Front Office Football Central  

Go Back   Front Office Football Central > Main Forums > Off Topic
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read Statistics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-29-2020, 10:23 AM   #51
larrymcg421
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Georgia
Quote:
Originally Posted by PilotMan View Post
So, just curious, addressing the elephant in the room, is this like Jackson, where after death, the allegations and details of transgressions go away? Or is it where the measure of the person's accomplishments and the good that they put into the world are able to overcome it?

Well, the discussion of Jackson's allegations had died down quite a bit up to his death. However, they recently resurfaced in the HBO doc and he is now more controversial than ever.
__________________
Top 10 Songs of the Year 1955-Present (1976 Added)

Franchise Portfolio Draft Winner
Fictional Character Draft Winner
Television Family Draft Winner
Build Your Own Hollywood Studio Draft Winner

larrymcg421 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 11:06 AM   #52
spleen1015
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
There is no comparison in my mind. I feel like Jackson did what is alleged because there's a lot of smoke.

With Kobe, nothing was ever proven, the victim couldn't tell the same story twice.

The 2 situations are nothing alike other than they both died tragically.
__________________
Why choose failure when success is an option?
spleen1015 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 11:59 AM   #53
BYU 14
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: The scorched Desert
Quote:
Originally Posted by spleen1015 View Post
There is no comparison in my mind. I feel like Jackson did what is alleged because there's a lot of smoke.

With Kobe, nothing was ever proven, the victim couldn't tell the same story twice.

The 2 situations are nothing alike other than they both died tragically.

Agree and Kobe made himself a better man, husband and father coming out of that incident, and continued to strive for that as the years went on. The allegations themselves just didn't hold water in the case of Kobe as more came out. Not sure you can say that about Jackson.
BYU 14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 12:52 PM   #54
thesloppy
Pro Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: PDX
I was always hearing rumors that the dude constantly cheated on his wife (tho certainly not from any kind of remarkable source). Maybe that's just due to my bias.
__________________
Last edited by thesloppy : Today at 05:35 PM.

Last edited by thesloppy : 01-29-2020 at 12:54 PM.
thesloppy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 02:52 PM   #55
miami_fan
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Land O Lakes FL
Quote:
Originally Posted by PilotMan View Post
So, just curious, addressing the elephant in the room, is this like Jackson, where after death, the allegations and details of transgressions go away? Or is it where the measure of the person's accomplishments and the good that they put into the world are able to overcome it?

I really have no feelings either way. I was never a big Kobe fan, but I could certainly appreciate his accomplishments on the court and the skill that he possessed as a generational player.

I was not a big Kobe fan either. Magic will always be my favorite Laker ever but that is a byproduct of my age and when my love for basketball began. For me, his rape trial is not the elephant in the room. I think the story of his rape trial and the charges being dropped are what they are. It happened and the details are there for all to see. I believe he knew he did something wrong but I also accept that he was not convicted of the charge. Why? Read Kobe's apology. The emphasis is mine

Quote:
"First, I want to apologize directly to the young woman
involved in this incident. I want to apologize to her for my behavior that night and for the consequences she has suffered in the past year. Although this
year has been incredibly difficult for me personally, I can only
imagine the pain she has had to endure. I also want to apologize to
her parents and family members, and to my family and friends and
supporters, and to the citizens of Eagle, Colo.

"I also want to make it clear that I do not question the motives
of this young woman. No money has been paid to this woman. She has
agreed that this statement will not be used against me in the civil
case. Although I truly believe this encounter between us was
consensual, I recognize now that she did not and does not view this
incident the same way I did. After months of reviewing discovery,
listening to her attorney, and even her testimony in person, I now
understand how she feels that she did not consent to this
encounter.


"I issue this statement today fully aware that while one part of
this case ends today, another remains. I understand that the civil
case against me will go forward. That part of this case will be
decided by and between the parties directly involved in the
incident and will no longer be a financial or emotional drain on
the citizens of the state of Colorado."

It is not a perfect apology but it is enough for me to believe that he knew that he had done wrong. That being said, I am also not interested re-litigating the case every time his name is brought up either. If I believe someone is bringing up the case in an effort to re-litigate it, I would probably push back against it as well. I think there was some of that in the immediate aftermath of his death.

I do think he had done things to prove that he was a different person than he was in 2003. Is it enough for everyone else? I don't know but it is enough for me. Can a documentary come out next year that changes my opinion of him? Absolutely if the evidence is credible to me. But as of today, I think his work after his trial is the difference between how I feel about Kobe and Michael Jackson. Kobe has come closer to admitting his wrong and learning from it IMO. For me, when I think of Kobe Bryant, that case is not the first paragraph of his story if I am documenting it. For Michael Jackson, his allegations are.

P.S. I think I went back fifteen times to change wording from present tense to past tense. I guess it still has not sunk in yet.
__________________
"The blind soldier fought for me in this war. The least I can do now is fight for him. I have eyes. He hasn’t. I have a voice on the radio, he hasn’t. I was born a white man. And until a colored man is a full citizen, like me, I haven’t the leisure to enjoy the freedom that colored man risked his life to maintain for me. I don’t own what I have until he owns an equal share of it. Until somebody beats me and blinds me, I am in his debt."- Orson Welles August 11, 1946
miami_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 03:02 PM   #56
Chief Rum
Hall Of Famer
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Where Hip Hop lives
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lathum View Post
I don't really have an opinion on it, but I hate that people get all butthurt when it gets brought up. It is part of his story and shouldn't be brushed away just because he died a tragic death.

While I think it's stupid for people to get butt hurt on this, I differ from your opinion otherwise. For eternity, the rape allegations will always be there. They were in his life and they will soon be again as we get further from the suddenness of his death.

Fact is, millions are grieving his loss right now. They won't be so much in a few days, but right now they're feeling it. So is your urge to be 100% correct for the record on Kobe right now worth more than the pain you cause to these people by insisting on pointing out his flaws in this moment? That's pretty selfish and not empathetic.

Kobe's rape allegations will be under his name for all time. They aren't going anywhere. There's simply no reason to bring it up now except to cause pain to others when they're feeling their lowest.
__________________
.
.

I would rather be wrong...Than live in the shadows of your song...My mind is open wide...And now I'm ready to start...You're not sure...You open the door...And step out into the dark...Now I'm ready.

Last edited by Chief Rum : 01-29-2020 at 03:04 PM.
Chief Rum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 03:18 PM   #57
Kodos
Resident Alien
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
I don't think it was said in an effort to cause pain to people who are feeling his loss. I think it is just acknowledging that there was at least one thing in his past that was not ideal and that shouldn't be whitewashed now just because he is dead. From what I've read, it seems like Kobe did try to make amends more than most celebrities in similar situations, and that is to his credit.
__________________
Author of The Bill Gates Challenge, as well as other groundbreaking dynasties.
Kodos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 03:20 PM   #58
spleen1015
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
It's just the way people are. Some don't care that he died but they care that he allegedly raped someone. So they are going to grind their axe when they can.

Everyone has a right to feel however they feel just like we can feel they're jackasses for bringing it up at a time like this.
__________________
Why choose failure when success is an option?

Last edited by spleen1015 : 01-29-2020 at 03:21 PM.
spleen1015 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 07:58 PM   #59
Carman Bulldog
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Canada
Quote:
Originally Posted by BYU 14 View Post
Agree and Kobe made himself a better man, husband and father coming out of that incident, and continued to strive for that as the years went on. The allegations themselves just didn't hold water in the case of Kobe as more came out. Not sure you can say that about Jackson.

From everything I've read, I've actually formed the opposite opinion's. I'm not convinced on Michael Jackson but I'm fairly sure that Kobe was guilty. For what it's worth, I also think Mike Tyson was wrongly convicted for his rape charge from 1992 (that's not to say that he didn't get away with some other offences such as multiple counts of domestic violence).

And I don't think the fact that a true verdict was never reached should be the determinant factor. I mean, by that logic, does that mean OJ didn't kill his wife? He's another one that I think is guilty.
Carman Bulldog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2020, 11:25 PM   #60
CrimsonFox
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
the more i read the more heartbroken i become for all those poor broken families.

Mrs Kobe and a 17 yr old, 3 yr old and 7 month old surviving without Kobe and their 13 year old daughter

A husband and 3 children surviving without their wife

Another husband and 2 sons losing their wife and daughter

And finally the most heartbreaking...

A teenage girl surviving, losing both her parents and only sister. She's got no one now except a 29 year old half brother that lives way far away from her.


Last edited by CrimsonFox : 01-29-2020 at 11:25 PM.
CrimsonFox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2020, 07:04 AM   #61
Butter
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Dayton, OH
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carman Bulldog View Post
From everything I've read, I've actually formed the opposite opinion's. I'm not convinced on Michael Jackson but I'm fairly sure that Kobe was guilty.

Someone hasn't watched FINDING NEVERLAND.
__________________
My listening habits
Butter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-2022, 08:16 PM   #62
RainMaker
Hall Of Famer
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Chicago, IL
Glad these were never made public.

Access Denied

Last edited by RainMaker : 08-24-2022 at 08:17 PM.
RainMaker is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:38 PM.



Powered by vBulletin Version 3.6.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.