NFL "Teams Behaving Badly" Thread: 2015

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by TroyF

As for Boomer and the other idiots who seem to think it's ok to be violent over money. . . I guess there is nothing to say to them.

Probably not, 'cause I can think of only a relatively small handful of reasons better than that.

[CU Tiger]

Uhhh...the NFL isnt the game for you TroyF.

that thinking doesnt work in pro football

FWIW not paying a debt = stealing


Stealing=...a punch to the face being the best possible scenario...

[Solecismic]

If that mentality were true, the Jets would have one more linebacker and one less quarterback on the roster today.

There's a good way to get your money back without sucker punching someone. Now this guy is definitely out his $600, and it's possible he may never get another decent chance to stick on a roster and get that nice $510k minimum salary.

But it's also a good sign that Geno isn't that much of a leader. Leaders don't let a $600 plane ticket (and we don't know all the details here) create a rift where someone on the roster wants to break your face.

You're going to need everyone with you if you're one year away from your contract year and your first big contract, you've pretty much stunk up the league your first two seasons, and this is your last real shot.

I'm with Bowles on this one. Though he's probably wishing he had remained in Arizona right about now.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

Now this guy is definitely out his $600

You think? I'd lean toward him getting paid tbh, based on the scant info we have to work with.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

But it's also a good sign that Geno isn't that much of a leader. Leaders don't let a $600 plane ticket (and we don't know all the details here) create a rift where someone on the roster wants to break your face.

Yeah, this. Carter got lit up for saying this on ESPN but I tend to agree with you here. I'd go even further, I don't think a second year scrub even dares to step to the QB of a team if he's got the support of the entire locker room. And I haven't exactly been overwhelmed with the public messages of support for Geno since this happened either. Wouldn't be surprised if there's more to come out on this one.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

Uhhh...the NFL isnt the game for you TroyF.

that thinking doesnt work in pro football

FWIW not paying a debt = stealing


Stealing=...a punch to the face being the best possible scenario...

Please, just stop. I am 100 percent certain there have been hundreds of disputes about money in the time I have watched football. There have only been a handful of cases where a player has ended a career. Most of those cases had nothing to do with money.

All NFL players are not neanderthals that do not understand the law.

As for Jims point, I agree with. It as wellwell check

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

Uhhh...the NFL isnt the game for you TroyF.

that thinking doesnt work in pro football

FWIW not paying a debt = stealing


Stealing=...a punch to the face being the best possible scenario...

One other thing here: You really think a punch to the face is the best case scenario for someone not paying back a debt?

How so exactly? Are you saying a small claims court civil suit is worse than a punch to the face? Because while we all consider it to be a Douche Bag thing to do, the court system does not consider it stealing. It is considered a civil matter and would be dealt with in civil court.

The idiot who did this ruined his career and lost over 400,000 dollars by his actions. He will probably lose more because the Jets insurance will almost surely subrogate against him and win.

Gene Smith should have paid back the debt right away. He should have did the right thing. Under no circumstances should he have had a cheap shot thrown at him for his screw up. I would venture to guess everyone on the board has loaned out 50 bucks at some point in their lives and been stiffed on it.

I would venture to guess not many have broken someone's jaw over it.

[Suicane75]

I once beat a man to death for wearing too many of my socks.

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

I once beat a man to death for wearing too many of my socks.

I need to know what number you consider 'too many' before I can decide if you handled things properly.

[Suicane75]

Five. All the slack I cut that man.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

Five. All the slack I cut that man.

Five pairs or five individual socks? This is a matter of life and death, so the distinction is important.

[JPhillips]

It's six hundred bucks. IK shouldn't have asked, but Geno should have paid. They've both just pissed away a lot more money than the original amount.

If the story of the camp plane fare is correct, this is even more stupid. IK has to have somebody running the business side of the camp, so let that person handle it through Geno's people. Was there a contract for the camp? If not IK just learned a valuable business lesson.

They both handled it like college kids paying for a keg rather than an adult business relationship and it will cost both of them much more than six hundred dollars.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by TroyF

One other thing here: You really think a punch to the face is the best case scenario for someone not paying back a debt?

How so exactly? Are you saying a small claims court civil suit is worse than a punch to the face? Because while we all consider it to be a Douche Bag thing to do, the court system does not consider it stealing. It is considered a civil matter and would be dealt with in civil court.

The idiot who did this ruined his career and lost over 400,000 dollars by his actions. He will probably lose more because the Jets insurance will almost surely subrogate against him and win.

Gene Smith should have paid back the debt right away. He should have did the right thing. Under no circumstances should he have had a cheap shot thrown at him for his screw up. I would venture to guess everyone on the board has loaned out 50 bucks at some point in their lives and been stiffed on it.

I would venture to guess not many have broken someone's jaw over it.

Boomer wasn't saying he should have been punched for owing $600. But using a realistic scenario for the world these guys live in, that could very well happen. I heard him tell a story earlier about Sam Wyche banning card games for money on plane rides because players were fighting over $50 a couple hours after a big win.

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

Five pairs or five individual socks? This is a matter of life and death, so the distinction is important.

Five individual. Once the third sock went on the left foot (he was left footed), it was just a spit in the face.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Logan

Boomer wasn't saying he should have been punched for owing $600. But using a realistic scenario for the world these guys live in, that could very well happen. I heard him tell a story earlier about Sam Wyche banning card games for money on plane rides because players were fighting over $50 a couple hours after a big win.

This. I don't think anyone is saying he should have punched Geno. I am one of those that wonder about how "sucker punch" is defined in this scenario. There are some that are saying that they were in a face to face confrontation when the punch was thrown. Leaving that aside, I have always heard from players that owing another player money is a significant faux pas in sports. Usually this comes from players not paying their gambling debts, but I could see this being the case here.

I think this started off being about $600. Once both players got face to face and words were exchanged, I think it then became about 24 year old men preserving pride and showing they were not going to be "punked."

[Logan]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

I am one of those that wonder about how "sucker punch" is defined in this scenario.

Bowles was the one who used that term first, and he wasn't even there when it happened.

[Ben E Lou]

I suspect that "sucker punch" means "we cut the marginal player and we're keeping the QB, so we'd like to try to make it look like the marginal player is the only bad guy in this story."

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

I suspect that "sucker punch" means "we cut the marginal player and we're keeping the QB, so we'd like to try to make it look like the marginal player is the only bad guy in this story."

And that our QB only got knocked out by a "sucker punch."

[HomerSimpson98]

Surely there are some good fantasy football names to come off this right?

Geno Glass Jaw?
The Sucker Punchers?
For 600 Bucks I'll Punch Out Tom Brady?
IK TKO Round 1?

Come on FOFC

[cartman]

What sound can Geno Smith make after getting his jaw broken? Pflugerville

[BillJasper]

If Smith makes it to the field this year, every defender will be threatening to break his jaw.

[Logan]

Bills (Rex) picked up the sucker puncher.

Amazing.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Logan

Bills (Rex) picked up the sucker puncher.

Amazing.

Actually, the fact Rex is involved, it makes complete sense in a Rexian-way.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Logan

Bills (Rex) picked up the sucker puncher.

Amazing.

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by Logan

Bills (Rex) picked up the sucker puncher.

Amazing.

Doesn't surprise me. Rex was there when he was drafted.

[miami_fan]

So does Rex make IK the special team captain for the week 10 game against the Jets?

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

So does Rex make IK the special team captain for the week 10 game against the Jets?

I'm not so sure Geno Smith is on the roster if Fitzpatrick and Petty do a halfway decent job in Training Camp.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Logan

Bills (Rex) picked up the sucker puncher.

Amazing.

Will Goodell throw down any punishment? If this happened 50 yds away it would certainly be a suspension.

[NobodyHere]

Well Brady is definitely guilty.

I mean who can seriously trust that face?

[Draft Dodger]

who wears a baseball cap to court?

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by TroyF

One other thing here: You really think a punch to the face is the best case scenario for someone not paying back a debt?

How so exactly? Are you saying a small claims court civil suit is worse than a punch to the face? Because while we all consider it to be a Douche Bag thing to do, the court system does not consider it stealing. It is considered a civil matter and would be dealt with in civil court.

The idiot who did this ruined his career and lost over 400,000 dollars by his actions. He will probably lose more because the Jets insurance will almost surely subrogate against him and win.

Gene Smith should have paid back the debt right away. He should have did the right thing. Under no circumstances should he have had a cheap shot thrown at him for his screw up. I would venture to guess everyone on the board has loaned out 50 bucks at some point in their lives and been stiffed on it.

I would venture to guess not many have broken someone's jaw over it.

I'm not saying it's "right" or it's how I would handle it or even how it should be handled.
What I'm saying is in the machismo world that is the NFL, if you go around stiffing people out of money a single punch to the face is much less than what "could" happen.

I know a certain Carolina Panthers retired offensive lineman who didnt pay up a card debt to a certain wr who is now in Baltimore. Inexplicably the OL's car (brand new BMW 760li) was stolen from his home while the team was on a road game and found burned out...the player was "dared" to report it to the police.

I think a lot of people think that the NFL is full of choir boys or regular white collar dudes. I'd submit Aaron Hernandez is closer to the median than Peyton Manning.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Draft Dodger

who wears a baseball cap to court?

Im sorry, was I not supposed to?

[bhlloy]

So yeah, given the reactions from the locker room that continue to come out, along with the lukewarm reaction from the head coach, I wouldn't be surprised if Geno has played his last snap for the Jets

[SirFozzie]

Deflate-gate judge hammers NFL's case against Tom Brady; 'Your Honor is spot-on,' defense crows - Yahoo Sports

Wow. Optimisim is still rising. even if you think Brady is guilty at this point, you have to wonder if this was handled fairly. But if I had to put a percentage down on Brady playing week 1? I'd say 80%. I've seen analysis by sports lawyers that puts it higher, but I'll take those odds.

[Julio Riddols]

I'd kinda like to see the NFL get their asses handed to them.

[SirFozzie]

As the resident Pats fan and late night person, I bring this up, because well, I'm probably the only one who noticed it. Way to yell out false accusations ESPN, and then whisper the "oops, my bad". Say the pats filmed Super Bowl practices (proven false) during prime viewing programs, admit that no such thing ever happened.. at 12:20 AM

ESPN Apologizes To Patriots For Sharing False Spygate Story « CBS Boston

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Deflate-gate judge hammers NFL's case against Tom Brady; 'Your Honor is spot-on,' defense crows - Yahoo Sports

Wow. Optimisim is still rising. even if you think Brady is guilty at this point, you have to wonder if this was handled fairly. But if I had to put a percentage down on Brady playing week 1? I'd say 80%. I've seen analysis by sports lawyers that puts it higher, but I'll take those odds.

Molson can back me up on this. Few feelings are better as a lawyer than having the judge make your case for you when he addresses opposing counsel.

[Kodos]

Yep. Not looking good for the NFL.

[molson]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Molson can back me up on this. Few feelings are better as a lawyer than having the judge make your case for you when he addresses opposing counsel.

Ya, it's interesting how some judges don't want to let on which way they're leaning, a few screw with you and try to give you mixed messages, and then some just don't hide the ball at all. I think if I was a judge I'd be the latter, because if you're leaning one way, you want to challenge that leaning and give the other side every opportunity to poke holes in whatever rationale you're finding persuasive.

But ya, as an appellate attorney who's usually the respondent arguing second, it's pretty great when you know things are going well before you even start.

[Solecismic]

It's still a question of whether Goodell has the ability to suspend Brady, regardless of whether he deserves it.

It sounds like the judge is spending some of his time off the bench going over the NFLPA's arguments on whether this violates the CBA. That if the NFLPA has given him a reason that holds up, he'll take it.

The Wells report was a mess. I doubt even Goodell thinks Wells would stand up to one minute of cross-examination.

Sadly, even if Brady wins this, which is entirely possible, the fact that Goodell did this - even leaking the initial incorrect psi numbers that made Brady think someone had done something wrong - permanently tarnishes his reputation.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

It's still a question of whether Goodell has the ability to suspend Brady, regardless of whether he deserves it.

It sounds like the judge is spending some of his time off the bench going over the NFLPA's arguments on whether this violates the CBA. That if the NFLPA has given him a reason that holds up, he'll take it.

The Wells report was a mess. I doubt even Goodell thinks Wells would stand up to one minute of cross-examination.

Sadly, even if Brady wins this, which is entirely possible, the fact that Goodell did this - even leaking the initial incorrect psi numbers that made Brady think someone had done something wrong - permanently tarnishes his reputation.

Not nearly as much as putting a cheating SOB like Brady back on the field tarnishes the entire league.

If he does win the case -- and with judges today who knows -- I hope karma takes care of him. A CEI would be about right afaic.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Not nearly as much as putting a cheating SOB like Brady back on the field tarnishes the entire league.

If he does win the case -- and with judges today who knows -- I hope karma takes care of him. A CEI would be about right afaic.

Your response illustrates the damage Goodell has already done.

[Subby]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Not nearly as much as putting a cheating SOB like Brady back on the field tarnishes the entire league.

If he does win the case -- and with judges today who knows -- I hope karma takes care of him. A CEI would be about right afaic.

HOT TAEK ALERT! PUT ON THE OVEN MITTS.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

Your response illustrates the damage Goodell has already done.

I don't think we can really blame Goodell for Jon.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

As the resident Pats fan and late night person, I bring this up, because well, I'm probably the only one who noticed it. Way to yell out false accusations ESPN, and then whisper the "oops, my bad". Say the pats filmed Super Bowl practices (proven false) during prime viewing programs, admit that no such thing ever happened.. at 12:20 AM

ESPN Apologizes To Patriots For Sharing False Spygate Story « CBS Boston

“Other media outlets including ESPN, had this allegation and pursued this allegation for months, and it just didn’t meet the standard in terms of what you needed to report it, and the Boston Herald evidently felt they had met the standard to report it. They need to come out and say, ‘We stand by our story’ or they need to have a retraction and apology and deal with the consequences of it, but certainly it’s damaging to the Boston Herald at this point, especially if they stay silent on the subject.” - Chris Mortenson in 2008

My take on the legal part (and reading between the lines on the leaks) is that Berman is desperate to avoid setting an aggressive precedent, and he's really ticked off the NFL wasn't even engaging in good faith settlement talks before that hearing (reportedly the NFL refused to budge from their prior offer - have Brady admit complete guilt and publicly apologize, then they'd consider reducing the suspension), while Brady is willing to accept a fine or maybe 1-game suspension for failure to cooperate if the NFL clears him of ball-tampering allegations, or at least admits there is zero proof. I think Berman might call Goodell to the stand in hopes the NFL agrees to a settlement like that to avoid Goodell/the NFL's (further) public humiliation. Obviously as a fan I'm still hoping Goodell has to take the stand, even though I'm not nearly as confident as some that Berman would completely rule in Brady/the NFLPA's favor. Despite the NFL's constant lies and ESPN's biased coverage we're actually winning this thing in the court of public opinion, which I didn't even think was possible back in January.

[Draft Dodger]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I don't think we can really blame Goodell for Jon.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

Your response illustrates the damage Goodell has already done.

Please. Unless the texts were all faked, you'd have to be a complete & utter moron to believe anything other than Brady was behind the cheat (not to mention to believe that a lowlife like BB was completely unaware). And you have no sports ethics whatsoever if you want that bastard on the field any time soon.

That is, quite possibly, the dirtiest franchise in sports today & one of the dirtiest of all-time. There's no rational, logical or justifiable reason I can find for anyone outside of a local homer to hold them in anything but contempt.

And it's a sorry commentary on the state of society that anyone backs them at this point, regardless of location.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Please. Unless the texts were all faked, you'd have to be a complete & utter moron to believe anything other than Brady was behind the cheat (not to mention to believe that a lowlife like BB was completely unaware). And you have no sports ethics whatsoever if you want that bastard on the field any time soon.

That is, quite possibly, the dirtiest franchise in sports today & one of the dirtiest of all-time. There's no rational, logical or justifiable reason I can find for anyone outside of a local homer to hold them in anything but contempt.

And it's a sorry commentary on the state of society that anyone backs them at this point, regardless of location.

I don't agree with your assessment. Nor does the name-calling help your argument.

The texts mean that, more probably than not, Brady has been rather adamant about how he felt after playing a game last season against the Jets with over-inflated footballs.

This better explains the awkward press conference than some conspiracy theory about what part-time workers can accomplish in a bathroom in less than two minutes.

[stevew]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Not nearly as much as putting a cheating SOB like Brady back on the field tarnishes the entire league.

If he does win the case -- and with judges today who knows -- I hope karma takes care of him. A CEI would be about right afaic.

James Harrison has one more thing to accomplish in his career.

[Draft Dodger]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Please. Unless the texts were all faked, you'd have to be a complete & utter moron to believe anything other than Brady was behind the cheat (not to mention to believe that a lowlife like BB was completely unaware). And you have no sports ethics whatsoever if you want that bastard on the field any time soon.

That is, quite possibly, the dirtiest franchise in sports today & one of the dirtiest of all-time. There's no rational, logical or justifiable reason I can find for anyone outside of a local homer to hold them in anything but contempt.

And it's a sorry commentary on the state of society that anyone backs them at this point, regardless of location.

seems like you've really thought this one out, hoss. nice work!