Congressional Sexual Harassment Thread (Al Franken & Co.)

[JPhillips]

He forcibly kissed her and then humiliated her for days. And I'll be shocked if this is a one time only thing. He deserves what he gets.

[corbes]

Originally Posted by molson

It's kind of interesting that the Franken and Moore allegations are these huge deals that plenty of people on both sides think should disqualify them from office or from seeking office, but that we kind of forgot that Donald Trump himself has 16 accusers, there's detailed accusations of rape and child rape made in lawsuits and depositions, and he even made admissions on audio recordings.

+1!

[molson]

I've been spending way too much time staring at Franken's hands and that lady's boobs, but it looks to me like he's making contact with some of fingertips, but that it's not a full "grab." And that's it's pretty likely he was making more physical contact immediately before or after the photo was taken. Because he's RIGHT there. It'd take some serious hand dexterity to get that close and not touch or grab on the way in or in the way out, and it would be some serious bad luck if this split second captured the very closest his hands got.

[tarcone]

Clean out congress. They are fat cats that only think about themselves and are drunk with power.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Clean out congress. They are fat cats that only think about themselves and are drunk with power.

To do what exactly? Replace them with identically self-interested power drunk folks?

Not sure that going to accomplish much other than creating more work for the pages/guides who have to explain where the bathrooms are.

[Warhammer]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Clean out congress. They are fat cats that only think about themselves and are drunk with power.

That's what led to Trump getting elected.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

He forcibly kissed her and then humiliated her for days. And I'll be shocked if this is a one time only thing. He deserves what he gets.

Yeah, I'm torn here. I'm not sure this picture and the accusations described are disqualifying "sexual assault" as opposed to just douche-y (and I hate the internet lynch mob because there's an important delineation between something like this and actual rape or whipping your dick out and masturbating in plants), but I can guarantee this isn't the only time Al Franken did something like this. The female's response to it may have varied, but that's kind of how I expect many powerful men act. I said as much during the Trump "Locker Room" talk - it's not locker room talk, it's country club talk. I don't think every or even most rich/powerful man acts like that, but power and prestige in any profession and especially Wall Street, Hollywood, Capitol Hill & athletics, has enabled that behavior forever from any narcissist or sociopath or predator who enters the field.

Originally Posted by molson

It's kind of interesting that the Franken and Moore allegations are these huge deals that plenty of people on both sides think should disqualify them from office or from seeking office, but that we kind of forgot that Donald Trump himself has 16 accusers, there's detailed accusations of rape and child rape made in lawsuits and depositions, and he even made admissions on audio recordings. Maybe Trump wouldn't be president if that article about Weinstein came out last year.

Yeah, and there's no way Roy Moore will still be elected after this either!

I just don't really know where things are going politically. Trump did much worse than this, Clinton did much worse than this, even George H.W. Bush has been accused of stuff while in his wheelchair... it's good the pendulum has swung in this direction, but it's gone so far in the opposite direction that you see that huge bifurcation and backlash. No room in the internet/twitter echo chamber to try and make any nuanced argument at this point, it's just one people in the middle sit out and let the crazy people on both sides go to extremes.

[CrimsonFox]

I have no doubt that Moore will win his election.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

I have no doubt that Moore will win his election.

If there was ever going to be a state to elect a pedophile, it would be Alabama.

I want to know more about this.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/16/politi...ent/index.html

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by molson

I've been spending way too much time staring at Franken's hands and that lady's boobs, but it looks to me like he's making contact with some of fingertips, but that it's not a full "grab." And that's it's pretty likely he was making more physical contact immediately before or after the photo was taken. Because he's RIGHT there. It'd take some serious hand dexterity to get that close and not touch or grab on the way in or in the way out, and it would be some serious bad luck if this split second captured the very closest his hands got.

On top of that, he's doing it in front of a bunch of people, like the skit that he wrote for the tour. It's all in front of a bunch of people. He's not parking a car behind a dumpster. While he's guilty of the act, the context couldn't be further apart.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

... then humiliated her for days.

I actually did not read this. I thought it was a one shot deal and then they toured together.

More to come from the investigation.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

On top of that, he's doing it in front of a bunch of people, like the skit that he wrote for the tour. It's all in front of a bunch of people. He's not parking a car behind a dumpster. While he's guilty of the act, the context couldn't be further apart.

Taking advantage of her in a rehearsal like that is waaaay out of line. He isn't the first to do it, but it's almost always a way for an older, more established actor to take advantage of a younger, inexperienced actress. It happens because the woman will probably be too scared to say anything, and if she does the man can always claim he was just really into the scene. It's predatory, plain and simple.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Here's the way I judge these things. If this happened to your GF/wife, sister or daughter, what would your reaction be?

Looking at that picture, if that was my girlfriend, I'd need bail money.

It has been fascinating to see what the reaction has been to these incidents from friends and acquaintances while comparing it to their past reactions to real or perceived incidents of harassment involving their significant others. It makes sense I guess but still kinda fascinating.

[Arles]

Originally Posted by CrescentMoonie

I think it's the opposite. If Trump isn't elected, Weinstein is still just the guy that women in Hollywood know they have to put up with to get ahead.

I think this is spot on. Hollywood spent 18 months railing on Trump for (rightly) being a powerful sleazebag in regards to treating women. At some point, I think even some in Hollywood have a bit of a conscience and say "Wait, if we are clamoring for women's rights with Trump, how can we keep turning a blind eye to this perv Weinstein".

If Trump isn't the republican nominee, I'm not sure any of this stuff ever sees the light of day.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Taking advantage of her in a rehearsal like that is waaaay out of line. He isn't the first to do it, but it's almost always a way for an older, more established actor to take advantage of a younger, inexperienced actress. It happens because the woman will probably be too scared to say anything, and if she does the man can always claim he was just really into the scene. It's predatory, plain and simple.

It was a completely bullshit thing to do, no question. And if you're going to clean house in all of Congress he is free to go, but behaving like a jackass is the sort of thing I'd expect to see in a comedy tour. It crossed a line and he should have realized then. It's still not parking behind a dumpster.

[cuervo72]

Maybe the USO can get rid of the eye candy/sex object role?

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Maybe the USO can get rid of the eye candy/sex object role?

Why?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Maybe the USO can get rid of the eye candy/sex object role?

Yes, let's replace it with, I dunno, some nice family board games or something.
That'll put butts in seats.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

I have no doubt that Moore will win his election.

Oh I have doubts. Then again, with any electorate, I always have some degree of doubt.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Yes, let's replace it with, I dunno, some nice family board games or something.
That'll put butts in seats.

I dunno - I'm thinking Steve Harvey putting on Family Feud would probably beat out some skit with an old SNL alum and an aging model/poker hostess.

I guess what I've wondered for a while - and not having served, I have no idea, so any input from vets is appreciated - is how effective USO tours are for morale. Are they (like variety shows, telethons, etc) an entertainment format which has outlived its usefulness. Has communications and the ability to access other entertainment (including, oh, porn) obsoleted much of the content. I mean, I don't know if we're still in the era where troops are lusting after Betty Grable's legs taped to the top of their foot locker.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

I dunno - I'm thinking Steve Harvey putting on Family Feud would probably beat out some skit with an old SNL alum and an aging model/poker hostess.

Can't have that.

Harvey uses suggestions of lechery as part of his humor after all.

[BBT]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

I dunno - I'm thinking Steve Harvey putting on Family Feud would probably beat out some skit with an old SNL alum and an aging model/poker hostess.

I guess what I've wondered for a while - and not having served, I have no idea, so any input from vets is appreciated - is how effective USO tours are for morale. Are they (like variety shows, telethons, etc) an entertainment format which has outlived its usefulness. Has communications and the ability to access other entertainment (including, oh, porn) obsoleted much of the content. I mean, I don't know if we're still in the era where troops are lusting after Betty Grable's legs taped to the top of their foot locker.

USO tours haven’t been like what you see in movies for a long time now. Closest I saw to anything like that over my career (1998-2016) was about 4 Redskins cheerleaders coming over with some former NFL players (Darren Woodson and 3 others) in 2012. They basically ran a “training camp” and signed some autographs. Otherwise, it’s mostly celebrities coming over to give a quick speech, bands/cover bands/military bands, or a few lower-rung comedians doing stand-up routines. The WWE does a show over there as well.

Military has been hammered by sexual assaults over the past few decades so the culture is completely different than the days when you’d see Playboy playmates or “eye candy” at the shows. Even still, just about anything draws as there isn’t much else to do when you aren’t working or sleeping.

[mckerney]

.@BillForOhio, a sitting Ohio Supreme Court justice and Democratic gubernatorial candidate, apparently posted on Facebook about his sexual escapades.

"In the last fifty years I was sexually intimate with approximately 50 very attractive females." pic.twitter.com/TUNT2IVbTt

— Eric Heisig (@eheisig) November 17, 2017

Uhh... wow.

[JonInMiddleGA]

See, you had to know that bragging was going to eventually begin

[albionmoonlight]

I had to read that, like, three times to realize that he wasn't bragging about making passionate love to Senator Bob Taft.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I had to read that, like, three times to realize that he wasn't bragging about making passionate love to Senator Bob Taft.

You'n me both.

[panerd]

I thought that as well. I like this guy.

[PilotMan]

4th'd

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I had to read that, like, three times to realize that he wasn't bragging about making passionate love to Senator Bob Taft.

That may have scored a lot of votes in Ohio though...

[cuervo72]

Eh, not so sure!

A Republican 'Family Values' State Legislator Quits After Having Sex With a Man in His Office

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Eh, not so sure!

A Republican 'Family Values' State Legislator Quits After Having Sex With a Man in His Office

To be completely fair to him, he only said his marriage was "natural," he didn't say his extramarital affairs were as well.

[stevew]

Trickle down economics at work, people.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

It was a completely bullshit thing to do, no question. And if you're going to clean house in all of Congress he is free to go, but behaving like a jackass is the sort of thing I'd expect to see in a comedy tour. It crossed a line and he should have realized then. It's still not parking behind a dumpster.

[Thomkal]

So I think by the time this is over, all sitting representatives and senators will have allegations about harassment against them, and none will be left to run the government. One way to clean up the swamp I guess.

Honestly I can see these things used in just about every election from now on whether its true or not. Sad.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I had to read that, like, three times to realize that he wasn't bragging about making passionate love to Senator Bob Taft.

I went back and had to do the same thing, thinking Bob Taft is an attractive female??

[thesloppy]

Count me in as another who read that as sexin' up Bob Taft....and reading it that way made me think the dude was being sarcastic and I was practically laughing along with him....until I was forced to re-read it and realize it was actually just some weird version of entirely humorless bragging.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I had to read that, like, three times to realize that he wasn't bragging about making passionate love to Senator Bob Taft.

Same here. I was questioning my knowledge of Bob Taft until I re-read it the 3rd time.

[Chief Rum]

I don't know if Bob Taft is still around, but methinks if he is, he probably picked up a few votes for being so damn attractive.

[Noop]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Actually yes, it would surprise me.

I'm sure it happens but "equally"?

I would guess that if they were properly prosecuted and the victims would speak up the numbers would far out pace men.

I know it sounds like hyperbole ...

[tarcone]

I was thinking Bob was an unusual name for a woman.

[ISiddiqui]

Bob Taft will be whoever the fuck you want him to be!

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[Ben E Lou]

We have another accuser of Franken.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/20/politi...010/index.html

[Kodos]

He needs to go.

[Jas_lov]

Franken shouldn't resign unless Trump does. Trump and the Republicans have no moral authority on this issue.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

Franken shouldn't resign unless Trump does. Trump and the Republicans have no moral authority on this issue.

My sins are still my sins regardless of the degree of your sins.

I expected more shoes and drop, and Franken needs to go.

[molson]

I hope in Franken's next apology he says he's groped far less woman than Donald Trump so we really shouldn't worry about it

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

My sins are still my sins regardless of the degree of your sins.

I expected more shoes and drop, and Franken needs to go.

This is my perspective - I actually like(d) Franken a lot and he talks a lot of sense generally, however this undermines his influence and as such he'd be better off to leave with what dignity he has left.

That Trump and some others don't do the right thing doesn't excuse him from doing so ...

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by molson

I hope in Franken's next apology he says he's groped far less woman than Donald Trump so we really shouldn't worry about it

Do you mean fewer women or smaller asses?

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

My sins are still my sins regardless of the degree of your sins.

I expected more shoes and drop, and Franken needs to go.

I think degrees of sins do factor in. However, a pattern seems to be emerging here but lets have it play out a little longer to see what (if any) additional things pop up.

[Ben E Lou]

Isn't that a safe Dem seat in a state with a Dem governor? What's the downside for the Dems of losing Franken and putting someone else in?