Any feedback on 2004 draft file?

[Vinatieri for Prez]

I am just about ready to download the 2004 draft file created by those on the board and import it into my game and was wondering if anybody has used it and noticed if the ratings were realistic, bugs, etc.?

[Northwood_DK]

Yabanci from eNFL have some interesting points.

Quote
I think these user created draft files are very dangerous and a bad idea. Typically the creater buys into all the pre-draft hype and creates a lot of overrated players, with a much higher talent level than a FOF2k4 produced draft file. So you end up with one draft class that is different than the rest and it ruins the whole career. I've seen this in games like OOTP, where the most respected roster creater made a draft file that looked and sounded like a good idea, but had all the errors mentioned above. I think as good as it sounds it would be a huge mistake to use this draft file. Quote

I hope this is not the case but is looking forward to some feedback aswell.

[Ben E Lou]

I can't imagine a user-created draft file that isn't either a big source of controversy, or has significantly too much talent.

[austinm56]

Well, first, FOF has the X-Factor option, so the file will very when starting a career, and also every import is not the same. Some times Eli Manning will be rated at an 85, other times he may only be a 55.

I have used this file myself, and trust me, it isnt that bad. Actually with the way i have set the rateings, fictional FOF generated player drafts tend to be even if not better then this file.

The only point to the file is to incorporate those college players into your FOF dynasty if you so choose to.

All i can suggest it save your game before importing the file, if you dont like it , then just reload your previous season.

[Northwood_DK]

I don’t think people criticize your work. They just want to know what they get when they use your file. I don’t have any knowledge on how to make draft files, so maybe this is a stupid question.
How this file was made. Is its a normal draft file where only the original names have been changed or was all the "new" players made from scratch.

[austinm56]

Well i myself dont mind alittle critizism, as long as no one says:

it would be a huge mistake to use this draft file

Especially if the person saying it hasent used the file.

I only ask that if someone cares to comment on what i have taken ALOT of time to make, PLEASE state wether or not they have used the file first, and what their dislikes about it were. PLEASE dont just assume that its a "Bad Idea".

[FargoFreez aka fof playa]

Originally posted by austinm56
Espically if the person saying hasent used the file.

Must have been a fucking elitist.

[austinm56]

Must have been a fucking elitist.

Hey thanks alot man, im sure theres a great reason to start cussing at me?

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Whoa, there! Since I started the thread, I will weigh in. My question by no means was meant to criticize or invite namecalling. First off, I am very grateful for all those who contribute with files, utilities, etc.. I was just curious how it ended up working. I think I will give it a try tomorrow and take your advice Austin, by loading and checking out the ratings, and then ditching it if I am not happy.

But if anybody has any other experiences, let me know.


P.S. Austin, you better not be some Big 10 freak and have John Navarre ends up being the top-rated QB.

[FargoFreez aka fof playa]

Originally posted by austinm56
Hey thanks alot man, im sure theres a great reason to start cussing at me?

Are you couriers? I guess I though it was pretty obvious that I was calling the person that didn't try your file an elitist.

[austinm56]

P.S. Austin, you better not be some Big 10 freak and have John Navarre ends up being the top-rated QB.

Remember, every import of a draft file is different, but the way i have distributed the rateings, he shouldnt be the top QB.

P.S. please lemme know what you think of the draft file.

[QuikSand]

A general question/comment about user-created draft files.

Do we (the user community) understand how the game generates and imbeds boom/bust information? I'm not talking about the X-factor which adds a bit more randomness, I'm talking about the imbedded tendency for a given player to vary dramatically from his initial projections.

I just onwder if this is being accurately represented in any user-creatded draft file, or if instead we have a draft that does not indlue such a feature. (I don't know te he answer to this - but if all this is knnown and understood, the discussion has completely missed me)

[Bee]

Originally posted by QuikSand
A general question/comment about user-created draft files.

Do we (the user community) understand how the game generates and imbeds boom/bust information? I'm not talking about the X-factor which adds a bit more randomness, I'm talking about the imbedded tendency for a given player to vary dramatically from his initial projections.

I just onwder if this is being accurately represented in any user-creatded draft file, or if instead we have a draft that does not indlue such a feature. (I don't know te he answer to this - but if all this is knnown and understood, the discussion has completely missed me)

My understanding has always been that the boom/bust factor is "injected" after the file is imported so there's no information concerning boom/bust in the file itself.

[austinm56]

Well that is controlled by the volitarity for each player. The volitarity will determine if there is to be a big or little change in the players abilities. For my specific draft file, the top 2 or 3 at each position have been set to a low volitarity, the rest have been set to 50.
At one point, i am bound to change this and give each player a different level, but for the moment this is where it stands.
As the college season ends, i will also add in the players 2003 stats, which can be seen in the left column of the players profile (before trainning camp)
I have done it this way so the players abilities will vary, since we still dont know yet who will be good or bad. Which should answer some questions about the integrity of this file.

[austinm56]

My understanding has always been that the boom/bust factor is "injected" after the file is imported so there's no information concerning boom/bust in the file itself

The volitarity (boom/bust) is a rating that i can adjust in the created file, just as easily as the players name. Of course the rateings themselves i cannot control. I can set Eli Manning to all 625's (highest rateing), but when imported, he could still end up the #5 QB. (even with a low volitarity rateing)

[QuikSand]

Originally posted by Bee
My understanding has always been that the boom/bust factor is "injected" after the file is imported so there's no information concerning boom/bust in the file itself.

I seem to recall (back in the old days of the "Petri Dish" experiment) some evidence that this wasn't the case. Back then, playing FOF 2001, some of us were using the same series iof TCY-generated draft files to run separate careers. As it turtned out (I seem to recall) certain players were "booms" in every career, and other players were "busts" in every career -- strongly suggesting that the boom/bust code was instilled in the creation of the draft file. (It is possible that my memory is failing me here)

It's possible that Jim has altered the way this works (perhaps by switching to the volatility rating) but it's also certainly possible that this remains hard-coded in the draft files themselves.


However, I (somehow) get the sense that this thread isn't exactly the place to be discussing this.

[Bee]

Originally posted by QuikSand
I seem to recall (back in the old days of the "Petri Dish" experiment) some evidence that this wasn't the case. Back then, playing FOF 2001, some of us were using the same series iof TCY-generated draft files to run separate careers. As it turtned out (I seem to recall) certain players were "booms" in every career, and other players were "busts" in every career -- strongly suggesting that the boom/bust code was instilled in the creation of the draft file. (It is possible that my memory is failing me here)

It's possible that Jim has altered the way this works (perhaps by switching to the volatility rating) but it's also certainly possible that this remains hard-coded in the draft files themselves.


However, I (somehow) get the sense that this thread isn't exactly the place to be discussing this.

I was thinking along the lines of FOF4 where we had all the user created historic draft files. While there were a couple numbers no one really understood (although later perhaps they figured them out?), the experience I had with them seemed to indicate that different players would boom/bust when replaying a career with the historic rosters.

The volatility rating is interesting because I haven't figured out yet whether it's a control for just the "chance" of change or if it also affects the "degree" of a change. With my limited experimenting with it, I tend to think it's only affecting the "chance" that you can expect the player's rating to change and not the degree that the player's ratings will change. But I haven't done enough investigation to say so with any real certainty, so I could definitely be wrong.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally posted by Bee
With my limited experimenting with it, I tend to think it's only affecting the "degree" that you can expect the player's rating to change and not the liklihood that the player's ratings will change.

I gotta disagree with that. It contradicts both what Jim said about it, and my experiences as well. For example, right now the 4th-best QB in my league is a former 5th-round draft choice with a volatility rating of only 32. His ratings obviously changed a LOT.

[Bee]

Originally posted by SkyDog
I gotta disagree with that. It contradicts both what Jim said about it, and my experiences as well. For example, right now the 4th-best QB in my league is a former 5th-round draft choice with a volatility rating of only 32. His ratings obviously changed a LOT.

Actually you're right, I had my wording backwards. I think it affects the chances that you have a change, but not necessarily how much it changes.

Edit: Although, I'm not positive...which is why I mentioned it in the first place.

[FloridaFringe]

Originally posted by FargoFreez aka fof playa
Are you couriers? I guess I though it was pretty obvious that I was calling the person that didn't try your file an elitist.

How does couriers have anything to do with this thread?

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Originally posted by austinm56
Remember, every import of a draft file is different, but the way i have distributed the rateings, he shouldnt be the top QB.

P.S. please lemme know what you think of the draft file.

Austin,

I imported your draft file. My current career has a low x-factor. When I looked in the pre-draft review, there was a pile of top notch picks (80/89s; 75/85s) with blue bars near the top on most categories. When I used the FOF generated file, the quality of the draft was considerably lower (with only a couple of players showing potential in the 70s).

This got me a little worried, so I decided to go with the FOF file instead. I didn't want to skew my career. Anybody have a similar experience with this or other created files?

I still appreciate the effort and if you can take down the ratings a bit, I might try it again in my next career.

I think I might use the names in your readme file to change the names of the FOF created draft though just to add some familiarity. Navarre will be the worst QB guaranteed.

By the way, Navarre turned out average in your draft.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Originally posted by QuikSand
A general question/comment about user-created draft files.

Do we (the user community) understand how the game generates and imbeds boom/bust information?
I just onwder if this is being accurately represented in any user-creatded draft file, or if instead we have a draft that does not indlue such a feature.

This is an excellent question I never thought of which is pretty critical. Some of you have good ideas, but I was wondering if Primelord has the answer? Jim, can you hear us?

[FargoFreez aka fof playa]

Originally posted by FloridaFringe
How does couriers have anything to do with this thread?

couriers was a wee bit oversensitive and had a knack for creating drama out of tiny pokes at humor.

[Daimyo]

I imagine volatility is the rating built into draft files for booms and busts. In the help file Jim states that generally players from traditionally good colleges will have lower volatility while players from traditionally poor colleges will have higher volatility so i guess it could be set by TCY. I believe he also mentioned that the most talented players would tend to have higher volatility than lessor talented players (which makes sense since you should probably have a lot more high round busts than low round breakouts).

[Ben E Lou]

Originally posted by Daimyo
In the help file Jim states that generally players from traditionally good colleges will have lower volatility while players from traditionally poor colleges will have higher volatility so i guess it could be set by TCY.

Huh??? Did he update the help file with one of the patches? I did a pretty thorough search, and volatility wasn't mentioned at a all in the release version. Going to check now...

[Ben E Lou]

OK...I'm still not seeing it..

[austinm56]

I imported your draft file. My current career has a low x-factor. When I looked in the pre-draft review, there was a pile of top notch picks (80/89s; 75/85s) with blue bars near the top on most categories. When I used the FOF generated file, the quality of the draft was considerably lower (with only a couple of players showing potential in the 70s).

Did you import just once, or try it multiple times? And what version of the file are you useing?

In the latest one i have adjusted the rateings, and i myself never get more than 5 players with a potential over 80. Of course every import is different. If you were to import 10 seperate times, you would get 10 different players at the top of the list.

[Axxon]

Originally posted by FargoFreez aka fof playa
couriers was a wee bit oversensitive and had a knack for creating drama out of tiny pokes at humor.

The REALLY cool thing is you just described couriers to couriers. I can't really recall being in the position of reading someone doing this to me.

Couriers you bastard!!!!!! Hope you enjoyed it.

[FloridaFringe]

It's just not the same unless it's coming from someone like you Axxon. This think that this guy has been so upset with something that I had said so many months ago that he just had to bring it up now. I must have really been pecking at his brain all this time. Congrats to me.

[FargoFreez aka fof playa]

Originally posted by FloridaFringe
It's just not the same unless it's coming from someone like you Axxon. This think that this guy has been so upset with something that I had said so many months ago that he just had to bring it up now. I must have really been pecking at his brain all this time. Congrats to me.

Yeah...Congrats on being a total tool. I remember your very first post was a fucking advertisement for one of the biggest sim busts ever. World Championship Boxing Manager. You were like "it's so great" and "you should really try it". And then I thought I made you cry.

[FloridaFringe]

Yet you are the one still holding the grudge after how many years now? If you re-read the posts back then you will see that I was in no way advertising for WCBM but instead simply expressing my opinions on the game. Just because you didn't agree with me doesn't make my opinions any less sincere then yours. Even others during that debate agreed with me and pretty much told you how much of an ass you were being. Sorta like right now.

[Steel City Spud Farmer]

I downloaded it, but haven't gotten through the draft or the next seaon yet. The only thing I saw off hand that i didn't like was the filler guys. Alot of useless players in there as far as 0 rankings and the such...but I'm still going to use it. Thanks for putting it out.

[Daimyo]

Column AY: Volatility Rating. From 0-100. This determines the likelihood that a player will suddenly get a lot better, or a lot worse. Players with a high volatility rating are much more likely to have sudden and drastic changes in ability.

Generally, players from small colleges and players with very high college ratings should have higher volatility ratings.

You didn't read *all* the help files I guess

[austinm56]

The only thing I saw off hand that i didn't like was the filler guys. Alot of useless players in there as far as 0 rankings and the such

I dont like it either, but to create a draft file, it must be AT LEAST 800 players, and without creating every college player, there must be fillers or fictional guys will beat out your named players.

[yabanci]

Originally posted by austinm56
Well i myself dont mind alittle critizism, as long as no one says:

Especially if the person saying it hasent used the file.

I only ask that if someone cares to comment on what i have taken ALOT of time to make, PLEASE state wether or not they have used the file first, and what their dislikes about it were. PLEASE dont just assume that its a "Bad Idea".

I am the fucking elitist who said that, but please understand the context. There was a discussion of whether we might use the file in a newly created multiplayer league, and it was my opinion that using a user created file that hasn't been around long enough to be thoroughly tested and reported on is a bad idea. This is a brand new game, brand new multiplayer engine, brand new online league, new draft file editor, changed draft engine, etc., so adding a user created file to the mix at this time IMO would be unwise.

But that's not to say I don't appreciate the work you must have put in to this, and I wasn't criticizing the quality of the file since I haven't used it and can have no opinion on it. I'm sure a lot of people will use and like the file, and we all thank you for that.

[FargoFreez aka fof playa]

Did you just edit your post to throw in "fucking elitist"?