Ping - Marc Vaughn (FM Cohesion Factor)

MikeVick7 · 03-18-2005, 06:01 PM

I have a terrible habit of buying new players every off-season...heck even during the season and my team always starts off a bit slow at the beginning of every season. So is there some kinda gelling or cohesion factor that gets figured in to the game?

SirFozzie · 03-18-2005, 06:12 PM

I'm pretty sure there's a cohesion rating, not seen, I just don't have the official word on it.

Tekneek · 03-19-2005, 09:58 AM

I used to carry fairly large squads, even on the lower league clubs I always manage with. I would also swap players out of the starting 11 all of the time, with rarely more than a goalkeeper being a sure member of the first 11 on a regular basis. I got much better performance when I settled on a top 11 and only swapped out when necessary. I never noticed an inherent positive or negative associated with how many guys were in the squad the previous year, though. They always seemed to need a little adjustment time in the new season.

Perhaps you should try and schedule a few more friendlies than usual to get your squad settled. I've found that helps them get a head start. Overall, my clubs usually perform well until the mid-point and we get inconsistent from there to the end...I probably overwork my guys to finish just out of a playoff spot every year.

Marc Vaughan · 03-19-2005, 01:40 PM

There is indeed a cohesion factor built into the game (its relationship based ie. who plays with whom and when (and of course the personalities of the people involved and their feelings towards each other)).

The effect of introducing new players to a team differs somewhat depending on the players themselves - some will naturally adapt to a particular team more quickly than others (note: domestic (ie. non-foreign) players will generally adapt to a team more quickly than those from abroad - although this can be offset somewhat by having team-mates/coaches etc. who know the players main languages and/or are friends of the player).

As a rule of thumb I generally try and limit new 'starting' players in a team to a maximum of 2-3 a season, if at all possible - I happily sign many more than this, but try and ensure that the others are juniors who will sit and wait a season or so on the bench/loan/reserves until they start complaining.

If you MUST sign more players than this because its a desperate situation try and get them as early as possible in the summer and have a long pre-season tour to bed them in.

Hope this helps,

Marc

ice4277 · 03-19-2005, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Vaughan

If you MUST sign more players than this because its a desperate situation try and get them as early as possible in the summer and have a long pre-season tour to bed them in.

Marc, does actually selecting a 'tour' from the friendlies menu actually give an advantage to team cohesion, or any other stats, or does it have the same effect as just selecting a few friendlies in a row?

MikeVick7 · 03-19-2005, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Vaughan

There is indeed a cohesion factor built into the game (its relationship based ie. who plays with whom and when (and of course the personalities of the people involved and their feelings towards each other)).

The effect of introducing new players to a team differs somewhat depending on the players themselves - some will naturally adapt to a particular team more quickly than others (note: domestic (ie. non-foreign) players will generally adapt to a team more quickly than those from abroad - although this can be offset somewhat by having team-mates/coaches etc. who know the players main languages and/or are friends of the player).

As a rule of thumb I generally try and limit new 'starting' players in a team to a maximum of 2-3 a season, if at all possible - I happily sign many more than this, but try and ensure that the others are juniors who will sit and wait a season or so on the bench/loan/reserves until they start complaining.

If you MUST sign more players than this because its a desperate situation try and get them as early as possible in the summer and have a long pre-season tour to bed them in.

Hope this helps,

Marc

Thanks Marc...yeah this totally makes sense. My team finishes strong every year but they always have a problem getting started. This last season has been particularily difficult...as even though I'm in the top 10 in the EPL and in the first knockout stage of the Champions League...well over half of my 1st team players are all unhappy cause they think they we should be doing better. I even have one Brazilian striker that I brought in during the offseason who is so pissed at me that he's starting to miss practice and thinks I'm an inept tactician. Ha...he's probably right...now that I think about it.

But yeah I'm barely keeping the ship afloat this season...but I think it's because I brought in more new players this last offseason than I ever had before. I have way too much fun with that EPL and Champions League TV money.

Marc Vaughan · 03-19-2005, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ice4277

Marc, does actually selecting a 'tour' from the friendlies menu actually give an advantage to team cohesion, or any other stats, or does it have the same effect as just selecting a few friendlies in a row?

Same effect as far as your team goes - however it does promote your team abroad and can bring in slightly more revenue than individual friendlies at the time*.

NB> Only effective if your team has a reasonable reputation

bhlloy · 03-19-2005, 06:32 PM

This makes a lot of sense... in my one big career with FM after winning the Welsh Premier with TNS 3 years running and getting to third round qualifying of the Champions League I finally took a job I was happy with. Hull in league 2 with about £3m to play with. They had sold most of their good players and had nearly been relegated the year before but they had a couple left (Barmby, Anselin and they had signed Ronnie Wallwork)

To cut a long story short... I signed 20 odd players that offseason. A lot were juniors but a couple of my old TNS players came in as starters, a few english league veterans and a number of quality foreign finds. In total I think I only returned 3 players in my starting 11. We sucked. Started the season losing at home three times in a row I think. Haven't played in a while as I kinda lost interest but this would go a long way to explaining what I saw as that squad was waaaay more talented than anything else in the division and my tactics were proven. The team just didn't play well together.

SunDancer · 03-19-2005, 10:15 PM

Can a tour increase your club's appeal to players from that country and the teams you play (exposure-a recruiting tool)?

Also, on a tour, would having any "national" players from that country have an impact on revenue?

Marc Vaughan · 03-20-2005, 04:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunDancer

Can a tour increase your club's appeal to players from that country and the teams you play (exposure-a recruiting tool)?

Also, on a tour, would having any "national" players from that country have an impact on revenue?

Thats not a bad idea- however its really one for the future at the moment, simply because we'd have to hold a 'map' of reputations from each club to all countries in the world and that'd eat up too much memory at present ...

JeffR · 03-20-2005, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Vaughan

Thats not a bad idea- however its really one for the future at the moment, simply because we'd have to hold a 'map' of reputations from each club to all countries in the world and that'd eat up too much memory at present ...

...or just add the touring team as a favorite to a small number of local players whenever a big enough team goes on tour in that country.

MikeVick7 · 03-21-2005, 10:56 PM

Well after paying more attention to letting my existing players gel...I only made one off-season move...a back-up striker. And so far this season my squad has started out 6-0-0.

Desnudo · 03-22-2005, 01:06 AM

I've worked a lot harder at paying attention to who comes and goes on my teams. I've definitely noticed it works to keep as much of your team together as possible and to get rid of bad apples, no matter how talented.

Marc Vaughan · 03-22-2005, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Desnudo

I've worked a lot harder at paying attention to who comes and goes on my teams. I've definitely noticed it works to keep as much of your team together as possible and to get rid of bad apples, no matter how talented.

Same irl, one method I use which works fairly well is to pickup promising youngsters from U21/U19 teams fairly frequently ... not all of them will cut the mustard obviously, but they're usually fairly patient about sitting in the reserves/youth teams and that time will help them settle into the squads style of play.

SunDancer · 03-23-2005, 05:56 PM

Whats the difference between a cup, league,friendlies and tour? I know what they are, but what are the effects of them?

SirFozzie · 03-23-2005, 05:58 PM

Cup/League-Tournament style, Cup is a four team knockout tourney (four teams play semifinals one day, finals & third place the next), League is a round robin tournament over three days (play each other team once, best record "wins"), friendlies and tours are one-off games (tours are a series of one-off games).

Cup games have to have penalties in some way

SunDancer · 03-23-2005, 06:05 PM

Yeah,
I know what they are. Just was curious as to what the effects were from a team, media, and financial standpoint.

Marc Vaughan · 03-24-2005, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunDancer

Yeah,
I know what they are. Just was curious as to what the effects were from a team, media, and financial standpoint.

Tours are best for increasing revenue from merchandising as they elevate your teams profile in the country involved.

Small tournaments (leagues or whatever) are good for getting players fit (as they play several matches close together) and also recieving television money (if your tourney is big enough to attract TV attention).

Friendlies are well, friendlies - they're easy to arrange and work a little in each area.

NB> For the first two bear in mind that Brighton going on tour in the far east will have a MUCH lesser effect on things than Man Utd doing the same ...

03-18-2005, 06:12 PM	#2
SirFozzie Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: The State of Insanity	I'm pretty sure there's a cohesion rating, not seen, I just don't have the official word on it. __________________ Check out Foz's New Video Game Site, An 8-bit Mind in an 8GB world! http://an8bitmind.com

03-21-2005, 10:56 PM	#12
MikeVick7 College Benchwarmer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Ron, Mexico	Well after paying more attention to letting my existing players gel...I only made one off-season move...a back-up striker. And so far this season my squad has started out 6-0-0. __________________ Hattrick - Seattle Reign (224367)

03-23-2005, 05:58 PM	#16
SirFozzie Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: The State of Insanity	Cup/League-Tournament style, Cup is a four team knockout tourney (four teams play semifinals one day, finals & third place the next), League is a round robin tournament over three days (play each other team once, best record "wins"), friendlies and tours are one-off games (tours are a series of one-off games). Cup games have to have penalties in some way __________________ Check out Foz's New Video Game Site, An 8-bit Mind in an 8GB world! http://an8bitmind.com

03-23-2005, 06:05 PM	#17
SunDancer College Benchwarmer Join Date: Sep 2002	Yeah, I know what they are. Just was curious as to what the effects were from a team, media, and financial standpoint. Last edited by SunDancer : 03-23-2005 at 06:06 PM.

03-19-2005, 09:58 AM	#3
Tekneek Pro Rookie Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: USA	I used to carry fairly large squads, even on the lower league clubs I always manage with. I would also swap players out of the starting 11 all of the time, with rarely more than a goalkeeper being a sure member of the first 11 on a regular basis. I got much better performance when I settled on a top 11 and only swapped out when necessary. I never noticed an inherent positive or negative associated with how many guys were in the squad the previous year, though. They always seemed to need a little adjustment time in the new season. Perhaps you should try and schedule a few more friendlies than usual to get your squad settled. I've found that helps them get a head start. Overall, my clubs usually perform well until the mid-point and we get inconsistent from there to the end...I probably overwork my guys to finish just out of a playoff spot every year.

03-19-2005, 01:40 PM	#4
Marc Vaughan SI Games Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Melbourne, FL	There is indeed a cohesion factor built into the game (its relationship based ie. who plays with whom and when (and of course the personalities of the people involved and their feelings towards each other)). The effect of introducing new players to a team differs somewhat depending on the players themselves - some will naturally adapt to a particular team more quickly than others (note: domestic (ie. non-foreign) players will generally adapt to a team more quickly than those from abroad - although this can be offset somewhat by having team-mates/coaches etc. who know the players main languages and/or are friends of the player). As a rule of thumb I generally try and limit new 'starting' players in a team to a maximum of 2-3 a season, if at all possible - I happily sign many more than this, but try and ensure that the others are juniors who will sit and wait a season or so on the bench/loan/reserves until they start complaining. If you MUST sign more players than this because its a desperate situation try and get them as early as possible in the summer and have a long pre-season tour to bed them in. Hope this helps, Marc

03-19-2005, 06:32 PM	#8
bhlloy Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003	This makes a lot of sense... in my one big career with FM after winning the Welsh Premier with TNS 3 years running and getting to third round qualifying of the Champions League I finally took a job I was happy with. Hull in league 2 with about £3m to play with. They had sold most of their good players and had nearly been relegated the year before but they had a couple left (Barmby, Anselin and they had signed Ronnie Wallwork) To cut a long story short... I signed 20 odd players that offseason. A lot were juniors but a couple of my old TNS players came in as starters, a few english league veterans and a number of quality foreign finds. In total I think I only returned 3 players in my starting 11. We sucked. Started the season losing at home three times in a row I think. Haven't played in a while as I kinda lost interest but this would go a long way to explaining what I saw as that squad was waaaay more talented than anything else in the division and my tactics were proven. The team just didn't play well together.

03-19-2005, 10:15 PM	#9
SunDancer College Benchwarmer Join Date: Sep 2002	Can a tour increase your club's appeal to players from that country and the teams you play (exposure-a recruiting tool)? Also, on a tour, would having any "national" players from that country have an impact on revenue?

03-22-2005, 01:06 AM	#13
Desnudo Coordinator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Here and There	I've worked a lot harder at paying attention to who comes and goes on my teams. I've definitely noticed it works to keep as much of your team together as possible and to get rid of bad apples, no matter how talented.

03-23-2005, 05:56 PM	#15
SunDancer College Benchwarmer Join Date: Sep 2002	Whats the difference between a cup, league,friendlies and tour? I know what they are, but what are the effects of them?

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