2024 NFL Season Thread

[Danny]

Hes no Gardner Minshew but not bad

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by Lathum

You wouldn't want a guy who at the time of retirement was top ten in almost every passing category, never missed a game, and was a 2X Superbowl winner and MVP.

Weird but ok.

I mean, counting stats, sure. He'll get in. But it's Quik's old (anti-)Tim Brown argument.

Thought exercise: for the length of his career, would an Eagles fan trade their QBs for Eli? I'm not sure I would, and there are some really questionable names in there. A HoF QB shouldn't even be a deliberation.

Eli Manning is retiring and the Eagles will miss him – NBC Sports Philadelphia
The Eli Manning Hall of Fame debate has one obvious answer – NBC Sports Philadelphia

[SirFozzie]

How the fuck did Vinatieri not get in.

He could've got in just from his Patriots career alone, then he goes and does another decade with the Colts at high level.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I'm just amazed that there are people who think Rivers belongs in the Hall.

I saw his name mentioned in an article about this year/years ahead and my jaw dropped to see his name mentioned. Wouldn't have crossed my mind if you'd asked me to name the next 100 players who could/should be in.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by Sweed

Agree with you on Stafford. He's a guy you looked at and said "I wish we had him". Eli? More like "I wouldn't mind having him".

Joe Burrow may be on the "Stafford Path" if he never gets out of Cincinnati, or they never sell the team while he's there.

Originally Posted by Lathum

You wouldn't want a guy who at the time of retirement was top ten in almost every passing category, never missed a game, and was a 2X Superbowl winner and MVP.

Weird but ok.

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

I wouldn't mind having him.

Thanks.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I'm just amazed that there are people who think Rivers belongs in the Hall.

I saw his name mentioned in an article about this year/years ahead and my jaw dropped to see his name mentioned. Wouldn't have crossed my mind if you'd asked me to name the next 100 players who could/should be in.

I mean it was already mentioned, but it's literally the anti-Eli argument. If you just looked at stats and metrics, he's an HOF QB.

Talk to anyone who watched most of those Chargers games (and being objective) it was overwhelmingly empty stats and he choked away pretty much every big moment he was given. The king of losing a game with his play in the first three quarters then throwing for another 200 yards and 3 TD in the fourth quarter to make it respectable.

I think (and I hope) he doesn't sniff the hall, but it's going to be really tough separating some of these cases from each other. He's a decent year away from being the exact same statistical profile as Matt Ryan (who doesn't make the hall in my mind either but everyone seems to think will).

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

How the fuck did Vinatieri not get in.

He could've got in just from his Patriots career alone, then he goes and does another decade with the Colts at high level.

Jan Stenrud remains the only first ballot specialist in history.

As one article I read noted, it took Devin Hester THREE ballots to get inducted. There's just a reluctance to put specialists in on the first try.

[Ksyrup]

Similar to closers.

[Edward64]

No dog in this fight, especially since no Hog in either team. But going with the Eagles just because I'm tired of Taylor Swift.

[weegeebored]

Can't root for either team, but I think KC wins for two reasons: Mahomes and Reid. And I am in agreement with E64 -- I can't handle the KC Swifties anymore. Hope Kelce retires. Or maybe they will break up because football and the Eras tour are finished.

On a different topic, I just don't see Eli as an HoF QB. For the sake of discussion, take away his 2 SB wins. Does he make it on his other merits? Was any defense afraid of him? And without Tyree's helmet catch he likely only has one SB win, and that catch was more about Tyree than Eli. (Although I must admit that SB throw to Manningham was as good as it gets.)

[JonInMiddleGA]

With the Jets-to-part-ways-with-Rodgers report on ESPN, I can't help but wonder ... Cousins to NYJ and Rodgers to MIN?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by weegeebored

On a different topic, I just don't see Eli as an HoF QB. For the sake of discussion, take away his 2 SB wins. Does he make it on his other merits? Was any defense afraid of him? And without Tyree's helmet catch he likely only has one SB win, and that catch was more about Tyree than Eli. (Although I must admit that SB throw to Manningham was as good as it gets.)

If we remove the 2 biggest moments and accomplishments of his career then he doesn't get in is a pretty silly argument. Especially when you consider he beat the greatest QB of all time. Twice. He also won a road game at Lambeau against an amazing Packers team in January.

And all due respect you have zero clue what you are talking about with the helmet catch. Eli should have been taken down about 5 different times that play and he kept it alive.

As for the Swift hate I really don't get it. They show her like a total, of 35 seconds, in a 4 hour broadcast.

[NobodyHere]

I looked it up and at the last superbowl they showed Taylor Swift 12 times for 55 seconds. That's 12 times and 55 seconds too much.

I just hope they keep the camera off Trump tonight.

[Lathum]

dola- as for merits, he is 11th all time passing yards, 11 passing completions, and 11th in passing TDs.

I full on admit the INTs are an issue, but when you look at where he ranks on offensive numbers and factor in the fact he had two runs in the postseason, not one that was a fluke, I think he is a no brainer.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

I looked it up and at the last superbowl they showed Taylor Swift 12 times for 55 seconds. That's 12 times and 55 seconds too much.

I just hope they keep the camera off Trump tonight.

She is the biggest pop star on the planet and has brough tons of new fans to the game. Should they not try and grow the sport?

You guys act like she is on the sidelines with a headset on...

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

With the Jets-to-part-ways-with-Rodgers report on ESPN, I can't help but wonder ... Cousins to NYJ and Rodgers to MIN?

Vikings will give JJ McCarthy the job unless his injury is lingering. I assume Rodgers wants a guaranteed starting job & the only ones who will be willing to offer him one are whichever of the Tennessee/Cleveland/Giants/Raiders don't draft a rookie up high. He's probably a good candidate to wait until TC and hope a starter goes down, but I don't think any good team would give him the control he wants... hopefully he just fades away and gets a cabinet position or something.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Vikings will give JJ McCarthy the job unless his injury is lingering. I assume Rodgers wants a guaranteed starting job & the only ones who will be willing to offer him one are whichever of the Tennessee/Cleveland/Giants/Raiders don't draft a rookie up high. He's probably a good candidate to wait until TC and hope a starter goes down, but I don't think any good team would give him the control he wants... hopefully he just fades away and gets a cabinet position or something.

My MIN comment is largely based on the Favre history. I don't think it's realistic ... but it'd be amusing

[sovereignstar v2]

I'd be very surprised if the Vikings were interested in Rodgers. Might be risky, but I think you go into 2025 hoping he's ready to start

Edit: what Bishop said....

[miami_fan]

Where do y'all hang out that is filled with people who are Swifties/Chiefs fans? I want to go there to see what would have y'all hoping an outcome to allow for Eagles fans can be Super Bowl Champion Eagles fans for the next year. No offense Eagle fans, I have many in my own family and I won't be upset if the Eagles win. But you know how y'all are!

On a different topic, I just don't see Eli as an HoF QB. For the sake of discussion, take away his 2 SB wins. Does he make it on his other merits? Was any defense afraid of him? And without Tyree's helmet catch he likely only has one SB win, and that catch was more about Tyree than Eli. (Although I must admit that SB throw to Manningham was as good as it gets.)

I have to agree with Lathum's point regarding taking away achievements to justify not selecting someone to the HOF. He won two SBs. Super Bowls are the only time when QB wins are a thing.

[Jstraub]

Originally Posted by Lathum

dola- as for merits, he is 11th all time passing yards, 11 passing completions, and 11th in passing TDs.

I full on admit the INTs are an issue, but when you look at where he ranks on offensive numbers and factor in the fact he had two runs in the postseason, not one that was a fluke, I think he is a no brainer.

I'm in the 'no-brainer' he should be in camp. Its called the Hall of FAME. Not the Hall of stats. He is famous and for the right reasons in on-the-field moments. Big-time moments in big-time games. He should be in the Hall for the same reasons Lynn Swann is in.

For the record, If I had a vote, I'd give strong consideration to Joe Flacco for the same reasons as Eli. I'd give no consideration to Matt Ryan or Phillip Rivers or nearly all the WR with STATS galore.

[Danny]

Well then heres your 2026 hall of fame class

QB Eli Manning
RB Brandon Jacobs
RB Ahmad Bradshaw
RB D.J. Ware
WR Dominik Hixon*
LT David Diehl
LG Kevin Boothe
RG Chris Snee
RT Kareem McKenzie
DE Osi Umenyiora
DE Justin Tuck
DE Dave Tollefson
LB Chase Blackburn
LB Mathias Kiwanuka
CB Aaron Ross
CB Corey Webster
K Lawrence Tynes

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Danny

Well then heres your 2026 hall of fame class

QB Eli Manning
RB Brandon Jacobs
RB Ahmad Bradshaw
RB D.J. Ware
WR Dominik Hixon*
LT David Diehl
LG Kevin Boothe
RG Chris Snee
RT Kareem McKenzie
DE Osi Umenyiora
DE Justin Tuck
DE Dave Tollefson
LB Chase Blackburn
LB Mathias Kiwanuka
CB Aaron Ross
CB Corey Webster
K Lawrence Tynes

How many of these guys were in the top ten in the most meaningful stat categories all time at their position when they retired?

[Lathum]

dola- find me a player in any sport who is top 11 all time in three of the most meaningful categories at their position not in for any sport.

Hell, Cy Young also has the record for all time losses, guess he shouldn't be in Cooperstown. Reggie Jackson struck out more than any batter ever. All time leader in NBA history turning the ball over, LeBron, guess he is out.

[Carman Bulldog]

Anytime you can put in a quarterback with a career record of 117-117 in the Hall of Fame, you have to do it (...it sure seems like all those seasons where he played at an All-Pro, MVP or OPOY level sure didn't help his team's record... oh wait, he never did have a season at those levels?).

[Lathum]

2-0 when it matters

[Lathum]

So we are basing HOF credentials on team records now? Is QB wins even a stat?

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by Lathum

How many of these guys were in the top ten in the most meaningful stat categories all time at their position when they retired?

By that criteria Roman Gabriel should be in. Hadl and Brodie possibly too.

[BishopMVP]

I'm fine with Eli getting in, but also fine with the NFL sticking with a much smaller Hall than MLB. (I also don't know why I'm supposed to hate Eli as a Pats fan, our O played poorly/Giants D Line played amazing those games... only guy I might hate is the ref for not calling in the grasp like they had all season!)

[Carman Bulldog]

Originally Posted by Lathum

So we are basing HOF credentials on team records now?

So we don't count his win-loss record, because it's team dependent? But we do count Super Bowl wins, which are arguably even more team (and luck) dependent?

Originally Posted by Lathum

Is QB wins even a stat?

QB Record is included on the player summary on Pro Football Reference for quarterbacks, but not for any other position. Not my rules.

Speaking of stats, you keep mentioning that Eli finished top 11 in a few career statistical categories while ignoring the fact that he compiled these numbers in an era where passing stats became significantly inflated. The rest of the top 10 in these categories is basically all contemporaries, aside from Marino. It's basically meaningless comparing his all-time ranking against anyone that played before the year 2000. So while he's top 11 all time, he's basically 10th best of his era, behind the obvious guys but also Rivers, Roethlisberger, Ryan and Stafford. If Eli is in, it should be behind those four. And I don't think all four of those guys should be in.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Carman Bulldog

If Eli is in, it should be behind those four. And I don't think all four of those guys should be in.

No, they shouldn't.

But Manning should.

[Ghost Econ]

Lauren Daigle out there wearing wrapping paper.

[Carman Bulldog]

Originally Posted by Jstraub

I'm in the 'no-brainer' he should be in camp. Its called the Hall of FAME. Not the Hall of stats. He is famous and for the right reasons in on-the-field moments. Big-time moments in big-time games. He should be in the Hall for the same reasons Lynn Swann is in.

I sure hope you (and Lathum and all the other pro-Manning guys) are Julian Edelman guys as well. Three time Super Bowl champion, including one Super Bowl MVP. Led all receivers (both teams) in yards in each of those games and in receptions in two of those three games.

Edelman's biggest big game moment was arguably as equally impressive as Manning's, one big difference being it came on first down instead of third down. The other big difference was that while both catches were spectacular, Edelman was responsible for making his play while the best part of Manning's famous play was made by another player.

When he retired, Edelman was also second in NFL history in postseason receptions and receiving yards, behind only Jerry Rice in both categories.

I'm not sure how one argues Manning is a HoF player while Edelman is not.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by Lathum

How many of these guys were in the top ten in the most meaningful stat categories all time at their position when they retired?

The most and only truly meaningful stat categories for any position in the NFL are "number of super bowls won by team while on roster" and "number of regular season + playoff games won by team while on roster". Everything else that's being tracked is just fluff and sidetracks from what a team sport is about.

[MIJB#19]

And all this HOF talk sidetracks from the most meaningful game of the season.

[Ksyrup]

Graphics for the grandparent viewing segment, I see.

[sovereignstar v2]

Swallow your fucking whistle

[bhlloy]

What a fucking joke. Way to put the refereeing questions to bed early guys.

[RainMaker]

Refs are back

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by Carman Bulldog

I sure hope you (and Lathum and all the other pro-Manning guys) are Julian Edelman guys as well. Three time Super Bowl champion, including one Super Bowl MVP. Led all receivers (both teams) in yards in each of those games and in receptions in two of those three games.

Edelman's biggest big game moment was arguably as equally impressive as Manning's, one big difference being it came on first down instead of third down. The other big difference was that while both catches were spectacular, Edelman was responsible for making his play while the best part of Manning's famous play was made by another player.

When he retired, Edelman was also second in NFL history in postseason receptions and receiving yards, behind only Jerry Rice in both categories.

I'm not sure how one argues Manning is a HoF player while Edelman is not.

Please tell us you're not being serious.

He averaged 77 catches, 847 yds per season. Yes regular season counts too.

Here you go with his sheet.. https://www.pro-football-reference.c...E/EdelJu00.htm

Feel free to add anything to bolster your argument.

[bronconick]

Way to prove the narrative.

[Sweed]

And if the d-back had put his hands on the WR facemask?

[GrantDawg]

Looked pretty textbook to me, but you know. WR are supposed to get away with everything.

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[Danny]

Eagles lineman breathed on Mahomes, some pretty big discipline by the official not to call that.

[Ksyrup]

Make-up call.

[RainMaker]

What's worse, the refs or the scorebug?

[miami_fan]

Not a original thought, but I can’t take Tom Brady seriously when it comes to the refs getting unnecessary roughness wrong.

[GrantDawg]

Hurt's looking sharp early, and Mahomes not so much.

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[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

What's worse, the refs or the scorebug?

Scorebug because it's on the screen 100% of the time instead of 90%.

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

What's worse, the refs or the scorebug?

Whining about refs

[Carman Bulldog]

Originally Posted by Sweed

Please tell us you're not being serious.

He averaged 77 catches, 847 yds per season. Yes regular season counts too.

Here you go with his sheet.. https://www.pro-football-reference.c...E/EdelJu00.htm

Feel free to add anything to bolster your argument.

Yes, very pedestrian regular season numbers. And Eli averaged an equally pedestrian 60.3% completion percentage, 26 touchdowns, 18 interceptions and a quarterback rating of 84.1. Again, if Eli's resume is two games, why can't Edelman's resume be three games?