Official 2023 College Football Thread

[Lathum]

How miserable a fan base do you have to be to lose the best coach of the modern era, maybe ever, replace him with a guy who took over a 4-8 team, went 24-2 including a 20 game win streak, is 104-12 in his career, and just played for the national title, and complain about it.

Who did they think they were gonna get?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Lathum

How miserable a fan base do you have to be to lose the best coach of the modern era, maybe ever, replace him with a guy who took over a 4-8 team, went 24-2 including a 20 game win streak, is 104-12 in his career, and just played for the national title, and complain about it.

Who did they think they were gonna get?

I don't get much sense, yet, that the primary fan base is overly perturbed. They're understandably more in a state of shock & loss right now I think.

The older ones, those who remember the years in the wilderness after Bear, I feel like some of them might almost be internally resigned to the inevitable decline.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Lathum

How miserable a fan base do you have to be to lose the best coach of the modern era, maybe ever, replace him with a guy who took over a 4-8 team, went 24-2 including a 20 game win streak, is 104-12 in his career, and just played for the national title, and complain about it.

Who did they think they were gonna get?

Because many of them remember hiring guys with the same kind of resume who failed. The unknown is always scary, and they are still mourning the loss of the greatest coach they are likely ever to have. Honestly, do you think Deboer is a better coach than Saban?

[HerRealName]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Because many of them remember hiring guys with the same kind of resume who failed. The unknown is always scary, and they are still mourning the loss of the greatest coach they are likely ever to have. Honestly, do you think Deboer is a better coach than Saban?

If that's the standard they're going to have to hire Belichick. No one else is in the same area code.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by HerRealName

If that's the standard they're going to have to hire Belichick. No one else is in the same area code.

See, that's the thing. No one was really going to make them happy, short of maybe Kirby.

[GrantDawg]

This seems to be the chief thing I am seeing as criticism for Deboer. First, he doesn't like recruiting. That is a handicap in the SEC, but I'm sure he will hire some recruiters that know the ropes and get him players. The bigger thing is he might have NFL ambitions. He could make a quick splash with players he has now and be leaving for the NFL in a couple of years.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by HerRealName

If that's the standard they're going to have to hire Belichick. No one else is in the same area code.

If that is not the standard, then they are no longer Alabama football. That is not to say that Deboer has to walk in the door and become Nick Saban instantly. This is to say that the standard is any similarities to the Alabama coaching stints of Ray Perkins, Mike Dubose, Dennis Franchone, Mike Price or Mike Shula will not be tolerated.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

If that is not the standard, then they are no longer Alabama football. That is not to say that Deboer has to walk in the door and become Nick Saban instantly. This is to say that the standard is any similarities to the Alabama coaching stints of Ray Perkins, Mike Dubose, Dennis Franchone, Mike Price or Mike Shula will not be tolerated.

Interesting that you included Perkins on the list. Not saying that you're wrong but I actually gave both Perkins & Curry an overall pass from being included in the serious disastrous decline.

In 4 seasons, Perkins went 3-0 in bowl games and won 8 or more games in 3/4 seasons. Granted, a 5-6 1984 was their first losing season since the 1950s but overall he had a .600+ winning percentage in the conference and a .667 win percentage overall. That's basically 8-4 ... which definitely feels like a possibility under Deboer unless he's a more effective recruiter than I anticipate.

[HerRealName]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

If that is not the standard, then they are no longer Alabama football. That is not to say that Deboer has to walk in the door and become Nick Saban instantly. This is to say that the standard is any similarities to the Alabama coaching stints of Ray Perkins, Mike Dubose, Dennis Franchone, Mike Price or Mike Shula will not be tolerated.

Saban is the best coach in the history of the sport. That's the only point I was making. Smart is probably the only coach that could prevent a dropoff. The dropoff is unavoidable though, no one is matching what Saban accomplished.

[Swaggs]

Still seems like the stage is somewhat set for Dabo to eventually get there. It’ll be worlds easier to replace this guy than Saban. There is no way to meet expectations at this time.

[sovereignstar v2]

Deboer obviously afraid of the B1G

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Interesting that you included Perkins on the list. Not saying that you're wrong but I actually gave both Perkins & Curry an overall pass from being included in the serious disastrous decline.

In 4 seasons, Perkins went 3-0 in bowl games and won 8 or more games in 3/4 seasons. Granted, a 5-6 1984 was their first losing season since the 1950s but overall he had a .600+ winning percentage in the conference and a .667 win percentage overall. That's basically 8-4 ... which definitely feels like a possibility under Deboer unless he's a more effective recruiter than I anticipate.

I have more sympathy for Curry myself though going o-3 against Auburn was never going to be tolerated. The funny part is when Perkins and Curry got three and four seasons respectively after Bryant left after a 9-2-1 season. They went a combined 58-25-1(.690) overall. Both had a 10 win final season. Both were told it would be in their best interests to find employment elsewhere. Right or wrong, the standard is at a Bear Bryant/Nick Saban level.

Originally Posted by HerRealName

Saban is the best coach in the history of the sport. That's the only point I was making. Smart is probably the only coach that could prevent a dropoff. The dropoff is unavoidable though, no one is matching what Saban accomplished.

Listen, my sister in law's husband's family are all rabid Tide fans so I have interacted with that fan base well over 25 years. If you ask that fan base, Nick Saban was a good coach when he came to Tuscaloosa. He only became the greatest coach in the history of the sport because he was coaching at Alabama. For Tide fans, the last three years are the dropoff. Is that a ridiculous standard? Absolutely. That does not stop that from being the standard though.

[GrantDawg]

All this makes me wonder, does Michigan have a replacement plan for Harbaugh?

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[Atocep]

In the game of what if's it would be interesting to be in the timeline where Rich Rodriguez sticks to his agreement with 'Bama instead of falling back to Saban.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Because many of them remember hiring guys with the same kind of resume who failed. The unknown is always scary, and they are still mourning the loss of the greatest coach they are likely ever to have. Honestly, do you think Deboer is a better coach than Saban?

Of course not, hence my last question. Other than Kirby, and maybe Harbaugh, who were they getting with a better resume?

[Brian Swartz]

Originally Posted by Grant Dawg

All this makes me wonder, does Michigan have a replacement plan for Harbaugh?

Yep. Sherrone Moore. I'd be quite surprised if it wasn't him when Harbaugh leaves.

[GrantDawg]

I thought I'd saw a name I just couldn't remember who.

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[GrantDawg]

Will Rogers unpacked his bag in Washington, turn on the news to see his coach just left for Alabama, and then repacked his bag.

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[bronconick]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

Yep. Sherrone Moore. I'd be quite surprised if it wasn't him when Harbaugh leaves.

Heck, he's already 6-0.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I don't get much sense, yet, that the primary fan base is overly perturbed. They're understandably more in a state of shock & loss right now I think.

The older ones, those who remember the years in the wilderness after Bear, I feel like some of them might almost be internally resigned to the inevitable decline.

I think this is a good summary. There are just some people in sports that you can't replace. It's Tom Brady or Michael Jordan retiring.

A decline is inevitable because guys like Saban come around once in a generation. So you have people who are sad and frustrated with no one they can logically blame. Sometimes good things just come to an end.

[GrantDawg]

The Husky fans are getting ugly on Reddit now that the shock is wearing off. From the "he is a bad recruiter" arguments:
"For anyone wondering:

2018: Tuli (DT1), ZTF(DE2), Culp(TE2), Hampton(SS1), Ale(NT1), Mele (OC1)

2019: Bandes(NT2), Tuitele(DT2), Asa Turner(FS1), Fautanu (LT1), Fabriculan (SS2), Buelow(RG2), Kalepo(LG1), Trice (DE1), Tuputala (MLB2)

2020: Odunze (WR1), McMillan (WR2), Rosengarten (RT1), Bruener (MLB3)

2020 was Peterson’s class that lake kept together.

So basically the entirety of both lines, the WR, the LBs and half the secondary were all Petersen recruits.

Now we’ve had 4 mediocre to bad classes for whoever takes over."

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[RainMaker]

Wasn't Washington crushing it in the transfer portal? Not to say recruiting isn't important, but it feels like big schools are much better off working the portal where there are known commodities.

[GrantDawg]

Those were the starters, so I guess the backups were transfer portal guys. If getting backups is "crushing it" then I guess.

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[GrantDawg]

This is interesting. Jedd Fisch is a top candidate for the Washington job, but also for the Tennessee Titans job.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Those were the starters, so I guess the backups were transfer portal guys. If getting backups is "crushing it" then I guess.

Dillon Johnson and Muhammad were two very important players on their team that came through the portal. Both will be in the NFL. And Penix was one of the best players in the country.

Maybe that's the norm but it seems like some vital players came through the portal. They were also ranked #4 in portal rankings for 2024, although I'm guessing that changes with the coaching change.


Which brings up a question. Can you withdraw your transfer if the coach leaves?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Which brings up a question. Can you withdraw your transfer if the coach leaves?

yes.

Will Rogers already has.

FML

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

This is interesting. Jedd Fisch is a top candidate for the Washington job, but also for the Tennessee Titans job.

Looks like he has gotten the Husky's offer.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Dillon Johnson and Muhammad were two very important players on their team that came through the portal. Both will be in the NFL. And Penix was one of the best players in the country.

Maybe that's the norm but it seems like some vital players came through the portal. They were also ranked #4 in portal rankings for 2024, although I'm guessing that changes with the coaching change.


Which brings up a question. Can you withdraw your transfer if the coach leaves?

That's 3 out of 22. They were good pick ups, but it doesn't take away that team mostly depended on players recruited by the other coach.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Interesting note on Twitter I saw pointing out that inbound Univ of Washington head coach Jedd Fisch is about to start the 17th job of his career (18 if you count interim) with an average tenure of less than two years.

For some perspective, the well-traveled Brian Van Gorder who became a bit of a punchline for his instability has held 22 jobs in 41 seasons, with roughly the same average tenure.

[Vegas Vic]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Honestly, do you think Deboer is a better coach than Saban?

One thing to keep in mind. The vast majority of Saban's legacy and success came before college football instituted NIL and free agency. It's a new landscape, and the attributes that made a guy elite in the old days don't necessarily carry over now.

[GrantDawg]

Yeah, I mean Saban had fallen off a cliff since the NIL. They had only made the playoffs three of those four years and with one National Championship and two National Championship game appearances. Pretty mid.


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[GrantDawg]

That was a little flip, so I will add some depth to it. You are right that going forward coaches are going to have to be able to deal with the NIL and the portal. Good teams are going to have to work out a way to bring in elite high school talent and keep/develop that talent while also bringing in supplemental talent through the portal. Saban was already doing that. He recognized the new landscape and had been working it well. He said during his retirement interviews that the college landscape had changed over the last four years more than anytime in his coaching career. But he also said he had learned to deal with it and that it had nothing to do with his retirement.
The changes are only going to hurt the coaches that are unwilling to accept that they are the new normal. Guys like Dabo. But elite teams are going to have to excel at getting talent through both avenues, and I'm sure they will.

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[GrantDawg]

We will find out today if the Travaris Robinson, who just just poached from Alabama to be Georgia's Co-DC (Will Mustchamp is stepping away from on field coaching) is going to be poached back by Alabama. DeBoer, or really most likely Saban for DeBoer, is trying to get him to come back by making him the full DC there. My understanding is he is a very good recruiter, but he is not a great X's and O's guy as his stent at South Carolina's DC proved. I don't think Georgia will counter with a offer of full control of te defense, so he likely to walk.

[GrantDawg]

Update, he is staying. That's a pretty big black eye to the new Bama staff.

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[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Update, he is staying. That's a pretty big black eye to the new Bama staff.

Eh, maybe he knows it'd be a fairly sure route to unemployment. Maybe he's self-aware enough to know that he's really not a DC.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Vegas Vic

One thing to keep in mind. The vast majority of Saban's legacy and success came before college football instituted NIL and free agency. It's a new landscape, and the attributes that made a guy elite in the old days don't necessarily carry over now.

I feel like Saban was doing a pretty good job of navigating those waters over the years. The school is rich with resources to bring in top players and if you're looking to play in the NFL someday, there's probably no better choice.

There was going to be some dropoff due to more parity in the sport. You're not going to be able to maintain the depth you could in the past. But dropoff for them means being the 4th best team in the country instead of the 1st or 2nd. They would still almost always make the new playoffs.

Like I don't think he's particularly great with the X's and O's, but he's always got good assistants and always found a way to have more talent than anyone in the country. Two incredibly important aspects to being a great college coach. Sounds like the guy is just tired. It's one of the most stressful jobs in the sport and at 72, I don't blame him for wanting to retire.

[GrantDawg]

"Eh, maybe he knows it'd be a fairly sure route to unemployment. Maybe he's self-aware enough to know that he's really not a DC."
True enough. He is a great recruiter but hasn't exactly "wowed" when calling plays at other stops.

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[cartman]

Ohio State hired the Texas A&M AD to be their new athletic director. The same one that gave Jimbo the extension and later fired him

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by cartman

Ohio State hired the Texas A&M AD to be their new athletic director. The same one that gave Jimbo the extension and later fired him

I guess it is a plus that he was a good enough fundraiser to afford the money to buy Jimbo out?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by cartman

Ohio State hired the Texas A&M AD to be their new athletic director. The same one that gave Jimbo the extension and later fired him

2nd straight fan base that has not shed any tears with that dimwit departed.

He's apparently a hella good con man.

[JPhillips]

There's a lot to be said for a guy who can fundraise to the extent that a 75 mil buyout gets covered.

[HerRealName]

Originally Posted by cartman

Ohio State hired the Texas A&M AD to be their new athletic director. The same one that gave Jimbo the extension and later fired him

If he fires the basketball coach and eats the buyout then I'll be a happy man.

[GrantDawg]

I hear Georgia is the favorite, followed by OSU and Texas:

@AlabamaFTBL @CFB @RedditCFB @SECfootball @UofAlabama @espn pic.twitter.com/PBDUBSRfCL

— Voski (@Voski) January 17, 2024

[cartman]

lol, a TE for Miami was granted a NINTH year of eligibility

Miami TE Cam McCormick granted ninth year of eligibility - ESPN

McCormick, 25, was originally a three-star prospect out of Bend, Oregon. He was part of the 2016 signing class at Oregon that included QB Justin Herbert, and a national class that included Nick Bosa, Ed Oliver, Rashan Gary and Jalen Hurts -- all now established NFL veterans.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by cartman

lol, a TE for Miami was granted a NINTH year of eligibility

Miami TE Cam McCormick granted ninth year of eligibility - ESPN

How many degrees this m'fer GOT?

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

How many degrees this m'fer GOT?

He is on the Stetson Bennett plan, so none.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by cartman

lol, a TE for Miami was granted a NINTH year of eligibility

Miami TE Cam McCormick granted ninth year of eligibility - ESPN

I was going to make a joke but reading through this guys injuries, it's pretty admirable that he's still willing to play football. This is from 2020 and he had already gotten a degree and was in graduate school.


After 2 lost seasons, Oregon’s Cam McCormick is ready to get back on the field - The Athletic

[Danny]

Itll be nice for him to go directly from playing college football into an AARP membership.

[GrantDawg]

Man, the more I think about it. That guy has got life hacked. Nine years of college paid for and paid to go. I'm in.

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[bronconick]

Ryan Day is getting Bill O'Brien as OC for Ohio State.