arrive and start really pushing that guitar around especially at the 2:48 mark. It'll pick up pace slowly, and then whoa! That's not bad kid.

So what happened?

Well, a couple of things. Firstly, I think Chicago 13 left a sour taste in a lot of Chicago mouths, and Dacus probably had a greater impact on that album that this one. (Although Cetera sucks as a singer there. He might be at the height of his bass powers in the late 70s, but he is at the bottom of the mouth ones). Chicago pushed more of a club/disco concept on that album, but Cetera did a song with the Bee Gees on Hot Streets that's very club-esque as well. So you can;t blame that on Donnie.


I think the major issue here behind the scenes is that Donnie is pushing for Chicago to continue to beef up the speed. Embrace the faster side of music. Don't soft rock yourselves. Because aint it Time certainly isn;t soft rock. And even Take a Chance is different by far from the typical Chicago slower pieces that mark this era and will define the next. I don;t think that's what Donnie signed up for. He's do stuff later like be a session musician for John Lennon's Rock and Roll album or Badfinger. So he's okay. But i wonder if Chicago missed out. Maybe they couldn;t see past Kath.

When my father was the pastor for more than a decade at a church, and was the defining aspect of that church and community, after he left for another pastoral role away, the next pastor was always compared to him, and was there for a short period of time before they moved away from each other. The next one was there for a while. That's how it goes.

Anyways, check out the Dacus songs to sort of see where he was hitting.

[Abe Sargent]

Alright so let's have the talk about that album. It's hard to figure out what to do with Chicago III.


As was mentioned before, both CTA and Chicago II were surprise hits, and came late in the CTA run. No one expected that Chicago would have that many hits from their first two albums. Certainly they were not.

So after the hit-fest of the first two albums and a year of tourning to support them, Chicago sat diwn to pen Chicago III, another double album/


Now let's be honest here. What would you do if you are Chciago?

You just had the following hits - Questions 67 and 68, Colour My World, Beginnings, Make me Smile, 25 or 6 to 4, Does Anyone Really Know What Time it is, and a remake of Im a Man. That's 7 hits, 6 of which were top 40, and most of which were top 10 hits. Many of those hits are obvious jazz fusion like Make Me Smile or Does Anyone...? Only one is a ballad, and one a hard rock piece. The rest are all in that jazzy, normal style that hits.

So what do you do?

What do you feel?



Chicago does something very unexpected. They produce Chicago III. It's it a guitar-heavy album that features Kath like CTA, their first album was? With some jazzish things, some other stuff, and some experimental music?

Nope


Is it more like Chicago II? Chicago II is laden with typical songs in a typical verse-chorus format that are pretty good. Only the four song movement It Better End Soon and the Ballet for a Girl in Buchanan suite are different.

Or do you slide a little more towards the songs that hit, to produce more hits? Do you try to move into hit-territory?

So your options are - heavier, jazz, blues, rock from CTA, or more traditional, still experimental, jazz fusion stuff from Chicago II, or more traditional pop stuff. Which of the three would you choose?


And where does Chicago go?



None of them.



They decide to create their most experimental, their edgiest, and least hear-able album. It's not laden with pop- or AM- friendly music. It's not an albums that's in the ouevre of the first, sprinkled with potential hits hither and thither.

Nope.



They create a jazz fest that's just unbelievably risky, experimental, and hard to figure out sometimes. Why did Chicago basically say, you either like us, or you don't, and we don;t care?


i have no idea.


But this stuff? Wow is it a blues, jazz heavy litany of songs. Just two were uncovered that were minor hits - Free from the Travel Suite was a #20 hit, and Lowdown hits #36. Oh, and the album, on the strength of Chicago's reputation, still hits #2 on the charts.


Chicago III's statement is going to confuse me later on. But there are many instrumental pieces, three different suites of songs (An Hour in the Shower, Elegy, and Travel Suite).

I want to do a quick little tour of the non-hits from this album to show you how Chicago responded to becoming suddenly popular.


Here is a piece from the Elegy suite called Progress? Listen to it once, and you are going to get just how jazz and experimental this freakin' thing can be:





Wow. Angry dissonant horns, sliding into street noises, and ending in a toilet flush. That is a statement. That's clearly jazz. You can't argue with it. Not even jazz fusion. Not smooth. But there's definitely a statement here.


Here's one of the few non-experimental pieces we'll do next:

Loneliness is just a Word. Horns virtually the entire time as Kath sings. Quick little 2:40 minute song. But you get the idea.




Now one of my favorite tracks from the album is I Don't want Your Money. Very blues heavy, very forward driving fun.

Now, this song may strike some folks as...wrong. Because in it Cetera is not singing in his typical falsetto. He's still a tenor with an odd voice. But there you go. It's a pretty good song from where I'm sitting.






There are a handful of songs that are parts of movements that don;t feature all of the artists. Motorboat to Mars is a part of the Travel Suite and is a Danny Seraphine drum solo. Stuff like that.

Here's the lighter almost-country What Else Can I Say? With Cetera back to his falsetto, so you are good to go.




And let's not forget the spoken poem of When All the Laughter Dies in Sorrow:




It's a bizarre album.

[Pyser]

nothing to add, just saying i saw chicago last night at hollywood bowl with fireworks. 90 minutes of hits. what's not to like.

[Abe Sargent]

I'm glad you liked it! Sounds like a lot of fun!

[kcchief19]

Don't know how I missed this until tonight. I'm a huge Chicago fan too. I own pretty much every original album from 16 through 33 and a few smatterings of pre-16 albums.

I pretty much enjoy every incarnation of the band, as well as Peter Cetera's solo work. I'm a homer, but I never really felt like Chicago "sold out." I think they evolved as they got older, they changed with membership and they changed with the times. So did The Stones and Michael Jackson. The Beatles would have too, as is evidenced by Paul McCartney's solo work. They tried their hand at almost every genre at one time or another, albeit to varying degrees of success ("Hot Streets" was a disaster).

I came of age in the '80s, so those are the albums I gravitate towards. "Hard to Say I'm Sorry" as one of the first 45s I ever owned. I don't necessarily have a favorite era. Granted, I enjoy the deeper tracks of their '80s and '90s albums better than the deeper tracks of their '70s albums, but "25 or 6 to 4" is just as much among my faves as "Hard to Say I'm Sorry" or "Look Away."

Chicago 19 is probably my go to album. The pop hits are good, but all the tracks are solid. I don't feel like 16-18 were as deep as 19. I really 10, but I have to be in the right mood. 19 is a pretty much any mood album.