SCOTUS Overturns Federal Ban on Sports Gambling

[ISiddiqui]

https://www.si.com/college-basketbal...-supreme-court

So each state (and not just Nevada) can now institute sports gambling if it wishes.

[albionmoonlight]

The writing was on the wall with this.

Buzz has it that some states have the bills already drafted and will be able to pass them in a matter of weeks.

Fun times to be alive.

Sadly for me, my guess is that North Carolina will decide to do some stupid half-measure and allow "expanded DFS" or something like that instead of just letting folks log on and place normal sports wagers.

I'd be super worried right now if I were an offshore casino or a small time bookie.

[murrayyyyy]

I don't think it will change things as much as people think. Bookies float you money not casinos. Also it's taken Nevada a long time to get to where we are and I'd bet they aren't sharing secrets with other states.

[QuikSand]

Looking at the waves of people who hit the Delaware casinos to place legal bets on football (terribly structured against the bettor), I think this is a big deal. There's a market, and the swath of people who don't want to mess with the underground to do it is substantial.

[PilotMan]

I wonder if the morality police will come for this. Will the evangelical right decry the legality of the vice for all? Thirty years ago, churches would have been very up in arms about something like this. Hell, even legalizing gambling at all was a huge religious marker against. Now though? Will it be strongly opposed in red states like KY, where I live? Will they push legislation that bans it outright, under the guise of morality of course? And if they don't, does the hypocrisy show brighter?

[stevew]

So i just wonder how bad you'd have to make the odds to get equal wagering on a steelers game at a pittsburgh casino(or Packers/Greenbay, etc etc)? I would assume some significant value will be derived from betting against the home team.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

I wonder if the morality police will come for this. Will the evangelical right decry the legality of the vice for all? Thirty years ago, churches would have been very up in arms about something like this. Hell, even legalizing gambling at all was a huge religious marker against. Now though? Will it be strongly opposed in red states like KY, where I live? Will they push legislation that bans it outright, under the guise of morality of course? And if they don't, does the hypocrisy show brighter?

A lot of lotteries were initially decried by religious institutions. The state governments outflanked them by designating the proceeds go to things like college scholarships. They may decide to do the same thing with sports gambling.

[albionmoonlight]

Put me in the "this will be a sea change" camp. There's too much money to be made for most states to not jump on the bandwagon.

The two big impediments would be morality and the sports leagues themselves, but neither seems like they are going to stand in the way.

Gambling just isn't seen as the vice that it used to be, so I see only token resistance from the morality players.

And the (professional) sports leagues have taken positions ranging from neutral to eager. And all of them realize that this will be a way to get and keep eyeballs in a fractured entertainment universe. So they will be on board as long as they get a say in how it's done.

I do think that American culture has a lot invested in the myth of big time college athletics as "amateur," so I do see the future of legal college sports betting as much more up in the air than the pro leagues.

[Izulde]

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

I don't think it will change things as much as people think. Bookies float you money not casinos. Also it's taken Nevada a long time to get to where we are and I'd bet they aren't sharing secrets with other states.

I *am* worried about how this will affect things here long-term, though.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Izulde

I *am* worried about how this will affect things here long-term, though.

The big question, I guess, is how many trips to Vegas happen only because of sports bets.

There are, I am sure, some number of folks who go to place their preseason props who then make a weekend of it who might end up not coming if they can just do that from their laptops in Los Angeles.

But Vegas is fun. And I figure for a lot of people, the sports betting is an excuse to go, but they can replace that excuse with any number of others.

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by Izulde

I *am* worried about how this will affect things here long-term, though.

Casinos profited over a billion in march with only 43 million coming from sportsbooks. Until they get rid of penny slots, I won't be worried.

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

I wonder if the morality police will come for this. Will the evangelical right decry the legality of the vice for all? Thirty years ago, churches would have been very up in arms about something like this. Hell, even legalizing gambling at all was a huge religious marker against. Now though? Will it be strongly opposed in red states like KY, where I live? Will they push legislation that bans it outright, under the guise of morality of course? And if they don't, does the hypocrisy show brighter?

If your state has mega-bucks or those gas station scratch cards, I doubt it. (something not found in Nevada)

[digamma]

You might be surprised, though I would guess that dollars would ultimately win out. There were some interesting trade offs when the internet gaming act was passed, with people pointing out the seeming hypocrisy of Florida and Kentucky lawmakers in particular who carved out specific riders for horse tracks. Which is clearly higher on the moral pecking order than betting on other sports.

[cuervo72]

Well, they wear civilized hats at tracks.

[RainMaker]

I think it'll be good for Vegas. Sportsbooks are small percent of their income and this just gets people into betting more. Especially if the leagues are smart enough to embrace it.

[miami_fan]

I don't know much about sports gambling and never had a big interest in its legalization either way. However, the idea of some politicians in Florida rejecting it due to it does not reflect the "innocence of the state" is LOL funny.

[digamma]

I have been a little skeptical about how much this would increase gambling on sports nationwide, but some of the Las Vegas Golden Knights data is making me change my tune.

In an average game this season, bettors placed 15x more bets on the Knights than on their opponent, regardless of spread. The Knights accounted for 30% of the total NHL "handle" (total dollars bet), more than 3x any team in any other league (the Pats were about 8% of the total NFL handle).

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

I don't know much about sports gambling and never had a big interest in its legalization either way. However, the idea of some politicians in Florida rejecting it due to it does not reflect the "innocence of the state" is LOL funny.

Should just say Disney and one of the Indian tribes pay our campaigns a ton of money to keep it illegal.

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by digamma

I have been a little skeptical about how much this would increase gambling on sports nationwide, but some of the Las Vegas Golden Knights data is making me change my tune.

In an average game this season, bettors placed 15x more bets on the Knights than on their opponent, regardless of spread. The Knights accounted for 30% of the total NHL "handle" (total dollars bet), more than 3x any team in any other league (the Pats were about 8% of the total NFL handle).

NHL handle is so poor though. It's not even put in it's own category by the gaming board as it's found in other. Last month's figures for the sports books in the state.

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NFL will be the beast with NBA a close 2nd nationally. MLB a distant 3rd and then NHL well below that. I think the thing that people forget is that they won't float you money like a bookie and it won't stop illegal gambling. When limits are placed on you in Vegas it's too easy to find a bookie who will take your action.

I think this will be a real threat to daily fantasy but revive fantasy football somehow.

[JPhillips]

Today the DoJ released an opinion that all online gambling is illegal. It will certainly be challenged in court, but Adelson is getting his money's worth. I wonder if the Feds will raid any of the NJ sites.

[RainMaker]

Those states rights folks seem to get awfully quiet sometimes.

[albionmoonlight]

Interesting. Wonder if this will make the Powerball and Mega Millions illegal. They are certainly gambling that crosses state lines.

I'm sure that they will get exemptions from the ban, but that means getting Congress to do something.

[albionmoonlight]

Sources - Guardians' Luis Ortiz subject of gambling investigation - ESPN

I was very much in favor of broadly legalized sports gambling. But with a few years of experience under our belt, I think it has just kind of made sports suck a little bit more.

[albionmoonlight]

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A triple dola over the course of seven years. Nice.

[Kodos]

Gambling is such a big problem, whether it is legal or illegal. Ruins a lot of people's lives, especially with young men.

[Lathum]

Really brave of him to write and publish that, as millions of young men are going through the same thing.

I've never really shared my story here, but I went through first hand a lot of what he did.

As a lot of you know I was really in to sports betting. I always loved gambling from the time I was a kid playing cards in the cafeteria. I started sneaking in to casinos in Atlantic City when I was 17. Playing poker at 18. At around 21 I was introduced to sports betting. There really is nothing like the rush of winning.

This part really stood out to me

I had more free time than I knew what to do with. It’s like a thick cloud was just hanging over my head, keeping me in a funk.

For me it was covid. Leading up to Covid I had always gambled, mostly betting on sports. I don't consider poker gambling, and actually played professionally for a while with decent results. I was always able to keep everything in check, never losing or wagering too much.

Covid came along and we had so much free time and never left the house. My wife was till working but I had so much extra time I started gambling a lot more making bigger bets and wagering lots of sums of money. I was moving all kinds of money from crypto accounts, to crypto wallets, to sportsbooks. Literally thousands of dollars a day. Some days I would win 4K and other days lose 5K. I would wake up every morning feeling like shit, often not even knowing how much I has won or lost.

Mostly I felt worse because I was hiding it from my wife.

Now I want to be clear. I never gambled money we didn't have. A lot of people went to way darker places, but it doesn't change my story and about what I went through. I really became someone I didn't like. Staying up until 4AM betting on Australian horse racing or womens college basketball 4th quarters. It consumed me. It changes you. I opened a couple credit cards so it was easier to move money around without the volatility of crypto.

Then my dad died.

I really started reflecting after that and realized this isn't who I want to be, and the first step would be telling my wife. This was March of 2023.

It took me a couple weeks to build up the courage, going over and over in my head what I was going to say. Finally I couldn't wait any longer and I sat her down in the kitchen and told her everything. The late nights, the thousands changing hands daily, the toll it was taking on me. She was predictably upset and felt betrayed. I really thought it was a possibility my marriage was over. I had run up about 30K between the two cards. I gave her some space for a few days and in that time she talked to her therapist. My wife told me she loved me, but also was hurt and it would take time to get over it. I got in to therapy which has helped me immensely. We paid off the cards and are fortunate it wasn't a financial hardship for us.

My wife eventually understood how covid exploded my gambling, totally forgave me, and said she had her own ways of coping during covid and this was mine. That being said it is so easy to fall into that world and lose it all. I almost did.

Three years later and with a couple small exceptions I haven't made one sports bet. My therapist doesn't think I am an addict, and that covid really caused tings to blow up. I still play poker and occasionally go to the casino, but the urges to bet a small fortune from home aren't there. My relationship with my wife is amazing, and I consider myself lucky I was able to get out when I did.

I have more thought but ironically have an appointment with my therapist.

[albionmoonlight]

Thanks for sharing that.

It is an insidious addiction, and the more people are open about it, the better off we all are.

[Kodos]

I'm glad you got things straightened out, Lathum. I used to worry about you with some of the posts you used to make about betting. I remember one time 6ish years back when cuervo stated that you had a gambling problem and I pointed out that your response was pretty defensive:

NFL 2019 Season Thread - Page 8 - Front Office Football Central

Originally Posted by cuervo72

I'm from Philly. I have people from Philly on my FB feed. Trust me, they weren't like this because they bet on the Eagles.

Also, you have a gambling problem.

Originally Posted by Lathum

You don’t know me. How about you go fuck your self.

Originally Posted by Kodos

Yeah, he’s a little defensive on that topic.

Originally Posted by Lathum

Would you like it if someone called you an alcoholic because you posted you got drunk a few times or like white claw?

It is a shitty assumption to make about someone because they have a different opinion or they like an activity that you don't.

If you, he, or anyone else thinks the NFL and its success isn't largely driven by gambling I have a bridge to sell you.

I'm glad you're in a better place now with regards to gambling. It's really easy to start losing and then try to make up your losses and get caught in a downward spiral financially. And these betting apps are designed to prey on human weaknesses. I don't have personal experience with it, as I am a cautious guy by nature. Football pools and NCAA tourney's are about the extent of my gambling history. And I get upset enough when my teams lose - I don't need to make it worse by losing money in the process too. Anyhow, I just wanted to say I'm impressed that you came to terms with the problem and worked to fix it.

This Jon Oliver video covers how insidious these betting apps are and how they pay lip service to caring about gambling addiction while also doing everything they can to keep people hooked.

[Lathum]

I remember that exchange, and at the time ffelt shame because a big part of me thought he was right and it hurt to have it pointed out. If he sees this I/m sorry I lashed out like that

[cuervo72]

Yes, glad to see you got this straightened out, and it takes courage to admit you had/have a problem (I say have bc as the son of someone who quit drinking when I was 3, I was always taught that someone is not a recovered alcoholic but a recovering alcoholic).

Also, *flashes finger at Butter* wherever he is. (Still at LL, so lurking somewhere anyway.)

[JPhillips]

When I was teaching I was amazed at how many young men were talking about gambling. It's really a time bomb that we've yet to se fully explode.

[RainMaker]

The prediction market stuff is insane too.

Today's White House Press Briefing had a 98% chance of running over 65 minutes - until Karoline Leavitt abruptly ended it with seconds to spare.

Traders on the NO side made 50x in seconds. pic.twitter.com/Fe0MVMq9Oj

— PredictionMarketTrader (@PredMTrader) January 7, 2026

[Lathum]

Watching the Oliver thing and jotting down thoughts.

I am not at all surprised ping pong was the 4th highest wagered on sport. It is available at odd hours, especially late at night so when the traditional sports are done addicts need to get their fix or chase their losses.

The part about live betting is spot on. When I started betting online years ago you could only place totals and spreads, and if you missed the start of the game that was it. Now with live betting and AI adjusting the lines it is so easy to either chase your losses, or double and triple down. They also kill you on the juice with those it often being -130 and above. Impossible to win long term.

Maybe they will touch on it more, but the "bonuses" are probably the most insidious part of online wagering. It is the equivalent of a crack dealer giving kids samples. All the "free first bet" and "bonus dollars" all come with strings. The free first bets are almost always paid in site credits if you lose, which means you have to win another wager to convert them in to dollars. The bonuses are even worse, often having a "paythrough" to release the bonus money. Meaning for ever X amount of bonus dollars to be released you have to wager Y amount of real money. If you withdraw before then you lose all the bonus money, so it encourages you to keep playing.

The cat cancer thing was a riot

The part about the kid saying he would go into his girlfriends bathroom and rattle off bets is spot on and a large part of why I hated who I was becoming. It becomes consuming and you find yourself slipping out of events, missing tings, or mentally not being there because you are on the phone making bets of checking scores. If you missed a bet you wanted to make you would have major FOMO so your whole schedule revolves around making bets.

They are absolutely correct that these sites do everything to keep you playing and reeling you in. When I was playing a lot I would get all kinds of bonuses and contacted by hosts. When I quit I would get all kinds of emails with deposit offers and incentives to come back.

They are absolutely correct that they need to have some limits regarding advertising, but I suspect it won't change because everyone is making money off this.

[RainMaker]

Table tennis is also popular to bet on because it is how some groups launder money. Most matches are fixed.

[Kodos]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Table tennis is also popular to bet on because it is how some groups launder money. Most matches are fixed.

Marty Supreme was right!

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Marty Supreme was right!

Of topic, but that was a really good but crazy movie.


As for betting, I can get how people feel the need to chase that feeling of winning. I just hate the feeling of losing so much it cuts me off.

[Kodos]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Really brave of him to write and publish that, as millions of young men are going through the same thing.

I've never really shared my story here, but I went through first hand a lot of what he did.

As a lot of you know I was really in to sports betting. I always loved gambling from the time I was a kid playing cards in the cafeteria. I started sneaking in to casinos in Atlantic City when I was 17. Playing poker at 18. At around 21 I was introduced to sports betting. There really is nothing like the rush of winning.

This part really stood out to me



For me it was covid. Leading up to Covid I had always gambled, mostly betting on sports. I don't consider poker gambling, and actually played professionally for a while with decent results. I was always able to keep everything in check, never losing or wagering too much.

Covid came along and we had so much free time and never left the house. My wife was till working but I had so much extra time I started gambling a lot more making bigger bets and wagering lots of sums of money. I was moving all kinds of money from crypto accounts, to crypto wallets, to sportsbooks. Literally thousands of dollars a day. Some days I would win 4K and other days lose 5K. I would wake up every morning feeling like shit, often not even knowing how much I has won or lost.

Mostly I felt worse because I was hiding it from my wife.

Now I want to be clear. I never gambled money we didn't have. A lot of people went to way darker places, but it doesn't change my story and about what I went through. I really became someone I didn't like. Staying up until 4AM betting on Australian horse racing or womens college basketball 4th quarters. It consumed me. It changes you. I opened a couple credit cards so it was easier to move money around without the volatility of crypto.

Then my dad died.

I really started reflecting after that and realized this isn't who I want to be, and the first step would be telling my wife. This was March of 2023.

It took me a couple weeks to build up the courage, going over and over in my head what I was going to say. Finally I couldn't wait any longer and I sat her down in the kitchen and told her everything. The late nights, the thousands changing hands daily, the toll it was taking on me. She was predictably upset and felt betrayed. I really thought it was a possibility my marriage was over. I had run up about 30K between the two cards. I gave her some space for a few days and in that time she talked to her therapist. My wife told me she loved me, but also was hurt and it would take time to get over it. I got in to therapy which has helped me immensely. We paid off the cards and are fortunate it wasn't a financial hardship for us.

My wife eventually understood how covid exploded my gambling, totally forgave me, and said she had her own ways of coping during covid and this was mine. That being said it is so easy to fall into that world and lose it all. I almost did.

Three years later and with a couple small exceptions I haven't made one sports bet. My therapist doesn't think I am an addict, and that covid really caused tings to blow up. I still play poker and occasionally go to the casino, but the urges to bet a small fortune from home aren't there. My relationship with my wife is amazing, and I consider myself lucky I was able to get out when I did.

I have more thought but ironically have an appointment with my therapist.

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Consumer Reports is looking for stories on betting app experiences, if you are interested.

[Lathum]

How the fuck is Kalshi legal on any level? Polymarket isn't available here. You can still access it with crypto and a VPN, but Kalshi is in the US.

It's like sports betting but on crack.

[JPhillips]

Prediction markets are open that there's insider trading. They were asked about picking the first song of Bad Bunny's SB show and they said there's nothing to stop a performer who has rehearsed the show from betting. They don't care because they make money regardless. You should assume that if it's possible to rig a prediction, it's being rigged.

[Jas_lov]

Yeah, there was a story going around that a guy bet $50k on someone running on to the field at the Superbowl and then he did it himself. I wondered how that was legal.

[Lathum]

I just don't get how it isn't considered gaming.

They also have insane things like betting on the high temp in a given city

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Lathum

How the fuck is Kalshi legal on any level? Polymarket isn't available here. You can still access it with crypto and a VPN, but Kalshi is in the US.

It's like sports betting but on crack.

The President's son sits on the board of both.

And yes, it's blatantly illegal. Just sports gambling and unregulated securities. They basically figured out how to "legalize" insider trading.

[Young Drachma]

Haha signs we've gone to hell for sure, but how do you put the genie back in the bottle.

[Ghost Econ]

2 "former" MLS players received lifetime bans for betting on their own games and their own props. But MLS said the integrity of the game is all good so nothing to worry about. Also, one of the jersey sponsors for a team in questiom is a gambling website.

[albionmoonlight]

I thought expanding sports betting would be a good thing overall.

Pretty clear that it was not.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I thought expanding sports betting would be a good thing overall.

Pretty clear that it was not.

We've just seen the tip of the iceberg. I heard an interview with an expert who claimed something like 80% of his college students bet online.

It's like crack but legal and it is going to ruin a lot of lives as these kids grow older and try and get jobs, save money, etc...

[RainMaker]

I think an ominous part of this is the people they are catching are incredibly dumb. Like openly talking about it in text messages and making large enough bets to be flagged. Imagine how many are doing this but being smart about it.

[Lathum]

Long piece and as a seasoned gambler there are a few holes to poke in it but over all really well done. While he didn't feel the sting of losing his own money, he experienced a lot of the other ups and downs and negative effects of problem gambling.

The Atlantic

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I thought expanding sports betting would be a good thing overall.

Pretty clear that it was not.

I think the crux of the problem here is that there appears to be absolutely no regulatory check on outright predatory practices. In an ideal world there'd be a regulator with knowledge of the gambling industry who could take a look at offerings and say "uh, no, you aren't going to do that".

[RainMaker]

I guess I'm still confused how Kalshi and Polymarket aren't considered gambling. You literally bet on which team wins a game.