The 2013-2014 NFL Offseason/Coaching/Free Agency (non-draft) Thread

[albionmoonlight]

I agree with the sentiment in here that it will become a story because the media will demand that it become a story. Even if .1% of the universe of players, coaches, executives, etc. speaks out against Sam, that's who will get the airtime.

And, of course, if, somehow, the NFL people aren't giving you enough of a story, just go find some drunk fans of a rival team and film a quick bit about how hurtful/hateful they are being.

[albionmoonlight]

dola:

I imagine that the first really juicy anti-Sam statements by a "public figure" will be some narcissistic former player so desperate for attention that he will say something closed-minded and hurtful just so he can grab one more ESPN news cycle.

The odds-on favorite would have to be Terrell Owens, but I'd like to see what odds Vegas would give for Warren Sapp. I could see some value there.

[Logan]

And if it happens, that guy will get destroyed all over the media and on Twitter for his comments and he'll be apologizing within 48 hours. The likelihood of there being a second guy saying/doing something stupid is miniscule.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Logan

And if it happens, that guy will get destroyed all over the media and on Twitter for his comments and he'll be apologizing within 48 hours. The likelihood of there being a second guy saying/doing something stupid is miniscule.

Exactly. The outrage from the first idiot will be epic. The rest of the idiots will suddenly find the restraint to shut their mouths before they get compared to the ballplayers/fans who taunted Jackie Robinson.

[Logan]

I gotta say, having you continually agreeing with me is making me feel very uneasy about my thoughts on this entire situation.

[cartman]

But, as the whole Chick-Fil-A thing showed us, there will also be plenty of vocal defenders of the anti-Sam viewpoints.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Logan

I gotta say, having you continually agreeing with me is making me feel very uneasy about my thoughts on this entire situation.

Thankfully it wasn't a Kansas player

[molson]

Originally Posted by cartman

But, as the whole Chick-Fil-A thing showed us, there will also be plenty of vocal defenders of the anti-Sam viewpoints.

The Chick-Fil-A thing was about gay marriage, wasn't it? I think it's a leap from there to have the perspective that Sam either shouldn't exist at all, or shouldn't be allowed to play in the NFL. I don't think you're going to have major corporations speaking out against those things.

[cartman]

Not from a corporation, per se, but there will be lots of vocal support for the anti-Sam viewpoints. I was positioning this as a counter point to the posts that somehow the negativity is magically going to melt away once one anti-Sam statement is made.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by cartman

Not from a corporation, per se, but there will be lots of vocal support for the anti-Sam viewpoints. I was positioning this as a counter point to the posts that somehow the negativity is magically going to melt away once one anti-Sam statement is made.

My opinion only, but a private business owner having a viewpoint of a societal issue on his own (with no impact on how his business operates) is much easier to defend than whatever that hypothetical anti-Sam comment would be.

Hell, I didn't agree with that guy's stance but understand our country allows for him to have that stance.

If the viewpoints are "I feel weird being in a locker room or sharing a huddle with a gay guy", I don't see many real people (not anonymous Twitter people) saying "yeah, I can see where he's coming from". And anything beyond that "gay people shouldn't be playing in the NFL" would never be said.

[molson]

Originally Posted by cartman

Not from a corporation, per se, but there will be lots of vocal support for the anti-Sam viewpoints. I was positioning this as a counter point to the posts that somehow the negativity is magically going to melt away once one anti-Sam statement is made.

What are these viewpoints? That he should be banned from the nfl? I just don't see anyone above YouTube commenters saying that, let alone publicly.

[cartman]

Originally Posted by molson

What are these viewpoints? That he should be banned from the nfl? I just don't see anyone above YouTube commenters saying that, let alone publicly.

That's the point, they are the behinds the scenes whispers right now. As has been posted earlier, the on the record statements from NFL and team execs are much different than the off the record statements. Once a prominent person puts their name to a controversial statement (likely not as extreme as he should be banned from the NFL), I just don't see that as ending any further controversial public statements regarding the situation.

[CU Tiger]

Hmmm I'm trying to make a point here without someone mistakenly thinking my opinion is the one shining through. That disclaimer aside.

We have to remember the NFL as a subset of society is going to score considerably lower on the tolerance and diversity scale than your average walk of life. This is an arena where "fag" is still a common and ultimate insult. Machismo is in abundance. Look no further than the recently released MArtin and Incognito text messages and try to overlay that culture with and openly homosexual team mate...one who is already not accepted because he is a rookie coming in to take a vet's job. I think ultimately Sam is going to face internal ridicule, like it or not. The question will be whether he is mentally tough enough to endure and prove his worth.

I think the plight would be much less on an established vet coming out than it is on an unproven rookie.

[chadritt]

or maybe teams will have to institute a "No slurs in the workplace" policy.

[molson]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

This is an arena where "fag" is still a common and ultimate insult. Machismo is in abundance. Look no further than the recently released MArtin and Incognito text messages and try to overlay that culture with and openly homosexual team mate...one who is already not accepted because he is a rookie coming in to take a vet's job. I think ultimately Sam is going to face internal ridicule, like it or not. The question will be whether he is mentally tough enough to endure and prove his worth.

I think the plight would be much less on an established vet coming out than it is on an unproven rookie.

Originally Posted by cartman

That's the point, they are the behinds the scenes whispers right now. As has been posted earlier, the on the record statements from NFL and team execs are much different than the off the record statements. Once a prominent person puts their name to a controversial statement (likely not as extreme as he should be banned from the NFL), I just don't see that as ending any further controversial public statements regarding the situation.

But again, these predictions are always so vague. What are these "whispers"? What kind of "internal ridicule" are we talking about? What exactly do you see happening? Players cornering and beating up gay teammates in the locker room? Players signing petitions to ban gay players from the NFL? Gay players being bullied in changing into utility closets? Slashed tires? (Edit: I could see public talk of distraction and opposition to gay marriage, but I don't feel like that's the kind of thing you're talking about).

I think any of that would blow up so fast with a media-obsessed issue like this. There would be suspensions, and sponsors dropping guys.

And I'm not so sure NFL players are throwing homosexual slurs around so commonly now. One player yesterday (wish I could remember who), said he never heard those slurs in the NFL. That could just be because he was a guy who was generally tolerant so people didn't say stuff around him, but that's kind of the point.

I sometimes read about NFL players being annoyed by this general perception that they're all intolerant cavemen, and I get it. They may not be the smartest guys as a group, but they're also younger, spent a lot of time on liberal college campuses, and grew up in a world where homosexuality was not that big a deal. Homosexual relationships were already regularly portrayed on network TV and movies when these guys were kids, which was not the case the generation before. I say give these guys a chance before deciding that they're intolerant as a group and are going to haze and punish this kid.

Edit: I don't know how comparable it is but there was a WWE wrestler who came out a while back. The company did press releases galore, TMZ was all over it for a day or two, and then, nobody cared - the fans, media, or his co-workers. That's not close to the same scale of media covering the NFL obviously, but I think maybe it would be stretched out only a little while longer there before the media got over it. I really don't think it would matter to any but small pockets of players, and most of those would be smart enough to keep their mouth shut, and maybe one or two make a twitter comment that gets them fined.

It's really too bad though, that the gay community never had a Jackie Robinson in sports. Nobody ever stepped up. It would have been something incredibly courageous for a gay player to come out in 1988 or something. I think maybe that would approach what Robinson went through, and the courage he had. It still means something to be first, I guess, but not as much as it would have meant then.

[Thomkal]

Interesting story about Michael Sam's upbringing, especially what his father thinks about gays being in the NFL.

Log In - The New York Times

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Interesting story about Michael Sam's upbringing, especially what his father thinks about gays being in the NFL.

Log In - The New York Times

So the son who didn't end up in jail, or dead while attempting to break into a home, is the son he can't accept? Great guy.

[NobodyHere]

“I’m old school,” he(Sam Sr.) added. “I’m a man-and-a-woman type of guy.” As evidence, he pointed out that he had taken an older son to Mexico to lose his virginity.

Great guy indeed.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

So the son who didn't end up in jail, or dead while attempting to break into a home, is the son he can't accept? Great guy.

Yeah, Dad made it pretty clear why he was looking for acceptance heading into college with his comments. Very thankful he found it at Mizzou. Amazing that Sam succeeded given the circumstances.

[flounder]

Originally Posted by chadritt

or maybe teams will have to institute a "No slurs in the workplace" policy.

That's just crazy talk.

[Lathum]

Solid marketing move for a guy about to hit free agency

Giants cornerback Terrell Thomas says NFL isn't ready for Michael Sam | NJ.com

[Kodos]

It was just a matter of who would start saying dumb things first. Congrats, Terrell.

[Logan]

How Sports Illustrated Botched The Michael Sam Story

[Galaxy]

Texas Sports Anchor Delivers Jaw-Dropping Speech On Gay NFL Players (UPDATE) (In a positive way.)

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Solid marketing move for a guy about to hit free agency

Giants cornerback Terrell Thomas says NFL isn't ready for Michael Sam | NJ.com

Funny....I actually think the Giants will draft him if available in the 3rd. Maybe 2nd depending on JPP's health/outlook.

[Matthean]

Lions dump Louis Delmas, too | ProFootballTalk

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by SteveMax58

Funny....I actually think the Giants will draft him if available in the 3rd. Maybe 2nd depending on JPP's health/outlook.

What I have read of him so far, he seems to be a bit of a tweener, and even a third would be a reach. More like a fourth rounder as a pass rush specialist. A second rounder would be ridiculously high.

And that's aside from any lockerroom/team perception/media impact concerns.

[M GO BLUE!!!]

Just had a thought... Will Michael Sam be invited to attend the draft?

I think it would be a mistake to invite a guy who will likely be picked anywhere from rounds 3-6, but with all the hubbub surrounding this guy I could actually see it. (The world needs to back off & let him prove himself as a football player.)

[chadritt]

I would hope not, unless they have VERY good reason to think someones picking him in the first round. Thats just bad news waiting to happen if they have to keep showing him waiting. Also I would hope he would be aware enough to say no if invited.

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

What I have read of him so far, he seems to be a bit of a tweener, and even a third would be a reach. More like a fourth rounder as a pass rush specialist. A second rounder would be ridiculously high.

And that's aside from any lockerroom/team perception/media impact concerns.

Yeah I don't know how many great prospects passrushers there look to be in this draft aside from Clowney who is definitely not around by the Giants' pick.

But they need to restock the passrush depth & while he might be slightly undersized, he may be able to help as a nice situational rusher from what I see (or throw him as a SLB/nickel DE). I like those kinds of LBs that can also be a 4-3 DE in passing situations.

[stevew]

Originally Posted by Matthean

Lions dump Louis Delmas, too | ProFootballTalk

Amazing how bad their cap is. Seems like a hopeless overpay of Suh has to happen. That old cap was horrible, can't believe he counts at 22m. That's like twice as much as he roughly should be worth.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by stevew

Amazing how bad their cap is. Seems like a hopeless overpay of Suh has to happen. That old cap was horrible, can't believe he counts at 22m. That's like twice as much as he roughly should be worth.

I don't understand that part. I get that Suh/Stafford/Megatron were picked under the old system, so their rookie contracts were much higher than their more recent counterparts. I don't understand why their 2nd contract needs to be based on that 1st one or why everyone treats it as an accepted reality that it will be true going forward for their contracts. Is Andrew Luck going to ask for less than Sam Bradford because he made less his 1st 4 years?

[M GO BLUE!!!]

Think how much worse it would be if Cliff "What's A Running Play?" Avril had taken that contract he thought he was better than.

[stevew]

He'd have 1 less Super Bowl ring.

[stevew]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

I don't understand that part. I get that Suh/Stafford/Megatron were picked under the old system, so their rookie contracts were much higher than their more recent counterparts. I don't understand why their 2nd contract needs to be based on that 1st one or why everyone treats it as an accepted reality that it will be true going forward for their contracts. Is Andrew Luck going to ask for less than Sam Bradford because he made less his 1st 4 years?

I know it makes like no sense. Best thing I can figure is Suh would cost 26ish and 31ish to franchise so if you want a multiyear deal that drops his cap this year you're going to be paying him out the ass or you're cutting him. He knows a new 6 year is going to get him about 72-90m with 30-40m in guarantees so he's not going to move off his demand.

Or in short, Washington looms over everything with cap room, I guess

[Matthean]

If I were them, I would pick which of the three is most expendable and dump them via trade or whatever. Trying to keep all three and managing the cap is simply going to be too much for that team even with the right coaching staff. They had a very small window and I'm afraid it passed them.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by stevew

I know it makes like no sense. Best thing I can figure is Suh would cost 26ish and 31ish to franchise so if you want a multiyear deal that drops his cap this year you're going to be paying him out the ass or you're cutting him. He knows a new 6 year is going to get him about 72-90m with 30-40m in guarantees so he's not going to move off his demand.

Or in short, Washington looms over everything with cap room, I guess

Yeah, I'm not calling you out - I see even the less dogmatic NFL writers like Bill Barnwell talk about it like there's no alternative, like the player bases whether he accepts that 2nd contract on how much of a raise it is from his initial contract and not the total dollars compared to other players at his position.

[JPhillips]

Just saw that my next door neighbor growing up is the driver for one of the MRI machines at the NFL Combine in Indy.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Marino & Sharpe both out, Gonzalez in

Gonzalez named analyst for CBS Sports | www.ajc.com

[Kodos]

Neither one of them added much.

[stevew]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Marino & Sharpe both out, Gonzalez in

Gonzalez named analyst for CBS Sports | www.ajc.com

thank the lord.

[frnk55]

Now I can watch CBS pregame show on Sundays. I couldn't stand Shannon Sharp the way he talked. Really annoying.

What was the reason? Anyone know?

[Buccaneer]

Ok, I am now really pissed. The Buccaneers are changing their logo and helmet this. They already have the best logo in all of sports and they feel the need to change it?!?

[stevew]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Ok, I am now really pissed. The Buccaneers are changing their logo and helmet this. They already have the best logo in all of sports and they feel the need to change it?!?

I think their Pewter helmets and jersey scheme is top 5 in the league. I wouldn't mind a return to the pirate with a knife in his mouth though.

[Dutch]

Buccaneers to reveal redesigned logo,*helmet | SI Wire

Hmmm, I wonder, Sapp and McCoy will unveil some "slight" uniform tweaks and a new helmet and logo for the Bucs on Thursday. Same color scheme though. The Helmet will feature a chrome grille. No further information.

[Dutch]

Wow, looks like we all are on the same page here.

I think there is room for improvement, so I can withhold judgment until after the unveiling.

[Buccaneer]

Chrome grill can only bring to mind the horrors of Oregon and Nike college helmets.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Chrome grill can only bring to mind the horrors of Oregon and Nike college helmets.

To be fair, those are Chrome Helmets, not grilles.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by Mike D

To be fair, those are Chrome Helmets, not grilles.

Not entirely true.

[stevew]

Originally Posted by frnk55

Now I can watch CBS pregame show on Sundays. I couldn't stand Shannon Sharp the way he talked. Really annoying.

What was the reason? Anyone know?

I'd like to think it was cause he was unintelligible. His brother is much more talented orator.