The Official NBA 2016 Offseason Thread

[nol]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

Simmons to lead all rookies in assists and turnovers.

And rebounds too. For that reason, he's the surefire Rookie of the Year unless Joel Embiid is incredibly dominant in limited minutes.

Originally Posted by stevew

Just saw this somewhere. The 16th-30th picks will only have 2 years of their rookie deal guaranteed and their team has options on years 3 and 4 and can make them a restricted free agent after year 4.

This guy got a much better deal than the current bogus slotting system.

And yet it was seen as exploitative when Philadelphia offered a million a year to 2nd round/undrafted players. I mean, Deyonta Davis was seen as a top-10/lottery pick before he fell, and that deal he signed is for all intents and purposes the 'Hinkie Special' with one fewer year. That makes me wonder if he has some undisclosed health issue that makes him want to get more guaranteed money rather than hit the market sooner.

[Logan]

Draymond Green got arrested for assault in Michigan.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Damn it. I'll wait until this is substantiated, but it's getting harder to root for this guy.

[Kodos]

Face it. He's an asshole.

[wustin]

The person he assaulted was also probably an asshole.

[wustin]

Also I wouldn't be surprised if he gets kicked off the Olympics team because of this.

[nol]

The bail was $200, so it must have been a most heinous offense.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by nol

The bail was $200, so it must have been a most heinous offense.

Non-aggravated assault is a misdemeanor in that jurisdiction.

[wustin]

Green is scheduled for arraignment on July 20. If convicted, he would face a maximum of 93 days in jail and a $500 fine.

lol

Draymond Green of Golden State Warriors arrested on assault charges in Michigan

[whomario]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I half expected him to simply not show up on the first day of camp after only telling Pop and Pop being like "wait you guys, i didn´t tell you ? Sorry about that, really i swear !"

[HomerSimpson98]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

And so goes the last reason for me to watch the NBA for the foreseeable future. Great player, better person. No farewell tours, just the same way the dude came in day in and day out and did his job. Its been a pleasure Tim

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Unless he somehow faked a passport when he was around 10 he's 19 as they've said all along.

Not faked a passport, but the passports aren't terribly accurate when the information comes from a country like Sudan.

If you believe the passport age is accurate, you have to believe he was starting up high school at 9 years old. That after going through 4 years of high school in Australia, he came to the US, started back in 8th grade and went through it again.

[TCY Junkie]

Originally Posted by HomerSimpson98

And so goes the last reason for me to watch the NBA for the foreseeable future. Great player, better person. No farewell tours, just the same way the dude came in day in and day out and did his job. Its been a pleasure Tim

I have been watching Duncan since freshman at wake. I liked that woods guy the year before so I tuned into see him. Did not take long for me to jump on the Duncan bandwagon. The last few years only reason I watched nba. When he played on 12 minutes and 14 minutes in games 2 and 3, even up 2-1 I was sad. Knew Duncan would not be back most likely.

[TCY Junkie]

I was dave and busters with my nephew in SA. It was about 5 years. Duncan had his worst year ever. I remember seeing him get out of a car racing machine with his kids. His limp was terrible. Understood why he did bad that year and surprised he made some resurgence. Was impressed.

[nol]

Draymond is probably going to need a change of venue to get a fair trial.

Bailiff: "Please rise Mr. Green, the honorable Richard D. Ball presiding" Draymond: "Oh fuck this shit." pic.twitter.com/12NNZucUav

— Terry (@TheBossManTerry) July 11, 2016

[Atocep]

So some random guy in East Lansing got kicked in the nuts?

[Groundhog]

I read that he slapped a fan that heckled him in a club? Sounds pretty minor... obviously a bonehead move, but I'd imagine the fan was being a complete douche, too.

[Groundhog]

Just as expected, so good to see Duncan ride off into the sunset like he did, rather than that Kobe farce this past season.

[Brian Swartz]

It was time for Duncan to go, sad as it is. Two years ago he was still a major factor, last year not so much. I could do without his bug-eyed whining to the refs but was/am a big fan of everything else he did pretty much.

Also, I thought this was great:

[RainMaker]

The Onion always had great Duncan stories.

http://www.theonion.com/search?q=Tim+Duncan

[albionmoonlight]

Which guy would be happier if the NBA told them that Duncan does not have to speak at all, and in exchange Kobe gets to speak twice?

[MrBug708]

Duncan. Kobe isn't really a great interview

[Groundhog]

Juan Hernangomez looks like a decent pick up for Denver so far.

Secretly rooting for Jarrod Uthoff to make it as an undrafted free agent. His relative (third cousin) was a pro player down in Australia for years, and a school visit by him nearly 30 years ago is the whole reason why I got into basketball in the first place.

[Brian Swartz]

I wasn't so much a Spurs fan as a David Robinson fan growing up, but Duncan made sure I stayed one after the Admiral left, that's for certain. I remember what Barkley after his stint in summer league ... "I have seen the future, and he wears #21". Thought it was typical Sir Charles overblown hyperbole at the time, and it might have been but he more or less lived up to it.

All-Time:

** More wins than I forget how many franchises have still.
** 10th in minutes played
** 6th in rebounds
** 5th in blocks
** 14th in points

I said after the 2014 championship that I was ok with Duncan never winning another game, and never really changed my mind. Nothing could ever have topped finishing off that year that way, even though It was disappointing a bit the way they lost the last couple years. No reason for TD to hang around anymore though. It was one heck of a ride.

[Atocep]

Duncan is the best Power Forward to ever play. Probably the 2nd best player behind Shaq from this generation (and that's debatable).

I didn't like him, but he went about things the right way.

[korme]

He's above Shaq.

[Groundhog]

It's a tough call, IMO. Duncan was obviously more skilled, but during the 90s Shaq was one of the most destructive forces we've seen offensively. I'd give it to Duncan, but I think Shaq's decline makes people forget how good he was for quite a long period of time.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by korme

He's above Shaq.

Comes down to peak or longevity. Shaq's peak was definitely better.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Comes down to peak or longevity. Shaq's peak was definitely better.

Yeah, I didn't even think this was actually a question.

[wustin]

I think Shaq is better than Duncan. Guy was unguardable and was a big reason why the NBA was so slow paced during the late 90s/early 2000s.

[VPI97]

All these years and this is the first time I've seen Duncan & the Spurs in the HEB commercials.

[nol]

Shaq's 1999-00 was the best season either of the two had, but looking at a year like 2002 it's hard to say their peaks were too far off.

It's easy to think of the Spurs as being this well-oiled offensive machine, but back then they were still a somewhat ugly, grind-it-out defensive team with David Robinson rapidly fading out of the picture. The Spurs lost to the Lakers in the series that had Derek Fisher's 0.4 second shot, and a rookie Tony Parker was the Spurs' second-leading scorer at just under 14 points a game and 40% shooting.

In that series, Duncan averaged 29 points, 17 rebounds, 4.6 assists, and 3.2 blocks to Shaq's 21.4, 12.2, 3.2, and 3.

You can compare what they did through age 28, 30, or whenever you deem Shaq to have fallen off, and in that timeframe you'll find that the two were quite similar overall, just with Duncan being 40-60 offense to defense with Shaq being 60-40.

[stevew]

Eh, i think Shaq and Duncan were both so good that either way you go you would win titles galore. I do think Shaq only getting 4(I think) is a bit low for a player that was simply so much larger than anyone he faced. Shaq was also pretty injury prone and a bit more conditioning seemingly could have prevented it.

[nol]

Yeah, just interesting that in the Lakers' three-peat years Shaq was certainly carrying Kobe and the rest of the Lakers as a whole, but against the Spurs Duncan was able to cancel him out and Kobe ended up being the difference-maker.

Speaking of the Lakers, D'Angelo Russell is probably going to be out for the rest of the summer league on account of being too good relative to the competition, so it will be interesting to see what Ingram can do when force-fed some more shots.

[korme]

Tim's annual per-36 stats are one of the most amazing sports things I have ever seen. pic.twitter.com/cXFBrXWXLx

— Andy Glockner (@AndyGlockner) July 11, 2016

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

I wasn't so much a Spurs fan as a David Robinson fan growing up

Random but I walked past Robinson on the street in NYC yesterday. Quite tall.

[wustin]

Person Draymond slapped (I can't believe slapping is technically considered assault) is a scholarship football player from MSU. We all know Draymond donated 3 million bucks to his alma mater last year...the "victim" is seeking to drop charges. Either he didn't want Draymond to get arrested (and the cops wanted to arrest someone) or I bet he got pressured the heck out of by his school.

[korme]

Originally Posted by wustin

I think Shaq is better than Duncan. Guy was unguardable and was a big reason why the NBA was so slow paced during the late 90s/early 2000s.

He may have been more dominant at his peak, and you can certainly put together a better highlight reel. He even could have had the league on a string for much longer than he did, but he didn't dedicate himself to the game and as a result I cannot rank him higher than Duncan. People forget that Duncan was excellent on both ends of the floor.

SHAQ
4x Champion
1x MVP
3x Finals MVP
15x All-Star
14x All-NBA
3x All-Defense

TIMMY
5x Champion
2x MVP
3x Finals MVP
15x All-Star
15x All-NBA
15x All-Defense

[korme]

Rule change:

The current rule for away-from-the-play fouls applicable to the last two minutes of the fourth period (and last two minutes of any overtime) – pursuant to which the fouled team is awarded one free throw and retains possession of the ball – will be extended to the last two minutes of each period.

[whomario]

Kind a weird to "change it but not really change it". It´s basically saying that it´s wrong, just not all the time ? I suppose it might be less of an issue with teams not in the penalty early in quarters, but on the other hand it only needs one coach to say "screw it, let´s get into the penalty early"

Timberwolves sign Jordan Hill to an 8 mio/2 years deal. Another decent pickup with little risk involved for them ... Might be a nod towards KG retiring ?

[korme]

Let us not forget last year when JB Bickerstaff had his Rockets foul Andre Drummond 12 times in a row to open the 3rd quarter

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by korme

Rule change:

A sad joke.

It's akin to MLB ordering people to no longer throw curve balls to people that can't hit them.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

It's akin to MLB ordering people to no longer throw curve balls to people that can't hit them.

I think it would much closer to MLB banning defensive shifts.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I think it would much closer to MLB banning defensive shifts.

Which would also be idiotic.

I figure the next brilliant move from the league will involve the banning of shot blocking since height shouldn't be used to discriminate against those who can't elevate as well as others.

[albionmoonlight]

I can see both sides of it.

The NBA is in an entertainment business. And Hack-a-Shaq is not entertaining. So ban it.

On the other hand, free throw shooting is a basic skill, and if a player chooses not to (or cannot) develop it, he and his team should pay a penalty for that choice. Changing the rules every time something happens to slow down the game is an overreaaction

[whomario]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

A sad joke.

It's akin to MLB ordering people to no longer throw curve balls to people that can't hit them.

These kinds of wrong analogies are thrown out every time it seems ... I´ll try to argue here once more.

Actually the analogy of this "tactic" would be if the MLB allowed the opposing team to force people to throw curve balls whenever it suits them. If the other teams pitcher isn´t particularly good at them, for example.

Or if an NFL team could force the other team to pass even though their QB kinda sucks and their RB is awesome. Yes, they can influence it with their defensive formation (and the score dictates it as well), but the other team can still decide what they want to do.

An NBA analogy for this tactic would be a magic button forcing a bad shooter to shoot a 3, a bad passer to pass the ball instead of going to the basket or the other teams worst defender to guard you star scorer. Again, you can try to figuratively "force" these things, but you can not literally force them. That you can only (!) do with FTs and bad FT shooters. Which somehow seems logical, why exactly ?

There is not a single sport where an off-the-ball foul (if noticed by the referee) benefits the offending team this massively.

They could (and should be able to) still decide to foul a Drummond when he tries to score, but they should not have a metaphorical magic button to force him to shoot a FT whenever it suits them. Unless, for fairness sakes, on the next posession the Pistons get a magic button moment allowing them to make sure that a weak passer has to pass off a drive or a weak 3 point shooter has to shoot from deep or a guard has to absolutely try a hook shot.

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

On the other hand, free throw shooting is a basic skill, and if a player chooses not to (or cannot) develop it, he and his team should pay a penalty for that choice.

But there would be a penalty to it. The other team can still play him more aggressively than a good FT shooter. Just like they can leave a bad 3 point or midrange shooter to double team or close out harder than usual on a guy who can´t dribble or pass the ball very well (which isn´t any less basic a skill than FT shooting, is it ?).
But it would not be penalized in such a singular fashion and in fact reward a team for breaking the rules by fouling. Again, the Pistons are still going to have to live with the fact that Drummond can´t hit his FTs when fouled while trying to score. They would still be a better team and Drummond a better player if he could hit FTs. It just would not be a magic button anymore, that doesn´t exist as a "tactic" against any other of the myriad of weaknesses spread out amongst other NBA player.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I can see both sides of it.

The NBA is in an entertainment business. And Hack-a-Shaq is not entertaining. So ban it.

On the other hand, free throw shooting is a basic skill, and if a player chooses not to (or cannot) develop it, he and his team should pay a penalty for that choice. Changing the rules every time something happens to slow down the game is an overreaaction

I'd be more upset if we weren't talking about non-basketball plays. Intentionally fouling someone that doesn't have the ball isn't a basketball play and shouldn't be beneficial to the defense. At lower levels of play this is typically 2 shots plus the ball out of bounds.

If you want a guy to shoot free throws you should foul him while he has the ball. Then he has to shoot his free throws and the league shouldn't do a damn thing to change that fact.

[cartman]

A better baseball analogy would be the pitcher throwing into the dugout to hit a bad batter and making him take over the at bat.

[nol]

Originally Posted by whomario

Kind a weird to "change it but not really change it". It´s basically saying that it´s wrong, just not all the time ? I suppose it might be less of an issue with teams not in the penalty early in quarters, but on the other hand it only needs one coach to say "screw it, let´s get into the penalty early"

It only needs one coach to get his butt kicked by using a worse version of a strategy that is already not particularly effective against the two worst free throw shooters in the NBA. The only changes that will result from this will be teams not intentionally fouling to get a 2-for-1 or 3-for-2 at the end of quarters and that every inbounds play at the end of a close game will be a bloodbath because no referee is going to want to call an off-ball foul that would give the win to the inbounding team.

[JonInMiddleGA]

{shakes head} At this point, it just makes me hope that guys who need this sort of absurd coddling from the league get a CEI sooner than later. If they're inept enough at a basic skill that the strategy makes sense to employ then I probably don't give a rat's ass to see them on the floor anyway.