WW LXXXVI - The Charmed Ones (Game Over - Innocents Win)

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

I got a PM on Day 2 giving me information about my new win condition. I learned that Cole Turner is a lawyer who defended/freed some guy who killed a college friend of mine. I want vengeance on Cole Turner because of this.

so is your solo win condition getting me lynched?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

Dude, I said I was just theorizing!

What, we're not allowed to suggest ideas in Werewolf now? Or only you are?

thats a pretty far fetched theory

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Lathum

dola- If you think there is only 1 wolf left then it is probably a cunning wolf.

I just have a hard time thinking that way - if that is the case then the village was pretty unlucky.

But if that is the case then you could refuse to be turned tonight (right?) and we can win the game tomorrow by voting out Heinz. I'm not counting on this happening (you would take the win, I expect) but I'll throw it out there as long as we are constructing scenarios.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Lathum

so is your solo win condition getting me lynched?

Well, I did not know it was you until last night after the deadline. But yeah, that is how it works.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

I just have a hard time thinking that way - if that is the case then the village was pretty unlucky.

But if that is the case then you could refuse to be turned tonight (right?) and we can win the game tomorrow by voting out Heinz. I'm not counting on this happening (you would take the win, I expect) but I'll throw it out there as long as we are constructing scenarios.

I don't think I can, since I don't become a demon until the following night I don't think I would get the win.

Plus if I am decline the conversion I am believe I am told who attempted to convert me.

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by Lathum

thats a pretty far fetched theory

This coming from the guy who has tried to implicate each of the other 4 players in the last 12 hours...

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

This coming from the guy who has tried to implicate each of the other 4 players in the last 12 hours...

not implicating anyone.

I just know I am good so I am bouncing around theories. At least my theories are plausable...

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by Lathum

not implicating anyone.

I just know I am good so I am bouncing around theories. At least my theories are plausable...

Sure, if you name everyone surely you've gotta be right with something!

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I don't think I can, since I don't become a demon until the following night I don't think I would get the win.

Plus if I am decline the conversion I am believe I am told who attempted to convert me.

FWIW, I do not think I believe the details you are sharing about Cole. I struggle to believe that you could decline the conversion and be around the following day.

But that really does not matter - if you are Cole and have not been converted (and I do not see where this would have happened) then you are not the right person to kill today.

[Lathum]

Unvote Heinze
Vote Chubby

I dont feel great about it but I am gonna go back to my original line of thinking. I just dont trust Heinze as far as I can throw him, and I am a pretty strong guy.

[mccollins]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Mccollins, are you going to be able to play again one of these days?

Hopefully. I decided against playing in this one at the last minute because I'm in a game on TSW and I've just started moderating a game on another forum.

But, yeah, I've been reading along and miss you all.

Continue!

The Clap reminds me I'm playing in his game!

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Unvote Heinze
Vote Chubby

I dont feel great about it but I am gonna go back to my original line of thinking. I just dont trust Heinze as far as I can throw him, and I am a pretty strong guy.

In your defense, I'm no small man.

[Hannibal Lecter]

Originally Posted by mccollins

Hopefully. I decided against playing in this one at the last minute because I'm in a game on TSW and I've just started moderating a game on another forum.

But, yeah, I've been reading along and miss you all.

Continue!

The Clap reminds me I'm playing in his game!

Thats Dr. Lecter to you!

[The Jackal]

unvote lathum

vote chubby

I was already going to do this before hoops switched, I like what lathum laid out this morning, it makes sense.

[The Jackal]

Oh and no, I'm not Cole. Though I am as attractive as Julian McMahon.

[EagleFan]

As of post 439:

Chubby 3 - hoopsguy (445), Lathum (460), The Jackal (464)
The Jackal 1 - Chubby (416)

[jeheinz72]

I actually voted earlier, but it's moot anyhow. I'm with the group

Unvote Lathum
Vote Chubby

[hoopsguy]

There is a big part of me that is tempted to "Nightfall" this but I do think that Chubby deserves a chance to argue his case.

[EagleFan]

The day has been quiet. Everyone begins to wonder, is this nightmare almost over? Are we all about to be free? Yet there is odd tension in the air. Everyone can feel it, it feels like grief, anger and hatred all rolled into one tightly knit package.

It is easily dismissed as something caused by this unexplainable week which has left everyone both physically and emotionally exhausted. Fingers point around the room more than ever. No-one wants to be the next target, of the evil which lurks inside or the angry mob. You ponder your next move.

A scream echoes through the club. "No one gets out alive!!!"

The lights dim. Evil laughter fills the air. Though you can see little it is apparant that everyone has the same expression as you look around the room, a soulless, emotionless expression.

"Fools, all of you!!!"

Everyone drops to the ground, exhausted, a hollow shell. You struggle back to your feet and then you see it. The body of the bouncer now sways in the air, suspended from a beam in the ceiling by a rope.

You are too drained to even move.

Sparks, a flash of light, puffs of smoke fill the air making it too dense to breath, let alone see. You sink slowly back to the ground, now wishing for it all to be over. Your will to go on is almost entirely gone. You close your eyes...

Soon there is the sound of movement. Everyone slowly staggers back to their feet. Your eyes focus where you saw the bouncer but there is nothing. He is nowhere to be seen.

How can you escape this. There is one way, but that is the cowardly way. You must push on...

[EagleFan]

As of post 469:

Chubby 3 - hoopsguy (445), Lathum (460), The Jackal (464), jeheinz72 (467)
The Jackal 1 - Chubby (416)

[jeheinz72]

What's the plan for over the weekend? I might be able to hop on for a few minutes Sunday, but that'd be it.

[EagleFan]

The weekend will most likely be off, unless those remaining agree to have a cycle sometime over the weekend. I can arrange my schedule for weekend play around the players.

[hoopsguy]

I can certainly play over the weekend if others can ... assuming we are on, there will not be many players left.

I'm honestly trying to envision a scenario where we have a game still going over the weekend.
1.) There is one wolf, we do not get him, he converts Lathum = game over.
2.) There are two wolves, we do not get one, game way over.
3.) There is one wolf, we get him, game over.
4.) There are two wolves, we get one, the remaining one converts Lathum = game over.

Always fun playing games with incomplete information End result is usually me spinning my wheels, frequently in the wrong direction.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

So Chubby/Lathum - You are surmising that we had

8 villagers
2 wolves (Source and me as the cunning)
1 Cole (lathum)

That would mean we've got left

3 villagers (Chubby, Jackal, hoops)
1 Wolf (Me)
1 Cole (Lathum)

left, right?

Then let's make this easy Chubby, let's lynch Lathum. If he's telling the truth we'll know it and it'll be 2 villagers after the night kill and me going into tomorrow. You can lynch me and the village would win (they actually wouldn't since I'm not a wolf, but we'd pay out on whichever of Jackal/Hoops played a magnificent game)

If he's lying, well, then it's pretty clear that hoops version of events was accurate.

Catching up (just got home)

I don't know who is the other wolf (most likely cunning) but yes, I agree that lynching Lathum today is the villages best play. I'll post more when I catch up (in case someone already listed the scenarios so I don't repeat)

unvote The Jackal
Vote Lathum

[EagleFan]

I am an idiot!!!

I forgot entirely about previous plans tonight. I will probably be out from around 7 until 1-2 in the morning. I appologize whole heartedly about this.

Can we either run the deadline earlier or later? If 7:00 is okay with everyone I could do that (I can leave a little late). We could have the night phase right after the day phase with conditional night orders based upon the day results.

Would 7:00 be acceptable?

[Chubby]

Here's the scenarios as I see it:

We start with 3 wolves + cole (very unlikely) - The game is basically alreayd over regardless of who is lynched tonight. Villager/Cole goes down, it's 2-2 and game over. Wolf goes down, they convert Lathum and it's 2-2 game over.

We start with 3 wolves, no Cole (very unlikely) - I believed Lathum when he said he's Cole even before hoops swearing he knows Cole is in the game. We lynch a villager/Cole then it's over. We lynch a wolf then we keep playing.

We start with 2 wolves + Cole (very likely) - Obviously if we get the last wolf it's game over we win. If we lynch a villager (3 out of 5 left) then Lathum gets converted and it's 2-2 game over. I think this is where we are, not sure on who is the wolf.

[b]We start with 2 wolves and no Cole (very unlikely) - Even if you ignore logic and hoops vouching for Cole, why does Lathum claim Cole unless he's a wolf? It puts a target on his back.

Lathum coming out - Lathum wants to win the game, I think he thought he'd be safe from the villagers and if he survives the vote, gets converted to win with the wolves.

Based on the above, I think our best play is lynch Lathum today ensuring we're playing another day and go from there. With Cole lynched today, the wolves can't win today/tonight.

[Lathum]

I am fine for an early deadline.

An for those of you saying I will be converted tonight I am being honest that I believe I can make the choice.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I am fine for an early deadline.

An for those of you saying I will be converted tonight I am being honest that I believe I can make the choice.

So let's say you can choose, you would turn it down and give up an automatic win? I highly doubt that.

[jeheinz72]

I'm fine with an early deadline...since, I'm outta here until Sunday anyhow...

[hoopsguy]

Fine with early deadline as well.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Chubby

So let's say you can choose, you would turn it down and give up an automatic win? I highly doubt that.

I mentioned this before, my PM's have led me to believe I would be told the identity of my attacker, so I would get a win either way.

[hoopsguy]

OK, here is what I see right now:
1.) Hopefully EagleFan would not allow this day to drag out if we were mathematically eliminated (2 wolves + revealed Cole)
2.) If there is one wolf, and we miss then the ratio slides to 2-1-1 (villager/wolf/Cole) and we count on Lathum telling the truth about how his ability works to keep the game going. And we count on him to choose "villager"
3.) If there is one wolf and we get him right we win.

That pretty much cover it?

[EagleFan]

A few minutes to go. Going to start preparing the write up. Will slighly alter it if the vote changes between now and the time I finish it.

[EagleFan]

Sorry, typos on this laptop seem to be frequent.

[hoopsguy]

I would think about creating a tie today if there was someone around to help make that happen. That could potentially allow the Lathum situation to play out.

Oh well, hopefully we have our guy in Chubby.

[EagleFan]

deadline

[EagleFan]

The mob begins to form. "We need to end this tonight!!! It cannot be allowed to continue!!!" bellows hoopsguy. He points at Lathum and Chubby. Everyone glares in their direction.

Lathum shakes his head. "It's not me. I have a dark and evil secret. My name is Cole Turner and most know me as a lawyer."

"Bast@#d!!!" shouts hoopsguy. "My best fried is dead and his killer is free because of you! You must die!"

jeheinz72 calms hoops down "We must get out of here, we cannot proong this. Let's hear him out, but I am ready to see him die if he is responsible for this."

Lathum continues "I am half demon."

jeheinz72 grabs the knife which killed The Source and charges.

The Jackal stops him before he reaches Lathum. "Wait, we must hear him out. Why would he tell us this if he was responsible for this?"

"Because then he win!!!" decries hoopsguy.

"I did not do this. I fight against evil every day. I have powers, I can feel them. They are strong. Only once did I use them this week, I saved the waitress when she was attacked."

"But she is now dead!!!" another voice speaks up, it's Chubby. "She is dead and you are the only person among us who claims to have these abilities. The choice is easy."

"Chubby seems too willng." says hoops. "If we kill Chubby we will know where Lathum lies and if we have a chance to survive."

"I am voting we kill Chubby"

"I agree"

"I agree"

"I am okay with that."

"Wait, I'm not okay with that." says Chubby. "Look, here are reasons why it is not me. Here is why we must kill somene else. We must kill. We HAVE to KILL. EVERYONE MUST DIE!!!"

Then you notice Chubby looks different. It's not a man but a woman. Her face becomes clear and her attractive features slmost seem to calm everyone at first.

Chubby turns towards Lathum and he begins to glow red in pain as if burnign frothe inside. Then a flick of Lathum's hand snds Cubby flying across the room.

"I loved her!!!" screams Lathum. "You killed her!!! You must die!!!"

Fire begins to leap from Lathums palms. A fireball is hurled towrds Chubby. It's a direct hit. Chubby falls to the ground. "Noooooo!!!"

Lathum walk towards her with rage in his eyes. He extends his hands towards her and she lifts into the air. His hands begin a choking motion and she gasps for air. Soon the gasping stops. He throws her to the ground and one last fireball leaves only ash where she once was.

It's over. You have survived.

You turn towards Lathum still in shock. He kneels on the charred ground. "It's.... over" is all me can mutter.



Game over.... Innocents win.

[EagleFan]

I have to bolt out the door in a minute. I will post any major win conditions and results as well as any more details after I get back tonight. Post any questions what you may have.

I have a lot to say, and some to appologize for. I made a few rookie mistakes but I hope you had an anjoyable game. Any and all feedback would also be greatly appreciated.

[Danny]

Yay! Good job innocents

[Lathum]

WOOHOOO!!!

I thought it was a very good game EF!!

[The Jackal]

Nice.

[hoopsguy]

The one thing Chubby said that was correct was that we could kill Lathum today and come back around for the last wolf (him) tomorrow. Clearly that appealed to me based on my win conditions.

If the wolves only had Source + standard Demon (haven't looked at first page yet) that was potentially a pretty tough road. A lot depended on getting Lathum converted.

I do think this would have been pretty interesting with all the original roles in play.

Man, there were some bad villager voting patterns this game

[RendeR]

wooohooo, win win win win win GO GOOD GUYS!!!

[Hannibal Lecter]

I must say I liked the fact that all the wolves had the major condiion of being the only one left... that made for some interesting votes!

[hoopsguy]

Lathum, were you being honest about how the night attack would work? Or at least as far as you knew?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Lathum, were you being honest about how the night attack would work? Or at least as far as you knew?

yes I was

[The Jackal]

Question to hoops and heinze, who appear to be the other vanilla villagers, did you get EF's vanilla major victory condition also?

[hoopsguy]

Only victory condition I had, outside of "win with village" was "major victory: outlast Cole".

[Danny]

Chubby was actually Christy the cunning wolf.

[EagleFan]

Day two all vanilla villagers got a major victory condition. I will detail them more tomrrow morning. It's been a long day/night and I am a lot more tired than I anticipated. It was to add a little flavor.

In addition the wolves each had amajor wivtory condition of outlasting the other.

The Cole character had the most action. I was bugging the hell out of Lathum this game. He had several ways to be converted and several conditoins depending upon game circumstances.

Originally he could have been tempted by The Source to turn evil. He would have become a full fledged demon at that point with a condition of outlasting Christy for major victory.

He was also being tempted with chances to respond to situations. When he responded using his powers (saving the waitress) he was given his gretest temptation. Turn evil and become the next source.

Finally he could have been turned by an attack but would have been given a choice to die or turn at that point (originally).

When the Charmed One(s) got killed this activated his rage due to his connection to Phoebe. He was given an option then. Remain good, if he did this it would result in any night attack on him leading to the death of the demon. Or turn bad and he would have killed the demon who killed the Charmed One(s) that night and become the new Source.

My plan for a big game was that if Cole turned with The Source alive he would have received a condition of becoming the new Source by killing the current Source.

The Paige character was going to have a win condition similar to hoops in getting rid of Cole (she distrusted him in the show big time) as a major win condition if she became a Charmed one.


I probably didn't convey enough for people to try things on their own. I was hoping people would think outside of teh box based on some of the events that happened. There were crystals which fell to the floor after one NPC was killed and they could have been used by either side (different ability depending on who) if someone asked to pick them up. There was a knife (actually my mistake as it was supposed to be a dagger but I called it a knife first so I had to stay with it) which could also have been picked up and served a purpose. I added the use of that same knife to the write up of the Source being killed to highlight it and get people thinking that maybe it had something special about it to be able to kill The Source.


The clue that CR received contained a mistake on my part, for that I am very sorry. I was going to do a write up about the bartender earlier that day which would contain a few misleading clues. The intention of the CR bartender clue was to hopefully direct him towards that write up and a potential dead end. The DI was supposed to be the true clue (49). I had written up the bartender storyline while at work but I timed out when I submitted it so it never posted. Bad timing pulled me away from my desk and I forgot that I had never posted that write up until after I sent the PM to CR.


I tried to mute Leo's power by having there be a lot of chances to discover him. An attack on him which is survived became one of those ways. Once discovered he would be helpless the following night as he could not block an attack from a dark lighter.


Hopefully I didn't try to do too much with the game. I had a lot of that prepared for the larger game and had to cut a lot back but hope I didn't make it too unbalanced by not cutting out the right things.


What I really wanted to try was a couple of things. One being free thinking (people trying out various objects, maybe they are beneficial, maybe not). Having an ongoing story (the various NPC encounters), having a convert with the ability to have a say in things and having a struggle among the individuals on each side.