Official 2022-2023 College Basketball Thread

[HerRealName]

Originally Posted by INDalltheway

A little aggressive on my side - my bad. You are right I want them to call more fouls. I also think the teams/coaches are to blame as well. They could handle this on their own in the offseason if they made a concerted effort or joint statement about how they want their league played and officiated. I know it would never happen in my lifetime, but fans of this conference are going to be suffering watching these horribly officiated games multiple times a week. There are only a few teams in the Big Ten that I look forward to watching and enjoying the game as an actual basketball game.

No worries, I know Edey takes a beating every game... I'm not sure if he ever feels any of it though .

I just want to see the Big Ten do better in the NCAAs but I can't see it happening until they clean things up in conference.

[Ksyrup]

UK is definitely the worst 10 win team in the country.

[INDalltheway]

Originally Posted by HerRealName

No worries, I know Edey takes a beating every game... I'm not sure if he ever feels any of it though .

I just want to see the Big Ten do better in the NCAAs but I can't see it happening until they clean things up in conference.

100% agree

[Ksyrup]

If UK loses to South Carolina - as a 19 point favorite - fans may buy Cal a one-way ticket to Austin. They're down 21-6.

[Ksyrup]

You can probably guess Louisville's record (at least within 2 wins) by looking at this chart:

Which teams can rack up assists while taking care of the ball?

*Sorry Louisville fans 😳 pic.twitter.com/vAXEAiDuWn

— CBB Analytics (@CBBAnalytics) January 26, 2023

[Atocep]

The Big 12 is pretty good

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Atocep

The Big 12 is pretty good

The crazy thing is there are zero below average teams.

[Galaril]

Houston should move back up to number 2 with a nice win against Cincy and the Bama blow out loss.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

The crazy thing is there are zero below average teams.

9 of the 10 teams are in today's KenPom top 37

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Atocep

9 of the 10 teams are in today's KenPom top 37

Meanwhile, that 10th place team (Tech) would be in the top half of the ACC.

SI

[JonInMiddleGA]

How bad was the shooting during UT vs Auburn today?

At one point Auburn was 1 for 26 from the floor over a 20 minute span.
And at the end of that stretch, UT had a one point lead.

The teams combined to go 5 of 48 from three.

Clearly both were angling for a Big 10 bid.

[Ksyrup]

We went to the FSU/Louisville game with my boss and his wife and while both teams have a combined 11 wins, it was a decent game. Probably more entertaining than whatever kind of game Auburn and Tennessee played today.

[Kodos]

Glad IU was able to hold on in the second half to beat Purdue. That’s a tough team they have.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Glad IU was able to hold on in the second half to beat Purdue. That’s a tough team they have.

20 years ago Zach Edey is a lock to go number 1 in the draft. The guy is a monster and the most difficult matchup in college basketball.

[INDalltheway]

This tweet shows how far Purdue has come over the last several years. Now it's time to put together a Final Four run to fully transform the program and take the next step.

[Atocep]

It's kind of frustrating to be 14th in Kenpom, 20th in the NET, but behind in all projected brackets to a team you beat by 25 on their home floor that's 61st in Kenpom and 55th the NET rankings.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Atocep

It's kind of frustrating to be 14th in Kenpom, 20th in the NET, but behind in all projected brackets to a team you beat by 25 on their home floor that's 61st in Kenpom and 55th the NET rankings.

Ok, I give up. I've spent too much time this morning trying to figure out which two are these mystery teams.

SI

[henry296]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Ok, I give up. I've spent too much time this morning trying to figure out which two are these mystery teams.

SI

Knowing Atocep backgorund, it is Pitt and WVU.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Ok, I give up. I've spent too much time this morning trying to figure out which two are these mystery teams.

SI

It is WVU and Pitt.

To be fair, that game was early in the year and, if I recall correctly, Pitt was without one of their best players. But, to also be fair, it was a 25-point win on Pitt's home floor.

The Big 12 is just brutal this year. WVU is 14-9 overall with all the losses being quad 1/top 50 teams. We have some good OOC wins (+25 @Pitt, Auburn, +29 vs Florida on a neutral site) and losses (only two were Purdue on a neutral court and @Xavier). We also have those top 25 (and in some cases top 15 rankings) in the computer-based rankings, but are only 3-7 in conference. Most folks think we need to get 4 more wins between the rest of the season and B12 tourney to get into the NCAAs.

Pitt has a much weaker profile, but has 17 wins and most of the Bracketology folks have them 3-4 lines higher than WVU right now. Wins matter, but the combo of it being our biggest rivalry and that we won so convincingly head to head has lead to a lot of discussion over whether WVU would be better off winning 20-25 games in the ACC versus winning 15-20 in the Big 12.

[sterlingice]

Yeah, the Big XII is just insane this year (says Kansas alum, looking up at the conference leaders)

SI

[henry296]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

It is WVU and Pitt.

To be fair, that game was early in the year and, if I recall correctly, Pitt was without one of their best players. But, to also be fair, it was a 25-point win on Pitt's home floor.

Pitt was missing Hugley who was their best player last year, but has been hurt and is sitting out the rest of the year. The same 9 players played vs. WVU as played vs. UNC last week, so if someone is making the "best player" argument that doesn't hold water. Pitt is better now than they were then, but they are being propped up by road wins vs. NC state and Syracuse which aren't that great and the 2 wins over UNC which is a bubble team.

WVU and Oklahoma and Ok State are very interesting cases for strength of schedule vs. results. Pitt likely is bottom 3 in the Big 12 with those teams, but tops in ACC due to weak conference schedule. Only have to play Duke and UVA once.

[sterlingice]

With the exception of maybe Tech, the other teams in the bottom of the Big XII (WVU, OU, OSU) are the top half of every other conference in the sport. Hell, Tech is only 2 behind ACC leader Clemson at KP, but Clemson is also a bit of a paper tiger in a really weak ACC.

Speaking of the ACC, this is the year they're getting rid of a bunch of coaches, right? Brey is already retiring. Is Leonard Hamilton next? This is the type of year that if they were at the top of their games, they'd be in the fight for the conference title.

I mean, Bennett is near that top, steady as can be (though with a weaker team for him) along with Larranaga (who has probably lost a bit off his fastball). Then there's Keatts (NC State) and Brownell (Clemson) who, in their good years, occupy that "we went about .500 in league so let us in as a 7-10 seed" and Capel, who had never won more than 6 league games before. Pastner has to be reaching his end at Tech. And I know it's Payne's first year at Lousiville and looked like a good hire- longtime Cal assistant who played at UL - but holy crap is that an unmitigated dumpster fire.

If you couldn't grab a bite of the top half of the conference apple this year with Duke and UNC playing down, it might be time to go.

SI

[ntndeacon]

Forbes at Wake has turned out to be a great hire! We actually have a chance to make the tourney, which wasn't happening under Manning or the Dumpster fire that was Bzeldick!

[Ksyrup]

I read an interesting and pretty candid interview of Leonard Hamilton. He flat-out admitted they were a year late to using the transfer portal to find starters and that, combined with 2 guys from last year's team going pro that they didn't expect, a couple major injuries this year and the ridiculous Baba Miller suspension, put this team in a bad situation. They've actually done fairly well in conference considering they went 1-9 in non-conference games to start the year.

All that to say, he absolutely did not sound like a guy ready to retire, and considering what he did to elevate FSU basketball the past 15+ years, I can't see them forcing him out because of 1 bad year.

I'd also point out that a few years ago Larranaga at Miami went through 3 bad-to-mediocre seasons where they were constantly undermanned - like, only had 6-7 scholarship players for most games - and he's managed to turn that program around. I'd go so far as to make them one of my tournament sleepers this year. And he did it as an old guy with a recent bad track record. So I'm not counting out Ham yet. And even if this is the end, he almost deserves his own statute for making FSU basketball relevant - especially during a time when the FB team sucked and we needed something other than soccer and softball to root for winning teams.

[sterlingice]

Yeah, I don't have a lot of sense of what's going on at a micro level at the ACC. Both are really good coaches and this could just be an unfortunately timed lean period.

SI

[Ksyrup]

I just saw Ham in person at the Louisville game on Saturday and while I know the dude is like 75, you could have easily convinced me he was younger than me. But I'm sure he's feeling the age even if he still doesn't look it.

[miami_fan]

Unfortunately, men's college basketball sort of fell off my radar this year. Has this been like a huge story? This is the first time I have heard about this and it is absolutely insane.

NMSU men's hoops season halted indefinitely amid 'new allegations'

New Mexico State men's basketball has canceled Saturday's game at Cal Baptist and suspended its season indefinitely following "new allegations" within the program, according to a statement from the school.

The new allegations have prompted an investigation by the school and led to the coaching staff being put on paid administrative leave, the statement said.

The Aggies have been embroiled in controversy since November, when forward Mike Peake shot and killed a New Mexico student in self-defense in Albuquerque after he'd been lured to the campus. Per the school's statement, Friday's decision to suspend the season is separate from that case.

"New Mexico State University is suspending operations for the men's basketball program until further notice," the school's statement said Friday. "NMSU personnel were recently informed of new allegations, separate from the events that took place in Albuquerque late last year, involving potential violations of university policy. While those allegations are being investigated, the men's basketball coaching staff has been placed on paid administrative leave. The game scheduled for February 11 against California Baptist will not be played."

NMSU is just 9-15 this season in Greg Heiar's first season.

"The New Mexico State University Board of Regents were informed this evening of the suspension of operations for the men's basketball program," the NMSU Board of Regents said in a statement. "The board supports the action taken by the university leaders and is confident a full and thorough investigation will be conducted."

After the Peake incident, multiple NMSU staffers took possession of Peake's gun and other potential evidence that was later recovered by New Mexico State police. Heiar, fearing retaliation for the shooting, left town without having three NMSU players who'd picked Peake up after the shooting and transported him to the hospital to talk to police. Their bus was stopped on a highway as it traveled back to Las Cruces.

Lorenzo Jenkins, who serves as a special assistant to Heiar, had Peake's tablet in a backpack. An unnamed New Mexico State administrator had his phone, state police said. The gun used in the shooting was located at the team hotel in Albuquerque, where assistant coach Dominique Taylor had it wrapped in a towel after Heiar called him and told him that Avery, Muhammad and Roy could tell him where to find the weapon.

It's unclear how and where the items were transported after the shooting.

The school and the Albuquerque district attorney have both launched separate investigations into the incident and the actions of staffers, coaches and players after the shooting.

ESPN's attempts to gather personnel files on coaches and staffers at NMSU have been repeatedly delayed by the school in recent months. A lawyer with the school said it would respond by Feb. 6 to the request but the school did not release the personnel files. The school's original investigation after the Peake shooting and aftermath was "ongoing" as of late January, per Justin Bannister, NMSU associate vice president of communications.

[rjolley]

I remember reading the story about the shooting, but haven't seen anything since. Can't imagine what kind of craziness is going on there..

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by rjolley

I remember reading the story about the shooting, but haven't seen anything since. Can't imagine what kind of craziness is going on there..

Huge? Nah, not really.

It was big for a day or two when it happened.

The story had bad vibes from the get-go. What appears to have been self-defense (player who shot & killed an assailant was apparently set-up to be attacked) got really murky once three witnesses, the shooter's tablet, and most importantly the weapon all went *poof* with the involvement (assistance?) of members of the coaching staff.

How these new hazing allegations connect to that, or if they even connect to it at all, is a mystery.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Huge? Nah, not really.

It was big for a day or two when it happened.

The story had bad vibes from the get-go. What appears to have been self-defense (player who shot & killed an assailant was apparently set-up to be attacked) got really murky once three witnesses, the shooter's tablet, and most importantly the weapon all went *poof* with the involvement (assistance?) of members of the coaching staff.

How these new hazing allegations connect to that, or if they even connect to it at all, is a mystery.

Reading up on all things going on in that program this morning, if true, the shooting incident is the only thing that makes sense to me

[JonInMiddleGA]

Kentucky about to lose to Georgia in Athens. 2nd time in three years even. To bad / very bad Georgia teams.

Not sure how much longer before UK has to make a coaching change. If that's not a sign it's time then I don't know what it would take.

[Ksyrup]

They had a brief run the last 2-3 weeks where it looked like they turned the corner, but they're back to crap again. Oscar has even regressed and gotten exposed. I'm not sure who the replacement would be, but it sure seems like a divorce is necessary.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

They had a brief run the last 2-3 weeks where it looked like they turned the corner, but they're back to crap again. Oscar has even regressed and gotten exposed. I'm not sure who the replacement would be, but it sure seems like a divorce is necessary.

Oscar is incredibly talented but immature and if he's not motivated he simply won't work and acts like a baby. He's not a bad kid by any means, I'd be shocked if he ever got into any kind of off the court trouble. But he's a handful to deal with on and off the court.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Oscar is incredibly talented but immature and if he's not motivated he simply won't work and acts like a baby. He's not a bad kid by any means, I'd be shocked if he ever got into any kind of off the court trouble. But he's a handful to deal with on and off the court.

Is that a polite way of saying he tends to be kinda lazy?

(Legit asking, not sure if that's an accurate read of your take or not)

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Is that a polite way of saying he tends to be kinda lazy?

(Legit asking, not sure if that's an accurate read of your take or not)

Lazy when not motivated. He was motivated when he first landed at WVU and when he first arrived at UK. Keeping him motivated is the challenge.

[miami_fan]

What is John Calipari as a head coach in an era of NIL? The appeal of Cal as a head coach was as a recruiter who either A) allegedly got the players the most money in college with illegal payments or B) he allowed the players to show off their skills in a way that allowed them to make the most money in the pros as top draft picks. He has never been regarded as a quality in game coach.

[Ksyrup]

That was the knock on Oscar when he left WV. Huggins publicly talked shit about him and looked like a fool when Oscar went off last year. I don't know what the issue is this year but he's not been as good, and certainly not as consistent, as last year.

[Atocep]

WVU got thumped by Texas today, but it featured the strangest call I've seen in my life.

Emmitt Matthews of WVU drove to the basket, Texas player planted to take a charge, contact between the two and the shot went it. After video review the refs called the bucket good, a block on the Texas player, and a charge on Matthews. No free threw, ball to Texas.

I still can't wrap my head around the call and I've never seen anything like it.

I can't find a clip, but if I find it I'll post it. The play itself is nothing crazy. Just a simple drive and close block/charge play.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Atocep

WVU got thumped by Texas today, but it featured the strangest call I've seen in my life.

Emmitt Matthews of WVU drove to the basket, Texas player planted to take a charge, contact between the two and the shot went it. After video review the refs called the bucket good, a block on the Texas player, and a charge on Matthews. No free threw, ball to Texas.

I still can't wrap my head around the call and I've never seen anything like it.

I can't find a clip, but if I find it I'll post it. The play itself is nothing crazy. Just a simple drive and close block/charge play.

Had to dig through a lot of Twitter to find discussion, never did find video.

It seems what happened was
1) called a charge
2) overturned the call & changed it to a block (removing the charge)
3) count the basket
4) forgot to give WVU the and-one free throw

[JonInMiddleGA]

New Mexico State men's basketball won't resume season

[cartman]

Unreal ending to the Portland State-Northern Arizona game over the weekend. N. Arizona up one with 0.4 seconds remaining. Portland State throws a length of the court inbounds pass, teammate quick catch and release and it went in.

Portland State sinks N. Arizona at buzzer after full-court lob

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

New Mexico State men's basketball won't resume season

Two questions

1. The head coach can't stay in place right?

2. I am not naive enough to believe that hazing has or will disappear from team sports anytime soon. However, I really thought hazing involving the victim's genitalia was a thing of the past. That is still a thing?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Two questions

1. The head coach can't stay in place right?

2. I am not naive enough to believe that hazing has or will disappear from team sports anytime soon. However, I really thought hazing involving the victim's genitalia was a thing of the past. That is still a thing?

I don't get the feeling anybody keeps their job on this deal.

Interesting (to me anyway) note about first year HC Greg Heair and some of the coaching trees he's part of.

Aside from Chris Jans (who he replaced here, as well as his first HC job at a JUCO), he's worked under:

Larry Eustachy -- lost two jobs, one for cuddling up to coeds while drunk and another for emotional & verbal abuse

Gregg Marshall -- lost his job for verbal & physical abuse of players

Will Wade -- lost his job amid a cloud of pay-to-play allegations

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Two questions

1. The head coach can't stay in place right?

Shoe. Dropped.

Another important update. This letter was just sent to our NMSU community. pic.twitter.com/wVgtc9M22J

— Dan Arvizu (@dan_arvizu) February 15, 2023

[rjolley]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Shoe. Dropped.

Another important update. This letter was just sent to our NMSU community. pic.twitter.com/wVgtc9M22J

— Dan Arvizu (@dan_arvizu) February 15, 2023

He made the decision to terminate the coach. That's a bit harsh. Just firing him would've been enough.

[RainMaker]

This is a crazy twist in the Alabama murder case. Miller provided the gun but hasn't been charged or kicked off the team. He's projected to be a top 5 pick by a lot of people.

Darius Miles asked Brandon Miller to bring gun used to kill Jamea Jonae Harris, police testify - al.com

[GrantDawg]

The PAC-12, that already has a visability problem and is losing two of its biggest draw schools, are considering signing a TV deal with Apple TV. The conference is going to end up on milk cartoons soon. "Have you seen us?"

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

The PAC-12, that already has a visability problem and is losing two of its biggest draw schools, are considering signing a TV deal with Apple TV. The conference is going to end up on milk cartoons soon. "Have you seen us?"

I've been following this pretty closely and it is pretty hard to believe it, but I'm not sure the Pac survives this as power conference unless they get a lifeline somehow. I think the main issues are that these schools, outside of a handful, just don't have the huge following/attendance numbers that the other conferences do (likely due to competition for entertainment time/dollars for their fans) and, more so, they have had two really bad commissioners in a row that have overplayed their hands.

I don't know if it is true when you get down to the details, but I read that they briefly had the highest paying TV deal after adding Colorado and Utah. It is hard to believe where they are now. I think the ACC/Big 12/Pac 12 should probably figure out how to work together, but it seems like egos are too big and past bad blood comes in the way.

[sterlingice]

The BigWhatever (10, 16, ??) should pick up whatever they want - Standford, Cal, whatever, and the Big XII just pick up the rest. But that's not going to happen. God forbid the sport actually try to retain some of the good from the past when every individual actor is just trying to pick apart everything for marginally more bucks.

Instead, the Four Corners probably go to the Big XII, Wazzu and Oregon State get left out, Oregon/Washington either go to the Big10 and Stanford/Cal get left out or Oregon/Washington go elsewhere and Stanford/Cal go to the Big10. Or maybe there's a zombie Pac-10 that includes the remaining members, San Diego State, SMU, Fresno St(?), Boise St (?), etc. Oregon and Washington are gone either now or they rule the zombie league until everything fractures in the early 2030s.

SI

[Swaggs]

Washington St and Oregon St seem like they are screwed unless the P12 commish can pull out a Hail Mary somehow (maybe unevenly high shares for Oregon/Washington with a mid- and lower-tier for the other schools?) or pull off a full on merge with the Big 12 or ACC.

It sounds like the four corners (AZ, ASU, Utah, and Colorado) are not enough to increase the value of the contract for the Big 12 and it is debatable whether they would even increase the overall pool enough to keep the current shares where they are. If Washington or Oregon want in, I'm sure they already have an open invitation. Cal and Stanford seem as if they prefer going it alone or taking their chances that maybe the Big Ten or ACC become options.

I think there is a chance that the four corners + Washington/Oregon join up sometime soon, if Washington/Oregon aren't required to sign a grant of rights. I think the Big 12 should do that, but I'm not sure if that the other schools will think that is fair or, on the heels of Texas and Oklahoma leaving, if they want to get back into setting that type of precedent where they play favorites or make special concessions.

I think, for the Big 12, the thinking is that this new commissioner wants to have sports across all four timezones for TV AND feels like basketball can make much more money that it currently does. There has been some talk that 2-4 non-football schools may be invited (I'd assume Gonzaga, Villanova, St. John's, maybe Creighton). One of the WVU insiders think that could happen in early March.

Nowhere enough to catch the Big Ten or SEC, but enough to make them securely 3rd (or 3A or 3B with the ACC) for awhile. That would be a really solid legacy for this commissioner.